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Takei Fires Back At Shatner October 22, 2008

by TrekMovie.com Staff , Filed under: Shatner,TOS , trackback

Looks like we got ourselves a full Orignal Series star war going on here. Yesterday we posted the new video from William Shatner taking some shots at George Takei, and today Entertainment Tonight caught up with Takei and gave him a chance to shoot back. See the video below.

 

Takei: ‘we did invite Bill’
Takei tells Entertainment Tonight that he did try and bury the hatchet with William Shatner by inviting him to his wedding, but that Bill didn’t show up (Takei also says that Shatner has not shown up at many events related to other TOS figures). See the ET video below.

 

Shat Takei feud big news
Entertainment Tonight isn’t alone in picking up on the latest video from The Shatner Project. Shatner’s Takei tirade was picked up by dozens of news organizations from gossip rags to TV networks to major newspapers. Here are just a few:

Nimoy and Shatner talk Prop 8
Takei talks a lot about Proposition 8, which is on the ballot in California this November. As it turns out William Shatner has been asked about this exact issue. A recent gala for the LA Philharmonic (dedicated to to Music Director Esa-Pekka Salonen) was attended by both William Shatner and Leonard Nimoy, and the LA Times ‘Dish Rag’ blog asked them both about it. From that article

The Dish Rag asked Nimoy if he’d attended the wedding of his "Trek" costar George Takei (a.k.a. Lieutenant Sulu) to his longtime life partner, Brad Altman, and how he felt about Prop 8.

“We got an invite and sent George and Brad an e-mail and told them unfortunately we had to be in New York that day –- but we sent them our best wishes,” said Nimoy.

He added: “Absolutely NO on Prop 8 because I believe that gay people have every right to get married and share their lives. George and Brad have been together for many years. They have every right to be together in any way they choose. Prop 8 is completely unjust.”

Shatner was all too happy to talk about the night’s honoree: “I have followed Esa’s career to when he first came here, then to the Hollywood Bowl then to this amazing musical venue here.”

Since it was reported Takei did not invite him to his wedding due to their acrimonious history, we just asked about Prop 8.

“That’s not about music,” said Shatner, before concluding our chat. “That has a dissident sound to it."

 

Comments

1. Buzz Cagney - October 22, 2008

Oh god please don’t let me be the First!
Grow up boys.

2. Jordan - October 22, 2008

I really don’t want to hear this kind of stuff. I just wish they would kiss (not really) and make up.

3. Sebastian Meyer - October 22, 2008

Oh just stop… please.

And vote no on Prop 8.

4. bobfred - October 22, 2008

yay…this again

5. Drew - October 22, 2008

The fight never ends…..

6. jdawg - October 22, 2008

Okay. I’ve switched sides. Sulu needs to get over it. I hold grudges to, but I dearly hope after forty years I’d be able to get over it.

Much to my surprise Shatner seemed quite mature as he should at 77 and logical in his remarks about George, and Georgy with that “don’t fo there girlfriend” tone and that obnoxious bobble head thing he’s doing, really needs to get over it and get a life.

I still like him as a character actor though.

And it might have been nice if Shatner went to D. Kelleys star ceremony. Other than that … pathetic.

7. Jordan - October 22, 2008

Shatner didn’t do to Kelly’s funeral? That makes me feel sad.

8. Buzz Cagney - October 22, 2008

7 remember, thats according to Takei.

9. Xai - October 22, 2008

More TOS soap opera stuff.

#8, nobody’s “right” in this, so don’t even try.

10. cellojammer - October 22, 2008

I can’t decide if this is entertaining or painful to watch. And I mean both sides. Guys, it’s time to really let this go!

11. Capt. Roykirk - October 22, 2008

Yeah, more “soap opera stuff.” grow up guys, stop calling each other crazy.
And to keep things even, vote yes on Prop. 8

12. Thehaggard - October 22, 2008

Frankly -
I think both of these guys need to shut the %#@! up. They are taking their feud into the public eye at a time in history where Star Trek is already a joke to some people. It is hurting the fan base, the history, and legacy of Star Trek. I don’t mind that they have humanity and a life outside of Star Trek. So be it that they hate each other. But why drag all of this out? Why bathe us in this silliness of 4th grade whining? I like Kirk and Sulu, heroes of my youth. Not so impressed with Shatner and Takei. Maybe it is best that some new blood are taking over their roles.

13. Sean - October 22, 2008

If I had to pick a side, I’d be on Takei’s side. What George said was true, Shatner didn’t go to those “happy occasions” that he was invited to, then Shatner complained about not being invited. I think Shatner is an ego-maniac and a drama queen.

ANYWAY, I almost wish I lived in California still just so I could vote NO on Proposition 8. George deserves to be happy, and NO ONE should be able to tell him or anyone else who they can and cannot marry.

14. Even more Life Like - October 22, 2008

Cue fight music- da da da daaa daaa ..

15. Adrian - October 22, 2008

Is anyone else annoyed by the fact that he is called Sulu, as if that was his name, instead of Takei?

I think they’re both acting like children in this whole thing, although Takei has been more honest. He is extremely bitter, and in this interview attempts to hide that bitterness. Shatner knows damned well why he is hated by Takei, he knows damn well nothing its not a “psychosis” and he is attempting to play the innocent victim. Rather then playing this game of “we’re both the peace makers!” just take it out back and beat the crap out of each other.

PS

NO ON PROP EIGHT! Our nation has had enough bigotry, its time truly embrace the notion that we are all equal.

16. Atlantians - October 22, 2008

With all do respect to Mr. Takei, while Prop 8 does take away the legal recognition of a union between himself and his partner, the larger issue is that the Court grossly overstepped their legal bounds by throwing their opinions out as legislative law in ‘legalizing’ homosexual ‘marriage’ to begin with.

The judiciary has no right to say: ‘We don’t care what the people of California think… we overturn this legal legislative action on their part… because of such and such a twisted basis in previous judicial decisions. ‘

The Judiciary can’t throw out laws and thus make a new one in this manner. They can interpret, they can cast down laws bellow them, and they can cast down laws that directly conflict with the Constitution.
They can not however make sweeping judgments based ever so tenuously on previous judiciary rulings.

Regardless of your view on the topic, this is legally an issue for the citizens to decide. The judiciary should never have stepped in and Mr. Takei is wrong in implying that he has been legally entitled to his ‘marriage’ for a long while and suddenly the mean bigots are after the homosexuals. This simply isn’t the case.

Now, as for Shatner. I have no idea what to think. =P

I like to give him the benefit of the doubt, but George’s point about the other no-shows makes a strong case. Can anyone confirm this? I have no reason to doubt Mr. Takei, but I want some basis to work from when Shatner inevitably responds.

Thank you.

17. Jared Butcher - October 22, 2008

Oh f**k would they both just grow the hell up…seriously

18. supesguy - October 22, 2008

I think these two gentlemen should bury the hatchet on this issue. Bill Shatner wisely pointed out that they have fewer days ahead. Eventually it will be too late.

And please Vote No on Prop 8. George Takei deserves to be married as much as anyone else.

Equality is good for everyone! The more freedom they have, the more freedom we all have.

19. Son of Surak - October 22, 2008

Well, I was very impressed with Takei’s benevolent diplomacy in the interview — again extending the hand of friendship after Shatner’s sniping (although he spoiled it a bit at the end). Takei has a great dignity and persuasiveness about him. I don’t know. Either Takei is a genuinely cool fellow and he has Shatner pegged as a petty narcissist, or, Takei is a smooth-talking psychopath and Shatner is not so bad, after all. I wish somebody could do a mind meld and figure out the truth here.

By the way, I’m voting YES on Proposition 8. Takei and his pal Brad can play house all they want to, but marriage is sacred.

20. The TOS Purist aka The Purolator - October 22, 2008

That’s B.S., the Shat showed up for plenty of TOS Cast gatherings. He’s shown up at a lot of conventions and he was there for the unveiling of the Enterprise Space Shuttle, too.

I wish George would just let it go.

21. AsylumJN - October 22, 2008

I think they are actually buddies and they’ve teamed up for an act to grab the media’s attention for proposition 8. I’ve always been a supporter of gay-rights/marriage. Gay’s should be allowed to marry. YOUR church doesn’t have to bless them. YOUR church can frown upon it. But YOU HAVE NO RIGHT to deny them their marriage if a CHURCH OTHER THAN YOURS and the state/country is willing to recognize it. Our country was founded by pilgrims who escaped religious persecution. Why do we still struggle with this. It’s ridiculous.

22. Anthony Pascale - October 22, 2008

NOTE: I know that the video and articles mentioned politics, but I still do not want this to denegrate into politics because that always ends up in a bad place. So lets just skip it

RE: 20
I do not believe Shatner was at the launching of the space shuttle, he is the only one not in the publicity photo (roddenberry was also there).
http://img.trekmovie.com/images/toscastentshuttle.jpg

Of course conventions do not count as Shatner is paid to attend them.

I am sure our resident Shatnologist John Tenuto can clarify what events Shatner did and did not show up to

23. Buzz Cagney - October 22, 2008

Notice that little jiggle of his head when he says that ‘Bill was the star of the show’- that hurt him to admit that!

24. Buzz Cagney - October 22, 2008

No 9- You are wrong- either Shatner went to dear old De’s funeral- or he didn’t. So somebody is going to be correct.

25. Devon - October 22, 2008

Personally, the only way this is going to end is if one of them stops going back and forth. One should play nice with the other, let it end.

26. TrekMadeMeWonder - October 22, 2008

Is this all a subtle attempt to make us comfortable with the new black shirted and brooding Kirk?

27. Kyle - October 22, 2008

Takei’s

28. Capt. Roykirk - October 22, 2008

I agree #12, Kirk and Sulu were both really cool, heroic guys. Will and George, not so much. At least Nimoy,Nichols and Koenig haven’t gone weird on us.

29. MORN SPEAKS - October 22, 2008

It’s like two parents fighting, I feel like I have to choose a side! Well if I have to, I choose Takei.

At any rate, this has gotta be good buzz for the new movie!

30. Devon - October 22, 2008

# 8 – Unless it’s mentioned elsewhere, in the video George says William didn’t show up to Gene’s funeral, not Deforest’s.

#20 – I don’t believe George was saying he wasn’t at events with the other cast members, but that he wouldn’t attend gatherings that would honor individual cast members such as weddings, birthdays, funerals, etc.

31. VERG - October 22, 2008

No KHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN 8. (te he he….)

32. Brian - October 22, 2008

It’s well known that Shatner didn’t show up for alot of things involving the cast. He’s lived on Planet Bill for a long time. You would think that at his advanced age he’d get over himself a bit. I typically side with him when it comes to whining from the supporting cast but in this case George is right.
If George did indeed invite him and he didn’t bother to respond and then went online to talk about not being invited then that’s just childish.

33. Buzz Cagney - October 22, 2008

I’m pretty sure that George wouldn’t accuse Shatner of not showing up to De’s funeral without it being accurate. Its a shame all round.

34. Brian - October 23, 2008

He didn’t say it was De Kelley’s funeral; he said it was Gene’s. Either way it’s pretty lame.

35. Anthony Thompson - October 23, 2008

George is a very classy guy. And he is exactly right that Shatner has NEVER shown up for other cast members. That is a fact. Shatner has no class. And considering how he seems to have a hard time remembering how to pronounce Takei’s name (and forgets receiving wedding invites) perhaps he really does suffer from “mad cow disease”.

36. Andy Patterson - October 23, 2008

Ah well. I won’t get into the details. I love them both.

Ah, the media.

37. Enterprise - October 23, 2008

Please God, is this the National Enquirer or a Trek website.

38. max - October 23, 2008

40 years from now the next generation of Trekkies will be debating the Christ Pine/John Cho fued. I’m calling it now.

Oh well, I love both these petty bastards.

39. Iowagirl - October 23, 2008

Look at all the media hype. Even the Washington Post and The Times are covering it. Those guys are still Top of The Pops. No matter who’s “right” – it’s great they’re still alive and kickin’. :)

40. EnsignJulka - October 23, 2008

Personally I’m on the fence with this…

41. Valar1 - October 23, 2008

I hope they keep slinging the mud, that will be one way to get more exposure for trek and the new movie.

42. Anthony Pascale - October 23, 2008

If you are wondering what happened to your poltical posts…i deleted them

i am serious about the no more politics stuff. I dont care what side you are on…or how reasonable it starts…it always ends up with mudslinging, namecallling and thread closing.

SO NO MORE POLITICS.

43. DJ Neelix - October 23, 2008

I’m definitely on George’s side on this one. As above poster wrote, Takei is just responding on Shatner’s accusations.
Of course I don’t really know, but my guess it that his description of Shatner is spot on. He has the typical bully character, it shines through from a mile’s distance.

44. Rastaman - October 23, 2008

Since my original post was deleted for political reasons, I’ll say this again:

I think Shatner is in the wrong here. He is a bully and has been tormenting his Trek costars for years. Not just Takei either. We’ve heard it from Koenig, Doohan, and Nichols. Nimoy and Kelley have acknowledged it to some degree as well.

Clearly, Shatner is trying to steal some of the limelight from Takei’s recent marriage for his own publicity purposes. Because that’s all he cares about … his own ego. It is shameful that Shatner attempts to muddy what should be one of the happiest memories of Takei’s life. The fact that Shatner called Takei “psychotic” is totally ludicrous!

Takei is rightfully outraged and reacting to Shatner’s own transgressions. I would too. More power to you Takei!!! And congratulations on your wedding.

45. CmdrR - October 23, 2008

George, Bill… you two just need to go ahead and f***.

Really, end this.

46. commander K, USS Sovereign - October 23, 2008

And maybe it was Shatner’s ego that prevented him getting a part in this movie…

47. Devon - October 23, 2008

I hope they mention the new movie after each person takes their turn.

48. Jimthebard - October 23, 2008

Du de de deee deee deee deee deeeeeee

Or however that Vulcan fight music goes LOL

I am not going to bash either of these guy’s cos as an English man I am taught to respect queens! LOL

You have your TV show where you do your detective stuff, a bit Bill Cosby for me, and you have your YouTube channel. So please explain why you don’t seem to think you are seeking attention? Could it be that you are a attention seeking fantasist?

And George, give yourself more respect and don’t rise to the bait.

Maybe it stems from Takei not wearing a top in the 3rd series whilst Shatner had to cling film his gut into shape?

49. captain_neill - October 23, 2008

Shatner’s ego seems to be the main problem here. I love both actors and would love to see them work out the differences.

Takei appears to be really trying to reach out to Shatner but I think Shatner believes he is right as well.

Calling Takei ‘psychotic’ is really harsh.

50. raffie - October 23, 2008

ROFL, they’re both weirdo’s xD

51. Fatman Bruno - October 23, 2008

There’s a possibility that Bill didn’t show up because it would take something away from the wedding/funeral etc… forget the Groom/Casket look there’s Capt’ Kirk!!!
Either way I get the feeling that Bill will join George’s debate on Prop 8, however briefly before asking George to settle it in a paintball match…

52. Jon G - October 23, 2008

Wow… we get it, they hate each other… why can’t they just never talk to or about each other ever again?

53. Vulcan has no moons - October 23, 2008

Sulu is full of crap!

The way he’s always talked about Bill, has been nothing but a bag of hurt. He’s probably been so madly in love with Bill the moment he saw him, that maybe…. juuuuuust maybe Bill was the reason why George turned gay!

I’m just saying, that for so many years, he’s been up Bills uhh.. wait… he’s been ON HIS case, that it’s so obvious that he’s the one with the grudge and not Bill.

Also, he’s constantly talking about his ego… I’m sorry but at this point… Sulu is the attention whore and the one with the agenda.

No one really talked about Nimoy BEING there… If there was anything to this, Leonard would have told Bill.

It’s complete and utter BS…

Sorry Sulu… But I am not stripping you of your command… In fact, I’m reducing you to ensign again. Useless!

54. Solo - October 23, 2008

Takei would be funny if this were schtick but I’m afraid it’s serious in his mind. I guess that’s how it goes when you have too much time and money. Sort of an older, uglier Linsay.

Sad. Sad all around, An ignominious end to a rather sad life.

55. Kirk's Toupeé - October 23, 2008

Looks like Sulu’s balls are in The Shat’s court now!!!

56. Bugs Nixon - October 23, 2008

I wonder if there is a point thats not being made here – something that no one is prepared to say…

is he accusing shatner of being homophobic?

57. Bennie - October 23, 2008

Please, get a live an grow up!

58. Spock - October 23, 2008

I would really, really like to think that they patched things up years ago and that this public display is really a joke on the press for running stories on stupid bullshit.

59. Peter Lemonjello - October 23, 2008

Shatner should just keep his mouth shut as he ends up looking like a bigger and bigger ass each time.

60. DJ Neelix - October 23, 2008

To all you Shat-lovers on this board: have you completely closed your eyes!!!!????

Sorry, but isn’t it obvious that Shatner is the one who’s just spreading lies?
Takei has every right to defend himself when someone calls him psychotic!!
I think y’all would be pretty pissed too.
Shatner is constantly looking for fights it seems, not only with Takei but also with the J.J. Abrams team.
He’s a total egotist and now I’m actually happy he won’t be in the new movie! In fact, I hope we’ll never see William Shatner play captain Kirk ever again. He doesn’t deserve it.

I think all of you defending Shatner are doing it very much so because of reasons you’re afraid to admit… let’s just say that if it was the Shat who was gay then he would be the one you would defend. But that’s just my guess of course…

61. Adam Cohen - October 23, 2008

As fans, I think it’s time to accept that the Original Cast has had personal differences that will never get resolved. There is no “burying the hatched” with these people– they’re actors and their egos preclude them from being forgiving.

I personally think its unprofessional for any of them to put this stuff out there for the media to consume. And I also think it’s silly for the media to embrace this as some sort of catfight. But mostly, I find it sad that these guys truly dislike one another. But that’s life, so let’s try and move on and ignore these senior citizens and their verbal jousting.

62. Vulcan has no moons - October 23, 2008

@61 Don’t forget… It was Takei who started this shitstorm…

@ 60,

You don’t honestly mean that do you? He doesn’t deserve to play Kirk again? Unless I missed something, history recalls just ONE man to play Kirk and that one man happened to be the creator of what we know and love today as James T. Kirk… and he happened to be played by Shatner…

So, without Shatner there would be no Kirk as we know it.

63. Scott - October 23, 2008

What a joke. These guys have no intention of mending anything. Takei extends all these offers of friendship to Shatner and then in the next breath insults him. All in all, It’s pathetic and doesn’t reflect well on either of them. I love their work on film, but honestly they like seem childish and petty individuals.

64. Miles R. Seppelt - October 23, 2008

Dear Anthony,

Do we really need this type of material on trekmovie?

If Shatner and Takei don’t get along for some reason isn’t that their own personal business? Is any good done by spreading this type of stuff around? This is “National Enquirer” level material and all it does is contribute to a bad situation.

The various posts listed here are good evidence I think of the level of conversation this type of “news” engenders.

If two people have personal differences I think that is very unfortunate, and I’m also inclined to think that is their own private affair. The media and the public don’t need to be party to it.

Trekmovie is a great, great site and owes it to itself and its readers to keep the reporting to the highest possible level – and to keep the focus on real news.

65. James - October 23, 2008

@ 64:

I agree. The puerile scrapping of two bitter old men are of no interest to Star Trek, noteworthy only to the gutter press. It brings the franchise down.

66. Dom - October 23, 2008

Maybe the reason Shatner has turned up to fewer functions than other TOS co-stars is because he’s been working more than them. Shatner’s CV has very few holes in it. He’s a busy guy who only really had a null patch in the 1970s, post-Star Trek television series era.

It’s easy to forget that he hasn’t just been a name in drama: he’s hosted shows like Rescue 911 as well.

And as for being paid to turn up at conventions, as a freelance myself, I don’t do anything unless I get paid for it, unless it’s to generate good will to earn me money further down the line. I just had a month with no work and am about to work three weeks solid without a day off to catch up. Did I go on holiday? No! I worried about where my next rent payment is coming from. Shatner is a professional and deserves every penny he earns.

Where many people have given up the ghost and retired, even pushing towards 80, Shatner is still working.

I get the impression that a number of his Star Trek minor co-stars, who are still only best known for their Star Trek roles are just a bit jealous of his continued success.

It’s a shame, because, ever since this open feuding was started by certain cast members of TOS in the 1990s, it’s spoiled Star Trek for a lot of us.

It would be nice now, if all of them agreed to put up and shut up. It makes them look bad and it’s bad for Star Trek. Shatner’s remarks have mostly been reactive. Takei has spent years mocking Shatner, be it on Howard Stern’s show or in magazine interviews. Shatner has been pretty chilled about Takei’s barbs for a long time. Eventually, he was bound to kick back!

And the other thing mentioned about Shatner wanting more close-ups in scenes in TOS: whether or not a close-up is used or not in a TV show is decided in post-production, not on set. I don’t know how much power Shatner’s agent had in the TOS era, but the directors, producers and editors decide what shots go where unless the star has some kind of contractual dispensation to override them!

67. Dom - October 23, 2008

64: It’s a news story that’s been reported worldwide. Why should a site directly related to Star Trek not report it?

68. Opcode - October 23, 2008

I believe Shatner didn’t attend the Roddenberry star ceremony either. I have several photos of the event and the whole cast of TOS, even the Harry Mudd actor, was there, except for Shatner.

69. star trackie - October 23, 2008

It’s publicity for George,that’s why he stirs the pot. After 50 years in Hollywood he is finally being noticed and he loves it.

70. Chingatchkook - October 23, 2008

Like anything else, I suspect that the truth lies somewhere inbetween. These two are fighting their battles through various media outlets without actually talking to each other. As several other posters here have said, ‘grow up gentlemen, get over it’. Excellent words.

71. Denny - October 23, 2008

Since they aren’t in the new Trek movie, maybe these two can get together and try to revive the “Grumpy Old Men” movie franchise.

72. Green ink - October 23, 2008

There’s something sad and pathetic about this ‘feud’. They’re essentially being played by the media to bitch about each other, while a simple phonecall could have avoided this messiness. But whereas Shatner just does it to harp on Takei and inflate his ego, Takei at least seems to use it for some good and get some support for his cause.

Also, I think the so called bitterness of Takei gets overestimated. Sure he’s only famous for being in Star Trek, and only gets media attention when something like this happens. But what gets lost there is the fact that Takei has a life outside the media, but that’s simply not interesting to report on (from the media’s point of view). Two bitter old washed up actors bandy complaints about each other over wedding invitation sells better than George Takei opposes proposition 8.

In the end they’re both just as guilty. Takei should have gotten over his Shatner issues years ago, but alas. And Shatner shouldn’t have gone on the internet and call Takei psychotic or complain about not being invited to a wedding of someone you apparently don’t really know. Despite them knowing each other for more than 40 years.
But maybe Shatner is really that self absorbed, he owes his fame just as much to Trek as Takei and yet still considers most of them strangers.
Takei’s claim that he never shows up at personal gatherings is a strong indicator of that.

On a different note. Nice to know Shatner likes classical music enough to follow the career of Salonen. But “That has a dissident sound to it.”,
he probably said dissonant.

73. Mark Lynch - October 23, 2008

Well having read the Shatner and Takei threads, I think that Mr. takei comes across as the most thoughtful and reasonable of the two. If what Mr T. says is true then Mr S. has gone further down in my estimations.

Not exactly ‘childhood raped’ (a phrase which is horrible and I hate BTW)
But I am glad that I am old enough to be able to differentiate between the character and the actor.

James T. Kirk is still one of my childhood heroes. As for Mr S. Ho hum, as they say.

74. grhome - October 23, 2008

what bother me most of all…is that one of these men…either Shatner or George….is lying!

It’s one thing to argue back and forth…..that’s just beiing silly.

But it’s painfully and regretfully obvious that one of these men is LYING!

That really bothers….and saddens me.

75. Green ink - October 23, 2008

Indeed, either Takei invited him to the wedding or not. And I wanted to hear that journalist ask him, why he said he hadn’t invited Shatner if he now says he has.
I’m not a big fan of Shatner, and I don’t think he should have made such crass comments in his vlog, but I’m dissapointed in Takei for seemingly trying to constantly put himself in the underdog position.
First it’s ‘Bill is a jerk who I don’t want at my wedding’, then it’s ‘we did invite him, but he didn’t bother to rsvp’.
So hopefully someone gets them together or at least calls them out publicly to tell what really happened.

76. The Underpants Monster - October 23, 2008

They’re old men. Old men like to complain. The media shouldn’t take it so seriously.

77. Green ink - October 23, 2008

Okay, I need to think more about what I’m going to say before I post it, and also I need to get outside and actually do something,
but I saw this somewhere else, because I was curious how this was reported outside of the fanzone.

“I heard Takei speak at a Star Trek Con recently, and he said quite clearly that Shatner was invited. The “not invited” thing was because they had a very long list of potential guests and limited space (a problem most brides could sympathize with) and at the time of the interview had not yet figured out who made the cut. So, they said Shatner was on the “long list”. That got out as “not invited”.”

So Shatner seems to be just full of it. It probably being himself.
The thing is though, from his video, what shines through isn’t anything malicious on his part or a dislike, but mostly simply a lack of understanding. He honestly doesn’t seem to grasp that others might interpret his behaviour differently from him.
Oh well, it’s probably too late for those men to change, the best thing to do is probably ignore them and let them get on with their lives.

78. Dax - October 23, 2008

Vote NO to Proposition 8! Don’t let the bigots win!

79. 4 8 15 16 23 42 - October 23, 2008

This is all very 7th Grade… and a distraction from the REAL questions at hand, like:

WHEN ARE WE GONNA GET MORE PIX FROM THE NEW MOVIE?!

80. 4 8 15 16 23 42 - October 23, 2008

This is only news in the sense that the media reported it, but it is not really news in the sense of it being at all relevant.

81. RobertaLincoln - October 23, 2008

Fist of all, let’s not make this a debate about Prop 8. I don’t like the idea of this site becoming a forum to push political issues.

Second, Shatner and Takei need to kiss and make up. They’ve both got personl issues with each other, and they shouldn’t be using the media to air those issues.

82. G-Boss - October 23, 2008

Bill And George;
I know that you have people that read these boards.
Enough is enough.
End this nonsense.

83. krikzil - October 23, 2008

Well, that didn’t take long. Gotta love the media.

It’s kinda funny to hear Takei try to dismiss Bill’s comment about them not knowing each other. Just because you do a tv show or movies, does not mean you are anything more than actors on a set, especially when one is the star and one is not and there’s not a lot of interaction. Heck, Bill has stated that he and Nimoy didn’t become best friends until after the show ended.

I do know that it has been the supporting cast, for probably almost 20 years now, bitching about Shatner at cons. They need to get over it. As for Kelley’s funeral — I don’t know if Shatner attended or not; I do know he was visiting him when he was so ill because he told us about the visits at a Creation con. (De was supposed to have attended one but was too sick.)

84. Decker's Stubble - October 23, 2008

I think we have new candidates for celebrity boxing. Absurd, but no more than two old men cat-fighting over some 40 year-old grudge.

85. Fringe - October 23, 2008

Shatner has never voiced any expectation of a wedding invite, and his gracious response to media inquiry was reported by The New York Post of 4 June 2008: “No, we have not been in touch [with George Takei and his soon-to-be husband] but I wish the happy couple all the best. George deserves a moment of happiness.”

Link: tinyurl.com/49uyf9

Note: A&E’s new talk show, “Shatner’s Raw Nerve”, premieres on the Biography Channel in December (or sooner?), so there’s precious little time to promote Shat’s capability as a badass on the edge!

;-)

86. StarTrekkie - October 23, 2008

The weird thing about Shatner is that most people know he’s arrogant, but we love him anyway. Has anyone seen that Shatner documentary, “How William Shatner Changed the World”? At the end of the show, I got a very deep sense of how unhappy and unfulfilling his life really is though. I wouldn’t be surprised if George Takei is the same way.

And on another note, regarding Takei’s comments – yes, we *are* all created equal…. under sin.

87. Cervantes - October 23, 2008

More fuel on the fire for these two on this site then?….again.

Instead of folks getting all riled up over their pro-this and anti-that agendas on another needlessly inflammatory topic here, would it be too much to ask for some Star Trek *MOVIE* news instead of this irrelevance?

Give me another portion of J.J.’s re-imagined ‘iBridge’ for us to either like or dislike (probably the latter, to lay out my stall early….) or something else more worthy of this site than the above nonsense.

I personally wish that the recent rash of official images had been spread out a bit more, to give us less of this kind of slow news day….

However, I did like the comment by #47 Devon. :)

88. Daoud - October 23, 2008

I hear that Chris Pine and John Cho have already signed a pact in blood that the OS/2 generation won’t repeat the errors of the OS actors.

89. ensign joe - October 23, 2008

yay more gossip for the masses..

Shatner ’08 ;)

90. Spoctor McKirk - October 23, 2008

No to Proposition 8. Yes to Preparation H. This is nothing but a royal pain in the Trek nation’s a**.

91. Raphael Salgado - October 23, 2008

Let’s see..

Shatner apparently didn’t get the wedding invite from Takei…

Shatner apparently didn’t get the cameo invite from J.J. Abrams…

Someone needs to fire his agent, clean his ears, stop those meds!

92. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#66—”…a number of his Star Trek minor co-stars, who are still only best known for their Star Trek roles…”

Is Shatner “best known” for something else?

#83—”I do know that it has been the supporting cast, for probably almost 20 years now, bitching about Shatner at cons.”

Where there is smoke, there is usually fire…It hasn’t just been Takei, of course. There is a pattern with Bill. It is probably a bit different on the set of ‘Boston Legal’, as his current role is a more “supporting” one.

#86—”…most people know he’s arrogant, but we love him anyway.”

Some of us just love the ‘character’ which made him most famous. William Shatner never commanded the Enterprise. He never actually defeated the Gorn on Cestus III, destroyed the ‘Doomsday Machine’, or outdueled Khan in the Mutara Nebula.

:)

93. allister gourlay - October 23, 2008

Soap opera stuff indeed!

94. Dennis Bailey - October 23, 2008

I imagine that Shatner did mean “dissonant,” whether he said “dissident” or not.

95. Gabriel Bell - October 23, 2008

#38 Max

“Christ Pine.” Hilarious typo.

96. Dr. Image - October 23, 2008

Shat and George should do “The Odd Couple.’
It would be a riot.

97. joe1306 - October 23, 2008

the adventure continues… oh man, thy should stop this

98. Jason Regan - October 23, 2008

Is this stuff really worth reporting? It’s not really about Star Trek – just two sad old let-downs being very petty and now very boring. Personally I find this about as interesting as the latest Paris Hilton/Nicole Richie feud, and not much more relevant to Star Trek.

99. starfleetmom - October 23, 2008

As usual, Takei takes any question on any issue and turns it into his personal political soapbox. He and Nichelle Nichols were disgusting at the 40th anniversary con in Vegas. They used the stage not for Star Trek, but for pushing their politics and their agendas and she ended up storming off the stage in a diva-esque hissy fit and he proceeded to call an audience member names. What whiners. I can’t stand them.
Sure he sent an invitation…he just forgot the stamp and the return address accidentally on purpose. ;-)

100. Holger - October 23, 2008

This is a personal matter between Shatner and Takei. Period!

101. Greg - October 23, 2008

Between the new Star Trek movie and this thing with George Takei, what is William Shatners problem. He is acting like a little kid. And he doesn’t realize how infantile he is making himself appear. He sounds like a cry baby. And he is doing all this in front of his daughter. I guess it is no big deal to her, she must be used to it. I used to defend him all the time to family and friends, not anymore!

102. ByGeorge - October 23, 2008

#98

You are correct – this is boring. Yesterday I said the exact opposite – that watching 2 grown men acting like babies was funny and entertaining to watch. But after 1 day it is stale already. I couldn’t even listen to the videos.

To get back the thrill we need to give them some lirpas and let them fight it out on Entertaniment Tonight. Better yet, we should design some new funky weapons that they use on Vulcan if both survive lirpas AND the ahn woons. Now its getting fun again. Going to go design some primitive Vulcan Kal-if-ee weaponry for the upcoming duel.

103. star trackie - October 23, 2008

#92 “Is Shatner “best known” for something else? ”

Depends on who you ask. Ask a Trekkie and its Captain Kirk.
Ask anyone under 30 and he’s Denny Crane or the Priceline guy.
Ask someone is more into music than TV or movies and he’s the “rocket man” and “tambourine man” guy with the wild covers.
Ask a kid who listens to his ipod all day and he’s the guy on Ben Fold’s album.

“Best known” is all subjective to who is being asked.

104. jondh - October 23, 2008

They both deserve a good spanking

105. Izbot - October 23, 2008

This Kirk vs. Sulu thing is totally against established canon. It’s possible this battle is taking place in the Mirror Universe or some other parallel dimension. Besides, we all know Kirk died on Veridian III. It simply cannot be happening. Oh wait, I forgot about those Shatner novels where Kirk was cloned from dinosaur DNA or whatever. Yeah, it probably takes place in that alternate reality.

106. The Underpants Monster - October 23, 2008

#96 – That would be awesome. I see George as Felix and Bill as Oscar. I wonder if they’d do it.

107. steve623 - October 23, 2008

And let’s not forget his unforgettable performance as the eyeless man with the melting face in “The Devil’s Rain”.

What? Nobody remembers that one? Just me?

108. Jamesb3 - October 23, 2008

Look, I admire and like both of these guys, but we have all been fans for a while, and it is Takei who has consistently harped about his dislike for Shatner. It has become a part of his schtick; when you think Takei, you automatically think “hates Shatner”, and that says something.

Shatner, on the other hand, has, until now, never defended himself from these statements by Takei and a few others. I’ve no doubt that Takei’s criticisms of Shatner have a grain of truth to them, but it should not surprise anyone that a Hollywood actor might be a bit of an egotist and might step on a few people in a dog-eat-dog industry.

Bottom line, if you had to listen to someone you had worked with publicy malign you for years, would you not finally have enough and tell him to “just get over it”?

I think Shatner’s reaction is perfectly understandable, as well as understated. You could have been considerably more pointed in his response.

And it would be a classy thing now if SHatner made a public comment in support of Prop 8.

109. biodredd - October 23, 2008

And people wonder why I rarely post here anymore.

This thread would be a perfect example of that.

A site called “TrekMovie.com” posts the lead story for this week’s National Enquirer and expects to continue to be viewed a respected site for Trek news. Other then the fact that these two people worked in Trek over 40 years ago, there is nothing news worthy here and all it ends up doing is forcing Anthony to go through the thread daily and clean out all the political messages and post warnings all day about what is and isn’t allowed.

Thank god this wasn’t a BSG post filled with spoilers. The roof might have fallen in. Only three months until that nonsense happens again.

110. Ante - October 23, 2008

Takei is full of crap, so mad at whole world beacuse Shat have succesfull carrier and he not. Shat is absolutley right. And please Anthony stop deleting my postas beacuse you don’t agree with my opinion. I feel like in communism.

111. bdrcarter - October 23, 2008

Vote no to Proposition # 8.

If George did in fact invite Shatner…and he jsut chose not to show up AND then bitch about it…he really is the tool everyone has said he is.
Is it possble he just can’t stand all the Trek attention going on lately that he isn’t (or shouldn’t be) part of? He’s coming across as as the one holding the grudge.

If you haven’t already, read Harlan Ellison’s City of the Edge of Forever book. He has an unfettered opinion about The Shat.

112. kcp - October 23, 2008

As much as I love Shatner, he’s an idiot. His interview was so condenscending and his treatment of his former co-workers is always disrespectful. This nonsense that he doesnt even know Takei, but iis insulted at not being invited to his wedding. Which is it? In everyone of his co-stars books, even his friend Nimoy, all report what an egomaniac Shatner was.His arguments are all over the place and not well thought out. Bizarre. Maybe Mad Cow.

113. Wrath - October 23, 2008

What a pair of children.

114. Nelson - October 23, 2008

I say, get David Kelley to write them both into a storyline for Boston Legal and bury the hatchet. This is so silly, end it or don’t cover it.

115. Raphael Salgado - October 23, 2008

It’s obvious we’re not in the 23rd century. If these two guys can’t get along, we will all be assimilated!

Someone please send each of the a bottle of Romulan Ale, a couple of Tribbles, and a Deltan. I’m sure the squabble will all be over in a matter of hours.

116. Raphael Salgado - October 23, 2008

Is this the equivalent of Britney and Christina with their supposed antics that keep them in the spotlight? Kinda like the girls from The Hills? Or if that’s not a good analogy, how about Kaufman and Jerry “The King” Lawler?

117. Carmina Burana - October 23, 2008

Webmaster (Anthony?)

Isn’t post 78 pretty in your face political and shouldn’t it be yanked? They’re soliciting votes for cryin’ out loud!

118. trekboi - October 23, 2008

Im with george- he might be bitter but the shat-mans rep speaks for itself.

hmmm no politics? star trek was at its best when political and its been there right from the beginning with the casting of nichelle and the creation of chekov.
for thoes that dont want to hear about george and bills bitch fight- dont read the articles and let others chose which “news” they want to follow.
i dont like anthony deciding what is said- what is censored ect ect

let the forums run free!
not that anyone’s listening to me- lol

119. Ante - October 23, 2008

I say, vote for Proposition ( and bann these perverts. That is my opinion and I expect form Anthony to not delete my post.

120. Joe Schmoe - October 23, 2008

OK, Billy, you sit over there in that chair, and Georgie you sit in this chair . . . . Now I don’t want to hear a word out of you . . . . you aren’t allowed to punch, pinch, slap or even pretend to hit each other . . . . and NO mouthing words to each other, and absolutely NO staring at each other, or making faces at each other . . . . the next boy who says or does anything out of line will be sent right to your room!

Now if you boys can both can be nice to each other, maybe later we can go get an ice cream or something.

121. Al Hartman - October 23, 2008

I’ve met George many times, and been shoved against a wall by Shatner’s body guards at a con.

I know who I think is kinder, more gracious, more loving to the fans…

And it ain’t “The Shat”.

122. Cervantes - October 23, 2008

#119 Ante

I say ban people who can’t spell! :)

123. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#109—”And people wonder why I rarely post here anymore”

Really?

124. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#103—-Uh….no.

Even people who have never seen an episode of Star Trek know him as “Captain Kirk”.

And are there actually people under 30 who watch Boston Legal?

125. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#100–”This is a personal matter between Shatner and Takei. Period!”

And yet both of them use public forums to argue their points….hmmm.

126. richpit - October 23, 2008

I can’t imagine caring any less about whether or not Shat & Takei are mad at each other. Really.

I care even less than that if gay folks want to get married. How’s it gonna hurt me? And I’m a Republican saying this!

Really, they need to let it go.

127. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

Shatner and Takei.

I like them both, but their feud is an embarrassment to the franchise. Time for them to bury the hatchet.

128. krikzil - October 23, 2008

“Where there is smoke, there is usually fire…It hasn’t just been Takei, of course. There is a pattern with Bill. It is probably a bit different on the set of ‘Boston Legal’, as his current role is a more “supporting” one.”

That would apply to the supporting cast as well. I mean, still whining over something from 30-40 years ago? Bill and Leonard were the stars and of course had the lines and the power. However, for all their complaining, there have been an equal number of guest stars and others who have said Bill was fine and they had no problems with him at all. Everyone seems to admire Nimoy and respect his judgment — well Bill is one of his closest friends.

I do know from personal experience having been on the TJ Hooker set that he was friendly when he didn’t even have to acknowledge my friend and I – we were just 2 fans watching the action. Nobodys. And he was both starring in and directing this particular episode.

“Best known” is all subjective to who is being asked.”

Course, the telling part is that he is known across such diverse multi-generational lines.

129. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

Does Prop. 8 allow for beastiality too?

130. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

I want to marry my cat.

131. The Underpants Monster - October 23, 2008

John, I’m sure you can google the text and find out.

132. Norman - October 23, 2008

*****hey – back to the film.

Could it be possible that the pictures we have seen of the crew on the E are actually post TOS???

I mean, Abrams, et al have said this is not exactly a prequel. We know time travel is involved. But, just because Pike for example will be in the film, doesn’t mean that the pics on the bridge of the E happen shortly after his command.

Then, the issues of Chekov (exaclty when did he show up), Sulu, Scotty, and Spock wearing different colored shirts in WNMHGB, etc. may be non-issues.

(granted, there may be new issues under this theory – like Bones appears about 15 years younger – but hey, he is a Doctor dammit. Maybe he discovered a new alien skin cream.)

Abrams likes to jump all over the place when it comes to chronology, so maybe all we have seen so far is a post TOS bridge.

The black shirted Kirk could be…

1. The cadet Kirk who himself has time traveled – thus prompting Spock to administer the choke hold, thinking he may be an imposter.

2. In a new command uniform for the post TOS era.

3. Who knows?

Just some thoughts…

…If it turns out to be true – you heard it here first. ;)

133. AdamTrek - October 23, 2008

#129 Probably not. But just think, California is now one step closer!

134. JWM - October 23, 2008

In the end, I don’t care whether Shatner and Takei get along. I don’t think anyone else should, either. I do think that they both need to pick up and walk on. The only thing that I will say in defense of Shatner is that I heard Sulu bash him for years before he ever responded. He even took time in that Star Trek Memories book to say he was unaware of the problems, was unaware of what he did to make Doohan and Takei hate him and he was sorry for it.

I don’t blame him for taking a moment to say “I wish this guy would shut up” because he’s been listening to it for decades.

I did read somewhere that Takei was upset because he felt Shatner had a hand in cutting dialogue he had in TWOK that had to do with his promotion to Captain or some such. But regardless of the spark, this has exploded into something bigger than it should be.

As for the Prop 8 stuff, what does that have to do with their feud? Why do they feel the need to question actors about it, anyway? Why do people in general give so much weight to what actors think? They’re humans with their own sets of beliefs, and because they’re famous doesn’t make their reasoning any more valid or…logical…

135. Nelson - October 23, 2008

Anthony, thought you might like to know, that Whoopie Goldberg chimed in on this topic during The View today. She knows Shatner and said this whole feud is not real. Shatner can be impish and this whole thing is a joke. She knows that if you don’t quite get his thinking, you miss that he’s often joking.

I think I’ve posted enough on this topic!

136. Trevor H. - October 23, 2008

The funny thing is that Shatner has basically admitted that he was insecure during the original TOS run and he used what power he had at the time to promote himself and his part. Much to the detriment of his fellow actors. Nimoy and others understand this. Takei never has and has held a grudge and takes pleasure in jabbing Shatner.

Takei’s career or lack of one had little to do with Shatner. He was a 3rd tier actor on what was a B-Level show. It has only been because of recent participation on shows like “Howard Stern” that has allowed him to rise up out of the abyss and get work on shows like Heroes.

What Takei has recently learned, is what Shatner learned during the long lean years of the 70′s, self-promotion is the difference between working in Hollywood or not working in Hollywood.

137. J_schinderlin56 - October 23, 2008

Like someone said yesterday. I think that William Shatner is in love with George Takei and didn’t come to the wedding because it was just too painfull.

138. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#128—-”Everyone seems to admire Nimoy and respect his judgment — well Bill is one of his closest friends. ”

Everyone also seems to admire and respect the judgement of DeForest Kelley….who didn’t speak to Shatner for years over a personal incident significant to De, but not to Bill. That’s the pattern.

“…there have been an equal number of guest stars and others who have said Bill was fine and they had no problems with him at all.”

Spending a day or two on the set with someone can leave you with an impression of a person which is far different from that of those who work closely with him/her for long periods of time.
Anyone who meets my youngest sister thinks she’s great and fun to hang out with. If they spend more than a day with her…the true colors come out.
:)

“I mean, still whining over something from 30-40 years ago? ”

Whining? Or using what he has to create exposure for himself? I think it has been a long time since Takei was really incensed by any of that stuff from long ago. But would the likes of Stern, Conan, or Letterman even care to invite him on without the promise of rehashing uneasiness on the set with Bill Shatner? I don’t think so. I don’t think he gets a spot on Stern, or a recurring role on ‘Heroes’ without putting his face out there like that. Bill should have recognized that for what it was…publicity stunting—trading juicy stories for facetime.

As for the whole Wedding bit, Takei was asked if he invited him. The media is aware that he and Bill aren’t exactly best buds. It is not as if he went out of his way to make a public spectacle of someone’s non-invitation. On the other hand, Bill did go very much out of his way to attack Takei in the wake of it.

The only one winning in this is Takei. Before you know it, he’ll be right back on the talk show circuit…where he needs to be in order to stay halfway relevant. This kind of stuff is the only reason he has a career today outside of the Star Trek conventions, IMO.

Bill did not need to address this. He ‘should’ be above that…but he isn’t.

Now, on the other hand, fresh insults like “psychotic” and “sick” will likely fuel new anymosity.

139. BND - October 23, 2008

Is ClosetTrekker tha’ voice o’ reason among us here?

I says sit back and enjoy. Like a hot dog, no one is so sure aboot which piggy or beefy part is in it… Like Cher we dunna know what is true and real and what is false fur show… Like a fresh and new chat thread, we dunna know iffa it will be fish or fowl…

O’ course, what does Chekov think aboot all this?

Maybe it’s all worth it iffa we see Mr. Sulu gets a part on J.J.’s Fringe… and Shatner write his book aboot tha’ feud called “Rising Sun, Setting Sulu”… forward by Christopher Buckley…

Arrrrrrr…

140. Marshall McMellon - October 23, 2008

I KNEW it! In the original reports it said that Shatner was “not on the guest list.” It never said he wasn’t invited. He just wasn’t on the guest list. As I suspected, he didn’t RSVP so they just assumed he was not coming. Simple enough.

141. tribble farmer - October 23, 2008

This is even better than televised gladiator fights.

142. cw - October 23, 2008

Shatner is an embarrassment. I am glad there is a new Kirk.

143. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

All Shatner would have to do is bellyflop on top of George, leaving nothing left but a grease spot on the floor.

144. Scott Gammans - October 23, 2008

#130, I am really getting tired of this argument. Obviously the marriage you wish for is impossible because one of the parties involved cannot give intelligent, informed consent.

Of course, I’m sure your cat could always find someone else to marry.

145. THE MSH - October 23, 2008

Well Sulu did bash Shatner in the media. He made a point of NOT inviting Shatner in the media. All the other Star Trek cast members were IN the wedding. No wonder Nimoy was in NY…sheesh. I am sure Shatner is sick of SULU bashing him in the media. That is what Bill’s video is all about. I mean if you don’t want to invite him don’t, why make a big deal of it in the media? I am sure Bill doesn’t care if he was at Sulu’s wedding or not. By the way, I am sure Star Trek would have the popularity it has today if Shatner was the helmsman, and Takei was captain. I mean without Shatner, Sulu’s autograph is worth………well you get my point.

http://www.wnbc.com/entertainment/16473636/detail.html

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,362855,00.html

http://www.people.com/people/article/0,,20203817,00.html

146. Mike Thompson UK - October 23, 2008

Like someone said Shatner has had to put up with this bitching
for twenty years now……watch mind meld and see what Nimoy said about it. No wonder he is fed up with it.

Now, Shatner opens his mouth for the first time and he is seen as the bad one.

These functions he missed, maybe his wife (Marci) did want him to go to them! One reason he divorced her ?? As he seems to have changed over the years.

147. paustin - October 23, 2008

yeah its a little unfair…invited or not, right or wrong Shatner doesnt drudge it up everytime he has a microphone pushed in front of him. George however does. Poor Bill brings it up once and he’s gonna get slammed…I suppose he should have known better, knowing George would just be waiting for the opportunity. I’m a Stern fan and have been a Star Trek fan as long as I can remember and when George is on Stern the Shatner bashing is endless….some prompted by Howard and co of course…lol. But still he never passes up a chance to bash the Shat.

148. P:SI #262 “That’s Takei as in Toupee” | Project: Shadow - October 23, 2008

[...] Takei Fires Back At Shatner (via TrekMovie.com) [...]

149. Mark - October 23, 2008

Hmmm, the Shat entering into a PR war in a PC society with a gay guy? Not a good move, Bill. He’s gonna be labeled a homophobe pretty soon, mark my words. I agree with Shatner, though: George, ya gotta move on at some point.

150. Gary - October 23, 2008

Im from venezuela, the country that will kick the US’s ass or so says CHAVEZ, lol

VOTE YES!

151. THE MSH - October 23, 2008

The woman interviewing is not so smart either. Shatner was not ranting about Sulu’s wedding, he was making a statement about George’s constant bashing of him in the media.

“Why is Shatner ranting about your wedding?” Oh brother.

152. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#145—-Takei did use the stories about Bill to gain exposure–not admirable in any way, to be sure—but I think the motive was clear. It’s tough to feel sorry for Bill over that for me. After all, Shatner has admitted to less than friendly behavior towards his colleagues. You reap what you sew.

We all know about the failure to correctly pronounce George’s family name for decades. That kind of thing is no doubt irritating, but probably not in itself enough to warrant a grudge. However, Shatner once admitted (confirming what Takei suggested) that he tanked Sulu’s promotion scene in TWOK, explaining that he did it with Takei’s “best interest in mind”. Later, he reversed himself by claiming that was ridiculous and he never did such a thing. Whether he did it or not, he was certainly dishonest about it in one of those claims.

Nichols and Koenig thought he was a jerk, Doohan couldn’t stand him either, and Kelley once went for years without speaking to him (De never said a bad word about anyone) over a personal incident (recounted by Nimoy).

Those stories sell because they are about someone with whom the World is familiar. Even if some of it was jealousy, it is hard to imagine that none of it was warranted or legitimate. Most of us wouldn’t talk about our past co-workers like that simply because Letterman wouldn’t offer us a spot on his show to do it. We don’t have Hollywood acting careers which benefit from any kind of publicity—good or bad.

The point is, while I have little respect for Takei’s tactics, at least I can see that he had something to gain from it.

Shatner should have been above this crap. He wasn’t. He got back on his internet soapbox and started calling names, wallowing in the mud with George Takei. That is why Bill’s behavior is more significant to me.
Back in June, he thought he probably wouldn’t be invited, yet sent his “best wishes” to Takei and Altman. He should have left it there, and been the bigger and better man he is supposed to be.

He didn’t. Instead, he called Takei “sick” and “psychotic”…and for what? Telling stories about a ‘public’ figure in exchange for exposure? Give me a break. That comes with the territory.

Amd I’m still not clear exactly how Takei made a public spectacle of not inviting Bill to the wedding (especially since he now says Bill was invited). If a reporter asks, what’s wrong with answering? All he did was answer that he wasn’t sure if there would be room for Bill back in June. Takei now says he was invited, but didn’t show.

Takei’s behavior is par for the course. Bill’s is just bizzare.

153. EnsignJulka - October 23, 2008

Why can’t they resolve this behind closed doors?? It’s all over the news now! But then again who knows it might bring a lot of publicity for Star Trek, whether in a good way or a bad way who knows…

154. Jason - October 23, 2008

See, he did it again. Bill, c’mon, we like you, we honestly do, but please, when you turn something down- like a role in Trek or an invite to a friend’s wedding- don’t say it’s the other guy who didn’t invite you. Just admit the reason, it’s getting really old.

155. DATA KILLED SPOT! - October 23, 2008

This reminds of the whole conflict Worf and Riker had over Troi’s death in All Good Things .

156. Charley W - October 23, 2008

For those of us that DON’T live in California, you should have mentioned just what Prop 8 is.

157. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

144.

Oh, so you’re saying the cat can’t consent to an unnatural perverted act but humans can. I totally understand now. Thank you for your wisdom, the world is a better place with you in it.

158. supesguy - October 23, 2008

Anthony, thanks for deleting my thoughtful reply but allowing something as offensive as #129 to be posted.

Wow.

159. Red Shirt Extra Number 1649372850 - October 23, 2008

I dont live in Cali but i know how to use a computer and find out what Prop 8 / Proposition 8 was.

Support SHATNER!

160. ensign joe - October 23, 2008

I think Shatner is having a laugh at how easily it is to mess with people.. how every word is hung onto and made into something it is not..

to quote Frank Herbert:

“The person who experiences greatness must have a feeling for the myth he is in. He must reflect what is projected upon him. And he must have a strong sense of the sardonic. This is what uncouples him from belief in his own pretensions. The sardonic is all that permits him to move within himself. Without this quality, even occasional greatness will destroy a man.”

161. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

No offense intended against anyone, ever.

Unlike those who purportedly are for equal rights are some of the most hateful/overly sensitive people in the world.

Live and let live I always say!

162. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#158—I’m sure that when he sees it, it will be deleted…Anthony is pretty good about that. There are alot of posts, but the way I understand it, they are only ‘automatically’ deleted if they contain certain key offensive words.

He may simply have not gotten around to reading it yet (although I just thought it was a joke).

#160—I don’t see how that applies to Shatner, or why you would believe that calling Takei “sick” and “psychotic” is just him “messing with people”.

The simplest answer is most often correct.

In this case, I think Shatner made a mistake in lashing out at Takei. I think he has demonstarted that he is more than willing to get down in the mud with George, and probably just helped add life to Takei’s career on shock-jock shows and late night talk, while diminishing his own image.

It’s only a real story when Bill responds. Well….he responded alright.

163. Enterprise - October 23, 2008

Shatner/Takei 08 – bringing the goofy back to the Presidency.

164. Andy Patterson - October 23, 2008

160

to quote Frank Herbert:

I like that quote.

165. krikzil - October 23, 2008

So let’s recap.

Takei is doing it for publicity and his career but he’s cut more slack about that than Shatner who should “rise above it.” Gotta love these double standards.

As for Shatner going out his way….uh, no. He’s been doing his videolog for fans for quite a while now, discussing stuff that his daughter brings to his attention. It does speak to his popularity that the media obviously follows it and then makes a big deal out of it.

166. Spocks Brain - October 23, 2008

This is better than watching a new generation of startrek episode!

Keep the clips coming !!!

I prefer watching this than stupid soap opera TNG Voyager DS9 or Enterprise episodes!

LOL

Im serious!

167. Enterprise - October 23, 2008

Takei really wanted to date Shatner.

168. Mr. AtoZ - October 23, 2008

Invited? Shatner wasn’t on the guest list! Takei was at Dragon Con this year, he was asked “You’re not inviting Shatner?” his reply was “Oh my no.”

169. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

Shatner and Takei just need to get together, light up a bong, sing kumbaya and then their differences won’t seem so great.

170. classictrek - October 23, 2008

gosh this really saddens me. why is this being thrashed out for all the world to see. talk about hanging your dirty washing out! I hope this is quickly resolves itself as this doesnt make pleasant reading.

very unfortunate state of affairs. we’ll probably never know who’s right or wrong. i want these guys to get together have a drink and a chat and sort out their differences. life is way too short.
Greg UK

171. Mike T. - October 23, 2008

Didn’t this whole mess start when the powers that be wanted Sulu to become Captain of the Excelsior in Trek 2 or 3 and Shatner talked him out of it, since that Sulu’s character would have been promoted right out of future movies?

Also, originally Shatner and Nimoy were the only actors in the opening credits before they added DeForrest Kelly, so Shatner was the star.

I feel bad for Mr. Takei but at least thanks to Trek he is doing well and was on current shows like Heroes.

172. krikzil - October 23, 2008

“Everyone also seems to admire and respect the judgement of DeForest Kelley….who didn’t speak to Shatner for years over a personal incident significant to De, but not to Bill. That’s the pattern.”

As much as I loved and respected De, I’m sorry he over reacted in the situation. WHY did he stop speaking to Shatner? Well, De informed him that his dog had died. Bill is an animal lover and has had dogs forever so he was naturally sympathetic and asked how it happened. De responded that the dog ran head first into a lawn sprinkler and killed itself. Bill naturally laughed. I would have too despite loving animals myself.

“Anyone who meets my youngest sister thinks she’s great and fun to hang out with. If they spend more than a day with her…the true colors come out.:)”

Seems like every family has one, huh? lol

173. Chris Pike - October 23, 2008

oh what a tangled, shamed, rather pathetic and sad web we weave….

174. Mateo NYC - October 23, 2008

uh-oh, the queen is pissed!! They both need to get over it — Shat does have an enormous ego, and Takei needs to just realize that and get over it.

175. Enterprise - October 23, 2008

What does that have to do with anything?

176. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

The bridge still sucks.

(Why didn’t they go for the full 23rd century look as opposed to the tried and true 21st century garden variety version?)

(Love those unis though.)

177. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#165—”Takei is doing it for publicity and his career but he’s cut more slack about that than Shatner who should “rise above it.” Gotta love these double standards.”

That about sums it up.

Takei is a fourth-tier (at best) celebrity, whose career depends upon doing whatever it takes to stay relevant as long as he can.

I like to think that Shatner is at least a B-list star. He has nothing to gain from any of this, but alot of image to sour.

Takei has alot to gain by telling tales about Shatner.

I ‘do’ expect more from someone like Shatner who has built a successful career on merit. Shouldn’t I?

Takei is doing precisely what I would expect him to. How else is anyone on the big-time talk circuit going to find him interesting? What else does he have to offer that’s worth awarding him prized facetime?

Is it fair? Probably not, but in my experience, there’s no such thing anyway. All men (and women) are ‘not’ created equal, as much as we like to say they are. Some are tall. Some are short. Some are more substantial than others. Some are more talented than others. Shatner has far more natural talent than Takei. I therefore expect him to be above some of the things Takei feels it necessary to do. It is about “expectations”.

Some children need to be praised for slightly above average grades. Others need to be prodded to do better than that in order to reach their potential…

Expectations.

178. Canonfornication - October 23, 2008

Bah im bored of this shatner sulu ‘feud’

Lets have sum more Trek 09 news!

179. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

What’s the difference? Ha Ha! I’m glad you asked:

21st century= Busy, overly-detailed

23rd century = streamlined, simple

You see, 200 years from now, scientists will have learned to shrink technology down even more, leading to a more simplified look/design of their machines. Similar to the look of TOS. Who is to say the basic designs of the 60′s show won’t be the look of the 23rd century?

180. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

Shatner has been very self-effacing for years now. People need to lighten up and give him the props he deserves as the King, of Star Trek.

No disrepect to Nimoy, but it was Shatner that sold the series (and a reworked story).

Nevertheless, one would wonder if Lloyd Bridges or Jack Lord could’ve done better.

I think not.

181. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#171—”As much as I loved and respected De, I’m sorry he over reacted in the situation.”

Perhaps, although I find it hard to believe that you would have laughed in Kelley’s face (but I’ll take your word for it). Personally, I thought that story was horrible. If one of my employees came into work looking visually distraught, and told me that his/her dog had died, I think I could keep my bearing even though the cause of death may had been a little strange. I am a combat veteran Marine and probably in most ways a cliche alpha male, but even I am not that insensitive. However, the notion that De over-reacted is a valid opinion.

But again, it is far from one incident, or two, or even three. Shatner was an a__hole on the set of Star Trek. He has even admitted as much, adding that he was somewhat insecure in those days (Well, apparently he still is–IMO–since he felt it necessary to lower himself to a back-and-forth bit with the likes of George Takei just this week).

That in itself isn’t a huge deal, and doesn’t set him apart from alot of “stars” in Hollywood. I just cannot feel sorry for him. He made his own bed a long time ago. Takei has every right to tell those kinds of stories, and takes advantage of it rather routinely.
Do I find it somewhat sad? Yes, but such is the state of Takei’s career. Without that kind of stuff, no one would even care where he was or what he was doing (beyond Trek fans anyway). I ‘don’t’ think he would be on Howard Stern’s radio show, nor do I believe he would be on ‘Heroes’. I think the only reason he has a career beyond the convention circuit is because he is willing to “tell all” when it comes to someone who ‘is’ relevant…William Shatner.

When I read the headline for the article the other day—before I ever bothered to listen to what Bill said—I had to shake my head and ask, “why?”

Why, Bill? What could you possibly have to gain from that?

Another thing…Having his daughter ask the questions make it about as legit an interview as an Al-Queda spokesperson interviewing Osama Bin Laden on a videotape sent to Al-Jazeera. It may have been intended as a shout out to fans in the beginning, but lately, it’s a soapbox for whatever agenda he has, whether it is attacking JJ Abrams or George Takei.

His response back in June to Hollywood access was classy, and just about how a man of appropriate dignity should have approached this. He should have left it at that….but he didn’t. Instead, he got down in the mud.

Very disappointing, and embarassing.

182. Quatlo - October 23, 2008

Insert “Denny Crane fart” here for whoever “We”, as spoken by Mr. Tacky, are.

183. Enterprise - October 23, 2008

When did Shatner start referring himself in the third person?

184. S. John Ross - October 23, 2008

There is a single point of fact on which to judge the entire thing: Takei says Shatner was invited. Shatner says Shatner was not invited.

One of these men _lying,_ and being a bigger/smaller celebrity or having more/less acting talent simply isn’t relevant. It’s disturbing how many people discuss this in those terms.

The liar – whichever man that is – is in the wrong. The other is a victim of slander and has every right to defend himself.

185. DATA KILLED SPOT! - October 23, 2008

I love Takei to death, but what he has to realize is that, like Uhura, his role was appropiate for the time (late-60′s). Of course no one was going to let him steal the show! That would have been controversial for White americans! But probably not as controversial compared to if Uhura (who did have a problem accepting her limited role) or if any of the other women had, let’s say, took command of the ship.

178) It’s pointless trying to predict what technology will look like and be capable of doing, 200 years from now. Heck, we can’t even predict what technology will look like twenty years from now!

The number one thing you have to realize is that a TOS episode was being shot and produced with a very limited budget. If you’ve ever watched 2001: A Space Odyssey ( a movie which had a much larger budget) it’s easier to see the difference money can make in realizing ones vision to the fullest extent.

186. Lendorien - October 23, 2008

Invites get lost in the mail. Happened to my Mom’s cousin when my sister got married. You never know. maybe it feel be hind the mailbox.

The classy thing would have been for Shatner to keep his mouth shut about it. or actually call his former co-cast member and ask.

And likewise with Takai. He could have just responded demurely and say something like, “We did send him an invitation. Perhaps it got lost in the mail. We would have loved to have had him attend.” And then left it at that.

Instead he goes off on a tirade. Both of these gentlemen need to grow up. They’re both certainly at the age where they should have done so long ago.

187. Tim Handrahan - October 23, 2008

Whoever or whatever started this, it is time to end it. NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is an embarassment to them and Star Trek itself. Negative publicity of any kind could only hurt the upcoming film. We have heard enough of the J.J.-Shatner drama. No more is needed. It has been 40 f*&$@%g years! Let it go, BOTH OF YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

188. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#183—I disagree. I don’t think it has anything to do with “right and wrong”.

It has everything to do with dignity, IMO.

I don’t have much respect for Takei publicly airing dirty laundry for the sake of exposure, but at least I can see that he has something to gain.

By stepping down to that level, Bill has nothing to gain, but part of his image to lose.

Bill’s response brought this story from the back page to the middle pages. He should have ignored it, and stood by his response back in June.

If you have to lower yourself and surrender your dignity to defend yourself, whatever it was probably wasn’t worth defending in the first place.

But that’s just my opinion.

189. John from Cincinnati - October 23, 2008

184.

” It’s pointless trying to predict what technology will look like and be capable of doing, 200 years from now.”

Exactly.

Who’s to say it’s going to look like a 2008 iPod store in 2265?

I say keep the gray, black color scheme with new modern materials, screens and controls as opposed to the white, plastic, concierge desk disaster but that’s just me.

190. Headlines for October 23rd | dashPunk - October 23, 2008

[...] Takei Fires Back At Shatner | TrekMovie.com – George Takei takes Willian Shatner down a peg for his ludacris rant. [...]

191. ensign joe - October 23, 2008

187

“If you have to lower yourself and surrender your dignity to defend yourself, whatever it was probably wasn’t worth defending in the first place.”

Tell that to Ghandi.

192. S. John Ross - October 23, 2008

#187: I understand what you’re saying, but it’s all moot if Shatner is, in fact, making up the story to begin with. You say that “Bill’s reponse brought this story from the back page to the middle pages,” but that’s only true _if_ Shatner is telling the truth. If Takei is telling the truth, then Bill’s response wasn’t a response at all.

So again, it comes down to: which man is lying?

193. Negotiator - October 23, 2008

All I know is that without Shatner’s memorable portrayal of Kirk Takei probably would have had to get a real job.

194. S. John Ross - October 23, 2008

#193: And without Shatner’s memorable portrayal of Kirk dozens of stand-up comedians would have to … search … elsewhere! … for-easy-material!

But that doesn’t excuse anyone lying.

195. Stanky McFibberich - October 23, 2008

I wish all celebrity “news” would cease.

196. Jeffries Tuber - October 23, 2008

I hope Shatner joins Takei in campaigning against Prop 8. Can anyone argue that Roddenberry would want different? Equality, progress, tolerance, these are Roddenberry’s legacies.

I for one agree with Whoopi that Shatner is an impish master media manipulator. i think he’s generating publicity for this movie and for himself. If acting like an ass helps Takei get the word out on 8, then it’s a net positive.

197. krikzil - October 23, 2008

“Perhaps, although I find it hard to believe that you would have laughed in Kelley’s face (but I’ll take your word for it).”

Oh certainly not intentionally and with great regret afterwards (I’m the biggest lover of animals around — I trekked to the artic to Polar Bears a few years ago!), but it’s just one of those funny images that can make one laugh out loud without wanting to. Also I think a lot of men, and I’m betting Shatner is one of them, think that those tiny little dogs are mockable to begin with. Given that Shatner has always had Dobermans, I think the image of De’s little dog being able to kill itself on a sprinkler was just too much. Shatner does have a wicked sense of humor.

” It may have been intended as a shout out to fans in the beginning, but lately, it’s a soapbox for whatever agenda he has, whether it is attacking JJ Abrams or George Takei.”

When exactly did he “attack” JJ? He’s said nice things about the guy’s talent and wished the movie well. As for George, well Bill bashing has been quite the sport for a long time now, so he’s entitled to finally speak up. Saying he deserves it for being distant, distracted and not everyone’s best bud on sets 20-40 years ago is a rationalization I can’t buy into.

Granted I wish they could spare us all the silly drama. I’m particularly tired of it cause I’ve listened to it at cons for literally decades.

198. Negotiator - October 23, 2008

Everybody lies! I lie, JJ lies, Shatner lies, Takei lies, the Pope lies and so does # 193. So what’s your point. Mine is, without Kirk, there’s no Sulu.
Without Sulu there’s still Kirk. Takei’s original beef ( excuse the pun ) is about Shatner taking too much credit at the expense of the bit players.
Yet, without Shatner’s part in all this, at whatever cost, Takei, Nichols etc would most likely not have had enjoyed the fruits of success associated with Star Trek.

199. Enterprise - October 23, 2008

Sulu is a insignifiant character in Trek. He barely got an episode.

200. martin - October 23, 2008

Interesting how Shatner is wrong on the issue. Possibly he is a little confused by the number of articles back in June quoting Altman saying:
“We have only 200 seats. Our contact list has, like, 3500 names, so we have to whittle it down. I don’t know if William Shatner is going to make the cut.”

201. Xai, watching "Soap Trek" on that internet machine - October 23, 2008

195. Stanky McFibberich – October 23, 2008
“I wish all celebrity “news” would cease.”

In this case Stanky, you and I are marching to the same drummer.

I think it’s a subject that should not have got this far. It was up to Takei and his partner to make their own choices and people…ALL people… should be cool with that.

#198, 199

So? Takei and Shatner are both guilty in this of two things, pettiness and neither of them were big enough to end this BS long ago.

One of them should end it now. Or both.

202. Leslye - October 23, 2008

One thing nobody has picked up on: When Takei says he hopes Shatner joins him in voting and campaining for Prop 8 (I’m paraphrasing), I thought it was kind of funny. Shatner is a Canadian citizen. I guess the Shat could campaign all he wanted. but he can’t vote. I guess they really don’t know each other at all. This whole thing is silly and they need to grow up all ready! It’s all just really rather sad.

203. Magic_Al - October 23, 2008

I like how smart Takei is to use this media attention as free political advertising. He’s taking a lemon and making lemonade.

204. Leslye - October 23, 2008

#202 Opps! sorry I meant vote no on prop 8

205. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#197—” I think the image of De’s little dog being able to kill itself on a sprinkler was just too much”

Maybe if it were relayed by a total stranger, but by Mr. Kelley himself?

I guess there are two reasons I can’t wrap my head around that.

1) My impression of Mr. Kelley was always like a sweet grandfather. I cannot imagine that if he was telling me that story that I would (even accidentally) humiliate him like that by laughing in his face. Now, of course, I realize that Shatner and Kelley are closer to being contemporaries and evidently, it wasn’t such a big deal to Bill.
2) The only time I ever remember crying as a child was in the days after my first dog had been hit by a car. There is something about ‘dogs’ and a man’s (or woman’s) relationship to them which sets that animal apart to me. Maybe it is unquestioned loyalty…I don’t know.

In any case, I was particularly offended by that story. De Kelley was a bigger man than me for refraining from punching Shatner in the face, as far as I’m concerned. If I were in De’s position, somebody would have taken an ass-whipping that day—him or me. It doesn’t matter. The point would have been made.

“As for George, well Bill bashing has been quite the sport for a long time now…”

As I have said before, I think the “Bill bashing” has been his ticket to the current resurgence of a mediocre career. I don’t think there has really been any “fire” for quite some time there.

Although it is obvious that you don’t see it this way, when I see Bill using a webcam to hurl insults at George Takei in retaliatory fashion, I get embarassed for him…sort of like I get embarassed at seeing a 55 year old man in a convertible sportscar. It just looks ridiculous.

Why does Bill even care?

He never even cared to learn the correct pronounciation of the man’s name, yet this stuff is somehow hurting his feelings? Give me a break. Takei has been wallowing in that kind of mud for some time. We expect it out of him, whether we feel it is justified or not.

Why would Bill get in there with him? It makes no sense to me, unless he is insecure.

206. VOODOO - October 23, 2008

At least you can’t say that these two are boring or bland like the last bunch of Star Trek series.

207. Spocko - October 23, 2008

Somebody needs to lock those two in a room until they finally resolve their issues.

208. Third Remata'Klan - October 23, 2008

Oy.

Hey, do you think Chris Pine and John Cho get along…?

209. krikzil - October 23, 2008

“As I have said before, I think the “Bill bashing” has been his ticket to the current resurgence of a mediocre career. I don’t think there has really been any “fire” for quite some time there. Although it is obvious that you don’t see it this way..”

Oh, I do agree it’s been his ticket. But what I don’t get is how you so easily justify it away but then hold Shatner to such a greater standard. Especially since you clearly think Shatner is an ass. Doesn’t quite compute. And Shatner has only just started responding while the supporting cast has been blaming him for their second tier careers, cloudy days and global warming for decades. ;)

“I were in De’s position, somebody would have taken an ass-whipping that day—him or me. It doesn’t matter. The point would have been made.”

Hmm…I’m having a hard time with your “appropriate responses” index.

Looking back, I can say everyone was pretty nice in the 70s…things went negative in the 80s as the movies were going and Shatner and Nimoy started commanding Millions$$ and writing, acting and directing. (Interesting too that Takei didn’t have the guts to tell Shatner to his face when Bill was researching his Trek memoirs. NO, only Nichelle had the courage to say it to his face.) Then of course everyone had an autobiography to sell in the 90s.

210. max - October 23, 2008

god, I wish I was above the fray but I’m not so here goes my honest opinion. ;-)

I George says he invited Bill but Bill didn’t RSVP I’m inclined to believe him. Bill apparently missed that. He’s obviously a busy man. That can happen.

Just a few weeks ago we had Bill adressing a statement from Abrams in a way that seemed like he didn’t actually read the statement he was responding to. He does this sort of thing.

Look, I love Shatner. I really do. But he’s an old man now. We really shouldn’t be shocked when he acts like a forgetful or easily confused old man. That’s not a diss a Shatner. That’s just nature taking its coarse.

211. gooser - October 23, 2008

sulu is aging pretty good

212. max - October 23, 2008

#144. LOL! If anyone can get their cat to concede to marriage, then by god they’ve earned the right to marry that cat. More power to them.

In my district we have our own Proposition 8, but it goes by a different name. I lot of you probably do. Just vote no no matter what they call it.

213. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

#209—”I’m having a hard time with your “appropriate responses” index.”

Like I said, Mr. Kelley (RIP) was a better man than me. Nobody’s perfect, least of all me.

“you clearly think Shatner is an ass.”

I always knew he had a big ego. But that’s to be expected. ther are certain people we(and I use that term very generally) expect to have big egos…

The Heavyweight Champion of the World.
A Presidential candidate.
Commanding General of a powerful army.
Centerfielder for the Yankees.
Quarterback for the Dallas Cowboys.
Oscar winning director.
CEO of a “Fortune 500″ company.
Leading man in a television series.

That never bothered me, and Takei’s stories were just something I found amusing.

Honestly, I always thought he could be a little goofy, but that was part of his charm. I didn’t really begin to think of him as a ‘total ass’ until about a year ago. I thought he really showed a lack of grace and class with the whole in-or-out of the movie business, and this junk with Takei is just the most recent entry.

“…what I don’t get is how you so easily justify it away but then hold Shatner to such a greater standard”.

I don’t justify it at all. In fact, I thought I had made clear that I have very little respect for Takei’s tactics. The only difference to me is that at least I can see that he had something to gain (furthering his career) by being willing to air it publicly. I don’t consider that a “justification”, but simply an explanation (as bad as it is).

As for holding Shatner to a greater standard, he is a bigger star. My expectations ‘should’ be greater for him, IMO. What does he have to gain by lowering himself to Takei’s realm? Nothing.

Takei ‘has’ been telling those stories for twenty years…So what changed? why does it bother Bill so much today, when in June, he had nothing but “best wishes” for George and his partner?

I don’t get it.

For decades, Shatner didn’t think enough of Takei to learn to pronounce his name, but now—all of a sudden, Bill is offended? George is “psychotic” and “sick”?

What the Hell is he talking about?

The bottom line is, there was nothing to this so-called “feud” until Bill’s rabid response his week.

It’s not about taking sides, or who is right and who is wrong to me. The only one who benefits from this is Takei. Now he has something else to talk about on Stern…A year from now, he’ll be telling Conan about it…Then Letterman.

Shatner should have left it at “best wishes”…

214. 4 8 15 16 23 42 - October 23, 2008

You know what I think is really sad? Of all the great Trek related news that I have seen on this site lately, the ONLY item to make the ‘serious’ news source I read — BBC News — is this rigmarole between Shatner and Takei. Truly sad.

215. krikzil - October 23, 2008

“As for holding Shatner to a greater standard, he is a bigger star. My expectations ’should’ be greater for him, ”

I guess I don’t buy that lesser stars are somehow “lesser” people, with a lower expectation threshold from the rest of us.

I’m sorry this has all gotten so ugly between them but I’ve always thought Bill’s restraint through the years went a long way in disproving that he was a souless SOB in reality. Con after con, year after year, he never responded in kind. Takei’s behavior in this one area has puzzled me greatly since he’s such a warm and friendly guy. The Shatner bashing — especially as a means to promote a career — is just so bizarre in someone who seems so grounded otherwise.

216. Closettrekker - October 23, 2008

Years ago, my unit was sent to a joint Army-Marine Corps field exercise at Ft. Bragg, N.C.

One of my squad leaders was sent briefly back to Camp Lejeune and was scheduled to return to the unit the following morning. What I can tell you about this Marine was that he loved his wife like no other. She was all he talked about with his fellow NCO’s.
While he was back on base, he decided to pay a surprise visit to her while he had a few hours…Well, she was surprised alright. He found her and a local car salesman in what can only be described as a “compromising position”. He lost control and beat both of them severely.

I don’t condone domestic violence in any shape or form, but (so help me) I hardly felt sorry for his wife. One of his fellow NCO’s actually had to testify for the prosecution, and afterwards, he conveyed to me that he felt the same way. He said his obligation to testify as to what another Marine told prosecutors he could confirm had been told to him by the defendant after the fact made him sick to his stomach. I understood completely. I too felt more sympathy for the Marine than I did his wife or her “friend”. But I still signed the order, along with my own direct superior, to recommend a Court-Martial for two counts of Assault, Conduct Unbecoming a United States Marine, and Unauthorized Absence (as he failed to return on time as ordered).

I am quite capable of disliking Takei’s tactics without feeling sympathy for Bill. That isn’t the same thing as “justifying” those tactics…Just as the man I told you about had a “reason” to do what he did, so did Takei. Neither “reason” is a justification, though.

None of this is very admirable.

217. krikzil - October 23, 2008

Closettrekker — you couldn’t have known this but you really couldn’t have picked a worse story to tell me. I work in a Family Violence Bureau so sympathy for someone who commits such a violent assault is foreign to me.

218. Bob Bastard - October 23, 2008

I can’t believe people actually care about this bullshit.

219. Teleportation Girl - October 23, 2008

I find the whole feud between Shatner and Takei very sad.

You could guess that Shatner might be uncomfortable working with gay actors, perhaps. He does come from a generation that was more rigid in their thinking about such matters. However, it also seems to me that there is more to it than that. He is throwing insults around, totally rejecting his former crew members. To me it feels like he has a lot of anger around the whole idea of Star Trek, his identity as an actor and how he feels about his legacy.

Whatever the case, it is not really for any of us to make judgements about other people’s motivations. I mean, we really have no idea what the truth is. All I can say is that I feel for them both and hope that some sort of peaceful resolution can happen. Their careers have brought a lot of great entertainment to us all. I hope that within their private lives, they can have the same kind of fulfillment and happiness.

220. Gabriel Bell - October 23, 2008

Um, 216 … floating off topic much? Hopefully AP will delete this offensive and completely irrelevant post.

221. Jeff - October 23, 2008

I remember watching two crabby old men argue in a parking lot once. They nearly came to blows. I guess it doesn’t matter how rich and famous you are … you can still be crabby old men.

222. NoRez - October 23, 2008

Well, you know who’s going to get this hatchet buried at some point….

Howard.

223. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 23, 2008

As someone who has attended conventions and other events since the 70s, I can say over the years, Takei–for all of his “good guy” act, has used many events to verbally assault Shatner, while in the times that i’ve seen Shatner, he did not even come close to saying anything negative about Takei.

One person is a bitter supporting player still failing to grow beyond the effects of a job designed to be exactly as it was offered to him (in other words, Roddenberry did not promise the coming of “Captain Sulu” during TOS’ production), the other is not.

Why is anyone shocked at Shatner’s comments? He’s never wasted HIS years blasting Takei every time he’s near a camera or microphone, so after decades of playing nice, he’s had enough. Anyone would under the same set of circumstances.

Takei is a walking embarassment to have wasted so many years railing against a person who happened to be–through luck of casting and real talent–one of the faces of a major entertainment franchise.

Takei should take a long look within and be thankful he’s even remembered to this day in the role given to him; countless former 1960′s TV supporting players are not so lucky, not even rating a spot as a trivia question today (not to mention not working in the business with all of its opportunities anymore).

Grow up, Mr. Takei.

224. CMX54 - October 23, 2008

George, stand tall and never fear. Bill is the sick one, not you.

225. S. John Ross - October 24, 2008

#223 sez “Why is anyone shocked at Shatner’s comments?”

For starters, he’s not qualified to declare that it’s “patently obvious” that someone is a psychotic. That said, I think many of us are just disappointed in Bill’s latest little episode, not “shocked.”

226. Daithí - October 24, 2008

You would think given that both these men have more days behind them than ahead that they would just bury the damn hatchet, so Shatner was a pr*ck and an ego maniac on the show who cares get over it lads!

227. Closettrekker - October 24, 2008

#216—”I guess I don’t buy that lesser stars are somehow “lesser” people, with a lower expectation threshold from the rest of us.”

Now that is putting words in my mouth. Shatner has earned a greater status in Hollywood than Takei has, and therefore has nothing to gain by telling stories as George does. He doesn’t need to lay down in the gutter to further his career. That is where the “expectations” come from. I don’t ‘expect’ him to lash out at someone of Takei’s ilk in Hollywood. It is beneath him and the successful career he has built.

I never said Takei was a “lesser person”, just a lower-tier entertainer. That is hardly the same thing.

#217—I completely understand, and doing such work is very admirable. Keep it up.

As an active citizen and businessowner within my own community, I have helped to furnish homes for women who are the victims of domestic abuse and their children. We do it every year.

The point of that story was that both of them were wrong. I can disapprove of the retaliatory behavior without feeling sorry for the other.

#220—Reality is often ‘offensive’. Whether it gets deleted or not is his perogative. I told that story to illustrate a point within the context of a larger relevant discusion with a particular poster (therefore I disagree that it is completly off-topic), without getting into much detail. The “whole” story is alot worse.

#225—”I think many of us are just disappointed in Bill’s latest little episode, not “shocked.”

Well said.

228. DrNebuloso - October 24, 2008

They are doing this on purpose. Look at the attention both of them are getting.

229. Closettrekker - October 24, 2008

#228—I think Takei did it on purpose (purposely telling those stories for decades in order to keep himself relevant). Shatner has nothing to gain by courting negative attention. It was, IMO, far beneath him to lash out like that.

Shatner could have easily continued to let the public judge Takei by ignoring that and sluffing it off. Instead, he chose to sink to that level and diminish his own public image to some degree.

What perplexes me is the timing. Why now, all of a sudden, does it hurt him? For decades, he never cared enough to learn the man’s name, yet ‘now’ he is so offended by George’s recounting of these stories that he calls him “psychotic” and “sick”?

Disappointing.

230. Peter Lemonjello - October 24, 2008

Shatner owes Takei an apology.

231. No Use For A Name - October 24, 2008

MARRIAGE is SACRED!

BWA-HA-HA-HA AH-HA-HA

232. The Seeker - October 24, 2008

Hey, could this be a set-up for Shatners new show Raw Nerve? Make a fuss and Takei comes on for a 1 to 1 with big viewing figures. It all seems like a set-up that has backfiered.

233. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 24, 2008

225. S. John Ross – October 24, 2008
#223 sez “Why is anyone shocked at Shatner’s comments?”

“For starters, he’s not qualified to declare that it’s “patently obvious” that someone is a psychotic. That said, I think many of us are just disappointed in Bill’s latest little episode, not ‘shocked.’”

Actually, there can be cause to question the psychological status of anyone who has spent decades attacking someone who was (in the honest, grand scheme of things) a coworker, nothing more. Shatner (as I said before), is probably at the point where after his own decades of not tearing down Takei, is sick of the combined bitcy suggestions, accusations, and misplaced whining Takei has made a career off of.

Anyone would be tired of the collective character assassination attempts, so I can understand the motives behind Shatner having enough of it all.

Reiterating,Takei is bitter for the spoils of a franchise not going his way; Shatner was the star of the series, not Takei, yet the latter party cannot wrap his head around that fact, or that Shatner’s personality and talents elevating the role of Kirk to something generations of fans loved and tied to the heart of what that OS meant. This would be as moronic a stand down the pecking order as if Butch Patrick whined about his Eddie Munster character never getting his “due” because of Fred Gwynne hogging the spotlight as Herman Munster! That would not make much sense, would it? Therefore, it applies just the same to Takei’s lower rung on the importance/fame ladder and the job he was given some 4+ decades ago.

Instead, Takei has transformed himself into one of the most unjustified whiners in entertanment history, right up there with Bela Lugosi’s petty, weak minded anger directed at Boris Karloff.

He created the hostie situation by not accepting reality decades ago. Now, he dares to play the injured party when someone calls him out on his near lifetime of hatred, which all of Trek fandom–and the general media witnessed all along.

234. Holger - October 24, 2008

125: Yes. The question is: does this tell us something about public forums, or about Shatner and Takei, or about both? :-)

235. Peter Lemonjello - October 24, 2008

Writer Peter David confirms on his Blog that Shatner was indeed invited to the wedding. The invite was sent to Shatners manager, who presumably did not forward it to Shatner himself.

236. star trackie - October 24, 2008

Looks like George is oneof those types who like it dish it out but when the slop flies the other direction, he just can’t take it. Oh well.

237. Peter Lemonjello - October 24, 2008

It’s sad to see so many siding with the arrogant fat boated lier that is Shatner.

238. Closettrekker - October 24, 2008

#233—”…there can be cause to question the psychological status of anyone who has spent decades attacking someone who was (in the honest, grand scheme of things) a coworker, nothing more.”

While that might ‘generally’ be true, I have to disagree in this case.

Takei has a clear motive for being willing to recount those stories for the likes of Stern, Letterman, and Conan. It keeps me somewhat relevant, whereas otherwise, it is hard to imagine he would be at all. He wouldn’t have his face out there if not for the willingness to do that. I cannot imagine him with a semi-regular spot on Stern, nor can I imagine him being wanted on the late-night talk circuit.

While it doesn’t make his “tell-all tactics” right, it is certainly calculated and logically reasoned. I have no doubt that, at least at some point, that stuff really bothered Takei. However, it is certainly clear to me that–at this point—it is a tool to garner exposure and further his career. If not for some measure of recent popularity on Stern, I doubt he would have the somewhat resurgent career outside of the Trek conventions he is having (with ‘Heroes’, for example).

These are hardly the actions of someone in “psychosis”, IMO. Rather, they are more likely the actions of a man who will do whatever it takes to further his career.

On the other hand, Shatner’s lashing out may suggest that something is wrong there.

Once again, for decades, he has heard Takei tell these stories. In that time, Shatner never even cared enough about George to learn the man’s name. Back in June, he said that he had nothing but “best wishes” for Takei and his partner, and that Takei deserved some piece of happiness.

So, I ask you….What changed?

Why now, after 20 years of hearing this, does Bill suddenly get offended enough by Takei’s storytelling to have his daughter ask him about it on a webcam, and hurl such insults?
And more importantly, what does Bill have to gain by stooping to that level and doing so? Unlike Takei, he doesn’t need any dirty laundry to get attention. His career and legacy is far more stable than George’s. What does he need this for?

Disappointing.

239. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 24, 2008

Re:236. star trackie – October 24, 2008
“Looks like George is oneof those types who like it dish it out but when the slop flies the other direction, he just can’t take it. Oh well.”

Seems to be the case.

240. Closettrekker - October 24, 2008

#234—Definitely both.

241. dalek - October 24, 2008

Brilliant. This is better than Star Trek has been for 10 years.

I call for the next movie “The Wrath of Takei”…

Here’s to round 3 :)

242. Closettrekker - October 24, 2008

#239—The problem is, we know now that not only is Takei willing to wallow in the “slop” for career gain (which we have known for decades), but Shatner isn’t above it either…only he (unlike George) has no tangible gain to achieve.

243. Shatner_Fan_2000 - October 24, 2008

Closet, I doubt pre-teen girls discuss Disney’s “High School Musical” cast as much as you discuss Shatner and Takei.

;-)

244. steve - October 24, 2008

My two cents: I am on George’s side. Shatner’s ego is legendary. This feud is silly though.

245. Closettrekker - October 24, 2008

#243—-If the cast of “High School Musical” could create enough controversy to establish grounds for a good debate (which I love, as you know so well), I might give them a run for their money.

Nah.

246. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 24, 2008

Re: 238. Closettrekker – October 24, 2008
“Takei has a clear motive for being willing to recount those stories for the likes of Stern, Letterman, and Conan. It keeps me somewhat relevant, whereas otherwise, it is hard to imagine he would be at all. He wouldn’t have his face out there if not for the willingness to do that. I cannot imagine him with a semi-regular spot on Stern, nor can I imagine him being wanted on the late-night talk circuit.

While it doesn’t make his “tell-all tactics” right, it is certainly calculated and logically reasoned. I have no doubt that, at least at some point, that stuff really bothered Takei. However, it is certainly clear to me that–at this point—it is a tool to garner exposure and further his career. If not for some measure of recent popularity on Stern, I doubt he would have the somewhat resurgent career outside of the Trek conventions he is having (with ‘Heroes’, for example).”

However, because his Shatner-bashing started long before Conan, Stern, Letterman and others were ever on the air, it forces one to see Takei’s hate rants as being obsessive, as he was again–a co-worker entitled to nothing from Shatner.

He saw the dawn of the 70s, with the Trek syndication & merchandising boom, and somehow–when seeing so much of the attention and merchandisng focus going to Shatner (while ignoring the same for Nimoy and to a lesser degree Kelley) created his own sense of entitlement, when even a casual glance at how TV was packaged and merchandised in the 60s and 70s would have told him that he was a on a level generally ignored, in favor of the most popular, bankable stars. He could not accept this.

Truth be told, Takei needed to realize that to those obtaining rights to produce or merchandise Trek did not hold Sulu in high regard. I recall Nimoy having to take up the cause for Filmation to include Sulu (and Uhura) on their animated series, as they were not serious considerations for the cast (I never heard of Roddenberry caring either way when the series was in development).

Then, there’s merchandise: when the Mego Corporation launched its 8-inch action figure line, the first wave included Kirk, Spock, McCoy, Scotty and “The Klingon.” NOT Sulu. When one, last Starfleet crew member was added, Uhura made the cut, followed by a series of aliens..still, no Sulu. So, in two distinct cases, it is clear few ever placed much value in the Sulu character at a time when Trek was becoming a seriously mainstream property. This had nothing to do with Shatner’s behavior during the production of the OS; likely, had more to do with Roddenberry, et al, using the Sulu character as he was designed to be used–and that’s not as a major player, hence the ease at which companies in the years to come ignored the character.

Perspective…and business practiced escape Takei, past, present, and there’s no reason to think he will ever “get it” in the future.

He would rather make Shatner out to be a Grand Schemer / egomaniac / master of greed, when Shatner was never responsible for Takei’s lack of opportunity, failures or the nature of the entertainment industry.

“Once again, for decades, he has heard Takei tell these stories. In that time, Shatner never even cared enough about George to learn the man’s name. Back in June, he said that he had nothing but “best wishes” for Takei and his partner, and that Takei deserved some piece of happiness.

So, I ask you….What changed?

Why now, after 20 years of hearing this, does Bill suddenly get offended enough by Takei’s storytelling to have his daughter ask him about it on a webcam, and hurl such insults?”

As I touched on before, though he made the June statement, I really think he had a period of reflection to think about why he continued to play nice for over 40 years, right up to this year, when Takei–at every chance–blasts him. Enough is enough. Shatner, if anything has earned the right to say anything he wants, as for the oft-mentioned 4+ decades, this has been a one-sided “war” initiated by Takei.

Having posted this, I do think there is great cause to question Takei’s mental health….that, or the man is just evil with his open hatred for someone who did not guide the highs and lows of his life.

247. Iowagirl - October 24, 2008

#243, 245

Just wait until you see Abrams’ Trek version of Disney’s High School Musical…:)

#246
Agreed.

Nobody’s denying that Shatner’s ego is sort of a person of its own ;), but what does it say about Takei’s ego if he keeps ranting after all those years and – even more important – seems to be still enjoying it or still isn’t able or willing to cope with the situation after more than 40 years? He should zoom in on the really important things in his life now, his husband, Prop 8, etc.

248. Closettrekker - October 24, 2008

#246—No one has earned the right to say what he wants in public without being judged.

I still don’t see the catalyst for Shatner’s sudden public reaction. His comment about it in June was the correct course, IMO. Only Shatner knows why he did what he did and changed direction for the worse.

Takei’s place in Star Trek history and the type of career he has had since is not in question. As I said before, he is a fourth-tier (at best) celebrity figure. Shatner, on the other hand, is an active success. I would call him a B-list star in Hollywood terms.

There may very well be other cause for questioning Takei’s mental health. I don’t know the man. However, I have never seen his storytelling as anything but a tool to get attention. That seemed to be “his thing” to offer to fans who found it amusing, even long ago. He, more than any of the others (some of whom have told their own Shatner stories at times), has been willing to take advantage of it for personal gain. It is now “currency” to him for facetime and exposure. Those are not the actions of a ‘sick’ man. They are the actions of a man with a purpose more important to him than discretion or dignity, IMO.

I always felt that Shatner (for the most part) was quite admirably behaved in basically ignoring much of that…even taking the proverbial high road. I thought it was a sign of having evolved since his self-admitted insecurities and poor behavior on the set back then…in other words, maturity.

That went completely out the window this week.

Now Takei has more ‘storytime’ to offer the late night circuit. Right or wrong, he ends up the winner in all of this. Nothing better could happen to him than Entertainment Tonight showing his face as much as possible… It was never really a “feud” until Shatner got in the mud with him.

Disappointing.

249. Xai - October 24, 2008

Closettrekker, Compassionate God, Iowagirl, etc…

Frankly, there IS no real truth here..
Two mature men of any stature or position should have had the b#lls years ago to work this out or just ignore the other guy.
One whines, one has a superiority complex but if questioned about the other, he should be stating “I wish him the best” and move on to the next subject.
Neither of these men are coming across in the best light when they insult the other. It diminishes them and us for reading the crap.

This is no better than trash TV or a supermarket tabloid and IMO both the threads should be closed. But that is Anthony’s call, not mine.
I’d rather talk about red bridge rails than “When Celebritys Attack”. I won’t be back on this thread.
X

250. Chris Mulrooney - October 24, 2008

Thats Shitner *I mean Shatner* I have had a runin with him after an issue with Shatner. He talks about people supporting the troops and singe 2005 has never showed up or shown a support for my Org Trek to the Troops other of his co stars and other actors of Star Trek has. Which is great. and his book “Up Till Now” Talk slanderous about Gene Roddenberry. I only got to page 30 then I threw it in a box. I got sick when I read the words. so I made a post Up Till now I was a Shatner fan”

251. Closettrekker - October 24, 2008

#247—”Just wait until you see Abrams’ Trek version of Disney’s High School Musical…:)”

Is there a ‘mystery hatch’ in one of the kids’ lockers?

Perhaps there will be a flashback scene to previously never-before-seen depictions of “Pre-School Musical” and “Kindergarten Musical”…

I wonder if Bob and Alex would sign on to write the script…

Maybe they will have all the kids faces melt off at the first sign of singing…and of course, a bald man with no eyebrows carrying a briefcase lurking about…

I wonder what Walter would say.

252. DATA KILLED SPOT! - October 24, 2008

Space!
(Space!)
The final frontier!
(Says who)
Well….ME!
(Captain James T. Kirk?)
Yes!
(Dramatic Pause)
And these are the voyages of the-
(Wait!)
What?
(We already know what you are about to say)
THE STARSHIP ENTERPRISE!
A FEAST FOR THE EYES!
IN THE 23RD CENTURY!
THERE WILL BE TOTAL UNITY!
SPACE! THE FINAL FRONTIER!
BOYS AND GIRLS, HAVE NOTHING TO FEAR!
I AM CAPTAIN JAMES T. KIRK!
AND MY CREW WILL WEAR MINISKIRTS!
( No! Just the women! The men will wear spandex)
OH NO! LOOK! IT’S A BIRD OF PREY!
(WE’RE DOOMED!)
NO! I SHALL SAVE THE DAY!

253. Ivory - October 24, 2008

Takei deserves what he got from Shatner. He has been publicly taunting Shatner for at least 15 years.

It looks like Shatner had had enough and finally fired back.

Also, why is Takei using this as a soapbox to push his poltical agenda?

P.S. I have nothing against Prop 8,. I just find Takei somehow using this ongoing argument with Shatner to push his agenda a little odd.

254. admiral R - October 24, 2008

It’s crap like this that spoils the fun of new Trek movie!!

255. Shatner_Fan_2000 - October 24, 2008

247 … “Just wait until you see Abrams’ Trek version of Disney’s High School Musical”

Oh, I’m gonna see it alright. May 8th, right? ;-)

256. Matthew_Briggsuk - October 24, 2008

Maybe there could be aJeremy Kyle or Dr Phil special about these 2.

Let’s finally get these 2 together and bury the hatchett have some peace

257. Trek Fan - October 24, 2008

Obviously, it was edited to make Takei look as good as possible.

258. ETMoody3 - October 24, 2008

I would like to advocate the cooling of passions about this.

These men are entertainers by trade. Entertainers need publicity.

There has been copious amounts of publicity here.

I do not suggest that publicity is the motivation, I cannot read anyone’s minds. Both men in question are not eschewing the press on this issue. By observation it is reasonable to assume that the publicity is not unwanted.

Personally , I find it somewhat amusing because it seems quite trivial but so much passion has flared over it.

259. THE MSH - October 24, 2008

It’s simple, Shatner just got sick of Takei talking bad about him in the media for so many years. He finally just answered back that he is sick of it, and to either forgive what Takei has a problem with, or shut up. I mean talk about “obsession”, it has a sickly sweet smell to it, if you ask me.

Sulu was just the transparent helmsman. AYE CAPTAIN, WARP 4, PLOTTED IN SIR, IT’S COLD DOWN HERE, WARPING OUT OF ORBIT SIR, YA YA YA YA…stabbing actions.

That was Sulu’s entire contribution to the entire show, except for the Mirror Mirror episode.

I guess if it wasn’t for Bill he would have had bigger parts…eh? Maybe he just wanted bigger parts…EH?

260. S. John Ross - October 24, 2008

#233: I never said anything about “cause to question.” What I said was factual – not speculation, not characterization, not opinion, nor a matter of taste. A simple, actual fact.

They’re rare around here. I guess it’s hard to spot ‘em as they whiz by :)

261. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 24, 2008

Re: 260 S. John Ross”
“I never said anything about “cause to question.” What I said was factual – not speculation, not characterization, not opinion, nor a matter of taste. A simple, actual fact.”

I disagree, John. Your “he’s not qualified to declare that it’s “patently obvious” that someone is a psychotic” is opinion, too…not fact. In history, when people who met then-future killers such as Mark D. Chapman, said they believed him to be crazy/unhinged, or a sociopath before his infamous act, were they incorrect because they were not licensed psychologists? The end result of Chapman’s ill behavior would argue in favor of the witnesses being qualified.
In this case, Shatner is correct: aside from Closettrekker’s financial theory, Takei’s neverending hate-filled rants about someone who was of no great personal relation to Takei began long before the nighttme TV shows ever paid attention to his Hate-a-thon. Takei exposed his beyond obsession behavior in the 1970s at conventions. While Shatner moved on to non-Trek projects, without so much a paragraph dedicated to any aspect of Takei, the former Sulu could not abandon his obsession. When one is obsessed for DECADES, and so filled with hate and campaigns of character assassination, it appears as darn near close to the definition of psychotic as possible:
“A mental state caused by psychiatric or organic illness, characterized by a loss of contact with reality and an inability to think rationally. A psychotic person often behaves inappropriately and is incapable of normal social functioning.”
Takei has behaved “inappropriately” with his hatred for decades.
Takei, in creating his Shatner-is-all-that-is-wrong-in-my-world fantasy has lost (as the definition states) “contact with reality and an inability to think rationally.” No rational, healthy mind could concieve and agressively push such warped, hate filled propaganda about another for decades without being exactly as Shatner described him. And remember, some psychotics can appear “normal” to those not in their targeting sight, but when the object of their obsession appears, the mind returns to the ill thoughts and fantasies…in Takei’s case, blaming Shatner for his own failures,etc.

262. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 24, 2008

Re: 260 S. John Ross”
“I never said anything about “cause to question.” What I said was factual – not speculation, not characterization, not opinion, nor a matter of taste. A simple, actual fact.”

I disagree, John. Your “he’s not qualified to declare that it’s “patently obvious” that someone is a psychotic” is opinion, too. In history, when people who met then-future killers such as Mark D. Chapman, said they believed him to be crazy/unhinged, or a sociopath before his infamous act, were they incorrect because they were not licensed psychologists? The end result of Chapman’s ill behavior would argue in favor of the witnesses being qualified.

In this case, Shatner is correct: aside from Closettrekker’s financial theory, Takei’s neverending hate-filled rants about someone who was of no great personal relation to Takei began long before the nighttme TV shows & morning talk radio ever paid attention to his Hate-a-thon. Takei exposed his beyond obsession behavior in 1970s at conventions.

While Shatner moved on to non-Trek projects, without so much a paragraph dedicated to any aspect of Takei, the former Sulu could not abandon his obsession. When one is obsessed for DECADES, and so filled with hate and campaigns of character assassination, it appears as darn near close to the definition of psychotic as possible:

“A mental state caused by psychiatric or organic illness, characterized by a loss of contact with reality and an inability to think rationally. A psychotic person often behaves inappropriately and is incapable of normal social functioning.”

Takei has behaved “inappropriately” with his neverending attempt to assassinate Shatner to media and fans; his hatred has lasted for decades.

Takei, in creating his Shatner-is-all-that-is-wrong-in-my-world fantasy has lost (as the definition states) “contact with reality and an inability to think rationally.”

No rational, healthy mind could concieve and agressively push such warped, hate filled propaganda about another for decades without being exactly as Shatner described him. And remember, some psychotics can appear “normal” to those not in their targeting sight, but when the object of their obsession appears, the mind returns to the ill thoughts and fantasies…in Takei’s case, blaming Shatner for his own failures,etc.

263. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 24, 2008

Sorry for the double post!

264. Iowagirl - October 24, 2008

#255

…spot-on…:)

265. Jack - October 24, 2008

If you’re not allowing political posts — then don’t allow political posts. Allowing select ones, even if they’re at the start of the thread, and not others = not so cool.

266. S. John Ross - October 25, 2008

#262: I never said anything about “correct” or “incorrect.” What I said was factual – not speculation, not characterization, not opinion, nor a matter of taste. A simple, actual fact.

267. Dave - October 25, 2008

I think they should both have gay sex together, then that will be the end of it.

268. DATA KILLED SPOT! - October 25, 2008

Dave, shut up.

269. Closettrekker - October 25, 2008

#262—I don’t think that, even by the definition you provided, Takei would qualify as “psychotic” (although I am no more a qualified psychologist than William Shatner is).

Let’s look at your definition.

““A mental state caused by psychiatric or organic illness, characterized by a loss of contact with reality and an inability to think rationally. A psychotic person often behaves inappropriately and is incapable of normal social functioning.”

Loss of contact with reality?

I have never heard anything which suggests that George Takei has lost contact with reality. Even your suggestion that he blames Shatner for all of his shortcomings on life is a stretch. The only thing he has talked about is that Bill was so insulting that, despite working alongside him for 3 years on a television show and 6 feature films—Shatner never displayed the courtesy of pronouncing his name correctly, accused him of having a huge ego (demanding more facetime, lobbying for all the good lines, etc), and accused him of tanking scenes that were not Kirk-centric at times. Shatner has admitted all of this (even though he has since changed his story about the TWOK promotion scene bit). How does that demonstrate a loss of contact with reality?

Inability to think rationally?

I would argue that deducing correctly that trading “dirty laundry” about Shatner for laughs at conventions, airtime on Howard Stern, and for invitations to late night talk shows that have enormous audiences in an attempt to keep himself somewhat relevant in Hollywood is a perfect example of thinking rationally. Morality and rationality are not the same thing.

Inappropriate behavior is often subjective, so let’s assume that most ‘inappropriate behavior’ that society can agree upon is criminal or taboo. None of Takei’s behavior fits that description. His comments are not libelous.

Incapable of normal social functioning?

Let’s see. He maintains a healthy, long term, and presumably monogamous relationship. He seems to be regarded quite well as one of the more “personable” Star Trek guests at conventions. I don’t think those are the qualities of an individual who is “incapable of normal social functioning”.

The suggestion that George Takei is “psychotic” for publicly speaking poorly about William Shatner over the years is absurd to me. He doesn’t even come close to fitting the definition you provided.

It is as simple as this. Bill is someone he doesn’t care much for, and people like to hear stories about him (good and bad). In fact, they are willing to put Takei in front of a large television or radio audience to do so.

George isn’t “sick”, just because “Dr.” Bill Shatner says so. That’s ridiculous. I didn’t, for one minute, believe that Shatner meant that as anything but an insult—certainly not as a concerned diagnosis…

270. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 25, 2008

Closettrekker, there’s little to no rational behavior in obsessive character assassination for decades.

I think some do not truly comprehend what it means to do a thing for DECADES. In the positive sense (ex. a person was a good social worker for 30 – 40 years), it reveals dedication to something–generally something beneficial to a life. On the opposite end, if a person is a stalker, a hate-monger or in Takei’s case, engaging in neverending character assassination for the same amount of time, that reveals nothing except a serious psychological problem, and again, this was going on long before there were interested TV & radio programs for Takei to use for a quick buck.

Keep in mind that psychotics–particuarly those where the syndrome is based on some external focus (here, a person) have been known to turn it on and off, meaning just because Takei does not treat others in this way does not mean that his mind is not ill in its obsessive hatred of a person he once shared a job with on a few projects.

There is nothing remotely normal about that, and I reiterate that Shatner very likely thought to himself that after he DID NOT spend 40 years blasting Takei at every opportunity, played nice, but still gets crap tossed in his face, why is stll giving this guy a break about anything?

For anyone still questioning Shatner’s response, place yourself in this specific situation: being the recipient of public character assassination for decades by a person you only really knew at a job.

How would you feel about such a person?

Would you think his behavior was normal on any level?

271. Son of Hugh - October 25, 2008

in response to COMPASSiONATE GOD and closettrekker.

It’s like what Spock said in “The Alternative Factor”

“Madness has no purpose but it may have a goal.”

272. Son of Hugh - October 25, 2008

And to the people that want to make sense of this ongoing feud,
Recall what Spock said in “Let That Be Your Last Battlefield”

“To expect sense from 2 invididuals with such extreme viewpoints is not logical.”

273. will - October 25, 2008

Looks like this “fight” was just a publicity stunt to get the commercial, er, interview about Proposition 8 onto Entertainment Tonight.

274. Closettrekker - October 25, 2008

#270—”…if a person is…in Takei’s case, engaging in neverending character assassination for the same amount of time, that reveals nothing except a serious psychological problem,…”

There isn’t a shred of truth to that, IMO. How do you define attention-craving as a “serious psychological problem”. It certainly isn’t psychosis, especially using the definition you have yourself provided.

It doesn’t demonstrate a person “incapable of normal social behavior”. He isn’t any more “psychotic” than my wife’s hairdresser!

Nor does it demonstrate that he has an “inability to think rationally”, especially since it has ‘always’ gotten him the attention he seeks. That is the very definition of rational thinking.

“…and again, this was going on long before there were interested TV & radio programs for Takei to use for a quick buck.”

And before that, he did it to sell books…before that, he did it because people at conventions found it amusing, and it gave Takei something to offer that others who disliked Shatner (like Doohan, Koenig, Nichols, and for a while, Kelley) were less willing to share.

There was always a reason for him to be willing to share those stories.

There have always been people interested in hearing it. It used to be restricted to fans at conventions, etc. Now it is just a broader audience.

The fact that Takei craves and garners attention does not, in any way, shape, or form, make him “psychotic”.

One of his largest assets as a lower-tier celebrity is his knowledge of Shatner (who is a bigger celebrity) stories. Using it to an advantage (at any level, not just on Letterman) is completely rational, even if it is distasteful.

Labeling him “psychotic” is far beyond a reach. It is absurd.

275. P Technobabble - October 25, 2008

I think anyone who harbors such animosity for such a very long time has some kind of issue, though I will not attempt any diagnosis. From the sidelines it seems Takei is being the petty one, because he’s never let it go. He’s still angry and bitter after years — is that “normal” behavior for anyone? Unless Shatner is taunting him with phone calls, emails, balloon-o-grams, or whatever, I cannot understand why Takei wouldn’t have just let it be water under the bridge. In fact, I would’ve thought Takei had gotten everything off his chest when he got to bash Shatner at the Comedy Channel Celebrity Roast. It was blatantly obvious that Takei was saying everything he ever wanted to say to Shatner. It was pretty obvious Nichelle Nichols was taking her shots at him, as well, though she wasn’t quite as mean as Takei. I thought Shatner took it all pretty well…
I have nothing against either of these men, I don’t know them personally. I like them because of Star Trek, and I like Shatner because of some of the other things he’s done. Takei has not had the kind of career Shatner has (which he may be bitter over), but I don’t think anyone ever handed Shatner his career either…

276. Jon C - October 25, 2008

#273 Yep.

277. Jon C - October 25, 2008

Maybe they can get the Organians to mediate.

278. Jabob Slatter - October 25, 2008

George has plenty to be angry about. First, his family lost everything during WWII and were put into “relocation” camps. Then as an actor in the 60s he faced blatant racism against Asian actors that persists to this day. Not to mention the fact that he’s gay and had to hide it all these years because so many people are ignorant and hateful.

Dealing with a prima donna personality like Shatner’s had to have been difficult. Sure, he should let it go, but Bill isn’t helping by making his stupid comments.

Anthony, posting something like this and not expecting it to get political is kind of like leaving cottage cheese in the fridge for months and expecting it to not get green and black.

Oh well, at least this isn’t a stupid “canon” argument.

279. DEMODE - October 25, 2008

Maybe its just me…but I think they both know its “profitable” for them to hate one another, and so they play it up for the media.

280. VOODOO - October 25, 2008

I hope the movie is half as entertaining as watching these two idiots battle it out it public.

This feud is like something out of “Galaxy Quest II”

281. Closettrekker - October 25, 2008

#275—I think it stopped being something Takei was ‘angry’ about a long time ago. Now it is something which gets him exposure, sinceguys like Stern, Letterman, and Conan invite him on to talk about it. If not for his willingness to tell those stories, none of those guys would care about having him on their shows.
His regular appearances on Stern, for example, keep him somewhat relevant in showbusiness. It is hard to imagine him having any kind of career beyond ST conventions if not for that, and he certainly wouldn’t even be on Stern’s how if Howard wasn’t so entertained by his stories about Bill. His recurring role on ‘Heroes’ is a perfect example of the fruits of his efforts to keep his face out there.

#280—More like “Galaxy Quest” is partially inspired by the events Takei often describes.

282. Captain Robert April - October 25, 2008

An invitation gets lost in the mail and suddenly it’s World War III…

283. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 26, 2008

Re: 274. Closettrekker – October 25, 2008
#270—”…if a person is…in Takei’s case, engaging in neverending character assassination for the same amount of time, that reveals nothing except a serious psychological problem,…”

“There isn’t a shred of truth to that, IMO. How do you define attention-craving as a “serious psychological problem”. It certainly isn’t psychosis, especially using the definition you have yourself provided. ”

I do not see it as the lone attention-craving angle you use to frame Takei’s behavior. Obsession has an origin–and his hatred–again–started before he was making money (or thought there was a market for it) from his warped nonsense. I see the origin–the foundation of his behavior as the genuine motive behind anything he’s said. Making money was a “happy accident” for him.

“It doesn’t demonstrate a person “incapable of normal social behavior”. He isn’t any more “psychotic” than my wife’s hairdresser!”

Hatred–as it was originally born in him during TOS’ production–for decades is not normal. Continuing to obsess & spread public hatred is not only psychologically ill, but immoral on the money-making side you cite, so either way, in comparison, Takei comes off as a person whose actions make all of his character assassination details about Shatner seem as tame as cutting ahead in a grocery store line.

And as I said about turning it on and off, psychotic behavior can be masked around those who are not the targets. For another example, hardcore or criminally racist individuals have been known to be as “loving” and “friendly” as anyone could–in the opinion of friends and family, but when said racist’s attention turned toward another race, his enitre mental profile turned into one of complete, consuming hatred (or in some cases, action). So again, Takei may behave around others, but when his intended target is on his mind, he goes into overdrive with hatred–and has done so longer than anyone being completely honest would ever even joke that was normal.

This has always been a lose-lose situation for Takei, for while he thinks he’s convincing the world to hate the (still) most visible, popular performer to ever be associated with the Star Trek franchise…while he still drowns in immorality in trying to profit from it at the same time, Takei has created a piss-poor legacy, which–when all is said and done for all TOS perfomers in the decades to come–will say Mr. George Takei’s most KNOWN, PROMOTED act was NOT his political goals, NOT his helping to encourage/develop asian actors, BUT it was his psychologically fractured hatred and obsession over a person he hardly knew, shared a few jobs with during a short-lived TV series, a few movies.

That is his life and legacy. No one thinking rationally (posessed with a healthy mind) would deliberately go down that path for so long.

Meanwhile, William Shatner will not be remembered for spending nearly a half-century badmouthing a (brief) co-worker.

284. Mr. Bob Dobalina - October 26, 2008

All this is a tool George uses to get exposure. He’s been crying the “Bill is a line hog” since Trek 2. Of course the Shatner bashers, many of which were the same fans that helped give George his disillusioned sense of self importance over the years, love to jump ont he bandwagon.

Sorry George, you’re name was in the END credits of Star Trek, not the beginning…IF it was there at all. Get over it.

285. mrtrek1701 - October 26, 2008

You know…. it’s been touched on before, and others may have touched on it. I have to wonder if this whole thing isn’t one big ingenius marketing stunt that their managers came up with to get exposure. I mean, c’mon? Seriously? Does it really seem logical that these two would continue to theatrically bust each others balls all over the place? This is Hollywood. It’s all about publicity. And guess what? They’re getting it!

Hell, Bill and George are probably best friends. Maybe they even came up with the idea themselves!

Pure speculation, but seems more plausible to me than a legitimate battle between two gentlemen of their respective statures.

286. Captain Robert April - October 26, 2008

Of the 79 episodes and two pilots, George was in 51, generally only in the bridge scenes, which means when he was there, it was only for a couple of days.

Hell, Eddie Paskey and Billy Blackburn were in more episodes (59) and you don’t see them bitching about Shatner…

287. Closettrekker - October 27, 2008

#283—”William Shatner will not be remembered for spending nearly a half-century badmouthing a (brief) co-worker.”

Shatner will be remembered for having a long and successful career, the highlight of which is his portrayal of James T. Kirk. George Takei, as an actor, is not even in the same class. That’s a given.

Takei and Shatner shared a set for 3 years on a television series and 6 feature films, over a period of 4 decades. You have a definition of the word “brief” that is, shall we say, ‘unique’?

But I hardly think that Takei will be remembered for that either.

“This has always been a lose-lose situation for Takei”.

Not even close. He’s the only ‘winner’ in this mess. Shatner doesn’t need to draw attention to himself. Takei does. If anything, Bill’s response makes Takei even ‘more’ relevant than he was the day before.

Entertainment Tonight would never have approached him if not for Bill Shatner’s rant.

“No one thinking rationally (posessed with a healthy mind) would deliberately go down that path for so long.”

You are confusing ‘rationality’ with ‘morality’.

Rational behavior has nothing at all to do with morality. He simply needs to have something to gain from his behavior to qualify it as such. You proceed from a false premise which is based upon the notion that he never had anything to gain prior to the recent interests of talk show hosts. That is simply incorrect. Even when he was only doing it on the convention circuit, he was reaping the benefits albeit on a smaller scale), yet you continue to ignore that. What set him apart from the other minor support characters was his willingness to tell stories about the show’s biggest star. You can pretend that many Trek fans were not interested in what he had to say and its entertainment value, but you would have to surrender all credibility in your argument. It was a hit.
From there, it evolved into a book sales point. Now, it is something with expanded interest from more mainstream media outlets. Whether you like it or not, Takei has made himself more marketable than Nichols and Koenig over the last few decades, and much of that is due to these stories, done at the expense of William Shatner.

That’s a win, whether you like it or not. He’s not the first person to make a living in garbage, nor will he be the last.

As for his legacy, he continues to be one of the more endearing guests at conventions, and one of the fan favorites—as his generosity and warmth toward the fanbase is legendary in those circles.

Anyway, you have failed to demonstrate how his behavior indicates an inability to think rationally, or somehow shows him to be incapable of normal social behavior.

None of this comes anywhere near that. He demonstrates rational thought every day, and functions quite normally within society. He is nowhere near that definition of “psychosis”. Not a single point (beyond perhaps the morality of his actions–which has nothing to do with the man’s sanity) of yours stands as accurately indicative of any mental disorder.

It is as absurd as it was yesterday.

288. krikzil - October 27, 2008

NO, carrying a grudge — for whatever reason — for 40 years is what’s absurd. ;)

“What set him apart from the other minor support characters was his willingness to tell stories about the show’s biggest star.
It only recently started actually benefiting his career to any significant extent with a higher profile. ”

No, he wasn’t the only one at all. I’ve seen these folks yearly since I was 13 or 14 (30+ years ack!) Doohan and Koenig also were quite open about their disdain for Shatner at cons. Doohan was the first one I’d heard say anything but Koenig had a lot ot say as well. Doohan was quite clear he disliked Bill intensely and refused to be interviewed for Bill’s book while the others went ahead with it. (And only Nichelle had the guts to tell Shatner to his face that she disliked him.) And of course they all said stuff in the 90s bios. Takei seemed to get more bitter in recent years to me, less humor about it all.

289. Scott Xavier - October 27, 2008

Ive worked with a lot of douche bags, let it go…

290. Closettrekker - October 28, 2008

#288—-”NO, carrying a grudge — for whatever reason — for 40 years is what’s absurd.”

I never said it was a good thing. It certainly is not healthy. But psychosis is something entirely different. That is not even debatable.

The fact of the matter is, it does not fit the definition of psychosis. It does not demonstrate even one of those symptoms. You are free to think that prolonged grudges are absurd, but there can be no question that an actual, diagnosis of “psychosis” is ten times more so.

And that was my point.

291. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 28, 2008

Re: 287. Closettrekker – October 27, 2008:

“Shatner will be remembered for having a long and successful career, the highlight of which is his portrayal of James T. Kirk. George Takei, as an actor, is not even in the same class. That’s a given.

Takei and Shatner shared a set for 3 years on a television series and 6 feature films, over a period of 4 decades. You have a definition of the word “brief” that is, shall we say, ‘unique’?”

Details, Closettrekker, details: 3 seasons and 6 films includes days one is not even required for several day’s shoot, while the other is there the majority of the time. As the star, Shatner actually spent more working hours with Nimoy & Kelley, as they were the only other major players.

When Nimoy and Shatner speak of their relationship–a real one–it is only due to the original job affording each much time around the other,and from there a relationship was born. They really KNOW each other, while the supporting players could not possibly have shared as much time to develop a true connection, making (once again) Takei’s rants born of psychologically ill obsession, as he never really knew the man well enough to be so filled with his near-half century of hatred.

As member Captain Robert April said in post #286:
“Of the 79 episodes and two pilots, George was in 51, generally only in the bridge scenes, which means when he was there, it was only for a couple of days.

Hell, Eddie Paskey and Billy Blackburn were in more episodes (59) and you don’t see them bitching about Shatner…”

Deny it all you want, but there is nothing remotely psychologically healthy about obsession and hatred for decades about a person you hardly knew–again–all of this starting before he was making a fast buck from it.

“Not even close. He’s the only ‘winner’ in this mess. Shatner doesn’t need to draw attention to himself. Takei does. If anything, Bill’s response makes Takei even ‘more’ relevant than he was the day before.

Entertainment Tonight would never have approached him if not for Bill Shatner’s rant.”

Takei’s been on ET regarding his hatred long before Shatner’s statement, so Shatner did not create a link that already existed. ET is a televised version of a gossip rag, not a source of relevant news. If Britney relieved herself on stage, they would report on such a disgusting non-story–not because the world cares, or it is important, but due to the series being a gossip feed bowl, and many ex-Trek stars have been served up before.

C.G.: “No one thinking rationally (posessed with a healthy mind) would deliberately go down that path for so long.”

“You are confusing ‘rationality’ with ‘morality’.

Rational behavior has nothing at all to do with morality. He simply needs to have something to gain from his behavior to qualify it as such. You proceed from a false premise which is based upon the notion that he never had anything to gain prior to the recent interests of talk show hosts. ”

Incorrect. In a stable society, socially acceptable behavior often ties rational behavior to concepts of morality. Example: currently, despite its continued presence, using proven racism against another is is considered irrational for social and legal reasons, yet it is also considered immoral, hence the use in Takei’s case.

“Even when he was only doing it on the convention circuit, he was reaping the benefits albeit on a smaller scale), yet you continue to ignore that. ”

I never ignored it–I simply reiterate that in the period when this public character assassination started, he was not using to bait convention promoters, as he was a performer from the then-recently cancelled TOS (and TOS was growing hot in early 70′s syndication), so conventions would willingly invite just about ANY ex-sci-fi / fantasy performers. It had nothing to do with the specifics of your claim (a purely financial tool).

So, when Takei’s public rants started, he was venting for his weighty emotional reasons, not as a self-promotional tool–as he would be regularly invited to conventions in any case.

“What set him apart from the other minor support characters was his willingness to tell stories about the show’s biggest star.”

As krikzil posted, Takei was not alone, but unlike the others, he was seemingly possessed by a desire to destroy the career and public image of another man on an agressive level with no association with a healthy mental state.

“That’s a win, whether you like it or not. He’s not the first person to make a living in garbage, nor will he be the last.

As for his legacy, he continues to be one of the more endearing guests at conventions, and one of the fan favorites—as his generosity and warmth toward the fanbase is legendary in those circles. ”

His true legacy–the one you ignore–is what he is BEST known for: hating William Shatner. His voyage of psychotic behavior has completely buried any thoughts any accomplishments or any detail fans would care to know about his lone claim to lower-level “fame.” That (not Sulu, not WW2, or working to develop asian performers…or brief stab at politics or begging for a Capt. Sulu project–or even his coming out of the closet) is forever the nonsense which defines George Takei’s life whether you want to accept that or not.

292. Closettrekker - October 28, 2008

#291—”…there is nothing remotely psychologically healthy about obsession and hatred for decades about a person you hardly knew”

Nor is there anything in that behavior which indicates “psychosis”.

“…he was seemingly possessed by a desire to destroy the career and public image of another man”

I think he was ‘possessed’ by a desire to make himself relevant and entertaining. Certainly, he has achieved that to some degree by telling these Shatner stories. I don’t think he ever believed he could destroy Shatner’s career. You’re really jumping off into the deep end there, my friend. People having been telling stories like this about actors in Hollywood far more popular than Bill long before Takei starting doing it. No one really cares that Shatner has a big ego. People just tend to find it amusing. It is less amusing to us because this is very old news to Trek fans.

Joe Namath tells the same story (SBIII) every time he is interviewed, and has since the day his football career ended. Why? Because that is the only thing he has to say that people still find relevant. It’s the sole reason he is ever interviewed. If he wants to get another message across, his only chance is to tell that story and slip something else in.

The only difference between that and what Takei does is taste.

“His true legacy…is what he is BEST known for: hating William Shatner. His voyage of psychotic behavior has completely buried any thoughts any accomplishments or any detail fans would care to know about his lone claim to lower-level fame.”

That is what ‘you’ remember him for. I know plenty of people who are not Trek fans that recognize him as Sulu. Now people know him as the guy on ‘Heroes’ who used to be on Star Trek.

“That… is forever the nonsense which defines George Takei’s life whether you want to accept that or not.”

Only to someone who takes William Shatner that seriously to begin with. The truth is, this so-called “feud” (which was nothing of the sort until Bill’s retort) means very little to most people.

293. COMPASSIONATE GOD - October 29, 2008

Re: Closettreker:

CG: #291—”…there is nothing remotely psychologically healthy about obsession and hatred for decades about a person you hardly knew”

“Nor is there anything in that behavior which indicates “psychosis”.

Yet in not wholly rejecting my comment, you are actually reading as though you likely believe there IS something wrong with his behavior–not psychosis–but something nonetheless.

That speaks volumes about Takei.

“I think he was ‘possessed’ by a desire to make himself relevant and entertaining. Certainly, he has achieved that to some degree by telling these Shatner stories. I don’t think he ever believed he could destroy Shatner’s career. You’re really jumping off into the deep end there, my friend. People having been telling stories like this about actors in Hollywood far more popular than Bill long before Takei starting doing it.”

Take another look at Hollywood & popular music history. Careers have been hurt or destroyed by gossip from other entertainers or gossip rags, so Takei–certainly no stranger to entertainment history–used the one effective weapon a seemingly powerless person can use: character assassination.

CG: “His true legacy…is what he is BEST known for: hating William Shatner. His voyage of psychotic behavior has completely buried any thoughts any accomplishments or any detail fans would care to know about his lone claim to lower-level fame.”

CT: “That is what ‘you’ remember him for. I know plenty of people who are not Trek fans that recognize him as Sulu. Now people know him as the guy on ‘Heroes’ who used to be on Star Trek.”

To the general public–particularly those not fans of Trek, over the decades, the number 1 reason they were/are aware of Takei was/is due to him being “that guy who hates William Shatner,” or at best, “that SPACE Trek guy who hates William Shatner.” As you so frequently point out–his appearances on late night TV, and Stern’s radio show–only strengthen the argument about what he’s best known for, as he has used each show to–more than anything else in his life–rant on and on and on about his psychologically ill hatred of Shatner.

Any who thinks “Heroes” will be even a blip on Takei’s “fame-o-meter” (such as it is) in the decades to come are fooling themselves. Assassinating Shatner’s character has been Takei’ most visible public output for decades, and will reman so, long after “Heroes” has recieved the boot of cancellation.

“Only to someone who takes William Shatner that seriously to begin with. The truth is, this so-called “feud” (which was nothing of the sort until Bill’s retort) means very little to most people.”

As you and others said, Shatner does not need the publicity, so in eliminating that as a motive, the truth of the matter (unless Shatner later says otherwise) is that his comments must be serious.

294. krikzil - October 29, 2008

And sadly, this whole thing appears in the latest TV Guide — terribly distorted in Takei’s favor. Tabloid journalism!

295. Closettrekker - October 30, 2008

#293—I ‘do’ believe there is something wrong with it…morally. I also find it quite distasteful to air dirty laundry merely for personal gain.

I do not, however, equate that with “psychotic”.

“To the general public–particularly those not fans of Trek, over the decades, the number 1 reason they were/are aware of Takei was/is due to him being “that guy who hates William Shatner”

That’s pure speculation.

Even my wife knows him simply as the Asian guy from Star Trek and Hiro’s father (since, unlike Trek, she actually watches that show). I’m quite sure she has no clue about any “feud” with William Shatner (who, to her, is the guy who used to be on Star Trek, and does commercials and stars in a country music video with George Constanza).

#294—”And sadly, this whole thing appears in the latest TV Guide — terribly distorted in Takei’s favor. Tabloid journalism!”

Which is exactly why I said (many, many posts ago) that Shatner had nothing to gain by responding in that fashion. The minute Bill responded like that, the only possible “winner” (as far as the general public is concerned) would be Takei.

Bill should never have made this a ‘real’ story. He should have left it at “Best wishes”…

296. MSH - October 30, 2008

Another one of those get togethers that Shatner never showed up.

http://www.georgetakei.com/03.asp

297. COMPASSIONATE GOD - November 2, 2008

Re: #294. krikzil – October 29, 2008
“And sadly, this whole thing appears in the latest TV Guide — terribly distorted in Takei’s favor. Tabloid journalism!”

I would not be surprised if other motives were behind TV Guide’s (apparent) support of a person who has been on the attack for decades…..

Back to the central matter: all one needs to do is realize two important facts:

1. Takei’s public rants started before it was ever used as any form of a self-promotional tool–since he was already a “regular” invited to conventions as one of the “stars” of TOS, so it is not as though he had to create reasons for promoters to invite a former cast member of a then-increasingly popular TV series (the syndication boom) .

2. As mentioned several times before, Shatner does not need the publicity, so in eliminating that as a motive, the truth of the matter (unless Shatner later says otherwise) is that his comments about Takei must be serious.

Character assassination and obsession before the greed motives is the very reason Takei’s mental state richly deserve the questions and criticisms recieved.

298. MSH - November 5, 2008

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SGYldchka40&feature=related

Shatner not getting along with the cast again, as always

299. MSH - November 7, 2008

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIgEbl65f_M&feature=related

Takei is right, Shatner is hated by the entire TOS series cast, and never included the helmsman in any fun. I am so glad that ET got this story so spot on.

300. MSH - November 8, 2008

HOLY COW!

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