Comments on: John Logan On New ‘Star Trek’

By: ferengi21

ferengi21 — Thu, 21 Aug 2008 19:15:13 +0000

Star Trek: Nemesis may have been the worst Star Trek film as far as financial performance figures go (and let’s be honest, that’s the ONLY reason why there was no follow-up in the shape of a TNG cast Star Trek XI) but it was certainly not the worst of the series in my opinion (in terms of overall appeal). Unfortunately I have to agree with some of you out there that the honour goes to Star Trek V. I love TOS, I love Shatner too and the way it turned out wasn’t his fault entirely. The writer’s strike and budget restrictions had a lot to do with it. Star Trek V is a fun, enjoyable “romp” and very much in the spirit of the original show but I think it tried a little too hard to live up to the high water mark, both financial and comedic, left by Star Trek IV and maybe pushed the gags one step too far. It’s biggest crimes in my opinion were 1) The terrible, awful (even ghastly!) special effects delivered by Bran Ferren & associates for the film which, after ILM’s usual 80’s magic had been worked on the previous 3 films, looked like they belonged on a YouTube mock-up, in fact I’ve seen BETTER effects on some fan-made projects, even though admittedly they are more recent and digital technology has advanced greatly since 1989, but still – they were far worse than what was achieved 10 years earlier for Star Trek: TMP in 1979! Secondly 2) Some of the character moments were ridiculous – when the mountain climber is revealed to be none other than the “Shat” himself at the beginning of the film I clearly remember some fellow cinema-goers laughing out loud at the implausibility, plus a whole scene/set being created just so Scotty could bang his head??….please….and as for the “naked” Uhura dance sequence…well, enough said. It felt it an over-exploitation of the characters we know and love and, ultimately, unnecessary. As far as TNG movies go I’m afraid Insurrection takes the prize for the worst of the bunch – and not that “worst” really means bad, more that it just felt like a T.V. movie, an extended episode – that also borrowed heavily from previous TNG plots (Who Watches the Watchers?, Journey’s End etc). Nemesis may have been slow in parts, borrowed heavily from The Wrath of Khan, had some un-characteristic character moments/dialogue and a few plot holes but the “worst” Trek movie as an overall experience? far from it. Hopefully the new JJ Abrams Star Trek film will re-invigorate the franchise but, in my humble opinion, they should have gone with a really well scripted DS9 movie years ago to reward the fans (and the DS9 cast) with a final big screen outing the show truly deserved which will now, sadly, never happen. Live Long & Prosper!

By: Herbert Dustman

Herbert Dustman — Mon, 18 Aug 2008 06:38:19 +0000

I don’t know what movie theater any of you Nemesis haters was in, but the one I was in there was gasps and applause finished with a standing ovation. From excellent story (though admittedly slow at times) and great action sequences came one hell of a ride. When the Enterprise actually rammed the Scimitar it was amazing! I had always wanted to see that, and here finally it was… and judging by the reactions of the crowd they had wanted to see it too.
The only real concessions I can give to the haters are; yes, B4 was kinda lame, the sex scene was kinda icky, and they could have got a better actor to play Shinzon…
But all in all, it was just what we needed to get the taste of that crappy Insurrection out of our mouths. I sat through that one wondering if it had been made for Hallmark or the Family Channel…. that supporting cast was like a Seventh Heaven episode….

By: Jeremy

Jeremy — Tue, 24 Jun 2008 01:34:41 +0000

It was the worst. Bad story, bad villain, bad cast. I am sorry, but Marina Sirtis, Gates McFadden, and Levar Burton are not big screen actors. Stewart can do it, Frakes is ok, and Spiner is ok…

I’m not saying that TOS actors are leagues ahead, but there is NO denying the chemistry of Kelley, Shatner, and Nimoy. Plus, in Ricardo Montalban, Christopher Lloyd, and Christopher Plummer – they had superior villains…

By: Closettrekker

Closettrekker — Thu, 13 Dec 2007 22:05:59 +0000

#131- For the most part, I agree, except that I believe TMP WAS good and was certainly successful. I don’t think it crosses over well into mainstream, but since when do we care about that? First Contact was the ONLY TNG film I enjoyed at all, save a few brief moments in Generations.

By: Checkpoint Charlie

Checkpoint Charlie — Thu, 13 Dec 2007 10:29:31 +0000

I don’t think the Nemezis is the worst tng movie. The Generations was that, and the Insurection has’t been better than the Nemezis.

By: PeterTHX

PeterTHX — Thu, 13 Dec 2007 07:50:07 +0000

I chalk it up to the “no ILM = not very good or not successful” formula.

TMP: no ILM
II: ILM and considered the best Trek film
III: ILM, successful with a couple flaws, but in whole very good
IV: ILM & most popular Trek film
V: No ILM and the worst VFX of any Trek film (or any other films in that era)
VI: ILM & Nicholas Meyer resurrect the Trek film franchise
Generations: ILM – criticized somewhat, but succesful
First Contact: ILM, considered best TNG film
Insurrection: No ILM, criticized and downright hated by some fans
Nemesis: Digital Domain has the Enterprise leaving smoke trails, flops

JJ Abrams new film *is* using Industrial Light & Magic…so draw your own conclusions!

By: Closettrekker

Closettrekker — Wed, 12 Dec 2007 21:01:01 +0000

#127- I guess that is a matter of opinion. I did not personally find that to be the problem with ENT at all. I thought limited access was (I did not get to see it regularly until it came out on DVD). I would love to see a young Gary Mitchell, Samuel Decker, etc. in a series. It would be good to see the voyages of NCC-1701 in between TMP and TWOK, or a Sulu commanded Excelsior series, or even an Enterprise-B series featuring Demorra Sulu and Capt. Harriman. There is plenty of room for fresh, new characters (and even some tie-ins with events/people in future/past series). I just like 23rd Century Trek better.

By: Justin Olson

Justin Olson — Wed, 12 Dec 2007 09:37:15 +0000

Mr Snuffleupacus wrote (#78):

“I had high hopes for Nemesis because I like the Logan-scripted Gladiator…”

Interestingly, the script to “Gladiator” was not just the work of John Logan. In fact he was only one of three credited writers that were hired to work on the script. According to the Wikipedia entry on Gladiator (which has footnotes for the sources of this info):

“[John] Logan rewrote much of [original screenwriter David Franzoni's] first act, and made the decision to kill off Maximus’ family to increase the character’s motivation. With two weeks to go before filming, the actors still complained of problems with the script. [The third and final screenwriter] William Nicholson was brought to Shepperton Studios to make Maximus a more sensitive character, reworking his friendship with Juba and developed the afterlife thread in the film, saying “he did not want to see a film about a man who wanted to kill somebody.” David Franzoni was later brought back to revise the rewrites of Logan and Nicholson, and in the process gained a producer’s credit. When Nicholson was brought in, he started going back to Franzoni’s original scripts and putting certain scenes back in. Franzoni helped creatively-manage the rewrites and in the role of producer he defended his original script, and nagged to stay true to the original vision.”

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gladiator_(2000_film)

By: Mr Snuffleupacus

Mr Snuffleupacus — Wed, 12 Dec 2007 01:56:30 +0000

Getting back to Nemesis: Logan is only responsible for the stupid storyline for Nemesis. Baird (who I respect TREMENDOUSLY as an editor of films such as The Omen and Superman I & II) is to blame for the direction as the director.

Whatever wound up on film is his fault.

I’ve never read Logan’s original treatment for Nemesis…so I can only surmise what was in that. Logan professed to be a Star Trek fan — much the way Orci does — and at the time, that generated some hope that Nemesis MIGHT have been something good.

Unfortunately…and I don’t presume to guess how…the project got off track.

If Anthony is really in a “go-getter” mood, it would be cool if he could get Logan here to discuss the behind the scenes happenings with regard to the writing of Nemesis…;-)

By: Mr Snuffleupacus

Mr Snuffleupacus — Wed, 12 Dec 2007 01:51:28 +0000

#124, the problem with setting a series “in between” established eras of Trek history is that we know that whatever happens in such a series CANNOT be of any importance — or rather we would know how it must end. This was the problem with Enterprise as well.

To me, that automatically sucks the drama right out of such a premise…

I’d rather see either a reboot (and I am traditionally NOT a supporter of reboots) or a sequel series.