Pine Talks Kirk + Abrams Talks Secrecy October 25, 2008
by TrekMovie.com Staff , Filed under: Abrams, ST09 Cast , trackback
Of the main new Star Trek cast, the one we always want to hear more from is Chris Pine, the new James T. Kirk. Variety profiles the up-and-comer as one of their ‘10 Actors to Watch‘ and talks about his process of bringing back an iconic character. There is also a new interview with JJ where he talks about how he doesn’t like to talk about things, yet.
Pine’s Kirk is just human
Pine admits to Variety that he is "not really a sci-fi buff," but he does realise that he is taking on a role that is ‘iconic’ that that the original Trek actors " left that indelible a mark on the social psyche." So he started off by steeping himself in Trek lore, before taking Abrams advice to make Kirk his own. From the artidcle:
In jumping full throttle into cramming sessions with "Trek" lore encyclopedias and watching the original series, however, Pine decided midway that he was doing himself an injustice.
"All I was doing was heaping upon myself an incredible amount of responsibility, weighing myself down with ‘You must remember to act this way’ and such…That’s when I was really able to let go and accept the parameters that J.J. set forth in the beginning, which was to bring what was special and unique about us to the roles.
That meant embracing Kirk’s descriptors — charming, funny, leader of men — rather than a predigested image.
"Just try to be human," Pine clarifies. "I got to do everything: yell, shout, cry, laugh, take charge and be vulnerable. I pulled the lucky straw."
Pine and his new crew
Abrams: Trek a fun secret he wants to share
USA Weekend has a feature on Star Trek’s director titled JJ Abrams: He holds the secrets, all about how Abrams projects are all ’sworn to secrecy’ projects. From Lost to Cloverfield to Fringe to Star Trek, this has worked for Abrams and according to Star Trek producer Damon Lindelof, it is part of his nature. Lindelof says of Abrams:
He really is a fanboy. A lot of people say that about people like J.J., but he’s a fan first," Lindelof says. J.J. also is an incredibly secretive person.
Abrams has been burned by leaks in the past, both with a leak of the unfinished pilot for Fringe as well as a scathing review of an unproduced script for a Superman movie. He says that he keeps secrets so that the fans can experience things for the first time when they see his work:
That, to me, is the part that’s the most frustrating — having something that is not in a state to be seen, or publicly reviewed, getting out there. I’m keeping things secret ultimately for the audience.
Abrams was specifically asked what it was like staying mum about the upcoming Star Trek movie, here is what he said:
It’s like having a really big secret where you just feel like, ‘Alright, I have to carry this around.’ It’s good news, meaning it’s not carrying a secret around that’s a depressing burden. It’s a fun, exciting anticipation as opposed to dread. All I want to do is show people. Fringe, Star Trek — these are not being made to keep secrets
More on Abrams secret world at USA Weekend here and here.
JJ and his ‘mystery box‘
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Comments»
Hope to see more soon! Love what you guys have added to the offical star trek website Mr. Orci and JJ!
JJ is so right about spoilers and secrets. I just can’t fathom why someone would want to have everything spoiled in advance of a film, TV series, book, etc.
I never watch previews for upcoming episodes. It just ruins so much. Sadly, I already know more than I would like about Trek ‘09, despite always looking out for spoiler alerts.
(Of course, that doesn’t mean I don’t want to see their take on the ol’ NCC-1701 ASAP!)
- …by steeping himself in Trek lore, before taking Abrams advice to make Kirk his own. -
Once he‘s steeped himself in Trek lore, he‘ll (hopefully) realize that it‘s impossible to make “Kirk his own” as it is impossible for Quinto to make Spock his own and so on. These characters already have become legends. They already have been created. If the new actors are really good, they will be able to add new aspects to the characters we know for more than 40 years, they will be able to tell us some new stories about them, and entertain us with an extension of already established lore. Imo, they should be grateful for that chance and put all their effort in making this film enjoyable. Sometimes less is more.
I hope JJ hires me to perform as the entertainer for the crew party. JJ Call me! Ill show your real mystery and magic.
“Just try to be human,” Pine clarifies. “I got to do everything: yell, shout, cry, laugh, take charge and be vulnerable. I pulled the lucky straw.”
Well, I’d say “just try[ing] to be human” is the right tack to take with Kirk: Humanity’s first and best apologist to the rest of the galaxy.
Peace. Live long and prosper.
The Vulcanista }:-|
I love JJ Abrams’ work, but with all due respect, I’m glad his Superman script was leaked. Simply because we know that you don’t make a Superman movie that way.
Its a reimagining Pre-Rebootquel, of a previous altered timeline, compounded by the events from actions, by people from an untouched timeline thats still within the existing Star Trek universe from the mirror side.
:-D
or,, it really is a musical
What’s in the box?!?
What’s in the box?!?
I gotta know what’s in that BOX!!!!
oh,,and by the way,,
I Know whats in the box too,,,
Its full of crap and hes going to set it on fire,
hes holding a cigarette lighter in his pocket,,,,
you see,,someone will see the fire and stamp it out,,and,,and,,
well you get the picture.
@8: Gwyneth Paltrow’s head. Now you know.
If its not the old burning bag of crap gag,,,could it be Spocks brain ??
hmmm
“That, to me, is the part that’s the most frustrating — having something that is not in a state to be seen, or publicly reviewed, getting out there.”
As a sometimes song writer and onetime performer, I can tell you there is nothing so frustrating as having your creative work put “out there” when it’s not ready.
I hate to admit this, but I think the pace of info-flow has been just about right…
STAR TREK LIVES!
The “I got to do everything” line may be the most promising thing I’ve read from Pine so far; I like the sound of that.
As the song goes:
“It’s my TREK in a BOX”
The more I hear about Abrams the less I want to hear about Abrams.
‘WHat’s in the box?’ Whatever it is you want to be in there! ;D
….and the adventure continues….
the new actors will only add, they will never make the characters their own.
To me the originals own the roles and alwayswill, these actors will just be portraying younger versions of them.
I hate spoilers but with Star Trek you like to know things just so you know this film is respectign our show, our legacy.
The trailer is going to be EPIC! I’ll be seeing it this week,woo!
I know this question may have been asked already, but I need to know….do we know if the ST trailer will be attached to the UK premier of the new Bond Movie?
Is it just me, or do we see some resembalence of Bill Shatner in Chris Pine? At first I was a bit skepticle, but now I am liking him more and more!!! I think the key will be his voice/ delivery of lines. Can’t wait to see the movie!!!
WHERE IS THE ENTERPRISE? WANT TO GAZE UPON THE ENTERPRISE ON MY SMALL LAPTOP SCREEN. GIVE US THE ENTERPRISE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Why is Dr. McCoy’s hair parted on the wrong side? The way Bones wears his hair is part of canon! (No, the picture is not flopped.)
I’m glad Star Trek has not been leaked to the press or to the fans. The more time goes on, the more I favor secrecy. I remember my ravinous desire to find out the plot to ‘Nemesis’ in 2002, eventually reading that Data would die before I ever saw it in the theater. Well, I spent most of the movie waiting to see how it would happen, and that probably dampened one part of that movie I might’ve enjoyed…
Frankly, I don’t want to see a picture of the Enterprise until I see it on the big screen. In a way, I’m a little disappointed to see the cast in costume and part of the bridge. Of course I’m excited, and by golly I’ll jump for joy at it, but there’s a part of me that wishes it would all be kept under wraps until next May. Voyuer that I am, I can’t just ignore TrekMovie.com, though…
[...] yet and that’s Chris Pine, the man actually plays Captain James T. Kirk. Thankfully Variety (via TrekMovie) got Pine to speak about his role very [...]
3: That is where you’re hopelessly wrong.
#19 TK already asked that question, to no avail. I think that its unknown or it would have been answered. It should be. What I’ve heard the UK release of Bond is pivotal in the movies international success.
oh and #20 I thought the first poster with Pine staring at the camera, looked a lot like Shatner’s face did on the Star Trek movie posters, there’s something there.
One thing Shatner did really well was subtext. You could literally hear him think by just watching his face. I hope Pine nails that too.
#19 It will be attached to the UK release of Bond. I’ll be sitting scribbling notes when the trailer comes on so I can relay it back to everyone here.
#27 for deffo? As of what date tho? From the premiere on? Where did you get this info. I’m not doubting you, I just want to be certain :) Thanks.
My main beef is still: WTH is up with an actor portraying Kirk, with sparkling blue eyes?? Even my non Trek-fan girlfriend noticed that. She said: “I thought Kirk had hazel/brown eyes?” Before I’m slammed for minor nit-picking, nobody realistically expects the new actors to look identical to the originals, but this costuming choice rules out the possibility of “reviving Kirk” in a sequel, starring Shatner, unless he opts to wear blue contact lenses, or has his eye color digitally altered. Kirk played by an actor with blue eyes really bothers me for more than simple aesthetic reasons. Maybe it’s just me, but isn’t there already an attempt to portray *some* continuity between this upcoming film(s) and those before? Why not make Spock a tall, beefy guy while they’re at it? The writers/directors of this film are admittedly staunch Trek fans and they “claimed” to try to write Shatner into this movie as they did for Nimoy, but claimed (understandably) that since the Kirk character was killed on Viridian lll, that it would have seemed too contrived to do that all in the same film. Again, that’s understandable but if they *had* figured out a way to do it (or do so in the future) how are they going to explain the eye color disparity? Again on eye color, although Karl Urban seems like a terrific choice for McCoy, his eyes are brown, unlike DeForest Kelley’s who *did* have the sparkling blue eyes. Mr Orci himself recently admitted on this site that eye color “was discussed.” Respectfully to Mr Orci and others, on this I have to agree with the other comments, in saying you (potentially) shot yourselves in the foot with the eye color glitch. That in itself It won’t ruin this film but it presents continuity problems, – at least as far the pre-existing (or maybe future?) big-screen film franchise is concerned.
[29] Dear Crewman Darnell… while I see your problem here, I see two possible outcomes for you. Either you will be blown away by the movie, the Kirkness of Pine and the Bonesness of Urban and the whole scale of the story they will tell… or you will really have the time to concentrate on things like eye color. In that case, we are all in trouble.
This is my brother Darnell, and my other brother Darnell.
29: Ya know, I never noticed that. Maybe they spent all their money on the fancy new bridge and ran out of cash for colored contacts. :P
Really.. who the hell cares about eye color and which side of the hair is parted. Oh wait, I hear that Quinto wears a different size boot than Nimoy… OMG!
I agree with what Fakesteve said… you will be so focused on the eye color and hair that you won’t be actually watching the movie.
Actually, that goes for all the canon nazi’s… you will be so focused on trying to find things that don’t match canon that you will miss the entire movie. Just try and enjoy the damn movie. If the story isn’t great… that will be what I am disappointed in.
I am not going to reference a particular post in this thread, but I have to say I absolutely hate it when a fan or fans feel the need for big spoilers on this movie “just so they can be sure their show was done right”
Huh?
The fans don’t own it. We paid money at the box office or own a collectable, but that does not give us ownership or editorial control of this or any film. I expect the filmmakers to live up to what they said and leave it at that.
IMO, some fans will be disappointed in this movie because they’ll refuse to see beyond their pet peeve to the great story beyond, as #33 Montreal paul mentioned.
It’s just not a real comment thread until Stanky & Iowagirl balance out the wide-eyed optimism with a heaping helping of pessimism ;)
#25
My gut feeling tells me I’ll remain a hopeless case…:)
#35
I was so happy and almost deeply moved when I read your lovely words and I would very much like to thank you for being so kind – you‘ve really massaged my ego. ;)
PS: I very much enjoy Stanky’s comments, too!
Crewman Darnell (#29),
Kirk’s eyes are not hazel/brown. They were, because Shatner’s were. Now they’re blue, because Pine’s are blue. Eye color is not an important part of a character’s physiology, at least not in Star Trek. If such a trivial thing keeps you from enjoying what could be a rousing good movie, then you might want to consider reorganizing your priorities.
Stanky McFibberich (#15),
Ah, Stanky, what would this site be without you? There are a lot of purists here who love to rant about what they feel is the pilaging of their beloved TOS, but yours are the only comments I’ve come to respect. I may not agree with you, but your steadfast determination awes me. It’s always good to see one of your rapier witicisms (sp?) posted here.
To my beloved #3,
Not only to I agree with you, but I must point out that you write beautifully. I”m glad I married you.
G.S.
Although I have to disagree with you on #37. Emerson said that “a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds.” And an ever greater thinker, James T. Kirk, said, in ST III, (”Fresh minds, new ideas…be tolerant!”).
Secrecy is over-rated. We already know the rough plot of the movie.
I don’t want to see the script… But, I’d like to see more pictures of the main sets, and the exterior of the ships.
Why is this going to ruin the movie for anyone?
Unless of course JJ has lied to us, and the design of the sets and exterior of the ship put a lie to the idea that this isn’t a reboot.
41. Al Hartman
I don’t want to see teh exterior of the ship before the movie at all! I remember going to see TMP and was blown away when they first revealed the Enterprise. I hadn’t seen any pictures of it at all. I was in awe. But seeing something beforehand ruins the surprise and awe factor of the first reveal in the movie. You know what it looks like.. the whole build up and slow reveal is ruined by the fact that you had already seen it. Sorry, I was to be blown away again seeing that ship on the big screen.
What is this, “National I Love Stanky Day”?!
I’m honored.
I kind of agree with JJ, I don’t want to be spoiled before it comes out. But I probably would try to find out as much as I could – I need to stay away from computers starting soon!!
I agree that fresh minds and ideas are what the doctor ordered for Star Trek.
Folks, when I first heard about this movie and the plans being made for it, my initial reaction was that I thought it was a bad idea to recast these characters (AKA “fake actors”). Since that time, I’ve looked at the photos. I’ve read as many of the interviews as I can stand. I’ve read a percentage of the comments made. I’ve rolled my eyes and laughed and cried and stared at the screen in disbelief.
Has ANYTHING here changed my opinion? Has ANYTHING been written or shown that makes me feel any better about it? Have the gushing comments by insiders and the rah-rahs of the die hard supporters of all things Trek convinced me that somehow I will want to embrace and look forward to the release of this movie?
Nah.
For the sake of those who already know they are going to love it….bless you. I hope it lives up to your expectations. I really do.
so Stanky… I guess you will be watching old VHS tape of TOS on opening day while the rest of us are going to the movie.
I guess you’ll rent it some 10 years from now on a whim?
I have to say I saw Bottle Shock with Chris Pine in a supportive roll. Uhh, well I hope it was the director’s fault that he overacted, was “jammy” and…hmmm, he may just work out well as James. T. Kirk after all!
It gladdens my old heart to see more and more folks realizing that the emperor is walking down Main Street in his birthday suit.
#39
My dear husband Gary,
Thank you so much for your affectionate compliment which means a lot to me. I’m very glad about our bonding, too.
I.
#40
Our respectful disagreement is also enjoyable, as always. Although I’m as much an admirer of Emerson as you are, let me muse with you about our greatest hero JTK who indeed said “Fresh minds, new ideas…be tolerant!”, but then spent the rest of this wonderful movie to prove that sometimes it’s the old broom that sweeps cleanest by once again saving the galaxy and – even more important – rescuing and resurrecting his friend and brother. Or, as Joseph Joubert once said “Who ever has no fixed opinions has no constant feelings.“
#29, etc.: It’s been almost seven years since “The Fellowship of the Ring” came out, and as excellent as Liv Tyler’s performance as Arwen in the LotR films was, it still irritates me that she wasn’t given gray contact lenses, because the eye colors of certain characters were “mythologically” highly significant to Tolkien (Arwen was a descendant of Luthien, who also had gray eyes, and their fates paralleled each other).
One’s feelings about the importance of eye colors in the new “Star Trek” movie, therefore, depend on how important a part of the “Star Trek” mythos one considers them to be. They may not seem significant to the general public, but for people who have been devoted fans for years they may well be highly significant. For example, how many “Star Trek” novels have referred to the characters’ eye colors (e.g., Ael commenting to herself on McCoy’s “strange blue eyes” in “My Enemy, My Ally”)?
One further point to ponder. At present Memory Beta lists the characters’ eye colors in their infoboxes. When the new movie comes out next year, will Memory Beta users have to delete that information because the eye colors are now “canonically uncertain”?
…The truth is that Abrams just enjoys jerking the fans’ chains. As for the “scathing review” of his Superman pitch, hey, it’s not *our* fault if the truth hurts his feelings.
#51 – OM
“…The truth is that Abrams just enjoys jerking the fans’ chains. As for the “scathing review” of his Superman pitch, hey, it’s not *our* fault if the truth hurts his feelings.”
Oh, I didn’t know you were JJ’s psychologist and knew his inner most troubled termoil. Wow… What a revenge he will have on everyone. Lull them into a false security about making a Trek movie just so he can stick it to people that didn’t like his Superman script. LMAO!!!
#49-
Oh, dear. Your considerable intellect and independent mind are one of the reasons I asked for your hand in marriage. Sometimes such exchanges are not always the easiest, but they are always stimulating.
And to think my relatives said I was just going to get some simple corn field girl.
50. Anthony – October 26, 2008
Re: eye color
Might I point out that we may be talking about “our” Spock visiting not only his past, but a slightly different version of it. (also known as a parallel universe).
hmmmm…
#53,49
This simple cornfield boy thinks you need a room. Eh?
Iowagirl,
Thanks for the Joseph Joubert quote.
Two more, one which is a rejoinder to your quote:
Those who never retract their opinions love themselves more than they love truth.
I guess then another quote of his is fitting:
The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress.
————————-
Wouldn’t it be nice if that were the accepted mission of this website?
51. OM – October 26, 2008
“…The truth is that Abrams just enjoys jerking the fans’ chains.”
Show me where that truth lies, and then I won’t think you live under a bridge somewhere.
#53
Oh, dear – each compliment is as the first…
Love
Yours simple corn field girl
#56
“The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress.”
- Wouldn’t it be nice if that were the accepted mission of this website? -
Gary, I think we’re on the right path.
#55
Nah, too simple. :)
We need to ask ourselves… what do we love about Trek? Is it Kirk’s brown eyes or the multi-colored jellybeans on all the consoles? Or is it the eternal optimism for the future, the power of friendship and candid representation of humanity (both good and ugly)?
What I think JJ and crew have done is concentrate their efforts on the ‘intangibles’ of Star Trek that makes it unique from all other shows, and then tried to fit as much of the classic Trek in as possible, which I heartily applaud.
I guarantee you that Star Trek has not gathered such a following because of phasers and cheap sets, although such things have a charm all their own.
re: 47. montreal paul – October 26, 2008
“so Stanky… I guess you will be watching old VHS tape of TOS on opening day while the rest of us are going to the movie.
I guess you’ll rent it some 10 years from now on a whim?”
I will go see it if I have nothing better to do…
59. – “Or is it the eternal optimism for the future, the power of friendship and candid representation of humanity (both good and ugly)?”
There are many things I love about Star Trek, but if JJ gets this part right (a given in my opinion) he’s 9/10 of the way there with me.
Thank you for bringing back what I love with a Bang, not a Fizzle. :D
To Crewman Darnell’s statement in 29: I can see the point of nitpicking about every little thing being tiresome, but when a non-fan sees that something is not right, I think we are well beyond an acceptable threshold of difference. I don’t have a problem with there being differences in this version of Star Trek, but when those differences are so extreme that are distracting to the audience at large, then are a negative rather than a positive. And to Orci’s (I believe it was Orci) statement that the changes will be explained within canon, trying to explain changing eye color will be a little like trying to explain the annoying Klingon ridges/no ridges issue.
Call me a simpleton (at the risk of getting a warning from Anthony! :-)), but yeah, I kinda dig the original Star Trek because of the ship, and the phaser designs, and the fight scenes, and McCoy’s blue eyes, and Nimoy’s craggy face, and the blinky lights and bright colors. All the high-flown words about a vision of an optimistic future, the brotherhood of mankind (or the siblinghood of sentiency) are all well and good, but for me personally, my love of Trek was born from a case of the sum of the parts equalling something different and something more than some over-arching philosophical theme that is supposed to trump the tangibles and make them irrelevant. I liked all the little things that went together to make Star Trek.
I shouldn’t speak for anyone but myself, but I’m guessing that a lot of us canon fodder, us Stanky sympathizers, us cranky old trolls who are taking to this new movie with such reluctance are what you might call bottom-up fans. We relish the nuts and bolts of the thing. A trip across the country has the same scenery no matter what you’re driving, but for us, it’s much cooler if we’re riding in a cherry, vintage convertible, not a modern, tricked-out SUV.
Or something like that.
Scott B. out.
Hey guys if Stanky doesn’t wanna see it because it violates his sensibilities then oh well….There was no other way to go for a new movie. All the actors are too old or departed. Changes are inevitable and also if they made it totally close to the original only tos fans would go and see it. They are trying to make this interesting to all movie goers so although it is our star trek, it is not our eras star trek. it will have more action look different and be different yet familar….It sounds to me like the movie makers are trying to preserve the core of trek…optimism, family/friendship bonds, scifi, the enterprise etc….There will be plenty for us fans to notice and respond to but those NOT familar will love it too. That is what they are striving for. We will see if they made it or not….Nimoy seems to think they have….Before this movie Treks time was over….this is a shot in the arm. Too many of you are thinking this will kill the franchise…well maybe it was already dead unfortunately, and this is a shock to the heart to get it started again…The comments that EW made after screening parts of it say that JJ succeeded in turning it into current pop….and they also say the first shot of the enterprise is incredible…and that the two main actors this will be star making performances for both of them….hmmmmmmmm
Iowagirl-
“Too Simple”? Thought you were a simple corn field girl…
re: 54 Jim Nightshade
“The comments that EW made after screening parts of it say that JJ succeeded in turning it into current pop”
Ugh.
My guess is, if the movie’s any good, we won’t give a !@# what color anyone’s eyes are.
#64:
I can at least handle some of the changes, but I would have had a different ship and crew in the TOS era, there’s not really much need for revisiting an old crew (although I don’t hate the upcoming movie, I’d just try to expand upon the TOS era more creatvely).
#68 Are you kidding? Captain Kirk is an absolute legendary character and this is an area of his life and career never touched on in canon before. Let’s see how he deals with a threat from the future; which arguably, you can say, the character has never had to deal with before. We only ever saw 3 years of missions of the crews original 5 year mission, and 6 more adventures during the movie.
There’s a heck of a lot of story and events and timeline to mine. Why would anyone care for the adventures of Captain Ying and first officer Yang? I think they tried that already, it was by Erik Jendreson and shot down, as soon as Berman was.
If you are too preoccupied by the Kirk’s eye color or McCoy’s hair parting to enjoy the movie…. then I think you are gonna miss enjoying the movie.
Get a life people.. it is only a movie!
#60 Stanky McFibberich “I will go see it if I have nothing better to do…”
Okay, who are you and what have you done with the REAL Stanky??!!
The Stanky we know and respect would never make a statement like that!!
#70 is absolutely right.
I’d understand if they changed Spock into a woman, made Uhura asian, or the Enterprise was a toilet paper tube attached to a piece of string, BUT it’s not.
It’s eye color and hair style, NOBODY CARES.
There’s a real possibility many of us will not like the “solutions” JJ’s design team came up with. They are working with iconic materials and asking us to “pay them” to find out what they did to change them.
It’s fair to ask “what does the big E look like?” before we pay them for the experience, the story, the compilation of the edit and the music.
“They are working with iconic materials and asking us to “pay them” to find out what they did to change them.”
That’s what we’ve done for 10 movies now. Nothing different with this.
#38: ” Kirk’s eyes are not hazel/brown. They were, because Shatner’s were. Now they’re blue, because Pine’s are blue.”
I see your point, but isn’t that like saying that Kirk was a white male only because William Shatner was a white male? :)
60. Stanky McFibberich – October 26, 2008
from now on a whim?”
“I will go see it if I have nothing better to do…
“Good Lord!”
(thumps chest)
“Defib! Stat!”
(thumps chest)
“Arrggh!”
Zapppp…
Whoa… what’d he say??
#74—”That’s what we’ve done for 10 movies now. Nothing different with this.”
Well, not true. Every movie prior to this was moving forward with the mythos. When we saw STMP and the changes on the big E, the story was taking place after the TV series.
This is the first time anyone is telling stories in the time period of Kirk and Spock using new designs. Trek fans have an emotional investment in the classic visuals and current Trek fans are the primary audience for this film. It’s practically a guaranteed sell. If they made no changes, we would all go for the new story (with new actors). But since they are making changes…it is fair that they get our acceptance our not for the look of the film.
Xai, I was as shocked as you are!!
Somebody check the weather report and see if Hell has frozen over!
I can see why JJ would want to keep things secret: People not going to see the movie becuase Pine has a different eye color than Shatner, and therefore, JJ doesn’t get Star Trek… I’d keep it secret too…
80. OR Coast Trekkie
LMAO
#78:
This story is being told BEFORE the events of The Five-Year Mission. And for all the strict constructionists out there, this story is going to become canon whether the Trekverse likes it or not. We have absolutely no idea what that time period between Enterprise and The Cage looks like; therefore, TPTB have free rein over what that universe at that particular time looks like.
Like what you see or hate it, Trekkies do not have right of first refusal. (Although in a true and just universe, yeah, we SOOO would!)
Peace. Live long and prosper. And relax.
The Vulcanista }:-|
#78 McCoy, No sir you are wrong sir…JJ stated again in the EW article that, ” We weren’t making a movie for fans of Star Trek, we were making a movie for fans of movies”
So Star Trek fans ARE NOT who they are making this movie for…
and re Stanky #67, I would like to know why current pop as a term in and by itself is necessarily ugly or bad or UGH….pop is popular modern is up to date….I would like for star trek to be up to date and popular….I think they liken it to more visually sophisticated movies like DARK KNIGHT, IRON MAN et al….
That article also states “Star Trek was once the definition of smart sci-fi. The series subverted Americas cynical cold war culture with its rich vision of a peaceful future and a weird wonderful universe worthy of joint exploration. But since the box office peak of the original film series in 1986 the Trek brand has devolved into a near-irrelevant cultural joke, likely to inspire giggles and unprintable curses from even its most ardent supporters. After a succession of contrived TV SPIN OFFS and mediocre features based on the best of the bunch even people who had built their entire careers around Trek could see the writing on the wall. Star Trek says Leonard Nimoy, had run its course….”
Now personally I enjoyed all the trek movies and series to varying degrees…but I also agree that something was wrong….they basically turned into themselves so much became so detailed and self supporting that only us hard core fans appreciated it. TNG did catch many millions of new audiences for Trek, many not even that familar with TOS. But that boat has sailed….I also think all involved always did the best they could….but this fresh NON TREK FAN (JJ) restart has to be the only way to go.
If you don’t like what youve heard you always have the option of not supporting the movie. I know I am going to give it a chance…
Oh yes also in the article JJ made an interesting comment “In fact Abrams can sum up his regard for Trek in two words…Galaxy Quest. the 1999 HIT starring Tim Allen that satirized Trek with painful precision.”its so ridiculous, so accurate, so SOPHISTICATED, it spoils the Star Trek universe he said.”
Hmmm So now we know why Star Trek is dead….That DARN TIM ALLEN…and Galaxy Quest. .. If Berman et all had turned star trek into a ridiculous accurate sophisticated spoof of itself it woulda been popular…
Or maybe a ROCK MUSICAL? ANDREW LLOYD WEBBER is working on it now even as we type and read! hahaha…. SIGH….
Come on people too many of you protesteth too mucheth…..someone else said its only a movie! And if its entertaining and fun and still is mostly the Star Trek we know and love….who cares about the eye colors, exactly how the bridge looks….etc…..
To me these are the important factors…the story should be good, the actors should be good…with entertaining sequences, action, positive star trek spin on the future….awe inspiring look and style….and it sounds like they have tried to deliver on these factors which if good in any movie should be enough to make the movie good. Isnt a good movie entertaining all more important than canon???
barrydancer (#76),
Though I can tell you were joking because of the “smiley” at the end of your post, I’d like to address your comment (at least somewhat) seriously.
In a way, yes it does mean that Kirk was a white male only because Shatner was. The makers of this new film could have decided to radically recast all of the characters with little or no connection to what had come before. If they had chosen to, they could have mixed up the genders and ethnicities any way they saw fit. They could have gone the new “Battlestar Galactica” route, saying “except for the general storyline, everything else will be different.”
They didn’t, though, which in a way is part of my point. In my opinion the filmmakers went to great lengths to find actors who would almost immediately be recognizable as these characters. I think if you showed photos of the new actors to almost anyone on the street and asked them to guess which Trek characters they were playing, most people would get them right (even though they might not always be able to name the characters beyond Kirk, Spock and McCoy).
The color of Kirk’s eyes was never of any consequence whatsoever to the overall mythology of Trek. What’s important is that the actors bring these characters to life for us, show us the people we’re so familiar with and still bring something new to the mix. A little thing like a change in eye color is simply not something to fret over.
Oh and there sounds like PLENTY to interest fans on the series….We will be acknowledged in the story details and nods to the original series….That sounds like they are trying to appease us and make in new again for everyone at the same time….
I only have 1 worry…IS THE BAD GUY a GOOD ENUF BAD GUY??? They are comparing him to Kahn…We can hope so because except for the BORG none of the other star trek movies had a sufficiently bad bad guy in my opinion eheheh….although six wasnt bad….dont count 4 a whale alien ship…well that was a lot like the first movie wasnt it? oh well….
#66
Progress, husband – remember?! ;)
This Chris Pike actor is defo intriguing………I’m sure he’ll pull it off
I’m simply going to wait to see the film before declaring it’s good or bad.
Personally, I’m much more comfortable with Star Trek returning to the core characters of Kirk, Spock and McCoy than going with some random era featuring new characters. If it works, these guys will make the roles their own and we’ll have lot of fun for years to come!
re: 46. Stanky McFibberich
“For the sake of those who already know they are going to love it….bless you. I hope it lives up to your expectations. I really do.”
gee…thanks.
Wish you were one of us.
I hope you enjoy sitting home alone watching the dvd of “Mudd’s Women” while we enjoy JJ’s new Trek…;-]
re: 72. Harry Ballz – October 26, 2008
I would list all the things that are better to do, but space limitations prohibit. :)
re:77. Xai – October 26, 2008
i appreciate the emergency attention :)
re:83. Jim Nightshade – October 26, 2008
“I would like to know why current pop as a term in and by itself is necessarily ugly or bad or UGH….pop is popular modern is up to date”
shaky hand-held cameras
re:89. Commodore Redshirt – October 27, 2008
I was thinking more along the lines of “And the Children Shall Lead”
Hmm.
Nobody seemed to care when Kirk rocked up in TMP with fuller, thicker hair than he did in the series.
“A wig? Canon violation!”
#23
“Frankly, I don’t want to see a picture of the Enterprise until I see it on the big screen.”
Amen! Show me everything BUT the Big E!
Frankly, I’m glad there are people like J.J. Abrams who will save me from myself. As I am dumb enough to read every spoiler I can get my hands on, please keep the spoilers away!
Thank you, J.J.
As for the eye color…well, I kinda wish they’d had them wear contact lenses, but it’s not such a big deal….
Is it?
re: 90. Stanky McFibberich
” I was thinking more along the lines of “And the Children Shall Lead” ”
Not “Let That Be Your Last Battlefield” ?
Reboot >Rerun
#70. Huh? Not sure why you’re arguing the point with me – it’s obvious we agree.
I think you misread my post, the point of which was: If this new movie does its job — and makes us care and believe and thrill to the early adventures of Kirk/Spock/et al — then it *won’t matter* whose eyes are blue and whose are brown. The film will have done its job.
#95. Sorry, repeated myself there at the end. I wish there were an editing function (I mean, aside from my brain, which obviously malfunctions more than I’d like.)
#83 “No sir you are wrong sir…JJ stated again in the EW article that, ” We weren’t making a movie for fans of Star Trek, we were making a movie for fans of movies”
So JJ and Paramount when on this multi-million dollar endeavor without considering the HUGE existing Trek (and sci-fi) fan base? LOL
#76: “I see your point, but isn’t that like saying that Kirk was a white male only because William Shatner was a white male? :)”
Actually, according to non-canon sources Kirk had some Native American ancestry through his mother.
#95 Sorry bud, it was a reply to Meteo 69, which for some reason showed as post 68, and my reply as 69 last night. Maybe someone’s posts have been moderated for approval and everyone shifted up 1 number. Or maybe I had too much Tranya on Saturday night :)
#99. Hey, happens to the best of us!
#98. No kidding. Really? Which novel is that from? There’s some piece of Kirkarcana I DON’T know?
Hey there #82 “This story is being told BEFORE the events of The Five-Year Mission. And for all the strict constructionists out there, this story is going to become canon whether the Trekverse likes it or not. We have absolutely no idea what that time period between Enterprise and The Cage looks like; therefore, TPTB have free rein over what that universe at that particular time looks like……”
There is NO WAY that this story can be taking place before the “5-Year Mission”. we DO have a pretty good idea of what the time period between the Cage and TOS looks like..you ever hear of an episode called “Where No Man Has Gone Before”. Forget the overall look of the ship, uniforms, etc. Captain Kirk’s primary crew consisted of: 1-Spock, 2-Gary Mitchell (his #1), 3-Sotty, 3-Lee Kelso, 4-Dr. Mark Piper and 5-Sulu, NO MCCOY, NO UHURA, NO CHRISTINE CHAPEL (how come she’s not in the movie), NO CHEKOV!!!
The EW article (as I have said many times already)– lead me to believe that this will be an alternate timeline story. I really feel that Abrams and crew are taking a BIG RISK!!!
#101 – So what. Let him take a risk. Maybe we’ll get a great movie.
Canon. Law. Eye color. Sheesh.
It’s a movie about fictional characters.
They never existed and never will… they’re illusions only, shadows without substance, unreal.
If this movie doesn’t appeal to more than those who put turtles on their forehead and go to conventions, trek is dead.
Personally, I hope it’s a great movie. I’ll settle for entertaining.
And I hope he makes more.
Even if it Kirk’s eyes are yellow.
It’s really great to see that the vast majority of fans are embracing the movie. :-)
“Every movie prior to this was moving forward with the mythos. When we saw STMP and the changes on the big E, the story was taking place after the TV series.
This is the first time anyone is telling stories in the time period of Kirk and Spock using new designs. Trek fans have an emotional investment in the classic visuals and current Trek fans are the primary audience for this film. It’s practically a guaranteed sell. If they made no changes, we would all go for the new story (with new actors). But since they are making changes…it is fair that they get our acceptance our not for the look of the film.”
Here’s the really screwy part: PARAMOUNT HAS A VESTED INTEREST IN THE ORIGINAL DESIGNS! How many millions were spent on remastering and updating the original episodes for hi-def? How many marketing doodads are out there are reliant upon those old designs?
I suspect that Paramount is looking at this as a seperate line from TOS, in case this thing does tank, so that the existing marketing won’t necessarily be negatively effected.
Think they know something about the actual viability of this flick that they don’t want us to know?
- ‘STAR TREK LIVES’…i hope this is not a cut from ‘Frankenstein’….
90. Stanky McFibberich – October 27, 2008
re:77. Xai – October 26, 2008
“i appreciate the emergency attention :)”
YOU!?
It was MY heart that stopped from the shock of your statement. You have no heart, so I don’t worry about you. ;-)
#102. Amen, brotha.
All I can say is thank God that Superman script review was leaked. That thing was INSANELY BAD.
Vic
It was actually more entertaining than most of the “Superman” movies that have been produced.
#101 Chekov was there, in Where No Man Has Gone Before. Really. And all the first season episodes too. Really. He was even assigned to the bridge. Really.
He was just off duty when WE happened to be on the bridge watching what was going on.
See how easy it is to explain things away?
I, for one, put my trust in the writers, director, and the entire cast and crew of this movie to deliver – and I haven’t seen anything so far that makes me worried.
If it’s great, I’ll say so. If it sucks, I’ll say so. But I’ll say so AFTER I’ve seen it.
Do I care if Pine’s eyes are a different color that Shatners? Not in the least tiny bit. In fact, until everyone started talking about it, I would have been hard pressed to even tell you what color Shatner’s eyes were, and I’ve met the man.
Do I care that the uniforms and sets look different and that the Enterprise probably will too? Nope. They are close enough and live up to the spirit and intent of the original. In fact, as long as the bridge doesn’t look like Willy Wonka’s Chocolate Room and the Enterprise doesn’t look like an AMC Pacer, then I’m ok.
What I DO care about is that for approximately two hours, I’m entertained by a good story, good acting and good production values – which is more than I can say about ST over the last several years. I hope that it rekindles my joy at seeing these great characters again.
I’m giving JJ and the gang benefit of the doubt.
Kirk’s Kung Fu chop to the neck and double fisted pile driver punch are more important to the JTK character than eye color. Get serious, people.
I realize we’re just passing time, but it would be cool if folks fostered more intelligent conversations.
Like: if Spock’s veins run green with copper-based blood, why do his lips, tongue and corners of his eyes look pink with the red of iron-based blood? Would color correction in the new movie actually make a more satisfying film?
What happens in twenty years, when we all have nanoprojectors behind our eyeballs projecting information and images directly on to our eyes… and currently in development technology to send and receive messages by electronic telepathy are real?
Or a serious conversation about the ‘big issue’ of the Reeves-Stevens book PRIME DIRECTIVE that KO cited as very influential: the issue is that book is whether the Prime Directive is morally justified when it means standing by while an intelligent species commits genocide or dies of starvation. Also cited in that book is a pro-PD argument that’s very similar to the rhetoric we hear in American politics about America not being the world’s sheriff.
Even better, why so many White Folks in Star Trek? No Chinese and no Indian characters… even though they represent 40% of Earth’s population today.
#108 “It was actually more entertaining than most of the “Superman” movies that have been produced”
Yeah, Dennis, like THAT’S an endorsement!
p.s. did you ever get around to seeing The Illusionist?
I think the eye colour should be addressed, if ONLY because I have a feeling Shatner WILL be in the sequal, as this film is going to be HUGE…
As someone else stated, having the two actors playing the same character in the film with different eye colours WOULD be odd to say the least. This isn’t about nit-picking, but creating a ‘flow’ between old and new.
I’m sure it would be a piece of cake to change eye colour digitally these days? And by doing so they would ‘future proof’ themselves incase Shatner ever does turn up, or some other story featuring perhaps video footage of Shatner etc etc etc…
Can’t WAIT for May!!!
#110 This crew was concocted in the 1960’s. Roddenberry achieved something spectacular having an African, Asian, Russian, and Alien on the crew. The biggest fight was Mr Spock because of his devilish overtones, so much so they airbrushed the ears and eyebrows in publicity shots they sent out to the south.
If you watch the show closely tho you’ll see that Indians and indeed, chinese people, were guest stars in the original. Khan anyone? Mr Singh (not Khan)? Even chinese actors I believe in The Omega Factor.
Now the question you should be asking are WHERE ARE THE AUSTRALIANS AND THE ITALIANS? :)
#112. Actually, now that you mention it – I’m realizing that Pine’s blue eyes make Shatner’s appearance impossible. All along I’ve been saying, “Easter-egg cameo! Easter-egg cameo!” But this pretty much kills that possibility.
In Titanic didn’t they fit old Rose with contacts so her eyes would match up with young Rose? Why should it be any different here?
“Blue Eyed Kirk”
Myself, I never gave a Klingon crap on “which side the hair is parted.”
I was mainly questioning the costuming/casting choices insofar as if Shatner ever was considered to be written into this film, (or a sequel) how would the Chris Pine, eye color aspect jibe? Again, I was under the impression there would be some physical traits/continuity between the films. I have *never* voiced expectations that the younger actors in this film be *identical* to the originals.
Bob Orci himself said on this forum (paraphrasing) “Eye color had been discussed.”
Kirk with blue eyes aint right. I’m sticking with that.
I still think that was a bad call, yet I plan on viewing this flick with great expectations and an open mind.
116. Crewman Darnell,
I remember Bob Orci’s quote regarding eye color, and I suppose they would have dome something to make Shatner’s and Pine’s eye colors match up, if Shatner were to be in this movie. I think that once it became clear that Shatner wasn’t going to be involved, the eye color may have become a non-issue.
Besides, the majority of the intended audience for this movie isn’t going to care that Pine’s eyes aren’t the same color as Shatner’s. Personally, I’d be hard-pressed to tell you what color Shatner’s eyes are. The actor with the most distinct eye color was DeForest Kelley, and it doesn’t bother me a bit that they didn’t match up Karl Urban either.
In post 117, the name should read “Thomas”.
#116. I’m not saying eye color matters. I’m just saying that since they didn’t bother to match up Pine’s with Shatner’s, then clearly Shatner idnt innit.
Personally, I don’t care. I think that generally Pine is a physical match with Shatner. Same kind of fair good looks, same glint of intelligence in the eyes. That’s far more important than the color.
maybe Kirk and Bones swap eyes before the films end? (it was done in Minority Report)
#120. Noooo. . . even better: Face/Off. They swap mugs!
#113
Lt. Gaetano – The Galileo 7
Lcdr. D’Amato – That Which Survives
Cdr. Giotto – The Devil in the Dark
Of course names could mean any nationality.
re: 105 Xai
My heartless mistake. Sorry.
It’s simple: if William Shatner were to appear in Star Trek 12, he’d have to wear contact lenses to match Chris Pine’s eyes.
Face it folks. William Shatner ***used*** to play Kirk and Chris Pine is now Kirk.
re:125. Dom
Are you trying to agitate people?
Hey, in the 23rd century they can change their eye color if they want to – so Kirk changed his a couple of times during his lifetime. :-)
Who cares about the eye color?!?! That is a non issue. I can see it now.. after the movie comes out.. you will all be bitching about eye color, hair styles and the bathroom is on the wrong side on the bridge… you won’t even have seen any of the movie. Sheesh.
Maybe Paramount will do SE dvds of TOS and movies 1-7 and CG in sparkling blue eyes for shatner and brown for Kelley…(similar to what Lucas did with Anakins ghost at the end of JedI)
Imagine watching the KHHHHHAAANN! scene with shatner having sky blue mel gibson/daniel craig eyes…or shatner looking up at the heavens watching his ship go down in flames with his sparkling blue eyes…or Ruth looking deeply into shatners irresistible blue peepers in Shore Leave…
115 – maybe thats why Shatner isnt in the movie!…he refused to wear blue contacts…
Dennis Bailey (#109),
I’m with you regarding JJ Abrams’ Superman script. I enjoyed reading it and thought it would make an amazing film. True, would have completely changed the origins of Supes and told a very different kind of story, but I was quite intrigued. Even more-so after I saw the disappointing Superman Returns.
#76—”…isn’t that like saying that Kirk was a white male only because William Shatner was a white male?”
Yes. It is. But that just so happens to ‘not’ be the particular physical difference between the two actors in question.
Kirk was written to be a particular type of personality, with specific character traits. The color of Pine’s eyes will not hinder his ability to bring the character to life in his youth.
James T. Kirk is a natural leader, in great physical condition, charismatic, loyal, honest and of good character, confident (perhaps even a bit arrogant), appealing to the opposite sex, courageous, and poised–even in the most critical of situations.
I am guessing that about sums up the character Chris Pine has chosen to play. IMO, if he successfully brings those traits to the character, it will be an adequate portrayal. He will have done the character justice.
Eye color will add nothing to the quality of his performance, whatsoever.
There is a fine line between “attention to detail” and preoccupation with it. You may miss the forest for the trees…
#51—”…but for people who have been devoted fans for years they may well be highly significant.”
I have been a devoted TOS fan since the mid-late 70’s. I actually never even noticed Shatner’s eye color, despite having seen every episode at least two dozen times, and each movie (excluding STV: Shatner’s Great Trek Turd Of ‘89) many more times than that. I guess I was far too busy enjoying them…
“For example, how many “Star Trek” novels have referred to the characters’ eye colors (e.g., Ael commenting to herself on McCoy’s “strange blue eyes” in “My Enemy, My Ally’ ”
Who cares, since ‘novels’ are non-canon (recognizing of course, that Orci and Kurtzman may choose to “canonize” some elements of certain novels by incorporating those elements into the script)?
#52—”At present Memory Beta lists the characters’ eye colors in their infoboxes. When the new movie comes out next year, will Memory Beta users have to delete that information because the eye colors are now “canonically uncertain”?”
That depends upon how serious they are about making sure the information is strictly canon.
‘Memory Alpha’ also uses sources of information which are not canon. The articles are often conjectural in some areas, or drawing from non-canon reference material which is in itself speculative.
Reference sources, even one such as MA, should be treated like books such as Okuda’s Star Trek Chronology. They have always been “trumped” by live action productions of Star Trek, and may be in this case as well..
For instance, Mr. Okuda decided for himself that the 5 year mission ended in 2269, when in fact, it was later made ‘canon’ that it ended in 2270 (”Q2″). I have also noticed that MA claims that Kirk took command of the Enterprise in 2264. From what source, I wonder, does that come from? How about the birth years of Kirk and Spock?
Those type of sites and books are fun, but be careful not to make more of them than they are…
The entirety of that reply is to post #51, not #52…sorry.
#110 – bmar
A thousand Amens!!
#113 – Mugz
Actually, I would fully expect that, should we get a sequel or two (and boy, is it WAAAAY to early to be talking about that!), we would never see any of the original actors ever again. Or would Paramount figure that this new cast just can’t handle a movie without one of the original actors holding their hands?
I know it’s a difficult concept to embrace, but just because a select number of the original actors are still alive doesn’t necessarily mean that they should make an appearance (other than Nimoy in the first film) in the relaunched franchise….
(runs and hides)
Ok all you eye color fans…..Maybe Just Maybe by Kirks century they can easily change the color of their eyes for instance so ladies can match their eyes with their dresses? Maybe he liked blue when he was younger or maybe when he got older he changed the color? So why would eye color actually matter….? Now I do remember that McCoy told Kirk he was allergic to a drug retinex that cures eyesight problems hmm….could be because of all that eye color changing he did when he was younger…heehh..
Ok All you guys that keep mentioning it have gotten me curious now….What were the main plot points of JJS Superman script???
I have to admit that after Superman Returns it could have hardly been worse….
All that movie did was point out how great the original Chris Reeve Superman movie was..even stole some of the lines, land plot again etc…..I kept thinking no make up your own great lines….and oh no not Luthor again! Wheres Brainiac!!?
The only half interesting thing was the son with the subconscious super powers plot….but even that kinda took away from the mythos….yah it looked better…..but if you dont have the story or characters the look of the movie doesnt mean much….
Which is another reason I am not concerned about any changes in the Trek movie so far….wait and see how good the story actually is..the characters and acting…if that all works the rest will work too…
Secrecy and Disclosure.
What is the point of secrecy, if not to enhance the enjoyment? A trickier question for y’alls is, what is the point of wanting to know more about the movie?
Is it so that you will know, in advance, whether or not you will go? Surely not. Surely the fact that we are here means that we are probably going to be lining up to go to the midnight screenings on Day 1.
Or is it so that we will know, in advance, whether or not we will like the film? I think this is closer to the truth but if so… why?
I am looking forward to the new Star Trek movie but I do not like that J.J Abrams does not want William Shatner to play in the new movie. I am big Star Trek Fan and I do want to see William Shatner in this movie. There is a short video in YouTube.com where William shatner is in a video and mentions that he would be interested in being in the movie. The old captain Kirk can be easily brought back to life to be in this new movie. Spock could go back in time and beam up Kirk just before he died in Generations. It seems like J.J. Abrams does not care about what the big Star Trek fans and William Shatner want to see in this new movie. So if there is any chance that J.J. Abrams reads this I hope you have William Shatner play in this new movie for May 2009 and have the old Captain Kirk go back in time with the old Spock. In Star Trek Generations I did not like seeing Kirk die in that movie and J.J. Abrams if you remember the movie Star Trek 3 the search for Spock. Well maybe you should watch that movie because Spock was brought back to life and you can do the same with Kirk. How many true Star Trek fans want to see William Shatner in this new movie? We need to get J.J. Abrams to listen to the Fans of Star Trek.
I’m curious, is the woman Kirk is making love to in the trailer Uhura, or another woman? I ask because the room behind Uhura undressing, and the room behind Kirk/woman look identical.