Shatner on ‘Star Trek’ Movie: Nimoy Is In, I am Not July 9, 2007
by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: ST09 Cast, Shatner , trackbackIn his latest videoblog on Shatnervision, William Shatner discusses the recent rumors about tension between himself and Leonard Nimoy over roles in the new ‘Star Trek’ movie. The Shat makes a joke about the tensions, but also says that Nimoy has a part and he does not.
Transcript (of relevant bit):
Shatner: There is a Star Trek movie and I called Leonard. I said "have you heard" and he said "yes I have," I said "what do you mean?" and he said "I have read the script." I said "Is it a good script?" and he said "ya." I said "am I in it?" and then there was a pause, he said "no" and then he began to laugh. I went through the…I grabbed him by the throat. He’s in it and I’m not in it!
[question: Why didn’t Leonard say ‘if Bill’s not in it I am not going to be in it’]
Shatner: Because we are not that good friends [laughs]. I mean the man needs the money. Leonard loves to benefit the whole stargazing thing at the planetarium. He’s got the whole bit…it’s the Susan and Leonard Nimoy Planetarium…
I had heard the same rumors reported in the New York tabloids and I knew the ‘Shatner is angry’ part was not true (but it seemed that there may be a kernel of truth to the Nimoy role part). Last week I contacted Nimoy’s reps and was told it is ‘premature’ for any comment at this time. Paramount of course ‘do not comment on rumors’ (even when they are from Shatner). I do believe that there is truth to what Shatner is saying, but that there is currently no final signed deal for Nimoy.
What role is for Nimoy?
If Nimoy is in, then there seems to be only two possibilities. One would be an older Spock (likely post-Star Trek Generations) in some form of flashforward (Abrams just loves those). The other possibility would be another character, maybe Spock’s father Sarek. Nimoy himself has said to be open to playing Spock again if the role were substantial and also appeared open to playing Sarek.
No Shat?
As for Shatner having no role it is a bit hard to reconcile with the recent comment by the film’s writers that they were still hoping that Shatner would have a role in the film. Perhaps Orci’s comment "we’re certainly hoping to include him in the shoot" could be taken differently and meant that they hoped Shatner would be there but not in front of the camera. Shatner himself often discussed the dilemma that the writers had in trying to resurrect Kirk post-Generations (something that they do not have to do with Spock).
Shooting is still over four months away so there is still time and the Shat himself may be hoping the attention this gets changes some minds over at Paramount. The Shatner/new Star Trek movie saga has been going on for almost a year now and this is probably not the last chapter.
Bonus video: Shat on Trek conventions and co-stars
Here is the Shat discussing his fellow Trek costars at a recent radio appearance.
Comments
I’ve been suggesting this possibilty since I heard BOTH Shatner & Nimoy were to be involved: a New Generations-era Spock ‘reading’ Kirk’s memoirs. That way, Shatner could easily do voice-overs without any evidence of his aging, or conflict with Generations.
I always thought a Q TNG movie would be good…..his TNG episodes were always great…..
Then again, I always thought that a Romulan Movie, involving unification would be cool too…
It would be….disappointing to have Nimoy there without Shatner, the same way it was odd not to have Nimoy and De Kelley alongside him in Generations.
Kirk’s dead, Spock isn’t…it’s as simple as that. JJ is not gonna undo the Generations incident. But we might see Spock again. I can live with that. Spock is my favourite TOS character, so I’m all up for a reprise…
Interesting…I always thought putting Shatner in the movie could be difficult, and not necessarily the best move. But it’ll be interesting to see what Nimoy does in the new movie. We don’t know for sure he’s playing Spock, either, do we?
As the article says… this won’t be the last we hear of this on-going saga. In my opinion, Shat priced himself out of the movie. But we’ll see.
I always thought that Shatner was satisfied that Kirk was dead so that he could retire that character. But hey, I guess a lot could change in 13 years…. wow, where does the time go?
#2 Light Years - A Q movie would’ve been GREAT! In my opinion, Q is the greatest Star Trek villian of all time.
Sounds like Nimoy might be playing Sarek, not Spock? Nice tip of the hat to the old series without doing something so obvious.
However, based on the script for Transformers, I don’t have a lot of hope for this film. I’m expecting the obvious and the stupid. And the confusing. Unless, of course, JJ does a major rewrite, and since he’s directing, there’s hope.
Nimoy, but no Shatner? Grrrrrr…………………..ooan!!
in case anyone was wondering, this was the ‘big news’ i was referring to last week.
What the hell? If they’re gonna have Nimoy, then thats great. But why the hell wouldnt they put Shatner in there? I dont care if its just for 5 minutes. Jesus, this is really idiotic.
What the hell? If they’re gonna have Nimoy, then thats great. But why the hell wouldnt they put Shatner in there? I dont care if its just for 5 minutes. Jesus, this is really idiotic.
I wish Shatner had cared more about Kirk dying in Generations in the first place, he really didnt seem to care much at the time
trektacular wrote:
> I wish Shatner had cared more about Kirk dying in Generations in the
> first place, he really didnt seem to care much at the time
Yes, he did. Read the 1994 book, “Star Trek: Movie Memories”, by William Shatner and Chris Kreski.
No Shatner: no popcorn for me.
Oh well, maybe I’ll give it a look in a few years when it comes out on terrestrial.
Meanwhile I’ll be watching Doctor Who. Russell T Davies knows what he’s doing if these guys dont.
erm… could you give us a brief synopsis of what it said? I know he’s been trying to resurrect the character since Generations, but I’ve never actually heard his feelings on the matter and at the time of filming.
He actually appears to have dropped a few pounds. Looks pretty damn good for a man of 76 years old.
Hey, maybe if it’s only Nimoy we are looking at a TNG era movie…..
I mean, the writing team did not say which Enterprise will be in the movie.
And since Captain Kirk is not in it…..
Orci needs to explain why he gave us false hope in regards to Shatner appearing after he insinuated the original report was bull. In effect he threw Shatner fans a red herring and i’m not happy that he kept the hope alive when its now obvious Shatner won’t be in the movie.
Explain yourself Orci. Massive shame on you!
This is a quasi-surprising turn of events.
Evidently reconciling a return for Kirk was beyond the skill and imagination level of the writers perhaps?
Amazing, considering we are dealing with a subject matter in which basically well, anything goes. It’s science fiction.
I think the issue was overthought and overbaked, put Kirk in the movie, then do what everyone else is doing, do some viral marketing addressing HOW he came to be in the film, and a prequel comic book.
Damn, that was really hard.
kirk is dead
shatner is a drunk
deal with it.
I have a feeling the Shat will be in it. I think he’s just trying to make fans think otherwise so it’s this big surprise when he’s on screen.
Would Shat play with our minds? Nawwwww….
Wait and see. Wait and see…..
I dont think playing Sarek would work.
Looks like it may be a Spock-framing device. The more I think about it - I like the idea of a “let me tell you about my friend Captain Kirk” wonder years story.
That said, you can only do that for one movie. Sequels cant have that.
Makes sense i guess - after all Kirk is missing presumed dead on the Ent B in the 23rd century and dosnt show up again until the 24th…for 5 minutes before he falls off a bridge after helping to stop Picard get his ass handed to him on a plate.
Spock however is alive and well..
I know they could do that X3 de-aging thing and have a pre Gen Kirk but to be honest - it looked abit werid…it didnt look right….plus fans would be like ‘um…Wasnt Kirk like killed in Star Trek 7?’
Anyway in the real world The Shat had his send off to Star Trek in Generations…without Nimoy…
now maybe Nimoy will do the same in this one.
Plus The Shat is a sorta parody of himself these days (”Whooooooo” on talk shows, Denny Crane, priceline & kellogs adverts, singing etc)
Nimoy is like a Vulcan eldar…
I just lost all interest in this movie.
however saying that - Shatner should still be in it somehow
Who cares what Nimoy plays? The character of Kirk, being dead, now has little relevance because there is no hope. We know Damon or whatever wannabe plays the part will live, and we know exactly the circumstances are toward his death.
Unless The Return is made canon, we know that the heroic James T. Kirk dies a stupid death for no reason or importance, all because some wimp couldn’t fight his own battles and then couldn’t figure out that he could just leave the nexus a few minutes earlier and slap the cuffs on the villain BEFORE he put everyone in peril.
There is really no reason to do a prequel for a character that has no future.
No hope.
It really doesn’t matter how great the script is now. It doesn’t matter if it follows canon or not. The movie won’t accomplish anything.
Let them make Sulu a girl for all I care. At best, I’ll download it.
No Shatner, no interest.
#14 I did read the book, still doesn’t explain exactly why he comitted to it though
Maybe Spock is at Kirks 24th Century Funeral? Who knows, personally I don’t mind if Shatner is in it or not.
Plus if Nimoy liked the script then the script must be good.
I just had a fangasm with a particular thought;
If it is Kirks 24th century funeral then there is an opportunity for lots of cameos. Picard, Sisko, Janeway etc etc could all be there!
On the other hand the idea of Kirks funeral isn’t the nicest thought, but we’ve seen him die already so why not!
#8>>However, based on the script for Transformers, I don’t have a lot of hope for this film. I’m expecting the obvious and the stupid. And the confusing. Unless, of course, JJ does a major rewrite, and since he’s directing, there’s hope.
It doesn’t matter if the script is good or not. These people toyed with us for over a year, teasing us on the possibility of Shatner being in the movie.
Just last week AFTER THE POST ARTICLE, they had the nerve to say that they want Shatner in the movie, knowing full well they didn’t offer him a part.
That’s terrible.
That blows all the goodwill they’ve established.
Kirk as a character has no hope now. Another poster here had an idea of a comic prequel to explain Kirk’s presence. Or just an canonization of THE RETURN would do it.
Getting Kirk back among the living wasn’t that tough.
They made a STUPID choice.
I’m clearly not the only person pissed off right now. And they lost business as a result of this video.
Good. Let Paramount throw hundreds of millions at this film. I hope it grosses less than Nemesis.
Until I hear something from the guy who matters in this thing, JJ Abrams, I could care less what K&O, [i.e., the Hollywod Kidz] have to say about anything, and I’ll reserve judgment regarding the substance or immateriality of this movie until then.
I’m praying to God, given what I’ve heard heretofore, that he’ll butcher that script into something general audiences will flock to see, and not pander to a dwindling sect of zealots who behave as if Trek’s not only their personal property, but some kind of half-baked religion with Gene Roddenberry as their deity.
The only way for this thing [yes, I said thing] to survive is to shed that image of Trek generated over the last 20 or so years and appeal to folks who flock to see crap like Spiderman and Pirates of the Carribbean, and who watch shows like Lost and American Idol.
There aren’t enough “Thralls” left, [no matter how vociferous, world-weary and self-deluding they may be] in the “Gamesters of Trek” to do that, and they’re just gonna have to get used to the reality that both time and public convention have passed them by, and Trek looks to new frontiers and lifeforms. About damned time, too.
Rewrite the book, JJ. Start all over from scratch. Make your mark. Create new horizons and all the possibilities they represent, and I’m with you all the way, man.
KEEP ON TREKKING!!!!
#4
“Kirk’s dead, Spock isn’t…it’s as simple as that.”
Spock was dead once as I recall.
Re #33 Shadow6283
Dude, I agree with everything you just said.
Gotta be honest… if it’s true… I am more than a little bummed. Kirk’s ill-fated ending in Generations notwithstanding, I had really hoped that J.J. & Company would find a way to include The Shat in the new movie.
:(
Regardless, I’ll still gladly offer my Quatloos to Paramount.
Btw, #20. Sci-Fi Bri… Kirk is NOT dead! Shatner is NOT a… hmmmm, well… I’m pretty sure abut the first part. :)
re 30 - “If it is Kirks 24th century funeral then there is an opportunity for lots of cameos. Picard, Sisko, Janeway etc etc could all be there!”
Yuk! No thanks - that lot should he consigned to dvd and never let out
Sounds like Shatner may be a little miffed and is playing a game of Hollywood one-up-manship. Abrams and Co. can’t be happy about having a plot detail like that leaked this early.
I’d personally prefer no holdovers from the show, but as this board proves, it’s impossible to do something everyone is going to be happy with. However, if you’re going to do it, using Nimoy would seem to be the easiest and most graceful way to do it without a convoluted set of plans to resurrect anybody.
If Bill Shatner is absolutely, definately not in this in an acting capacity, then I admit I am disappointed. I didn’t like this iconic fantasy heroic character being “killed off”, and hoped there could be some ” sidestepping” writing to help Kirk cheat the odds one more time for this TOS era Movie. Whether as a quick “catch-up” introductory prologue intro. or some kind of “bookend”, or somekind of “flashback” o”flashforward”, either way with Leonard Nimoy involved. If Bill is not in this it will be interesting to confirm WHY not, whether it is because the writers or director wouldn’t or couldn’t resurrect his character, or whether it’s some issue to do with Bill himself. Either way, it will be a disappointing missed opportunity to have the character “living on” in imagination. And as far as Leonard goes, I truly hope we will see him as his OWN character in some older capacity, however brief, rather than some tacked on cameo as Spock’s father!
It doesn’t really matter how they use Nimoy. There was no demand nor call for Spock’s return. There has been a demand and call for Kirk’s return since Generations.
Kirk has unfinished business. Spock does not.
The producers really dropped the ball here. First major decision on this movie is a collosal mistake.
What REALLY makes me mad is that the writers flat out said they wanted Shatner in the movie when they knew full well they didn’t write him a part.
The lie pisses me off almost as much as the mistake.
If u had to pick THE MOST Iconic Star Trek character…..I think most would choose Spock over Kirk - plus the fact that Nimoy as Spock can be intergrated into the film quite seemlessly (unlike Shatner as Kirk)…well there ya go i guess….
still who knows.
Can’t wait to see the movie hopefully shatner will play a role. But if not oh well.I will enjoy it either because Mr Nimoys in the film.
Man, those Priceline ads are turning into a reality.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=HTqrFrEwee8
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=8wDM_g0aHN4
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=dTn2KYkoYlw&NR=1
-TGP-
I’m a “Star Trek” fan; I don’t do the actor-fandom thing. Shatner or not, makes no difference. This movie sounds like a winner so far.
#6: “As the article says… this won’t be the last we hear of this on-going saga. In my opinion, Shat priced himself out of the movie. But we’ll see.”
Exactly so. We’ll see what we’ll see. ;)
The fact that you can say “Shatner or not, makes no difference,” means you really don’t get it. Shatner IS Star Trek. Shatner just isn’t an actor–he is the franchise.
Star Trek without Shatner is bland. Yes, the hope is that the characters will bring back the wonder of the franchise, but the producers denying their biggest draw a role in the movie shows stupidity.
Any producer that doesn’t even have the guts to tell Shatner directly, doesn’t get Star Trek. The video says Shatner found out because Nimoy told him on the phone.
The producers flat out lied about wanting Shatner in the movie. That’s NOT a good way to run Star Trek.
Some people will buy anything that says Star Trek in the title. Most won’t.
All I want is a good movie. One that is fun to watch and doesn’t take itself too seriously. (that’s what made TOS good) And I don’t want to see Matt Damon or actors of his ilk in the film. I honestly don’t care if Shatner or Nemoy are in it or not, provided they don’t have them do some stupid, sappy retrospective. Give ‘em a cameo if need be. Please don’t allow them to make fools of themselves. (Shatner already does that enough on his own.)
I agree that the lying about Shatner is just as worse as him not being in it. They toyed with people’s feelings and hopes there. A lot of people have deep feelings about Shatner being in the film that it didnt help one of the writers giving us hope to the contrary after a report (now correct) told us he wasn’t going to be in it.
These are meant to be the best writers in the world. That they couldn’t come up with a plot that would work with Shatner involved I don’t buy for one second. Every time a major character died on Voyager, the crew sometimes changed years worth of timelines to bring their friends back… Every Berman era major character that was permanently killed off got a second chance: Yar, Dax, hell even Trip was put in cryo storage. Seeing a new Captain Kirk story but knowing the characters fate still exists at the hands of Rick Berman’s Generations… Not my cuppa Trek.
Shatner time for you to swallow your pride and call New Voyages up. Meanwhile I’ll be watching the Sulu one and hoping Farscape comes back.
I’d like to hear back from Orci after his comments. He has some serious explaining to do.
47 - “New Voyages”??
FWOK THAT!
Snake. These people love Star Trek and the Kirk character. If Paramount don’t want Shatner returning as Kirk you can bet these people do. I’d take his return on that medium over nothing. But as much as I love the man Shatner also has a big ego and likes his money. It will never happen.
anyone know what Berman wanted him to do in Enterprise? wasnt it something in the mirror universe or as a chef or something?
They lied to us for OVER A YEAR. More important, they lied to us a WEEK AGO AFTER THE POST ARTICLE.
They responded directly to the Post article and said that they would love Shatner in the movie.
To GET Shatner in the movie, you might consider writing a part for him in the script.
They kept us waiting FOR OVER A YEAR, teasing, talking about Shatner like they really revere the man. And now this? What are they going to do, bring him in as an advisor? Who gives a crap?
The lie and the disappointment overshadow the fact that Nimoy is actually returning. That would be a nice story, but for the fact that they ripped out the heart of the film.
Shatner and Nimoy are a package deal.
It may be a good script, but it’s soured.
49 - hey I love ST and Kirk too but theres no way id want Shatner to appear in any of that NV stuff… >:(
the guy who runs it (and plays Kirk) should go back to being an Elvis impersonator or whatever it was he did before
Know what PISSES me off?
You all assume.
You assume the writers are hacks and can’t write Trek based on Transformers. You also assume they lie. Do we know yet?
You assume that Shatner’s giving a whole story, while he may just be still in negotiations.
Deal with facts when they arrive, then whine or rejoice.
Message to ANTHONY PASCALE I’m sorry my friend but the petty and whining child like reactions in this comment section means I won’t be returning to your wonderful site I’m sick of all this petty overreactions that’s why I stopped going to the Star Trek.com forums and it’s why I’m going to stop coming here, Thanks to you Anthony Pascale it was a great site but I can’t take it anymore GOODBYE.
Even if these writers bound themselves to the TNG canon’s idiotic premise that there is a nexus that retains the “echo” (Guinan’s word) of all those who have been inside, so it follows that Kirk is still in there, Soran is still in there, Picard too; and because these residuals of conciousness are consistent with the Katra, and Spock has melded with both Kirk and Picard, access should not be a major plot impasse, just a little creative contrivance. If they really want the original Kirk, they can get him, this all may be posturing on Shatner’s part. Having said that, I wish the Shat would just think of the fans and take the leap, at 76 there really isn’t anything to be gained by some major payday demand.
The fact that Kirk died isn’t a problem. It’s a movie.
What is a problem is that Shatner can’t play the same Kirk convincingly. They’d have to age the character, which is a problem because Kirk died in middle age.
When we left Spock, on the other hand, he was already noticably aging. So, as has been suggested, a movie framed by appearences of an edlerly Spock would work, and really resonate with fans. (Probably bringing them to tears.) He could be readng Kirk’s memoirs, or addressing a StarFleet graduation, or just reminiscing with young Vulcans, but the segue to Shatner’s voice providing narration to scenes of the young Kirk and Spock that would comprise the primary action would be simple and obvious.
Oh, one more thing: Think of the impact if you’re sitting in a dark theater watching the new movie begin and the first character to appear on screen is Nimoy as Spock.
55 - Will we be moved to tears? I hope so….I want to see (through my own tear filled eyes.) hoards of fanboys WEEPING IN THE AISLES at the sheer emotionial POWER of this movie
all together now - Uh huh huh huh huh huh…..WHHHHAAAAAAAAA HUH - HUH HUH HUH UH HUH uh HUH…etc
53, Shatner flat out said there is no part for him in the movie. Can that change? Yes. But as of now, he’s not in the movie.
Regarding the use of the nexus, it’s even simpler than that.
The original Kirk is in there in one of two theories:
1. In the nexus, you exist at all points in time, including before you enter the nexus and after you leave. It’s the very nature of the thing. So the original Kirk is still in there (as is Picard). But if you leave the nexus at a point where you are still alive, you would replace the version of you that’s out of the nexus. That happened to Picard, since obviously there weren’t two of them fighting Soran. So Spock can go in there, grab Kirk, say, let’s roll, and they move on.
2. Picard is a wimp. Soran beat the snot out of him. Because of that, Soran won, and Picard and Soran both entered the nexus.
Once in the nexus, Picard dialed 1-800 GET KIRK. Kirk proceeded to fight Picard’s battle for him, though due to Picard’s negligence in choosing the most dangerous point in history for the confrontation, Kirk died a meaningless death. However, Soran was stopped.
By stopping Soran, Picard never enters the nexus.
So original Kirk is still in there.
From a plot standpoint, the nexus could still be used to bring Kirk back.
Of course, the writers aren’t bound to use the nexus. They could come up with something completely different.
However, they instead chose to lie to us for a year, including last week, and NOT WRITE SHATNER IN AT ALL.
When I mentionned Picard, Janeway, TNG Crew cameos earlier, I only meant a glimpse of them listening to Spocks speech :)
Who is this “us” that some say is beling lied to?
Paramount owes Trek fans: zero. From their perspective, those are the fans that ignored Nemesis.
Paramount’s obligation is to make a movie that makes money. They have ample reason to believe a Trek movie won’t make money if it is tailored solely to satisfy the whims of hardcore fans.
These days I’m not sure whether we can believe everything Mr. Shatner says… I don’t recall the last time he sounded serious in any interview I have seen or heard him in.
I think that until the casting announcements are made, we should quite honestly take this with an appropriately sized pinch of salt. That’s not to say I do not want to see (the original) Kirk in this new Trek movie, because I do.
But if it is his ego or monetary greed which has precluded him from appearing then I for one think that this is a sad day for Star Trek fans.
I believe that Mr. Shatner has most likely made a pretty large sum of money over the entirety of the original cast series of ST movies (yes I am aware he had lean years after the show was cancelled) and it would not hurt for him to think more of the fans at this particular point rather than the bulge of a wallet. Of course I am speculating based on what I have read and am not privy to any information of any relevance.
As the saying goes, this is just my two pence worth…
If I am proven to be incorrect over any of my assumptions I will eat my own hat and put the spectacle onto YouTube……
But do feel free to personally insult me, I could do with a chuckle ;)
Guys….methinks you’ll be waiting a long time if you want to see anyone from the TNG era shows….for better or worse, their day seems to have passed.
61 - about Shatners ‘lean years’
I think that was disgraceful - he should have been a millionarie many times over due to TOS but apparently didnt get any royalties (none of them did) so when it took off big time in the 70s and sold everywhere they didnt get anything - I dont even think they got anything for the merchadice.
They were so lucky that Trek came back and even more so as big budget movies…
I feel that Shatner and Nimoy pretty much Star Trek as much as Roddenberry did and Gene L Coon did etc etc
It was partly down to their performances
#55–who are YOU to decide that Shatner can’t play Kirk? The guy can play Kirk convincingly just fine. That’s just a ridiculous comment. As for the impact of Nimoy playing Spock being the first scene, now that Shatner is not there, who cares? Nimoy without Shatner is not good enough.
Shatner’s lack of participation overshadows the news of Nimoy being in the movie. There won’t be any impact, just disappointment.
And to say Paramount owes the fans zero, that is probably an even dumber statement than saying that Shatner can’t play a convincing Kirk.
Paramount owes the fans EVERYTHING. Without them, there is no franchise for them to butcher. The fans have pumped money into this franchise and kept it going, even when Rick Berman was around.
Paramount has flushed Trek down the toilet for years. They have not shown they have known what they are doing since before Roddenberry died. They kept Berman employed for 10 years too long. They have kept out the biggest name in Star Trek.
And yes, they lied to the fans. They said they were interested in Shatner appearing in the movie. JUST LAST WEEK.
62 - yeah -and good riddence - those DS9/Voyager days still give me shivers
dark days those were.
#45: “The fact that you can say “Shatner or not, makes no difference,” means you really don’t get it. Shatner IS Star Trek. Shatner just isn’t an actor–he is the franchise.”
No, it means that I’m less narrowminded than you are. I “get it” just fine - what you don’t get is that Trek is a lot bigger than your tastes allow you to appreciate.
“Trek without Shatner is bland?” That’s your *opinion.* What is not opinion, but *fact* is that Trek has prospered in several incarnations over the last two decades entirely without Shatner and to the delight of many millions of fans the world over.
oh and Insurrection around the same time as well - Christ I’m suprised Trek has survived in any form after all that…let alone getting a big budget movie soon
just goes to show the solidness of the concept - and especially TOS
61,63: I’d guess that Shatner’s Boston Legal paycheck is significantly larger than anything he was paid for the movies. As for making money off TOS, well, I assume they all got residuals fom the reruns, but residuals from a 1960’s TV show can’t be enormous. As for merchandising money, I’m sure they didn’t imagine it when the contracted for TOS.
#55 billg
The fans may be moved to tears at an elderly Leonard Nimoy as Spock, but will it be tears of laughter at the actor that has to put on the ears as a young ‘un? ;)
Residuals in the 1960s were not nearly as renumerative as they are now. I don’t know what others were paid, but Shatner has said that he sold his residual rights back to the studio for a relatively small cash amount at the time that TOS ended.
Probably seemed like the smart idea at the time - a three-year show that was canceled, after all, was likely to disappear without a trace. I don’t know if that kind of buyout is even allowed under current SAG rules.
68 - ya think?
.I heard Shatner was paid $2 million for The Voyage Home and that was in 86…so thats gotta be more in todays money (maybe $6 million??) and $5 million for Generations in 1994 and he was only in that for about 25 mins
You are not narrowminded if you think Shatner belongs in this movie. But you are also not broadminded if you accept anything with Star Trek in the title. That makes you empty minded. Those few fans that remained with Enterprise and the Berman/Braga era fall into that category. They will swallow anything so it doesn’t matter what they think.
Trek without Shatner IS bland. And yes, that’s my opinion, and one that was shared by the millions of people that stopped watching Star Trek since 1994. Shared by the millions of people that decided not to bother to see Kirk-less Trek in the movies.
Trek has NOT prospered without Shatner. It tumbled dramatically.
this Nimoy In/Shats Out story is appearing on all the big movie news websites now - First ST new movie news they have bothered to report in a while:
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/33270
http://movies.ign.com/articles/802/802672p1.html
And that AICN article is way off saying it’s a total reboot when Abrams and the writers have said its more a prequel
oh wait - its saying it SHOULD be a total reboot….not its gonna be.
yeah right pal lets just throw out TOS and Movies and make Kirk a woman and Spock gay shall we..
oh and one of the the Star Trek II writers has just died
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/33269ed
#72
It didn’t tumble. Some of Voyager and DS9 are the best episodes of Star Trek I’ve seen. If anything, it simply turned to a different audience. They are no less “Trek” than any of TOS is.
Although I do admit that ENT is largely boring, and the franchise DID fail after Voyager finished (Nemesis and ENT). Hopefully after this new movie (hopefully) reawakens Trek’s potential, that they’ll make another series set after VOY. Frankly, I enjoy most of the TNG era shows a lot more than some TOS episodes.
They’re all Trek.
-TGP-
LOL@Kulessa
man o man….get thee to a Voyager/DS9/TNG site asap.
bet this new movie being set in TOS pisses you off eh?? Bet u cant understand why its not set post Nemesis on board the Titan under Captain Frakes with Harry Kim as 1st officer and having them trying to locate Sisko by means of Quark
#64 “who are YOU to decide that Shatner can’t play Kirk”
He’s a fan. As am I, as are you. We are all entitled to our opinions, so there is no need to have a go at someone for expressing what they think. You have, so let everyone else.
IMO: William Shatner is 76. He hasn’t appeared in any form of Trek since 1994, when he was 63, and even then he had to play his character in a retired position. Aside from a possible flashback plot, I do not believe he will appear in the film because he has aged where his character has not. His character is dead, for a start.
I for one am looking forward to this film. I hope it will allow trek to continue for a very long time, even if it involves changes. Remember, Kirk himself said that people can be frightened of change.
Let the film makers have a chance - they haven’t even started filming it yet, before people feel the need to dismiss their abilities or quality of work. I for one will be reserving judgment until I have seen the film, not before, no matter who says what.
Keep up the excellent work trekmovie.com!
Regards.
#77
You’re trying way too hard to start an argument. I don’t really care that it’s set in TOS, and I don’t really care for the movie that you just described. And frankly, I don’t care for you.
If you want to start an argument, good for you. I don’t see the point.
-TGP-
thats ok - i knew you wouldnt
not trying to start anything
I do think that DS9 and Voyager helped kill star trek though..am am really looking foward to the new movie Shatner or not
wasn’t there talk about Spock finding Kirk’s grave after Generations and then a flashback to their early days from that point in time from Spock’s point of view and memories…?
sounds like a good idea to me…kind of a parallel story line off on Generations
Bap bap bap bahhhhhh..bahhhhh bap bap bahhhhhhh…bap bap bap bahhhhhhhbah…bahhhh bap bap bah bahhhh
thats me singing the DS9 theme - hope you like it Hulessa
#76, it tumbled dramatically, both in quality and in ratings. Opinions can vary, but ratings are gold. The decline in numbers from Season 1 of Voyager through Season 7 of Voyager, combined with the decline from Season 1 of Enterprise to the end were insane. Most shows get canceled with ratings like Voyager and Enterprise.
Fact: The ratings declined every single year since Generations.
These filmmakers don’t deserve a chance. They dropped the ball the first chance they got. They pretended to have interest in Shatner for OVER A YEAR, and just LAST week DENIED the Post article and flat out said they were still interested.
That’s called lying folks.
They are making a dumb mistake.
>
Re #33 Shadow6283
Dude, I agree with everything you just said.
Thanks, man. Just good old boy, Kansas Prairie Common Sense, as they say where I hail from originally. Abrams had better listen while there’s still something left to salvage.
Hey, you the same jon1701 over at the TrekBBS?
Generations should be ignored at all costs. Firstly, it came out 13 years ago and most of the general audience has probably forgotten about it anyway. I think that fun tingling feeling that Star Trek fans get when they see the original Kirk and Spock up on the big screen for one last go will outweigh any concerns about ‘canon’.
Hoping against hope that they change their minds about Shatner.
yeah but Generations had Whoppi Goldberg in it….WHOPPI FUCKING GOLDBERG damnit!!
a bone fide *A* lister!!! You can’t just throw it in the trash when it has someone of that acting stature in it!
God I hope she pops up in the new movie
#76 Hon. David Kulessa:
It didn’t tumble. Some of Voyager and DS9 are the best episodes of Star Trek I’ve seen. If anything, it simply turned to a different audience. They are no less “Trek” than any of TOS is.
Although I do admit that ENT is largely boring, and the franchise DID fail after Voyager finished (Nemesis and ENT). Hopefully after this new movie (hopefully) reawakens Trek’s potential, that they’ll make another series set after VOY. Frankly, I enjoy most of the TNG era shows a lot more than some TOS episodes.
They’re all Trek.
There’s a big difference between A Star Trek and THE Star Trek. “TOS” is “THE” Star Trek, while TNG, DS9, VOY and [choke] ENT are “A” Star Trek. The PTB know this. That’s why we’re getting a movie set in that classical, epic era. To paraphrase Ron Moore: “Sorry, I’m afraid the 23rd Century’s [not 24th-?] is the future of Star Trek.” Get used to it, for at least another 20+ years or more.
As far as Trek’s potential, it’s limitless. But, I guarantee you this, if you’re counting on more post 23rd Century “Trek” following this movie, you’d better think again. That ain’t gonna happen. Any show will remain [where it belongs] in the 23rd Century, the same era where the movie takes place.
It’s too bad they think Generations has to be honored in any way; that movie did more to fracture Trek than any other event. I do think Shatner is kind of tough to follow, though, and they may not want to overshadow the new actor; or this is all bogus or it’s about salary. But if the script is done, this might be all she wrote. Too bad. Nimoy and no Shatner? Killing off Kirk for no reason was just nonsensical, and it will put a cloud on the “new” character, too, who we all know has that bridge to nowhere in his fictional future. Oh well. Still have the DVDs, VHS too.
All this whiny crap about the Nexus and TNG and Generations. WHO CARES? Just act like it never happened. The Motion Picture was better than any TNG movie because it had the REAL Star Trek characters, and actors in it, and they ignored that whole movie when they made Wrath of Khan. Just ignore the whole Generations storyline. THAT would be ballsy!
Bottom line: Star Trek was always Kirk/Shatner Nimoy/Spock et al. All the goodwill and interest in the “franchise” is based on that foundation. The evidence is in the box office of the TNG movies, and the ratings of the spin off series. Money talks, fanboy “canon” walks. (I hate the use of the word “canon” in this context btw/this ain’t church!) So you piss off the TNG geekos; you’ll make it up in box office cultural curiosity crossover business as non-ST fans tune in for the big comeback.
Shatner is burning hot and bright in his old age. Nemesis blew. To not include Shatner is a stupid BUSINESS move. He will sell tickets. The return of Capt Kirk is worth triple whatever they pay the Shat in opening week box office.
I no longer care about this film.
Unfortunately, you can’t solve a problem by pretending it never happened. They never ignored TWOK.
If there is a line in Trek XI establishing Kirk being alive post Generations, that’s another story, but without Shatner, there is no reason to believe they will do that.
Money DOES talk. But canon matters. Ignoring canon actually pisses people off, and causes them to walk.
By LYING to us just a week ago, and NOT going with Shatner, they simply cost themselves a LOT of money.
No Shatner? No interest.
#83: “it tumbled dramatically, both in quality and in ratings. Opinions can vary, but ratings are gold. ”
Yep - and TNG was *enormously* successful for seven years. Paramount made more money off of TNG and the associated merchandising than any other version of Trek; at its zenith, more people were watching that show than could be lured into the theaters to pay for Star Trek 5 or Star Trek 6.
All that success, without even a whiff of the “essential” William Shatner. Imagine that.
In any event, by the time the dust settles the Shat will have a walk-on somewhere in this movie, and if the film is successful the Shatner fetishists will declare that the only reason it did well was because he hoisted himself through a short scene at the beginning.
And la-de-da, life will go on. :lol:
No shatner in it for 5 seconds? no need to explain post/pre Generations bollocks
TNG was successful BEFORE they killed off Kirk. The TNG movies tanked. Even First Contact has a high budget and is only in the middle of the pack when it comes to profits.
Paramount did NOT make more money off TNG than TOS. You’re kidding yourself if you believe that.
TNG was a successful syndicated show that did not air against network TV. It was a complete failure in the theatre. The second TNG was off the air, it was out of sight, out of mind.
Shatner MADE Star Trek, and to this day, IS Star Trek.
Like I said, they cost themselves a LOT of money. And more important, their lying cost them a LOT of goodwill. There is NO downside to having Shatner in the movie.
Big mistake.
Could it be a money issue with Shatner?
Wasn’t it only last week that tptb said they wanted to include Shatner in the film?
Could it be a money issue with Shatner?
Wasn’t it only last week that tptb said they wanted to include Shatner in the film?
“TNG was a successful syndicated show that did not air against network TV. It was a complete failure in the theatre. The second TNG was off the air, it was out of sight, out of mind. ”
I have to agree there - I know FC did decent BO but it was a great film (basically the ALIENS storyline done as Trek) plus TNG had only recently finished..
The other 2 films BOMBED because they wer shit and also NO ONE CARED
rewatching TNG today is quite embaressing - especially season 1 and 2 lol
#90 Unfortunately, you can’t solve a problem by pretending it never happened. They never ignored TWOK.
Me: I said they ignored TMP, not TWOK. They did ignore TMP, except for the new Enterprise. “Problems don’t age well” is another good phrase. To be precise, I am more interested in fixing the error of Kirk’s death. I am not concerned about Generations, and would “ignore” its entire plotline to fix the error. To be clear.
# 91 Yep - and TNG was *enormously* successful for seven years. Paramount made more money off of TNG and the associated merchandising than any other version of Trek; at its zenith, more people were watching that show than could be lured into the theaters to pay for Star Trek 5 or Star Trek 6.
All that success, without even a whiff of the “essential” William Shatner. Imagine that.
In any event, by the time the dust settles the Shat will have a walk-on somewhere in this movie, and if the film is successful the Shatner fetishists will declare that the only reason it did well was because he hoisted himself through a short scene at the beginning.
Me: That has more to do with the realities of modern syndication vs. 1960’s finances than anything else. Also, for all the high-minded “quality” of TNG, it was made possible in the wake (pun definitely intended) of the cute whale movie; ST 4, which probably makes sci-fi purists heads explode.
#93: “TNG was successful BEFORE they killed off Kirk. The TNG movies tanked. ”
Wrong. Only two Trek movies have come close to “tanking:” the one Shatner directed and the last one, “Nemesis.”
In fact, the most successful and popular TNG film was the one made *after* they killed Kirk. Shatner’s involvement was immaterial to the success or failure of “Star Trek” by that time.
As to where Paramount’s made the most money - go look it up.
Shatner *probably* won’t be in the next “Star Trek” film - wouldn’t count him out, because he’s lobbying in public now - but he *probably* won’t.
Doesn’t matter, because James T. Kirk *will* be. :)
Why would the writers not want Kirk + Spock to walk off into the sunset together?
Paramont really blew it again in regards to Star Trek.
This is just going to be another lame prequel/money grab. That’s too bad because it could have really been very special to have Kirk + Spock back one more time.
It’s not too late to get Shatner involved.
Wrong. Insurrection tanked.
$58 million budget, $70 million box domestic office, in 1998 dollars. That’s pathetic. It was the lowest ranked Trek movie in a year until Nemesis. Remember that half the money goes to theaters. They lost money on Insurrection.
That was a dud. It was the first Trek movie not to even be number one in its opening weekend.
Star Trek V only had a $27 million budget and made $55 million domestically. It actually made more money for the studio, and that was the biggest TOS dud.
One out of six.
TNG failed 3 out of 4 times.
Yeah, Shatner probably won’t be in this movie. And neither will a good chunk of the audience.
After teasing it for over a year, Abrams is slapping fans in the face by doing that.
You may accept anything with Star Trek in the title, but most people aren’t like that.
#97, they didn’t ignore TMP–the movie was set over a decade later, and they went in a different direction. There were no contradictions.
#101: “$58 million budget, $70 million box domestic office, in 1998 dollars.”
Cute game playing. Go look up real totals instead of first-run domestic, and get back to me.
Anyway, the fethists should chill. The Shat may yet get his little walk-on, and you can declare “victory. :lol:
# numbers to numerous to type…
All these arguments and assumptions over nothing. Shatner spoke and you all kneeled…oh please. Where are the facts? Because he said so? He helped kill Kirk, irregardless of what he said after Generations.
This is all just a bunch of meaningless BS and spamming until it’s actually confirmed. Let’s find out what really is going to happen then you can all have your collective “I told you so”.
OK seriously now i do think we are ignoring 2 BIG factors with this news
I’ve not read one posative thing about NIMOY being in it - as i said before back at 41 “If u had to pick THE MOST Iconic Star Trek character…..I think most would choose Spock over Kirk - plus the fact that Nimoy as Spock can be intergrated into the film quite seemlessly (unlike Shatner as Kirk)…well there ya go i guess….”
Another thing - the script MUST BE quite good if Nimoy is involved….He’s known for being rather choosy with Trek and wouldnt do Generations because of the script…
Ok so Shats says he’s not in it - That may change - or he might he joking around
StillKirok, I know you’re angry, but you don’t have any cause to make false accusations against the screenwriters. They’ve never lied, that I can see–all they’ve said was they hoped Shatner would play some role in the movie. They didn’t say he was coming back as Kirk or that they were going to bring him back to life.
You’ve really got no one but yourself to blame for getting your hopes up so high, based on little to no evidence. I’ve tried warning you before you were setting yourself up for a fall…but the truth has ALWAYS been making this movie about Kirk’s return back to life in the TNG era was mere speculation on your and other Shatner lovers’ parts.
You did this to yourself. Sorry, but that’s the way it is.
And does this sound like a real conversation or two friends joking around? (Note Nimoy laughing)
“Shatner: There is a Star Trek movie and I called Leonard. I said “have you heard” and he said “yes I have,” I said “what do you mean?” and he said “I have read the script.” I said “Is it a good script?” and he said “ya.” I said “am I in it?” and then there was a pause, he said “no” and then he began to laugh.
In my opinion… two things to note.
one…. Nimoy says it’s a good script
two… Nimoy laughing.
form your own opinions, just don’t call them facts.
The screen writers did lie. They said they were surprised at the report that Nimoy was in but Shatner wasnt and said they wanted him in the film because they have nothing but awe for him,
Speil.
They didnt write him in the movie. They knew that he wasn’t in but Nimoy was.
They lied. And brought hope to many Shatner fans that the new york times piece was a fabrication.
The next time they are interviewed someone should bring that up. But given their track record an honest answer isn’t something i’d expect.
boy this is getting heated. There can be a million reasons for this turn of events, but to start saying the writers are liars is jumping to conclusions. I believe they are sincere, but Shatner himself has specific demands and who knows if they can meet them. I am sure there is more to this story than what i have been told and what has been made public
btw Bill in the 2nd interview video…talking about his OS cast members
‘They didnt know they loved me’ LOL
btw i just listened to the first video again and i really do think that Shatner is telling the gods honest truth…he really believes he’s not in it.
#108 Dalek,
Perhaps it could be read as they wrote both in and expected Nimoy to say no and Shatner say yes. It could well be that Shatner is in negotiations and you are relying exclusively on very little unconfirmed information.
In effect, you don’t know if anyone is lying until more actual FACTS are known.
Cute game playing. Go look up real totals instead of first-run domestic, and get back to me.
================
First run domestic. That’s what is the standard for measuring a film’s success. Either way, it was a HUGE disappointment. The film did $20 million LESS than FC, with a $13 million greater budget. You can delude yourself all you want, but Insurrection was a HUGE failure.
Xai–yes, Shatner helped kill Kirk. He screwed up–13 years ago. He’s admitted it, apologized for it, and done everything he could to rectify it, from writing the most successful fiction books in Trek history, to making numerous attempts over the years to have the character returned. He made a mistake, but shouldn’t be forced to pay for it forever. Not in this franchise.
Snake–yes, Nimoy being in it means it’s a good script, but it also is well overshadowed by the lack of Shatner. Spock alone means nothing. There is no NEED for Nimoy to return. There IS a need for Shatner because of Generations.
106, you are simply wrong. They lied. From Orci, “We’re certainly hoping to include him in the shoot, because we have nothing but reverence and awe for the man.”
How could they be hoping to include him in the shoot by not including him in the script?
Hence, a flat out lie.
So yeah, I’m angry, and I’m not alone. This was a year long tease with an obnoxious ending. That’s not going to win them back the fans they’ve lost.
Dennis:
While the exact numbers (inflation..etc) may not be 100% correct (it is not an exact science) I think it is fair to say that the TNG crew was simply not as iconic as the TOS crew.
Don’t get me wrong I love TNG, but they are not as popular as TOS. If they were Abrams would be trying to figure out a way to revisit those characters instead of Kirk and Spock.
I for one am very upset that Shatner will not be in this film (although I have learned to take what Shatner says with a grain of salt) and my interest at the moment has been decimated.
Maybe Nimoy was just jerkin around with Shats…cause he knows Shats in in negioiations with the studio about his fee etc so said ‘hey your not in it’ to make The Shats blood run cold and make him make a decision about his fee?
I DUNNO DO I I JUST GUESSING!
boy this is getting heated. There can be a million reasons for this turn of events, but to start saying the writers are liars is jumping to conclusions. I believe they are sincere, but Shatner himself has specific demands and who knows if they can meet them. I am sure there is more to this story than what i have been told and what has been made public
==================
Anthony–they didn’t write him in the script. Worse, they’ve been playing this stupid silence game for over a year. It’s one thing to keep a plot secret. It’s quite another to give starving fans hope and then to lie about it.
The worst part is they likely won’t comment on it until ComicCon.
But the fact is, they made their comments about wanting Shatner in the movie AFTER the Post article came out.
They need to speak out on this issue or go behind the scenes and make something happen with Shatner.
If not, they simply blew all the goodwill they had, and lost a good chunk of money.
The presence of Nimoy doesn’t even come close to the absence of Shatner.
Had this been reversed, with Shatner in and Nimoy not, you would not see the anger you are seeing today.
#112 StillKirok
you said….”106, you are simply wrong. They lied. From Orci, “We’re certainly hoping to include him in the shoot, because we have nothing but reverence and awe for the man.”
How could they be hoping to include him in the shoot by not including him in the script?”
Two questions….
1. Have YOU read the script?
2. If I told you the world was flat… would you believe me?
I’ll make it easy and answer the second. You’d say “no”… I’d say “why”. You’d say because there is overwelming evidence that the world is round”
Apply that logic to question one, and have some actual patience please.
ok this discussion thread is offically doing my head in now..
till the next piece of news people! (hopefully the revilation of the cast and that Shats is gonna be in it too)
bye
Wow.
I think some people need to get over their Shatner crushes. I think he’s great, and brought something quite unique in his portrayal of Kirk. But by the same token, I don’t deify him. The way some of you all talk, I think Shatner himself would call security if he saw you loitering around his front gate. And if you are such big fans of his, can’t you even see when he’s f@#king with you? The man loves to bullshit with people. Yeah, right. He and Nimoy are having a big spat over who is in the movie. Give me a break. You act as if this is a personal affront to you. The writers don’t need you, The franchise doesn’t need you. You are owed nothing. You are only being asked if you would like to go along for the ride. Stay home if it’s not your cup. Just try to say less idiotic things.
116–Nimoy has read the script, and said there is no part for Shatner. Hence, he’s not in it.
Let’s use your logic:
the overwhelming evidence is that he’s NOT in the movie.
I don’t know why some are finding it difficult to take Shatner’s statement at face value.
There’s only one thing that can cool tempers right now–a comment from Abrams, Orci or Kurtzman refuting this.
Right now, they have a LOT of angry people on their hands. Silence isn’t going to change that.
Xai–if you were Abrams, Orci, or Kurtzman, and made the same comments, responding to Shatner’s video, I’d be more patient.
But at this point, the producers have really tried that patience. The big question has been answered. And the answer is not cool.
#118–what kind of a dumb comment is that? Shatner crushes? Being a fan of one’s work is nothing sexual. Speak for yourself. What’s next, you going to say “Get a Life?”
As for the franchise not needing anyone, you clearly haven’t followed the ratings and box office totals of recent times. People HAVE stayed home. They HAVE abandoned it. The franchise is in TERRIBLE shape. This is a desperate revival attempt.
Kirok you are spamming and you are flaming….this is your one warning
119. StillKirok - July 10, 2007
The point is… you’ve not read it and were not present for ALL of the conversation. You don’t know anything more than this out of context paragraph.
I guess the world is flat.
No Shatner as Kirk… but they are bringing back Nimoy??? Man, I hope they are hiding something from us, and Shatner is indeed going to return. His death in generations was awful, and if the are making a prequel franchise, who wants to see when we all know what happens to Kirk?
Oh, and #118… I will never get over my Shatner crush!
If I’m honest im upset about it all. I feel that they have lied to us, definitely.
I would like information from them to the contrary. I’d hate to have to wait til comic-con. Passions are running high — let’s here from the source and not the PR machine now.
Kirok.
You ask us to use our logic but you make a statement based not on fact, but on hearsay. You are jumping to conclusions. If you have seen a script for this movie, e-mail me with a copy and I will forward you info on how to collect payment. But I’m pretty certain you are speaking out of emotion. And not logic.
My, but there is a lot of heated passionate opinion about this subject! First and foremost, what we are talking about is only a movie. If such devotion and energy went to something like, say, the environment, we wouldn’t need to worry about saving it. But I digress, it is a wonderful gift to recognize an opportunity to make many people happy, and it would be nice to believe that William Shatner and J.J. Abrams possess this ability. One more ride with the original Capt. Kirk has the potential for such a moment, and it seems to be as easy as saying “yes”. Star Trek has never been to hung up on how to resurrect people before, (ask Leonard Nimoy) so put egos and paychecks to the side and light this candle! Meantime, I look forward to the return of Indiana Jones. LLAP
I dont understand all the “Shatner wanted too much money” talk. If he was never written into the script in the first place, there wouldnt have been any discussion for payment.
I just think its kinda lame for Abrams and the writers to get our hopes up that Shatner will be in the movie, and then suddenly its revealed that he’s not even in the script.
Maybe there’s more to the story. Maybe Shatner will be in it anyway. I dont know. But right now I’m more than a little annoyed.
Shatner’s story doesn’t make sense… We know the producers met with him and Nimoy, it was confirmed by both parties. Either he was talking about something that happened a long time ago, before they met, or he is messing with our heads…..
P.S. Good to hear that Nimoy likes the script.
Anthony, I am doing neither. If that’s flaming, then what about the Shatner crush crack? But fine. Your site, your rules.
THX–the statement is based on fact. Nimoy read the script, told Shatner, who told us. That’s not jumping to a conclusion.
“There is no part for me in the script.” Pretty clear.
I don’t see how you can NOT draw the simplest conclusion from the statement.
Believe me, nothing would make me happier than to have a producer come online and make a statement in response to this video and renew the hope.
Doesn’t seem likely though.
“There is no part for me in the script” is industry code for “I don’t like the part they want me to play
‘
Shatner told me the world was flat so it must be true.
Shatner told me the world was flat so it must be true.
enough crap for now
Shatner did not tell you the world is flat. Your logic is flawed. Shatner has no reason to lie about it.
Hey look, like I said, I want to see this change. It would be welcome news. Maybe Orci or Kurtzman will actually say something before ComicCon.
I don’t believe in the no-win scenario.
..as flippant as Shatner is..about EVERYTHING…I find it amazing that so many people are taking his word at face value. Maybe I’ve just seen way too many interviews with the man, but I would take everything he said with a grain of salt so big the salt vampire could live off of it for a year.
Now the Shat is out of the picture, what’s next cutting Spock’s scene(s) in post.
The more I think of Orci’s comment “We’d like to include him (Shatner) in the shoot” the more I think he meant as a behind the scenes consultant type who visits the set or something. This blows. I’m glad we’ll be getting Spock back on the big screen, but I really wanted to see Kirk by his side one more time….
Huh, huh, huh….
I love watching all the people grousing about how without Shatner, the movie will suck, and threatening to boycott it. I’d be willing to bet, though, that, come 2008, they’ll be in line at the local movie theater wearing their best Spock costumes. Please, everyone; we haven’t had a genuinely exciting Star Trek project in years…..let’s just sit back and enjoy the ride. (And enough Generations bashing, people; it kind of gets old after a while)
-Nathan
#104: “All these arguments and assumptions over nothing. Shatner spoke and you all kneeled…oh please. Where are the facts? Because he said so?”
Exactly so. Based on past history, I’d believe just about anyone else involved before I’d believe Shatner.
If his demands during negotiations were reasonable, that would be a first - what *is* a first is that the studio will make the picture with or without him, so if he wants in this time he’ll have to blink. That is why *he’s* the one carrying this on in public; no one else is budging. And good for them. :)
You all are just a bunch of nerds.
;-)
i totally agree with everything StillKirok has said, just look at the chronology of events……it’s right there!
# news article that says Shatner is angry at Nimoy.
# statement from Orci & Co saying they want Shatner in the shoot.
# Shatner now says Leonard has read script and that he isn’t in it.
my own opinion is that Shatner has no reason to lie about it, nor does Mr Nimoy, seems pretty clear to me that William Shatner never had any intention of being cast in this new movie :(
there’s a small chance he could be added at the last minute but i doubt it.
It’s a diversion, folks. If you are willing to believe anything, then believe that.
And Marvin, the term is geeks.
As another poster has said, it’s certainly workable to bring back Kirk from the Nexus, due to it’s sci-fi nature. It’s possible to bring back Kirk alive and it might be entertaining to do so plausibly. Or they could leave him dead and do the Spock reminiscing thing with only Kirk’s voice to provide the older version.
Personally, I’d just ignore anything after Star Trek VI and take into account the history of the original 79 Star Trek episodes and six movies and go from there. Doing this, they’d adhere to only what was established for the original series characters and not have to worry about the “cannon” of all the other spin-off series and movies. Simple and effective. Just go with the original series events and characters. That should be enough trek history to develop for possible future films.
If both actors are in it, or one or none, it should be interesting to see what develops.
#135–he’s actually been the only one who is dead honest. It was like that with the Enterprise negotiations. When it was about money, he said it was about money. No need to lie about that.
The problem with ignoring all Trek post-ST6 is that it doesn’t change that post-ST6, there is a hell of a lot of Trek stories that are a part of the official canon.
You can’t fix a problem by ignoring it.
By not addressing Generations at this time, they are still ignoring it. The character still has no future. Anything Kirk does is tainted by his stupid death. And worst of all, now we have the possibility that they may kill Spock too.
Dennis Bailey: I’ve noticed that you always seem to be bagging on Shatner all the time. I guess its safe to say that you dont like the man, huh? Just an observation.
Speculation aside, I’m waiting to hear the final word from JJ Abrams. I could care less what the Hollywood Kidz have to say about anything in any case, never did, and never will. I can’t believe folks swallowed that spiel of theirs for so long.
Still, it’s Abrams call, not theirs, and I’m certain he’ll correct this in due time, if he doesn’t want to create the biggest firestorm since Project Genesis blew the hell outta the Mutara Nebula.
StillKirok
You ain’t Crambam, are you?
OK, I’m Capt. Obvious.
Shatner story… 140-something comments.
If he’s not in this movie… just send him to the theater and sell tickets. Paramount will still get rich (er).
This thread certainly makes it clear that it’s more important to the fans that William Shatner is in the movie then whether the Enterprise design is modified mildly or a lot.
I think this is all spin. We should take a stress pill and chill. The facts will come out soon. It’s obviously some kind of game that is being played out and the fans are the barometer.
Nelson–seems like the facts are out. There’s really no reason to NOT take it at face value.
oh my god oh my god oh my god oh my god no shatner in this movie its gunna sock i’m not gonna see it wah wah wah
Just kidding. Who really knows who’s actually gonna be in this? We are so still in the fanning the flames of bullshit stage of publicity. Very little is known for certain, while much is still up for speculation and discussion. It’s difficult to judge when we’re hearing facts, or just manipulation to maintain interest, or an attempt at jockeying for a better position.
Whatever, it makes for a good show before the actual show, all these people with their little leaks here and there, most of which add up to nothing, but still, there’s nothing like rampant fan speculation. Except maybe crack. Or meth. Or crack laced with meth. Or an actual film to watch - I guess that would be better, but entails much waiting. Which brings us back to speculation. Woo hoo!
I have seen an *amazing* number of great TV shows and movies in the last forty years that have not featured William Shatner in *any part whatever.*
Seriously. Hard to believe, I know, but true. :)
Not to get your hopes up, but think about it: In TWOK we had Spock get killed off. The fans were upset and when TSFS came out, everyone went to the theatre hoping for his return. Remember, Nimoy’s name wasn’t in the opening credits of TSFS. Why? Because they wanted to keep you wondering right up to the “Jim. Your name is Jim!” moment.
Now, Kirk has been dead since Generations. The new movie comes out in December, 2008. The producers have “hinted” that the original Kirk (Shatner) might be in the movie. Same methods, same ideology. Where’s the fun, or surprise, if they announce NOW that Shatner will reprise the role of Kirk risning from the dead? History may be repeating itself!
Oh, and on another note, when people talk about how the script MUST be good because Leonard Nimoy “likes it”. Puhlease!! Nimoy’s the one who insisted on the brainfart premise involving the whaleshit story! He couldn’t find a good story if he had a map and flashlight!!!
Of course, the “whaleshit story” *was* the biggest cross-over-to-the-mainstream hit that the Trek film franchise ever had, and the second-biggest grossing Trek film of all time.
What, it’s not the most popular with Trekkies? Tough, but not for Nimoy or the studio.
shatner is so frikken old that he could only to voiceover work…. if he appears in the film it will be a joke
hmmmm….
whaleshit = ambergris
ambergris = perfume
prefume smells sweet… like money
Shatner kinda been lookin’ whale-like
therefore, Shatner equals money
Dennis:
No doubt that you are correct when you say Shatner is not the be all + end all of the universe
But, Shatner’s take on Kirk is special to many people. Shatner/Kirk brings something to the series that simply cannot be measured.
To many people he is the living embodiment of Star Trek. HE IS THE BIGGER THAN LIFE HERO that Star Trek has been sorely lacking since the characters poor ending.
Was there ever a worse ending for a major fictional character?
I mean, here is this icon that is simply thrown off a cliff by the writers of Generations because in their mind their version of ST was better. History has proven they were wrong.
In trying to rid the ST universe of Kirk they unintentially threw millons of fans of Kirk off that cliff as well. The franchise has not been the same since. I am upset because I thought they were going to fix that problem.
When Kirk died so did ST in many people’s eyes. I think many people saw this as the final chance to give the Kirk character (a character that is special to many people) a last chance at life.
Many people want to see that bigger than life hero defeat death just one more time. That’s what movies are for.
It’s still not to late.
JJ if your out there bring Shatner back to ST + allow it’s greatest character the ending he deserves.
Before we kill Abrams + the other writers is there a chance that Shatner is asking for too much money like he did with Enterprise?
Anthony hinted that there may be some “specific demands” that Shatner had that maybe could not be met.
I would be a lot less upset if the writers tried to get Shatner into the film but he was asking too much money + backed out on them.
If they included Nimoy + not Shatner for reasons other than money/demands I’d be very upset.
There is still time to include Shatner as Kirk.
Lord Garth is pissed off !!! Mute Andorian and mute Tellerite henchman are on their way over to Bad Robot Productions right now
I can’t tell you how shattered I am at hearing this news. I feel these new writers had a wonderful opportunity to bring Kirk back and undo the wrongs of that horrible “Generations” movie. Real creative writers could do it. Hell I can do it!! So why can’t they. I am now going back to my TOS books and am forgetting this movie. I am very disappointed. They cruelly led us to believe that there was a chance that Shatner and Nimoy together would be back. Now that looks lost …….. and shame on them.
#155 “whaleshit story was the biggest cross-over-to-the-mainstream hit”
Only because ALL the fans, who were completely jazzed by TWOK+TSFS, went to the movies expecting more of the same! TVH had a pre-sold audience who were BETRAYED, discovering the letdown only AFTER they had bought a ticket and entered the theatre! That whale storyline reduced Star Trek to The Three Stooges in one fell swoop!!! Disgraceful!
What if Indiana Jones or James Bond just fell off a cliff for no apparent reason to his death?
Wouldn’t fans of those great characters have a right to be pissed off?
Kirk’s death is so lame and must be fixed.
This might be the only chance we get
# Ivory………
for me personally, Kirks death at the end of Generations was the contrived piece of cinema i’d ever seen, it was wrong then and it is now.
he should indeed get the death his character deserves, or revival
i hope Shatner does manage to be cast, but i’ll see the movie regardless
look at this way, IMO Berman only killed the character off to give the TNG series of movies a fighting chance at the box office……..and to sever the chance of any TOS movie with that particular cast and crew being made :(
ARE THEY F**KIN JOKING, someone ring up those two fan boys writing the script and tell them to put Shatner in it , i dont care if tis money he wants , the man is William Shatner ! if they want to make any money on this film actually have people wanted to see it , then pay him whatever he wants ( i dont care how they get it , rob fort knocks or something ) .
PEOPLE MAYBE YOU SHOULD LOOK AGAIN AT THIS PICTURE FROM THIS VERY SITE
http://trekmovie.com/wp-content/uploads/kirkawesome.jpg
In my opinion, the writers, producers, and director should definitely take the all or nothing approach. Both Kirk and Spock in the movie, or neither one in the movie.
If the situation were reversed and the Shat was in but Nimoy out, I would still be upset. Someone said it earlier. They’re a package deal, and get the best work out of each other.
Dennis Bailey wrote:
> I have seen an *amazing* number of great TV shows and movies in the
> last forty years that have not featured William Shatner in *any part
> whatever.*
I’ve seen a lot of t.v. shows and movies in the last 52 years, and when William Shatner shows up, those productions are extra special. The Museum of Television & Radio think so, too, and that’s why they inducted William Shatner in their Hall of Fame. The tribute that they gave to him for his career of accomplishments was outstanding. William Shatner — actor, director, producer, writer… and that’s just in the show biz side of his life.
brain set on shuffle… so, just some thoughts:
Kirk deserves a better death than he got in Generations. Check.
I, as a fan, don’t really want to see all my heroes die on screen.
IF Kirk is brought back, I, as a fan, do not necessarily need or want an explanation. Sherlock Holmes DIED. Then he wasn’t dead. Conan Doyle offered no explanation and no one complained because they were too busy enjoying his return in ‘Hounds.’
Still, I, as a fan, also do not want to see my heroes age to the point of senility on screen. Shatner is not young. He is good. He is spry. He is not young.
SO… My last, best hope, as a fan is this:
Pay Shat his bucks. Have him do a voice-over from an undisclosed perspective/ point in time and let the audience see him introduce ‘himself’ played by a new actor.
Oh, and I want the E in there all fresh and pretty. Her on screen demise hurt worse than losing Spock or Kirk.
This just in:
New Star Trek film by Abrams will not take place in outer space or the future. Also to be filmed in black and white. And it will be a “flapper era” musical starring the corpse of Jimmy Durante.
JJ:
Bring back Shatner as Kirk before it’s too late.
This sux but Kirk died in Generations. They are keeping Bermans cannon!
#167: “I’ve seen a lot of t.v. shows and movies in the last 52 years, and when William Shatner shows up, those productions are extra special.’
Well, if you want to count *before* “Star Trek” I guess I’d have to say that I’ve seen a lot of TV shows and movies in the last *53* years and not one of the ones I’ve really liked - other than TOS and several of the TOS-based movies - have featured William Shatner. He certainly hasn’t appeared in a single of the really good TV shows or films that I’ve seen in the last twenty.
So, I’m perfectly open to the likelihood that Abrams and company can make a kickass movie without Shatner - it’s done all the time. This one will happen to be “Star Trek.” :)
cue of Amok Time theme for Robert and Dennis
anwoon or lirpa, gentlemen?
Well, the other ridiculous thing is this unfounded notion that if Shatner had a part in the film that it would consist of “undoing” the storyline of “Generations.”
That was a movie made - what, sixteen years ago? Paramount is making a new film for a mass audience *now* and they’re not going to squander resources on making nice over the fact that some fans from those days didn’t like the role that Shatner signed on to play in *that* film.
There’s more than a chance that in the end Shatner will be in the next Trek film somewhere, for a couple of lines, but that won’t make the film into a “Bring Back Kirk” vehicle. Quite clearly they’ve got an approved script, that they like, in which the participation of Shatner and Nimoy is *optional.* That tells you where the focus of the story is, and it ain’t on the Starfleet Retirement Village.
i don’t think Dennis Bailey likes William Shatner all that much, as Kirk or anything lol
Dennis is right that it is not a priority to ‘deal with Generations’…the film is not a swiss army knife…it cannot ‘fix’ every issue for every subset of the fandom.
it has one job and one job alone…to make star trek a large viable franchise again.
Dennis, I don’t know why but right now Trekkies remind me of the French.
Specifically, this quote:
“How can anyone govern a nation that has two hundred and forty-six different kinds of cheese?”
— Charles de Gaulle (1890-1970), French general, president. Quoted in: Newsweek (New York, 1 Oct. 1962)
I agree with you that Shatner is no longer the center of the Trek universe. Sad, that people can’t appreciate his contribution and move on.
Starfleet Retirement Village? Hmm… Kirk and Rand in depends?
#175: “i don’t think Dennis Bailey likes William Shatner all that much, as Kirk or anything”
I just don’t care one way or the other. I liked him as Kirk - better on the TV series than in the movies because I liked Kirk better on the TV series than in the movies.
But someone else is going to be Kirk now, and it’s really past time for that.
I liked George Reeves as Superman when I was a kid, and later I liked Christopher Reeve in the same part. No biggie.
Dennis + Anthony:
I am not embarrassed to say I was hoping Star Trek XI as a bring back Kirk vehicle.
Post # 163 by Ivory was 100% correct when she/he said
“What if Indiana Jones or James Bond just fell off a cliff for no reason” + that “Kirk’s death was the “worst death of any major fictional character ever” in post 158.
I totally understand that for the franchise to survive they must bring in new fans.
On the other hand I don’t see why they can’t do both. Apparently with the inclusion of Leonard Nimoy Abrams + company feel that they can satisfy the old fans while bringing in new fans at the same time.
My question is why can’t they include Shatner as Kirk? It would make so many people happy.
I am very upset (well as upset as one can be about a film) about this news. My entire attitude towards this project has changed.
I just don’t care if Shatner is not in it as Kirk.
Ivory:
Your posts at 158 + 163 said it all.
Well done.
#179: “My question is why can’t they include Shatner as Kirk? It would make so many people happy.”
I imagine that they can, if the deal is right. The days when he was driving this train, though, are clearly long past.
They’ve got a movie to make, and he’s either willing to do that movie for a reasonable price or not.
#178, Dennis.
i’m open to recasting in this new film, it needs to be done for obvious reasons (time period it’s set in, original actors current ages)
i’m very interested to see what a new cast can bring to the iconic roles, it would just be nice “if” they could work Shatner in to it somehow
i’ll see this film regardless,and hope it’s good :)
So I leave for a couple hours and people are STILL believing this load of BS?
Don’t believe all you read, especially on the internet. And then please don’t start assuming the worst. We have people that are referring to others as liars or worse.
Let’s be reasonable and believe it AFTER someone confirms it. Until then this is a lot of flaming and spamming.
[…] (Anm.: Auch dieses Interview ist Teil des Gesprächs, das Shatner in der ‘KABC Morning Show’ geführt hat. Siehe hierzu auch seinen Bericht über ehemalige Trek-Kollegen und Trek-Conventions. Dies ist eine Übersetzung des Original-Artikels der sich beim Trek Movie Report finden lässt.) […]
#182: “it would just be nice “if” they could work Shatner in to it somehow”
And it may happen yet. Shatner didn’t put this clip up on his website just to entertain his fans - he obviously wants to do it. He wants to do it on his terms. That won’t happen, but that doesn’t mean he won’t do it.
i see a lot of ire directed at the film makers here. Bear in mind that they have said little about Shatner and Nimoy except to talk about their respect for them. It was Abrams who went out of his way to reach out to both of them. It was the film makers who set up meetings with both of them last fall. As I understand it they always wanted to find a way to involve them and both Shat and Nimoy let them know what it would take. Beyond their monetary needs they also had specific needs of what they wanted in the script for their roles. The writers then went off then to write the script.
To make this all work many stars need to come into alignment. The script needs to please paramount, please nimoy, please shatner, please abrams, please the budget, etc.
Shatner is the one who has stoked the rumors more than anyone. Shatner is the one who told them what he wanted to do the film. It just might be that there is no way to get everything right.
but are you going to fault them for trying. What if they just dismissed Shat and Nimoy from the outset as ‘old news’…what if they dismissed canon and the fans. They havent done that…but they cannot do EVERYTHING to please EVERYONE….that is too much to ask.
If you feel that a Star Trek film can only succeed with a 2 minute scene with Shatner and if that scene is is not in it then the other two hours suddenly become moot then that is a very very narrow view of the universe.
Do I wish they could all figure out a way to make it work…Yes of course. But I want a good movie more than anything…that is the focus.
anyway that is the most I will say, but I do think people need to get some context and perspective here
Dennis:
Are you suggesting Shatner is trying to shake them down for more money?
I wouldn’t doubt it if he is.
You have more connections than just about anyone here.
If Shatner is in this simply for the money + is giving them a hard time about signing over this then shame on him.
I agree that Shatner seems to have an agenda by putting these clips on the net. He isn’t doing this because he cares about his fans
He also has a track record of doing this. Anyone remember his Enterprise negotiations?
Let’s hope this is Shatner being Shatner + that he will appear in the film.
Anthony i can understand and appreciate what you’re saying. Im sure you understand a lot of people are understandably upset that after indications that Shatner might return after so many years of nothing, only to be told he isnt in the script, its a massive let down for people who’d love nothing more than to see him return to the role. A lot of people’s feelings run deep for Shatner as Kirk. And a lot of hopes were crushed when this news story came out today because of the hope given to us by recent events and the production crew.
I’m not ashamed to admit it Shatner as Kirk is my hero and its as synonymous to the actor. Just as Sean Connery as Bond is another hero; but Roger Moore, Tim Dalton, Pierce Brosnan etc as Bond aren’t.
I’d like to hear more from the Abrams camp though. It would be good if we could get them to speak about it.
Ivory your posts 158 and 163 sums up wonderfully how I feel as well. Thank you.
Yeah, I’m suspecting all of that and for all of the reasons that you cite, VOODOO. You clearly are very familiar with the history of his approach to these things - and I’d forgotten about the “Enterprise” thing. There’s another one that didn’t go as he planned, with a lot of tall tales being told in the aftermath.
I’m surely not the person around here with “connections” these days, though. Listen to Anthony. The Anthony is wise in the ways of the Left Coast.
StillKirok. For someone who talks a lot, and wants to get the last word. You don’t say much.
For the rest of you “I won’t see the movie unless my Ego-Hero is in it.” Stay home and watch reruns.
The fat boy is not in the movie. His time has come and gone! He made 1 good Trek movie. ONE! The guy is a prima-donna. His character is dead! About time someone told that egotistical lard ass to piss off! You can’t move forward until you let go of this past. The man cannot act, is over weight and looks like $hit. It would take a lot of CGI & makeup and a major suspension of disbelief to believe a really good Serious Trek movie needs him.
If the boys in charge can blow up the franchise and re-(write, cast, launch, or any word) they way Batman was redone, we should be so lucky.
The last 2 movies sucked the biggest A$$. We need a major transfusion.
#33. Really good post. Says it all.
No one but a hopeless fanboy could possibly have thought that J.J. Abrams or Paramount would spare as much as five seconds of priceless screen time to ‘fix’ something done in a mediocre film that most regular filmgoers have long-since forgotten. In the spirit of fan comity I tried to warn StillKirok that he was likely in for a huge disappointment, and while I find Shatner’s spilling of the beans at this date to be thoroughly unprofessional, I’m glad ‘Kirok” has been spared any cruel hope that this film will be worth spending the next sixteen months looking forward to, or standing in line for.
For myself, I’ll be there with bells on, if only to see what they’ve come up with.. What I want is a great story featuring the characters, universe and hope for the future brought to life by Gene Roddenberry back in 1966. If Abrams and crew can manage to retain Trek’s essence while updating its dramatic style for modern audiences–a long-shot, I think, but far from impossible–he’ll have a monster hit on his hands, regardless of whether a five-minute cameo with Bill Shatner happens or not.
Today’s news made a long time lurker like myself finally get off the bench + post my thoughts.
I am truly dissapointed that William Shatner will not be in Star Trek.
I am only 17 years old and I never got to experience the “glory days” of TOS and their films.
While I will most likely go and see the film. It is no longer a top priority like Pirates or Transformers.
What a difference a day makes.
I also agee with Johnny in his praise for Ivory’s post’s at numbers 158 and 163.
You said just about everything I was thinking.
Re 186:
Well said, Anthony.
It’s good to keep in mind the writers and producers never actually promised Shatner would appear in the film. So nobody lied, here.
Think about it. It would make no sense to promise fans Shatner will appear in the movie…just to pull the rug out from under his fans over A YEAR before the movie actually opens. Where’s the benefit in doing that?
Dennis Bailey wrote:
> He certainly hasn’t appeared in a single of the really good TV shows or
> films that I’ve seen in the last twenty.
Ah, you’re not a fan of Boston Legal.
I’m still on HOLD with all of this. As a marketing tool, the big ? of whether Shatner and Nimoy, or one or the other, will be in the movie or not is a good way to keep things bubbling. I would certainly LOVE to see these two guys have one last outing as a couple of the greatest fictional characters of all time. On the other hand, if they wind up not being in the film, I will still check it out anyway just cos I love Star Trek….
Holy cow….people sure are getting riled up about this. In my mind, this barely registers as news, but apparently some people are taking things way too seriously. And, people, I hate to break it to you, but more good hours of television and film have been created without Shatner than with him. For Pete’s sake, more good hours of Star Trek have been created w