More Trek Plot Rumors February 2, 2008
by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Uncategorized , trackbackOur friends over at ScreenRant, who have a good track record, have some more Star Trek rumors for you to enjoy. A snippet below and they do involve [SPOILERS]
Alternative Timelines…Oh My
According to ScreenRant the new Strar Trek involves not just the previously reported (and confirmed by TrekMovie.com) time travel, but also alternative timelines. TrekMovie.com has previously noted that one of the influences for the new Star Trek is the classic TNG alternative timeline episode “Yesterday’s Enterprise.” But ScreenRant has a nice new spoilery tidbit:
…in an alternate timeline there will be a significantly different version of the NCC-1701. From what I’ve been told it will be a very kick-ass version – essentially an all-out warship.
Of course alternative timelines are nothing new to Star Trek. The above mentioned “Yesterday’s Enterprise” is only one of dozens of episodes that have some form of alternative timeline. They have also shown up in the films; Star Trek Generations and Star Trek First Contact (and arguably Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home) use alternative timelines.
ScreenRant also notes that part of the film takes place in the time of Star Trek The Next Generation. TrekMovie.com has reported that Nimoy’s Spock starts off in a post-TNG setting and it isn’t clear at this time if this is what they are referring to. In our October interview with Star trek co-writer Roberto Orci, he was clear that there there were references to TNG that were “pivotal to the story.”
For more check out ScreenRant.
Alternative timeline in “Yesterday’s Enterprise”
Loading ...
Comments»
Doesn’t sound very impressive to me.
I miss ST TNG
Wow, will I be the first on a post referring to my own site? :-)
Cool.
Vic
Interesting, I suspected that Leonard’s Spock would be in TNG time.
This doesn’t seem to be a spoiler, as much as a confirmation of what people were thinking all along…
Can you verify this, Anthony?
Oh, and just so you guys know… I withheld a REALLY big spoiler (that I’m sure Anthony knows about as well) because I have no intention of ruining this movie for anyone.
Vic
Well, it would have to be in the TNG timeline at some point, no? How else to explain Nimoy’s age? That’s not too spoilery. Alternate universes? Cool. We get Spock with a goatee at some point in this movie and half the posters on this board will geek out and have coronaries in the theater!
That sounds crazy, but cool. I look forward to it!!
C’mon, Vic! What’s the deal?!!
i want a patrick stewart cameo.
Sorry, Crusty. If you want no holds barred spoilers big enough to ruin the movie experience you’ll have to head on over to IESB.net. I care too much about my readers to step too far over the line.
Best,
Vic
Cool, this is what I sort of suspected all along, and if it does come to pass it sounds very cool. I just hope we don’t spend too much time in the 24th century unless it’s WAY past TNG’s time. Sorry, but that whole era hold no appeal to me at all.
And a BIG thank you to ScreenRant, and Anthony as well if you truly are holding back.
I have no need to know every little detail and I appreciate the efforts of those that willingly keep the lid on the pot.
i come to this site to ruin the movie. to get spoiled!!! so u wont hurt my feelings.
Hmmm…sounds a bit overdone and annoying. I think I would have preferred a high quality story that doesn’t resort to the forced and artificial drama of alternative timelines to remain compelling. Alternative timelines have have been done so many times before. A story of the genesis of the original crew seems more than enough to keep me interested. But I will keep an open mind of course, and hope it’s good.
7.
While I appreciate that, it’s going to drive me nuts.
It’s going to be a long wait for Christmas.
Bless you, Vic — you bastard!
This movie is going to rock my socks and shoes off.
I want Quark in this movie!
Alternate Timelines, tribbles, time travel…
I’m starting to have doubts. I know that this is going to be different, but why does it have to be impossible to follow?
Sounds like an episode of Lost, intriguing.
So we know Spock goes back in time wonder if he steals the Enterprise E to do it.
And is the beautiful new supergigantor E we have seen the superbattleship E??? Or reimaginined E ???
And who is in the coffin Jack visits on Lost, could it in fact be Spock ????
I like the idea of old Spock finding one day that everything he knew is gone, indicating that someone has messed with the timeline — like a massive multilevel simultaneous attack that he needs help to fight… He goes back and brings together the original crew of the enterprise, figuring that even young and inexperienced they will have the traits they need to get the job done. Knowing that he can never perfectly undo the damage that has been done, he simply does his best, and hopes it will be good enough for key future events to play out in a similar way. That’s the reason for the epic battle across timelines, and explains any changes to cannon.
Re spoilers:
“After a time, you may find that having is not so pleasing a thing, after all, as wanting. It is not logical. But it is often true.”
Peace. Live long and prosper.
The Vulcanista }:-|
Maybe that’s why Yelchin saw Klingons. Bet the Battle-E kicks their ridge-covered arses back across the neutral zone!
Greetings and felicitations, Vulcanista!
My above guess would also make sense in a symetrical sense, since JJ referenced ‘Yesterday’s Enterprise.’ They were fighting Klingons because of a missed opportunity involving a battle with the Romulans. So, this would go along with that timeline. (Kinda — this is where my head starts to hurt.)
I love Lamp…… and Spoilers
11.
Yeah buddy! Patrick Stewart Cameo!
Well if no one else will say it then ScreenRant STFU.. if you need to promo your site go elsewhere… I for one don’t GAF if your right or wrong… just wrong to use this one as a springboard.
Sorry Tony couldn’t help meself.
Meh. It’ll probably still be good, but I agree that I would have been happy with a straightforward “genesis” of TOS story line.
After setting the timeline right Spock stops off in 1997 to Pon Far Carmen Electra
Greetings, CmdrR!
All I really want them to do is tell me a good story. That hasn’t changed since I was three, and it’s not going to change anytime soon.
PS: How’s that young’un of yours coming along? Is it done yet? :)
Peace. Live long and prosper.
The Vulcanista }:-|
Back to Mirror, Mirror.
I for one like time travel stories in Trek….
…and I wonder if the big giant spoiler that cannot be spoken involves…. the Shat?????? :D
He was due today, Vulcanista. Must be a fluxuation in the chronoton collated gestation field. I hope to have a bouncing baby geek soon. I’m so psyched about all the cool ST toys he’ll be getting that are just for him and not for his father to play with really no foolin.
Amen to good storytelling. I don’t know if 126 pages means a two hour movie, or if there’s a lot of time burned up in FX. (Wonder how many pages of screenplay it took to write the psychadelic tunnel at the end of 2001?) This movie certainly feels overstuffed, but if it keeps chuggin, then they can mess with the timelines a little, I suppose.
Oi. I’m with others in that, while I certainly don’t think all this time travel and alternate timelines stuff will make it a BAD movie, I would have preferred a more straightforward storyline. Time travel storylines have of course been done very well in Trek… but they have already been done many, many times.
#34
Countdown begins…
Good luck!
Peace. Live long and prosper.
The Vulcanista }:-|
#33
Really?
Ya think? ;-)
Would be cool, indeed.
Peace. Live long and prosper.
The Vulcanista }:-|
I told you Closettrekker,
From TOS:
J.J.’s teaser trailer mirror Footage of Steelworkers building war-machines in WWII.
From Trekmovie.com:
From what I’ve been told it will be a very kick-ass version – essentially an all-out warship.
———————
Ps Thank God, it maybe an alternative timeline and does not have to with the TOS Timeline. But, why did J.J. not make his own crew??????
If you are dealing with alternate timelines, do we see a old James T. Kirk in there somewhere?
There is your way out, timeline is altered and Kirk survives…
Alternate timeline… Ehh… I mean, yeah, it’s a way to preserve canon so the original storyline is not tampered with, but… I dunno.
I guess I’m just skeptical because I still hate seeing all that history go to waste.
It’s still 11 months from release, I could be worrying about nothing.
YUBinit
warning for just being rude
screenrant vic is welcome here anytime
#34 CmrdR
PS: Post in the chat folder when the little geek/geekala finally arrives!
Peace. Live long and prosper.
The Vulcanista }:-|
YUBinit,
Um, if you notice, Anthony mentioned my site in the post, dude.
Thanks for your polite words.
Best regards,
Vic
Wow, this just keeps sounding more interesting. How, tell me HOW I’m supposed to wait until December >>>>>>> :(
Yes, Mike T. In an alternate time line Kirk could still be aliiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiive!
So there it is, a reboot using an alternate timeline as the explanation. So no worries about canon violation.
Unless the alt. timeline seen is the changed one, and the real one is reestablished by the end.
So many questions!
I prefer to stay open minded and use wait and see attitude about the rumors surrounding the story.
I’m not seeing a coherent story here, just a lot of canon erasing.
Just bring back The Shat & revive the authentic James T. Kirk.
This is the cherry on top! I’m am now fully revved up! Didn’t Orci or someone say we’d hear the name “Picard”? Alternate Enterprises? Hell yeah!
It is possible that the Shat will be in the movie thanks to the spoilers.
Forgive me for staying away from this article…
There is a breakthrough in the Hollywood and Writers talk.
http://www.ctv.ca/servlet/ArticleNews/story/CTVNews/20080202/striking_writers_080202/20080202?hub=TopStories
I wouldn’t mind seeing Tasha Yar again. That reminds me. I ran into Chris McDonald when I was moonlighting in a little bar in Hollywood back in 2001. I mentioned to him how Yesterday’s Enterprise was my favorite episode. He laughed and said to me, “The funny thing is in 20 years that’s the only thing I’ll be remembered for.” True story. Nice guy.
I’m intrigued more than ever! Classicaly most of the best stories have involved time-travel, so this one sounds like it could be rocking-and-rolling all over the inter-multi-dimensional time map, with plot twists around ever corner!
I look forward to the fun! :))
The thing all you canonites are failing to come to grips with is the fact that time travel IS canon. If time travel is canon then you must accept that infinite timelines are also canon because once the timeline has been traveled it has also been changed! The very act of moving through time will bring change, however small. Someone much smarter than me said that. Asimov? That sure as heck ain’t JJ’s fault.
Well said, Rocker Girl.
whopper of a spoiler?
The alternate timeline is kind of obvious from Mr. Orci’s “Star Trek Zero” reference and that it would be “in canon”: it is not a reboot per se but a change to an alternate timeline. Six of one, half a dozen of the other. It is in effect a reboot.
One of the arguments against sticking to canon is that it would be a hinderance in making a movie that mainstream audiences could follow.
So, alternate timelines would be easier for mainstream audiences to follow?
I just want to see the “real” timeline; the “real” Star Trek. Time travel has been done to death in Star Trek and done badly (temporal cold war).
Can they not do just a straight forward, non-time travel story?
I really want a Patrick Stewart cameo. Capt Picard is just as important to the Trek legacy as Kirk and Spock. Of all the “new” series set in the 24th century, Picard is the best loved character. The fact that he and Spock have a connection (due to his mind meld in TNG with both Surak and Spock) makes his appearance in the new film a possible important one, if they choose to put him in it.
“Yesterday’s Enterprise” was my all time favorite episode of TNG! I’m so excited that the movie will be taking influence from that awesome episode!
That sounds awesome! Alternate timelines create really interesting dramatic avenues.
I hate to do a shameless plug, but we’re really short on RP players. We have an NX-01 era RP called Star Trek: Poseidon – The Birth of the Federation. It’s awesome. Join up with us please?
http://www.ussposeidon.net/botf/
Sounds worse all the time.
15
Agreed. I really hope Abrams can keep this from being too much of a gimmicky, plot-heavy movie.
In my opinion that was the thing that sank the franchise in the first place. Instead of just telling stories about CHARACTERS, Berman and his writers began focusing too much on all these weird, twisty, high concept gimmicks.
To me it’s compelling enough that you’ve got people exploring the unknown depths of space in a fantastic starship.
Interesting…
In other words, I really hope we don’t have ourselves another “Nexus” here….
AICN ran this story about alternate time lines months ago. We have known that the series will keep the established time line and create an alternate for since last year.
I think it’s a pretty cool idea. It keeps everyone happy.
Any ideas on what that big spoiler is all about?
link to iesb and the major spoiler?
65.
“I think it’s a pretty cool idea. It keeps everyone happy.”
Not everybody.
A Warship version of the NCC 1701 sounds awesome!
I’m willing to bet that Shatner is the spoiler they’re keeping under wraps.
Spock in TNG era make sense with a Romulan villain and the last we saw of Spock he was on Romulus in “Re-unification”
I just looked at iesb.net and could not find what the major spoiler was
I thought the Enterprise we saw in the trailer was this warship he was referring to………
#52 elmachocombo “I ran into Chris McDonald”
Cool post! Isn’t it true that back in the audition days for TNG Chris McDonald came close to being cast as Riker, but Roddenberry opted for Jonathan Frakes instead? Frakes seems nice enough as a person, but McDonald is clearly the better actor! The whole dynamic for TNG could have been so much different and better with McDonald working with Patrick Stewart lo these many years. Just another example of where Gene had his head up his ass with a consistent pattern of making stupid decisions! Shame!
#69 I’m hoping so too!!!! Shat could just be throwing us all off with the fuss. All will be forgiven when we see him back on the screen, or even Nimoy ending the movie with a suprise smile saying “Jim!” like in Amok Time. This movie needs to right the wrong done with Generations while Shat is here to play the part. If they can bring Spock back in III, they can bring Kirk back in XI. I almost feel it would be out of character for Spock not to go after him after what Kirk did for him. It should be easy to do with alternate time lines taking place! Didn’t Kirk think that he would die alone? He didn’t in Generations. He needs a proper death….someday.
Other bonuses this movie could give us:
“Fleet Captain April” giving Pike command of the Enterprise :-)
Carol Marcus
Number One and with a name!
Gary Mitchel
J class starships
As a super-spoiler fan, would it be possible for someone to publish the big spoilers somewhere, maybe with a double opt-in sign-up kind of situation?
I don’t want people to casually come across anything that might ruin the experience for them, but for those of us who like this sort of thing, and respect others enough not to let it out, it would be very much appreciated.
And yes, I’m the guy that reads the end of the book first. I just don’t like surprises, what can I say?
The only thing that bugs me is if you know a super big spoiler. And do not what to tell anyone, don’t say anything about it. Please Vic I hope you do not think I am attacking you. But its such a tease to tell that you know a big secret about the movie, and not tell.
#76 “you know a big secret about the movie, and not tell”
Yeah, there’s nothing worse than a plot-teaser! :)
When I first heard the new TREK film was to be a time travel story, I was bitterly disappointed, but then I thought maybe the film makers would find a new approach to an over-used and convoluted sci-fi concept.
If there is any truth to this story, it looks like my worst fears have been realized. Unlike most fans, I was never that big a fan of YESTERDAY’S ENTERPRISE–just seemed too gimmicky a story and now it appears we may get too gimmicky a movie.
The Guardian of Forever concept sounded a lot more interesting to me.
Hmm…interesting , we shall have to see where all of it leads Dec. 25th!
78. To be honest, “Yesterday’s Enterprise” is one of my favorite TNG episodes. Also, personally, I think The Guardian of Forever idea was MUCH more “gimmicky.” But that’s just my opinion! :-p
Harry, I can tell you Frakes is a nice guy too. When I was living in L.A. I occasionally worked on film sets. One gig was a little Disney flick called Clockstoppers. Frakes was the director and had everybody laughing alot. I think we were both happy to have a job! Small world. Just first impressions, but Chris has a certain presence that I think would have been much better suited to the right hand man on the Enterprise. Frakes’ Riker always struck me as a bit of a blow-hard.
Why does this movie seem worse every time I find out more about it??
It’s pretty lame, and it shows how much they don’t even really understand or like the Star Trek universe, if they feel Gene’s vision is so inadequate that they have to make their own version of it in an “alternate universe.”
If they are intending this film for a general film audience as well as for the fans, why are they writing a time travel episode? This I feel will add complexity to the storyline and may confuse the non-Trek fans who don’t know the details as intimately as us.I feel the best solution was for the film’s writers to have concentrated on a story which is set in one time period. And, if they wanted to introduce other time periods, then this could be pursued in a later film.
This is not promising news. The last film written by a fan failed at the box office, and I fear the same may happen for this film.
(This film shares some common plot ideas with a Voyager episode where Seven of Nine is recruited by 29th century Starfleet agents in an effort to preserve the time period. )
#83
Unfortunately that was one of the episodes of Voyager I actually LIKED. I’ve been watching Star Trek since I was a little kid so all this time travel business is no big deal. However I have to wonder how the general movie audience is going to stomach all this alternate time line stuff.
Purist, we’ve been over this before. Gene is dead. Nobody but the New Voyages guys are going to live up to “Gene’s vision” as you see it. And where do you get this notion that JJ and co. see what came before them as “inadequate”? You seem to enjoy shoehorning a lot of baggage between the lines. You seem desperate to convince yourself that this is going to be a bad experience. That is unfortunate. Life is too short. Based on everything I’ve read this sounding more and more like an epic adventure movie the likes of which we haven’t seen in a loooooong time. Sh*t! Even my dad is excited and he hasn’t been to movies since we saw E.T.! Call me naive, but I want this to be a rip-roaring roller-coaster of a movie with great music, a great villain, lots of surprise twists, and an “Oh my God!” ending, not a 2 hour episode of yaaaaaawn.
MAJOR SPOILER!
Spock has to travel into the past and rescue the crew of the Enterprise from an alternate time line in which his comrades are all 20th century actors with different names doing a TV show called “Star Trek.”
Spock: “Jim, listen to me. My mind to your mind. You are not William Shatner. You are Captain James T. Kirk. Do you understand? Captain James T. Kirk!”
Kirk: “I am Captain James T. J. Hooker…”
Spock: “No Jim! Pay attention! Were running out of time!”
I could be okay with time travel and an alternate universe for some part of the film. I’m not really thrilled about either one, because as folks have said, we’ve seen this before, and IMHO both are hugely over-used plot gimmicks, but I can go with it.
However…
For me, the key issue still devolves back to the same question I’ve been asking since the first rumors happened. To wit: “Is the Trekverse in which this film ends, and in which future films would be expected to take place, the same, or so close that it really doesn’t make a difference (a la “Yesteryear”), to the one in which all the rest of Trek (except for clearly demarcated exceptions such as the Mirrorverse) has taken place?” If yes, then it’s all good as far as I’m concerned, though I’m also pretty sure that this sort of stuff is not going to remotely contribute to gaining new audience for Trek. If not, if this is some sort of backdoor [ptui!] reboot, with the concomitent lame excuse-making that “we’re not doing anything to canon, because it’s an alternate universe now”, then add me to the disappointed/disillusioned crowd, and TPTB can start counting the money they won’t be getting from me in repeat viewings.
I liked “Yesterday’s Enterprise”, and I thought the War Universe was a fairly effective way of showing how messed-up things could get, but at the end of the episode, the proper universe had been restored/returned to, and I have no less of an expectation for this film. I hope that the team can live up to that.
I have a bad feeling that the major spoiler is………….KCOPS SEID
@23 The Vulcanista
Truer words were never spoken.
I predicted this alternate timeline theory in the post teaser Orci reply thread in a moment of wild fanboy hyper-extrapolation specifically regarding why the ship could be different but I was aiming for cheap laughs due to it being just a bit TOO much.
Be careful what you wish for…
Ahh, it could work… If they do it, be prepared to have to explain alternate timelines to all your Significant Others and any other poor souls you drag along to opening night…
89 – nah, I think it is ………………. TAHS SI NI EHT EIVOM :D
i scoured iesb.net and really didn’t find anything there that would suggest a rumor that ruins the film for me….
but the above is making me cringe a bit. multiple time periods, alternate timelines…??
will wait and see
to be honest, was kind of hoping most of these time travel rumors were false, and that we would see a TOS-Menagerie style stroryline (i.e. Spock shows the past)
regardless of anything, still will be there in line Christmas Day at midnight. Less than 11 months to go ! looking forward to it
“# 1. Penhall – February 2, 2008
Doesn’t sound very impressive to me.”
Hard to make that call. But then if this was any of the other 10 movies and we were hearing certain aspects of those films this early on, I’m sure plenty of people would be saying the same thing.
It’s all in the execution and if it’s made as a good movie folks. Christmas isn’t here yet, so don’t freak out. It’s safe to sleep tonight because the sun WILL come out tomorrow ;)
“to be honest, was kind of hoping most of these time travel rumors were false, and that we would see a TOS-Menagerie style stroryline (i.e. Spock shows the past)”
We already had a movie somewhat like that, it was called “The Inconvenient Truth.”
#87 – LOL
Alternative timelines losing their way into the TNG timeline, old Spock starting off in a post-TNG setting, then travelling back to meet his younger self, explaining to him the wisdom of friendship while chatting to baby Kirk whose slightly elder self is busy beating the Kobayashi Maru computer while trying to prevent himself from being killed by Nero’s second henchman, then travelling back (or forth?) in a significantly different version of the NCC-1701 in order to re-invigorate his relationship with his now considerably younger father…
And throughout that entire time travelling hassle and changing from one alternative timeline to another, old Spock keeps twisting his mind with that one burning question “Is there nothing more“?
Spock is travelling back in time to kill Kirk.
They probably have to do a timeline story so they could put Leonard in it and make it an active role. But I hope the next one doesn’t involve time travel.
Pretty please?
Alternate time line? Warship Enterprise?
Sounds like “Of Gods and Men.”
Man, you yanks get worked up about this stuff. Chill out and wait for the movie, then debate based on fact and not speculation… In the meantime, there’s a big world out there, try leaving your bedrooms for a while
Stanky… remember over a year ago when I called you “Spanky” by mistake? Boy, those were the good old days. We had to walk miles to school rather than ride shuttlecrafts…we didn’t beam down because the transporter didn’t work right…we sucked up radiation from warped baffle plates…and we liked it!! One beep for yes…two for no.
#1: “Well, what WOULD you like?”
Here we have a new Trek with a massive budget and a massive creative vision–what else do you want? I mean, really. Movies can only do so much. Maybe it’s time to convert to a new religion, or something. I’m an old school Trekker (Trekkie, whatever) and I can’t stress enough that while Trek as a mythology deserves respect; cowering before its sometimes rabid fan base is a sure-fire way to failure. Make your movie. Knock it out of the park. I rather suspect most of us will be there. The “Littleness” of the discussion is just nauseating sometimes. This is why Shatner did the SNL skit. Can you blame him?!
#20 Josh ; #48 Sybok Amok ; and others…
I have to laugh at these comments about the movie sounding “incoherent” or “impossible to follow.” I guarantee you all that J.J. has a complete script to work off– not just a few stray threads of partial stories. Give me a break!
So, we get alternate timelines and with those it is not possible to include an older Kirk?
The excuse by JJ Abrams gets eben more ridiculous by this…
Ahhh, not the Shatner argument *again*
#106
Agreed.
I couldn’t imagine Abrams’ excuses to get even *more* ridiculous, but the sky‘s the limit…
#8. “Alternate universes? Cool. We get Spock with a goatee at some point in this movie and half the posters on this board will geek out and have coronaries in the theater!”
They said alternate timelines NOT alternate universes. There’s a difference!
See this is how they could have brought Shatner back with alternate timelines!!!! But that would be to easy!
The people involved have described this product as a kind of reboot for the franchise. Of the two other ‘reboots’ I know of, the most successful for me was the film Batman Begins. instead of complicating the film with unnecessary details, they simply created a believable, fun origin story that wasn’t hard for me as a non-Batman fan to enjoy. This is the best approach I think for re-energizing the franchise.
Instead, what do we have? An overly complex time travel story involving different eras of the Trek history with the elder Spock doing something to keep time on track (isn’t that always the case in these stories)? Why don’t we have a simple origin story, showing the crew’s first voyage? I read a Star Trek novel where this approach was attempted. This would be such a better idea.
I have faint hopes for this film. After the debacle with Nemesis, I am wary of fans writing Star Trek movies. They inevitably want to impress the other fans with their knowledge of the franchise and create a story that they may like, not necessary other fans and the general audience may like, and what is created is a mess.
This film may end up a DVD rental for me.
AWESOME ABOUT TNG LINKS im just hoping they don’t make it too complicated for non fans and it ends up like a long episode and fails like nemesis due to lack of appeal.
Interesting except for one small thing, rumors about this film have a amazing ability to turn out to be a load of dog doo. Remember the City on the Edge of Forever story line. What about the protestors outside the acadamy.
LLAP
105
Good point. If memory serves, we gave him a whole script that said “THE END at the end.
RE major spoilers, it would be good if the site put spoilers in say white text on a white background so the user has to high light them to see what it says. Often reports contain other interesting non spoiler info and it’s hard not to read the spoiler bits…
I thought that the movie will be a TOS movie. Now there is a TNG part in it. I personally never liked TNG. Except Data. Are they not capable of, simply telling a real TOS Story, without Time Traveling and the Mirror Universe? :(
115
Correction — message just from me.
There is no Star Trek without The Shat, this movie will be no part of canon than New Voyages. Shat is the Letter of Authenticity for anything Trek.
A true ‘reboot’ would be restoring Kirk to the Enterprise B & delete TNG, DS9, VOY & ENT from canon. Star Trek is about Kirk. Lets bring Shat home in XI & make Star Trek XII, XIII, and onwards about James T. Kirk’s new voyages aboard the flagship USS Enterprise-F, with Spock back at his side & a new crew warping into the 25 century.
I RECKON ERIC BANAS CHARCTER NERO IS IN FACT SPOCKS SON AND THAT HIS MOTHER WAS THE ROMULAN BIRD IN TOS THAT SPOCK GOT IT ON WITH!
ahh i feel so much better having got that off my chest!
ENTERPRISE Vs ENTERPRISE?
*YAWN*
So far we’re going boldly where every Trek series has been before. Big deal.
The irony of the “oh no time travel” arguement is that the most finacially successful Trek movies used time travel in the main plot. However this alternate timeline story sounds a bit much to handle. Hopefully the action and the nuances of the story will make non fans appreciate the whole deal. If not at least it should be entertaining!
This fits with the very first spoilers on AICN – an alternate in which Vulcan is toast and Spock is the last of. If I recall, there was talk that this would reboot the franchise into an alternative universe.
I hope the Big Spoiler is Shatner.
I don’t mind timetravel as a vehicle connection the “old” Trek universe with the “new”, but I always hated alternate timeline stories like Yesterday’s Enterprise or the Mirror Universe.
above should read “… connecting…”
What really bothers me is the fact that I feel as thought this movie is getting so complicated with alternate timelines, time travel, characters from multiples eras of Star Trek, and a plethora of alien species, that this movie is going to be too elaborate for the average moviegoer. Abrams claimed that this movie will appeal not only to Star Trek fans but also people who know nothing about Star Trek.
…at this rate, the movie isn’t going to make sense to anyone. Especially fans like us who will try our hardest to try and piece everything together (even at much expense to our sanity). I’m still quite optimistic for this new take on Star Trek but I’m afraid JJ is going to alienate people more than welcome them to the franchise.
#123 that wouldn’t make sense There are millions of Vulcans on Thousands of planets and Starships plus it sounds to me they took the Doctor Who plot with that story and replaced Galifey with Vulcan and the Doctor with Spock…or though DW did pinch the half human idea from Spock perhaps its karma
-An alternative timeline sounds better than ‘a remake’..this is one of the things that i liked in ” Enterprise”
The rants against time travel continue to amuse. The most popular episodes and movies have time travel elements.
There is an illogical disconnect here.
The adventure continues…
I for one loved every time-travel episode, i especially loved it when time repeated itself (al la Cause and Effect) so i am really REALLY excited about this film!
TNG era was my favourite era, i only liked the TOS movies and the “better episodes”. DS9 was really political which was a bore, but then turned into a kick ass show, however, although i did really like it, it was never as captivating as TNG trek. I also loved VOY, I was f***in sick of Klingons, Cardassians and Alpha Quadrant species that i needed a break, VOY gave me this break and was really well done IMO. ENT… well lets say I only watched 5 episodes… the theme tune was enough to p!ss me off!!
so in conclusion my trek ratings go like this:
1-TNG
2-TOS (Movies, Balance of Terror, the menagerie, COTEOF, [good episodes])
3-VOY
3-DS9
4-NV
100000000000000000000000000000000000-ENT
As you can see i prefer latter trek and with this trek, time “stuff” was ace, and although i still haven’t seen Mirror, Mirror i’m sure it rocked!
As for the “Big secret” – its Shat.
Will this movie suck? – no.
Should they make Star Trek: Titan a series? – YES DAMNIT!
Should Picard have a cameo? – yes.
Should Archer, April, Garrovick, Mitchell, Finney and that Irish bully (who i can never remember his name) get a cameo? – YES DAMNIT!
rant over.
(BTW I am only 20 – TNG i grew up with)
SPOILER ALERT…From an Insider on set. Spock will meet with the King of the Tribble Empire and Kirk will be brought back to marry the Tribble Queen….this will be Canon, in years to come.
#119
Wow! Finally an original thought – most of the lame fanboys and fangurls around here are endlessly rehashing the same tired speculations and scenarios for bringing back tired has-been actors.
Nero being the offspring of Spock’s liason with the Romulan Commander of the Enterprise Incident would be a cool tie-in with TOS.
to u guys still bashing JJ about the Shat- it seems that the end of the film would have involved kirk surviving in a slightly different timeline as a reward/pay off/ insentive for welcoming this alt timeline but the Shat wouldnt do a cameo so it is he who is responsible for him not appearing in the film.
he wanted a big part- this want going to happen and he ultimately robbed us of witnessing Kirks return in the movie/post next generation universe.
I like the idea that Species 8472 have invaded the alpha quadrant at the end of the movie after Spock brings the Alternate crew to the 24th century they fight alongside Riker and the Titan to Repell a 8472 attack after the alternate universe is destroyed by Nero
Yes, please no serious spoilers that you could easily happen upon. I like the veil of secrecy building up the anticipation. Same thing with Cloverfield, the build up and intrigue from the viral was exciting, and the movie the best cinema experience I have had for years. The movie was way better than the hype build up, and I expect even more from JJ’s team’s Trek. I was so blown away by Cloverfield, without question the best monster movie of all time for me and my brother.
#81, hey did you work on the set at the Boeing plant in Downey. I worked on Clockstoppers as well and Frakes was a great guy! I’m glad Roddenberry picked him.
^
Okay, gang, let’s just accept that Roberto, et al, have Spock going back to fight the NBC executives that cancelled TOS. Expect Jorge Garcia to step in as BelushiKirk. Mark it down. That would mesh up perfectly with the script I bought on ebay from user “THE_FRINGEDUP_ALLSPARKED_TREKKIE”
I will say this though. If Bana’s “Nero” gets anywhere near a fiddle, or has one on a wall in his quarters. I will throw up in my mouth a little. That would reek of writer’s hackery.
#118. You have got to be drunk on Tranya.
#126, what’s so hard to grasp. Its an alternate timeline. Ghesssh your a Trek fan and you can’t handle this concept.
I am not impressed. I hate time travel and alternate timeline plots. But these are only rumours.
I have reservations about all this talk of time travel and alternate timelines. They’re Clichés that Trek has worked itself into over the years. Now we’re being told that they’re both stuffed into one movie, and that we’ll get to see an Enterprise warship? I have great faith in the people doing this movie, they’re all supremely talented, but these rumors do nothing for me. We’ve been there so many times….when will Star Trek being about exploration of ideas, worlds and spirituality again? I hope the rumors are false and that we get to see something fresh.
#142 “I hope the rumors are false and that we get to see something fresh.”
I hope it too.
80. Freddie Wise wrote:
To be honest, “Yesterday’s Enterprise” is one of my favorite TNG episodes. Also, personally, I think The Guardian of Forever idea was MUCH more “gimmicky.” But that’s just my opinion! :-p
The bottom-line, to me, is City on the Edge of Forever was a love story. Yesterday’s Enterprise was about the mechanics of plot and time-travel mumbo-jumbo with a love story thrown in. I never thought the love story in COTEOF was incidental. The love story in YE, felt forced and contrived. And, of course you can see how the YE story was ripped from COTEOF.
The best comparison I can think of in a broad sense is comparing Back to the Future 1 and 3, to BTTF 2. The former were about the characters and human feelings. BTTF 2 was just plot, plot, plot, mechanics, mechanics, mechanics, gimmicks, gimmicks, gimmicks. I get this feeling from YE as well, though not as much as BTTF 2, but compared to COTEOF, it comes off that way to me as well.
. TOS explored time travel 5 times. FIVE times. 4 episodes out of 79 dealt with time travel. ONE movie out of 6, dealit with time travel..
I don’t care if time-travel wore out it’s welcome in the spin-offs, this is TOS we’re talking about here and TOS handled time travel quite well. The only TOS movie to deal with time travel was the most successful movie all ALL Trek movies. So all this belly aching about “I’m so sick of time travel” just doesn’t hold any water. You may just have a dislike for the concept in general, but you can’t hate it because it’s been done to death. Not in the TOS universe anyway.
The whole idea reminds me of one of my favorite movies, Nicholos Meyer’s Time After Time. Chasing someone through time can be quite fun, very dangerous and very epic. I think it’s the perfect way to introduce a new audience to these characters and retain ties to classic Trek, while at the same time providing a plot device that allows things from the TOS universe to slightly change.
Let me say that to me these rumors sound quite incompatible with the message of the teaser. “The future begins”, “the eyes of the world now look into space”. Make me think of exploration, strange new worlds and new civilizations.
We all knew this had to involve some kind of time travel as soon as we got indication that “Old Spock” and “Young Spock” were in the plot…
Gimme a break with all this bellyaching…what did you THINK it was gonna be?
#123-
Waitaminute… first Abrams writes a script for SUPERMAN RETURNS where Krypton WASN’T destroyed…
…but now we have a STAR TREK movie where the planet Vulcan is toast, essentially turning Spock into the “Last Son of Vulcan?”
Something sounds a little fishy. I’m still not buying ANY of these spoilers until I see the finished product.
Hmmm… plot prediction:
In the future, the Romulans send several agents back in time to kill Kirk; they succeed, resulting in an altered “Yesterday’s Enterprise” timeline. Spock must then go back in time, through different periods of the alternate timeline, and perhaps some of the normal timeline (?), and saves Kirk. In this, Spock is aided by his younger self and the rest of the crew of the alternate Enterprise; after they save Kirk, Spock and young Spock have a farewell scene, then future Spock either leaves, or perhaps dies (probably just leaves, though). Voyages continue.
A disclaimer: all of the above is pure speculation, and should not be mistaken for real-life plot elements or “leaks” or whatever. I made the whole thing up just now at my computer.
So what does everyone think? Plausible?
146 — it also says “under construction” which could be a I’m-style reference to the fact that the present is the mechanism for building the future… A kind of philosophical statement about the entire concept of using the realworld space program audio clips in the teaser. The bold TOS-style positive message is that contrary to the popular belief that we are destroying our own future day by day — we are actually building the ST future gene Roddenberry dreamed of.
Hmm- reading this in concert with Orci’s October interview, I notice this quote:
“…we are purposely not saying if it is a reboot or not is that the solution we have for maintaining canon while liberating us is inherently part of what the story is and something we are reluctant to give away.”
Might this be a reference to ‘alternate timelines’ that can liberate them from canon and show wild and crazy things?
#12 and where on iesb is this script explaination hat ruins the movie?
A battleship style Enterprise(spoilers) may support the idea of an alternate timeline which Spock would have to fix somehow.
In my opinion alternate time lines are a little too far flung.I’d rather follow a linear logical story.
YES!!!!!!!
THE MIRROR UNIVERSE!!!!!!!!
YES!!!!!!!!!
ZOE SALDANA WITH HER BELLYBUTTON, A DAGGER, AND A PAIR OF FMB’S!!!!!
YEEEEEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I am so looking forward to this movie. Alternate timeline Trek stories have been some of my favorites. I’m surprised so many Trekkers here are against them. I find them interesting and thought provoking. As for changing the Trek universe slightly in order to modernize the look and fix some of the inconsistincies of TOS, it seems to me that this would be the only logical way to do it. TOS stories would have occured the same way only in a more updated setting. It would not violate canon because it would become canon. It would be very similar to the way DC Comics updated their universe with their crisis series. In short, I wish JJ alot of luck with this revitalization of the franchise.
“Gene L. Coon (was the better Gene because he) was a U. S. Marine”
Granted, however, Gene Roddenberry was an Officer in the USAAF during WWII.
What is significantally different today is that back in teh 1950s and 1960s almost everyone of significance was a veteran of WWII or the Korean War.
As to the Subject…
Star Trek in an iconic part of the fabric of modern Western Civilization (like the Alamo, Rock Music and Penicillin). Be advised that if this turns out to really “put boogers in the oatmeal,” it will seriously alter an iconic element of what we call TREK.
Alternate timelines have a tendency to devolve into “gimmicks.”
Please, no TNG characters. Still haven’t recovered from the way B&B horned in on “Enterprise’s” last episode. I can understand Spock starting things out in the post-Picard era, but larding the movie with TNG characters is a good way to bog the movie down.
Orci did say that the Enterprise’s appearance was part of the story… so there ya have it.
Maybe instead of seeing Shatner at the end of the film, we’ll see the real TOS Enterprise restored.
Lets see here.. an alternate timeline,a kickass version of the Enterprise, Vulcan distroyed. Are we talking about STXI or Of Gods and Men? I think someone is getting their wires crossed.From what I am reading here, maybe Charlie Evans is the big Spoiler.
#107 The Shatner thing is very relevant as the more we hear about this plot the MORE JJ’s excuse of wouldnt fit into the story they are telling becomes more and more ludicrous:
- A time travelling Spock sent to save Kirk
- Alternate Timelines
And a writing team who cant figure out how to write a role for older Kirk that would fit in the plot???
DOH !
Hey, people remember that JJ said that both he and his wife were able to follow the script and enjoy it, so I for one am not that worried that this will be “too complicated” for non-fans to understand. Also, if Roberto Orci and James Cawley think that the movie will be good, I trust that it will.
161. Juli – February 3, 2008
Also, if Roberto Orci and James Cawley think that the movie will be good, I trust that it will.
I hope Bob Orci thinks the movie will be good. Hell, after all he has co-written the script! So he better is convinced the movie is good. :)
I do not like this alternate time-line & time travel plot in XI. It is so overrated & overdone in Star Trek.
More a read about this film the more doubts i have. I think i remember that Orci had stated that Yesterday´s Enterprise is among his favorite TNG episodes. Also he is TNG fan and it seems he making fan-boyish script . Perfect sample for this is writing Nimoy into this film and TNG timeline.
They should have rebooted the franchise and going back to basics. I do think general audience have zero interest in alternate time-line and another time traval in imaginary universe.
My interest in this film has gone from 10/10 to 5/10 in recent months. Sorry.
#123 – I’m pretty sure that Vulcan being destroyed has never been directly claimed to be in the film. “Moriarty” from AICN used that as a speculation as to what could be done in an alternate continuity (perhaps the best example of why I think creating such a thing would be an incredibly poor idea).
(’Course, with some of the rumors out there, I really do wonder if folks have been getting this film confused with “Of Gods and Men”.)
#114/116 – “If memory serves, we gave him a whole script that said “THE END at the end.”
[chuckle]
Glad you’re still reading, Roberto. :) Honestly, without asking for any plot points, would it be possible to give just a yes or no answer to my question in #88? I might have a bunch of different opinions on specific plot and production elements (rumored or otherwise), but that question is really the only make-or-break issue for me.
In one of your previous Q&As, you commented on understanding one poster’s fear. Well, that’s mine. Call me an unreconstructed old-school fan if you want, but the only real “fear” I have about this film is that when it’s over, within its own context, the Trekverse we’ve largely played in for the past 4 decades will be gone. Now I realize that even the new ScreenRant rumors don’t say that, but look at the reactions on here. I think it’d set a lot of folks at ease if you could just reassure us about the state of the Trek world as of the words “The End” on the last page of your script. No need to explain the path of how we get there. Just that Yes or No answer will do just fine. :)
Just MHO, of course, but there it is.
#160 – These are just rumors about the plot.
#154 – Sorry to burst your bubble, but its alternate timeline not universe.
I think this idea is brilliant. This can give the audience an explanation for why some aspects of original series history are changed, some the same. I’d love to see two versions of the classic Enterprise, the original and a combination of original and a very close new design.
This really can be a great movie depending upon the execution of the ideas presented, so I’ll wait to see more detail before I make up my mind one way or another.
The only thing I’d like to see is the exclusion of references to all the other series. I’m not so into the other ones especially Enterprise. I’ve never accepted the overall premise of that show: “Well you see the original series Enterprise wasn’t really the first ship to go into space and have fantastic adventures. Years before there was another Enterprise and it’s crew and Captain saved the earth and paved the way for the Federation. What? No it was never mentioned in any of the other series before because, it was, uh, well, the newer series never referenced it because, well, uh, uh, uh. Oh, never mind!”
127-
My thoughts exactly when I read that – it’s “Last of the Vulcans”! Now, when Spock goes time traveling, is it going to be in a police box? Accompanied by a shopgirl from London? ;-)
Hey how about this plot? The Romulans try to save Kirk on Veridian in order to somehow change history (for their own nefarious purpose, yet to be explained) and Spock must go back in time to make sure his friend dies.
I so much fear, that Spock will die. He’s old and everybody dies someday. But I so much fear this.
I really don’t know if I can survive the death of this man a second time. Please don’t.
Let him live … somewhere, someplace … don’t let him die again.
#165 – Semantic hairsplitting. ;) In any real sense, the difference between “alternate timeline” and “alternate universe” is nil. What both are describing are different space-time continua, with some differences in events or situations. And with an infinity of possible differences, some of the variations from continuum to continuum could be quite small, while others very large.
e.g., the continuum to which Spock returns at the end of “Yesteryear” is essentially indistinguishable from the one he left when he first went to Orion’s past, except that his pet had died when he was a child. Minor difference. In “Mirror, Mirror”, the differences are much greater (and determining where and when the divergence point is has been the stuff of fannish speculation for many years). And so on. Both can be correctly described as both alternate timelines and alternate universes.
Here’s a new plot idea the Romulans go back in time and kill Kirk before he goes aboard the Enterprise-B. That way he won’t die on Veridian. We can have old Kirk in the movie and he won’t die a meaningless death. Just re-do his death! It’s as simple as that!
#166 – “I’m not so into the other ones especially Enterprise. I’ve never accepted the overall premise of that show: “Well you see the original series Enterprise wasn’t really the first ship to go into space and have fantastic adventures. Years before there was another Enterprise and it’s crew and Captain saved the earth and paved the way for the Federation….’ ”
Oh, that never bothered me (and ENT is, admittedly, my third favorite Trek). Except for the ship in question being named Enterprise (whch also never bothered me that much, ’cause if one considers how many ships have had that name in reality, the idea that we’d go for a couple of hundred years and not have it used is kinda farfetched… ;) ), I took it as a given that there must have been ships out there having adventures and doing stuff that would eventually found the Federation. Such entities don’t just magically materialize, and the stories of how it would come together make great series fodder. My only real complaint was that they didn’t get serious about it ’til Season 4. At least Manny Coto “got it”, and set out to do something with the premise, instead of ignoring it the way B & B ended up largely doing.
So, Spock is to be the only surviving Vulcan in the current timeline?
Hmmmm…….remember The Last Mohican?
THE LAST VULCAN…………….nah, doesn’t sound right! :)
While part of me wants to kidnap Vic from Screenrant and extort the ‘big spoiler’ from him, the more logical part of me is thankful that he is withholding this kind of information. It’s kind of like watching a Criss Angel illusion…I’m curious as hell as to how he does it but knowing would take the fun out of it. Thanks for your restraint Vic, it’s going to be a looooong wait until December…..
Anyone thinking about what mechanism Spock uses for time travel? It seems like he will be moving all over the place with pinpoint accuracy. Also, it sounds like he has a method of locating disturbances caused by the bad guys and a way to avoid being personally affected by the timeline changes. Tough stuff….
-Guardian of Forever (confirmed not in the movie in an older post, but does exactly what the movie needs)
-slingshot maneuver (needs a ship and would get tedious if used repeatedly)
-Q (kind of a cop-out)
-Weird Romulan technology (gets his hands on the Bana-mobile)
-something else?
Ack, you folks getting worked up over these incomplete details and rumors are no better than 7th grade school girls and their gossip. How can you possibly formulate an opinion on the story of this movie when all you have are snippets? Shall we recall the story of the blind men and the elephant?
139: You have got to be drunk on Tranya.
I’m quite sober, but must confess your zinger was very original : )
145 – “TOS explored time travel 5 times…4 episodes out of 79 dealt with time travel. ONE movie out of 6, dealit [sic] with time travel…So all this belly aching about ‘I’m so sick of time travel’ just doesn’t hold any water. You may just have a dislike for the concept in general, but you can’t hate it because it’s been done to death.”
So following your line of argument, if they wanted to do a film where a super-machine comes back looking for its creator, that would be ok because it’s only been done twice, once in an ep and once in a movie? That’s an absurd argument. Further, it’s a cheat to just ignore the fact that other ST series and films have used the time travel plot device, and used it often. The simple fact is that it has been overused in SF in general and ST in particular. That doesn’t mean STXI can’t or won’t be a good story, but so far it doesn’t sound terribly original, and that is why some of us are reacting with skepticism. A film a la “Superman Returns” might make for good comfort food, but the satisfaction is short-lived.
First, I would like to say “thank you,” to Vic, Anthony and anyone else who might have some super-duper major spoilers, but opted to keep them under wraps. I don’t mind a few tid-bits, but I am hoping to be really surprised when I go see the film (l learned my lesson after reading the novelization to TWOK before I saw the film…).
Second, I don’t see any way in the galaxy how Star Trek can continue to survive if it doesn’t take chances and grow. From everything I read and hear from the new Trek Team, it sounds like they know Trek well enough to construct a story that fits into the “playground” Gene Roddenberry created, while also shaking up that playground enough to break down some of the “mental barriers” we have about what Trek should be.
What must happen in this film, IMO, is that we’ve got to care about the characters, period. Yes, we all love Kirk, Spock, McCoy, etc., but I think that is mostly “in general,” and somewhat abstract. We need to care about the characters in THIS story. So, all the time-travels, alternate universes, and homages to Star Trek ultimately mean nothing if we don’t care about the characters. I’m certainly not presuming to tell the Trek Team how to write movies, but its all the “fan-boy demands” that drive me nuts… as if the only way the new film will be succesful is if the crew still wears the original series outfits, or the lettering on the Enterprise must be exactly the same as the original. This sort of “keep Star Trek in the box” kind of thinking is what would kill it permanently.
Please, please just promise me they won’t DWELL on TNG in those scenes – I understand need for the time period given Nimoy’s appearance — but we all remember how they absolutely ruined the last episode of Enterprise by bringing those tired TNG characters out of retirement instead of focusing on bringing the then-current series to a dignified conclusion with a primary focus on the Enterprise characters themselves!!!!!! If I see Riker onscreen again, I think I’ll walk out of the theater screaming@!
re: 103. Jeffrey S. Nelson – February 3, 2008
“Stanky… remember over a year ago when I called you “Spanky” by mistake?”
Yes….good times…………
This may turn out to be the best Trek movie ever made FOR US FANS! But I highly doubt this multiple universe plot with all this time travelling and stuff is of any attraction to the general audience. If the execution is well done it may do twice as good as Nemesis but it’ll be far away from those 200 million bugs domestically that would justify such an incredible budget…
I just don’t get it. If these rumors are true…how could Orci, Abrams and Co. think of it as a movie for the general movie goers? A film for girlfriends, wives and hip hop generation youngsters?
C’mon…We’re talking about time travel, alternate timelines, Kobayashi Maru, mind melds, Picard, a Romulan called NERO, an alternate warship Enterprise, a battle with the Klingons etc…How could someone who doesn’t know about the old timeline even notice the difference? How could someone, who has never heared about Kobayashi Maru or Picard get his kicks of of something like that? It’s just way too fanboyish to attract more than 10 mio. latent Trekkies…
Don’t get me wrong! I’m so excited about this movie but that’s because I’m the archetype of an overgrown fanboy who loved every second of New Voyages so far! This will be our movie. It’s gonna rock! But it won’t revitalize the franchise. It can’t attract a new generation of viewers…And that’s a pity…
I hear if Frakes gains six more pounds they’re going to cast him in the lead of Free Willie:The Return! :)
#136, Steve Adams, No I don’t remember Downey studios at all. We were at a church or school for a few days – in Orange I think. Then at an airport, Burbank? The one thing I do remember well is craft services was awful on that show! It’s all about the food.
Maybe the Xindi are causing trouble again with the timeline and Spock has to go back and fix it.I dont care as long as it is done right.No matter what they do, someone will have a problem with it. I dont give alot of credibility to all of the rumors, I just want to see Star Trek brought back to the big screen in all of its glory and I think it is good hands. Transformers was a kiddie cartoon with a thin (or zero) plot and it was turned into a decent movie. I think Orci and the boys are on the right track with this one. As long as we dont see another of Data’s brothers.
#182 Smike van Dyke “latent Trekkies”
Latent??
Why, I…..I resent….that remark! Latent? My gawd!! What are you trying to imply? I like Merchant+Ivory films! I’ve never had a Trek experience in my life! Not that there’s anything wrong with that! :)
Alt timelines? Yeah.. ok, but… BEEN DONE. There is so much that could be done with the Pike-era, WHY overcomplicate things??
Time travel? Kiss of death. Romulans? Uh, Nemesis anyone?
In addition, the further away they stay from the tepid, tiresome, wimpy, B&B-saturated TNG universe, the better.
This is all going to be a hard sell. It will be interesting to see how it all plays out, and it’s good to know they’re really not throwing TOS out the window.
It better be well written if they’re stuffing the plot.
And I’m sick to death of you people automatically bashing anyone who even comes CLOSE to referring to themself as any kind of “purist.”
What’s your problem, you IDIC worshipping, rabid proponents of “open mindedness?”
More than a little hypocritical, isn’t it??
Time travel, time paradoxes… GREAT SCOTT! The surprise guest star is Darth Vader, from the planet Vulcan!
Seriously. This time travel business is going to melt my brain! :-D
#179 – “Second, I don’t see any way in the galaxy how Star Trek can continue to survive if it doesn’t take chances and grow. From everything I read and hear from the new Trek Team, it sounds like they know Trek well enough to construct a story that fits into the “playground” Gene Roddenberry created, while also shaking up that playground enough to break down some of the “mental barriers” we have about what Trek should be. What must happen in this film, IMO, is that we’ve got to care about the characters, period.”
Yup, agreed with this. I also think that the playground we have is plenty big enough to do just that, without having to round up the characters and drag them over to another playground across town.
So now we have Starfleet Academy, Kobayashi Maru, time travel, alternative timelines, the construction of the Enterprise, 3 ages of Kirk, 2 ages of Spock, Captain Pike, Klingons and Romulans. All that in two hours???
Will the kitchen sink be in it? : )
Harry, No joke. Frakes has a bad case of mid-life spread. He’d have to give Shat’s girdle maker a call stat! Y’know it’s weird that only a few of us seem to support the idea of time travel as a plot device. As posted above, it’s been a successful tool in the past. It’s the only way to bring Spock back. It’s NOT hard for people to follow. Remember a little crowd pleaser called “Back to the Future” anyone? I think the mechanism used to travel through time is important though. No slingshots, no wormholes, they need to come up with something new.
elmachocombo, you bet! I love time travel stories IF they’re done well. As an example….remember years ago a little film called Time After Time by Nicolas Meyer? It had an airtight storyline BECAUSE it conformed to all the established rules of time travel. Loved it! Let’s hope they get Trek XI half as right!
#190 – ‘Will the kitchen sink be in it? : ) ‘
Yep – it’ll be in the galley. Rumor mill has it they’ll slingshot both the sink and Chef forward in time from the NX-01, and Frakes (and his belly) gets a cameo. ;-)
Say what you will about Frakes and his gut, but how many of us have done a love scene with Marina Sirtas?
As much as I hate the idea of time travel in Star Trek again, I wouldn’t mind so much if they really are drawing some inspiration from “Yesterday’s Enterprise.” I’m openly a non-fan of TNG, but YE was the finest hour of Trek since “City on the Edge of Forever,” if not better. Like so many, I think YE would’ve made an amazing first TNG feature film.
I still think we’ll be surprised by whatever time-travel trick Abrams and crew are using. We might be disappointed or underwhelmed, but I think we’ll probably find that they gave it a fair shot. Somehow I have the feeling we’ll be leaving the theaters next Christmas saying, “Those clever bastards!! Where’s the next film?!?!”
(Or we’ll yell, “Kill the bastards!” but we always do that.)
#194 – OK, so he’s Ron ‘Hedgehog’ Frakes. ;-)
Maybe it(Trek 2008) will follow ‘A Christmas Carol’ type track and Spock will be an Ebenezer Scrooge type stubbornly locked into logic (once again),and be compelled somehow to go back and fix the timelines.by some outside force.
The film IS being released around Christmas.That would make it both seasonal and give it the possibility of being a traditional holiday movie that’s shown every year at Christmas.You know,like ‘A Christmas Story’ or ‘It’s a Wonderful Life’.
Oy. All this angst over the supposed plot details of a fim that hasn’t completed principal photography yet, and which won’t be released for another eleven months. Are Trek fans in 2008 even capable, I wonder, of getting this worked-up over something that really matters?
#193 Viking “Frakes (and his belly) gets a cameo”
Yikes, they better use a wide-angle lens! Thar she blows!! :)
#198 Oy. All this angst over the supposed plot details of a fim that hasn’t completed principal photography yet, and which won’t be released for another eleven months. Are Trek fans in 2008 even capable, I wonder, of getting this worked-up over something that really matters?
Right on! I say see the movie then complain the lettering on ship not being right or whatever.
194
I have. With one hand holding up her picture.
#197 – A ‘Peanuts’ Christmas Special’ in space? I think Star Wars tried to go that route about 30 years ago, and in the words of Jason Alexander at The Shat Roast, “Shitzum stinkum biggum” ;-)
#201 I have. With one hand holding up her picture.
Should that count though? Frakes was actually there with her, gut and all.
Love how the plot goes from the very beginning of the film takes place in the POST TNG era to many thinking this will have Picard and elements of a blown out TNG film. Will you all please stay away from the crack pipe, it can only end badly.
1. The very beginning of the film takes place in the POST TNG era. I imagine there will be a couple of nice (and brief) TNG references for you diehards. Maybe Spock steals A TNG era ship to go back in time. (If it’s not the Guardian of Forever as I’ll wager it turns out to be afterall)
2. There are to be multiple timejumps throughout the film. IN THE TOS ERA. Kirk’s youth- Academy- Pike with Spock – Kirk as Captain. Much like an episode of Lost where the story goes back and forth over the course of a few years. We also already know this.
3. If it is the Vulcan gets blown up by a superweapon as huge rumor, we already heard it here over a year ago and Spock (and old Spock) are the last of their kind. OLD NEWS
4. If Spock sets the timeline right (or as right as he can with all the damage) there are going to be subtle changes which keeps cannon but allows for a bit of flexibilty. (New look to E, cooler technology that Spock leaves behind in case Romulans come back, whatever)
5. Yes there is still a possibilty that Shat is in this. If the timeline gets changed his cameo could be Spock returning to his timeline to find him alive. This could also be the huge rumor. Could be anything. Spock could stop off in 1980 and buy up all the Microsoft stock. Or swing by Carmen Electra’s pad in 1998. It’s timetravel, the big plot eraser/ bottle of whiteout.
6. Don’t smoke crack !!!
“#163 – Perfect sample for this is writing Nimoy into this film and TNG timeline.”
No more fan boyish than when they wrote him for “Reunification.” Also was it fanboyish when they brought DeForest Kelly in for a TNG episode? James Doohan? William Shatner or Walter Koeneg?
Even if it is, so what? You are there to watch the movie, not the intentions of the writers putting a character in. You’re over thinking things.
#190 – Try *3* ages of Spock!
Kirk may be dead in our timeline or universe, why not Kirk alive, as the evil Kirk, in another timeline? In the realm of Science Fiction and Star Trek, that is most defiantly conceivable. In Yesturday’s Enterprise, correct me if I’m wrong, was Yar not with the living. It’s been a while since I’ve seen that one, I know she comes back and has the Romulin Child. Kirk would be an unstoppable Villan in an evil alternate universe.
Maybe Spock is just teaching a bunch of Romulan kids what really happened during diferrent time periods instead of the Romulan version of history and its a memory trip. Who knows? We will at Christmas. Most of the rumors seem to coincide with events that take place in Of Gods and Men.I think STXI and OGAM are being confused.
#178–
Sorry, but your analogy is too clever by half. An intelligent machine returning to Earth looking for its creator is a plot, and you better believe that lots of folks back in 1979 noted that it had already been done. Time travel, OTOH, is a plot device, and can result in stories as divergent in intent and quality as “City on the Edge of Forever” and “Carpenter Street,” depending on the talents and inclinations of the people involved.
For me, what Abrams’ film has going for it at this point is Nimoy’s endorsement and participation, along with the proven abilities of its director and producers. What it has going against it at the moment is mostly the AICN rumor mill and a lot of wankish fanboy speculation. That said, I have no idea whether it will end up being the best thing that’s happened to Trek in the last thirty years, or the final nail in the coffin (or, perhaps more likely, somewhere in between). For those who are absolutely convinced they know what the future holds, my sincere advice would be to get off these boards, and into stocks.
Mr Ballz, they do shoot in Panavison widesreen.
^
But this would not work on the full-screen dvds. You wouldn’t be able to see past Frakes.
^
Ah come on guys let’s not bash Frakes.
^
And too that poster that never saw Mirror Mirror, dude go get the dvd! What a classic trek.
^
Also did anyone notice the Nod to the Twilight Zone in “City on the Edge of Forever”?
#178–
Sorry, but your analogy is too clever by half. An intelligent machine returning to Earth looking for its creator is a plot, and you better believe that lots of folks back in 1979 noted that it had already been done.
V Ger or Nomad ….the same. It worked then though. I do think they drew it out a bit much. How long did it take for them to actually board the ship in TMP? I know they flew around it quite a bit.At times I thought I was watching the Slow Motion Picture. But it was good.
Alright, alright, all this speculation is just getting………….speculative. ;-) Let’s take a real flyer here: if Spock is jumping back and forth between points in time and quantum states (as we’re all ASS-U-MEing), then, in his regret for not accompanying Kirk to the launch of the Enterprise B (thereby insuring that he DID die alone), makes a pit stop on Veridian III on the way to/from the 24th century, and pings Soran in the noggin with a rock or something just as he’s about to fire at the bridge. As Spock emerges back in ‘his’ present via the (insert the sci-fi mechanism of your choice here), Kirk is standing there, asking, ‘Did it work?”, to which Spock replies, “If you and I are here together, it did.” Simple, plausible way of writing in The Shat, if you’re going to be pinballing all over space, time, and (*THERMAL UNDERHOSEN ACTIVATED*) canon.
What the hell. Might as well contribute to the other 1300 potential storylines buzzing around here like flies. ;-)
The phrase “all-out warship” concerns me.
#210 – Also did anyone notice the Nod to the Twilight Zone in “City on the Edge of Forever”?
More of a nod to The Andy Griffith Show. Kirk was trying to finesse a little trim right in front of Floyd’s Barber Shop. LOL :-)
Alternate time lines would make it very easy to bring Shatner back as Kirk.
The writers would not have to waste time bringing Kirk back to life (or out of the nexus) if an alternate time line exists.
ps: It looks like there may have been a breakthrough in the writers strike this weekend.
Why do so many people here think that the audience is just plain dumb?
I hear so many people mention things like.. the average person won’t understand a time travel story. Or alternate time frames will alienate people. Or, Shatner would be nothing but a distraction to the audience.
Come on people, give the audience a little credit. I don’t think the average person will stay away for the reasons stated above (and about a million others people are whining about) This film will sink or swim on it’s own merits. Besides haven’t some of the most popular films and episodes dealt with alternate time frames, time travel and characters (Spock, Tasha Yar) that were thought to be dead?
Would the people who are complaining about the perceived complexity of the plot prefer the writers just dumb it down?
ps:
Patriots 70
NYG 3
GO PATRIOTS!!!!!!
19-0
So its a sequel (post Nemesis)..a prequel (young Kirk Spock, Kobiashi Maru, NCC 1701 being built etc) and maybe a reboot as well (alternate timeline)
But really its first and foremost a sequel (star trek XI) as i assume it starts off with the TNG or post TNG era…whether it ends in that era is another matter
#142
“We’ve been there so many times….when will Star Trek being about exploration of ideas, worlds and spirituality again? I hope the rumors are false and that we get to see something fresh.”
Exactly 145 people want the latest Trek to be about ideas, worlds, and spirituality”.
The other 99.99998 percentile want an escape, an enjoyable story, and reasonable acting.
Please.
Gene is dead. Gene used Trek to get laid. He was a hack and a horndog, who was wise enough on occasion to let the talented people like Coon and Justman do the heavy lifting.
All this alternate timeline talk, and they couldn’t come up with a way to bring in Shatner? Flimsy excuses. Which is what I said back in August, that the “he’s already dead” was a lame excuse and a cop-out. Of course, I could be wrong, but will have to wait for the final product to make a determination. But as of right now, I am still perturbed at the Shatner snub.
Spork, I agree with you about what the viewing public wants, although greatly disagree on the importance of Roddenberry. He was more than capable and willing to run the show, but NBC wouldn’t let him do anything, and he got tired of fighting with them. Producing a risky TV show must be mind numbing. I followed the scifi show Sliders, and the original producer, Tracy Torme, was constantly fighting with FOX, and eventually just quit when his contract ran out.
#218 – “Exactly 145 people want the latest Trek to be about ‘ideas, worlds, and spirituality’.
The other 99.99998 percentile want an escape, an enjoyable story, and reasonable acting.”
I think the vast majority would like both. Tall order, maybe, but so what? No reason not to aim high.
‘Gene used Trek to get laid.’
And who among us hasn’t partaken of THAT fringe benefit of gainful employment? ;-)
Rumor rumor rumor…
[*snore..]
…just give me the facts! …[spoilers are okay by me!]
…and re: 7. ScreenRant.com
“Oh, and just so you guys know… I withheld a REALLY big spoiler (that I’m sure Anthony knows about as well) because I have no intention of ruining this movie for anyone.”
Please Vic, that was a rude and immature thing to post. I was expecting you to follow with a “nanna nanna nann-nah!”
If you ain’t gonna say, then keep a lid on it!
As it is, you sound like a cruel jester who can not be taken at their word. After reading that, I know I would never trust you with a secret.
You would make the world’s worst spy!
Anthony [if he knows what it is you are talking about] has kept it and all top secret info to himself.
If I was involved in the production of this film [or this website] and I saw your post, I would make sure you were kept as far out of the loop as possible!
So please, If in the future you know something that you can’t divulge, then JUST KEEP QUIET!
I have been reading all these little rumors and tidbits and I have formulated a theory as to what the movie is about. In TNG, there was a faction of Romulans that wanted peace and Spock was last seen working towards that goal. So in the new movie, Spock was successful and there is a renegade group of Romulans who don’t want peace. They go back in time to kill Spock when he is still at the acadamy to prevent the unification and that creates the alternate timeline and sets up the storyline. That is why Leonard is in the movie and not Shatner and that would fit nicely with the tie in to TNG.
It’s good they have Nimoy; someome has to fix these plot threads. He will be the only familiar face, and the only reference point for most moviegoers. The new TOS crew is an “alternate universe” too. I wish they had just given us a new mission during year four of the five– slighlly upgraded.
#220: Yeah.
For my part, all I want from any Trek film is (A) a sincere take on the Trek vibe & ethos and (B) a movie that isn’t disposable fluff.
I have no worries about (A) at all; the folks involved have entirely allayed any concerns I might have had about that (I’m no purist and don’t care about Trek canon unless I’m being paid to, and I’m not, at the moment). I still have lingering concerns about (B), but I remain hopeful.
218. Spork
Without Gene, there would have been no Star Trek at all. Nothing for Coon and Justman (whom he hired to labor on). Coon’s role has been exaggerated by Shatner and others because they didn’t like Gene. Gene was the BOSS and didn’t coddle their big egos.
That “hack” created, visualized (and fought for) virtually everything that we know and love about the Trek universe. Spork, may I ask what YOU have contributed to the world?
209: You’re splitting hairs. Placing the timeline in jeopardy is an overworked concept. A difference that makes no difference is no difference.
This is ridculous. First, every detail has to be right to keep canon and the characters have to be perfect and you can throw the general audience out the window. Then, you don’t think the film is going to appeal to the general audience because it’s too complicated. Come on people, make up your minds!
re: 221.
I’ve used Trek to not get laid. Let’s just say that we all know it’s a deal breaker sometimes. Maybe if there was an internet when I was a teenager, it would have been different. And you fellas here know EXACTLY what I am talking about. :)
re: 228.
Thanks for being a voice of reason. Let’s put this sucker to bed. The filmmakers have to walk a fine line between the loyal trekkies/trekkors, and establishing new fans/bringing in casual fans. That is their mandate, and I bet the studio suits agree. Now, discuss…
#226: “Without Gene, there would have been no Star Trek at all.”
Roddenberry created Star Trek in concept only, The Cage went no where. The Shat made it immortal.
All things Trek begin & end with James T. Kirk and the fans should accept nothing less than this film being a springboard for a new series of movies with ‘the true’ Kirk & Spock. JJ knows The Shat means assured box office but perfers to castrate canon by keeping him off the casting call.
I think it’s important not to alienate the TNG/DS9/VOY fan base that never watched TOS especially internationally, I’m from the UK and TOS seems to be concidered camp and corny here. The TOSR shows aren’t even shown here someone on the official movie forum said :
“I am from germany and TOS was treated like a children´s program.
The first “serious” ST Series was TNG (and I still kinda think like that.)”
I see alot of people talking about “City on the Edge of Forever” I gotta say I never seen it.
Okay, two things:
1: Maybe those who doubted time travel in the plot will stop doing so.
2: With alternate timelines there is NO REASON why Shatner can’t be in this. NO REASON.
230.
Who hired The Shat?
As for the new movie, Shatner is just too old and out of shape. That’s the bottom line.
Stop with the Shatner-bating!
Spock wakes up in bed next to his wife, Susanne Pleshette, and realizes that everything after “Turnabout Intruder” was a dream.
#225 – I freely admit, I’m a huge continuity guy. I think part of that is because I left behind the notion that Trek was just about a set (or several sets) of characters, once the number of main characters passed about 30 or so, and certainly now that the number of distinct Trek series has reached a dozen. For a long time, my love of Trek has been as much about its fictional world as about anything else, and I’m very protective of that.
I’m not so extreme as to get bent out of shape if they change a console or the markings on the ship (e.g., I thought it was amusing that they used the FJ microgramma style in the trailer, not upsetting), but I would be very upset if they did something extreme like destroy a whole planet which we know to be alive and well on into latter-era Trek. I think denying the need for some adjustments in production design is just being short-sighted, but the overall Trekverse, in the broad sense (an important phrase, mind you), holds together just fine and does not need to be changed, nor should it be.
I wonder if the apparent fact that they don’t feel they can bring Mr. Shatner into the movie bespeaks a commitment to preserving at least the general outlines of the Trekverse, since as so many folks have noted, if they’re not so committed, it’d be almost insanely easy to have brought him in.
234.
If you’re referring to me, I am NOT “Shatner-bating”. I grew up with the original series and loved it. Shatner, Nimoy and Co. made it a true classic. I am a Shatner fan – love him in Boston Legal!
But, I stand by what I wrote in 233. He is too old for the role. Just like Harrison Ford is too old to play Indiana Jones. Yes, we love them and their characters. But it’s time to recognize reality and move on.
#235 – and realizes that Kirk, McCoy, and Scotty were Larry, Daryl, and his other brother Daryl? :-)
“Gene used Trek to get laid. He was a hack and a horndog, who was wise enough on occasion to let the talented people like Coon and Justman do the heavy lifting. “
As another poster has already pointed out, that “hack,” pustulent twerp, conceived and fought for everything about this franchise that millions have found entertaining and, at times, inspiring, for the last forty years.
Since you’re apparently unaware of the definitions of the words you like to toss around to disparage the accomplishments of other people, a “hack”–e.g. an Irwin Allen or Glen Larson–is someone who, given the opportunity, will always take the money and run. And anyone who knows anything at all about the history of Trek will tell you that if that description had fit Gene Roddenberry, the lives of NBC executives, Harve Bennett, Nicholas Meyer, and even a certain Leonard Nimoy, would have been a lot less complicated. Literally–right up till the time of Roddenberry’s death.
Sheesh. In this day and age of soundbites that substitute for nuanced historical truth I know it’s impossible for some to get their little minds around the notion that Gene Roddenberry was not only responsible for the creation of the Star Trek format, but was also insistent from the beginning that it represent TV’s first serious attempt at adult-level space opera–and, at the same time, that people like Gene Coon and Bob Justman were instrumental in making that vision a reality. Nevertheless, those are the facts.
We don’t know what sort of mechanism all this time traveling will involve, but I had a thought that perhaps it only allows time jumps in ten year intervals. That is to say you may travel to points in time so long as they are ten years apart of in multiples of ten. This might explain the age of the various Kirks/Spocks. also, this would explain why Spock could not travel to a spicific pinpoint in time to say, bean Sorin in the head with a rock. Just a thought.
#192 Harry, I will Netflix that right away. Never even heard of it. I always did have a soft spot for that corny Chris Reeves film called Somewhere in Time although they never really explained HOW he managed to do it. Close your eyes and tap your heals or some such baloney.
Love the idea of the film having a TNG connection.
TNG IMO was the last great Star Trek show.
As far as the alternate timeline things go,
it sounds good to me.
God knows Star Trek is full of time travel
& Alternate Universe Weirdness!
It can be confusing at times,
but thats what we all like about!
Back in 1996 when First Contact was released,
I remember thinking that a lot of Star Trek
stories use time travel as a device.
Time Trek is back, Dude!!
Nrghh! Out of the loop again.
Why.. oh.. why can’t I just hybernate until Christmas Day!
#239,
Are you familiar with the lyrics to the Star Trek Theme?
When Alexander Courage wrote the main theme to the show. (Opening Credit music right after “Space, The Final Frontier…”, Gene Rodenberry insisted on writing lyrics to the instrumental so that Alexander Courage would have to share half of the ASCAP royalties for every performance of that music.
I don’t take credit from Gene for creating the show. I give credit where it’s due to Justman and Gene Coon for making it what it ultimately became.
Contrast TMP where Gene had significant creative input, and TWOK where he was almost completely boxed out.
Look at TNG when Gene was involved to what it became once he left.
See my point.
#241
That’s great, elmachocombo…just keep in mind that Time After Time was made in 1979, but a great flick for it’s time! :)
p.s. please let me know what you think!
funny to think gene used trek to get laid while generations of fans have used it to do the opposite.
Gene used Trek to get laid
Hey, but at least he got paid
In sci-fi, Trek is the best of the batch
Altough fans don’t get any ******
Some day our sex drive will fade!
As has probably been commented, an alternate timeline TREK (for this TREK) would make sense, because there’s the avoidance of any problems with canon.
The Enterprise 1701 was a warship from the very beginning anyway, the events of TOS were after a long war with the Klingons AND Romulans. The five year mission is after the war. Spock back in time? Yes. Alternate universe? No. Who says that that isn’t what the Enterprise looks like? We are not dealing with an alternate universe just an alternate looking one. When it’s time to refit the Enterprise, we’ll get a liitle different, but closer to what TNG looked like. I think that JJ and the guys are going to fit the TOS in a lot more closely with TNG, and their doing it with Spock.
“See my point.”
Yes, I see it clearly. And here’s a hint for you–using a duncecap to cover it ain’t helping much.
Naturally I’ve read “Inside Star Trek,” which sits on my bedroom bookshelf as I write and is of course is the source of the incident regarding Courage’s music credit that you speak of. It was reprehensible conduct on Roddenberry’s part, to be sure. Which has nothing to do with your premise that Roddenberry was a hack, and that Coon and Justman were primarily responsible for Trek’s success. (And what–no credit for D.C. Fontana? What’s up with that?) In fact, there’s nothing in the book to support your premise at all besides your willfully mean-spirited misreading of the material. That “hack,” after all, managed to win the Writer’s Guild award by his ownself long befoe his association with Coon or Justman, not to mention winning the Hugo for his script for “The Menagerie.” And if his talents as a writer dwindled in later years as his status as a cult figure grew–well, it wouldn’t be the first time an artist has succumbed to that devil’s bargain or lost his edge, as evidenced by Coon’s own less-than-stellar work in Trek’s third season. (By your logic, the fact that Joseph Heller wrote a lousy sequel to “Catch-22″ must mean that he was a hack all along.)
It’s also instructive to note that few have been more protective of Roddenberry’s memory or legacy than Bob Justman, notwithstanding his flaws. At the very least, Gene Roddenberry had a few interesting things to say as a writer before the well ran dry. Whereas your notion–that a writer who’s less than a saint and who evidently ran out of juice when he was well into his fifties and sixties obviously could never have been any good to begin with–is just stupid from the get-go.
One advantage to a completely alternate timeline:
The characters can die.
I wonder how TNV “Of Gods and Men” got ahold of the script and did their version first…
I still like my idea about the Romulans saving Kirks life on Veridian in order to somehow change history to their benefit and Spock must go back in time to make sure his friend dies. Anyone remember Roddennbery’s early proposal for STTMP where where Kirk & Co. go back to 1963 in order to prevent President Kennedy’s assassination?
#251
“One advantage to a completely alternate timeline:
The characters can die.”
I see that as a bit of a problem – killing off the characters all the time in different times (makes sense, i think) means that death loses it sting. Spock dying the first time was emotional and saddening..,
but spock dying a second, third, forth time in an alternative timeline, with the knowledge that it will all be ok in the real timeline, means that the deaths become just hollow for me.
Regards
Gary,
To be honest, I actually like your idea a lot better than I like Roddenberry’s. :-) Too bad no one thought of it a dozen years ago–unfortunately, it’s a little late now.
Actually according to wikipedia the idea was as follows:
After the release of Star Trek: The Motion Picture, executive producer Gene Roddenberry wrote his own sequel, involving a plot he had touted before in which the crew of the Enterprise travel back through time to assassinate John F. Kennedy and set a corrupted time line right (a storyline which was also used in an episode of Red Dwarf. This sequel was turned down by Paramount executives, who blamed the relative failure of the first movie on the constant rewrites demanded by Roddenberry (he was ultimately removed from the production and reduced to an “Executive Consultant” advisory position).
Way to go, Gene, turn our heroes into wanted presidential assassins.
Sure glad clearer minds prevailed and got Nick Myer, Gene was losing it even then.
Quit pooping on Gene Roddenberry! You jerks! It’s making me mad. We wouldn’t even have Star Trek at all If it were not for him. What are all of you in your twenties?
#250 Michael Hall “Roddenberry was a hack”
Okay, you’ve convinced me with your compelling argument…..
Roddenberry wasn’t a hack……he ended up becoming a has-been!
#204 Lord Garth “swing by Carmen Electra’s pad in 1998″
Lord Garth, I love how you make it clear that it has to be 1998 for Spock to swing by Carmen’s pad for some lovin’………what, current day Carmen not hot enough, eh?
STOP DOGGING GENE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HE INVENTED STAR TREK!!!!!!!!! WHY EVEN GIVE A DARN ABOUT TREK IF YOU HAVE THAT ATTITUDE? WHY ARE YOU EVEN ON THIS WEB SITE? JUST TO POOP ON A DEAD MAN? SHAME ON YOU! MAKING PEOPLE FEEL BAD IS NOT NICE! PLEASE DON’T EVEN!
For those who atre interseted the Red Dwarf story was called Tikka To Ride and the synopsis was as follows:
After Starbug was destroyed, the future crew no longer existed – therefore were unable to go back in time and kill the present crew, hence they survived.
But unfortunately disaster has struck. Starbug is completely devoid of curries. Lister proposes that they go back in time to order a couple of hundred curries from an Indian Restaurant. The rest of the crew will not go back in time because they are afraid of becoming the future selves they saw. However, Lister removes a guilt chip from one of Kryten’s spare heads and swaps them over, telling the new guilt-less Kryten to reassure them it will be OK.
They go back and appear in the Texas School Book Depository in Dallas on November 22nd 1963 just as Lee Harvey Oswald is taking his shot at President Kennedy. They knock him out the window where he dies hitting the ground, preventing Kennedy’s assassination.
To avoid being captured they go ahead a couple of years, however Kennedy’s survival causes an alternate reality where he has been impeached out of office and the new president is controlled by the Mafia, allowing the Soviet Union to build several Nuclear Silos in Cuba. Fearing the Soviets will start a nuclear war, all the major US cities are deserted.
Lister goes to the airport which would have been renamed JFK Airport where Kennedy is being transported to prison. He persuades Kennedy to go back in time with them, and be the gunman on the grassy knoll, and shoot himself for the ultimate conspiracy theory. After restoring Earth’s normal timeline, The gang return to Starbug. Of course they still haven’t got any curries…
Hey,
In the interest of riding high with anticipation, I’m avoiding spoilers and such. What I’m looking forward to is the first bridge crew picture, with everyone around the captain’s chair.
Enjoy the spoilers for me, ok…
Vinceman (Canadian Trek fan)
Vinceman….I like your name!
This looks like a job for…..VINCEMAN!!! :)
Cool!
The true creator of Star Trek is The Shat, without his immortal James T. Kirk, the 2nd pilot never would have been picked up. Roddenberry roughed out a concept that others like Coon & Justman fleshed out.
Far as TNG, David Gerrold was the true creator & Roddenberry pushed him out to keep him from being rightfully credited as such. Gene’s big contribution was putting a shrink on the bridge! Gene also hated the character Worf & would get angry over episodes where Michael Dorn was showcased.
In the 1980’s Twilght Zone Revival series there as yet another Kennedy time travel story called Profile In Silver, The synopsis is as follows:
Dr. Joseph Fitzgerald, is a Harvard University professor of history from the year 2172. He has travelled back in time and assumed the identity of an instructor at Harvard in 1963. When he is visited by a colleague from his own time, we learn that his mission is to observe the assassination of John F. Kennedy, from whom he is (perhaps collaterally) descended.
Fitzgerald is understandably nervous about watching his own ancestor be murdered, especially since he never got to know the man himself. A colleague, also arriving from the future, reassures him that every field historian has moments of doubt such as this, then departs for their home time while saying something that Fitzgerald doesn’t quite catch. He decides to get it over with and journeys to Dealey Plaza in Dallas. However, when he glances up to the Texas School Book Depository and sees Lee Harvey Oswald raise a gun to kill Kennedy, Fitzgerald is unable to stand by and watch the killing, and so he intervenes to save the president’s life: he shouts for the president and his entourage to “Get down! Mr. President, get down! He’s got a gun!” Oswald fires anyway, but misses, and is later arrested by Dallas police.
A grateful President Kennedy invites Fitzgerald to stay at the White House for the night. As Kennedy and his entourage return home, the president is notified that Soviet troops have captured West Berlin. Fitzgerald is astonished, and claims that Khruschev would never do such a thing. Kennedy sadly points out that Khruschev was assassinated earlier that day.
In his room that night, Fitzgerald frantically consults his time travel wrist computer, which informs him that his alteration of history has caused massive rips in the fabric of time. The assassination of Khruschev was not enough to “fix” the damage to the time stream; the computer informs Fitzgerald that all possible outcomes to this timeline will result in total war between the superpowers and mutual annihilation. There is only one way to repair the timeline, the computer intones: “The Kennedy presidency must end, as history originally recorded it.”
Meanwhile, the president and his chief Secret Service bodyguard, Ray, have discovered that Fitzgerald’s video camera is not the standard model it appears to be. Metallurgists can’t open it up or determine what it may be.They summon Fitzgerald, who tells them that the camera is a holographic camera from the future, as he himself is. They are skeptical but are convinced of the truth when the professor demonstrates the camera’s use. President Kennedy asks whether Fitzgerald was sent back in time to observe Kennedy’s reaction to the Berlin crisis, but the professor replies that he didn’t know about that. Kennedy is puzzled at this, until he looks again at Fitzgerald’s half dollar coin – dated 1964, with Kennedy’s face on it – which the Secret Service had recovered after Fitzgerald dropped it on Air Force One, and he quickly deduces the truth: that Fitzgerald came to Dallas to witness an assassination, Kennedy’s own (it is illegal to depict a living person on money).
Kennedy volunteers to do whatever is necessary to repair history. Fitzgerald, overwhelmed by his ancestor’s heroism, removes his time travel ring and places it on Kennedy’s hand, at which point Kennedy vanishes, evidently having returned to Dallas the previous day to be assassinated. But when Dallas and the motorcade are revisited, it is Fitzgerald who appears in the car and is shot and killed.
At Parkland Memorial Hospital in Dallas, the dead body of “President Kennedy” (actually Fitzgerald) is being attended to by a doctor, who is actually Fitzgerald’s colleague from the future. Ray, the Secret Service agent, recognizes her wrist computer because it is identical to Fitzgerald’s. She tells him that she knew what Fitzgerald’s fate would be, saying, “Some of us do our research in the even farther future” and goes on to say, “The last time I saw him I couldn’t tell him what I knew. All I could do was repeat a phrase” – the remark that Fitzgerald didn’t quite catch – “in Chinese that my husband taught me.” Holding Fitzgerald’s hand tenderly, she repeats the phrase in Chinese and then says it in English: “Goodbye, old friend… Goodbye.” Ray asks her if what they have seen will change history, and she replies that it won’t – because it didn’t. “Even the act of traveling in time is part of history,” she says.
At Harvard University in 2172, a man speaks to a classroom full of students, delivering a rousing speech in which he implicitly lauds Fitzgerald’s sacrifice and the sacrifices of other honorable men like him. As the camera turns, we see that the speaker, dressed in clothing appropriate to the period, is John F. Kennedy.
The plot spoilers that they are talking about are not any big deal, it won’t ruin th movie for you. J.J. and the kids are not going to let anything out. They are really weird about this kind of thing, I’ll bet my green blood that Leonard Nimoy doesn’t even know the plot. So have fun and read the “spoilers”.
We don’t care about that old tired J.F.K. story. Get with the future baby!
And #265 That shat doesn’t matter. My mother hated my klingon brother but she was still his mother.
#254
…the “real” timeline?
I don’t question the use of “real” in the sense of “it’s just a movie,” but in the sense that an alternative timeline is as “real” as the one we happen to be familiar with.
The problem with going back to the early days of these characters is that we know they all survived for decades. They don’t know it, but we know that nothing can kill them. Nothing can really threaten Earth, The Federation, or anything else we’re familiar with. All we can do is watch the “process” of our heroes dealing with some challenge while other characters (the Edith Keelers and David Marcuses of the universe) take all the collateral damage. Of course, that’s essentially the restriction of a TV show.
I doubt that anything like this is in the cards, but, if the new movie franchise does take us down an alternate timeline, it would be a gutsy move to kill off one of the ensemble early on, say Sulu or Chekov, to underline the point that this is not the same comfy Star Trek you’ve always known. It would say that these ARE different people and they CAN die.
I realize that watching Spock die again has limited appeal, but ruling out the possibility of death for these characters means forgoing the potential for that kind of emotional impact in the upcoming film(s).
On the other hand, it’s just a rumor.
I can’t believe some guy in the UK hasn’t seen “the city on the edge of forever”.
And some other dude has never seen Mirror Mirror and there posting here?
Wtf bonzo
“Roddenberry wasn’t a hack……he ended up becoming a has-been!”
*Sigh* In the end, we’re all “has beens,” Mr. Ballz.
“Gene also hated the character Worf & would get angry over episodes where Michael Dorn was showcased.”
Oh, bullshit.
Thank You. Michael. Anybody who uses Ballz as a call sign just doesn’t understand.
261.
Thankyou! Little people disparage great men.
265.
You still haven’t answered my question. Who hired “The Shat”?
244.
Again, what have YOU contributed to the world (other than moronic posts)?
Actually, I usually enjoy “Harry’s” postings, including the snark. And I often think his limericks are pretty clever, including the one about Roddenberry, who indeed was no saint, let alone the most talented writer/producer on earth. But he created and fought for a vision that’s been an inspiration to millions, and chose to use his unexpected celebrity to promote notions in the public sphere of kindness and decency and human potential, in a world that too often gives attention and legitimacy to self-promoting con artists and fools. Feet of clay and all, it’s not such a bad legacy, and it saddens me to see it tarnished by creepy little fanboys who have no just cause to feel anything other than gratitude towards the man.
# 252 – Gods and Men was done filming before it was even announced that there would be a new ST movie. Maybe JJ peeked at our script. :-)
I got it. The new movie wouldn’t be set like it is going to be if it weren’t for The New Voyages. Give props.
#274 Michael Hall
Thanks, Michael!
Don’t get me wrong, I appreciate that Roddenberry came up with the basic premise of Star Trek, but for over thirty years I’ve been hearing and reading about his horrible behaviour and numerous shortcomings……..simply put, I never did like the man as a human being. That doesn’t take away from how I’ve enjoyed the evolution of Trek.
There, I’ve said it!
Wow, these rumours sound great!
I’m primarily a TNG fan — but I suspect I’m actually going to like this movie more than any of the TNG movies! :D
Roddenberry no more created Star Trek than Walt Disney created Mickey Mouse.
Trek was the result of a team effort of producers, writers & the actors. Much of Spock’s character & the Vulcans were created by Nimoy & DC Fontana. Doohan decided his accent should be Scottish, McCoy being an ‘old country doctor’ came from De Kelley, Matt Jeffries created the USS Enterprise. Roddenberry was the Excecutive Producer who outlined a concept & only sold the 2nd pilot after the charisma of William Shatner convinced Lucille Ball & NBC to give it a chance.
Yeah! I know Lucille Ball is the real reason we are having this discussion. Quit crapping on poor dead Gene. It’s not needed. Let’s get back to pooping on J.J. What’s wrong with you? Your hurting peoples feelings. I hope it makes you feel good,
#236: I agree with you that there’s no need or call for fiddling with the canon. I was just pointing out that I don’t _personally_ care if they do or not, which is a very different subject altogether :) I care only about the two points I mentioned before: the feel/ethos, and the substantiality.
It is not my intention, wish, or even concern that others love Trek for the same reasons I do, as long as others keep loving Trek :)
100. Jabob Slatter wrote-
They probably have to do a timeline story so they could put Leonard in it and make it an active role. But I hope the next one doesn’t involve time travel.
Pretty please?
I thought the same thing myself, but they also could have gotten Nimoy in the film by using him as a storyteller and doing voice overs; he could have been talking about an early adventure on the Enterprise. Sure, the time travel gimmick gets Nimoy directly into the action of the film, but it also forced the movie makers into doing time travel… an overused sci-fi concept if there ever was one. They obviously thought of this, but in my opinion, chose incorrectly.
#279 Sybok Amok “Roddenberry no more created Star Trek”
Thank you for spelling it out!
Now, take away all the efforts and contributions made by the people you listed and the rest can be attributed to Roddenberry…..and the only trouble with that logic is………the remaining “stuff” he stole from Forbidden Planet! Every last bit of it!
Punchline: Contribution Roddenberry= 0, Everybody Else= EVERYTHING!
I ABSOLUTELY HATE IT WHEN PEOPLE GET CREDIT THEY DON’T DESERVE!
“Don’t get me wrong, I appreciate that Roddenberry came up with the basic premise of Star Trek”
No. What he came up with was “Star Trek.” Period.
“but for over thirty years I’ve been hearing and reading about his horrible behaviour and numerous shortcomings……..”
Please. Shortcomings, sure. But “horrible behavior,” really? Marital infidelity, rewrites that upset people (rightly or wrongly), a little herb smoking, not always giving others their due. . . yes.
Feet of clay, as I said. Get famous and see what people say about you.
“simply put, I never did like the man as a human being.”
Well, that’s too bad. I saw Roddenberry at several college lectures he gave during the ’70s to hundreds of fans and well-wishers, and even though he gave pretty much the same speech at each event I always considered the time to be well-spent. Onstage Roddenberry was warm, urbane, and funny, full of observations about topics as diverse as religion, nationalism, the human condition, and working in Hollywood. He always allowed that Trek was far from a perfect creation, and in no way represented his personal beliefs about what the actual human future might hold in store, excepting his conviction that mankind would ultimately prevail against the forces that sought to tear us apart. He encouraged his audience to share his aspirations for humanity (and judging by the applause the majority of us certainly did), even as we came to understand in later years that he often fell short of those qualities himself. If you didn’t have such an opportunity, or can’t on balance appreciate someone’s positive accomplishments in spite of their personal flaws, that really is your loss.
“That doesn’t take away from how I’ve enjoyed the evolution of Trek.”
Well, that goes without saying, doesn’t it? (And for my part, I think I’ve said enough on this subject.)
Oh, hell, I take it back. “Ballz” and “Sybok Amok”: you two really are asswipes.
There–now I’m finished.
Harry Ballz. Whatever. Why don’t you just go kick a dog. Why do you have to hurt peoples feelings? Does it feel good? Jerk.
Harry Ballz. Just stop writing to us. You suck. Don’t even- and I hope you feel bad like you make other people feel bad. Why? Is what I want to know? Just stop it. You don’t give a shat about Trek. You are the ones that J.J. calls “haters” Jerk!
Let me put it in such a way that even you two can understand…..
When I said, “I’ve enjoyed the evolution of Trek”, it’s just THAT….
Roddenberry “burped out” the germ of an idea, everyone else fleshed it out to what we enjoy today! Of course, over the years, he tried to take ALL the credit!
ALL RODDENBERRY DID WAS GET IN THE WAY OF THE PROCESS!
Do everyone a favor and get over yourselves!
This portion of trekmovie.com brought to you by “Bickering Trekkies.” “Bickering Trekkies”… dateless, pimple-infested and unshowered since 1966.
Your just making yourself look like an Andorian, bad attitude. I’ll meet you half way and say that I wont respond to your hatred any longer. Mr Ballz?
Ding Dong. GO NEW YORK!
286. Red Shirt. Sorry, I wont let them dog Gene.
I never met Mr. Roddenberry (I did get to meet Mrs. Majel, and I adored her and found her to be quite earthy and sincere). I know Gene Roddenberry via his writings and interviews. Do you take people at their word, or do you read into things? I always thought Gene Roddenberry represented my most basic desires to see mankind evolve into something BETTER, as opposed to what we are evolving into at this moment in time. I don’t have a clue what it would take, but I have no doubt about the basic positive gesture Mr. Roddenberry made toward a vision of a better world. I don’t think of him as a saint, but I think of him as a visionary. Personally, I see a significant movement toward the de-evolution of humanity… a far more materialistic, narssisitic kind of human, which stands in direct contrast to the kind of visionary that James Kirk/Mr. Spock/Dr. McCoy represents.
118. Sybok Amok – February 3, 2008
“There is no Star Trek without The Shat, this movie will be no part of canon than New Voyages. Shat is the Letter of Authenticity for anything Trek.”
Only in your opinion
279.
I hate to burst your bubble, but the fact is that Nimoy was far more important to the success of Star Trek than Shatner was, especially in the early days. He got the lion’s share of the fan mail. He also got the lion’s share of media attention. Shatner really wasn’t much of a factor; Jeffrey Hunter probably would have done just as well.
Michael Adams…warning for flaming
You can disagree with a post but then argue the post and do not attack the poster.
comments to http://trekmovie.com/about/feedback
Wow. Just wow.
160. dalek – February 3, 2008
“#107 The Shatner thing is very relevant as the more we hear about this plot the MORE JJ’s excuse of wouldnt fit into the story they are telling becomes more and more ludicrous:
- A time travelling Spock sent to save Kirk
- Alternate Timelines
And a writing team who cant figure out how to write a role for older Kirk that would fit in the plot???”
—-And some over zealous fans that can’t figure out that they DON’T know every thing about the movie, the writers, the director, the story is and just ASSUME.
If there is an alternate timeline, I wonder what caused it?
Well, now that I’ve survived Attack Of The Killer Michaels…..anybody else want a piece of me? :)
Ballz you are on thin trolling ice right now
harry, bud…. you are better than this….
I always thought that “Yesterday’s Enterprise” version of The Big E was the coolest….the “regular” Enterprise always struck me as more of a big Deep Space Marriott, wih Captain Picard as your concierge, and Deanna Troi as your, ahem, entertainment coordinator…
Sorry, Anthony, I’m done and will now behave!
I don’t think JJ’s problem is figuring out how to bring back Kirk. I’m sure he can figure out myriad ways to do just that. I think he just feels it might be too contrived and fanboyish and that bringing Kirk back to life was done just to please the fans. We may not agree with this decision, but we certainly should respect it. And its still not to late for JJ to pull a rabbit out of the his hat.
#251 – That is no advantage. If the timeline is not set right at the end of the story, it is a betrayal.
#269 – “I doubt that anything like this is in the cards, but, if the new movie franchise does take us down an alternate timeline, it would be a gutsy move to kill off one of the ensemble early on, say Sulu or Chekov, to underline the point that this is not the same comfy Star Trek you’ve always known. It would say that these ARE different people and they CAN die.”
If that’s desired, the answer is simple. Don’t do a prequel. Throwing out the previous continuity was, is, and will be a bad idea, but there’s plenty of opportunity to explore the possible risks to these characters in periods we don’t know about yet, e.g., after the “Generations” prologue.
What seems odd in what we’ve been told thus far are the contradictions, which make me think there’s still a great deal to this film that we don’t know. On the one hand, they seem to be going to considerable lengths to structure this film in such a way that it could be a jumping-on point for new folks to enjoy all of Trek, and supposedly remaining faithful to the source material to the point of telling a potentially significant celebrity “draw” that he’s not going to be in the film because his character was killed a few movies back, but when asked to confirm, with a simple, non-plot-revealing “Yes” or “No” answer, whether the film will end up in the same fictional universe in which it starts, TPTB go silent. It’s that silence that really disturbs me.
It’s evolution of the show / movies or whatever. I’m not that happy about a new version “reboot” as we often say, but as I have reflected on the 1979 changes to Trek and the big one in 1986 I can’t say that doing it all new isn’t bad. One thing that I am always unsettled about is of course the tv and movie canon. Also I do want a Trek movie to not deal with time travel. It’s a hard concept to take unless done right, but it’s even harder when they do it a lot. Trek 2, no time travel and no resurrections with things blowing up and killing people besides the bad guys. Gutsy. But with science fiction if you have the right look and feel the story can suddenly creep up on you and take you in all the way. Of course it needs to be well written, but you can ignore bad writing if it looks and feels right from top to end. The teaser certainly established that things will look right for me, but I’m reserving a lot of judgement until a see the 2:30 trailer in a few months.
>>Actually according to wikipedia the idea was as follows:
Please. NEVER quote any Wikipedia as scholarly evidence. I find wikis as entertaining, sometimes accurate, and possibly a step to finding out names to look up elsewhere, but as my college professors said of many students’ papers, they are “awash with murky research and unprovable suppositions”.
#222.
“Please Vic, that was a rude and immature thing to post. I was expecting you to follow with a “nanna nanna nann-nah!”
If you ain’t gonna say, then keep a lid on it!
As it is, you sound like a cruel jester who can not be taken at their word. After reading that, I know I would never trust you with a secret.
You would make the world’s worst spy!”
It’s incredible to me how some (very few) people have misinterpreted my intent with my comment.
The point was NOT to rub anything in anyone’s face – the point was to establish the kind of website that I run… That will not print anything just for the sake of “getting a scoop.” I wanted people to know that even though I had info that would spoil the movie, I am not willing to publish it in order to:
A. Not harm the movie/Paramount.
B. Not detract from your experience of seeing the movie for the first time.
If you think I was being a jerk, fine… so be it. But my regular readers know better.
Best regards,
Vic Holtreman
308. ScreenRant.com
Vic, ignore the few. We do appreciate the info and the care you show in your reporting
Anthony Thompson – February 3, 2008 said–
244.
Again, what have YOU contributed to the world (other than moronic posts)?
Umm, let’s see. On 9/11, the evacuation plans that I had put in place allowed 16,500 people to be safely evacuated from 7 World Trade Center.
Um, I was responsible for putting the recovery plan into place that allowed the bond market to re-open on 9/13.
So, what was your point?
How does that affect the widely held belief that Gene Rodenberry was not the driving force behind the continued evolution of Trek. There’s no doubt he had a strong conceptual hand, but it’s pretty much established that he didn’t do most of the heavy lifting.
So, please stop trolling.
Thanks.
Mr. Spork
*tears* Can’t we all just get along?
You’re a very logical man, Mr. Spork! :)
Ah, now its Bashing Gene Time.
Fascinating..
Up to now we‘ve had bashing the man who made one of the show‘s main characters iconic and instantly recognizable, only momentarily interrupted by bashing the man who wrote the original script for the most important TOS episode, and now trekmovie.com proudly presents:
Bashing the man who CREATED Star Trek.
We should do a special on the next bashing!
Gene really didn’t have much creative control for any of the motion pictures save for the first one.
Sure he created it, but Harve Bennett gave us the Trek we know and love today.
The whole time travel thing is best represented in this GIF animation:
http://forum.blu-ray.com/images/smilies/imported/deadhorse.gif
#314 “Sure he created it, but Harve Bennett gave us the Trek we know and love today.”
Well, the Trek I love the most is TOS and TMP. Gene’s work :-)
#297 and others
The more I think about them, the more I found that there is something wrong about these rumors. Having an alternate timeline plot the writers should be able to totally ignore canon, ignore the death of important characters and rewrite everything. But Orci states that canon will be honored (with some fully understandable creative license about sets and design), dead character will stay dead and Roddenberry philosohpy will be embraced.
Do you understand what I am saying? With an alternate timeline plot, this care about classic Trek will not make sense.
Talk about history repeating itself…
kg
re 308
Sorry about that, Vic. I guess I was a little annoyed by you tabloid tone. However, after looking at your site, I better understand. You deal in the greater HOLLYWOOD style of reality…
Anthony may or may not know the HUGE SPOILER that you write of… but if he can’t tell us, he would not say: “I’ve got a secret!” If one looks over the headlines and posts that Anthony has made on this site, one would see he has always been a straight shooter. He tells it like it is. We ALL know that HE knows stuff WE DON’T KNOW, but he shows his cred by what he says…and not by teasing us. We trust him.
As a former journalist, I know there are things one knows, and things one SAY they know… or don’t know. All this in order to gain the trust of the reader and source.
The late Peter Jennings would never have said:
“…and finally tonight; we know a big story, but we can’t tell you because we do not want to spoil you evening.”
You have a good site, and I welcome you here, but please; If you know something that you don’t want to tell, then simply just don’t tell! Let your good work bring people to your site!
BTW: good scoop last fall about how the new movie:
“none of the film takes place at all at Starfleet Academy.”
http://screenrant.com/archives/unverified-star-trek-plot-poin-1098.html
( I’d look at http://trekmovie.com/2008/01/02/tyler-perry-confirmed-in-trek/ )
:)
314: “Gene really didn’t have much creative control for any of the motion pictures save for the first one. Sure he created it, but Harve Bennett gave us the Trek we know and love today.”
Speak for yourself, pal. The Trek I know and love was ST’s glorious 1966 season. IMO the movies were just a pale imitation of the original, encumbered by actors’ egos and everything that came before. If Abrams seeks to capture the essence of ST, he’ll find it in the first season.
314.
I don’t think many people would agree with you that the Harve Bennet movies were the best of star Trek. Most were awful. ST 2 and 6 were mediocre. Why? The writing was not up to par. The production values were cheap. And Shatner did not take the role seriously as he had during the original series. He played Shatner, not Kirk.
ST2 is regarded by many as the best film. But it’s fatal flaw is that Kirk and Khan never encountered each other except via viewing screen! That, my friend, is poor writing! And Kirk’s son was only invented to bring in a young “hunk”, which he wasn’t anyway! : ) “Space Seed” is SO MUCH BETTER!
Harve Bennet kept the franchise going. But that’s about it.
310.
If that’s true (and I expect that it is), that is truly awesome. No adequate word to describe it, really.
As for defending Gene, i don’t consider that trolling. I will continue (as others have) to defend his great legacy. ST was HIS idea. HE hired Justman, Coon, Shatner and all the others. Nothing they did to “flesh it out” was done without his involvement and approval.
The first season’s success was due to Gene Coon & him alone. Coon was the one calling the shots on the show. The inital ‘Rand era’ episodes were pretty slow & mostly dreary, Coon sparked the life into Trek.
#320: “If Abrams seeks to capture the essence of ST, he’ll find it in the first season”
Roddenberry himself said numberous times the key to TOS’ success was the chemistry of the cast. JJ can use the characters but they will NEVER be the noble crew of the original USS Enterprise. The new film will be a failure without BOTH The Shat & Nimoy reunited and saving the galaxy as we know it one more time!
#319. Commodore Redshirt
All right, we’re cool bro. :-)
Vic
Ahhh…. it be an extended team effort that makes Star Trek what it is… no matter who did what, when, whar, why, or how…
RE: Mr. Gene: Isn’t thar a theme in Star trek, particurlay w/ robots, that the creator must let his creation go on and develop on its own?…
But I never thought of Enterprise as a warship… that seems a bit off the intent…
Fitting, though… for many discussions righty on this site..
“Admiral, thar be wars here.”
Arrrr….
gee, how ’bout those nacelle caps, eh?
>>The inital ‘Rand era’ episodes were pretty slow & mostly dreary, ..
wow. Balance of Terror, The Corbomite Maneuver, The Naked Time, The Enemy Within, & Charlie X are pretty slow and dreary… I want to watch the Star Trek you grew up on, Sybok! I must’ve missed some pretty amazing episodes, like Spock’s Brain, Way to Eden, Turnabout Intruder…
Not to start a flame war, but Gene bashing has no place on this forum. The man is dead, and whether we like it or not, Star Trek hasn’t been in his control since early TNG. Whether or not any subsequent power that be was able to capture his vision of the hopeful, Utopian vision is unfortunately academic at this point. Gene won’t be back to do anything about it. Star Trek is in the hands of a new generation. Let’s hope they can spark the magic that WAS Star Trek of TOS, as they claim to be doing.
And what of Gene *allegedly* using Trek for getting the ladies? I’m proud to say that I’ve done it. Many times. ;-)
God Bless the Great Bird of the Galaxy!
Here is an article where Eric Bana describes his role as a “cameo” in Star Trek.
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,21985,23159453-2862,00.html
327.
You smacked that out of the ballpark! I’ll take those “dreary’ episodes over ANYTHING post-Roddenberry.
324.
Gene R. was in charge of the show until the end of the second season. Gene Coon was a good writer who contributed some excellent episodes. If you’ll read the Whitman book you’ll find that virtually all the creative decisions made during the first two seasons were made by Roddenberry in collaboration with Justman. The many memos reproduced in that book make that very clear.
Hey…wadda about Fred Freiberger, lets not forget him…yay brother! ;)
#38–Only he can tell us. I have to admit that, for the first time, I have heard something which makes me feel uneasy about the film. If timetravelling Spock can “restore” the original timeline, then no matter. But I am not keen on “erasing” the events of TOS from canon. It is completely unnecessary. There is plenty within the 5 year mission left to explore, and too many blanks to fill to justify a “permanent” alternate timeline being necessary to tell a TOS-era Star Trek story. All I can do is hope that it is not “permanent”, as I shall continue to give Mr. Abrams every opprotunity to make this a success.
Still, questions abound…Is this merely a rumor?
Is JJ attempting to make Star Trek “more mainstream”—- by destroying it?
Are we, by the end, expected to reconcile with the notion that TOS-era Star Trek–as we knew it–never happened?
#305 is correct. If the timeline is not restored by the end of the film, it will be difficult not to feel betrayed…
#118–William Shatner’s appearance/non-appearance is ridiculously irrelevant. While I am beginning to share skepticism about this film, having Bill in it would do nothing to comfort me. In fact, it would make it worse, unless he was part of an “alternate timeline” that was eventually put to rest by the end of the story…The original timeline has to prevail in the end!
I’m hoping that the ship we saw in the teaser is the battleship Enterprise, and that the real one will be more faithful to TOS.
But it won’t be.
My my first post in a longtime. my internet access at home is down. While not the biggest fan of TNG, “Yesterday’s Enterprise” was in my opinion one of the best Star Trek episodes very, the dark mood, the federation getting their butts kicked, the tension among the crew was just excellent. Those of you have read my previous postings know me to be an absolute purist!!!! Having said that, especially after seeing Cawley’s interview and reading more about the plot — I’m actually getting more excited and my enthusiam (which at one time was dying) is seriously growing!!!!
327. “wow. Balance of Terror, The Corbomite Maneuver, The Naked Time, The Enemy Within, & Charlie X are pretty slow and dreary”
You omitted: The Man Trap. Mudd’s Women, What Little Girls Are Made Of?, Miri, The Conscience of the King. I’ll watch Spock’s Brain over any of these snoozers.
Gene Coon was the force behind TOS as it’s Producer! Look how fast the later 2nd season episodes declined after he left.
Bob Kane took sole credit for creating Batman, but that’s not true either, a gentleman named Bill Finger was equally involved in it’s creation.
Stating facts isn’t bashing. Roddenberry had the talent for hiring good people to take his concept & flesh it into reality. But, lets give credit where credit is due. The disturbing bashing seems geared towards Shatner by discriminating his age & weight.
Artie Lange took JJ to task during a Howard Stern interview on how the movie is going to show Kirk at different stages in his life but yet there is still NO WAY to show him during a period where he looks like The Shat??? That’s the true debate these forums should be addressing!
Christ I missed a hell of a fight here and Ballzio and Xai smack dab in the middle of it. Why Why Why do I always post so early ??? Why Why Why???? Well for those that missed my early usual brilliance check out #204 were I cut through the crap and attack the meat of the matter and filter the poopy bits.
Lord Garth hath spoken
Lord Garth…….you should have been there….”it was…fun!”
Well, at least that explains the Battlestar Enterprise. Even helps to explain why so much of it is being assembled on the ground (less exposed to enemy attack).
This may be one of those times when the Reset button is a good thing.
Must….. Have… Stewart…. Cameo!
But seriously, I really hope it works and doesn’t become overly Trekki!! Kinda hopin that this would revitalise the series and not scare people off!
No Ballzio don’t fade away you have to see my brand spanking new Enterprise size comparison picture, hand drawn by Lord Garth himself and with various cameos by many of our most beloved posters. It shows the size difference and detail between the new supergigantor E and the movie E which it most resembles. I should have it done tomorrow.
I have a nice id If it works. To bring the Episodes Unification part 1 and 2 from Star Trek The Next Generation in a shorter format as an Bonus Movie. With a name like Star Trek 7.5 Mission Unification On a futures New to bring out boxset.. Just an id in my opinion it shoud be great with Spock on board should be great also as a movie to the fans.
#317–You are assuming the altered timeline will be permanent, which I sincerely hope it is not. If Spock restores the original timeline, then they are not violating canon. Some have suggested that changes in the timeline will be subtle, and resurrecting dead men is hardly subtle. Mr. Orci said that anything which appears to violate canon will have a canon explanation. I assume he may be talking about the set designs, a more advanced looking Enterprise etc., not the history of the 5 year mission. At least that is my hope.
#323–Personally, I hope Abrams’ initial Star Trek project is his sole stab at the whole “saving the galaxy” thing. If he wants to get back to real classic Trek, it will be more about exploring the galaxy—not saving it. Somehow, the films seem to forget all about their mission, and instead become epic “saving the galaxy” adventures, or antagonist-driven storylines like TWOK and the dreaded Trek turd, STV. TMP was really the only film which stayed true to the original Star Trek themes. Ship-to-ship battles involving Starfleet occur in perhaps just over 10% of the 79 TOS episodes, yet somehow 4 of the 6 films seem to, at the very least, find a way to shoehorn one in.
I agree with your opinion for the most part about the collective efforts that built Star Trek as it was.
I just think you put too much in the perceived importance of William Shatner for this franchise’s future.
TOS-STIV=The Shat as Capt./Adm. James T. Kirk (great)
STV-GENERATIONS=Capt. James T. Kirk as The Shat (bad)
The young people I know do not know anything about Star Trek and think Bill is just the guy from Boston Legal and the Priceline commercials. The casual fans I know who lost interest in the Star Trek franchise in the mid-late 80’s, often do not even know the character died. When I explain to them that he died in one of the movies they did not bother to see, they could not care less that Abrams is not writing away his death. All they know is that the film is exploring the roots of the original characters, their early adventures, and that “the guy who helped create Lost” is directing, and that peeks their interest. I think younger “Lost” fans and fans of his Transformers movie/Cloverfield/MI3 will also give it a chance. They are going to buy more tickets to this movie than you or I will.
I was never a “convention” guy, as it was the characters in a fictional story that got me, not who the actors were. As long as the new actors can use their talents to bring those characters back, I think it will be successful.
What does concern me, though, is this potentially permanently altered timeline. They don’t need to do that just to explain away updated looking designs, etc. There are plenty of unfilled gaps in the current timeline in which to set any stories they wish to tell. I hope the film ends with Spock restoring the original timeline.
“You omitted: The Man Trap. Mudd’s Women, What Little Girls Are Made Of?, Miri, The Conscience of the King. I’ll watch Spock’s Brain over any of these snoozers.”
The poster omitted nothing of consequence, since the episodes he cites are obviously proof enough that there was more to first season TOS than the talents–however considerable–of Gene L. Coon. (Coon, who worked with Roddenberry without any apparent rancor as late as 1974, never made such a claim himself; ditto Bob Justman, or anyone else who’s sane.) Since you were responsible for making such an arrogant, declarative statement that Coon was solely responsible for the quality of the episodes that bear his credit, the burden of proof rests solely with you to back it up–and it’s just too bad for your premise that at least three of Trek’s all-time best shows were inconveniently produced in the period before the “real talent” got hired.
According to Memory Alpha, “Miri” was the first show produced under Coon’s tenure; I’ll have to check the credits to verify. “Mudd’s Women,” while not an episode for the ages, is a fun, likeable outing (probably as close to the actual premise of “Wagon Train to the Stars” as TOS ever got), and managed to introduce a character who has since remained a fan favorite. And “The Conscience of the King,” while definitely an off-format episode for Trek, happens to feature one of its most literate scripts (reflecting Roddenberry’s admiration for the works of Shakespeare), not to mention one of the show’s best guest-star performances ever. I’m not the least bit surprised that you’d prefer to spend your time with “Spock’s Brain,” though.
Now, I happen to agree that “Man Trap” and “Little Girls” are pretty dreary shows, but the real irony is that the one absolute “snoozer” of the first season that was an acknowledged failure by all parties concerned turns out to be “The Alternative Factor,” an episode that Gene L. Coon not only produced but actually wrote. I guess that this, along with his mostly dreadful work for the third season, must prove that Coon was never anything other than an untalented hack to start with; and since Coon, like Roddenberry, managed to break the heart of the woman he was married to by cheating on her–and since author Norman Spinrad has grumbled in several interviews about Coon’s treatment of his work–I think we can safely assume by the standards of our fanboy morality cops that Gene Coon was a “horrible” human being to boot.
Oh, well. At least he didn’t “rip-off” FORBIDDEN PLANET, or smoke dope.
#338 – I could be wrong, of course, but I don’t think the trailer was showing us the “warship”.
#340 – My concern, right off, is that the descriptor “supergigantor” already seems pretty far off the mark. Granted, I base this solely on the teaser trailer, but the ship as seen there seems approximately the same size (give or take 10-20 meters or so) as the previous incarnations of the Constitution-class. (Unless, of course, 290-300 meters is something you’d consider “supergigantor”, in which case don’t mind me. ;) .)
GOD DAMNIT NO!!!!!!
Time travel bs is what killed Star Trek in the first place. Why are the new guys using the same story crutch!?!
I still hope for the best with the new movie, but dammit that is disappointing to read that the story is yet again revolving around time travel. Voyager ended that way, Enterprise’s whole thing was about time travel cold war. Enough already!
335.
I am bored to tears with you. You don’t argue facts; you just argue (single-minded) opinions. And you like Gene Coon because “The Shat” liked Gene Coon. That’s not good enough for me.
As for Shatner, you want him to save the universe one last time. You cry “discrimination” if someone questions the logic of that. The fact is, Shatner and Co. were being made fun of for their age when the movies of the 80’s were being made. I felt that was unfair. They were in thir early 50’s then and could legitimately still be considered “up to the task”. Not now.
Wish all you want, but “The Shat” won’t be back.
Um, Walt Disney did create Mickey Mouse. Did it on the train back home from having Oswald taken from him.
#335 — Bob Kane was in fact the sole creator of Batman, the reason I know this was that my father was not only personal friends with him and worked with him on several projects — he was also a “ghost” artist for Bob Kane in the 1960s. I can recall many times as a child when my dad would take me to visit Bob Kane in his NYC apartment.
# 343, You omitted a few Gene Coon penned classics: Errand of Mercy, Space Seed, The Devil in the Dark, A Piece of the Action (co-wrote), Bread & Circuses (co-wrote), A Private Little War (co-wrote) & Metamorphosis.
Coon created the Klingons, Khan, Zefram Cochrane & the Prime Directive! These are facts. Plus, other cast members besides The Shat, plus Harve Bennett have credited Coon as the driving force behind TOS.
#346: “Wish all you want, but “The Shat” won’t be back.”
The cold reception at the box office will echo Shat’s warning about JJ’s bad business decision.
Fight Fight Fight !!!!
This is getting good. Ballzio pass the popcorn, Xai through me a Heiniken.
Oooh….popcorn AND Heiniken?? Count me in!! :)
I just hope that we see either the Enterprise E or the Titan, I’d luv to see the Titan on the big screen
There’s two types of people in this world — Those who get it. Those who don’t. The former know what “it” is and don’t have to ask; the latter don’t even know enough to ask.
Gene bashing. Nice. Nobody said he was Christ. The fact is that Star Trek–any entertainment–works best when visionaries like Gene and storytellers like Bennett work hand-in-hand. That’s how we get a “Wrath of Kahn.” And I can already hear someone saying “But Gene had nothing to do with TWOK.” Which just proves my first point.
It’s starting to sound like an MFA workshop in here. And please God, that’s not something you want to do to Star Trek. Nice posts #197 and #284.
“# 343, You omitted a few Gene Coon penned classics: Errand of Mercy, Space Seed, The Devil in the Dark, A Piece of the Action (co-wrote), Bread & Circuses (co-wrote), A Private Little War (co-wrote) & Metamorphosis. “
Um, no, I “omitted” nothing, since it was never my contention to begin with that Gene L. Coon didn’t make significant, last contributions to TOS. In point of fact, it wouldn’t have been the same show without him. At his best he was a wonderful writer, and the great episodes listed speak for themselves. And though anyone who’d read David Gerrold’s nonfiction Trek books in the ’70s would be well aware of Coon’s invaluable contributions to the show (as well as the wonderful mentoring he gave to writers like Gerrold), Bill Shatner probably wasn’t aware of that fact, and was entirely justified in bringing it up on his own in the interest of giving a long-neglected figure his due. That’s a far cry, though, from insisting that Roddenberry “only” created the basic Trek format, leaving others with more talent to do the “heavy lifting” for him so he could get rich and famous off of their creativity and hard work. That’s sheer revisionist fanboy wankery, and bears no more resemblance to what actually happened than believing that Gene Roddenberry was the sole visionary who was responsible for everything that worked on the show.
If I had to choose between Spock and Picard I’d choose Picard easy.
Personally I’d place Worf,Sisko,Seven,the Doctor and T’Pol (much sexier vulcan IMO) above Spock in who I’d like to see in the movie so I’d certainly hope that they aren’t hoping Spock is gonna carry the whole movie
Spock’s at an age with many a wrinkle
Hell, at this stage, all he does is tinkle
Don’t worry, he’ll carry the movie
In fact, it’ll be downright groovy
If I’m wrong, you can call me Bullwinkle!
‘This is getting good. Ballzio pass the popcorn, Xai through me a Heiniken.’
Make it kettle corn, Bocephus, and I’ll bring the platter of Buffalo wings. Celery and blue cheese dip included. :-)
Viking…..NOW you’ve made me good and hungry!
Man, I’m goin’ out for dinner! Later! :)
“336. Lord Garth, Formerly of Izar – February 4, 2008
Christ I missed a hell of a fight here and Ballzio and Xai smack dab in the middle of it. ”
I was in a fight?… musta been thrown across the bridge and hit my head… Don’t recall..
[Throwing a heine at Lord Garth]
#355: “If I had to choose between Spock and Picard I’d choose Picard easy.”
We had four Picard movies, audiences didn’t bother showing up for the last two. Plus, Stewart has made it clear his TNG days are over for good.
Give audiences The Shat and it will play to packed theaters the way Star Wars did in 1977.
#357:
What, no pizza???
OK, guys, Harry just punked out on us……who wants his hot wings? And I got him a plate with Suicide Sauce on ‘em, too……LOL :-)
#360 – That sounds like a good idea. A large Ledo’s with the kitchen sink, courtesy of Uncle Viking. But you’re still part of the cage match.
NO SOUP FOR YOU! LOL ;-)
Ledos has gotten that well known?
Dennis, I was chowing down on those big square morsels of Valhalla over 20 years ago, when I lived, loved, and worked in D.C. Even back then, you could buy their sauce in quart jars at the counter. Nobody – not Pizza Hut, Domino’s, Papa John’s, Fox’s (which I grew up on), nor anyone else – can reproduce that thin, flaky, pastry-like crust and that sauce. If you even know about the pizza joint I’m referring to, then you know what I’m talking about. I have every outlet within 100 miles of my family home pinpointed, to indulge in when I go home for the holidays. You know the old saying – ‘Sex is like pizza. Even when it’s bad, it’s still good, but when it’s great, it’s memorable’? The opposite applies as well. :-)
If I were a rich man (Yadda-biddy-biddy-biddy-biddy-biddy-biddy-BUM!), I’d OWN a Ledo’s franchise. It’s that good, people.
360. Sybok Amok – February 4, 2008
“Give audiences The Shat and it will play to packed theaters the way Star Wars did in 1977″
He got 6 and a third chances at doing that and never delivered. Add that this screenplay doesn’t include Kirk at this age.
I love Trek, but you can’t make a statement like that and expect it to hold up, Sybok.
#342 “The young people I know do not know anything about Star Trek and think Bill is just the guy from Boston Legal and the Priceline commercials.”
I’ve experienced just the opposite. Thanks to numerous references in the Simpsons, Family Guy and Robot Chicken, my 16 year old nephew and all of his friends all know exactly who William Shatner is and that he played Captain Kirk in Star Trek. Also, according to him, in the commentaries on the DVDs, the creaters speak with great admiration of the Shat and think he is cool. Yes, they parody Shatner, but it’s because they love the guy. The same with Adam West.
Shatner and Captain Kirk aren’t so “lost” on today’s kids as you may think.
“Shatner and Captain Kirk aren’t so “lost” on today’s kids as you may think.”
Glad to hear it, and if it be true, all hail Matt Groenig! :-)
But that doesn’t mean that teens and twentysomethings are eager to line up to see the 2008 edition of Bill Shatner play Captain Kirk one last time.
Xai, chuck me another Heiney. And pass that bowl of kettle corn back this way.
Well, if you’re lookin for bloodsport fella, you won’t get it out of me on this subject. Like Mr. Bailey, I have no strong feelings about Shatner’s participation one way or the other. Ultimately, it’s Abrams’ call.
Now hand me a slice of that great-sounding pizza.
I’m with #369, I want a slice too!
We can all disagree on many issues but nothing brings people together like pizza.
Gene Roddenberry might not have been responsible for making Star Trek great. He might not even have made a very big contribution to the show. But no one can deny that without him there would be no Star Trek. So anyone who loves the show should be very, very thankful for Gene Rodenbery.
Imagine that one insignificant man could have prevented TOS from being cancelled after 3 seasons — wouldn’t you owe that insignificant man your gratitude, even if he didn’t really do much? Gene deserves at least that much gratitude, as there wouldn’t even have been 1 season without him.
Armstrong and Aldrin may have had all the attention of the moon landing, but all those men and women working at NASA were responsible for making history. So even if Gene was more like one of the little guys, he still deserves his place in history.
Bear in mind that what Gene did is not the kind of job where people can easily point out their contributions by watching the show. When you look at a beautiful painting, you might not notice the frame. But without the frame, the painting would not be hung up at all.
Crucially, Gene is the person who took on the role of representing Trek as a central figure: the embodiment of Trek. From the sound of it, he carried out that role well, with charm, charisma and good spirit. So regardless of whether he was the best person to fill that role, or whether he earned it, that is what he did, he did that well, and that is his place in history.
Finally, I’ve read people who worked with Gene say they found him very kind and inspirational, and like a mentor. Surely being such a positive influence to anyone making Trek is a very worthy contribution for anyone to make to Trek? Even if he only inspired a few people?
Remember, without Gene there would be no Trek. So he’s a VIP to me!
368. Viking – February 4, 2008
“Xai, chuck me another Heiney. And pass that bowl of kettle corn back this way.”
[flips a Heiney into the air, Viking goes back, back, back.... and trips over the kettle corn bowl..]
Sorry, bud… it got away from me.
———————————————
I think there’s Zero% chance that the “big spolier” mentioned up top is Shatner. I know that’s not a popular opinion with some, but I just can’t see it happening based on JJ’s comments and the (possible) storyline.
#364: “Dennis, I was chowing down on those big square morsels of Valhalla over 20 years ago, when I lived, loved, and worked in D.C. ”
I live a few miles from the original Ledos in College Park, MD. Best pizza in the world, agreed.
Sumbitch. You see what a little thing like a damn good pizza can do to defuse hostilities? Xai, crack open that keg in the back of my shuttle, and call in another Veggie, Hawaiian, and pepperoni with double cheese! :-) And I want MORE WINGS! :-)
Oh, on a serious note – I am not kidding about the pie. if you live in MD/DC/VA/DE/GA/FL/WV, check it out:
http://ledospizza.com/
(Sorry for the shameless plug, Anthony. I have no link to them, other than being a patron in the way that Trekkers gravitate to this board.)
If you are anywhere else, and have any food industry experience, then for crying out loud, exercise your sense of entrenpeneurship and sink a little gold-pressed Latinum into a franchise. It puts your average McPizza to shame. ;-)
364: Wow, I never thought I’d be discussing the magic that is Ledo Pizza on this or any other site. I’m a long-time DC resident and Ledo’s fan. Square me up with some of that pie, and don’t cut any corners!
Meanwhile, I can’t believe some of the s*** I’ve read on this thread. If Trek’s first season was “dreary,” I’m Emily Dickinson. Star Trek when it was new was sexy, it was dangerous. And it was very well-written. It was what NYPD Blue was back in 1993. If Abrams can recapture any of that magic for a 21st century sensibility, he will have succeeded, IMO.
And I’d be the last person to worship at the Roddenberry altar, but some of the vitriolic, revisionist commentary here about his contributions is really over the top and uncalled for. The poster behind me was right – if it weren’t for Roddenberry (and Anthony, of course – gotta suck up to our host), we wouldn’t be having this conversation.
#372 – Thanks, Tom Brady. I was in my zone and open, Wobble-ball. :-)
#374 – Are you in Adelphi, or (God help you) Langley Park? I did nine years in Silver Spring/Wheaton, and then several years in Arlington and West Falls Church (during my last marriage). Born and raised in Cumberland, MD. Glad to make the acquaintence of someone with a similar Mapquest point of reference.
JB! Greetings, Home Boy! And I don’t trim the crust, BTW. That’s the best part. ;-) What part of the National Capitol Region do you hail from?
Currently in Great Falls, VA. The closest Ledo’s is West Falls Church. Before that I lived in Old Town Alexandria, and Beltsville, MD before that, next to College Park, which I gather is where Dennis is. Good to know there are at least a few of us here. Cumberland is a pretty little town.
“Yesterday’s Enterprise” was excellent trek, but i hope alt t.l. isnt a big part of this new movie
i hope its the trek we all wanted to see, the early days of the 1701 and the adventures of Lt. Spock
Warship.
When I saw some gaming critic call the new Enterprise from that MMO “grown up” because it was a warship, I cringed. The Enterprise has been and always should be an incredibly powerful weapon, but that capability should never define the Enterprise. Star Trek is about idealism. When they designed the movie Enterprise, they stretched logic a little bit just to find a way to keep the photon torpedo launchers subdued in appearance. This is because the Enterprise is the ship of enlightened men and women from the future. In my view, that’s what made the movie Enterprise a “grown up” starship. A warship bristling with weapons appeals to our more animalistic and adolescent side.
In light of the geopolitical atmosphere of the day, Star Trek will find itself to have suddenly switched to the wrong side at the worst possible time if it glamorizes preemptive, thoughtless violence.
I don’t think that’ll happen, though. Long live USS Enterprise. ISS Badazz NCC-1337 will never set sail.
I have never understood the whole ‘time travel is so overdone” mentality with some Trek fans. To me that is as silly as if I were to say Starships are so overdone in Star Trek. Beaming down to alien worlds is just done to death. Why do they have to be in space so much? Why does everyone wear the same clothes all the time?
Time travel is a tried and true story telling element of science fiction in general and Star Trek in particular. It just is. You don’t have to like it, but its going to be used.
I mean someone mentioned he would rather the past events be viewed as they were in Menagerie. While I love that episode and it was an inventive way of depicting the Cage events, I don’t see why it anyone would consider it an inheritantly superior method of telling the story this movie intends to tell.
And someone else complains about this movie having time travel but then says he liked the Guardian idea better (which I was thrilled about that rumor but alas it wasn’t meant to be). Ummm, City on the Edge of Forever WAS a time travel story. Indeed it is considered by most to be THE Star Trek time travel episode.
And finally the worst. I read more than once someone lament the time travel aspect and bemoaning queries as to why the movie couldn’t just tell a straight forward story.
The reason Star Trek has become the phenomena it is. The reason Star Trek IS what it is. The reason I watched Star Trek religiously and consider it the greatest television show of all time. Was precisely because it was NOT straight forward.
Which was the failing of TNG, which is a whole ‘nother can of worms. :)
Time will tell what the storyline involves. In the past, bogus info was disseminated by the studio to try and throw off all of the rabid Trek fans and create further interest in the property. Everything you’ve heard up until now could all be false. An illusion. May you find your way as pleasant.
#376: “#374 – Are you in Adelphi, or (God help you) Langley Park? I did nine years in Silver Spring/Wheaton, and then several years in Arlington and West Falls Church (during my last marriage). Born and raised in Cumberland, MD. Glad to make the acquaintence of someone with a similar Mapquest point of reference.”
Now I’m in downtown Silver Spring, which is a wonderful place since the “rejuvenation.” I absolutely love it.
I’ve lived in the DC ‘burbs all of my life, and discovered Ledos when I was in College Park as a student at the U. of MD in the ’70s. There was only one at that time.
Lived most of my adult life in Adelphi, never in Langley Park.
Langley Park was a nice working class area when I was in college, though – there was this great ice cream place called “Weiles” that dated back to the 40s or 50s, nicer than “Giffords” really. And a few blocks from Ledos was a place called “Leone’s” that also had pretty decent pizza and good Italian food in general – the “University of Maryland Association Of Star Trek” used to go down there for dinner after our weekly meetings.
I’m old as dirt. ;)
This all sounds so cool:)
~T’Lera
Anyways GM made all of these electric vehicles called the EV1 and leased them to people in southern California. Per the electric vehicle crowd, the cars were the Second Coming and people wanted to hold onto them long after there lease was up, but GM took them all back and destroyed almost all of them. GM stated that they were a money loser and the program proved that there wasn’ t a strong enough demand for electric vehicles to make the venture profitable. Guess what, in the late 1990’ s they were right. Gas…