Abrams Talks Klingons & Romulans + New Kelvin Images At Intel Site November 14, 2008
by TrekMovie.com Staff , Filed under: Star Trek (2009 film) , trackback
Trek news is coming fast this week. Since the release of images of Nero and his pointed ears, it is no longer a spoiler that Romulans are the new Star Trek bad guys, but what about the Klingons? In a new interview JJ Abrams explains why. Plus, in totally unrelated, but still Star Trek film news, Intel has updated their partnership site, including new Kelvin wallpaper images.
Klingons are ubiquitous in Star Trek movies and were the primary or secondary villains in most of them. In one case (Star Trek III) the studio made the film makers change the originally planned Romulan villains into Klingons because it was believed mainstream audiences expect Klingons.
Empire Magazine attended the recent UK Star Trek preview (see their report), but today they added some additional comments given to them by JJ Abrams and why he prefers Romulan bad guys for his Trek [minor spoilers]:
Part of the fact is that they hadn’t seen them for so many years, so that it immediately breaks, for anyone who knows, the rules of Trek to start the movie and have Romulans crossing paths with Starfleet. It jumps in breaking the rules, which I think is kind of fun. That’s not to say it’s not explained and it’s not consistent with canon, given our story, but it felt like we had seen so many iterations of Klingons done that this felt like a way to do something in the familiar vernacular but not so familiar that it felt overdone.
However fans of Klingons, do not despair, Abrams also tells Empire that fans should expect to see some Klingons, although apparently a subplot involving them was removed. More details at Empire.
Intel update with more to come
Back in July at Comic Con, Intel launched a partnership site (boldlygo.intel.com) with Paramount to promote their products and Star Trek. Today the site has been updated with some new animations as well as some new wallpapers of the USS Kelvin. There are now four areas identified to be explored
- USS Kelvin (notes ‘docking soon;)
- Starfleet Database (trailer and image gallery)
- Technology (pitches Intel products)
- Recruitment (sign up for updates)
The two new Kelvin images are in the Starfleet Database. It looks like this is a site to keep an eye on.
One of the new wallpapers
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Comments»
First.
USS Kelvin looks pretty cool. looks more enterprisey than the actual enterprise.
They look like models instead of CGI — I like ‘em. :)
I wonder if the nacelles will look backlit like in wallpaper_2.jpg on the Church Enterprise, when she’s going to warp.
Facinating! Intel processors power Starfleet computers…
Striking.
^ Sorry I mean the image above.
Not to shabby, I take it this is a few decades after the NX-01.
Actually, I’d be happier with the backlit glow around the nacelle cap than a fully orange-yellow glowing nacelle cap.
J.J…. We haven’t seen bad Klingons since Star Trek Generations (1994)… Romulans were in the last crappy film (2002). You should have used Andorians.
so….. the nacelle is mounted to the saucer, killing everyone when it is turned on?
“It jumps in breaking the rules, which I think is kind of fun.”
Now that wasn’t a very wise thing to say, was it?
I’m sure they can explain Romulans being in the movie if they’re pirates from the future, but screwing with things “for fun” seems to go against everything they’ve said about being respectful to the source material.
I think I’d rather a total “re-imagining” than a hotchpotch of details that adhere strictly to canon alongside ones that go completely against it. What’s the point of being very faithful to one really minor fact (like the year Kirk was born or something), only to fiddle with something that was actually quite important in the original series (like the Romulans being a mysterious unknown quantity that no one’s seen)?
Cool design of the Kelvin. Looks great… as a 24th century starship. :)
P.S. I don’t want to sound like one of those nuts who jumps on every little comment anyone associated with the movie makes, I just think that that particular comment was a dumb thing to say when a lot of fans are so wary of changes to the Star Trek they’re familiar with.
Do you think the side of Spock’s science station will have an “Intel Inside” sticker on it!!!
I like the design. Gives it an edge. Cool…
Yeah! It really Is so much fun deliberately meddling with canon! And no, this isn’t sarcasm at all. Take me literally! I think it is necessary to finally forget up that canon crap and to move on with maximum creative license…
#11
“It jumps in breaking the rules, which I think is kind of fun.”
Now that wasn’t a very wise thing to say, was it?
erm…
you seem to have missed this bit :
“That’s not to say it’s not explained and it’s not consistent with canon”
wasn’t very wise to read half a quote was it???
– That said, the Klingons do have a presence in Star Trek. “You will see Klingon Warbirds in the movie. Maybe not in the way you expect, but you will see them,” teases Abrams. –
I suspect that we’ll see them in the Kobayashi Maru test.
I agree 10000% with #1.
The “for fun” comments are right on as well.
This team has manifested that kind of arrogance and disrespect ever since Lindelhoff’s “this ain’t your daddy’s Star Trek” comments from early on. It sure ain’t my daddy’s Star Trek. And the more I see and hear, the less I think that it’s my Star Trek as well. They shoulda just called it “Dudes in Space” – it would have given them better liscense to do whatever they wanted and been way more honest.
Intel..Shmentel… Everyone knows the Enterprise computers are powered by Daystrom Duotronic computer circuits! My computer is too… My only beef is every week I have to outwit my computer with a moral logic speech to stop it from going on a killing spree…
Romulans may mean a visit into period of the Romulan Wars something completly missed in Enterprise
What about some Enterprise views: side, front/rear, top/bottom or some shots from other angles to see more of the ship?
#17, of course I read the whole quote, that’s why I said “I’m sure they can explain Romulans being in the movie if they’re pirates from the future”. That’s what I understand the explanation is. They’re not ignoring canon completely, but they’re certainly bending it, so it’s not a great idea for them to be flippant about it.
I like the fact that the Kelvin is clearly an earler generation of Starship than the Enterprise – the nacelle is very different, and the whole thing looks just that little bit lower tech and lunkier.
I don’t like it at all.
I saw that desing before in the trek universe, I don´t remember the name of it.
Is very poor the desing
Wee a new Star Trekky Shippe!
#11: I think it’s more to do with the “Klingons off the starboard bow! LOL!” cliche that the mainstream audience associates with Star Trek than breaking Star Trek/canon “rules.”
Or to put it another way:
“AGAIN with the Klingons…”
#25, you mean the Saladin? Or the Freedom? :p
God I hope this movie is good!!
It would be nice if there were some more widescreen resolutions for the wallpapers….
I hope it just doesn’t suck.
#23
it’s not ignoring canon at all.. it’s part of the plot..
Well, the Intel sponsoring explains the iBridge :)
As I said in other comments: It’s ok to do a completely new version of Star Trek, as long as you don’t try and sell it as the old. However, you have to be consistent with your own “new” canon. Otherwise logical errors will most certainly ruin it for everybody. It just won’t be believable.
The design is pretty… such a shame in can’t go into warp with only one nacelle
I think this guy has made the best manip of the ship, anyone else agree?
http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=15964611&postcount=5106
#34
The Freedom-Class could also go on warp with only one nacelle!
The Kelvin looks better in that shot: the nacelle looks less like an eye. I’m warming to it, a bit. The Enterprise, however, looks great. But aesthetics are far from everything. They are, in fact, not that important to any film, let alone Star Trek. They are the feather in the cap, not the feather in the arrow.
Regarding canon, we are told that every ‘violation’ of canon will be explained with a canon explanation. And we now have the ‘given our story’ qualification to whether something is consistent with canon. It seems obvious to me that, with the alternative time-line story, many of the key events that have been established and maintained through forty years’ of Trek are going to be ignored. It’s about changing what you know, remember. The canon explanation would be that history played out differently; and this history is just as important, because we’ve got Star Trek in the title. Ignoring the very difficult philosophical problem of whether time-travel, specifically altering the past, is even logically possible, some fans are not going to be happy. Of course, other fans won’t care one bit if ‘canon’ is violated: if history is rewritten. Of course, much of this history has not yet been depicted in canon. This was probably an attraction in doing an origin story. But we know certain things; e.g., that Kirk reprogrammed the Kobayashi Maru Simulator to make it possible to rescue the freighter. This doesn’t have to happen in the new film, if the past is different.
The key issue in the canon debate, in my opinion, is the final result of this alternative time-line. I.e., does this film end in an alternative time-line to the one in which Star Trek has existed for the vast, vast majority of the show’s history? (There is a well-established and reliable internal Trek chronology, with some inconsistencies, of course.) I could understand the team wanting to do this. It would wipe the slate clean. They would have greater artistic freedom to write the stories and make the films they want to make. It would be perfect for a new run of films, instead of having to work within the restrictive framework at the moment. So, from one perspective, this option is best for the franchise. It would certainly make more of that all-important commodity: money. However, couldn’t this same option be seen as undermining the entire franchise? If all the shows and movies happened in a different reality, doesn’t that undermine their significance?
I really do not know.
(PS: if we could log-on to this site with passwords before we post messages, then that would be great. At the moment, anyone can post with the name Alec, for example, and it might not be me. I suppose I could use a less common name; but this wouldn’t solve the ‘problem’. It’s a problem if someone says something offensive and I get banned)
No, it’s not ignoring canon-it’s actively erasing it. “whoops, old canon’s gone. What are ya gonna do? Pirate Romulans, you know… pesky buggers. Oh, well! Let’s have Spock do something insane like banish Kirk to an ice planet–ya know, something that should get him thrown in the brig–but let’s have him choke the crap out of him first! Oh, and let’s make the Enterprise look completely different–how about hiring the guy who did those awful designs on the Star Wars prequels! That’ll show those Trekkies who’s boss!” I can’t believe Paramount hired a flipping Star Wars fan to make a Star Trek movie. I mean, come on! Really? Really? I can almost hear Alec Guiness in Chris Pine’s ear, “Use the Kirk Chop, Jim!”
Bah, there were a few single-nacelled models floating around at Wolf 359 — Freedom-class starships for one.
No reason why you can’t throw a pair of coils inside a single nacelle housing, right?
The single-nacelled ships are so fugly.
Just a little update on the Star Trek Blu-ray situation. Still there’s nothing definite about Star Trek coming out in blu-ray yet but i have no doubt that it will happen because I just found out that Star Trek: First Contact is the first film available in HD on Xbox Live. Check it out! No, it’s not going to be available on Xbox Live. It ’s available on Xbox Live right now!
“It looks like this is a site to keep an eye on.”
I’ll say!
I’m going to spend a little time looking around.
I like it!
STAR TREK LIVES!
only 174 days to go!
It looks like an older school science vessel, i know it isn’t one but still
It looks more like the deflector is on top, and the nacelle is below…
JJ:
“Part of the fact is that they hadn’t seen them for so many years, so that it immediately breaks, for anyone who knows, the rules of Trek to start the movie and have Romulans crossing paths with Starfleet.”
Up to now, I’ve been onboard and supportive with JJ, but this comment makes me worry that he doesn’t know enough about the past ST movies and TV series’. The Romulans/Remans were the MAIN villians in the last ST movie, which was roundly condemned as the WORST ST movie of them all!
Why didn’t JJ know this, and if he did know it, why did he select such wimpy villians? If he was going to retread old vilians, I would have prefered to see the Borg or Dominion.
1: I agree 100%
14. Matt
“Do you think the side of Spock’s science station will have an “Intel Inside” sticker on it!!!”
http://img352.imageshack.us/img352/8265/p61fx5cg5.jpg
;)
45. cugel the clever
“The Romulans/Remans were the MAIN villians in the last ST movie”
Errr, like… NO? Remans were the villians, Human was a villian, but no Romulan. Besides, there’s a great bunch of fabulous episodes from all ST series with Romulans in there. So there’s the potential. Just use it. And leave the Klingons in the background.
Looks wicked!
hey cool. So far this article has only partially been overrun by the negative nancys and canon cops. Its nice to see some positive comments instead of the standard ( dare I call it canon) whining and moaning that has hijacked this site.:)
Interesting…. The Kelvin looks somewhat faithful to a “TOS but updated” look while Enterprise appears to be significantly changed from her TOS counterpart. I am beginning to believe there is a specific reason in the movie for the change in design…
Looking at the higher res versions of both Kelvin wallpapers, it’s clear that the main viewer on the bridge really IS a window now (and the ceiling as well).
The Kelvin looks significantly more like what you’d expect to see from Starfleet technology at this point in time – despite some changes. I’m thinking that this is still supposed to be a ship from the regular timeline, and when Nero shows up technology and the regular unfolding of events diverges from here. The new Enterprise somehow “logically” follows suit. No idea how this all works, of course.
45. cugel the clever
“Up to now, I’ve been onboard and supportive with JJ, but this comment makes me worry that he doesn’t know enough about the past ST movies and TV series’. The Romulans/Remans were the MAIN villians in the last ST movie, which was roundly condemned as the WORST ST movie of them all!”
You answered your own question… He didn’t see the movie, just like most of us who knew it was crap…
35 that is an improvement. now about those pylons. . .
48. Pah Wraith
My point was that the Romulans have been done to death in star trek movies and films, almost as much as the klingons. When they first appeared in TOS and TNG, they were relatively new, unknown, and sinister; but as they became “regulars”, they became less formidable until by the time of the final season of DS9, they were simply sidekicks to the Federation.
I agree with you that technically, the Remans and one human were the villians in Nemesis. However, don’t forget that initially most of the Romulan fleet supported Shinzon and it’s by no means clear that the Romulans became “good guys” in the end – only two Romulan warbirds arrived on the scene to assist Ent-E in the final battle with the Scimitar. Where was the rest of their fleet? For all we know, these may have been rogues, and the rest of the Romulan fleet was still hostile to the Federation. After all, Shinzon killed the entire Romulan senate (which presumably, after the Dominion war, was relatively open to negotiations with the Federation) and probably replaced it with hardline anti-Federation lackies.
In any case, my original point still stands – ST needs an infusion of new villain blood. I hope that in JJ’s next ST film, he actually does “go were no one has gone before” and comes up with an original antagonist.
Hmm… the design of the Kelvin is… non-conformist ;-)
Roddenberry was always insistent that starships should have an even number of nacelles – no one-nacelled destroyers or three-nacelled battlecruisers.
However…
I DO like the Kelvin. A LOT more than the new Enterprise. Probably because I had high expectations of what the Enterprise should be, and no expectations regarding the Kelvin.
If you look closely, however, the blue ‘eye’ on top is actually the DEFLECTOR. The red one underneath is the nacelle!
It’s not the job of the Director to view all previous TV shows and Movies. The story comes from the writers. It is also the job of the writers to pay attention to what has gone before and feed that information to the Director.
With JJ’s quote – you are assuming that he is referring to whether the Romulans have been in recent Trek films. Try reading it again and think about whether JJ is referring to the fact that at the period of time in the new film; StarFleet and Vulcan had not seen the Romulans.
“Part of the fact is that they hadn’t seen them for so many years, so that it immediately breaks, for anyone who knows, the rules of Trek to start the movie and have Romulans crossing paths with Starfleet.”
Klingons have become something of a cliche with mainstream audiences and have become the butt of so many jokes. Its kind of hard to sell a movie seriously if your main villain’s race is lampooned so much that its even referenced in top 10 lists on David Letterman. I’m pretty sure that’s part of the reason Abrams & Co. pushed them to the background and focused on the Romulans, which from where I sit is better than introducing a heretofore unknown species (Xindi anyone?).
As for the Kelvin, Definitely looks cool from these pics, though I do think that’s a secondary (engineering) hull on top and the warp nacelle is on the bottom.
58 Hanabi
Whether it is the director’s job or the writers job, the point still stands. The Romulans are boring and overdone. Let’s move on. Surely there are greater dangers in the galaxy than the Romulans. It’s too late (obviously) to do anything about ST XI, my comments are directed at the writers for ST XII – please don’t retread the Romulans, the Klingons, the Cardassians, the Borg, the Dominion, etc, etc. Do something different and creative.
50
yeah, it is nice to see a board without so much negativity.
Another nice nod to the ships in TOS in Kelvin is the three portholes at the very front of the saucer (Primary Hull). Take a look at the Kelvin from the Intel site with the blue background, and you’ll see them very clearly.
This is CGI? Wow! Really well done.
intel chips? they must have hoodwinked starfleet into not using the far superior amd chipsets.
but at least apple didnt get their borg-like hooks into ‘em.
the very last movie was a romulan story, didnt abrams even see that?
this should have been an andorian story, easily…
this movie had better not stink, so many red flags already.
59 TonyD
There was nothing wrong with introducing the Xindi. ST-ENT just didn’t do it very well and had other problems than simply the fact of introducing a new antagonist species.
I personally liked some of the plotlines of the 4th and final season of ENT – they should have started ENT with the kinds of stories that they did in season 4. If so, it might still be on the air. In particular, I liked the stories which showed tension between some of the races which later formed the Federation. This is a plotline which could be developed in the 12th movie….. the villian would come from within the Federation, not from outside. For example, it could be in the form of a civil war or rebellion which pits the Federation races against each other, with the Klingons and Romulans of course plotting and agitating on the outside.
#35 Kirky -
Thanks for the link. Yes, I think that image presents a much more “balanced” design. That one and some of the other fan manipulations I’ve seen certainly change the design into something more attractive and, well “balanced,” for lack of a better term. The new movie Enterprise design to me looks like a half-assed representation of the TOS or TMP Enterprise used as cover art on some cheap 1970s Star Trek coloring book or on the box art for a Star Trek “fazer” toy made in Yugoslavia…
And I’d like to add/agree with some of the other posts… the level of believability with regard to the CG for this film is as good as I had hoped!
To me, the CG in TRANSFORMERS was (for the most part) a new level of “real”.
I *HATE* fake, hokey CG. They really stepped it up in TRANSFORMERS.
See, for this new Trek, my #1 concern is that the ships look like real physical objects (TMP); not whether or not they placed the correct pinstripe on the side of the hull. But hey, maybe that’s just me.
It’s not a particularly attractive ship, but the Kelvin design does a good job of establishing what came before in the STXI vision of what the Starfleet lineage looks like, and in that it is a stroke of genius. I hope we see a slew of ships in this movie, some that look like the Kelvin, some with the Reliant configuration, and some that defy anything we’ve seen before.
Star Trek is turning over a new leaf, and it is exciting.
#35
that is a ship i can live with, and it deserves a repost:
http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=15964611&postcount=5106
a tall, confident old girl. thats more like it.
but hey, who needs to ask the fans? who cares what we think? right, jj?
64
“…the villian would come from within the Federation…”
I like your idea, it’s compelling. It has a very sinister tone, almost like a nightmare scenario where terrorists are pulling strings in government to wipe out unknowing citizens.
As far as Andorians being the main protagonist, I think it would be silly to re-launch serious Trek for the masses and depict the main villian as a Smurf blue alien with little antennea sticking out of his head.
@60:
I actually think the Romulans are about the most under-used villians in Trek. They can be very convincing, and in particular their closeness to the Vulcans (who have always been the good guys – Sybok excepted) makes them effective.
Introducing a previously unknown species at this stage would be a bad move, and I think that would be the case in ST:XII as well, if we get an ST:XII. I would personally like to see a more introspective villian in ST:XII – perhaps a human Starfleet Admiral with ideas about becoming a dictator of the Federation? Or the leader of an Andorian separatist faction?
There’s plenty of scope within the existing Trek universe for villians without needing to introduce any more species.
@64:
Great minds think alike!
pah. andorians kicked ass, nothing smurphy about ‘em:
http://www.idwpublishing.com/solicit/nov07/Andorian_cover.jpg
aggressive, cold and calculating…
jj insists we havent seen romulans in trek for ages, he must be speaking for himself.
the last time he saw romulans was before the proper makeup appliances seen in TNG, which might explain why his romulan looks like a human
http://cache.io9.com/assets/images/io9/2008/08/romulan-789281.jpg
not
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/inconsistencies/makeups/romulan-dar.jpg
ENT did a great job with the Andorians. In my mind, they were the most under-utilized alien race before season 4 of ENT. They were introduced in TOS as one of the founding races of the Federation, and then promptly ignored through hundreds of television eps and 10 movies! ENT did a great job with the makeup and FX to make the Andorians look real. I loved the way they made the antennae move independently and incorporated the antennae into the “mood” of the person – this is the kind of alien-making that ST has always done so well – they don’t just slap makeup on an actor and make him an alien; they actually create believable backstories and “personalities” for entire races.
14. Matt Do you think the side of Spock’s science station will have an “Intel Inside” sticker on it!!!
I used to have a Playmates TNG Tricorder that I put an Intel Inside sticker on! Yeah, dorky…
looks like the kelvin has a window/viewscreen too!
73
“this is the kind of alien-making that ST has always done so well – they don’t just slap makeup on an actor and make him an alien…”
Maybe not, but they got into a terrible habit of putting forehead/nose bridge appliances on just about any “alien” they could…
I think the new movie is definitely going to shake up Star Trek, and, for many of us, this is a GOOD thing. The time-travel stories have been done to death, except that in all of them everything always works out in the end… such as TVH (which is still one of my favorite movies, period). If the new movie turns out to be a time-travel story in which things don’t work out in the end, if things are altered, if things are morphed into something different… I say, “That’s science-fiction.” And I think that would make this film all the more significant. The intention of the producers, all along, has been to give Trek a jump-start. The Trek franchise has been declining in viewership, merchandise sales and simple interest, in general, over the past decade. Messrs. Berman and Braga have endured a tremendous amount of criticism (almost as much as JJ & Co.) primarily because fans were not so happy with the direction Trek was going. Until we see the new movie, we do not know where Trek is going (even if some people think they know). Personally, I think creating an alternate world (if that is part of the story) is a great idea, and is a rarely looked at notion in science-fiction. Sure, everyone wants things to always come back to “normal,” where everything is safe and secure. I don’t know about you, but my “normal” life has been full of alternate worlds, a permanently altered life, and left me with the feeling that nothing is safe and secure. If Trek is about boldly going, then there really shouldn’t be anything safe and secure about it.
(I’d love to have been a fly on the wall when Orci and Kurtzman were hashing out the plot…)
Finally, the Romulans will be fine as the villains. They have only appeared in NEM, and a cameo in TVH, while Klingons have been in TSFS, a cameo in TVH, TFF, TUC… um, who’s been overdone? The Borg simply do not have enough “character” to make good villains (which is why they had to have the Queen character in FC). I will agree (and I hope the Supreme Court is listening), I would love to see the next Trek film be about the exploration of uncharted space, encountering new life and new civilizations… something totally new, and not necessarily a proper sequel. I certainly don’t want the next film to have to be a remake of WNMHGB, or “Man Trap,” or every other episode of TOS simply because of “canon.” Take me on a new, and wild journey, guys!
It might just be me but, aren’t these ships SO outdated, that even their ‘new’ designs look old… dated?
IN all fairness, Enterprise E is amazing… perfect! JUST how I imagine ships of the future… or wish the to become.
But… before someone starts regurgitating the same old jazz about well it’s long before Enterprise E…
My only reply is, Enterprise 1701 is FAR into the future… and we can design ships in movies like that… maybe our designs would look cooler in Kirks time too..
We’re limiting our designs by what was possible in the 1960s..
That’s all I am saying
77
“I would love to see the next Trek film be about the exploration of uncharted space, encountering new life and new civilizations…”
P Techno, amen to this!
This is what Star Trek set out to be. I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: the defining moment for me is The Cage, when Spock walks up to the “singing” plant life and touchs a couple of the leaves… and then grins!
The sense of wonder and discovery…
THAT is what I call Star Trek.
Somehow I didn’t expect the Star Fleet to be run by Intel chips in their ships…
;)
If this had been the Enterprise design unveiled:
http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=15964611&postcount=5106
I would have reacted with “Yeah, Baby!! There’s my girl!!!” instead of “WTF??” – which was my reaction to the new design.
81
Yeah, cuz we all know how radically different and better that image looks than the one JJ’s team did.
Is JJ’s version so awful in the first place when all you did was — by your own admission — “tweak” it??
You’re splitting hairs, people
#37—i really dont think youll get banned for another Alec’s buffoonery; they trace email addresses here, so unless this other Alec hacked your email address, you’re good
btw the kelvin looks like a frying pan with 2 handles!!!
http://forums.superherohype.com/showpost.php?p=15964611&postcount=5106
is a fine looking ship, its hardly a split hair when compared to the bulbous mutant jj and crew bestowed upon us.
anyone noticed how they havent released any new pictures of the old girl?
gosh, i wonder why?
84
Why do you think that is?
Don’t you think they’ve shown us enough during the past several days? Especially in light of the fact that the film does not even open until May of next year?
Also,
The creators of this project have nothing to apologize for or “correct” in my opinion.
This new breath-of-fresh-air Trek film will not succeed or fail because of hardcore Trek fans like us. It will be up to the masses. They know this and that is why we won’t be seeing any corrections or apologies by JJ and crew.
It is their creative vision, not ours. And not to be a broken record but if ya don’t like what they’re doing to Trek then don’t go to the theater on May 9th.
@82:
The changes may only be slight, but they’re important. I think the one mentioned in #81 is much better than the one they’re going to be using. The design is much more harmonious.
Apart from the nacelles. They’re still ugly. It’s those damned hoods on the bussards – yuck! And they’re too short. Need to be about 30% longer. the ship looks really forward-heavy otherwise.
@84:
Dead on. One is nice, one is ugly.
…Heh, Intel’s pushing viewers to buy computers from Bankrupt City :-)
Intel Inside, Idiot Outside….
The excitement is growing. And, by the way, if you listen closely to the sounds played at the intel site, you will hear some classic TOS beeps.
#81 is good but, as a matter of fact, it’s the TMP enterprise. I want to see something different, you know.
#10
Yes, because warp engines are real.
I, too, would like to see TREK go back to its roots of seeking out “new life and new civilizations…”
I don’t remember the last time this happened. TMP? Voyager did it, to a certain extent, but the show quickly devolved into the same “bad guy of the week” scenarios we got in TNG. DS9 was a Western at an Army fort. And none of the movies have involved exploration since TWOK set the action template.
What happened to “Boldly go…”????
I wonder how fast it can make the kessel run.???
93
“What happened to “Boldly go…?”
Good question.
#93
Totally agreed.
I fear that reflective and deep plots don’t work on the big screen anymore. TMP was the perfect cross between 2001 and Trek, but a lot of people found it boring and too cerebral. The sad truth.
96 Paulaner
I see what you’re saying, right, but I think there is more than one way to approach it.
As a story unfolds, as it builds, there could be sequences in the film that better reflect the “thrill of discovery” vibe.
Think of Alien. When the crew went to answer the distress call. How awesome was it when they were making their way to the alien vessel… and looking inside? It was exciting and different, unlike anything we had ever seen before to that point.
I say it’s still 100% possible to execute — they just need the right people to put it together.
Is anyone else having trouble with that website? In Firefox the Flash loads then nothing happens, and in IE it pans around a “bay” of some sort then goes to black. :-(
Vic
I have to wonder whether were we’re going to see one of the established Klingon versions or if they’ve invented a new version for this universe.
#94 Depends on your warp factor :p
#0 I think JJ is on to something here. The Romulans, so pissed at being replaced in ST III: TSFS, and so thoroughly mangled across the Star Trek timeline, particularly with NEM… decide to go back in time and blow it all to hell. Yes, Nero makes perfect sense.
But as David Gerrold once said “A touch of Klingon makes the story.” Fortunately it looks like nero-Kirk as with ur-Kirk will still defeat Klingons in his Kobayashi Maru test by making them swoon over him, adore him, and worship him as Tiberius the Great, second only to Kahless.
This is Star Trek 009, after all.
I agree with everybody who loved the Andorians on Enterprise, but they wouldn’t be good villains for this movie.
All the negative comments about this movie really depress me. Sheesh.
Love the updates to the site. As for the Romulans, I’m actually glad that they’re the main bad guys and that the Klingons have been relegated to the back seat for once. Never liked them anyway (except for Worf, of course, and General Martok).
#98
I can’t get that Flash site to function from work, either. Thanks Adobe! Sure wish someone could just throw up some thumbnails. <:(
#35
Nope, it looks like something I’ve been watching for years, and years, and years. Give me something new to relish and investigate.
Old and busted, new hotness…old and – oh, you know..
haha no wonder the shields and engines are always going offline when ou most need them…
the ships are powered by INTEL! =P
“USS Kelvin looks pretty cool. looks more enterprisey than the actual enterprise.”
I’m still trying to figure this out. It looks almost like and exact replica of the old Enterprise but just with some refinements for the 21st century. Still havn’t heard any critiques of the new design that make any valid points about it’s design not being in line with the original.
#96
I think the problem with TMP wasn’t that it was ‘too cerebral’, but rather that the pacing was leaden and a lot of the acting wooden. Don’t get me wrong – I love TMP. But I can view it through a critical eye.
Intel processors practically run everything now…. makes senses they will run them in Starfleet. Hmmm… Pentium… Di-Lithium… maybe that’s what they really are.
You now who would be a great villain infusion? They’ve been around since TOS, have never been seen on-screen, brew up Kirk’s favorite flagon of hooch and would satisfy any “lizard man” alien requirement.
The Saurians.
TOS had all kinds of booze-related plot lines, too. Imagine a K7scene where a young Kirk has to decide between Romulan Ale and Saurian Brandy. Spock would harangue Kirk about the brewing techniques. Scotty would swear that a good bottle of Oban drunk out of a dusty glass is amber colored dilithium. McCoy could hand back with a mint julep and tell ‘em all to go to hell.
The Kelvin looks like one of Matt Jefferies earliest sketches for the Enterprise without the second nacelle. I like it. Hopefully, the Big E looks better from another angle like this ship.
74. richpit
What’s even dorkier is, I still have one! :)
Just a note from a Trek Purist.
I love the original E. There would be NO problem using that ship in any of the Trek Series or movies. In fact it has been used in Trek IV come to think of it, REMEMBER?!!! Spock was re-educating himself at the computer at his home at Vasquez Rocks. CORRECT?!!!
Yes, the original E would still obviously need minor improvements.
An updated texture map, some thrusters and air-locks, etc. But it has been used at the movies, as it originally appeared in Star Trek TOS – in Star Trek IV.
But that’s not the point here.
The producers have seemingly decided to revamp the ship drastically. Perhaps to show the audience that this is not the actual E we’ve known. It’s the Alternate E. And in that Alternate character, I believe the new design is close to perfect. I like the 50s styling when an “Alternate timeline plot” is considered. Yes I still think the Engine’s are a bit too big. But i’d still like to see it onscreen for final judgement. I think this ship is designed to take ALOT of punishment. And I think it is going to have to look like it can take it. Yes the new/alternate design is really growing on me. Can’t wait to see how they show the ship moving through space. The angle in the released image will probably not ever been seen onsceen and does appear to be a tough angle for the ship visually. An aft shot will surely be a better angle. It does convey a good feeling of mass and dimension. I am liking the texturing and the fact that the primary hull could be the only part that survives. I could see it going a couple ways.
The original E always looked to be kinda fragile. Although the TOS E took so many poundings, the FX were never ther to show any damage. Unless you consider the Remastered Eps. and how they handled the Doomsday Machine and the Constellation. Now that’s damage. Still the TOS E would not appear to be able to take so much of an assault.
So for now. Please no more Photoshoping the new E (alternate or not). No more talk about how the they are going to change thier design.
They are not going too.
Just be patient and the larger picture will be revealed soon…
…AND I AM SO EAGER TO SEE IT ALL!!!
The Kelvin is horrible, Romulans were the villains in the last movie
I can’t believe no one else has mentioned this: This makes the second time the people involved with creating the movie have said KLINGON Warbirds!” There is no such thing as a Klingon warbird. The ROMULANS use warbirds, the Klingons use Birds of Prey. Are they really making such an obvious mistake?
The Klingons and Romulans have been allies since Trek’s Stone Age.
They are kinda like the Russians and the Chinese. (uh oh.)
-It looks like a polished piece of art from the history of the sci-fi world … i don’t see nothing modern in this picture… it’s a very strange thing …
I took Abrams remark about “they haven’t seen Romulans for a long time” to be referring to the human characters in the movie, not the audience.
I wonder if the new communicators will look like a Razr or an iPhone.
117. I took it to mean no one saw nemesis.
“You will see Klingon Warbirds in the movie. Maybe not in the way you expect, but you will see them,” teases Abrams.
Klingons don’t have Warbirds!!!
Nice to see a more positive talkback for the first time in days! So much outrage over something so little and, shockingly, industry professionals showing no courtesy whatsoever to the professionals working on this film in the discussions! I was amazed to see past Trek designers slagging off the designs in these talkbacks!
I can understand them posting their opinions on their own blogs and maybe talking to Anthony in an interview, but to join in the rabble-rousing started by certain members of the great unwashed to the extent that people like poor James Cawley have to intervene is appalling! I wouldn’t work on episode four of a TV show, then go on a bulletin board and slag off another editor’s work on episode 5! That would be unprofessional!
Anyway, on-topic, I really like the Kelvin design! Like everything we’ve seen of this movie, it goes back to the original Trek designs, then heads off in a new direction. I’m kind of reminded of my childhood, when I’d watch a cartoon series, then a new animation company would take over resulting in a whole new design aesthetic, often along with new voice artists. I always loved that and enjoyed retrofitting those styles on earlier episodes in my head.
The look of the Kelvin tells us from the outset that we’re in for a fresh new approach to Star Trek. For me, it ranks up there with the revamp of the DC Universe, post-Crisis, in the 1980s.
In a sense, this is the first major overhaul that the look of Trek has had since the 1980s. We’re getting a new transporter effect, a new look to warp travel (always hated the ’stretch-bang’ effect used in TNG) and a new aesthetic for the ships.
I have no interest in seeing any more live-action TV Trek for now, but I’d love it if they did an animated series which can pick up on the new film’s look and take it further still.
Change hurts sometimes, but Abrams and his team are giving Trek exactly what it needs!
Deluxe! I like it.
Man, I was just checking that Intel site last night… must have just missed the update.
I kind of like that the Kelvin “breaks the rules.” First of all, they’re just rules that have been made up in publications, tech journals, and by fans as an explanation for what we see on screen. Nobody has ever said in an episode you can’t have a warp nacelle right next to the main population of your ship. (And if that were true, how do you explain the Defiant, or runabouts?) Second of all, I like that it doesn’t look like the same old endless variations on saucer, secondary hull, and two nacelles on stalks theme that almost every new starship has followed.
Obviously, the Enterprise has to look like the Enterprise, and I love it, but I’m think it’s cool that they did something different with this ship that we’ve never seen before, from an earlier time.
I am having trouble understanding the Kelvins design.
First, why attach the warp nacelle to the saucer, when there is already a secondary hull that it can traditionally be attached to?
Second, why have a secondary hull at all then?
Third, if starships with warpdrive can function with a single warp nacelle, then why do some need two? Does this increase speed?
120. NCC-73515
Maybe they do now! ;)
#123, yes having two warp nacelles increases warp speed
http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Nacelle
#122 “Nobody has ever said in an episode you can’t have a warp nacelle right next to the main population of your ship.”
Totally agreed. Let the imagination run wild, guys. I don’t want to see the same old schematics over and over again.
123. DATA KILLED SPOT!
Perhaps if you stop thinking about the Kelvin’s design conventionally and imagine it with the saucer vertically, you’ll see it as a secondary hull on one side and a nacelle on the other, linked by a saucer! One of Trek’s weaknesses is that we are always told one angle is ‘upright’, when there is no up and down in space!
Hey, where are my postings!?
#121 “So much outrage over something so little and, shockingly, industry professionals showing no courtesy whatsoever to the professionals working on this film in the discussions”
Yes, such an unpleasant behaviour. From a professional point of view, I would never criticize another professional in such a blatant way. No one is “right” in this matter. It’s only a question of points of view. Plus. some technical discussions are frankly ridiculous. This is science fiction and this technology doesn’t really exist. There is no point in criticizing an engine for being here or there. We are talking about aestethics, and this is a subjective matter.
I tried to respond to #120, but my postings seems to be landed in the database but is not viewed on this side hier. Please Anthony, repair this!
Yeah man
Love the Kelvin, seems like it has better aethetics to me, flows better. New E looks to hodgepodgey to me. Love the saucer, even like other elements of the engines, neck, dish, but I loath the damn cropped secondary hull and I loath the way things don’t seem to flow together on her. They really nailed the Kelvin though, kudos!! Great Starfleet Battles vibe.
the number of warp propulsion units affects the speed the ship achieves warp velocities, not the velocities, themselves.
a single nacelle craft can still fly at warp 6, but cant break the ftl barrier as fast as a two nacelle craft.
i’m assuming the secondary hull on the kelvin is mostly research equipment / sensor packages, maybe cargo and supplies?
its a strange configuration, certainly not for engineering functions, since the nacelle attaches to the saucer independently…
but then again, with jj and crew in charge of trek, who knows?
i think a ptolemy class vessel would have been a better choice.
Or is it not allowed to post memory alpha links? Hm, that would not be good to exchange information and knowledge…
(To the Kelvin) You poor cigar smoking Bastard.
132. j w wright
With respect, we don’t know if any of those rules count for squat in the New Trek universe of this film! ;)
Why does the Kelvin’s Engine have a “Teaser Trailer Enterprise” design to it?
Engine on the bottom, Secondary hull with blue dish on the top
The Kelvin. Maybe that’s the ship that Zefram Cochrane is using while traveling on in his “final” voyage.
The Kelvin. Maybe that’s the ship that Zefram Cochrane is using while traveling on in his “final” voyage.
12 and 123
I don’t get any complaints about the Kelvin looking too 24th century or about the nacelle being attached to the saucer. It looks almost exactly like a Federation-class ship upside-down with the two side nacelles removed. And the texturing and details are extremely close to the ST:TMP design. Doesn’t seem like a stretch at all.
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/articles/sftm/federation-sftm.gif
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/articles/sftm.htm
And I know they don’t have a secondary hull, but both the Reliant and the Stargazer attached their nacelles to the saucer.
Hey Guys – is it me or…? Take another look at the pictures of the Kelvin…
doesn’t the registry name and numbers look skewed to port on the saucer section instead of centered?? Wierd!
The New E leaves a lot to be desired, the orignal is far better. However, I do like the Kelvington, I mean Kelvin…
Yes, this Kelvin looks better than their Enterprise.
I think that when we see more images of the Enterprise in shots like those we’ve seen of the Kelvin, people might chill out a bit! There have been a lot of kneejerk reactions over a shot that doesn’t even fit the entire ship into frame!
For those decoding the Kelvin and it’s noticeable shared design vocabulary with the TOS Enterprise, it’s becoming increasingly clear that Nero’s attack on or near Kirk’s birth either militarizes Starfleet or corrupts the timeline with advanced technology–perhaps from a disabled Romulan craft.
Regarding animation, I’ll put my chips in with those who think this is a good idea–especially if it’s of the KILL BILL variety and not targeted at kids, like TAS.
One nice thing about starting this campaign and releasing visuals early is that S&S can get a run of franchise paperbacks written and ready for Holiday 2009… a Kelvin book series, etc.
#113
The Romulans WERE NOT the villains in Nemesis; a defective clone who was living with the Remans was the villain. If you go back and watch the movie, you’ll see that by the climax of the film the Romulans actually try to help Picard & Co.
As to the design of the Kelvin, I like it. It harkens to the principles behind the Reliant in that in takes familiar elements and mixes them up a bit to come up with an interesting design. Given that the ship probably plays a relatively small part in the story, I think its just fine.
Just remember folks: The key word in science-fiction is FICTION.
militarizes Starfleet or corrupts the timeline:
for example, the uncircumcised nacelles on the new Enterprise can be interpreted as combat shielding
Oh hey, one more thing: I think this Kelvin image is the first indication that they’re not monkeying with the TOS font. The teaser trailer’s font kind of freaked me out
Not a fan of product placement in the 23rd century. It strains believability. I didn’t like it when the gang wore Levi’s and drank Jack Daniel’s “scotch whiskey” in STV, and it feels like it’s going to be even more heavy-handed in this movie. Ordering a “Budweiser Classic” in the 23rd century, my ass.
[149] Yep, that was the Eurostyle, formerly known as Microgramma… was fashionable in the 80s, that font ;))
The more they can inject of star wars (especial the prequels) into star trek the better imo.
I actually like the design of the Kelvin. While I’ve never been a big fan of the single warp nacelle design, it is established canon. I thought the Freedom class was horribly ugly, but somehow adding the engineering hull on “top” of the saucer gives it some symmetry and make it look much better.
The only nitpick I have (if I may be a total geek here) is that the engineering hull contains the warp core, and it would seem to make more sense to have the nacelle(s) attached directly to it rather than on the other side of the ship.
Hi my name is Alec. Oh wait, no its not. Sorry for the confusion. Strange to see people on this site posting what they really feel, as opposed to on the Simon Pegg page from yesterday or the Jim Crawley page, where everyone wants to get on their good side and just say what they think pegg and crawley want to hear. Of course, everyone attacked me for bringing that up, yet right here on this site is a totally different tune. Very peculiar…
I’ve always been a big fan of the TMP Enterprise, and a lesser fan of the TOS Enterprise. The reason for this is because the day I bought the AMT Enterprise model kit, the Enterprise on television looked like a $12 model, and I felt rather let down. The tv Enterprise was, for its time, a very cool thing to see on television, because there was nothing else like it. But I think when you really get down to it, the tv Enterprise looks like a rather inexpensive model kit. Now, the TMP Enterprise looked so much better — for obvious reasons. The new look was much sleeker and sexier. And, using a much larger model, it looked bigger and had more mass onscreen. Certainly, the detail was far more elaborate.
As far as I know (I’m certain to be corrected if I’m wrong), the TMP Enterprise was pretty much the same Enterprise seen thru TUC… For me, this is the real Enterprise. The one from the tv series was my AMT model kit. Still, I dug the design of it. Prior to the starship Enterprise, sci-fi movies and tv shows were filled with flying saucer-style ships a la “Lost In Space,” or rocket-style ships a la “Buck Rogers.” There wasn’t much imagination going on, it seems. Then came 2001, and the look of those ships was spectacular. The attention to detail was exquisite. Of course, it could be argued that 2001 was the first serious science-fiction film.
Again, the first time I saw the pic of the new Enterprise, I thought “It’s the Enterprise.” I do not see anything wrong with this new ship, at all. So it’s a little more this, or a little less that, or whatever………? I barely noticed. Who gives a Horta’s butt (wherever that is) anyway? It still looks like the Enterprise, and I’d bet that 9 out of 10 people could be given a quick glance of it, and their mind would immediately think, “Enterprise.” That 10th person lives in a cave…
151 Eurostyle- cool font.
Obviously, JJ really liked the TOS E, (who wouldn’t) but if you’re going to start “fresh,” why design a new secondary hull and nacelles and then tack on such a derivative saucer?? Same with the Kelvin!
If you’re going to start fresh, start fresh!!
I read John Eaves was on the design team- did he do the shuttles?
Maybe he did the Kelvin too. Nice to see they brought at least him back.
Yes the “movie” Enterprise was my favorite too. Robert Wise’s pan on the ship, with Goldsmith’s music, unrivaled in all of Trek.
i like the very slow intro in the TMP where Scotty brings Kirk to the enterprise. its pretty much the best part of the movie (from my point of view, and thats just fine with me if others think otherwise) but my least favorite of the TOS franchise. Though I always watch the movies starting with TMP anyway because i just cant leave it out in my whole TOS experience. I even watch Nemesis (which is REALLY hard) but to enjoy the full star trek effect, we have to take the bad with the good. Because at least with pre-ORCI star trek, the other participants (even the horrible Brannon-Braga team that crashed star trek into the mountain) never decieved us about where trek was going or coming from. They stayed basically to the trek story line with just a few minor mis-steps, but nothing blatant. The point is, ORCI-ABRAMS, we just don’t like being LIED TO. If we were never lied to, so many of these posters wouldn’t be upset. Then we would just make a choice to see it or not to see it, and to be honest, if Nimoy wasn’t in this or any other Star Trek Pre-Orci members, I would not go see it at all. I would disregard this as a joke. But because Nimoy is included, as well as the other cast members all for it, I can only say that there might be reasons altogether different than them just saying “thats’ fine, let’s do this”. I think for the TOS its about Star Trek continuing, kind of like their “children”. All “parents” must support their “children”, even if it’s the red-headed step-child (not that there’s anything wrong with being a red-headed step-child) just as long as the red-headed step-child isn’t blatantly fraudulant. But many more posters on this site have cited much better examples of their disappointment in the cast and crew of for deceiving us. And I am not WOWED or IMPRESSED with Pegg or Crawley’s corporate-defence stances either nor with those on those webpages who jump on the bandwagon.
Whoever the poster on this page said “it ain’t my daddy’s star trek and it sure ain’t mine” or words to that affect, hear here! We park our starships in the same spacedock!
#132: we get it, you don’t like the new Enterprise.
The fact that you think AMD is superior to Intel show spoe people can’t let go of the past (Core2 has been out for a while now and is the performance standard, the i7 increases it).
156. Dr. Image
We haven’t seen the top of the saucer fully constructed yet! ;)
#154
What threads were you reading? The Cawley article has a lot of feelings, both ways. As for the Pegg article – all he did was talk about being excited. What ‘feelings’ should we have about him? He hasn’t done anything. And what exactly does ‘getting on his good side’ do for anyone? The chances of someone on this site actually meeting Simon Pegg in real life are nil.
The only time I’ve ever seen people shut down on this site are when they blatantly and unrepentantly break the rules (such as personal attacks) or ignore the site owner’s requests that they stop. There’s a difference between offering your opinion and just being negative for the sake of being negative.
158 – Orci hasn’t lied to us. He hasn’t revealed things, but that’s not lying. J.J. has not lied, he’s been inconsistent on the Shatner thing. He might just not be very good at interviews. He rarely does them for Lost, those are mostly done by the showrunners Cuse and Lindelof, who are both very talkative.
Cawley made his points clear last year and again recently, as purist he disagreed with much. As a filmmaker he understood the reasons. I think he’s also not going to publicly bash J.J., simply out of a measure of professionalism, generosity, and civility.
I am largely with Cawley on this film. I think the changes will work, people will enjoy the movie if the actors don’t suck. I, like James, don’t believe they needed to change so much. I realize it’s their vision, and ST:TMP was certainly a big change from the original, as TNG was as well. But I think this production team isn’t as intimately familiar with Star Trek as they claim. It shows with some of their choices. That’s not a bad thing automatically, but I think long time fans are going to have a LOT to nitpick.
153. Matt808 – November 14, 2008
“The only nitpick I have (if I may be a total geek here) is that the engineering hull contains the warp core, and it would seem to make more sense to have the nacelle(s) attached directly to it rather than on the other side of the ship.”
Let the Geek fest begin!
I always imagined the Main Engineering beinging in the back of the Saucer. In so many TOS eps. the Bridge seemed to be so close to that department.
Kinda noticed that the Intel site is using the “Christmas 2008″ trailer, not the May 2009 version.
Some ideas about why you would have the single nacelle separated from the secondary hull: first, as has been said, for symmetry and balance of mass. With the impulse deck at the back of the saucer, the point of thrust is centered between your two outboard components, and you don’t get any spin. I would presume that the matter/antimatter reaction still happens within the secondary hull, and an intermix shaft runs down through the impulse deck, and to the nacelle.
If there’s an emergency, you could separate either the nacelle or the secondary hull without losing the other. (Though I suppose the nacelle is useless without the engineering section, except to avoid the cost of replacing it.)
Or maybe main engineering is right there in the saucer where the impluse engine is, and the secondary hull is just about shuttles, cargo, and science equipment.
Mostly, though, I think it looks cool. You can come up with a million in-story reasons for it.
Prediction: They will release better angle shots of the Enterprise, which look more like the ship we are used to/were expecting, and the traditionalists will all proclaim that they actually listened to the badgering and redesigned it, rather than admit it was just a lousy angle.
In Broken Bow, one of the Vulcan dignitaries used the term “Klingon Warbird.” I hate to cite Enterprise, but it’s not without precedent.
114.
You know, the Orion interceptors have a pseudo-avian appearance, and it was implied that they once had a highly advanced civilisation. Their spacefaring technology may have predated the Romulans’ and Klingons,’ and given the Orion proximinity to both, may have influenced the starship designs of both.
Or Klingons may have a habit of hijacking warbirds from the Romulans.
I think the design of the Kelvin fits with the era that its in. I looks a bit more primitive than Enterprise but really cool too. I wonder if they consider the old Essex class vessels as cannon. Like the model in Capt Sisko’s office on DS9. Although the NX-01 had the saucer shape instead of the spherical secondary hull. I don’t know, just rambling here. In short, Kelvin looks cool, Enterprise….just wish they could have shortened the secondary hull and not protrude the main deflector dish so much, otherwise its a cool design.
168.
Do you mean the Daedalus-class?
#114
Agreed – that was the first thing that popped in my mind when I read the Empire/JJ article. The costliest of errors in the eyes of true Star Trek fans! All kidding aside, sometimes a reminder of who has what and which is which and what is when is helpful and necessary. Whoever coined the term “Bird of Prey” for the smaller Klingon ships was not doing us a favor since that was what the TOS Romulan ships were called. Disambiguation, anyone?
#169 maybe. I can’t get my hands on my Star Trek encyclopedia at the moment. But it was a very early design concept for the original Enterprise back in the sixties. I thought I saw somewhere it was an Essex class but of course I could be wrong.
#166
Line confirmed at Memory Alpha – although we never actually saw a Klingon warbird in Broken Bow. Perhaps the Vulcan who made this remark was as confused as JJ… they were the messed-up, pre-TOS Vulcans, after all.
@ 153
You are not the only nitpicker here, at least there is me to ;-)
I also like the Kelvin, but it is somehow strange to see a nacelle almost as large as the secundary hull.
And once more: They should DO REMOVE this fu***** zero in NCC-0514
(My contribution to the Nitpicking-Contest)
#173
naval construction contract 0514?
thats right, why would they ever need the 0?
why not call it the NCC-000000000000000514?
man, there is no end to the number of red flags about this production…
this is going to be as canon as the animated series.
If they’d made TNG today we’d probably see isoliniar chips with a big Intel logo on them at least twice per episode :))
Yes #173, I like the Kelvin, the padded zero in the number is very odd. I assume with a NCC-514, that it is at least 50 years older than Original E (yes, even if George is on it in its latter lifetime), so a much older ship with a bulky Nacelle works for me…
Oh, and yeah, I also find it dumb that they would add a ‘0′ in front of the registry number. It makes no sense. For example the Deadalus class USS Essex from TNG ‘Power Play’ had this registry number – NCC-173, as stated in the episode. Quite obviously no f*cking ‘0′ in front of the 173.
77 and 79: “I would love to see the next Trek film be about the exploration of uncharted space, encountering new life and new civilizations…”
Yes! I thoroughly agree. Add my voice to this. Let’s have a real film about space exploration and the human spirit as the next Trek. There is plenty of material that can be drawn upon for inspiration. How about reading some of the journals of real ship-based explorers like Cook, Bligh, Franklin, Slocum and so on and then translating some of their experiences and feelings to a space-based setting?
I agree with number 1. The new enterprise looks too much like 1701-A. Ther better be a good explanation for it
There’s nothing wrong with having a leading 0 in a registry number. Ask anybody on the east coast with a zip code starting with 0. I work with geographic data; FIPS code attached to US counties can also have a leading 0, as a placeholder. If you want a reason… consider that having consistently four digits allows the computers to more easily visually identify a non-communicative starship. (Or a human with a telescope, for that matter.)
I don’t find it implausible that there are fewer than 9999 starships in the 23rd century, and this is the registry convention they chose to use. As for it not being canon… are you kidding me? Of all the fairly reasonable worries about canon violation (none of which I care about), that has to be the silliest one. Next someone’s going to complain that Checkov’s service number is no longer 646-5827B.
174. j w wright
The animated series ***is*** canon in some of Star Trek. Roddenberry de-recognised most of the series from the canon of TNG, but it was subsequently recognised in later films, shows and in TOS-R. Certainly, these days, most people see it as a legitimate addition to the series. At worst it could be called deuterocanonical.
Heck, the canon used for the new film also includes some of the novels – it’s always been flexible, unlike some of the fans! ;)
And as for the Kelvin’s designation being NCC-0514, the use of four digits is commonplace in our society, be it PIN numbers or whatever.
Yet again, it’s the adherents of TNG canon who are obsessing over these silly ‘canon’ details. The new film isn’t set in the TNG universe: it’s a revamped version of the TOS universe. They’re very different things with some commonality.
TNG’s canon was a revisionist version of TOS and the previous films: Roddenberry himself considered most of the original Star Trek’s third season and much of TWOK-TUC to be apocryphal in his setup for TNG. In Robert Justman’s book, he’s quoted as saying that he was happy to contradict TOS in TNG. And anything put out by Richard Arnold has long been questioned by many people including David Gerrold!
Trek’s canon, as a result, is inherently stretchy and accommodating of a great deal of internal inconsistency, be it the dates Data attended Starfleet Academy to the organisation the Enterprise works for. Maybe it’s better simply to accept that there’s more than one canon each of which shares some common material.
#180 The computer digit thing can be agrued both ways. Are you sure that the east coast zips were established in 1776? Or, well after the entire US was diveyed up?
Sweet wallpapers! Thanks for the link!
Looks like I was pretty close on my first guess as to the Kelvin’s configuration: (Stargazer w/ 2 nacelles instead of 4)
It IS actually closer to a Saladin class destroyer / scout with a Deflector / Sensor POD / Secondary hull on top! The registry number fits w/ Saladin also! …and Saladin class fits very nicely w/ Capt. Robau (Faran Tahir).
http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/blueprints/uss-saladin-destroyer-scout-sheet-1.jpg
The pylons (at least the upper one) are still very much like those of the Stargazer though…
USS Kelvin is COOL! VERY MUCH a TOS style ship IMHO…
Can’t wait to see the Kelvin’s bridge / conn! EXCELLENT!
#36
No ship can go to warp with just one nacelle and three screws with the duality of the warp field according to The Great Bird. This is going to be as big a turd as Cloverfield… sure, it made money, but it’s still one of the worst things anyone has ever put on celluloid.
Werewindle=troll!
Dude, you are completely lacking in imagination! You’re ranting on about pseudo-science made up by a TV writer who has been dead for nearly 20 years! Give it up and go somewhere else!
RE: Nacelles (from memory-alpha.org):
“Most vessels typically have two nacelles. However, vessels can operate with one nacelle disabled, but at reduced warp speeds. (VOY: “Year of Hell”, ENT: “Twilight”) It is not unprecedented, though, for vessels to have different nacelle configurations. For example, Federation Freedom-class starships have one, Niagara-class starships have three, Constellation-class and Prometheus-class starships have four nacelles. (TNG: “The Battle”, “The Best of Both Worlds, Part II”, VOY: “Message in a Bottle”) ”
“Some starship classes, such as the Defiant-class and the Steamrunner-class, possess nacelles that are integrated into the ship’s main structure without pylons. (Star Trek: Deep Space Nine; Star Trek: First Contact) “
182. No, zip codes are a fairly modern creation, assigned retro-actively. So, of course, the Postal Service had hindsight as to the size and nature of the dataset they were cataloging. I see no reason not to surmise that Starfleet, no matter what system they used initially, eventually recognized the likely limits of the size of their fleet, and created a system accordingly. No doubt the hindsight of centuries of naval management was helpful as well.
Consider that FIPS codes, which describe counties/parishes uniquely within the US, have five digits, the first two of which identify the state. California is 06, owing to its sixth place on the list sorted alphabetically. So, perhaps there is a system of home sectors, and Kelvin belongs to sector 05. There could be any number of organization schemes we aren’t privy to.
My god, two or one warp nacelles, who cares? That not what Star Trek is about!!!! (idiots!)
RE: Single-Nacelle Starships (from memory-alpha.org):
“The concept of a single-nacelle starship has been derided by some as contrary to Gene Roddenberry’s design requirements for Starfleet ships, but there is nothing in canon that mandates a minimum number of nacelles for a ship. Indeed, single-nacelle vessels would appear in The Next Generation with the appearance of the Freedom-class, which itself is an homage to the Saladin and Hermes classes.”
“According to the Star Fleet Technical Manual, the Saladin was a more militarized version of her sister class, the Hermes-class. While the Hermes was a scout, and therefore carried only 2 phaser banks, the Saladin was a destroyer and was armed with 3 phaser emplacements (with two emitters each) and 2 photon torpedo tubes.”
Is this official?
startrektrailer.com/images/star_trek_poster.jpg
@#190
no. that’s gabe koerners work.
#185
That TV writer who has been dead for twenty years is the one who made the rules — the “canon” if you will. Franz Joseph designed ships with one and three nacelles and Gene said, “no”. I imagine that’s why that ugly little thing called “Stargazer” had four nacelles.
As I said in a previous thread (and was chastised by Anthony for doing so), this is a chance for JJ and company to do alot of un-canon and un-trek things in a movie and then apparently re-set the timeline at the end.
This will be a turd… but a turd that will probably make a lot of money (thankfully, none of mine)
sorry, maybe that should be “non-trek” and “non-canon”
#192. Werewindle:
I resist the urge to tell you what really is “ugly” and “a turd”…
…talk about pre-judging… be a little more open minded, please!
…also, Gene’s not the only one to have set S.T. canon.
…and I doubt that he would ever be so rigid or close-minded to “just say no”.
I can’t see the images.
The site doesn’t work for me. I allow scripts and the Flash movie loads. Then it gets to 100% and hangs.
:(
Re: 191. Thanks for reply. Wasn’t sure as the nacelles and struts looked a little similar, as did the way the deflector dish stuck out.
#194 — herbert… sorry, NOT herbert
What I am doing is not pre-judging. Well, I guess it is at some level, but here’s my point (which I have made in many previous posts):
Abrams/Orci/Kurtzman… I’m sorry but these people produce mindless entertainment (and I’m being very nice in calling it “entertainment”). I’m sorry, but if a bunch of writers/producers/actors, etc. give you a sub-standard product consistently, why would you want them futzing around with your beloved Star Trek?
155 P Technobabble — No, Forbidden Planet was the first serious science-fiction film. And, I might add, had a lot of elements — the use of communicators, the bridge, the command structure — that Star Trek would use as well (I won’t cynically say “rip off”; it’s more inspired from). That movies does feature a flying saucer, but it’s a pretty damn good rendition of it.
2001 is in a class all its own. No other work has achieved that level of hard science in science fiction since (not referring to the “Dawn of Man” or “Beyond the Infinite” segments in this regard – still good but more speculative).
140 Cap’n Calhoun — thanks for the link to the dreadnought images. It’s true, the Kelvin looks just like it if you remove the 2 nacelles attached to the secondary hull.
#184 – “No ship can go to warp with just one nacelle and three screws with the duality of the warp field according to The Great Bird.”
It is worth noting that Mr. Roddenberry concocted those so-called “rules” as a way to discredit Franz Joseph, with whom he’d had a falling-out in the late 1970s. Said rules have been completely discredited, both in terms of newer designs and in the canonical portrayals of FJ’s diagrams. Ergo, they mean pretty much squat these days.
That doesn’t bother me much, ’cause they ever made much sense in the context of how we were told warp drive worked, anyway.
#117 – I took it the same way you did, Dennis. It did reinforce to me that Abrams and his team have done their homework, and they do know the score.
Whether that means their creative choices will work, I don’t know, but it’ll be in that realm that the big questions about the movie will lie. ;)
197. Werewindle – November 14, 2008
#194 — herbert… sorry, NOT herbert
“What I am doing is not pre-judging. Well, I guess it is at some level, but here’s my point (which I have made in many previous posts):”
“Abrams/Orci/Kurtzman… I’m sorry but these people produce mindless entertainment (and I’m being very nice in calling it “entertainment”). ”
What you are really doing is pre-judging AND offering your opinion as fact.
My opinion is that “Transformers” was a good movie. It was supposed to be an action-adventure flick based on an old Kids toy… It what it was supposed to do. “LOST” seems to be science fantasy/suspense show and I find it a nice mental diversion from my day. Seems anything is possible on that island…
Opinion is fine. Don’t pretend it’s fact.
#202 should have read… ” It did it was supposed to do”
USS Kelvin looks like a Starfleet Ship’s retarded, reverse engineered cousin.
I’m with Xai: Transformers is VERY entertaining! …and Fringe is pretty damn cool, probably my favorite current show.
BTW: the one of the USS Kelvin banking over the planet, in front of the nebula is really beautiful…
(it’s on my desktop right now, heehee!)
=D
where is the other warp nacelle. If you are going to change every thing then why call it Star Trek? Abrams is just useing the name to sell his new space adventure. Talk about cheese.
Gene Roddenberry said Two warp engines (2) with 50 percent line of site. If you dont understand that, go make a star wars movie. Screw Abrams. I support Cawley, He is da man.
Steve J. (Post #65):
Thank you!
The re-design of the NCC-1701 does indeed look like someone’s half a$$ed attempt to draw the Enterprise while not remembering quite what she looked like.
Or, as I’ve said before, drunken, retarded five year old’s rendering of the original Enterprise!
I for one will NOT be seeing this pile of steaming crap!
#208 – I support James, also but y’know, even he’s used ships in “New Voyages”/”Phase II” that break Roddenberry’s so-called rules. ;)
Those rules were silly, and I’m certainly not going to condemn the makers of this film for ignoring them.
I may yet condemn the moviemakers for other things, but that remains to be seen. ;)
#45—”Up to now, I’ve been onboard and supportive with JJ, but this comment makes me worry that he doesn’t know enough about the past ST movies and TV series’. The Romulans/Remans were the MAIN villians in the last ST movie, which was roundly condemned as the WORST ST movie of them all!”
You misunderstood completely. He’s referring to the notion that Romulans and humans had no contact for about a century between the Earth-Romulan War and “BOT”, as portrayed in TOS.
According to Bob Orci, “Balance Of Terror” (his favorite Star Trek episode) was one of the episodes viewed by the self-proclaimed “Supreme Court” as reasearch material for ther making of this film. That comment from Abrams seems to be consistent with that.
It’s almost laughable to me that people seem to retrospectively view TOS as something which was above exploiting young people’s attraction to sex and violence, when that was very much an intregal element in its presentation from the very beginning.
Even its intial pilot (”The Cage”), which is infamously known as being viewed by the studio executives as “too cerebral”, had sex and violence at its core. One of the primary goals of the Talosians was to get Vina to seduce Captain Pike, and when she failed multiple times, they even tried to intice him further by expanding his “selection” of mates. Furthermore, one of the most memorable scenes in that episode featured him in a brutal struggle with a fearsome barbarian, culminating in Pike killing him with a sharp weapon in defense of himself and Vina.
Throughout the series, there are depictions of seduction, sexual assault, implied sex, torture, violent threat behavior, countless fistfights, phaser battles, ship-to-ship combat, strangulation, serial murder, murderous crimes of passion, etc.
I don’t get it. Where does this sudden aversion to a modern adaptation of Star Trek incorporating sex and violence come from?
What show were these people watching? It certainly is not the same one I saw!
This has to be the single most ridiculous criticism I have seen thusfar in any posts about the upcoming film.
Sorry, folks…I just had to say it.
197. Werewindle
On top of acting like (and very possibly being) a troll and a jerk, you’re a snob.
Abrams, Orci and Kurtzman know more about making slick, populist, good entertainment than you ever will.
Gene Roddenberry and Desilu didn’t create Star Trek to change the world, y’know! Star Trek was made as a populist entertainment show fro the start, as Closetrekker points out very well in post 212. Star Trek was created to attract big audiences, thereby attracting advertisers, thereby making the studio money. That’s what the original Star Trek has been about from day one!
It’s funny that you’re the one spouting hyperbole and calling a film of which you’ve seen basically nothing a ‘turd.’
You’re offering nothing to this site and these discussions beyond insults based on half-assed fanon from the 1980s. Give it up, go away, cool off and go to some other Trek site not dedicated to the new film.
You’ve made it quite clear that you dislike this film and that you’re a snob with major misconceptions about what Star Trek is: it’s a sexy, violent seafaring adventure-c u m-western set in deep space. It’s not the public face of a religious cult!
#211 – After reading about the preview and hearing about Romulans being in this movie, I wonder how this could be because I remember from watching “The Balance of Terror”, the Federation had no contact with the Romulans for about a century in the Earth-Romulan war. It also makes me wonder if #1 will appear with Capt. Pike.
#214—The attack upon the USS Kelvin 4 days before the birth of JTK (and therefore 30+ years prior to “BOT”) will undoubtedly affect the timeline, and that includes everything post 2233.
For example, the Enterprise may not travel to Talos IV under the command of Christopher Pike. There may never have been a fight on Rigel VII, or the implementation of General Order 7. “Number One” may never even serve under Pike, as she previously did. For all we know, she may have been an ensign who was killed on the Kelvin.
Klingon Warbirds, huh?
It just gets better all the time.
101-All the negative comments about this movie really depress me. Sheesh.
You’re going to feel even worse come next year when it actually hits theaters.
#216—That’s hardly the fault of Mr. Abrams. Blame the Klingon ship in TSFS that was painted like a giant bird of prey…
#217—When did you get to see the movie?
216/217
Go back to writing you books and stop bitching on a fan forum! Act like the professional you’re pretending to be!
Don’t like the movie, even though you haven’t seen it? Go away and leave it to people who have the intelligence to wait and see.
Loser!
My main wish for Trek is that the films would get back to being about EXPLORATION and encountering strange NEW worlds and seeking out NEW LIFE and NEW CIVILIZATIONS!!!
Remember that? As cool as this film looks….it DOES look like another war film…
Even ST:TMP was about exploring V’Ger…and that had a big character arc with Spock attached to it.
As bad as Star Trek V was, even that was about exploration!
I would say I bet that if you put two red-tipped nacelles like the one the USS Kelvin has on the Enterprise, it would look a lot more like the TOS version…
Seems pretty obvious what happens in the movie; atleast partly: a powerful, mysterious vessel from the future (Starfleet won’t know its from the future) arrives, blasts a bunch of stuff including the Kelvin. Nero isn’t arriving to introduce himself or the Romulans to Starfleet. It will be a mysterious attack from an unidentified species.
Starfleet probably goes on a crash program to make more powerful ships (kind of like building the Defiant after the Wolf 359 battle). Hence the timeline being altered to have more powerful Enterprise with the more futuristic nacelles.
Oh, and the reason we may see Kirk at some point in the film wearing Captain’s rank on his yellow shirt… probably for role-playing in the Kobayashi Maru.
The Klingon “warbirds” are probably the Kobayashi Maru… and even in the Navy terms get mixed around: modern cruisers & destroyers. Warbird does seem a more general term then bird-of-prey. We’ve seen many kinds of warbirds in different eras, but birds-of-prey do seem to be pretty close in appearance: B’Rel vs Kvort, etc.
I could be noted that Saavik had Lieutenant rank instead of Captain on her uniform when she took it, although maybe the formalities changed a little.
Hey, I just heard that the Klingon Language Movie, “Earthlings: Ugly Bags of Mostly Water”, is finally available on line. Check it out
earthlings-movie.com
I saw this at a Con last year, it is hilarious and really wierd.
TD