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“That Which Survives” Remastered: Review, Screenshots, & Video March 16, 2008

by Jeff Bond , Filed under: Review,TOS-R Screenshots/Video , trackback

REVIEW

One of the very last handful of original Star Trek episodes broadcast, “That Which Survives” is a rather joyless exercise in mystery with beauty queen (and onetime Catwoman) Lee Meriweather as a planetary siren who kills Enterprise crewman with a touch—and with just the right amount of reluctance.

It’s a plot that doesn’t leave much room for anything but redundant scenes of Meriweather’s Losira threatening the Enterprise landing party—including Kirk, McCoy, Sulu and an expendable geologist named D’Amtato. D’Amato is so expendable in fact that after he’s killed the grieving Kirk, McCoy and Sulu bury him with a gravestone that they mark “Lt. D’Amoto”—didn’t any of them know this guy’s first name?

That means ample time for a typical classic Trek “B” plot—something which more often than not took the form of a technological problem on the Enterprise, a ticking clock and an exasperated Scotty fulminating on how the ship’s whatsis wasn’t designed to take this, etc.

The stuff on the planetoid is grim, lifeless, right down to the deep purple lighting scheme, enlivened by the ongoing appearances of Losira, who disappears with an eerie vocal cue and a collapsing “door” effect. The Enterprise scenes are more entertaining, although as in “The Gamesters of Triskelion” (which also features Spock in command of the Enterprise, trying to track a landing party across the galaxy), Spock’s literalism and impatience with ordinary human reactions and emotions is pushed to the point where it becomes downright annoying. Scotty gets more than his usual screen time and James Doohan does a good job of playing off Nimoy, and his one-man-show inside a dangerous engine chamber is probably the most entertaining scene in the episode. There’s also nice support from Booker Bradshaw as Dr. M’Benga. Although he has far less to do than he does in the much better “A Private Little War,” Bradshaw makes enough of an impression in two episodes to register as one of the strongest supporting players in the series.

While CBS-D doesn’t have much to do here they do conjure up a convincingly barren, mysterious-looking planetoid and add a subtly blurring, “shifting” effect to indicate the Enterprise being thrown 990.7 light years away from the planetoid. “That Which Survives” features a lot of hand phaser fire and it’s better-animated than usual, not really requiring any touch-ups from the new effects team. With or without redone effects this one’s a tough slog.

SFX VIDEO


Star Trek ““That Which Survives” Remastered FX Reel

SCREENSHOTS

Assorted


Doctor M’Benga


I am for you!

Comments

1. The Vulcanista - March 16, 2008

Spock was an absolute *a$$* in this one, but he did find the landing party. I gotta give him that.

Peace. Live long and prosper.
The Vulcanista }:-|

2. Harry Ballz - March 16, 2008

Lee Meriweather……………growrrr!!

3. RetroWarbird - March 16, 2008

Great Scotty episode.

And nice to see him play off of Spock.

The rest of it was pretty cut and dry, including Kirk’s egomaniacal “GET IN HER WAY SO SHE CAN’T KILL ME!” tactics, and his later “let’s dance around her like a maypole” ones.

New effects were nice. Nothing special here, though.

4. tholianhata - March 16, 2008

Thought the new planet really added to the episode. Well done.

5. Heywood Jablomee - March 16, 2008

Really one of the throw-away episodes. Not a lot to talk about with this one. But I agree, great Scottie episode!

6. Katie G. - March 16, 2008

What romantic words:

“I am for you, James T. Kirk.” Isn’t that what Kamala said to Ulrik of Valt? (sp?).

I am for you, Mr. Poopey face…

Nah. Doesn’t work. Sorry dude.

Excellent Scotty episode. I agree, RetroWarbird.

kg

7. Enc - March 16, 2008

yeag great scott ep and great planet

but was wondering if the fx team coulda added something to the ‘sky’ backdrop for those landing party scenes.
and i was wondering casue i wasnt paying enough attention. did you notice if during the ex shots of it semed the ship was going faster each time in relation to the stars etc to go with the lines and tention build as we learned the ship was going faster and faster?
now i havent seen them all but i noticed last night. it looke dlike the impulse engines had a split exaust.

8. SirMartman - March 16, 2008

I am for you, James T. Kirk,,

Gag,,

lol

Yip Kirk sure was the ladies man,,

Whats the differnce between the Titanic and James T Kirk ?

Not everyone went down on the Titanic

9. Batts - March 17, 2008

I thought this was pretty well done. I like the feel of the dead planet and the Enterprise’s glow of being knocked 990.7 light years away!! I love the dialogue between Scott and Spock. ‘please ,mr.scott restrain your leaps of illogic! LOL”
This episode always sent a slight chill up the spine. A woman having to just touch you and you’re a gonner!! Ensign Watkins trying to lie about the machinery and boy did he pay for that!! However, he sure yelled out for Scotty!

10. Batts - March 17, 2008

Also a rare movement in the transporter beam that was also a nice one.

11. Engon - March 17, 2008

It may be entirely coincidental, but…

On April 4th 1968 “2001: A Space Odyssey” premiers in Los Angeles.

Ten months later, on January 24th, 1969, “That Which Survives” airs.

Both contain the following elements:

A murderous super-computer conflicted by its own emotions.

An ancient alien force capable of instantly propelling a spacecraft vast distances.

An ancient alien representative that appears and disappears and is suggestive of length, breadth and height. It is accompanied by eerie musical vocalizations.

An attempt by a lone man to disable a dangerous mechanism that can only be accessed inside a claustrophobic, horizontally-oriented, electronic corridor.

Finally, when the super-computer is ultimately disabled, its last conscious act is to replay an old video-recording of a talking head. The talking head proceeds to give much needed background exposition.

I know it is strange to compare 2001 with one of Star Trek’s less beloved episodes, but Kubrick’s film proved very influential and “That Which Survives” may be one of the earliest, and oddest, examples of that influence.

12. CanuckLou - March 17, 2008

Wow – you guys are harsh. Always enjoyed this episode. Beauty survives.

The adventure continues…

13. Battletrek - March 17, 2008

The 3rd season is the best, simply because the show stopped being so full of itself.

14. diabolk - March 17, 2008

#13… and became filled with crap by an uncaring producer. “Bitter Dregs” indeed.

15. Iowagirl - March 17, 2008

The 3rd season still has some very good eps imo. That Which Survives may not be one of those, but the great Scotty moments sort of make up for the episode’s otherwise rather substandard quality.

Anyway, Beauty survives and TOS survives!

16. Ro-Dan - March 17, 2008

If you’re a fan of the type-II hand phaser this episode is for you. Lots of phaser action.

17. Irish Trekki - March 17, 2008

I actually felle asleep during this episode!

18. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#13 the third season of trek was a joke, the network modivated by it’s unstellar ratings put the show on a 10 oclock time slot, the studio, cut the budget and bad scripts that would not have even been considered in the first two seasons got greenlighted for production, On top of this Fred Freidberger though he success in the movies, was not able to translate that success to the small screen, of course he went to produce the second season of the scifi schlock classic Space 1999 and the ever forgettable Superboy. Seaon three of trek gave us such scif embarasments as Spock’s Brain,The Way to Eden, and the Children shall lead, and the scif sillyness of that is That Which survives. I will give you this, It was one of season threes better episodes and believe me that is not saying much at all.

19. diabolik - March 17, 2008

#8… classic joke! Must remember that…

20. 1701 over Gotham City - March 17, 2008

I love the concept of Dr M’Benga, and seeing him was something we should have had more of… to think McCoy was the only doctor was absurd. How can one be the Cheif Medical Officer when there aren’t any others to cheif over?

21. JL - March 17, 2008

That pic of Lee Meriweather – I swear she looks like one of Jack Kirby’s Eternals!!

22. JL - March 17, 2008

And yeah. Season 3 is pretty awful. There are really only a cfew episodes from this terrible season worthy of not falling asleep. My favorite episode from Season 3 – and I’m not sure exactly why – is the Wild West one (damn I forgot the name!!)

23. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#22 Spector of the Gun, that one was okay but if you look really carefully at the sets you see evidence of cost cutting on the show. also kirk wastold by the Melkosians that they wanted not contact yet they basically his actions violated the prime directive of non interference by forcing them selves on the Melkoisians. The whole premise of the episode with the gunfight at the OK Coral strikes me as being a little on the loopy side.

24. TrekkyStar - March 17, 2008

re: 22

Was it Spectre of the Gun??

25. TrekkyStar - March 17, 2008

23. Garovorkin you posted before me

26. Jon C - March 17, 2008

Hey Anthony! .It’s St Paddy’s Day! What? No irritating clip of Finnegan?

27. JL - March 17, 2008

Yes! Specor of the Gun – thanks guys

The building fascades were definitely a direct result of cost-cutting, yes. The way I look at it though is that it added a sense of creepiness to the episode… an almost “nightmarish” vibe. Even before I read that in one of the Trek books (the cost-cutting angle), I always accepted the fake storefronts as part of the vibe of that wierd place they were in. And I know there are issues with the Prime Directive but the episode still had a few things going for it, at least for me:

• action
• sense of dread, impending doom
• some decent acting on the part of the cowboys (Earp, Doc Holiday, right?)

Better than “That hich Survives” IMO – by a MILE!

28. fred - March 17, 2008

I am for Barack Obama.

Wait…what was the question?

29. Ryan - March 17, 2008

I don’t know if it was mentioned in the ep, but what was that keypad thing Spock was carrying around? All I can tell is that it made Spock turn into kind of a jerk.

30. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#27 JL i will give the episode props( No Pun intended) for a few of those things that you mention. interesting bit of trivia I think the actor who played Earp had a bit part in Star trek 5 The Final Frontier. It is probably the best of the third season episodes. The thing is that the writing, editing and production in season three, was very sloppy and lacked the coherence of the first two seasons, it was like Friedberger had no idea what he was doing. In the case of that which survives The computer on the planet transports the ship 1000 light years away?when it would have been simpilier to destroy it makes no sense to meat all. The engineer encounters a strange woman in engineer and rather then run for help engages it in conversation? The ship going to Warp 14 which contradicts the Warp 9 limit and the fact that beyond Warp 9 the ship would quickly tear itself apart, that bit off continuity is thrown out the window. The who notion that Losara the holographic computer construct who was designed to protect the planet from intruders felt conflicted about killing. Please, that made no sense whatsoever. The computer isprogramed to defend and to kill, its can’t be designed to feel sorry for its enemies. The fact that each image was made to kill a specific person one at a time, very silly.

31. Randall - March 17, 2008

People are far too hard on this episode. No, doesn’t match up with the best of the first and second seasons, but still, it has an atmosphere of depressed closeness to it that always had a strong effect on me. Not the best thing to build a plot on, I admit… but far from crap.

There’s something…. claustrophobic about “That Which Survives,” or something ghostly about it. Somehow they managed to make an ultra-babe like Lee Meriwether seem creepy, sad, menacing and weird all at once. Neat trick.

Give the episode a break. With more time to spend on it, maybe they could have polished it up a bit and made it more interesting, and not merely atmospheric… but it’s hardly an out-and-out failure.

32. Andy Patterson - March 17, 2008

3. RetroWarbird – March 16, 2008

Great Scotty episode.

Yes. I don’t need a bloomin’ coo-ckoo clock.

33. Lyle - March 17, 2008

I always liked this episode, probably because I’ve always been a Scotty fan. Any episode that highlights Scotty’s “Miracle Worker” status automatically gets a leg up in my list of favorite TOS episodes.

But then again, I’ve always thought people were a bit too harsh on Season 3 overall. Sure, it wasn’t up to Seasons 1 or 2, but still there were episodes like The Enterprise Incident, Day of the Dove, The Tholian Web, The Empath, For the World is Hollow and I Have Touched the Sky, and All our Yesterdays, all of which are very very good Trek episodes, if not quite up to “excellent” status. Spectre of the Gun, IMO, was a great example of doing the most you can with a limited budget – the alien version of Tombstone with the one-sided buildings, clocks hanging in mid-air, etc, did a lot to create a surreal alien atmosphere that helped the episode a lot IMO.

Even some of the episodes that were overall dogs have their moments, the character of Alexander from Plato’s Stepchildren being a prime example. Another great moment was the self-destruct sequence from Let That Be Your Last Battlefield.

I guess all I’m asking is that people bear in mind that Season 3, while definitely not as good as Seasons 1 and 2, did still have its moments…

34. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#31 Randall what this episode could have been is not the point. The episode was poorly written and produced. The story has far to many holes to be considered any good. as for the whole Atmosphereic thing well that Ill give you that. Lee Meriwhether is beautiful, but as an actress did not impress. I see very little to admire int his episode or season 3 as a whole .and I don’t think remastering will ever add to the viewing pleasure of any of these particular episodes

35. Kyle Nin - March 17, 2008

Oh, not another Earth-type planet. Why can’t they make something else? How about a little variety?

Huh? It’s NOT Earth-like?

36. Flint - March 17, 2008

Checkov is mentioned by Kirk in this episode but not in it. Even though Spock has no tolerance for emotional outbursts, Scotty seems to be the only subordinate of Spock’s to rarely question orders. I like the ship scenes in this episode better then the planet scenes.

The final epic speech by a lone member of a society which has been extinct for ions is always entertaining to see.

37. bill hiro - March 17, 2008

“My fellow Kalandans” always makes me think of Futurama and its frequent use of the phrase “my fellow Earthicans”.

As for the episode, its pretty dreary business and I always hated that Sulu turns into an idiot in this show, stuck with a lot of generic question-asking to set up Kirk’s exposition: “Gee, Captain, what do you think happened? Gosh, Captain, what was that? Wow, Captain, what do you think happened to the Enterprise?” Sulu was better than that.

But its hard to hate it completely. There are only 79 of these things, so even the ones you don’t like, you do.

38. Irish Trekki - March 17, 2008

This is actually an example of one of the few movies that isn’t improved by the remastering. It’s largely because it’s one of the script heavy, drama orientated episodes. You can’t really maximise the new technology in a situation like that!

39. star trackie - March 17, 2008

The appearance of M’Benga and Scotty makes this one worth watching. As Vulcanista observes, Spock IS a complete ass in this one and he needed McCoy to take him down a notch or two. And the girl at the helm ranks as one of the worst actors to ever steer the ship. But still not a “bad” episode and certainly nowhere in the leagues of And the Children Shall Lead.

And let me say this, I’ve never subscribed to this “3rd season is rotten” nonsense that fandom has built up over the years. I had the good fortune to grow up on these episodes in syndication, where I didn’t know 1st season from 3rd. They might show Amok Time one day and Day of the Dove the next. Granted, there were plenty of stinkers in the 3rd season. But for every MArk of Gideon there was a Day of the Dove. For Every Spock’s Brain there was a Paradise Syndrome. For every That Which Survives there was an Enterprise Incident. Like the other two seasons, the thrid season offers some good epiodes as well as some not so good episodes, but it isn’t the godwaful nightmare that so many fans tend to label it.

40. Iowagirl - March 17, 2008

#39
- But for every MArk of Gideon there was a Day of the Dove. For Every Spock’s Brain there was a Paradise Syndrome. For every That Which Survives there was an Enterprise Incident. -

Spot-on.

41. mike - March 17, 2008

I just want to say to paramount that this whole star trek remastered thing was pretty weak. I’m a big fan of the old series, but even I have to be convinced to buy the whole series, potentially again. The fact that the so-called remastered episoses were obviously rushed and needed a larger budget makes it hard to justify spending all that money. I appreciate much of the work that was done, but the truth is that there are really only a few episodes that are worth watching anyway (maybe half at best) and if you guys were smart what you would have done is take all the best episodes and sell them as a package, fully remastered and perhaps even slightly redited for continuity. The hardcore would buy followup packages of the crappy episodes anyway, but a good remastered best of is something I would’ve bought, even as a gift for non trek watcher

42. Captain Amazing!! - March 17, 2008

YEAH!!! Dr. M’Benga!!! Whoo hoo!!!!!!!!

43. Gary the Gorn - March 17, 2008

This episode creeped me out when I was a little kid.

It was good classic B SciFi movie material. Much more entertaining than reruns of the Brady Bunch, The Patridge Family, The Little Rascals, and My 3 Sons and all of the other crap that was on TV in those days.

This was 10 times better than most things in sydication in the early 70′s.
I still remember running home after school to watch Star Trek at 4 p.m. every day.

At recess we used to play Star Trek and nobody wanted to be Dr. McCoy. Everybody wanted to be Kirk, Spock, Sulu, Scotty, Chekov, Lt. Boma (I know he was only in one episode but he was also in “Land of the Giants” and he made quite an impression in his only Star Trek appearance) a red shirt.

Brings back some great memories.

44. Hat Rick - March 17, 2008

An excellent episode from the standpoint of the digital improvement, I must say. Lee Meriwether is as appealing as ever.

One note: I was passing through California State University Northridge this morning. They are filming establishment shots for the new movie with hundreds of extras and elaborate set dresses of the main library building. There are three partial pillars in the main plaza and at least two gigantic bluescreens on either side. A most impressive event.

45. Commodore Lurker - March 17, 2008

Decloaking . . .

Nice to see alot of seldom heard voices (and maybe some new?) here today.

1. The Vulcanista – Critical of Spock? I’m in shock! Hey that … you know.
Peace. Live long and prosper.

11. Engon – Your “2001″ comparison is very interesting and well thought out. I never fathomed that before — bravo!

12. CanuckLou – “Wow – you guys are harsh.”
ITA (thanks for that Vulcanista). I think Anthony Pascale said it best. In his words, we are “PADANTIC” — great word, look it up. I did.

13. Battletrek – “The 3rd season is the best.”
WOW !!! In my 36 years of hard core Trekkin’, I’ve never heard any Trek fan say that before. Fascinating.

16. Ro-Dan – The phaser to this day, is still one of the greatest sound effects ever created. Wouldn’t you agree? I would love to know how they did that.

18. Garovorkin – ITA. Whenever I’m trying to turn someone on to Trek, I steer them away from season 3 TOS, except “The Enterprise Incident” (and a few others) — one of the greatest eps in all of the Trek saga.

“That Which Survives” I only watch for all the Scotty stuff and Spock as an A**.

Hey, I still can’t start STOGaM Pt. 2, anyone else with that problem? Or have the Trek gods cast me aside as Apollo did Scotty?

Recloaking.

46. British Naval Dude - March 17, 2008

arrr…

“That Which is Surly” …

What? Was every lad just crabby as all hell on this episode?

yarrr… it did have a creepy vibe to it, and I didn’t fall alseep watchin’ it so can’t be all bad…BUT…

As said afore- Spock was an emormous ass…. yup! A real kneebiter nerk! I’d have punched him out and gone ta tha brig happily.

Sulu was really obsessed with the Enterprise blowing up… how many times did he hafta say that?

Kirk being short with Sulu “Shut it Sulu! If I wanted a Russian history lesson, I’d have brought moptop!”

Even McCoy, after Sulu weeped, “How can you joke when D’Amato just croaked?” and Bones a’going “It’ll be worse if he gets company.”

Geez… arrr… then Scottie having Spock drive him batsy… “bloomin’ cuckoo-clock”… Scott getting dramatic… “nothin’ in tha universe will stop us from blowin’ up… just like Mr. Sulu seems ta want.”

arrrr… was sorta creepy and scary at times… very much a desolate feel to it all, in characters and in setting…

Now, if ya wanna perk up for St patty’s Day,
I have me St Pat poem posted in that thar “Chat” tab at the top, I believe it be thread 285…

47. Daoud - March 17, 2008

Another failure of the third season was due to the Genes and DC having almost no involvement in rewrites. That’s where Freddy made a mess of it. The good scripts stayed good, but the poor ones didn’t get that last-minute tweaking that the Genes and DC were so great at in seasons 1 and 2.

This episode would have been improved by a few minor nitfixes. Having Losira’s original purposes be found to interact with any visitor “as a pleasing force-hologram made especially for that visitor” (a la the Salt Vampire’s trick) so that the messages for Kalanda would be well-received and listened to… could have crossed with the defense systems inadvertently. Thus, the killing-Losira-made-for-you could have been a similar snafu a la Nomad.

The other thing that would have made the shipboard sequences make more sense would have been having a physiological/psychological effect as a result of the 990.7 ly slingshot. It could have “caused severe mental stress” that Dr McCoy could have said it will take us days to shake off, and maybe weeks for a Vulcan.

As to D’Amato’s grave… I don’t think it was intended to be permanent. I’d think they would have taken his remains with them when the left, and not left them on the planetoid.

Good job this time by the CBS-D team to make the planet look non-Earthy. The original NEVER made sense for an “artificial planetoid” or whatever the exact words were.

48. Like a door opening - March 17, 2008

In the beginning, after the landing party beams down, everybody on the planet and the Enterprise starts shaking. Was the planet set constructed on a trampoline? It looked like the rocks, ground and people where shaking independently (maybe a stevedore behind each rock jiggling them around?)

I never noticed how much the horizontal Jeffries Tube that Scotty ends up in the end looks a lot like the TNG-era conduits that Geordie, Data et. al ran through (the TNG ones had little sliding doors that automatically opened between sections.)

Also, what exactly did Scotty end up doing with his magnetic wrench? Just shoving it into the antimatter stream fixed the fused warp speed accelerator? Ship reassembled out of phase? Seems overly silly. Hope Scotty ordered all the wrenches be re-greased after his got stuck.

I missed the one shot of the Enterprise barrelling head on at the camera–that should have been remastered.

What was that thing Spock picked up from the navigation console and carried for the rest of the show? It looked like the remote control prop from “Spock’s Brain”

49. richpit - March 17, 2008

So tired of the “realistic” planets. Seriously.

50. S. John Ross - March 17, 2008

#48: Amen.

51. Jorg Sacul - March 17, 2008

That planet was a dismal rock. Looked like one from space, and on the surface. Not even as hospitable as Ceti Alpha V. Definitely a creepy episode, I’ll give you that.

One thing I could never figure out, just where in the ship WAS that access tube? Next to the Ion Pod that Ben Finney was in??

52. JL - March 17, 2008

“You are not… a pirate!”

53. richpit - March 17, 2008

#49: thank you!

54. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

Lets talk about the flashing disco cube on the ceiling, it must have taken a set designer all of 60 seconds to whip up that prop. Upon seeing it I half expected Sulu or McCoy to say to Kirk “Oh my God Jim were being menaced by a bad special effect”! Then the three copies of Losara show up combined with the flashing cube. I expected then to all start dancing. Think Cool in the gang song Ladies night. In all seriousness why didn’t the computer simply destroy enterprise at the outs set? The computer must have been incredibly stupid to leave a potential enemy standing escpecailly one who could beam in and phaser you , which begs the question of why the computer did not have a redundant force field to protect it self in the event that an enemy breached its outer defenses. How is that Spock found them when previous scans of the planet failed to find the computer or any power source. I seem to recall that the planet was impervious to deep scans.

55. British Naval Dude - March 17, 2008

#51…

no, mate… I just be a sea-faring laddie
And I swear I have never paid even as little as a “buccaneer” for some Spock falsies at a convention, so thar!

arrrrr….

56. Mr J. MeOFF - March 17, 2008

Weak story as usual for season 3. I swear the storylines were either the best or the worst part of TOS. There was no middle ground. The cheesy effects can be explained at times but the stories sometimes make the show almost unwatchable. They used the same stories too many times without changing enough elements to make it interesting.

Scotty (Doohan) steals the show once again!
He got some of the best lines of the show on numerous occasions.
At first Spock’s stubbornness is entertaining but by the end of the episode his is very annoying.
Doctor M’Benga should have been in more episodes.

I like this episode for Scotty’s lines.

57. JimJ - March 17, 2008

Gotta love this if even only for the classic, “I know what time it is…I don’t need a bloomin’ cuckoo clock!” Scotty line.

58. mntrekfan - March 17, 2008

What’s with the little caculator thingy Spock kept on him all the time?

59. sean - March 17, 2008

#38

I actually had the opposite reaction – since the episode was such crap, the CBS-D improvements actually stand out a bit more.

60. ety3 - March 17, 2008

Regarding Spock’s behavior, it’s almost like the writers forgot who he was from episode to episode.

Kinda like Data in “Insurrection.”

Elsewhere, I’ve always enjoyed Losira’s “fold and blip out” effect.

61. Denise de Arman - March 17, 2008

Spock did seem to be a bit surly in this ep – I think he was feeling pressured to find his captain and McCoy, the only people he felt close to in the whole universe, and we know Spock had to keep his captain safe at all costs. On top of worrying about their whereabouts and safety(although he would never admit to worrying), he had the safety of the ship and crew on his shoulders. I forgive him for letting his Vulcan side take over, poor baby… I’d forgive him for anything, sexy Vulcan…

62. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

A computer that is charge of defending an entire planetary installation , yet it can’t do a proper threat assessment to a potential enemy? thats what you call good solid writing. The only thing that could have saved season 3 would have been if Roddenberry rather then Freidberger had been running the show. Even with a reduced budget, they could have done al ot better on the writing end of things, but nothing could have overcome the 10 time slot that Trek was stuck in . In the end ,it was that more then anything elset that finally sunk the show. Trek might have made it to a a through a season 4 if they had had better time slot and who knows, the studio might have restored the budget, maybe we would even be talking season 5.

63. Batts - March 17, 2008

First, I wanted to bid a warm hello! to the 1st Ladies of Trekmovie.com!! Arman and Vulcanista. This is the only time I believe Captain kirk thought about sleeping with the enemy, but realized I might not wake up if she touches me!!

Side note: I always thought what kind of #1 would Meriwether might have made instead of Barrett. She just reminds me of that every time I see her.

64. Mr. Atoz - March 17, 2008

Did Kirk, McCoy, Sulu lose their phasers? Did I miss something?
Why didn’t they shoot the disco cube when they figured out it was responsible for genrerating Losira???

65. Denise de Arman - March 17, 2008

Mr. Atoz#64- Hmm… good question.

66. Denise de Arman - March 17, 2008

Batts#63- I liked Majel Barrett as Number 1, but did not like her as Chapel. Too mopey over Spock. Of course, I was never crazy over any woman who had the hots for Spock, as he was and always shall be mine…

67. max - March 17, 2008

This is one of those episodes I don’t think about much. I’ve seen it about three times and I still don’t remember that much about it.

68. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#64 and #65 Evil Disco Cube Computer caused Kirks phaser to overload and explode I assume that McCoy and Sulu had jetison their phasers as well. its funny but it sounds like Disco Cubemeister could have killed them at long range using their own equipment rather then send in the angst ridden Hologram to do it’s dirty work.

69. Batts - March 17, 2008

Not that i did not like Barrett as #1, I just thought how much Lee reminds me of that character! As for Spock and you, I guess i just learned my place….:(

70. Denise de Arman - March 17, 2008

Batts#69- Poor Batts – sorry! Those pointed ears, long fingers and mindmeld abilities have it over any earthling. I think Lee would have been a great Chapel, actually.

71. bill hiro - March 17, 2008

“And the girl at the helm ranks as one of the worst actors to ever steer the ship.”

I always liked Lt. Rhada. It was cool to see a chick at the helm.

72. paustin - March 17, 2008

#71
she’s right up there with Marcy Shatner

73. Katie G. - March 17, 2008

Re: #64. Mr. Atoz

“Did Kirk, McCoy, Sulu lose their phasers? Did I miss something? Why didn’t they shoot the disco cube when they figured out it was responsible for genrerating Losira???”

If memory serves, didn’t the computer disable the phazers so when Spock arrived Kirk yelled at him to quickly destroy the cube (before it could disable his phazer as well) besides getting rid of the dangerous replicas of Losira? Just a thought…

By the way, Anthony, how DO you spell phazer correctly?

phaser?
phazer?
phasor?
phazor?
fazer?
Shut up?

:-)

kg

74. Katie G. - March 17, 2008

Oops. Sorry, #68. Garovorkin. Just saw your post now.

kg

75. US Taxpayer Dude - March 17, 2008

^71

While Khan was the first Indian character portrayed on Trek, Lt Rhada was the first Indian crewman on the Enterprise – complete with a bindi, albeit a discreet one.

And everyone complains TOS was too “whitebread”!!!!

76. Rainbucket - March 17, 2008

I recall the FX being so slim that when they finally “destroy” the evil pulsating disco cube it just starts pulsating more slowly.

Was this changed at all? Surely they could have at least made it go dark, if not patch in some nice charred remains of a former evil pulsating disco cube.

77. Scott - March 17, 2008

Re: #75 – There was a character in TOS who made me question your comment that Rhada was the first Indian character. I recalled seeing a guy who looked Indian in Space Seed. A quick check of Memory Alpha revealed that the guy I was thinking of was Lt. Spinelli, played by Blaisdell Makee. Makee played a character named, ironically enough, Lt. Singh, in The Changeling. Singh is a typical Sikh name; Sikhism got its start in northern India.

Interestingly, Makee himself was Hawaiian! And even more interestingly, he was considered as Nimoy’s replacement (presumably to play Spock, or maybe another Vulcan), if Nimoy had decided to leave Trek after the first season! According to Memory Alpha, anyway. First I’ve heard of it.

Scott B. out.

78. Jorg Sacul - March 17, 2008

Katie:

P-h-a-s-e-r

pronounced by T’pol as “Fay-zor” in her Vulcan accent.

79. Xplodin' Nacelle - March 17, 2008

I always hated Spock in this one. He’s too arrogant, always correcting people. I just want to punch him through the screen. I think the writer of this ep really missed the boat. Too bad Nimoy didn’t insist on a rewrite. At least Scotty didn’t take his shit so easily. LOL

80. Batts - March 17, 2008

#70. Really Denise, I think you might have a point. Spock is a very logical, mentally and physically superior, accomplished, distinguished man. I could NEVER measure up!! You have raised the bar too high! LOL!! When i am told to get my mind out of the gutter, I say the gutter is 1 step up for me!! LOL. Ha Ha!! Cheesy, I know….

As far as Chapel/Meriwhether.. That is possible.

81. Denise de Arman - March 17, 2008

Batts#80- Spock made my romantic life impossible – he’s been my fantasy since the age of 9 and no man on the planet has been good enough for me ever since. I am consigned to a life of Vulcan feailty…

82. Katie G. - March 17, 2008

Re: #66. Denise

Um, have you talked this over with Vulcanista? You may have to challenge her (Pon Farr style) and fight over Spock. Gotta go see how many quatloos I have left…

Re: #78. Jorg

Hey, thanks! Anthony chewed us out a while back for not knowing how to spell it so I figured I should find out.

kg

83. OR Coast Trekkie - March 17, 2008

Exteremely minimalist effort in effects. They could have touched up the phaser effects, and the effects for the Enterprise in danger and that quick “if you blinked you missed it” flash… pathetic…

84. Engon - March 17, 2008

Although it always had low ratings, Star Trek’s fate was sealed by…

“Laugh-In”

85. OR Coast Trekkie - March 17, 2008

nice planet though

86. Jim Profit - March 17, 2008

I promise I won’t ask this again – as soon as I get an answer. It could even be “We can’t provide them anymore.” and that would be o.k. But once, only once I’d like to get an answer.

Here comes the question:

Where have the downloadable fx videos gone?

Thanks in advance.

87. regis - March 17, 2008

I assume D’Amato’s first name was Giancarlo or something similarly gigantic. Way too complicated to write.

Or perhaps he was Lieutenant Laurence Taylor “L.T.” D’Amato.

88. star trackie - March 17, 2008

#86, I don’t know about the fx reels, but I sure mix those kick-ass “coming soon” promos. They never air them on the local station here and they were always a lot of fun to watch.

I was really hoping to see them included as an extra on the remastered DVD set but no such luck.

89. twstrekfan - March 17, 2008

There’s lots to like about “That Which Survives” IMHO as it’s also my favorite TOS episode. Here’s a list.

1. Reference to a previous TOS episode… The Horta/silicon lifeform on Janus VI aka “Devil in the Dark” reference by Sulu. TOS almost NEVER did this.

2. A whole lot of redshirts getting dead action. Ensign Wyatt in the transporter room, Engineer Grade 4 John B. Watkins in engineering, & Lt. D’Amato while prospecting for underground water on the Kalandan Outpost. TWS is on the level of such killfest episodes like “The Apple” & “Obsession.”

3. Great amount of airtime from the “rest” of the crew… (Besides Kirk, Spock, & Bones) It’s nice to see the rest of the crew in action. Hell, a redshirt phasered the Kalandan Cube Computer to save Kirk’s skin!
Here’s a list of the rest of the crew who appeared: Lt Rahda, Dr. M’Benga, Senior Geologist D’Amato, & Engineer Watkins. Plus, don’t forget the redshirt who beamed down with Spock & put his phaser to good use.
It’s nice to also see Sulu off the ship & get airtime. Scotty’s actions here is priceless & Uhura is always a welcome sight.

4. Lots of FX action. Want phasers? Phasers to blast open holes in the ground @ 8,000C, phasers to blast beautiful, half-naked alien women who can’t keep their hands off of you, phasers to blast schizo alien computers who can send a starship 1,000 (or 990.7 if you’re Spock) light years away. Hell, you even had a phaser explode due to an overload caused by Losira. Opps, I forgot, they cut that scene from the Remastered version.

5. Spock, Kirk, & Bones were a riot… With our favorite Vulcan explaining how he hit his head on the arm of the chair was almost as funny as telling Scotty that nursing the warp engines by sitting on them made for an “undignified” & uncomfortable sitting position… (Opps, forgot they cut that scene out too.) Spock also showed Dr. M’Benga, Lt. Rahda, Scotty, & Uhura a taste of his Vulcan wit.
With Captain Kirk, he tells off Sulu that if he wanted a Russian history lesson, then he would’ve brought Chekov instead. Good ways to die? There are no “good ways” as Kirk explains to Sulu. Our Captain even goofs on Spock when he comments behind his back to the landing party, “A planet even Spock can not explain..” Damn, they cut that scene out of the remastered version also!
With Bones, he responds to Sulu that he was more than happy to see the newly deceased D’Amato “lonely.” “It’ll be worse if he had company…”
And, you can’t help but smirk a little when McCoy says that Losira “Almost made a ghost out of Sulu…”

6. The Enterprise’s velocity tops out in TOS at warp 14.1 here in “That Which Survives.” I’m disappointed that they didn’t come up with a ludicrous remastered FX of the ship at this speed. Boo!

7. We find out that phasers can dial up the thermometer to 8,000 Celcius. We get a nice detailed closeup of a tricorder, Jeffries tube action, & new sets like the earthquake planetside, which was created for this episode. It’s too bad they didn’t upgrade the special effects of the energy flow in the Jeffries tube that Scotty likened to “Ants crawling all over my body…”

8. For all those who felt that “That Which Survives” was boring or had put you to sleep, were you able to guess what Losira was the 1st time you watched it? I bet you didn’t. I don’t know about you, but when you have a gorgeous, half-naked mystery woman with a touch that’s too hot for even Kirk to handle (not that he wasn’t trying) & who’s played by a Miss America popping in & out like a genie, it definitely held my attention. Add to this your classic “Scotty saves a sabotaged Enterprise running at breakneck speeds while facing a countdown clock” and it’s very hard, IMHO, to find this boring. What’s the secret of Losira & her planet? Will they be able to recover all the wondrous Kalandan technology? Could Losira’s hologram be the early foundation for Federation holodeck and EMH technology?

People, “That Which Survives” contains so many hidden gems!

A+ for “That Which Survives” the episode, a D- for the lack of new FX/CGI, and an F+ for all the scenes they butchered from this remastered version.

Here’s my yahoo group that’s dedicated to Losira & to this episode.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Losira_Lee_Meriwether/

Come join if you like “that Which Survives” like I do.

Live Long & Prosper!

90. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#89 interesting but its still a lousy episode no matter you jazz it up.

91. Shlepra-Khan - March 17, 2008

#48, 58 — yes, the “Spock calculator” was Spock’s remote control from Spock’s Brain — which was a redressed and painted Captain Pike Communicator from The Cage. you can even see the little knobs at the top of it…

Happy St. Paddy’s day from da Schlepr-Khan, laddies!!!

92. Matt Wright - March 17, 2008

# 89 — To be clear, you attribute the cuts to ‘remastering’ which is incorrect. Those cuts are for syndication, the full remastered episode exists, just waiting to be put out on DVD/Blu-ray some day.

93. Katie G. - March 17, 2008

Re: #91. Shlepra-Khan

“#48, 58 — yes, the “Spock calculator” was Spock’s remote control from Spock’s Brain — which was a redressed and painted Captain Pike Communicator from The Cage. you can even see the little knobs at the top of it…”

Get outta here! Really? How did you find that out?

And

COOL! Thanks for the trivia!

Yes – - in case you hadn’t noticed, I have eaten 1/4 of my chocolate Easter bunny. Whew. Get me off the ceiling!

kg

94. Sean4000 - March 17, 2008

#92, to be even more clear, the “some day” is the 3rd Tuesday in November of the year 2025.

Wild accusation. I really have no release date. Getting impatient for the movie release though.

Matt, you know something we don’t? Anything?

95. CmdrR - March 17, 2008

Nice character moments. Not much on the plot side. Spock seems way outta character in this one, as if giving him (course) one-liners was more important than maintaining his persona.

Who decided to pronounce it DEE-Amato? I’m not really certain, but wouldn’t it be Duh-motto?

96. Denise de Arman - March 17, 2008

Katie- Vulcanista and I talked it over and decided that, since we are friends, it would be inconvenient if one of us were to murder the other. No Spock and Kirk stuff for us. So, should the occasion ever arise, we will be happy to share Mr. N. You could be included in that as well, that is, if your husband doesn’t divorce you for asking…

97. CmdrR - March 17, 2008

96 — I think I rented that VHS back in the late 80s.

98. Andy Patterson - March 17, 2008

I’m am for you D’Amato.

99. CmdrR - March 17, 2008

I just know that in an interview, Robert Stack laughingly recalled that on the set of The Untouchables (also Desilu) whoever got the villain’s name in the script first decided on the pronunciation. Since Shatner got to say D’Amato first, lord knows whether it’s pronounced right. Hell, he couldn’t get You-hura right.

100. twstrekfan - March 17, 2008

#90 – In Your Humble Opinion… Of course. BTW, you didn’t say why it’s a lousy episode so I’m curious to hear what you have to say.

#92 – Thanks, I know ;)

What we don’t know is when we’ll actually see it fully & in Hi Def. From what I have heard, Toshiba, the chief backer for HD-DVD, paid for the cost of all TOS HD Remastering. Neither CBS nor Sony Blu-Ray will put out the $$$ needed to convert from HD DVD to Blu-Ray.

On the bright side, this means that TOS will need to be remastered again so I’m hoping that the blu-ray version of remastered TOS will look a whole lot better, especially in the special effects department. I was very disappointed at all the missed opportunities for FX upgrades that “That Which Survives” deserved & I’ve got my fingers crossed for a better blu-ray version.

Live Long & Prosper.

101. Kelso - March 17, 2008

In Atlanta they played ‘The Jimmy Kimmel Show’ instead. Bah!

102. Shlepra-Khan - March 17, 2008

#93, kewl! I love a good chocolate buzz….

Re: The Spockbot Remote — just look at it…if some kind soul will post links to pics of both then you can tell that’s what it is.

103. THX-1138 - March 17, 2008

I have noticed that the episodes I liked as a kid are routinely the ones that most people pan around here. I always found this episode to be a little scary and a little sad. I still do, to some extent. I don’t necessarily agree that this one was a tough slog.

Odd to feel out of step on Star Trek episodes with other fans and critics. I have to say I’m with twstrekfan on this one.

104. Scott - March 17, 2008

twstrekfan: You’re the kind of fan the cut of whose jib I like. You’re passionate about something Trek and you back it up.

I for one always considered TWS one of the better 3rd season episodes, despite Spock’s insufferable personality.

I remember, oh, 30 years ago, a fellow Trekker friend of mine and I trying like crazy to figure out what the heck “many glasistants” were when Losira gives her speech at the end. We thought they were Kalandan time-units. Then I pulled out the James Blish book and read “medical assistance” and we both felt ridiculous.

Scott B. out.

105. Thomas Jensen - March 17, 2008

#89 You said it all and very well. I also enjoy this episode very much. I have the Spock Calculator & Scotty’s tool props from this one. A very technological episode and a lot of fun.

106. Shlepra-Khan - March 17, 2008

#95 — You say DUH-Motto and I say DEE-MATO!

107. Shlepra-Khan - March 17, 2008

#105 — what do you mean you have the props? You OWN the real robo-Spock control?? Oh behave!!!

108. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#100 You haven’t read previous comments that i made with regard to the episode above

109. T Negative - March 17, 2008

Any Trek fans lurking here from Denver?? Channel 2 now has TOS-R in HD!!!!

110. GNDN - March 17, 2008

I’m sorry to see that CBS didn’t try to replicate the “disappearing Enterprise” shot lifted from the title sequence to “The Cage”. The fish-eye lens made that three-foot model appear truly epic. I mean, even Filmation rotoscoped it for TAS.

After this lapse, I pronounce the entire “TOS-R” experience a complete and utter failure.

(That be irony).

PS: A good picture of the gizmo Spock uses throughout the episode can be seen here: http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Image:Remote_control_neural_stimulator_23rd_century.JPG

111. Andy Patterson - March 17, 2008

Looks like a futuristic Rubik’s cube

112. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#110 okay Twstrekfan on second thought ,why is it lousy?
. They find 1000 year old planet and it never occurs to Science officer Spock,that it might just be an artificial world, with his type of knowledge this should not have been a difficult leap in logic for him. Why beam down to a barren lifeless and waterless world without adequet supplies in case something goes wrong with the ship, hell why didn’t they take a shuttle to the planet with a properly fitted out exploration party,
The defense computer on the planet, hurls the Enterprise 900 plus lightyears,why bother when it would have been a lot safer to destroy then and there the ship, because by sending it away the ship is only going to return
Strange women in engineering, do you engage her conversation stand there and let her touch you or use common sense and run screaming for security? Antimatter core is going critical, why didn’t they simply jetison the core, Starships in emergencies? now suddenly they cant do this?
Enterprise travel warp 14 which contradicts the established warp limit of 9.6 ibelieve.
On the planet the Alien computer who purpose is to defend the installation at all cost is suffer pangs of guilt because of the the angst of the Hologram Losara, would work if like dr Daystrom’s M5 the computer had pathways modeled on her engrams. And how is it that Spock happened to beam in, in the nick of time which a phaser which for some reason the computer failed to neutralize like it that had previously disarmed kirk and the landing party. Why wouldn’t the computer have a final force field defense to protect it self in case its outer defenses where breached? Also sensing the return of the enterprise, Why didn’t said computer again take action against the ship, It that computer really that stupid?

TwesTrekfan, I don’t see how you call this a good episode given every problem it has, there are other issues but this will do for now

113. Mr. Poopey face(the poster formerly known as Closettrekker) - March 17, 2008

#39— I agree in principle, but as much as I love TOS, I can only count around 25 great episodes. However, IMO, that’s pretty good for a show with only 79 episodes.

As for the 3rd season:

The Enterprise Incident
Day Of The Dove
The Tholian Web
The Savage Curtain

I could add one or two more “subjective” choices from Season 3, but we can probably all agree that these are great, classic TOS episodes. Unfortunately, that leaves 5 times as many that are not on my short list of episodes from Season 3 of TOS which I would feel comfortable recommending to someone who had never seen the show.

With that said, which episodes are the biggest stinkers of Season 3?

IMO, they are as follows:

Spock’s Brain
And The Children Shall Lead
The Way To Eden

The rest are just ok. Season 3 isn’t the best, but it is not as bad, IMO, as the 1st and 2nd seasons of TNG.

114. GNDN - March 17, 2008

#112: Dude, I was just talking about one shot, not the whole episode. Oh, wait a minute, you weren’t yelling at me; you meant #100.

115. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#114 sorry about that typo god what is with me tonight ?, no I am not angry with you or anyone else I am terribly sorry. Yes my comment is addressed to #100 and I wanted to hear from him on this.

116. Enc - March 17, 2008

#110
see the pic above they did give us something for the ships 990.7 jump.

#112
-because by sending it away the ship is only going to return-

maybe this alien race arent curious and didnt think it posible that other (like us) would be and return.

-Strange women in engineering, do you engage her conversation stand there and let her touch you or use common sense and run screaming for security?-

there are 430 peopl on the ship im sure he didnt know them all. so he lied. for all he knew she coulda been some passenger or something.

-Antimatter core is going critical-

actualy it was a fused injector.

-why didn’t they simply jetison the core-

cause modern treks like tng and so forth have that ability and they put it all ina strait line for just that purpose. a line in ds9 gave a invention date of this ‘warp core’ iirc it was post tos. ships of that tos era did have the componants but not the system in place. they have noe ‘core’ to eject. if you watch tos they usualy mention jettisoning the engines.

-Enterprise travel warp 14 which contradicts the established warp limit of 9.6 ibelieve.-

never heard the 9.6 but there are differing factoids about the ship std speed and emergency speed and such. however in this ep did give us aline by scotty that the ship was not designed take warp 11 point someting for very long. so there we know that it can TAKE this kind of speed but i dont remember anywhere in tos that gave the ship a limit.

-Why didn’t said computer again take action against the ship, It that computer really that stupid?-

this might depend on just what this planet and its computer were built for in the first place. for all we know it was a colony, maybe a farming comunity. one wouldnt put destroy a ship kind of defences in there.
i mighty race moves asteroids together and uses whatever there tech is to melt them into a planetoid of certain composition and cover it with top soil. opps it didnt work this time the plants that grew are poison.

117. MAP - March 17, 2008

PLOT SPECULATION: Ok, this one creeped me out as a kid too (as others had mentioned) and I always thought as a kid, that due to “syndication cuts” that Lt. Rahda (who, to a kid..) to me looked alot like Losira and I everytime I saw this ep (remember, as a kid..) I thought there weremissing scenes (forever resting on the local TV station’s floor) that proved Lt Rahda was Losira in disguise and that she was going to steer the enterprise astray (or some such plot contrivance..). What always made me think that was the look Rahda gave when Spock found out some woman was on board. I have seen the Memory Alpha entries and they say the script underwent numerous rewrites so after seeing this ep again after, oh 15 or more years, I now wonder if there was some dialogue or story written to make other crewmembers paranoid about Rahda, which would explain that rather worried look over her shoulder in the afore mentioned scene. Of course, she was probably just wondering if the mystery woman would show up on the bridge and start assisinating crew members there. Anyhoo, just food for thought. Oh, and the disco computer, couldn’t destroy Big E since it was in orbit and some part of the program probably dictated that ships in orbit not be destroyed but rather “nudged” a few light years away so as not to bring too much attention to the power of the planetoid (ie spaceship rubble in orbit around the outpost would be a big red flag…) and perhaps it couldn’t send Big E off again since it took alot of power to “open the door” and send a killer hologram after each team member. Loads of power perhaps. Enough power to maintain the hologram with anti cellular whatever that is matched to the next victim? Again, food for thought. And Spock’s behavior, I think he is just trying to keep the “humans” a little more focused so they can concentrate and quit wasting time and brain power on silly human catch prases and whatnot. Time is short, you can’t have your crew all blithering on saying stuff like “I’ll sit on the engines themselves and nurse them along” or whatever Scotty had said. Remember Mr Logical is out to maximize every single second. Even when Scotty is in the fuel flow gizmo thing with his reverse polarity magetic wrench, Spock assigns the duty of watching the magnometer (?) graph to Uhura and continues with scans and calculations to figure out why Scotty said “the ship feels wrong”..At least if I were a Vulcan, and I were in charge, and had precious time wasting away because the humans were too busy making silly remarks and not thinking things through…or wasting time making useless emotional observations. I think Mr Spock handled them all quite well. Just food for thought…But then again, if Big E was polarized or something (not sure of the science there…) then how did it get repolorized back to normal if the super disco cube is running on low (or konked out)?? Aha! A plot hole?!

118. I Am Morg Not Eymorg - March 17, 2008

113: Mr. Poopey face

Sorry. Can’t agree. Which isn’t surprising since you have made it clear by repeatedly citing only 35 episodes on your personal list of the great episodes. A very very low total in my opinion.

As for the third season. I would add a few to your list easily. Not the least of which would be All Our Yesterdays and The Empath.

And frankly I like the first two seasons more than all the rest of the snooze fest seasons that followed on TNG by a long shot. With certain episodes as exceptions to the rule of course. :)

119. Thomas Jensen - March 17, 2008

#107 I am behaving… :) I do have both of those props as reproductions made in the original materials. I didn’t mean to state I own the actual screen used items. Of course, these two props are exact to the originals.

But I do have a few items that were actually used during the production of the original series.

120. Garovorkin - March 17, 2008

#116 the problem here is that being a defense computer it would have risk assesment capabilities. It would have scanned the enterprise, seen that it had warp drive and should have been able to conclude that there is the slightest possibility that this ship could return, logically the simplest solution would have been to eliminate the enterprise at the onset, Its defend the installation at all cost programing would have and should have made this the first course of action.

A women dressed like that would tend to stand out even on a ship 430 and most likely the crew would have been aware of a new passenger on the ship.

The warp speed limit was knocked down to ((.66 by the next generations time frame.

If your building a colony in unknown space wouldn’t it make sense to are your colony with the top of the line best defensive computer possible, especially when dealing with the unknown of space. It doesn’t make snese to arm a distant out post or colony with a less capable computer

I believe the Jetisoning capability was present even in the original series, though I could be mistaken on this one. Fused injector and they have no back or emergency eject in case of catastrophic failure, boy that shoddy engineering. i was under the impression that scotty said that if i make a mistake youll have to jettison me into spce its the only chance you have, implies that they could in fact eject the core.

121. Windsor Bear - March 17, 2008

You know something about the third season? Back then they didn’t have to worry about episodes being picked apart. We watched the episodes for entertainment value. They were fun to watch. They were entertaining. That’s why we watched them. That’s why they made them. Today, make one little continuity error or one little change of character, and we pick a show to pieces.

For what it’s worth, the first time I saw this episode, it creeped me out, and that was their desired effect. So it worked on me… back in the 60′s… when their effects were still state of the art… and television was actually entertaining… and viewers used their imagination instead of having to have every little detail handed to them. For best results, watch these episodes as if you were watching them during the time that they were first televised, and all the subsequent Star Trek shows and movies and canon and hype… hadn’t occurred yet.

And as far as the effects, remember… don’t expect alien technology to operate the same way that 20th century technology operates. If Losira’s computer had a conscience, and had a distaste for killing, maybe that was normal for her people’s technology. One of the nice things about Trek’s stuff not always making sense, was that we realized that alien cultures, technology, and even planets did not have to conform to what we understood, believed, or even could imagine. So, it was perfectly normal to see psychedelic planets, computers with spinning colors, and the like… The more you try to make it all “understandable” and fit-in with how we understand things, then the less alien it becomes. Quite frankly, I would like to think that other civilizations out there look and act like nothing we’ve ever seen or encountered before. If all the planets look alike, and all the technology acts the same, and all the spaceships work on the same principles… then the universe is really one dull, boring place.

122. Beagles Rule - March 17, 2008

I was wondering that myself, if Scotty asked to have the “core” jettisoned, or whatever that tube he was in, would that have saved the ship? Perhaps it would have but then they would be stuck all those light years away from help, and how long would it take to get back (or have help arrive?) I’ll leave all the math to the more purists here, but wouldn’t they be trapped for a very long time with nothing but sublight to chug along too? Alas, another thing I often wondered was the Lt Rahda (being Indian) and Losira’s outfit, it’s kinda I dream of Jeannie-ish, Always made me wonder too if they were one in the same…

123. Xplodin' Nacelle - March 17, 2008

As much as I can’t take psuedo-Spock in this one, I will admit that it’s not as bad as The Alternative Factor.

124. Enc - March 17, 2008

#120
-A women dressed like that would tend to stand out even on a ship 430 and most likely the crew would have been aware of a new passenger on the ship.-

some crew yes but not all. and alien dress codes are nothing new for these people.

-The warp speed limit was knocked down to ((.66 by the next generations time frame.-

the actual speed dosent change. just the warp scale

- believe the Jetisoning capability was present even in the original series, though I could be mistaken on this one.-

yes it was. as mentioned in this ep scotty was in the tube and asking for jetison. that would be the sec of tube he was in not the injector. juast like finney in cort martial was in the sensor pod taking readings. that pod was to be ejected with him in it just like scotty.

-ed injector and they have no back or emergency eject in case of catastrophic failure, boy that shoddy engineering.-

well voy and ent-E both only had one core. if you start dbling up on everything you end up with 2 ships.

- i was under the impression that scotty said that if i make a mistake youll have to jettison me into spce its the only chance you have, implies that they could in fact eject the core-

that might be the only good argument. but they dont have that tng style straight in a line warp core where you could simply eject something. they have the same parts but located in differant places in the engineering section and thus you cant eject it cause it might not be near the exterior hull.

125. Enc - March 17, 2008

#122
-I was wondering that myself, if Scotty asked to have the “core” jettisoned, or whatever that tube he was in, would that have saved the ship?-

yes it could have

-Perhaps it would have but then they would be stuck all those light years away from help, and how long would it take to get back (or have help arrive?) I’ll leave all the math to the more purists here-

yeah and they could call for help and wait for it or repair it themselves. like they did in WNMHGB. they were 990.7 lyrs away from where they wanted to be and yes a great didstance to them bu nothing restricted them from impulseing over to a system and getting things fixed. but this ep had them rescueing the landing party, this was important cause of mytery woman killing red shirts and same could be harming the landing party.

126. S. John Ross - March 17, 2008

#121 sez: “Today, make one little continuity error or one little change of character, and we pick a show to pieces.”

Depends on who, specifically, you mean by “we” :)

I think the large majority of folks who enjoy Trek (certainly, all of my Trek-loving friends) don’t give a wet slap about canon or minor points of continuity. I know I don’t; just get the vibe right and the message right and don’t put me to sleep, and I’m there :)

127. Katie G. - March 17, 2008

Thought my posting (#6) was worth repeating in case anyone missed it…

What romantic words:

“I am for you, James T. Kirk.” Isn’t that what Kamala said to Ulrik of Valt? (sp?).

“I am for you, Mr. Poopey face…”

Nah. Doesn’t work. Sorry dude.

(Well, I thought it was funny.) Goodnight.

kg

128. COMPASSIONATE GOD - March 18, 2008

Not a classic, but character moments still heads and shoulders above 97% of the Bermanverse on-the-couch nonsense.

129. Closettrekker - March 18, 2008

#118–”As for the third season. I would add a few to your list easily. Not the least of which would be All Our Yesterdays and The Empath.”

I like those episodes too. I just thought that those were more “subjective”, as I said, and that they wouldn’t qualify, IMO, as “great” episodes.

As for my list of total great episodes in TOS, I have 4 categories:

Great
Good
Okay
Stinkers, or “Trek farts” (only STV, IMO, qualifies as a full-blown Trek Turd, since it was an original feature film)

As for TNG, I’m just not a fan…

130. Garovorkin - March 18, 2008

#124 Okay fair enough, but still from a story standpoint I wouldn’t call this one one of treks better efforts, not by a long shot. The whole issue with the computer is problematic though.

131. Diabolik - March 18, 2008

I do see an echo of Losira later in ST:TMP. The planet’s computer not only duplicated Losira visually, but some of her personality also, hence the reluctance to use the violence.

The Illia probe was a recreation, but had a lot of Illia’s memories and personality which surfaced as it dit it’s job,

132. Jon - March 18, 2008

Regarding the new visual effects, I can’t help pondering–how much more realistic and ultimately successful–using a real model for the Enterprise might have been. I am routinely struck by the fact that I seem to vascilate between preferring the original to redone effects in each new episode. As the project develops, I seem to have come to the conclusion that if this had been done in a more expansive and attentive way, I would have no doubts about which I–and many others–prefer. I commend the team for their efforts; however, this project should have been commanded a grander scale of effort or just left it alone.

133. I Am Morg Not Eymorg - March 18, 2008

Closettrekker:

Ah gotcha, understood. Not agreed however. I think those two are as good as the ones you listed. At least to me. :)

And to set the record straight, I am no fan of TNG either. Not by a long shot. Friends don’t even bring it up around me any longer. LOL.

134. Mr. Poopey face(formerly known as Closettrekker) - March 18, 2008

#133—Yes, they lost me at Farpoint…

135. sean - March 18, 2008

I liked the way Losira ‘winked’ out, like she was a TV being turned off! Haha.

Problems with this ep:

Did they ever address the fact that the Enterprise travels WAAAAAY too fast in this ep? They get thrown a thousand light years and seem to traverse the distance in less than a day. Did they decide to keep the Kelvan upgrades or what?

I was entertained by Sulu’s slightly sexist comments – “I DONT WANT TO HAVE TO SHOOT A WOMAN!”. Haha. Kirk didn’t look like he was going to have any qualms shooting her.

Losira suffered from slow villain syndrome – when she went after Sulu she was bowlegged like she’d either just been horesback riding or had an accident in her pants. It also bothered me that the ground would explode every time Kirk shot a phaser.

Spock went into Vulcan irritation overload here – he berated nearly every officer he came across. He’s certainly been in more or at least equally stressful situations, so it just seemed out of place.

136. roebeet - March 18, 2008

#117 – I wasn’t convinced that Lt. Rhada wasn’t Lorisa in disguise until I finally saw the unedited show on DVD, some years back. That look she gave always convinced me that something was amiss with her.

I always amazes me the harsh words for some of the S3 eps, as well. I agree that some were really lacking, but ST is what it is partly because of S3. If anything else, S3 gives us some great scenes (like Scotty in the engine chamber), and some good full eps, too (DOTD, EI, SOTG, TTW come to mind). I even like “Spock’s Brain”, if only for a good laugh to see Shatner ham it up. The only ep I really wouldn’t mind seeing shelved forever is “The Way to Eden” – no scenes of importance to the ST universe that I can think of.

137. Engon - March 18, 2008

Well, one way you can tell that a Star Trek episode may be challenging to sit through is by how often it repeats itself:

“That Which Survives” – Losira: “I am for you…”
“And the Children Shall Lead” – Children: “Hail, Hail, Fire and Snow…”
“The Alternative Factor” – Lazarus: “Aiieeeee! THUMP!”
“Is There No Truth in Beauty”: Kollos: *creeeeek* “Hey, how ya doin’?”
“The Light of Zetar” Colony: (returns) “Hey, how ya doin’?”
“The Way to Eden” Adam: (sings anything) “Yeah, Brother…”

The repetitions might have been been fine the first time you saw the episode, but on repeated viewings it can become grueling. I’m sure there are many such examples in nature.

138. Enc - March 18, 2008

#135
-Did they ever address the fact that the Enterprise travels WAAAAAY too fast in this ep?-

yes they did. scotty mentions the ship isnt designed to take warp 11 for very long. so yes they can go that fast and faster. this losira person made them go over 14.

-They get thrown a thousand light years and seem to traverse the distance in less than a day.-

sure. why not. the usual speed of the ent is warp 8 (512 c) while the problem got them up to warp 14+ (2744c) you make that kinda jump in speed and you darn right less then a day.

-Losira suffered from slow villain syndrome-

LOL

-It also bothered me that the ground would explode every time Kirk shot a phaser.-

wel these people manufactured a planet. c my remark (#116) on how they could have done that and the rock could have impuritys and the rock wont melt but the other material could explode out when heated up by the phaser.

139. MrRegular - March 18, 2008

18. Garovorkin:
Agree with you on all points except that all of Space:1999 was schlock.
No sir. Please take into consideration Space:1999′s “Black Sun”, which is one of the most compelling and rich hours of science fiction ever filmed. Unfortunately in the 2nd Season of Space:1999 its thoughtful, compelling direction was changed to become more action adventure oriented, under the supervision of Fred Freiberger, who also presided TOS’s very mixed third season.

140. Garovorkin - March 18, 2008

#139 Mrregular I don’t hate space 1999, hell i own the entire series all 48 episodes. Gerry and Sylvia Anderson produced some of the most spectacular science fiction extravaganzas of that era. The models and specail effects were better then almost all the scif feature films produced in the 60′s and 70′s in fact they did a feature film in 1969 called Journey to the Far Side of the Sun, which is fun to watch but its concept is implausible,. The did UFO,thunderbirds Captain Scarlet, Stingrey, Firball XL 500. Recently they did a new captian scarlet CGI series which is supposed to be quite good. I wish they had done some of the effects and sets for the original Star trek. My issue wit hspace 1999 is that the moon traveling bellow the speed of light could not visit a planet every week and an I think a nuclear disaster like that on the moon would have turned the moon in an asteriod blet. but i like the series regardless but it is a little on the schlocky sde of things

141. Schlepra-Khan - March 18, 2008

I’ve been a 1999 fan since the premiere back in ’75. I love that show! Yep…still do!

I agree that the second year is not as good as the first. I own em all too on DVD and yet the ones I tend to watch most are the Year One episodes. Have all the UFO episodes also…

You youngun’s out there should give these discs a spin…you’re missing out on some quality sci-fi. They don’t make em like that anymore.

Garovokin, they kind of implied in the second year that the moon was slingshot into a densely populated part of space after the “breakaway” when it entered a spacewarp…

For me, that makes a *little* more plausible.

142. Jeff Barringer - March 18, 2008

#41 Mike, if you have xbox live, you can download the episodes you want. The episodes that have been remastered are offered in HD.

143. Christian - March 19, 2008

Does anybody seen the remastered warpdrive sequense, in this episode?
I’m very interested in, how it make it.
And remember this: “I’m for you, Mister!”

144. Kyle Nin - March 19, 2008

It seems that some FX scenes are missing from the video (like the Enterprise warping out-of-control).

145. sean - March 19, 2008

#138

Sorry, I ain’t buyin’ it. If they could travel a thousand light years in one day, then they could traverse the entire galaxy in just over 3 months. That’s simply TOO fast, and wildly inconsistent with other established speeds in TOS, not to mention subsequent series. The fact is, the show’s writers simply weren’t paying attention.

Also, the warp formulas you mention are nowhere to be found on screen, so yeah, they kinda don’t mean anything, know what I mean? ;)

And come on, you’re really stretching with your explanation about the exploding dirt! Haha. I know some of you are desperate for these episodes to make sense, but sometimes you have to accept the writers and/or effects technicians just botched the job. And that’s okay. Doesn’t mean I don’t enjoy them when they come on the TV.

146. Enc - March 20, 2008

#145
-Sorry, I ain’t buyin’ it. If they could travel a thousand light years in one day, then they could traverse the entire galaxy in just over 3 months-

if. IF they could maintain that speed. but thats not the case. engines arnt a fire and forget tech. you just dont turn them on and run till you want to stop. these things have alimited run tim eand HAVE to be shut down every once in a while. factor in endurance like 18 yra at c and when you end up doing warp 11-14 or what ever and that endurance is going to drop and drop big.

-The fact is, the show’s writers simply weren’t paying attention.-

in that time period i wouldnt expect them to. also who knew that a tv show fan base would grow as it has and who would have thunk it that it would still be around today. also remember that gene wanted each ep to be self contained and not dependant on any other ep. so the writers didnt need to pay attention to all those details.

-And come on, you’re really stretching with your explanation about the exploding dirt! -

asteroid manipulation was factual scientific postulation of the time period. why when it came time for Phase II/TMP a cored out asteroid was one example for a docking station. and we today are thinking of designing mass drivers and other tech to move asteroids and have already landed on one. but back then the theory and thought of manipulation was just that, give it to a science fiction writer and and they take it to the extreme. given a man made planet as the crew were discovering that it was and being able transport the ship 900.7 light years i dont see a problem in the story of an ancient and obviously powerful race to have pulled it of. after all even Gary 7 was tansporter a great distance over time from a planet that was hiden even from our 24th cent people.

i dont mind seein “exploding dirt”. it (I think) was a way of showing the audiance that the planet was different, different from other wierd planets in this galaxy. with out the exploding dirt we’d have phaser fireing and mothing happens. the first thing you think is something wrong with the weapon. but by shoing a reacion in the dirt, you show that the weapon works but the problem is the ground target. in this case the rocks are wrong, they dont melt. wierd. it’s a wierd / strange / somethings wrong- different with this planet.

147. SPOCKBOY - March 20, 2008

Why is the viewscreen plate all blue when the original is grey?

148. Sean4000 - March 20, 2008

Good point. lol. Goof up number ….??????

149. Christian - March 21, 2008

#147: Are you sure, about that?

150. Steve - March 21, 2008

I just can’t help but to feel when I have watched the last couple episodes that have ben remastered that they have pretty much given up on this. Maybe it’s because HD DVD is no longer. I just feel they would have at least redone the phaser effects before.

151. sean - March 21, 2008

#146

It’s still inconsistent. Other episodes treat a few light years as a great distance, while episodes like this act as though it’s nothing t’all. If it was that easy to travel that far – even if you had to shut down the engines after a day – then the galaxy would turn into a very small place. Yes, the writers back then couldn’t have realized the scrutiny these things would have gone through later, but Rodenberry did have scientific consultants, as well as individuals on staff ensuring continuity was kept as often as possible. Since this was a 3rd Season ep, I can only assume the often-maligned Frieberger wasn’t as concerned as Rodenberry (though ‘Arena’ has a similar problem, when at the end of the episode the crew find themselves thrown 500 parsecs from where they were).

As for transporting them across great distances, that’s fine for an ancient race capable of creating planets, but the Enterprise returned under her own power, so it doesn’t really apply. Losira didn’t modify the engines to go faster, she merely sabotaged them so that the antimatter valves would get ‘stuck’. So it still doesn’t fit. It also doesn’t make sense within the context of the plot, as Losira was trying to prevent the Enterprise from interfering, and throwing them 1000 light years away when they could just come back a few days later would clearly be – and was – ineffective.

The exploding dirt thing happened a lot in TOS, not just this episode. For some reason they had this habit of making things explode when a phaser would hit them, rather than melt or superheat (which would make more sense).

All that aside, I’m actually not a nitpicker. I can enjoy most things without the little errors bothering me. I think this episode was weak, plotwise, so the errors just make it that much worse.

152. Garovorkin - March 21, 2008

#151 Sean as much as I ve picked on this episode myself, and believe me i have not shown it any mercy in this regard, This episode had Possibilites, even with a reduced budget they could have done better with what they had. For example, the old Dr Who show which was filmed on tape and bargain basement special effects managed to come up with some inventive ways to tell good stories. Fred Freidberger was just not a very good televsion Producer. The first two seasons of trek had polish in editing,. and in story telling even the weak episodes from those first two seasons had better production then the strongest of the third season episode. Third season episodes were by comparison poorly edited inhaphazard, sloppy, I don’t understand why they didn’t give full executive duties to someone like Robert Justman or bring back Gene Coon, who was responsible for alot of the good things in the original series.

153. Enc - March 22, 2008

#151
-The exploding dirt thing happened a lot in TOS, not just this episode. For some reason they had this habit of making things explode when a phaser would hit them, rather than melt or superheat (which would make more sense).-

the plants might be poison but they had to get there water from some where. even if it wasnt water. some liquids could have been in the soil maybe even the rock. you hit it with a phaser on high and ‘boom’ instant explosive reaction.

154. Jeremy - June 23, 2008

Some of those women in the 60s were so hot.

155. mim - August 8, 2008

Point to ponder: If the Vulcan medical expert was in the episode of “Spock’s Brain” do you think it could be a bit more developed?

Just tossing around the tribble as it purrs to no end,or when it is dead, then you have a kapooted tribble, sorry.

Mim

156. Jerry - July 19, 2009

The directing and/or editing “That Which Survives” is also weird and disjointed. The scenes don’t flow with any rhythm and there are abrupt cuts, especially to the Enterprise, i guess to move the non-moving action along. Fascinating, if awful.

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