Sirtis and Frakes On Generations, Nemesis and New Movie October 1, 2007
by Sean B. , Filed under: Conventions/Events/Attractions, TNG , trackbackThis weekend TNG stars Jonathan Frakes and Marina Sirtis beamed into the Sacramento Creation Sci-Fi Convention to the delight of Northern California Trek fans. The pair spoke with a great deal of enthusiasm and frankness about their time with the franchise.
more detail and pix below
Sirtis On Nemesis Troubles
During the Saturday Night dinner, Sirtis sat at our table and lamented about the filming of Star Trek Nemsis. Apparently the trouble started from the first day of filming when she and director Stuart Baird got into an argument. Baird asked the actress to take off her shoes in a scene between Troi and Shinzon (to make Shinzon look taller and more menacing). Later in the day Baird decided to have a wooden box for her to stand on. She asked Baird "Why don’t I just put my shoes back on?" to which Baird threw his hat down and stormed off the set, claiming she was being difficult.
Sirtis also told us that Baird and LeVar Burton almost came to blows because Baird kept calling him "Laverne," plus he infuriated other actors by referring to them only by their character names (e.g. "We need Troi and Crusher on the set"). Lastly she told us that Baird didn’t really know anything about Star Trek, and didn’t seem to even like Star Trek.
Sirtis on Generations (where she got to helm the ill fated Enterprise D)
On Stage Marina Sirtis recalled getting the script for Star Trek: Generations.
I called my best friend Dornie (Michael Dorn) and said ‘I get to drive!’ He asked me if I had read the whole thing, and I told him not yet. He told me to finish it before I got too excited. So I read the rest of it and I couldn’t believe it! They let the blind guy drive and he did fine, but when I drive I kill everyone. I’m telling you, that planet came out of nowhere!
Frakes and Sirtis banter…including next film
Frakes came out into the audience with a microphone and peppered Sirtis with good natured interruptions and wisecracks. The two obviously haven’t lost any of their on-air chemistry over the years. Frakes spoke of his current projects, including a new The Librarian film, and answered questions from the appreciative audience. He also did a dead-on impersonation of an indignant Patrick Stewart. Later when Frakes talked optimistically about J.J. Abrams and his new Star Trek film, Sirtis chimed in “Are you kidding me?…Star Trek is about going forward, not backward!”
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Comments»
Yep, She rammed that ship into the ground dam hard…..lol
and that preempted the dam “first” crap.
Sirtis doesn’t look bad…. Frakes hair certainly looks better than the last time I saw him.
I like that they are being good natured about their positions in Trek’s history and likely not it’s future. Any mentions by them of being in a “next” film certainly have to be said with tongue in cheek.
This is interesting bit of info on the shooting of Nemesis. I knew, from the various articles and DVD, that there was some difficulty between director and actors, but I didn’t realize it was this bad.
Next gen TV reunion film anyone?An eventuality?
#4 Jon,
As much as I’d like it… not likely. Production costs and cast salary would kill it.
Frakes wouldn’t pose with me and Marina for a photo in Seattle last year even though they were sitting together. But Marina graciously did. The Filth of Frakes was thus launched.
Amen Sirtis. At least some of the cast that once knew Roddenberry got it. Anyone outside that circle calling themselves a fan and doesn’t understand that Trek moves forward isn’t really a fan.
Baird sounds like a real arsehole.
What I’m wondering is who’s the genius that hired Baird to direct Nemesis?
(Would his initials happen to be RB, by any chance?)
I’d love hear Frakes’ impersonation of an indignant Patrick Stewart.
Anybody have any links to such a thing, perchance?
Frakes looks like he did in that episode Future Imperfect.
#4 Sadly I think that a reunion film is out of the question at this point. And looking at Frakes it’s probably unwise. I can’t see them in those roles at this point!
But a reunion special with the cast looking back would be great.
I didn’t know they were so uptight about being called by their character names. Damn. Coming to blows?
Re #9 – The studios chiefs usually choose the directors not people like Rick Berman, prior to Trek, Berman had no knowledge of directing. He would not have had much say in the matter. He would have had some input with Paramount but not to the degree that you might think.
Troi has crashed the ship both times she “drove”. The Scimitar counts!
^10. Close! The “future” in that episode, aired in November 1990, was 16 years forward. Frakes is scheduled to catch up to his Admiral Riker look (from “All Good Things…”) in 2019.
Whoever decided Frakes shouldn’t direct after Insurrection made a bad call.
I was under the impression that Frake’s couldn’t direct because he had other obligations and didn’t have the time to dedicate to directing… or was that just something they said publicly.
I’ve noticed that since Nemesis, Baird seems to have gone back from whence he came– namely film editing “Casino Royale”– either he or the studios decided that directing wasn’t his strong point.
As for Sirtis’ comment about Star Trek going forward and not backward, I suspect what she ISN’T saying is that Star Trek can only go forward if SHE is part of it. Sorry, dear, won’t happen!
Bioredd,
The person(s) with the most power on the film are the producers. They are the ones who do the hiring and firing. They do appeal to the studio heads with their choices and explain why they want such and such to direct the movie. In this case that job would have fallen squarely on Berman. Producers choose a director and then work with him in casting the picture and hiring key personnel like DPs, costumers and such. Now as to how Baird got the job since he had cut his teeth in the editing room and apparently ambivalent to Star Trek, God only knows. A lot of jobs in the film industry are won through connections, so I’m sure Baird or his agent knew a higher up connected to the film or at Paramount. With what I’ve heard of this tool bag I am pretty sure he wasn’t politicking for the job. I could be wrong, though.
Ky
*I called my best friend Dornie (Michael Dorn) and said ‘I get to drive!’ He asked me if I had read the whole thing, and I told him not yet. He told me to finish it before I got too excited. So I read the rest of it and I couldn’t believe it! They let the blind guy drive and he did fine, but when I drive I kill everyone. I’m telling you, that planet came out of nowhere!*
I had the pleasure to know in person to Marina Sirits in STARFEST Monterrey, Mexico is a very attractive and pleasant person and I count this same Anecdote.
I remember on the commentary for Superman The Movie Richard Donner talked a little about his relationship with Baird (as editor). He kept firing and re-hiring him for various projects because dispite the fact that the two had regular arguments he was a good editor. So I guess professional conflict is not something new to him. Given Baird’s comments in the Nemesis commentary, it sounds like he’d be much happier editing anyway. It’s obviously his strength.
Sometimes people will rise above their station in life before being slapped down to the bleachers! Thank God this happened with Baird! Pity he was afforded the opportunity to direct a movie in the first place! So many talented people kicking around, he should never have been noticed by anyone of any importance. Good riddance!!
As an editor and occassional director (of commercials not features) I can tell you that editor turned director can be a difficult thing for everyone involved. Why?
As editors, we are used to being in total control of our environment, we control everything in calm quiet place. But when you direct, things can quickly spin out of control as you have to commuincate with DP, talent, gaffers, sound etc… – it can be quite a shock and leads to short tempers and lots of frustration.
Also, editors like to shoot alot of film because they know the importance of having coverage in the cutting room – this leads to many takes and long shooting days.
It;s also important to note that the director of Star Trek The Motion Picture was none other than Bob Wise – an editor before he turned director.
Yes, but isn’t it interesting that even someone like Wise, who did The Day The Earth Stood Still, one of my all time favorites, could direct a turd like Star Trek: The Motion Picture??
It just goes to show that even the best can’t bat it out of the park every time!
Re: Baird – in a franchise like Trek, which at the time was solely owned by Paramount, I have always believed the Studio picks the director, with in put from the producers. I have heard that RB wanted Frakes but he was over committed at the time, not sure if it is true. Where are Star Wars, owned by Lucas, can do what ever he wants. And from what I have read and heard Baird does come across as a bit of a (sorry Anthony) dick, who seems to think that he knows everything about everything.
I must say I would like to see Star Trek: Titan, set in the aftermath of the colapse of the romulan empire, but if wishes were horses.
People love to blame Baird for the suckage that was Nemesis, but it really doesn’t matter how good or bad the directing was because the script was crap to begin with. You could have put Jonathan Frakes in there as director, and while the shots might have looked a little different, it still would have been the same sucky movie. I’d go so far as to say that there is nothing they could have done to save Nemesis because it was simply bad from the very concept. It was the worst way to end the TNG cast, which in itself is bad because the TNG cast did not need to end. They could have easily had a couple more movies in them.
Right now I’m just happy TNG gets to continue in the novels.
If JJ offered her a part she’d snap it up!
“Going forward to pick up my paycheck.”
Oop saggy baggies!
-cs™
Harry I’m gonna let the salt vampire loose on you. TMP wasn’t that bad… oh wait, yes it was. But not for me! As cheesy and snorey as it might have been, I think it’s special just for being the first one. However comparatively it does take on undeniable turd-like qualities, if they can be thought of as qualities. Wow, thank God for Nicholas Meyer, eh? Salt Vampire said he once had Meyer in a hypnotic trance and was about to start leeching when he realized who it was, and let him go – JUST for saving Star Trek. What a guy!
come on the first movie is a good movie and it stand up better than the 2nd
I was at the premier of Insurrection in Las Vegas. A young kid called out excitedly to Levar Burton as he walked past on the red carpet ‘Hi Geordi’. He replied ‘It’s Levar actually ‘ and walked on. I went off Laverne after that.
Nemesis really felt like they had run out of ideas, too bad Abrams wasn’t around then.
Sometimes, you have to go backward to go forward…
Nemesis had the same bad mistakes that ST5 had. A long vertical shaft in the ship! Deck numbers that don’t exist!
And the shield diagram shows an early design of the Enterprise (the one that was used for the Playmates toy of ST8) which is simply wrong.
Baird is a masterful editor (Superman, Casino Royale, Lethal Weapon etc) and has done good directing work in the past with Exec Decision
Sounds like he rubbed some of them up the wrong way and unfortuantly wasnt riding the best of scripts so there wasnt a good movie at the end of it to fall back on…hence all the backbiting..He did a decent enough job at directing it though – the same happened with Insurrection – well directed – poor script. = crappy movie…but look at First Contact – well directed – good script – therefore good movie praised by all.
The script is the thing – very rarely does a bad story make a good film…if ever.
Oh and Tom Hardy as Shinzon didnt help matters – that part should have really been played by Stewart…I’m suprised he didnt actually as i would have thought he’d have jumped at the chance to have shown a ‘dark’ Picard – showing off his acting etc….maybe it was never suggested – OR maybe Stewart didnt want to (i heard he had salary disputes that almost made him drop out of Nemesis – maybe that was to do with him having been the star of X Men and X2 since Insurrection and was therefore more ‘bankable’ and should be given a bigger salary)
Frakes was awesome at the FedCon in Germany in June. He was absolutely hilarious on stage or sitting in the bar with fans. Paul McGillion was at the same con and he and Frakes got on like a house on fire right from the start. Paul kept hi-jacking the microphone at the press conference to liven things up a bit, including a priceless moment with Frakes, joking about the outlandish plans for the evenings partying exploits blaming Frakes as the ringleader! Garrett Wang & Anthony Montgomery also got in on the fun partying on down or horsing around on stage.
http://www.space-view.de/filme/f/galerie/die_con,0,263/Bild0007.html
http://www.space-view.de/filme/f/galerie/die_con,0,263/Bild0016.html
http://www.space-view.de/filme/f/galerie/die_con,0,263/Bild0013.html
I would LOVELOVELOVE to see a sort of reunion style mini-series for TNG. Nemesis kinda left a bad taste in my mouth. Or how about Peter David’s ‘Imzadi’??? But who would play really young Riker & Troi huh????
Oh yeah and the Nemesis poster should have had the tagline. “Who let Troi drive?” haha ;)
Frakes has been in my wardrobe, shirt thief!!!
Sirtis: “Are you kidding me?…Star Trek is about going forward, not backward!”
Heh! Continue dreaming, Sirtis. Berman’s collective era burned its cultural bridges with one dreary/New Agey series after another, and even the attempt to go “backward” (Enterprise) was more TNG/Bermanville than anything resembling the past.
TOS remains the most culturally significant/popular version of Trek for innumerable reasons, and it speaks volumes that the reboot is going to the best as the platform/source, instead of a reboot in the Next Generation-forward era.
“Are you kidding me?…Star Trek is about going forward, not backward!”
Funny I thought it was set in the future?
So it’s okay for them to do a film that films in gaps in the Trek history we’ve never seen before (First Contact anyone); but not JJ?
“Are you kidding me?…Star Trek is about going forward, not backward!”
No, Star Trek is about showing us ourselves and the lessons we have to learn about life (war, love, etc.), but told in another time to show that consequences can sometimes not happen for hundreds of years, or that people will come across the same issues years later and find a way to deal with them.
There never was a timeframe, nor was there ever a set in stone law that every subsequent Star Trek had to move forward. The story was what mattered.
On another note, Marina Sirtis is still hot!
Let’s get these two back into the gym and back on television in a Titan series. It’s the only Trek concept that will work on television.
Anyone agree???
You know, if Nemesis had been a hit and TNG would have continued in film, Sirtis, Frakes and the rest would all have nothing but positive things to say about it and it’s director.
But, as things are now, they are free to vent, and vent they shall.
And will probably never know what the cast members really think of each other….
sorry will should be we’ll….
Nemesis was simply a pile of steaming crap story-wise. Yeah, Baird was a terrible choice, and it doesn’t sound like he even wanted to direct that dog, but the script is to blame. It was simply worthless.
I don’t care if Star Trek goes backwards, forwards, or upside down, as long as the story if meaningful and engaging. Nemesis was neither.
First of all, I want to thank Anthony for including my report on the website. It was a great weekend.
A couple of quick thoughts: the thing with LeVar and Baird seemed pervasive, the way Marina told it. It wasn’t that Baird called him “LaVerne” once, but repeatedly. Like he couldn’t be bothered learning the cast’s real names.
The thing I enjoyed the most was the sense that these two really care about Star Trek and the fans. Both have continued to work regularly (Marina was in the Oscar winning Crash), so it’s not like they’re starving. They really believed in what they were doing, loved doing it, and didn’t want to stop. Marina said both she and Frakes would do a Titan Series/movie in a heartbeat.
I appreciated their honesty, regardless of whether what they were saying was “factual” (hell, I wasn’t there). They were great guests.
[...] Hier ist der Original-Text: Sirtis and Frakes On Generations, Nemesis and New Movie | TrekMovie.com __________________ "…wenn ich, Aguirre, will, dass die Vgel tot von den Bumen fallen, dann fallen die Vgel tot von den Bumen herunter. Ich bin der Zorn Gottes, die Erde ber die ich gehe sieht mich und bebt!" [...]
“A couple of quick thoughts: the thing with LeVar and Baird seemed pervasive, the way Marina told it. It wasn’t that Baird called him “LaVerne” once, but repeatedly. Like he couldn’t be bothered learning the cast’s real names.”
-1001001 – October 2, 2007
I think when Brando made The Score, he kept referring to director Frank Oz as Ms. Piggy and Kermit, (since Oz had been a puppeteer).
Sometimes it’s in good fun, and sometime it’s just being an ***hole.
If Baird really did keep calling for Crusher and Troi to come to the set, then he was the later…
That’s just arrogant and disrespectful on the most basic level…
#27 Heywood ST:TMP “I think it’s special just for being the first one”
Heywood, my boy, based on that logic, you probably look back fondly on your first sexual encounter, even if she was LOUSY in the sack! Oh, wait, too personal?
Bwahahahahha………………
RE: #42 “Nemesis was simply a pile of steaming crap story-wise.”
Sometimes, I can’t really understand the vehement anger people have toward Nemesis. Yes, the story had its flaws, but on the whole, it was actually a very good Star Trek adventure.
Without getting into a pissing match about Nemesis’ faults, what would have been an appropriate send-off for the TNG crew? A story about Q to put a nice book-end on the first episode of the series? Been there, done that (”All Good Things”).
My personal wish was to see Romulans in action (check). I just wish there had been more about Romulans, not the Remans. I also would have liked to have seen more “where no one has gone before”-type adventure (”we’re sailing into the unknown…”)
Your thoughts?
King,
all reasonable suggestions! I like your comment about getting back to the “where no one has gone before” aspect of things…
Yes, Nemesis really sucked, but the story didnt blow, but rather seemed incomplete…for instance a great angle they couldve gone with was portraying Shinzon not just as an evil mirror for Picard but also as something akin to a Star Trek equivalent to the Biblical Antichrist…even going so far as having Shinzon coming back to life after he was killed on the Scimitar through being possessed by a Pah-Wraith, only to have Data be unable to destroy the thalaron weapon only to have it fail to deploy, thus causing Shinzon to set a course for Earth, repairing the weapon en route…the Starfleet fleet arrives and tows Enterprise to Earth at warp, and the film gets another 40 minutes to it.
Other things that wouldve helped would be to have Enterprise have had Voyagers futuristic hull armor and transphasic torpedoes and have even them prove insufficient to hurt Scimitar and what about Janeways tactic of beaming torpedoes into a ships power core then detonating them…and since when would a warship like the Enterprise-E run out of torpedoes after firing only 50 at most?
Other creative ideas wouldve been to find out that the Yesterdays Enterprise Tasha Yar had given the Romulans Picards DNA and have Denise Crosby show up as Sela only for us to find out that Sela wasnt really Tashas daughter but really a genetically-altered Tasha herself who really had been under Romulan mind control to make her believe she was Sela…another creative idea wouldve been to learn that Donatra was really a Romulan/Vulcan/Human hybrid and Spock and Saavik’s daughter
I agree…Baird as a Star Trek director fitted as much as Bush as President…my idea: they shouldve gotten Harve Bennett to do Nemesis..also: they made Nemesis “too Trek” as if Baird deliberately made a crappy movie to destroy Trek forever…plus they were forced to make what theyd intended 2 be a massively epic movie on like a $70 million dollar budget
As for new movie ideas…any1 remember that DS9 novel trilogy “Millennium” about a Star Trek End Times? They should make them in2 a film trilogy with Jerry Bruckheimer and Michael Bay and J.J. Abrams and Mel Gibson codirecting/producing them…
Lastly: one way to improve any future Trek film/tv show is to give it the style of “Farscape” and ditch using a film score and instead use real MTV-type songs as soundtrack and turning Trek over to the MTV people
Sirtis: “Star Trek is about going forward, not backward!”
and yet, she was in Enterprise… where she and Frakes went backward via the holodeck to a time even before TOS. I’ll echo what was said earlier… she’d go backward in a heartbeat if JJ offered her the chance.
But then, I’ve never thought of her as a representative or a spokesperson of true Trek anyway.
Hmmm… let me see… who’s opinions and views of the new Trek movie should I give more credence to? Sirtis or Nimoy?
Oh, and by the way Marina, Leonard’s understanding of Gene’s vision for Trek eclipses any that you think you may have.
Things were really looking good for Nemesis before it came out – it had a script by oscar nominated John Logan hot of Gladiator…plus an fresh outside director who had made a couple of decent action films.. (last time an outside director had come aboard we got Khan)
The tone was said to be more First Contact than Insurrection and Berman had said that the dailies looked ‘more like a Ridley Scott or John Woo movie than a star trek film’
And the trailer looked pretty awesome and yes very Ridley in parts (the Blade Runner eye at the start that wasnt in the movie)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EJXEj_BYVtU
Heres the statement Berman made prior to nemesis coming out:
“”I think we are in extraordinary shape,” Berman said in an interview with TV GUIDE. “ENTERPRISE is right on target and a strong success for UPN, and there is great electricity about the movie. The footage – the dailies – look more like a Ridley Scott film or a John Woo film than a classic TREK movie. I think – contrary to rumors – that this is very, very likely not going to be the last movie. If this one does well as I believe it will, it will be a mere matter of weeks – make that days – before Paramount comes to me and says ‘So, when are we going to get to work on number 11?’” ”
oh and going back to my post at 33 – heres Stewart talking about the troubles on Nemesis:
In an interview with the UK magazine EMPIRE, Jean-Luc Picard himself, Patrick Stewart, revealed he almost rejected the role in the tenth TREK film.
“I was a breath away from saying this is not worth the time. An absolute breath away,” Stewart said. “They [Paramount Pictures] were negotiating so uncompromisingly that it had reached the point where humiliation was the only way of settling this and I wasn’t prepared to do that. But luckily the nice thing for actors is that you don’t actually have to walk into those rooms yourself, and you don’t have to answer the phone when they call. It’s a very curious place, Hollywood, in that in the space of the day, someone’s attitude can shift from downright brutality to treating you as a member of the family.”
OMG, I cannot understand the Nemesis defenders. #42 hit the nail on the head.
We’re vehemently opposed to Nemesis because it was a bad movie, bad storytelling, and worst of all…not Star Trek, on any level.
I guess this is a case of one man’s trash is another man’s treasure.
#51
It just proves that Berman lost touch with reality and had no concept of what “good” was.
I’ll give paramount one thing, they got one hell of a person to make that trailer. It still fools you into thinking it’s a worthwhile movie.
But, nah.
I don’t get the whole “Star Trek is about going forward not looking backwards” comment that people, including Marina, chime in with every so often. The last time I checked, the 23rd century was still the future. Telling stories during the TOS or even the TOS movie period is still addressing the future. In actuality, very few stories were told in the 23rd century compared to the 24th. So why is it somehow “Gene’s vision” that Trek continuously be pushed farther and farther into the future? Not to mention, if Star Trek is not about “looking backwards” then why have their been so many time travel stories? To me, this is a completely bogus criticism.
#56.
I concur.
Its funny that we still have panel discussions about why Nemesis sucks.
Bad Rick, Brent Spiner & John Logan are the main reasons.
Bad choices. How many times are you going to make the thing about Data? Data’s other brother? Make a film with less Data, just once!
We have waited 20 years to see a good movie with the Romulans & Nemesis hardly delivers. The mis use of the Romulans is a whole other rant. Its like they did not watch or read anything that came before. Oh wait they didn’t its Rick we’re talikng about, The professed TOS Hater. The little bones thrown regarding trek history & the so called fan service stuff in the script is not that exciting. It was not anuff John, your script still stinks. The people needed a real Star Trek Movie back in 2002.
One that represented TNG cast better & respected the characters.
I just feel bad that this was the last send off for TNG. It sure was not a Undiscovered Country for them, more like a Final Frontier.
Ok Action movie. Terrible Science Fiction movie. Awful Star Trek movie.
Nemesis was very flawed. But it wasn’t the atrocity that so many make it out to be.
The movie setup started out alright: Seeing the Romulan Senate was good, and it was nice to see the TNG crew laid-back at the wedding. The general premise of the movie was not bad, and in a way fit with the conclusion of DS9 (The Romulans skirting the effort of the clone after finding an ally in the Federation during the Dominion War).
The problems really were with the Argo scene, the casting of Hardy as Shinzon (He was a good actor, just didn’t fit the position), the death (and rebirth?) of Data, and few other little issues with holes in the plot. And also the cast didn’t get the time that was deserved (or originally fimed, at that).
These issues could have been remedied. And the movie would be a good movie at that point. But what people tend to do is say “Oh, that movie just sucked.” Give some points why you think it sucked when you say as such.
I think the true problem with the movie really was that people look at the box office numbers and statitistics of how “It only earned 67 Million”. There is something that has to be realized in this: Only so many people will go out and watch movies. To Quote the Wikipedia article::
“[Star Trek Nemesis] was released on December 13, 2002, in direct competition against Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets (released November 15, 2002), the 20th James Bond movie Die Another Day (released November 22, 2002) and The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (released December 18, 2002).”
That means a big problem with this movie was marketing. It released opposite of two of the largest grossing movie frachises in history, let alone facing the already increasing decline of Star Trek Popularity as well as an already saturated sci-fi market (Star Wars Episode II had been released earlier that year, and was still in some theaters).
On the second week of Nemesis’s release, The Two Towers came out. Combined Box Office Revenues at that week for the last month from Harry Potter 2, Two Towers, and Die Another Day posted 468 Million Dollars, and that’s not even including the other various movies that were outside of the Action and SciFi Genre. The top 15 movies at that point, totalling all of their accumulated revenues, posted 1.012 Billion Dollars.
The problem, thus, I believe, was timing, and the preconception that box office totals are what makes a movie.
Finally, I have something to say to the many people who say “Nemesis is not Trek”. Star Trek was born from the idea of confronting current day ethical, moral, and philisophical issues in a futuristic forum. What was the underlying question asked in this movie? Cloning, and the implications it brings up. If one is cloned, is the clone a person? Can they be what their source material was? And if raised in a different situation, are they truely just the sum of their experiences?
^ Ok Action movie.
Not even sure that’s true. The whole thing builds up to the preposterous ramming sequence. Ok sfx. But, for action, it makes no sense. They’re clearly trying to rip-off “The Enemy Below” by ramming the two ships. But, would you do that??? You’re billions of miles from any planet… oh, and air. Would you cripple your own ship just to slow down the already painfully slow Lion Fish Weapon of Doom? The TWO corridor firefight sequences are awful. The dunebuggy sequence is awful. (Prime Directive? — not for these butt-faced baddies. Blast em!) Riker battling to keep from falling off the catwalk (where in the ship is this exactly?) is goofy.
Nemesis is dull, because the action is poorly executed and it does little or nothing for the characters. It’s just there. Like somebody had a flat script and dropped in pointless “action” in hopes of reviving it.
Okay long time since I posted anything on here but I found an interesting (if apparently fake) look at the new Enterprise NCC 1701
It might be fake (or not) but it captures the very look I think this Starship should have… a morphed mix of old TV series and Motion picture
see for yourself at
http://www.youtube.com/user/Randie1313
Copyright Paramount/Bad Robot???
59 – ‘Riker battling to keep from falling off the catwalk ‘
The way Riker boots Ron Pearlman off – they obviously took that from Kirks ‘I..have had..Enough of You!’
There were too many rip offs from the previous movies:
the end 15 mins or so were taken straight from Trek II (Ent limping away from doom – i think Picard even says something like ‘try to put some distance inbetween the ships’ ) as the Spock like Data sacrifices himself…then you got the absent friends bit from Trek III..and then we find that Data placed his ‘katra’ in B4′….
Plus the end battle with the ship that can fire when cloaked eventually defeated by the Ent with the help of another ship..and the whole Romulans want peace thing = hello Star Trek VI…
Plus the obvious one – genetically enginerred villian with a grudge against the captain
Twas like a Trek movie greatest hits package…..then again the TNG films were hardly original – First Contact was basically trek does Camerons ‘Aliens’ and Generations had a good few similarities to The Final Frontier (heck of a film to rip from)
Harry Ballz wrote:
> Yes, but isn’t it interesting that even someone like Wise, who did The
> Day The Earth Stood Still, one of my all time favorites, could direct a
> turd like Star Trek: The Motion Picture??
A director can only do so much if the script is not there, i.e., it was being written as they shot it.
oh i forgot – They do battle in a systems interfering nebula as well…
Aside from a few minor nitpicks with the tone of the movie, TMP is probably my favorite now. It’s a mature movie…I wish the movies could find more of a balance and simply deliver an awe inspiring Star Trek movie.
Snake, great link to the Nemesis trailer. Too bad they didn’t make that movie.
I think thats the Planet of the Apes remake music they used in the trailer – sounds good
how Nemesis should have ended
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QYGNzfeFv4
I could Mrs. Sirtis imagine as my woman hairdresser! ;-)
#68 my backwards speaking friend, I couldn’t agree more.
Hey Snake, that should have been the whole movie and just saved us some time.
Is this site becoming a platform for Next Generation actors to whine and complain?
I love TOS, but….
36. COMPASSIONATE GOD – October 2, 2007
“TOS remains the most culturally significant/popular version of Trek for innumerable reasons, and it speaks volumes that the reboot is going to the best as the platform/source, instead of a reboot in the Next Generation-forward era.”
40 years of reruns of any show can make it “culturally significant”. Ask the Skipper and Gilligan.
I have absolutely no problem with the next Trek going to the TOS story base. I like ‘em all, but in the end they are just TV shows and movies.
70. OriginalFan – October 2, 2007
“Is this site becoming a platform for Next Generation actors to whine and complain? ”
Other than expressing dislike of Baird, where was the whine in that story? There was sarcasm in there. I don’t recall any in the other TNG cast story either. Did I miss it?
71. Xai – October 2, 2007
“I love TOS, but….
40 years of reruns of any show can make it “culturally significant”. Ask the Skipper and Gilligan.
I have absolutely no problem with the next Trek going to the TOS story base. I like ‘em all, but in the end they are just TV shows and movies. ”
Actually, that is incorrect. No one is talking about how visionary or daring Gilligan’ s Island, F-Troop, The Donna Reed Show, The Flying Nun or Get Smart were/are as a work of fiction. Moreover art–including that produced for TV–has cultural significance, like any book, piece of music, painting or film.
Too many sources have cited TOS with being significant, but the fact TNG and its sequels are not held in that regard is the point made here, and the very reason Sirtis’ comment is more wishful thinking (J.J. basing anything on TNG) than reality.
* Addendum: “Moreover art–including that produced for TV–has cultural significance, like any book, piece of music, painting or film.”
That is, any of the above which has a creative power/merit moving beyond the bonds of its entertainment roots.
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#74 Compassionate God
Did I say that “Get Smart” was more culturally significant than Trek?
No.
I said..”40 years of reruns of any show can make it “culturally significant”. I didn’t state to what degree.
I didn’t say anything had to be “visionary or daring” to be “CS” because it doesn’t have to be. Where’d that come from?
And frankly, Paramount would have used any flavor of Trek had they thought it was the one to do good box-office. “CS” is not a factor in this, greed is.
and what was the other thing I said?…. oh yeah…
“I have absolutely no problem with the next Trek going to the TOS story base. I like ‘em all, but in the end they are just TV shows and movies.”
Engage.
20 Years older and she’s still looken Great!
and Sirtis’ comments have to be tounge-in-cheek
Boy, I’d like to give her some tounge!!
She looks better than how she looked in Nemesis where she lost too much weight.
Harry B, are you in 6th grade? It seems like most of your posts are sex-obsessed, juvenile garbage – even your name is offensive. Grow up.
btw, Marina Sirtis is gorgeous in person. I had my picture taken with her at the grand opening of Star Trek: The Experience in Las Vegas. A real beauty.
Does anyone have anything by the actors on the dirctor before they started shooting? If so, I bet they were not saying “this guy is rude, difficult and doesn’t know the series.”
I could bw mistaken, but that’s why I don’t believe it when I hear actors say that they love their new cast mates and the director. Give it a few years to find out their real feelings.
I saw an interview with Walter Keonig (spelling?) on when he first heard about the next generation. He seemed honest and if I recall right said he was not too happy that Star Trek did not have the original crew. Now the circle is complete with Sirtis saying “Are you kidding me?…Star Trek is about going forward, not backward!”
For some it’s about going forward. Some it’s the messages of the good and bad things in our own time, that are hidden in the tales. And for some it’s the green dancing ladies.
For others it’s the little green paper.
Once the creator of a fictional world dies and someone else, or a group of someone elses takes over, it’s usually all about that little green paper.
Harry,
you are warned for inappropriate comments
comments to http://trekmovie.com/about/feedback
The problem with the TNG films was that Paramout put the least amount of creative juice and talent behind the camera as possible. They just wanted to turn a buck. And then they gave up on TNG after Nemesis, when the problem was that they gave TNG nothing to work with.
The TNG series was nothing like the movies, that is the problem.
Re: 76. Xai – October 2, 2007
“Did I say that “Get Smart” was more culturally significant than Trek?”
Your comparison indicated any series rerun long enough places it on the same level, so yes, you are arguing that point–incorrect–but the argument was used.
“I didn’t say anything had to be “visionary or daring” to be “CS” because it doesn’t have to be. Where’d that come from?”
YOU did not have to say it, as it was MY point in supporting MY original comment on TOS’ cultural significance.
“And frankly, Paramount would have used any flavor of Trek had they thought it was the one to do good box-office. “CS” is not a factor in this, greed is.”
That is the point–yet it is only due to the acceptance of TOS being a landmark, culturally significant series which allows it to retain a vice-like grip on being (by far) the top dog of the Trek franchise. The limited scope of Berman-ville injected New Agey philosophy (amongst other negative elements) into Trek, which (like the New Age movement) was bad when originally attempted and now is flat-out embarassing with a wealth of poor productions.
There was no real choice: if you want to keep Trek alive, it would be disastrous to use the very material which ran a steady course (for several years) of destroying the franchise.
#78
They were not tongue-in-cheek. She was serious (except for the “that planet came out of nowhere” comment).
:)
And BTW: Yes, she looked absolutely beautiful.
She’s 52!
If the new films do well, I hope they show the TNG era & cast again.
Even if in TV form.
#85 CG
No,
like everything else in the universe there are levels and you are attempting to twist my comments to your liking. Very Josh T-like. And for the third time… TOS is fine. Do I get to have that opinion?
Sirtis is still hot. Frakes looks like some old perv. Sort of like my dad.
1001001-..”absolutely beautiful”…the photos on this page and my memories of meeting Marina years ago at a Trek convention in Omaha are in total agreement with you. Counselor Troi was always my favorite character on Next Generation. I’m deeply grateful for Marina’s character and how the often inspiring shows featuring her helped me get through some really tough years.
Re: 89. Xai – October 3, 2007
#85 CG
“No,
like everything else in the universe there are levels and you are attempting to twist my comments to your liking. Very Josh T-like. And for the third time… TOS is fine. Do I get to have that opinion? ”
No sale. YOU were the one attempting to challenge my statements about the value of TOS (and why it is the base of the reboot). I called you on the specifics of your own claim (therefore no “twisting” occured), but after all of that, you attempt to deflect (or lessen) the charge with a “TOS is fine” line.
Sure it is fine–and the lone reason a reboot would ever have a chance in the wake of the limp Bermanverse.
Frakes looks like he’s contest Shatner’s hold on worst button down shirt at a scifi convention.
Frakes looks like he’s been enjoying more than a few rich dinners!
#92CG
If you look at nearly any post over the past several months, i’ve said “I like them all”. That’s not deflection or apology.. just my opinion. You want to turn that against me?… fine, knock yourself out. I can sit and enjoy 5 different series of Trek, I’m sorry your tastes are different. That “limp Berman-verse” kept Trek alive and thriving so we could be discussing this now.
No amount of opinion -swapping will make me believe that the choice of TOS for the movie basis is based on “cutural significance”. JJ and Paramount wanted to do Trek and they picked TOS because it was the era least used. They wanted change. If anything, this is a huge risk if they “reboot” (your word) this too far.
Re: 95. Xai – October 4, 2007
“That’s not deflection or apology.. just my opinion. You want to turn that against me?… fine, knock yourself out.”
You were the one knocking the status of TOS, so you either stand by your words–and the fact you commented on that specific point at all, or act like Mr. or Ms. Innocent. Whatever floats your boat.
“That “limp Berman-verse” kept Trek alive and thriving so we could be discussing this now.”
No, we are witnessing the rebirth of a property because that limp Bermanverse destroyed the franchise, pushing innumerable fans away, leading to the collapse of the big-screen films, and the cancellation of the worthless Enterprise. Obviously, there would be no desire for a reboot IF the Bermanverse actually held the “ship” together with material more successful/interesting than the previous Bermanverse production.
As implied by others, Paramount/J.J., et al,could have moved ahead–far beyond the TNG/DS9/VOY era / projected lifespans of the collective characters…to the 30th century or wherever, but this did not happen. The fact TOS remains the most popular, significant Trek–free of the Bermanverse New Agey nonsense–speaks to another “why and how” the TOS era is the one serving as the frame of the new film.
CG, any objectivity you tried to create earlier went to hell. Your “imnumerable fans” being pushed away, etc. Where’s the facts? Nothing’s been destroyed. These are opinions and I stated mine as such.
And I certainly didn’t insult you, but you sure act like it.
I’ve said what I like and have been consistant with it since I started posting , and stated the reason I felt they did what they are doing. I didn’t knock TOS, just gave my opinion.
Oh, and the new writers seem to like that ” Bermanverse New Agey nonsense”. Inspired by it even. Did that keep you up too?
Facts: Though no one else in their right mind will deny the innumerable fans abandoning the franchise, when ENT was cancelled, it was due to the base leaving, hence the reason it was……cancelled. Now, go to major news sites and look up Enterprise–around the time the axe fell; if the story is still up, it will simply paraphrase what I posted here.
Fact: The final TNG movie (Nemesis) pushed more audiences away and holds the record as the lowest earning film in the entire 10-film history of the Trek movie franchise (crawling in at $43,254,409), acting as bitter icing on the evidence of the Bermanverse destroyng the franchise to the point where a TOS reboot was the only realistic option left to the studio. Even the hated Final Frontier earned more than Nemesis.
Deny it all you want, but history cannot be altered to protect the Bermanverse’s glaring failings, and the return to TOS. Furthermore, writers’ personal taste has little to do with the fact the PTB wanted to go back to TOS’ universe! Otherwise, they may as well dig up the Berman prequel Enterprise–a production that is the end result of when one dumps TNG influence on a pre-TNG era.
#98 CG
Fine, you win. You want to be right far more than I care about this.
#99 Xai
Fine. You challenge, then run around & deny. Good day.
#100 compassionate god.
You got what you wanted…to be right, and yet I get a subtle insult. Did you need me to bow as well?
If I were you, I’d reconsider my handle, neither word applies.
Good day to you as well.
I always thought that Baird was the main problem behind the latest trek movie. He aproached it like an action movie, and not like a trek movie. Trek works… alright, as a straight up action flick, but as Star Trek II showed, The Trek template can do, and needs a lot more to become a trully great film. Yes ST II had some of the best actions scenes, but it also had the layers of subtext and characterizations that can make trek great. Yes, Nemesis did have this, Logan put it all in there, but I think the subsaquent direction and editing down played it all a bit too much. As I have said numerous time on this site the Shortened Riker/Troi wedding is a big example. A real Trek movie would have given the affair it’s proper moment, would have reintroduced Wesely Crusher, would have had the bit about dr. Crusher going off to Starfleet Medical, etc.
Plus, though I hate to rag on Logan, there was just a bit (and really only a bit) too much of the characters doing things and resolving matters in ways they wouldn’t have in the past eps, and movies.
It’s too bad that Baird pissed off so many of the cast. Sirnis doesn’t t strike me as someone who would make up stories (although I could be wrong. Anyone who doesn’t botheer to even try and understand what trek is all about, let alone do a little research before they get involved in a trek project, should no way no how be allowed withen ten miles of the production.
And to all who think that Trek should only go forward….give this movie a chance. JJ and his team haven’t gone wrong yet (even if you do think is MI: III was bad, it’s still a helluva lot better then the crap that was in #2). The writers did pretty damn good with Transformers (although slightly hokey in spots). If they understand what makes good trek go, and give it the same writting attention they did transformer, then they should do fine. I heartly agree with all who say that enough is enough with time travel, other then that, I am willing to give them a chance on anything.
#101: Xai, grow up a little. Then–and only then will you learn to avoid starting problems where NONE existed. You challenged, and a response was offered. If you have issues with that, then avoid critiizing others’ views WITHOUT any sort of evidence to back your claim, when you (should) know where that usually goes in any debate.
Good day.
#103 CG
still swinging?…you won… what do you want?
#104 Xai: There is no “winning” here. This is not “Jeopardy.” …and for a person indicating he was through with the discussion, apparently, YOU cannot let it go. Get over it, and grow up a little, and next time, refrain from challenging anyone when you do not want a response.
#105 compassionate god
I keep trying and you keep coming back to scold and insult me again and telling me to grow up.
Do you need clarification of what I said in #99, Alex Trebek? I conseded this because there is no point. That work?
#106 – Xai: if you truly wanted “out” you would STOP responding, hence my “grow up” line; you feel some need to either have the “last word” or play oneupmanship (which i’m not participating in), when this would not occur if you were adult enough to let it go, no matter what or when I post—which would have been the case early on when you could not sit on your hands and prevent your original challenge to my statement.
Once again, you open doors but wish to pretend you were not responsible or want the door closed.
Move on………
Okay boys, go to your respective corners and chill……..
I’m glad we’re going back to the original timeline. But more importantly, back to the original characters. THAT’s what Star Trek is all about. The 70 year leap they made back in 1987 was NOT the right thing to do. I was very happy with the prequel Enterprise though. But this die hard Star Trek fan feels that making a Star Trek movie or series without Kirk, Spock and McCoy is like making a James Bond movie without James Bond. Fortunately the people at 007 didn’t give us such a movie ever. Paramount however did give us way too much Star Trek movies and series without the original characters. I think only Harve Bennett understood what Star Trek ir really all about. He also saved a dying Trek with TWOK. HE should have been the one creating the second Star Trek TV series back in 1987. And although he sin’t involved with this new movie, I really hope it will be a big success. Because the idea is right. Now all I can hope for is that it reboots the franchise the way Casino Royale rebooted 007. And that JJ has the guts to erase all 24th century Trek from the new canon.
I don’t get all the Nemesis hatred. I took it for what it was and enjoyed it. Maybe I’m just less critical. Then again, maybe I’m just such a big Imzadi fan that I didn’t care about the rest of the movie because Riker and Troi finally got married.
I guess I’m pretty easy to please.
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