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Abrams: Star Trek More Than A Prequel May 9, 2008

by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: 1-18-08/Cloverfield,Abrams,Spoilers,Star Trek (2009 film) , trackback

In a very brief sidebar in the latest Rolling Stone magazine, director JJ Abrams is asked quick questions on Cloverfield, the Summer 2008 movie he is most looking forward to (X Files: I Want to Believe), his favorite website (SecretFunSpot.com) and one question on his upcoming Star Trek film.


On Trek…

Rolling Stone: What’s in store for your upcoming Star Trek movie?
Abrams: It looks at the formation of the core characters from Star Trek, so it serves as a prequel, but it’s also more than that.

More than a prequel?
Well that can have many meanings, but the simplest answer is that some of the film is actually not a prequel, but a sequel. [minor spoilers] TrekMovie.com has confirmed that the film starts in the post Star Trek Nemesis timeframe. This is where we initially find the elder Spock (played by Leonard Nimoy). So in a sense the film takes us from the end of the TNG era and brings us back to before the TOS era, showing the origins of Kirk and Spock and the crew of the NCC-1701.

Scan of Abrams sidebar interview…


Click to expand

Scan via NewFilmDimension.com

Comments

1. Cayce Pollard - May 9, 2008

damn. how long do those vulcans live?

2. Kirk, James T. - May 9, 2008

wonder if Jonathan Frakes’ visit to the Star Trek set was due to a small cameo onboard a ship called… the Titan!

3. Yang - May 9, 2008

The Titan would be bad-ass!

4. Hat Rick - May 9, 2008

SPOILERIFIC discussion:

Given that this is a rumored to be a time travel story, then the “more than that” part of it probably has to do with the fact that if something, or a series of things, doesn’t happen just right, then the proper timeline we all know and love could be different.

This sounds a bit like the premise of ST:First Contact.

5. DeBeckster - May 9, 2008

Wow! I’m the 4th message! I’ve never been this high before! Anyway, finally some clue as to the nature of the movie! I wish I didn’t have to wait another year to see it!

6. NCC-73515 - May 9, 2008

Yes, the Titan in the beginning and the 1701-E in the end… would be similar to IV, with the middle section in the past and the intro/epilogue in the future

7. AJ - May 9, 2008

Definitely gets the pulse racing.

I doubt Spock would be aboard the Titan.

If JJ references TNG at all, it’ll be Romulus or Vulcan. I honestly think the 24th century TNG references we’re hoping for will be non-existent.

8. AJ - May 9, 2008

Man…

I read these things, and I am SO EXCITED, then Sad that I read plot points.

I wanted to keep my opinion fresh, BUT Spoilers like that, are my Crack.

9. THX-1138 The Fandom Menace - May 9, 2008

#5

“I’ve never been this high before!”

If I had a dollar for everytime I said THAT in college.

Anyway, very interesting comments from JJ. Can’t wait to see this flick. And since this is a JJ thread with comments from him–Let the Hate Begin!

10. Mr. Bob Dobalina - May 9, 2008

Its a given that if Nimoy’s Spock is seen, it will be some point after his last appearance in Unification. Seeing as how VUlcans live a long long time that could be anwhere from the 24th century to the early 25th century. But I wouldn’t expect to see any familiar faces from the 24th century popping in to steal Nimoy’s thunder. He’ll start off there, then move about time…somehow…in search of this “Nero” character, to set things straight.

11. Commodore Lurker - May 9, 2008

Decloaking . . .
(sigh of relief) . . . Thanks Anthony for the <<>>. Between that microscopic tidbit and yesterday’s assurances from Bob Orci, I feel like a thousand Trek nightmares have been lifted from my shoulders.

I remember about six months ago when you had a poll about TOS-R. One of the responses was something like: “feel like my childhood is being raped.”

At the time I found that rather extreeme, but recently I’ve been feeling just like that. With this filmstarting after Nemesis connotes a level of complexity to the script that relievesalot (not all) of my “dumbed down” fears.

The question remainswhat story device is used to get Nimoy into the past: the GOF, slingshot around the sun, the Temporal Orb, a Romulan Quantum Singularity, a Space-Time Distortion, a new plot device, or Roddenberry forbid — some flakey Vulcan mystic ritual causing Spock to have an out of body astrial projection of his spiritual Katra???????

The answer to that question will determine the success and acceptance of this filmamong us Trek-o-maniacs.

IMHO.

Recloaking.

12. Bones Thugs & McCoy - May 9, 2008

Post Unification Spock could mean a peace brokered with the Romulans or, perhaps, a new WAR breaks out and the Titan needs to save the day — in a new Abrams-produced TV show. Blagagagagagga!

(unlikely but awesome scenario.)

13. CmdrR - May 9, 2008

Thanks for the update, Anthony.

What did the Romulans do to JJ’s face?

14. THX-1138 The Fandom Menace - May 9, 2008

BTW on the Art Asylum board forum, there is another “alleged” example of the Enterprise from the new movie. It does nod heavily to what was seen in the trailer, but I have serious doubts that it is legit. Cue the Romulan.

15. Harry Ballz - May 9, 2008

Post Nemesis??

Wow, live long and wrinkle!

16. SPB - May 9, 2008

WHAT I’M HOPING FOR IN TERMS OF “REBOOTING”…

I was thinking the other day that, ideally, this Abrams’ TREK reboot/re-imagining/prequel thingy would be akin to a film version of previous comic book “reboots” of the past, namely John Byrne’s run on the Fantastic Four and Superman; Frank Miller’s take on Daredevil and Batman; George Perez and Wonder Woman; and Walt Simonson’s version of Thor.

These writer/artists were able to find the perfect balance of paying tribute to the characters/storylines as they were originally conceived, yet expanding and enriching the characters and their origins… and at the same time, taking them to “the next level” and making them seem new and fresh for more modern readers.

THAT’S the type of approach I hope Abrams & Co. are taking with STAR TREK XI.

17. AJ - May 9, 2008

The question is: Is old Spock in the altered Kirk-less timeline when he makes the jump to the 23rd century, or does he go back to prevent the attack on Kirk which will lead to his being in the “proper” timeline?

We’re told we’ll see two Enterprises, one of which is a battleship, so maybe Kirk-less Old Spock has a Guinan ‘Yesterday’s Enterprise’ moment, and goes back to make it right.

18. Dennis Bailey - May 9, 2008

#14, THX-1137:

That’s actually by an artist who calls himself Jude Xavier, and it is indeed based upon the teaser trailer for ST XI.

The artist and others talk extensively about the design here:

http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=51129

19. Dave - May 9, 2008

We are clearly dealing with alternate universes here. I think the chances of a TNG cameo are decent. If it’s Patrick, it’s been a well-kept secret, and he must be working for peanuts. Frakes is probably your best bet. The nod to TNG will be small and short. Enough for those of us who want to see the 20 year journey of the crew of the Enterprise-D & E come to a respectable end, but not so much that non-Trekkies will scratch their heads or stubborn TOS facists will complain about TNG “ruining” at TOS film. I would also wager that there will be a tidbit regarding Unification.

I really do think that the new film is going to close the book on the last 40+ years of Trek and start fresh, without wiping the slate clean entirely. It is only appropriate for TNG to get a tiny spot in what should be a coda to Star Trek as we know it. It is definitely time to move forward, but let’s honor what has come before for a bit first.

20. ERik - May 9, 2008

Could this all be some means of modifying Shatner’s “The Return” and placing Spock on Veridian III remembering a past academy event that leads to Kirk’s return at the end?

21. Bob, the Evil Klingon Frontline Leader - May 9, 2008

#10 – Zilch. China clipper calling Alameda

22. Commodore Lurker - May 9, 2008

Decloaking . . .
19 Dave
I don’t have a problem with anything you suggest here. But ultimately, it’s how it works within the story and what the resolution is. And whether or not WE all walk out of the theater going: “Wow, that was frackin’ cool. I’m going to go see that ten more times.” Or if we walk out shaking our heads like we did at the end of ST: V, Insurrection, and Nemesis.

It’s fine with an old timer like me if JJ’s Supreme Court creates an entirely new Timeline for the Federation and everything we know as Canon. Just as long as it works, it’s satisfying, and above all to me — it’s not stupid!

Damn, “Everytime I get out, you guys pull me right back in.” That’s why I love TrekMovie.com.
Recloaking.

23. Christopher Waldrop - May 9, 2008

Is it just me or is there a little too much emphasis on history? I have a little bit of a problem with prequels, simply because they’re aiming at a known end. Even if this is a “reboot” and, as Abrams has said, not aimed at Star Trek fans, we still know basically where it’s headed. In some ways Enterprise was a reboot too. Yeah, I know, the last two films were pretty disappointing, and any concerns I have aren’t going to stop me from going to see the new film.

24. THX-1138 The Fandom Menace - May 9, 2008

#18 Dennis

I kind of thought that it was fan made, but it looked pretty decent. I for one wouldn’t be disappointed in this design if it was like the chosen E. I have yet to read your link but will check it out after I hit say it.

Two things for you: What is your take on it and why did you short change me, ‘bro? I thought I was at least one better.

25. Dennis Bailey - May 9, 2008

Oh, the 37/38 thing – sorry, that took me a moment.

I think Jude Xavier is tremendously talented, but I think that the portions of the design that he couldn’t deduce from the trailer – most of the engineering hull and parts of the saucer – will probably turn out to be changed a great deal more than he posits in his take on it.

26. Kobayashi_Maru - May 9, 2008

I’ve been pretty excited about this…but you guys bringing up the TITAN and all that…just got me to a level 10 or so…

it’s coming out this summer right? I don’t have to wait another year right?

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

27. THX-1138 The Fandom Menace - May 9, 2008

From reading Jude’s comments, he seemed to agree with your asessment. But for the rest of it, I could see it on the big screen.

As for the name thing, it reminds me of a line I usually say to folks when they ask me If I play the tenor (I’m a sax player, for those who don’t know).

My response is “Tenor, twelver, whatever it takes.” ala Mr. Mom. It usually takes about a minute for that one to sink in.

28. Dr. Image - May 9, 2008

25 Dennis- I hope so. That thing looks awful clunky. Almost 60′s Soviet!

29. J C - May 9, 2008

Gee.So elder Spock is going back in time to save Kirk ? Save young Kirk but not ‘Generations’ Kirk?
Question; Why would they save young Kirk and neglect to save old Kirk?
Answer;There’s much more to lose if a young Kirk dies.
However, If you’re fixing one Kirk death scenario (Romulans go back in time to kill young Kirk)it just begs the question as to why you don’t save elder Kirk.
Something just doesn’t add up.

30. J C part 2 - May 9, 2008

I think maybe that’s why JJ said it’s a ‘prequel’ but also something else.(sequel of sorts to “Generations”?)

31. Hat Rick - May 9, 2008

30, I think that if it were, then it wouldn’t make sense NOT to have Shatner in it, since he could play the older Kirk. Presumably he’d be rescued through use of the Nexus. That’s the sequel to Generations that I think a lot of people would like to see.

At least if it were that kind of reboot.

32. DJT - May 9, 2008

Okay. My first reaction is WOOO HOO!! TNG!!!

Second reaction is ….wait-a-minute…. using the word Nemesis makes me throw up a little in my mouth everytime. So by saying post Nemesis, I start to cringe.

Yes, I do want to see LN, but how will they reconcile the two universes of in regards to the post TNG movie look with the new Abramsverse look ?

33. AJ - May 9, 2008

Young Spock plants the suggestion “Don’t go to the Ent-B Inaugural cruise” to young Kirk, and STG gets winked out of existence.

34. garen - May 9, 2008

i guess i’ve assumed from the beginning (at least as far back when we learned that old spock would travel backwards through time) that the movie would technically be based…or at least start in a post nemesis timeframe.

The Titan, along with Capt. Riker would be so awesome!….however…i doubt we’ll see that.

at the VERY least i want there to be at least some mention of the progress made toward peace between the federation and the romulans….they need to acknowledge both the progress that spock has made over the years as well as the progress made at the end of Nemesis…the titans’s first mission….ie “the romulans are interested in talking.”

agreement?

35. Brian - May 9, 2008

It’d be cool to see Frakes make a cameo, but that’s about it. This is about TOS, not TNG. A little nod to it is cool but nothing more.

36. Dr. Wh-at now?! - May 9, 2008

So…we’re stuck in another time loop?

TNG -> TOS -> TNG

Where’s the exit ramp for the Office of Temporal Investigations?

Maybe it’s in the TARDIS, behind the wardrobe perhaps…

Spock!

37. garen - May 9, 2008

here’s another thought…just for fun.

if the movie actually begins post nemesis than we can guess at a couple of ideas for the ending of the movie….at least as far as the ending concerning “old” spock.

he either A) makes it back to his orginal timeframe at the end of the movie.
or B) is still alive at the end of the film but stuck somewhere in the past along the timeline…or finally C) the old spock character dies in this film…most likely on his adventures in the past.

38. XMind - May 9, 2008

200.35 years

39. Saad - May 9, 2008

Vulcans can live up to 300 years at least.

40. Andrew - May 9, 2008

Shatner is in the movie

41. SPB - May 9, 2008

AND THAT CARTOON OF ABRAMS IS TERRIBLE.

That ain’t J.J. Abrams… that’s Jack Osbourne!

42. Green-Blooded-Bastard - May 9, 2008

I wouldn’t have an issue at all with seeing Frakes in the film as captain of the Titan. Matter of fact, I dare say that might kick a little ass!

43. Alex Rosenzweig - May 9, 2008

Another take on the quote: Yes, it’s a prequel, and it’s also a sequel, but it’s also a reintroduction, a jumping-on point for potential new fans, and it’s also the “beginning” story that each of the other series got but TOS never did. So, based on that, could it be fair to call it “more than” a prequel? Arguably so.

44. Wesley's bunkmate - May 9, 2008

I’m just getting hideous flashbacks to the launch of Enterprise whe Brannon said “Yeah, it’s a prequel but it also has elements that will serve as a sequel” Nooooooooooooooooooooooooo!!!

Obviously way cooler people are now involved but the sentiments were the same.

45. CanuckLou - May 9, 2008

Excellent!

….the adventure continues….

46. Jeffrey S. Nelson - May 9, 2008

18. Dennis Bailey

Looks like a clunky design to me…more like Jules Verne than Trek. Matt Jefferies has gotta be rolling over in the subspace ether.

47. weeharry - May 9, 2008

29. Gee.So elder Spock is going back in time to save Kirk ? Save young Kirk but not ‘Generations’ Kirk?
Question; Why would they save young Kirk and neglect to save old Kirk?
Answer;There’s much more to lose if a young Kirk dies.
However, If you’re fixing one Kirk death scenario (Romulans go back in time to kill young Kirk)it just begs the question as to why you don’t save elder Kirk.
Something just doesn’t add up.

i agree with your first point but disagree with the second

1 he’s pursuing nero, whose target is the young kirk. why would nero try to kill old kirk? – I can’t see how that would change the timeline favourably towards the romulans.

2 if we assume the reason spock travels to the past is indeed in pursuit of nero, and despite the fact there have been umpteen time travel storylines over the past 40 years, the basic assumption is that time travel and changing the past is “a bad thing” – i don’t think spock would consider it logical to risk time travel even to save his friend – someone who it should be noted had lived a long and full life.

just because some fans would like to see shatner involved and disagree with the way his death was handled, if this is the way the movie is going then shoe horning shatner into the script just to appease fans would probably weaken the end product.

i do think they should try and get shatner to do the ‘space…the final frontier’ voiceover though

48. Dom - May 9, 2008

The era Old Spock travels back from could be way after the TNG era. Hopefully the new film will make a few changes to the timeline. Best thing they could do is kill of one of the old crew in this film, meaning that everyone’s future is up in the air!

As for TNG cameos: yuck! This is a film about the original crew. TNG characters in this film run the risk of stinking it up, the same way having TOS characters in Generations didn’t work! One thing Roddenberry was right about is that you don’t directly mix TNG and TOS: they’re just too different!

49. sirbroiler - May 9, 2008

i’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again.

Shatner blew his shot by doing Generations, simply for the paycheck. Ding. dong, old Kirk is dead!!! If he pops up in this movie – I’ll actually stand up and boo!!!

Now, if Riker shows up at the helm of the Titan – then SWEET!!!

I’m all for a reboot!

50. shat hands - May 9, 2008

Whilst I am going to watch this movie at the cinema, then buy it on every available format, and then watch it to my machines grind to a halt in a spluttering mini fireworks display that would make lilliput green with envy, i am starting to worry about the ‘totally different’.

How is the switching from post TNG to pre TOS going to come across on the screen? I’d hate to see a huge contrast of styles regarding set,or worst a change of camera! Hey sorry maybe that could work but it would have to be so slick.

Also a wise man from another thread said JJ is great at starting things but not to hot at seeing things through so i worry for the future….. maybe im just being a nervous suitor waiting for the first date!

Moreover I appreciate the hard work being put into the movie because i believe it is no mean feat in bringing the TREK we all love to the masses.

I just wait for the day that my close friends no longer look at me uncertainly when I say KHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAANNNN!

51. shat hands - May 9, 2008

sorry too hot

52. siv - May 9, 2008

We keep going for a temporal solution. Why not just a simple flashback while LN remembers how it all began at the academy as he goes out to the Forge for his his final walk into the sunset after a emergency dash back to vulcan on the Titan

53. Nick S. - May 9, 2008

I think it’ll be less temporal and involve a mind-meld. The fact that it’s focusing around a vulcan makes that increasingly possible.

54. shat hands - May 9, 2008

#51

mere flashbacks wont cut it i feel,its sci-fi so would your not exploit the vast possibilities?

55. shat hands - May 9, 2008

would you not!

sorry totally shat hands tonight

56. David P - May 9, 2008

Rolling Stone should have grilled him on the Shat situation

57. Anthony Pascale - May 9, 2008

David P

there is something familiar about you

…anyway…time to let it go

58. sebimeyer - May 9, 2008

Nice. A complex story would definitelz be better than the recent “I am bad. Now stop me” storylines the last few movies had.

59. Rooty Kazooty - May 9, 2008

Star Trek: The Next Generation ended as per the episode “All Good Things”, followed by Star Trek: First Contact…THE END.

James T. Kirk never died falling off of a rickety canyon bridge.

Captain James T. Kirk died heroically, at the helm of a mirror-universe USS Enterprise-A, single-handedly and expertly out-manouvering over 100 enemy star ships lead by Tolian Soran and an alliance of Klingon and Romulan conspirators. Kirk teamed with Captain Picard, who commanded the Enterprise-D and the entire TNG crew in an epic starship battle. Kirk saved the known universe by sacrifying his life when he destroyed the enemy fleet with a combination of self-distruct auto-sequence, space-time-continuum manipulation and wicked starship Tokyo Slide. Even Ambassador Spock broke his month-long meditation to say that his former commanding officer and friend of many years “blowed up real good”.

Everyone on ST:TNG lived Happily Ever After and Data Never Died. He lives on in the future as Lucasian Professor of Mathematics at Cambridge University, just as he did in “All Good Things”….B4 NEVER, EVER existed. Neither did of “Star Trek: Nemesis”…..Everything after “Star Trek: First Contact” is dead to me, except for Riker and Troi getting married and moving on to the Titan….Don’t even mention “Insurrection”

60. Daoud - May 9, 2008

I looked out next summer and the ship was clean
Turned on Trek music to start my day
I lost myself in a familiar theme
I closed my eyes and I slipped away

Its more than a prequel,
when I hear that old song they used to play (more than a prequel)
I begin dreaming (more than a prequel)
till I see Enterprise change away
I see my Enterprise warpin’ away

So much Berman has come and gone
His shows fade as the years go by
Yet “TOS” I recall as I wander on
As clear as the “E” in Christopher’s sky

Its more than a prequel…

When I’m tired and thinking old
I hide in my music, forget the day
And dream of a ship I used to know
I closed my eyes and she warped away
She warped away. She warped away.

Its more than a prequel…

61. james t. bert - May 10, 2008

Its more than a prequel
-JJ Abrams

Yes it is more than a prequel and sequel.
It is a Interquel.

62. subatoi - May 10, 2008

Post Nemesis is also post everything, even VOY, according to Memory Alpha, which may be even more symbolic.

63. Enc - May 10, 2008

sorry no riker or titan please. itll just remind fans of the lst ENT ep and bring up bad memories. only to be yes looks good for the fan base that happens to know of the titan storiees and the end of the last film and so on. not exatly someting you want in a tos film aimed at a non trek audiance.

sure i would like it but i still say no.

#53
no mind meld please. the mind is a tricky thing. remember what happened to tuvoks mind in flashback. did demitri die or not. its all just what someone thinks happened and not what realy happened. its the same witht the last ep ENT. a holodeck recreation of the events some 200 years later hopeing history was recorded accurately. and holodecks can be tricky themselves. someone to defeat data (not holmes), and jordie (agian) giving and recieving mixed signals from a girl in the holodeck based on the computers info that was not complete.
sorry. but I say no to the mindmeld idea.

64. AJ - May 10, 2008

Anthony:

Your introduction to the thread, confirming the film’s starting point (post-Nemesis), implies that the film takes place in that universe and timeline, and that there may be references to TNG-era Trek.

Is that true, or is it just “Spock is so old, it must be the 25th century.”?

While many here would love to see Spock go ’round the sun in the Titan and slingshot back to the TOS era (I am not one of them), I would expect visual references to Berman’s 24th century Trek will be quite sparse to non-existent, so as not to pigeonhole any future re-imaginings of this period into a particular design or set of rules.

It’ll most likely be Spock on Vulcan, or Spock in some non-descript white room with Time Machine, or doing a slingshot in his own shuttle, or even the much-feared “Obi-Wan” spirit guide concept (please, God..No.).

I would not get my hopes up for a “post-Nemesis” fanboy Trek experience.

65. Sisko's Shrimp Gumbo - May 10, 2008

Yeah I think a lot of people inferred that at least some part of it would take place TNG-era (naturally post-Nemesis) when it was announced Nimoy would be in it (the whole Reunification arc). No TNG/DS9/VOY cameos probably though, but [minor spoilers] Samuel L Jackson showed up after the credits in Iron Man so anything’s possible.

66. James T. Bert - May 10, 2008

I’m sorry I forgot to add a question mark

Yes it is more than a prequel and sequel.
It is a Interquel?

seeing the real J.J. Enterprise , I have to add that the Jude Xavier’s artwork is not close, But I Love it.

I think the Jude Xavier’s designs and Dennis Bailey’s Designs are some of the best designs I have seen in 30 years. I think their designs are better than NCC-1701-D, NX-01 and Voyager.
I would love to see Star Trek: TNG remastered with Jude Xavier’s Re-Designs and Dennis Bailey’s Re-Designs.

67. Admiral_Bumblebee - May 10, 2008

I still think it would be great if the movie would open with the Unification of Romulus and Vulcan. Spock finally managed what he worked for for so long. But some Romulans (Nero and his gang) do not like this, as they think this weakens the once so powerful Romulan Empire. So they travel back in time to prevent the Unification by destroying Vulcan…

68. DJT - May 10, 2008

X-Files, huh? Interesting.

69. AJ - May 10, 2008

67:

Admiral:

Can you imagine your scenario being a minor subplot in a TOS prequel? It would be like Nemesis: “Let’s kill of the entire Romulan Senate in the first 5 minutes so we can kick-start the main story.” The story of the downfall of Romulus would have been far more interesting than the dreck we got in Nemesis.

I think we know that old Spock travels back in time to mentor young Spock, and foster his bond with young Kirk to protect him from Nero, as his life and career are vital to the “proper” timeline.

Your scenario is a film in itself, or an entire season of Trek. Or it would require an endless Star Wars-style text spacecrawl, which would probably be as incoherent and unreadable to punters as the ones from SW I-III.

It would be better to have visual cues to imply that the unification occurred, but which will not mean much to the average filmgoer. As 24th (or 25th) century Romulans figure heavily in the film, JJ will probably throw old Spock into their introduction piece. If we see Spock on Romulus, the fans will know why, and new viewers won’t care.

Anyway, we’ll see!

70. Enc - May 10, 2008

#67
stop unification by destriying vulcan? how does kirk fit in then?
no. if you want to stop unification you go back 2000 years and stop surak and allow the separatist to stay and rule their romulan state on vulcan. no need for any party to involve kirk. and if you would want or need kirk wouldnt spock choose a more experianced late tos kirk instead of a pre-tos kirk.

#69
maybe nero is the praetor from bot :)

71. snake - May 10, 2008

So in Generations TOS characters and era ‘cameod’ to hand over to TNG characters and era in order to kick off their film series

now it looks like it could be the reverse..

awesome! the circle is complete

72. The Last Maquis - May 10, 2008

#22. Commodore Lurker

Hey, you finally fixed that “Fracking” Problem, It’s about Fracking time!!
I think that dude, uh “Jude X” and his Judemen, are Probably Close To The movie Design, But he’s Forgetting The whole perspective thing, That’s why He insisted on the Over Sized nacelles, and Wing things, I’ll wager they’re a lot Smaller on the Movie version. also The Titan?, Come on…..No way. But an alternate Defiant Enterprise would rock.

73. justcorbly - May 10, 2008

Late to this, but…

Spock is alive and well during TNG. No reason he wouldn’t b alive and well after Nemesis. He certainly is in the novels.

In any case, you need initially to position Nimoy/Spock at some point in time. Postioning him at a time already covered by the films opens potential canon problems. Putting him after Nemesis allows JJ to ceate his own canon, and also allows an older Nimoy to play an older Spock.

I wouldn’t be surprised to see or hear references to TNG characters or events. After all, we need to be made to understand where and when Spock is living. Less likely, it seems to me, is an actual appearance by a TNG’er. Still, odds are Spock will need help to set in motion whatever scheme he sets out on. I wouldn’t be surprised to see a TNG’er’s face show up on a communication device.

74. colonyearth - May 10, 2008

Ok…I usually try to read everyone’s posts before posting, but this time I only skimmed a few.

This news, as it is, falls somewhat in line with what I believe will be done with the film.

The problem in most everyone’s posts here and elsewhere is that most people tend to jump to extremes. IE: They’re going to wipe out the entire history of Trek and start a totally new timeline or something like that.

It doesn’t have to be extreme and in fact it would be better if it weren’t. JJ, et al, have repeatedly stated that this is not a “reboot” or “reimagining” or a “reinvention” as those terms don’t really fully apply to what they’re doing.

Use some common sense and simple deductive reasoning and what you’ll come up with, given the scant we know of this film’s plotline, and you can surmise something along these lines:

Post Nemisis Spock (if that is indeed true) goes back in time to stop a plot to assasinate Kirk. He jumps to various moments in time, perhaps not even in control of his movement through time, and attempts to stop each attempt on Kirk. However, during these attempts minor…MINOR…alterations occur in the timeline that, in the end, don’t destroy all we know of what came after, but does create some wiggle room in the timeline that allows for re-envisionment to take place.

Kirk’s ENT doesn’t look exactly as it did in TOS, perhaps Kirk and Marcus never had David, Chekov becomes a bridge officer immediately, Pike is never wounded in his herioc efforts…the list of possible minor changes could go on and the explanation can be used to always explain differences in old Trek and the new post JJ Trek. Perhaps the reason we’ve never seen anything about Gary Mitchell in the casting is because he’s one of the casualities of a minor alteration.

These are alterations that Spock is either unaware of immediately or is unable to repair for some reason. Perhaps the more he does to “fix” things only makes them worse.

The end result of all of this is an epic story spanning several decades that launches a new beginning with the ability to be fresh and not so tied to canon.

Suffice it to say to all the canonistas out there, these alterations could also work for canon. Events we know happened could still happen just as we remember them when we need them to. Kirk could still blow up the computers on Eminiar 7 (not sure of that spelling) or Spock could still sponsor Saavik and Valeris for the Academy or bigger or smaller events like that could still happen exactly as they did.

What this does is it keeps the universe still the universe but allows the creative minds the room they need to bring in new ideas and stories and make Trek fresher and more “real” as JJ put it.

This is a brilliant move and IMO exactly what they’re doing. It’s not an all or nothing thing here, folks. It can be give and take.

And for your die-hard Shatner fans, it could even be a way of bringing Kirk back in the future. For all we know, Spock makes it back to his time in the future and after he arrives we hear a voice off-screen…

KIRK (Off screen): “Welcome home, Spock. (Spock raises a quizzical and for him, someone surprised eyebrow) Spock? How did it go?”

SPOCK: “Very well, apparently. Fascinating.”

END CREDITS

We never “see” Shatner, but we hear him and now we know that whatever happened then, due to the minor alterations in the timeline, Kirk is alive in Spock’s TNG era, perhaps having not died on Veridian III (please, that was the worst movie death ever and so in vain!).

While I’m not a Shattite like so many here who think he has to be in the film or it’ll be crap and while I’ll be just fine with no Shat at all in it and while I’m not a Trek conspiracist that Shat is secretly in the film or trying to work out how he can be in it…I will say this…his supposed “outrage” at not being in it is not all it appears. He might have been shocked at first, but he knows storytelling as well as anyone else in Hollywood and knows he killed Kirk off…that is that. He would understand what they were trying to do. In that vein, he would support the film however he could.

Well let me tell you controversy sells. His feigned outrage at not being in the film got buzz going on it early on and so fast that the internet couldn’t even keep up. You can’t buy publicity like that, folks! So there is a chance…ever so small it may be…that he will make a cameo at the very end somehow in a scenario not unlike what I stated above.

I’m not saying it will be…so don’t jump to conclusions. I’m simply stating how it could be…were it to be. And it’s pretty much the only way it could be.

As Spock is fond of saying: “There are always…possibilities.”

I would not expect to see TNG cast, though. This will launch from Romulus most likely, which is where we last left Spock. There may be some power struggle taking place post-Nemesis in the Romulan government that causes the events to be set in motion, but I wouldn’t expect the time in the TNG era to be very long at all. This is a TOS film. I also wouldn’t be surprised if the time travel events were something they (or at least Spock) cannot completely control which will allow an explanation for why he can’t fix everything.

And as for this being like FC…yes in some small way, but I expect there will be considerable differences enough that that similarity doesn’t play through much if at all. The Borg going back was silly and seemed not to be thought out (or else they would’ve just done it from Borg space and the Federation never would’ve known their history was changed as in Yesterday’s Enterprise).

No, I fully expect this to be much better thought out and more interestingly played out on a much more epic scale!

Even Nimoy has stated he’s never seen a Trek film this big and sweeping. I see visionary and epic written all over it!

CE

75. colonyearth - May 10, 2008

Ok I posted but don’t know why it didn’t show up so here goes again:

Am I the only won who caught this little exchange?

“56. David P – May 9, 2008
Rolling Stone should have grilled him on the Shat situation

57. Anthony Pascale – May 9, 2008
David P

there is something familiar about you

…anyway…time to let it go”

Anthony!? Is there something you’re not telling us?! What do you know?!

Perhaps my little idea (which, really, is the only way Shat can possibly ever be in this film) could be….true? Hmmmm?

I’m not saying it is, but that is how I would do it and I’m a writer/filmmaker myself. And if I were JJ, I would do that just to give the fans a little surprise. But then…I’m not JJ and really am not sure what your little tete-a-tete with David P. was about there, but it was………curious.

Anything you have to say?

CE

76. Dom - May 10, 2008

Although Nimoy comes from the post-Nemesis timeframe, I wouldn’t be surprised if we open in the TOS era and older Spock is already there. Then at some point in the film we’ll get a flashback/flashforward to the older Spock making his journey back in time.

Realistically, you wouldn’t want to see any TNG-era designs or actors, as that would limit any future ‘renewal’ of TNG.

If they are going to ‘go epic’ with this movie and future Star Treks, there’s no reason they couldn’t do a a Godfather II-style intertwining of the new TOS characters and a recast TNG crew in a subsequent film.

77. Mr. Poopey face(formerly known as Closettrekker) - May 10, 2008

#75–GFII is my favorite movie of all time. I love that style, and it fits well with what JJ and co. have done with “Lost”. It seems like a plausible scenario to me.

78. I Am Morg Not Eymorg - May 10, 2008

21: Zilch! Never mind the furthermore, the plea is self defense.

79. the king in shreds and tatters - May 10, 2008

Abrams, dude, they got together in like the 6th season. I know, it got crappy, but still.

80. AJ - May 10, 2008

I don’t think Spock’s trip back will involve Starfleet at all, so we will not see familiar Starfleet designs or people from the 24th century.

It will be a personal mission for Ambassador/Praetor/Civilian Spock to save Kirk, and perhaps Romulus/the quadrant from Nero’s plan.

Godfather II…Who plays Guido?

1. Garrett Wang
2. Ethan Philips
3. Wil Wheaton
4. Gates McFadden
5. Aron Eisenberg
6. Rick Berman
7. Dwight Schulz
8. Matt Frewer
9. The entire cast and crew of Enterprise (except Manny Coto)
10. William Shatner

Loaded question!
.

81. section9 - May 10, 2008

I know exactly what they are going to do in the sequel:

Bring back Joanne Linville to take revenge on Old Spock for cuckolding her in “The Enterprise Incident”.

After all, she had to have been stripped of her command and sent to labor camp on Remus. One has to assume that the Romulans do not suffer fools gladly. I betcha they keep Old Spock alive just to tie up that loose end.

82. diabolk - May 10, 2008

Jude’s extrapolation artwork here:
http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg178/judexavier/STXINCC-17013View.jpg

I’m betting ths design, based on what we saw in the shipbuilding sequence is an EARLIER version for Pike’s ship, and will be more refined by the time we see the start of the Kirkian five year mission, looking more like the one we know, with more detail. This looks like a prequel ship.

83. Mr. Poopey face(formerly known as Closettrekker) - May 10, 2008

#81–I have long been a proponent of a similar storyline, although I don’t think it will happen…but just for fun:

Nero is the “love child” of Spock and the Romulan Commander, who was stripped of her status and punished due to Spock’s betrayal of her. Finally, she is scheduled for execution after it is discovered that not only did she lose the cloaking device, but she became pregnant with a son as a result of her foolishness. Still, she temporarily escapes and secures Nero’s safety. Eventually, she is caught and executed, but young Nero escapes. His hatred of his absentee father drives him to hatch a plan to change the outcome of the Enterprise’s mission to steal the cloaking device and kill the man he blames for his place in Romulan society and the fate of his mother. Older Spock must face this challenge while bearing the guilt associated with his own actions as First Officer of the Enterprise, as well as the knowledge that he has a son he never knew. The story would involve several timeline incursions at different periods, with both Spock and Nero acting in service of their own respective agendas—Nero to exact revenge upon his father and the Enterprise, and Spock to protect what he can of the timeline and the lives of his shipmates. Ultimately, Spock either mostly restores the original timeline events but makes sure that Nero is never conceived, or he wisks the baby away (after a meeting with the fugitive former Romulan Cmdr.) to safety within the Federation. I like that resolution and the possibility of an understanding between Older Nero and Older Spock…Perhaps Nero sees himself as a baby and even speaks to his mother, who convinces him to trust the father he has hated all his life and submit to this new timeline, where he will grow up as a 1/4 human, 1/4 Vulcan, and 1/2 Romulan citizen of the UFP.

Either that, or Older Spock convinces younger Spock that he should bring a Starfleet issued condom aboard the Romulan vessel…

Won’t happen, but I like the concept of a revenge story involving Spock as opposed to Kirk (which has been done more than once).

84. Mr. Poopey face(formerly known as Closettrekker) - May 10, 2008

Addendum to #83—-By the way, while he’s travelling back in time and all, perhaps Spock once again poses as Cousin Selek and sneaks into baby Sybok’s cribroom and smothers his face with a pillow….just a thought.

85. DFG333 - May 10, 2008

Vulcan’s can live up to 250 years.

86. WRATH - May 10, 2008

Post Nemesis,
A year between now and release
All the focus on the shat,

Anyone else hoping that a Patrick Stewart cameo has plenty of time to film? Spock trusts Picard, maybe Picard can help his journey…

A man can dream.

87. Captain Robert April - May 10, 2008

Yeah, yeah, very nice, SHOW US THE DAMN SHIP ALREADY!!

88. T'Leisha - May 10, 2008

It worries me about how tight lipped they are being about this whole movie. Aside from the teaser it doesnt feel like they’ve given us much. They just need to show us SOMETHING.
Its frustrating.

89. Xai - May 10, 2008

#87
Yeah, swearing always gets me to do something.

#88
It’s a year away… they can’t show stuff yet.

90. Daimyo Nintendo - May 10, 2008

probably already said but, vulcans live well past 200 years, some 270+!
so an elder Spock would be around 2440 and that is way past the nemesis
TNG 2379 era. Spock in the TNG era is not really elder yet, in the 2 unification episodes Spock would have not yet been considered elder by Vulcan standards. So for us trekheads for the movie to begin past 2379 and go back to the 2260′s would be very cool.

91. Cayce Pollard - May 10, 2008

I think you guys really need to chill out about getting more info about the movie. It will come in time when they feel it’s needed. We just had Spock and Spock on stage together, with Nimoy stating how he really believes this Trek is a good one overall.

I am sure we will get more info at Comic Con in July, too.

Relax a little and enjoy the ride with JJ Abrams. Also, keep in mind that this might be a 2-3 movie deal if it does well in the box office next summer. It’s worth the wait.

92. Andy Patterson - May 10, 2008

That minor spoiler doesn’t surprise me. I had assumed something along these lines. Time travel, flashbacks…showing how things unfolded. It all seems ….logical.

93. Jack - May 10, 2008

again, hoping it has nothing in common with the please-the-fans, more-of-the-same animitronic ride that the Berman trek franchise became. From those aintitcoolnews reviews, it looks like some folks think happened to the new Indiana Jones flick — too many wink, wink; nudge nudge references (“look here’s the ark”). Superman Returns is on cable right now… again, the dangers of sticking slavishly to canon is all becomes a big “what’s-the-point” retread. For me, once you start quibbling about the calendar dates and the coordinates – well, Star Trek stops being smart and entertaining.

Personally, I think Galaxy Quest was a better trek movie than Nemesis or Insurrection.

If they’re smart, we’ll see nothing at all until at least 6 months before its release.

94. Battletrek - May 11, 2008

Wow, we’ve been speculating what this movie is about for 2 years already! We still have a year to go. Good night.

95. Battletrek - May 11, 2008

i am so tired of reading about no news with this film. I’m done with it.

96. Enc - May 11, 2008

#83
sorry but i cant escape thinking ’bout tasha as i reead your story.

bow as to that cute litlle sybok bit. iirc was theree a comic that had savvik 1/2 romulan and adopted by sarek?

97. Page 2 | /Film - May 11, 2008

[...] Before we take a trip back in time, JJ Abrams’ Star Trek actually begins sometime after 2002’s Star Trek: Nemesis, as Ambassador Spock (Leonard Nimoy) returns from Romulan space. [TrekMovie] [...]

98. Mr. Bob Dobalina - May 11, 2008

#78 Zilch!

It is, in my opinion, that the people are intending.

99. John - May 11, 2008

Bit worried about this sequal/prequal thing. If it does indeed start off post TNG, then it’s part of the established (I HATE using the word, but…) canon.

If the Leonard Nimoy spock goes back in time for whatever reason, then the time he goes back to must surely look more like the 60s Star Trek then is (or has reported to be) the case. How can he go back in time to an era which suddenly looks different from that portrayed in the series, UNLESS it is an alternative universe, timeline – whatever.

I hope this is addressed in some form – must say I don’t envy JJ or the writers – they have a HUGE task going back to the Kirk era Star Trek. Are they going to pretend the 60s series didn’t happen the way it happened, or will th e60s series get another makeover at some point so the Enterprise looks like the one in the film to tie it all together?

AGHHHH soooo many questions for a Star Trek geek ;)

Peace!

- John

100. That One Guy - May 11, 2008

It is in agreement that we all want to see Titan. It would be nice to get at least Riker back on the set for a brief shot. And as for an earlier comment about it “being highly unlikely that Spock would be on Titan” is not entirely true. If I’m not mistaken, Titan focuses heavily on Romulus, which is also where Spock is, I think. I’m recalling my details from well over a year ago, so I could be shaky.

If Spock were in Romulan space, along with the Titan, it wouldn’t be too unlikely.

Of course, there is nothing that says that this takes place on Titan. It could very well take place on Earth, Voyager, DS9, or in a spacesuit floating around for no other reason than because he can… because he’s SPOCK. He might also be overseeing the repairs to 1701-E after the Reman Incident. He might also be talking to Commander Donatra on Romulus.

I’m going to place my money on that he’s on a ship talking to either Admiral Ross, Janeway, or Hayes. Either that or talking with Captain Picard, Chakotay, or Kira.

101. cayce pollard - May 11, 2008

#95…something tells me that you’ll be the first in line

haha

102. star trackie - May 12, 2008

#100 “It is in agreement that we all want to see Titan.”

..well, not all of us exactly.

103. richpit - May 12, 2008

This is the first negative thing (IMO) that I’ve read about this movie. Why can’t they just leave it as a TOS movie and not bring in TNG-ish things?

Don’t get me wrong, I’m a huge fan of TNG…but I wanted this movie to be TOS from a “new” perspective.

104. Andrew Overlord - May 12, 2008

This film is looking to be quasi-canon. It’ll have the same TNG era, but a totally new TOS era.

How many hardcore fans will this piss off?

A lot.

*sharpens butter knife*

….

*distracted by passing ice-cream truck*

105. David Joecks - May 12, 2008

Heres a idea. Remember in the TOS mirror universe when kirk tells spock that one man can change the future? What if mirror universe spock goes after a enemy in the mirror universe and chases this nero guy into the other universe? What if nero is trying to change what our universe kirk said to him by wiping him out entirely? Its just an idea. I dont know how relevant it is but it would be a cool idea.

106. Enc - May 12, 2008

#105
no kirk told spock that oine man can change the present.
mirror spock chase mirror nero to our universe. bad idea to start.
ok we THINK nero is a romulan only ’cause nero was a roman nut.
ok in the mirror universe vulcans are the agrresives so by mirror universe rules romulans would be the peace full type. the roles reversed.
a peaceful man nero wants to further his life thru any means neccasry reesulting death of many, resulting in kirks death.
ive heard this storey before it was generations.

107. Battletrek - May 13, 2008

JJ must like the Bee Gees-
More than a prequel, You are more than a prequel to me

108. colonyearth - May 13, 2008

100 – That One Guy

Dont’ hold your breath on any of it. I’d hate to see you pass out and hit your head on something pointy.

For you folks thinking there’s going to be some mass TNG era stuff in this film…give it up. And for those afraid of the same…don’t be afraid.

This film will have minimal if any real TNG era material in it. If there is a period of time spent in that era it will be first be very short and second be very non-descript. This is a TOS film and JJ, et al, have repeatedly stated that.

Again with the 10 second cat memories. Hmph!

CE

109. GASHAM - May 14, 2008

Abrams: It looks at the formation of the core characters from Star Trek, so it serves as a prequel, but it’s also more than that.

You know…. the more I read about the new star trek movie the more I think it is NOT a time-traveling with old spock traveling back to PRE-TOS time.

I think the new star trek is going to be like this:
Ultimate Marvel is reinvisioning of the Marvel Universe, taking place in a different universe (Earth-1610) to the mainstream Marvel Universe (Earth-616).

110. Dom - May 14, 2008

Hi John (99)

You simply have to approach the film with the view that the early TOS era designs look different because they’re as designed in a big budget 2008 theatrical film, rather than a low budget 1960s TV show. It’s the concept that’s the most important thing.

As for all this garbage about canon: the easiest thing to do is relax about it and enjoy the movie. Part of the fun about being a fan is making up reasons to explain the inconsistencies then discuss them. Who wants everything served up on a plate and explained ad nauseum?!

Personally I see it the way Gasham (109) does: Ultimate Star Trek.

I took the same approach to TNG and its stablemates: if TOS is the equivalent of Earth-616, then TNG is a separate continuity that uses aspects of the ’616′ tales as backstory, but isn’t exactly the same (Roddenberry stated that he was quite happy to take a revisionist approach to Trek history in TNG and indeed he and his successors did contradict TOS on more than one occasion!)

That way, I can see the original TOS continuity conclude with Kirk and crew heading out into deep space at the end of STVI, which suits me fine.

‘Ultimate Star Trek’ can be a cool, contemporary retelling of TOS informed by TOS but not bound by any of the subsequent continuities. Hopefully, at least one of the supporting cast, Sulu, Chekov or whoever will be killed off in this film, making sure that we can see the new crew in mortal peril at any time!!

111. AJ - May 14, 2008

110 Dom:

I do not think JJ has to kill characters off to put the crew in mortal peril. He should find a more creative way to separate the new TOS crew from the old. UNLESS he kills off Kirk.

For us, we could survive the deaths of any of the “supporting” cast, especially with a stable of new actors playing them. I actually thought a while back that Spock was coming back in time to compensate for events which occurred in the timeline because of Nero’s successful murder of Kirk. But, in the interim, they cast his mom, dad, and brother. No point in wasting screentime for a short-lived character.

I simply, just really hope they don’t make it “gritty.” Remember how DS9 was “gritty?” Not.

Starfleet ships are prissily clean and, in the 24th century, designed as much for comfort as for battle, exploration and research. That’s not a bad thing, as humanity strives to increase productivity and lower cost. Those “secret” shuttle photos made the interior look like chairs in a strip club at 7am on a Sunday. No style at all, and no comfort.

112. Dom - May 14, 2008

Actually, when I saw the new Battlestar Galactica, I finally saw the true successor to TOS. I hated hated HATED the cosy, politically correct philosophy and look of the TNG universe, the George Lucas-esque pompous dialogue and how infernally nice everything was! I made me want to vomit: thank God there’s no way in hell the human race would ever end up like that! And as for the dreary incidental ‘music’ . . .

I would love to have seen the better eps of TNG done Galactica style. Imagine The Best of Both Worlds or Yesterday’s Enterprise done desaturated, hand-held and gritty. It would have been awesome! TOS, for all its 60s colour, was gritty and often very dark!

People who are coming at TOS through a filter of modern Treks, which were mostly written by second generation lifetime professional TV writers, rather than ex-WWII and -Korean War soldiers and their ilk, don’t appreciate just how complex, dark and controversial TOS was. As these writers have got older, you can see their development: the grit is back, as the opportunity now presents itself to tell stories on a bigger scale.

You can see Ron Moore’s Galactica as very much a comment on where modern Treks went wrong. Galactica is ST: Voyager without cosy holodecks, food replicators and a seemingly endless supply of shuttlecraft. It’s TNG’s ensemble cast made beliveable and flawed, where characters who perform one function on the ship won’t necessarily have anything to do with other characters, but whose actions all serve a necessary function for the greater whole.

The biggest thing that makes TNG dated is how naive, smug and safe it is. Face it, they create a great enemy in the Borg, then, within a couple of seasons we meet Edward Scissorborg!! Star Trek: Enterprise failed because, for all its attempts to become a post-911 show, it was still locked in a smug 1980s hippy-dippy California mindset it couldn’t shed.

So in conclusion, I hope Star Trek (2008) is ‘gritty’: if it is, it’s following in the best traditions of the original Star Trek!

113. madame trek - June 20, 2008

My Dream STXI:

Captain Riker and the USS Titan
Spock, Romulans and Unification
DS9 characters involved as well

(I have no idea how to develop plots, I just know which characters and topics I’d like to see.)

Can we petition JJ Abrams to make a new series involving the Titan?! It seems like a lot of us here like it!

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