Howard Stern Grills Shatner On Abrams, Star Trek Movie & Takei Feud | TrekMovie.com
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Howard Stern Grills Shatner On Abrams, Star Trek Movie & Takei Feud December 11, 2008

by TrekMovie.com Staff , Filed under: Abrams,Shatner,ST09 Cast,Star Trek (2009 film),TOS , trackback

As part of his publicity tour this week, William Shatner showed up on the Howard Stern Show on Monday, and as usual, things didn’t stick to the usual promotional boilerplate. Stern needled The Shat on all sorts of topics, including the new Star Trek movie and the Takei feud. Some excerpts and a video clip below.

 

Shat on Abrams and Nimoy and the new movie
The interview started with Robin and Howard joking that Shatner ‘was not a big deal’ because he was not in the new Star Trek movie, which Howard ribbed him about, claiming he was upset, to which Shatner joked (bringing in a reference to Takei):

I’m really upset about it…but I really want to play I’m a Celebrity…Get Me Out of Here!

Stern also asked Shatner on if he was or was not offered a cameo in the movie:

Howard Stern: J.J. Adams claims they offered you a cameo in the new "Star Trek."
William Shatner: I know he does.
Robin Quivers: They didn’t offer you anything?
Shatner: No. J. J. has got to be a wonderful guy and he’s a great…
Interupted by Stern:
Stern: I know J. J.
Shatner: Do you?
Stern: He’s a really good guy. He was very good to my kids.
Shatner: How’s that?
Stern: J . J . used to write for a show called "Felicity." My daughters loved it. We went to California and we were hanging out and he said he’d put them on the show. They sat in the background of a scene. It was very exciting.
Shatner: If that’s what it took, I’d have put his kids on "Boston Legal." (they all laugh)
Stern jokes: You know what J. J. said; he said he wants to give you free tickets to the "Star Trek"opening.
Shatner jokes: "That’s greaaaaaaaaaaat"!…

Howard later pressed, asking if it ‘bothered him on any level’ that Nimoy was in the movie, to which Shatner noted “not on any level” but he did joke about how he recently went to dinner with Nimoy and Leonard wouldn’t tell him what the movie was about. Howard (as he does) kept pushing saying it must be ‘awkward’ between the two, to which Shatner stated:

It is not awkward. If I were producing Star Trek…how would you put my aging, fat face into movie when I was lean and I was great back then.

On Takei Feud – and Shat/Takei ‘Raw Nerve’ Showdown
Howard then asked Bill about how Takei claims he actually did invite Bill to his wedding, after Bill said he didn’t get an invite. Bill joked:

No, he and JJ Abrams have got together to offend me, I can see it.

Howard pressed the issue saying that it wasn’t a joke and he played the video Shatner had up on The Shatner Project where Bill talked about Takei in a very unflattering way. Bill said he just doesn’t understand why Takei is so upset, noting:

I am serious in that, wouldn’t it be better to leave this life without any animus anymore.

Bill said that he and Takei and A&E have agreed to do a Takei episode of Raw Nerve, where they will finally bury the hatchet (or maybe keep hacking each other).

Catch Shatner on HowardTV
Starting today Howard TV On Demand has excerpts of the Shatner. Here is a clip

Check your On Demand listings for Howard TV or go to www.howardtv.com for more info.

Comments

1. Nicholas - December 11, 2008

The man!

2. Nicholas - December 11, 2008

Denny Crane!

3. Enterprise - December 11, 2008

Shat News!

4. classictrek - December 11, 2008

Bill should have been in this movie. I will always be sad about that. Its a great shame.
Greg
UK

5. Mike T. - December 11, 2008

Mr. Shatner could pull off a older Kirk, he looked good for his age on the last episode of Boston Legal.
Now it would have been funny if George Takei would have been one of the people taking over the law firm in the last episode.

6. Charlie in Colorado - December 11, 2008

Wow… Takei appearing with The Shat on Raw Nerve could be some serious Must See TV!

7. ObiWanCon - December 11, 2008

I’m glad Shatner is not in the new movie.
Greg
UK

8. ensign joe - December 11, 2008

Woohoo Shatner!!

ok back to the continuum I go..

9. krikzil - December 11, 2008

Takei won’t be as brave on Raw Nerve. Remember, he never said a word when Bill interviewed him for his Trek Memories books. Only Nichelle had the backbone to tell him in person.

10. Devon - December 11, 2008

Except there was never a role offered to Shatner that we know of. Come on Howard!

11. Lousy_Canadian - December 11, 2008

The ‘Original’ Rocket Man.

12. Xai, (I'm from Iowa, I only wished I worked in outer space.) - December 11, 2008

#9 Krikzil.

I don’t know about that. I don’t see shatner playing softball on this one and likely Takei will respond to pointed questions.

I hope someone records it. I’d watch that episode… the rest of it I could care less about.

13. Richard Daystrom - December 11, 2008

While I won’t be disappointed if he’s not, I still think we might see him in it anyway. I never would have thought Majel Barret would have been.

14. Lt Bailey - December 11, 2008

Cpt Kirk was brought back to life in the novels written by Shatner, he and the other writers firgured out a way to bring him back to life and carry on for many book sequels. So why not do the same for the new movie?

Some nod or connection to the new film with Shartner would have been great, but it is up to the producers and directors who star (cameo) in a film, of course the actor has to agree to do it.

15. steve - December 11, 2008

#6 : Who will survive?

16. DIGINON - December 11, 2008

@ 13: Majel Barret was probably just added now during post-production when they did the sound editing. That was easy to do.
Unless they secretly shot something with Shatner (with both Shatner and the producers denying it) or unless Mr. Shatner agrees to do some kind of voice-over I guess it’s highly unlikely that he be added now.

17. Anthony Thompson - December 11, 2008

Shatner is not looking good in that clip.

18. Mazzer - December 11, 2008

Oh here we go again! JJ explained all this already.

19. sean - December 11, 2008

“It is not awkward. If I were producing Star Trek…how would you put my aging, fat face into a movie when I was lean and I was great back then.”

I have just decided that William Shatner is always right.

20. classictrek - December 11, 2008

#7
hey, who is the real ‘Greg UK’

I want bill in this movie

Greg
Great Britain

21. McCoy's Gall Bladder - December 11, 2008

Shat is da Man!

The feud is a joke. It’s just a way to keep them lively. Remember there is no such thing as bad press in Hollywood.

22. Sid - December 11, 2008

Shatner > Takei.

Denny Crane.

23. Al - December 11, 2008

When we all thought it was a more Old Spock centric film we thought Shatner could appear in the end bookend “born again”, eg new timeline, but I guess not now.

24. Richard Daystrom - December 11, 2008

#16

“Unless they secretly shot something with Shatner (with both Shatner and the producers denying it) or unless Mr. Shatner agrees to do some kind of voice-over”

Possible.

25. Chris J - December 11, 2008

#19: “It is not awkward. If I were producing Star Trek…how would you put my aging, fat face into movie when I was lean and I was great back then.”

In my opinion, this is the quote that should satisfy all the “Kirk in ’09” people.

I actually laughed out loud when I read it; it is classic Shatner. It is also true. One of the reasons that Brent Spiner said that he wouldn’t continue with the role of Data was because that while the android character was supposedly ageless, he himself was not, and thus having Data walking around with a cane and talking to anyone who will listen about the good old days on the D would have been unbelievable.

The same goes for His Shatness. If you had him in a cameo as Captain Kirk, you’d have to explain why he was so aged and, in all kindness to His Shatness, a bit, well, paunchy… especially since he is supposed to have died :S

Old Spock I can get, as he isn’t dead and Vulcans live for yonks. Old Kirk that has been resurrected because fifty year old, die-hard Star Trek fans can’t survive without him, I just can’t.

26. Gary - December 11, 2008

Mad Cow!

27. Oregon Trek Geek - December 11, 2008

If there is no secret Shat appearance in this movie, then he can certainly be in the next one. I’m not concerned. HOW they put him in the next movie I don’t know. That’s what they pay the writers for. However, #23’s idea is beautiful, and could be used to explain Kirk’s presence in the next movie if not this one.

28. Greg2600 - December 11, 2008

The feud is I think a joke too. They seemed very happy and friendly during the roast of Shatner last year.

29. Greg2600 - December 11, 2008

Shatner played a human character, and humans age, even in the 23rd/24th century. At the end of the day, with the script already written, there wasn’t enough room in it for scenes with Shatner. You have to spend time establishing his presence in the film. Although I certainly feel they could have easily explained his appearance by claiming that old Spock altered the timeline. Then you have Shatner team up with Nimoy and everyone else to do whatever. I know J.J. said all they really could fit was a slightly larger than cameo role, and Shatner insisted he wouldn’t do a cameo, I think he actually would have. Especially if he got to play Kirk, and Kirk was established as alive. If nothing else, J.J. passed on a guy who’s always on TV or radio, could be promoting the film.

30. krikzil - December 11, 2008

“i don’t know about that. I don’t see shatner playing softball on this one and likely Takei will respond to pointed questions.”

Xai–I hope so, as long as it doesn’t really devolve into a real nasty fight. (which I rather doubt) The whole thing is just all so, well, odd.

“I hope someone records it. I’d watch that episode… the rest of it I could care less about.”

Yes, definitely must see tv. Course, what I’m waiting for is the NIMOY interview!!!!

31. Capt Mike Of The Terran Empire - December 11, 2008

Denny Craine. Im Cookoo for Coko puffs.Denny Craine. Im James T Kirk and I want in the Movie!!!! Im Capt Kirk!!!! IM Capt Kirk!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!. Ok We need the Shat in the new Movie.

32. Chris J - December 11, 2008

#29

Yes, if they placed Shatner in the post-TNG, ‘Old Spock’ timeline (supposedly the normal timeline) then his age wouldn’t be much of a problem.

Apart from the fact that he’s dead.

So really the only way to get Shatner as Kirk into the movie would probably have to be in the altered timeline. As it is set before TOS, then having an older looking Kirk (say, as he starts the traditional five-year mission, or something like that) played by the very old looking Shatner would have looked a bit out of place.

Of course, if they had Shatner play Kirk’s Dad, or similar character, then all would be well. Or perhaps even using some of that X-men: Last Stand-style de-ageing CGI whizzbangery that they used on McKellen and Picard. Oops, I mean Patrick Stewart.

That could work? For a short scene, it wouldn’t be too difficult…

33. John Sullivan - December 11, 2008

Shatner is finally typecast. Not as James Tiberious Kirk, but as Denny Crane. In my humble opinion, the latter is a much more interesting character, even if Shatner didn’t have to act as much to play the fictional character this time around. I hope that Shatner’s next role is even further removed from the Kirk character. Nimoy will die with “In Search Of” on his tombstone … Roddenberry and Doohan’s tombstone will read “Upper Stage of Earth suborbital launch rocket,” and Takei’s, Nichols’, Barrett’s, Koenig’s and others will read “made by Star Trek, unmade by Hollywood typecasting.” But Shatner’s will always read “Denny Crane, don’t forget ‘da name.”

And I love it.

34. Jeffries Tuber - December 11, 2008

Man, if loving Shatner is wrong, I don’t want to be right.

If a man loving Shatner is gay, then I’m gayer than a Mazda Miata.

I’m glad he isn’t in this movie, because in so many ways this looks like tribute to Kirk and Shatner both. If they’ve really, truly pulled our legs [and what could be more Kirk than a colossal ruse?] I’ll jump for joy and weep at the same time.

35. Enterprise - December 11, 2008

I think Shatner should take his funds and buy the Trek franchise and make Shatner Trek.

36. Shatner_Fan_Prime - December 11, 2008

Closettrekker will be here in the morning to set you all straight like a sunday school teacher!

37. NoRez - December 11, 2008

I love this man. I hope his ‘aging, fat face’ is around for a long, long time. And, much as I would have loved to see his Kirk one more time, he’s absolutely right – Chris Pine is taking us on the journey that leads into the Kirk of TOS. The young, yummy, horny, kick-ass, shoulder-rolling JTK Himself. I’m okay with that, it’s forward momentum. Into the past.

Interested in the Shat-Takei matchup, I’m just hoping George doesn’t do that pithy-comment-chuckle-chuckle-chuckle thing he’s so good at.

and re: the Boston Legal comment – obviously blahblahblah Chinese not Japanese blahblahblah BUT – it would have been funny to give Denny a line about Asian people having a problem with him and not understanding why.

An even better idea would have been to not NEED a finale at all, though.

38. Third Remata'Klan - December 11, 2008

Bringing Shatner’s Kirk back to life is just way too convoluted a story to try and spin into one movie, a movie where they are trying to reboot the franchise with a new cast, no less. It would have been a ridiculous idea to bring Shatner into this movie.

Face it, he’s dead, Jim!

Now, if Kirk had not died, it would have been a much easier thing, and then I think they would have almost been obliged to include him.

As such, I wish people would just let Kirk lie. RIP, Jimbo, and all that.

Let’s give Chris Pine a chance with the character!

39. Third Remata'Klan - December 11, 2008

#27

If they do a sequel, I hope to God NONE of the original actors are in it.

The new crew needs a chance to fly on their own, thank you very much.

40. Third Remata'Klan - December 11, 2008

#32

I didn’t like that CGI de-aging stuff they used in X-Men. I didn’t notice it too much the first time I saw the movie, but once it really registered, they just kind of looked like walking, talking wax sculptures or something….

HE’S DEAD, JIM!

41. Brett Campbell - December 11, 2008

Love or hate him, he tells it like it is. And I love him!

42. spiked canon - December 11, 2008

Captain Dunsel

43. McCoy's Gall Bladder - December 11, 2008

In case you haven’t heard,

Bettie Page has died.

Not TREK related, but still sad news.

44. Enterprise - December 11, 2008

Wow, who knew she was still alive?

45. Closettrekker - December 11, 2008

Howard Stern: J.J. (Abrams) claims they offered you a cameo in the new “Star Trek.”
William Shatner: I know he does.

They’re both wrong. Abrams never said that at all. Both of these guys apparently need a refresher course in “reading comprehension”. Either that, or they’re both far too comfortable putting words in other peoples mouths.

46. Enterprise - December 11, 2008

Well, we know Shatner is a master at that.

47. Mark C - December 11, 2008

Only 46 posts so far, but so far, no cannon! Let’s keep it up, folks.

48. Closettrekker - December 11, 2008

Saying that the scene written for Shatner amounted to a cameo, and reminding the public that Bill himself asserted that he would not be satisfied with such a minor role (“I don’t do cameos”), does not equate to saying that a cameo was ever offered to him.

If Stern or Shatner thinks it does, I would have to question their intelligence.

Shatner is basically calling JJ a liar, and quite publicly at that. That’s is completely irresponsible, especially for someone of his public stature. I don’t care how genuinely disappointed he is. That’s no excuse. He should be ashamed of himself. But he isn’t. He should have corrected Stern. But he didn’t.

I would discipline my kids for doing exactly what he’s doing. I don’t tolerate dishonesty in my house. And here he is, doing it for a nationwide audence…again.

49. thebiggfrogg - December 11, 2008

Howard Stern is a p*tz. Say old schtick. Does he ever do anything remotely new? (as evidenced by this interview). Takei’s on: Bring up the feud (Make a gay joke). Shatner’s on: Bringup the feud. Have some random hottie of the moment take off her top. Takei’s on again: Bring up the feud (Maybe make a gay joke). Shatner’s on again: Bring up the feud. Have some other random hottie of the moment take off her top.

Big f’ng YAWN!

50. thebiggfrogg - December 11, 2008

48. I have a theory. Your handle is “closettrekker.” Who do we know who has been publicly stating that he is indeed not a Trek fan to get newbs into the fold (but is he REALLY a fan in hiding?). Who is pilloring Shatner for lying about a certain someone’s offer for his role in the movie.

I expose closettrekker as none other than J.J. Abrams, hisself!
Decloaked. Defrocked. DeKellied! (Whatever that means) ; )

51. Brett Campbell - December 11, 2008

My goodness, there sure is a lot of wasted energy in the forms of anger, vitriol and hatred from a lot of people posting on this site. It’s pretty sad, when we all presumably share a love for — or at least an interest in — “Star Trek” and the ideals and the possibilities that it should and can inspire. A lot of us (myself included) could do a lot better than we are doing.

Happy Holidays, Mr. Shatner! Thank you for entertaining me for decades and for giving me much to reflect upon as I age also. You are no Captain Dunsel in my book. And I believe that a lot of the supposed squabbles between you and Mr. Abrams and Mr. Takei are very likely misunderstandings fueled by a lot of media-hoopla of “he said, he said” and by the rancor that this has successfully (sadly) been manipulated by the media in the public and in “fans.”

52. Iowagirl - December 12, 2008

#19
Yeah – particularly when’s he’s being sarcastic and making a fool of somebody else…:D

#48
Maybe, I say maybe, there is something Shatner knows and you, we, don’t know. Or do you really think, Abrams & Co., Shatner & Co., give you, us, full particulars; the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Even I don’t have that blind trust in Shatner – even you shouldn’t have that blind trust in Abrams…:)

Apart from that, the way Abrams & Orci handled the “cameo” situation lead to a lot of people assuming that Shatner indeed had been offered the role (re-read the comments if you like) and rejected it. Although they never actually said it (you’re right about that), they still felt the need to “rectify” their previous statements by making clear that Shatner had not been offered that cameo. They wouldn’t have done that if they hadn’t felt that their prior information would have been capable of being misunderstood, to say the least.

53. Notbob - December 12, 2008

You do realize the “feud” was always a little joke thing for publicity for Raw Nerve. Whoopie Goldberg said it herslef. She said she’s friends with Shatner and that Shatner does this “trouble maker” routine for shows and what not; but it’s not real.

Considering she has nothing to gain from it, I think I believe her. I also still would be shocked if he is in this movie. If he’s not, I would be either. But after hearing Whoopie say what she did, Abrams and Shatner might just be fooling about. Maybe for Abrams on Raw Nerve.

54. Star Trackie - December 12, 2008

I hope George takes it seriously, if he trys to get cute or sarcastic Shatner will cut him to ribbons.

55. Star Trackie - December 12, 2008

#38 “Face it, he’s dead, Jim!

Now, if Kirk had not died, it would have been a much easier thing, and then I think they would have almost been obliged to include him.”

Apparently a lot of people just don’t understand how alternate timelines work.

56. krikzil - December 12, 2008

“Apart from that, the way Abrams & Orci handled the “cameo” situation lead to a lot of people assuming that Shatner indeed had been offered the role (re-read the comments if you like) and rejected it. Although they never actually said it (you’re right about that), they still felt the need to “rectify” their previous statements by making clear that Shatner had not been offered that cameo. They wouldn’t have done that if they hadn’t felt that their prior information would have been capable of being misunderstood, to say the least.”

#52/Iowagirl — Exactly!

JJ and Co’s commments did lead a lot of folks to think they’d been speaking to Shatner all along and they had not. (And unnecessarily strung Kirk/Shatnter fans along.) I’ve got some pretty intelligent, not Trek fan friends who thought Shat had been offered and refused and mentioned it to me aksing if I was mad at him as a result. But of course, the tabloidesque media — like with Takei “feud” — exists to create more drama.

57. garen - December 12, 2008

i guess i’ve always assumed he has having small plastic surgeries from time to time. But if he says he hasnt..then i mist believe his word unless shown otherwise.

I have been wondering for years now….why is his face soooo red?
it looks like rosatia(sp?) but he was red when he was younger.

58. EvilSean - December 12, 2008

Right, I’m going to attempt to bring this up again. I bet that Shatner will make an appearance in the new movie. I have this sinking feeling that we will get a cameo, probably right at the very end, just before the credit’s role. As we say in Ireland, “I can feel it in me waters”!!

59. 1701 over Gotham City - December 12, 2008

I love this man. Shatner and Adam West are my deities… and nice to know they are friendly acquaintances.

Anybody that does not like The Shat, does not understand The Shat.

60. garen - December 12, 2008

#57 *WASNT* red

…is what i meant to type.

i’m full of typos this morning. oh well…no ones reading this “thread” anymore anyway.

61. Brett Campbell - December 12, 2008

60 – “no ones reading this “thread” anymore anyway.”

Those of us who appreciate Mr. Shatner and his contributions to Trek are.

62. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#52—“…maybe, there is something Shatner knows and you, we, don’t know. Or do you really think, Abrams & Co., Shatner & Co., give you, us, full particulars; the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?”

You know full well that none of this came out of the blue. Shatner’s webcam performance came immediately after JJ’s comments confirmed that there had been a scene written for Shatner, which amounted to a cameo—something with which Bill had already indicated that he would be dissatisfied.
It makes absolutely no sense to conclude that there was something else at play. One action led to a reaction (and an incorrect one).

“Even I don’t have that blind trust in Shatner…:)”

If that were the case, you wouldn’t have just manufactured a possible excuse for his behavior.

“…they still felt the need to “rectify” their previous statements by making clear that Shatner had not been offered that cameo. They wouldn’t have done that if they hadn’t felt that their prior information would have been capable of being misunderstood, to say the least.”

The only reason Abrams felt the need to explain what he said in simpler terms, is because Shatner went on his webcam and made clear that he interpreted Abrams’ comments to mean something else.

Misunderstanding? Fine.

But even after Abrams clarified what he said, here is Shatner, months later, still unable to comprehend it…or unwilling to accept it. Either way, he’s basically calling another man a liar, without basis, and without honor.

Poor behavior.

63. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#56—“I’ve got some pretty intelligent, not Trek fan friends who thought Shat had been offered and refused…”

Then they either didn’t read JJ’s comments (instead relying upon someone else’s irresponsible interpretation), or they’re not as intelligent as you think they are.

There is no sugarcoating it—and there’s no getting around it. Shatner is accusing Abrams of saying something which he never said…period.

He’s just plain wrong. He is either incapable of simple reading comprehension, or he’s intentionally being dishonest. Take your pick.

Either way, it’s wrong.

64. Brett Campbell - December 12, 2008

63 – Insulting the intelligence of the friends of someone you don’t even know isn’t exactly exemplary behavior either.

65. krikzil - December 12, 2008

“Then they either didn’t read JJ’s comments (instead relying upon someone else’s irresponsible interpretation), or they’re not as intelligent as you think they are. ”

Well, one is a physicist tenured so he’s not exactly stupid. (Just because someone comes to a different perception as you doesn’t mean they are less intelligent.)

But you and I have been round and round on this subject. You lay all the blame on Shatner and excuse JJ completely. Sorry, his comments were easily taken out of context by those who don’t pay as close attention to every utterance as you and I and all us trekmovie fans do. Even I, who pay way too much attention, remember being utterly shocked in 8/07 when Shatner commented at that Vegas con that he had not heard a word from JJ since the original pitches. Given all the comments JJ had made about Bill’s requirements for role size, etc, it seemed like they were talking.

“There is no sugarcoating it—and there’s no getting around it. Shatner is accusing Abrams of saying something which he never said…period.
He’s just plain wrong. He is either incapable of simple reading comprehension, or he’s intentionally being dishonest. Take your pick.
Either way, it’s wrong.”

Shatner is responding on the level of what he’s heard in the media and been said to him. And frankly, JJ and co spent a year making statements that made it seem like they were in constant communication with him and they WERE NOT. That in my book was wrong. And it’s caused needless disappointment for a lot of fans who thought there was some chance shatner would be in the film, when in fact, there hadn’t been apparently from the start.

Orci himself, as Iowagirl pointed out above, made a specific effort to come back and say he based his remarks on Shatner’s remarks in the media, not from a any direct conversation. They all could have saved us the confusion and grief if the 2 sides actually picked up a phone and spoke to each other directly! ;)

66. Brett Campbell - December 12, 2008

65 – Excellent points.

Perhaps it’s time for everyone to stop playing the blame game.

It’s seems to me that Shatner has moved on — or is trying to in spite of constant media questioning. Perhaps we should all follow this example.

I agree with that all parties involved share responsibility in this situation — the media most of all.

67. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#64—“Insulting the intelligence of the friends of someone you don’t even know isn’t exactly exemplary behavior either.”

I would agree with that, except that isn’t exactly what I did. Read it again:

“Then they either didn’t read JJ’s comments (instead relying upon someone else’s irresponsible interpretation), or they’re not as intelligent as you think they are.”

Notice, I allow for two distinct possibilities, not simply concluding that they are unintelligent. I’m sure that Liz’s friends simply heard someone else’s incorrect interpretation of Abrams statement.

They (since she herself pointed out that they are not Trek fans) can easily be excused for that. Shatner, on the other hand, should have looked at what JJ actually said before opening his mouth on that webcam, given that he was the subject of those comments. He either didn’t, or he ignored the truth and decided to rewrite Abrams’ words.

It’s bad enough that he did it on his webcam. Months later, he’s still doing it—ignoring the facts! While before, it could have been construed as a misunderstanding, now, Shatner is just being dishonest.

Pathetic.

68. Brett Campbell - December 12, 2008

67 Re: #64—”Insulting the intelligence of the friends of someone you don’t even know isn’t exactly exemplary behavior either.”

I would agree with that, except that isn’t exactly what I did.

Not exactly what you didn’t do either.

69. Shatner_Fan_Prime - December 12, 2008

In post #36, I told you guys!

;-)

70. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#65—“Just because someone comes to a different perception as you doesn’t mean they are less intelligent.”

Then, as I suggested, they probably didn’t actually read what JJ Abrams said. Why would they? You said they’re not even fans. They probably read someone else’s irresponsible misinterpretation. I don’t blame them for that. There was a great deal of irresponsible reporting on that at the time.

If I were Bill Shatner, and someone said to me, “JJ Abrams said he offered you a cameo”, then my first response would have been, “Really? Whay exactly did he say?”

Shatner, at his age, has been around long enough to know that people’s words often get twisted, which you and I both know is exactly what happened. As I implied before, the first time (on the webcam), I can see it being a case of a knee-jerk reaction. But this is different. It’s months later, JJ has come out and publicly clarified that this is not neither what he said, nor what he meant.

What’s the excuse this time?

“…you and I have been round and round on this subject. You lay all the blame on Shatner and excuse JJ completely. ”

This isn’t about who is to blame for Shatner not being in the movie. This is about Shatner accusing JJ Abrams of saying something he never said, and doing so in a public forum like the Howard Stern Show.

That’s two very different issues.

“They all could have saved us the confusion and grief if the 2 sides actually picked up a phone and spoke to each other directly! ”

Which is precisely what Bill should have done the moment he heard the false report that JJ said he offered him a role, not going on the air to publicly perpetuate a lie…then doing it again.

71. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#68—“Not exactly what you didn’t do either”

Is that from the Bill Shatner school of interpretation?

72. krikzil - December 12, 2008

“It’s seems to me that Shatner has moved on — or is trying to in spite of constant media questioning. Perhaps we should all follow this example.”

I give him credit for not being thoroughly irritated with being asked about a film he’s not in when he’s plugging one of his multitude of other projects. I don’t know how any of the Trek actors remain civil after 40+ years of silly questions by the media to be honest. :0

“I agree with that all parties involved share responsibility in this situation — the media most of all.”

They do love to stir the pot!

73. Iowagirl - December 12, 2008

#62
“Even I don’t have that blind trust in Shatner…:)”
– If that were the case, you wouldn’t have just manufactured a possible excuse for his behavior. –

I don’t have to manufacture excuses for HRH – I was merely pointing out that neither you nor I belong to the “Inner Circle”. :)

– Either way, he’s basically calling another man a liar, without basis, and without honor. –

As Liz pointed out in #65, Abrams & Co started and fuelled the fire by playing cat and mouse with Shatner and the fans for way too long. Furthermore, in his interview in question Abrams said “We actually had written a scene with him in it that was a flashback kind of thing, but the truth is, it didn’t quite feel right. The bigger thing was that he was very vocal that he didn’t want to do a cameo.“ With this phrasing, he definitely tries to blame Shatner for not accepting the role. A role he‘s never been offered. Fact is, they didn’t correct the “misunderstanding” until Shatner nailed them down (together with his assistant Paul) and they couldn’t beat about the bush any longer. If Bill has no honor, he’s learned from the best.

#69
Yeah, sort of a multiple déjà vu…I’m afraid we’re being punished for something we did wrong in one of our former lives. We’re being trapped in this ShatnerversusAbramsUniverse and have to keep arguing ’bout this topic forever and forever – until Kirk is resurrected and we’re all freed from this curse. :)

74. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#72—“They do love to stir the pot!”

Especially Howard Stern, who seems to make that his purpose on this Earth.

75. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#73—-““We actually had written a scene with him in it that was a flashback kind of thing, but the truth is, it didn’t quite feel right. The bigger thing was that he was very vocal that he didn’t want to do a cameo.“—JJ Abrams

Everything in that statement is accurate, without suggesting that Abrams actually offered Bill a role.

Shatner was very clear about not wanting a cameo.

” Abrams & Co started and fuelled the fire by playing cat and mouse with Shatner and the fans for way too long. ”

So, is that the justification for Shatner’s lie— JJ started it, by not giving me what I wanted?

Nice.

76. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

“We actually had written a scene with him in it that was a flashback kind of thing, but the truth is, it didn’t quite feel right. The bigger thing was that he was very vocal that he didn’t want to do a cameo.“—JJ Abrams

Where’s the part where Abrams says he offered Shatner a cameo?

Howard?
Bill?
Anyone else?

77. The A-Man - December 12, 2008

Keep in mind the new Trek is in a new timeline. From my point of view, Kirk won’t die on the Enterprise-B-Nexus in that line.

78. krikzil - December 12, 2008

“Then, as I suggested, they probably didn’t actually read what JJ Abrams said. Why would they? You said they’re not even fans. They probably read someone else’s irresponsible misinterpretation. I don’t blame them for that. There was a great deal of irresponsible reporting on that at the time.”

Nope. While not a Trek fan per se, he is in the sci-fi community in general for other things and so he read the quotes from JJ, writers, Shat, all year long. The misperception could be formed by folks without malice and was very real whether you accept it or not.

“What’s the excuse this time?…Which is precisely what Bill should have done the moment he heard the false report that JJ said he offered him a role, not going on the air to publicly perpetuate a lie…then doing it again.”

Really don’t think there’s any need for an excuse this or any time as I don’t see that Bill is the villain of the piece. (But we are obviously never going to agree.) Really, no villains in my mind at all.. Both JJ and Shatner have been very complimentary of each other’s talent. I can’t help but think that given how incredibly busy both JJ and Shatner are, they spend at most a few seconds on this stuff when some reporter asks them a question. But given that the media’s bread and butter is news and controversy, it’s a bad plan all around. On the other hand, it does generate publicity for the film! ;)

However, I will always believe that none of this would have happened had JJ — the person who has all the power as it’s HIS movie — had actually called Mr. Shatner back in early 2007 and said, while we’d love for you to be in the film, it won’t work. Not spend most of the year making comments as he did without every speaking to the actor again. It was odd and contributed to this convoluted situation.

79. krikzil - December 12, 2008

“Especially Howard Stern, who seems to make that his purpose on this Earth.”

Stern is an odd one. On the one hand, I hate all his sexual innuendo on the 6th grade level, but then he will confront a racist Klan member on air and I cheer. Go figure. And I like that he uses Takei — who I do like other than the whole silly feud thing.

80. Andy Patterson - December 12, 2008

Ok. for the first time….I’m not only thinking this, but I’m saying….I wish he were in the movie now. If for no other reason that his character is not dead. What was it Bones said, “he’s not really dead you know as long as we remember him.” I still love Shatner.

81. krikzil - December 12, 2008

“We actually had written a scene with him in it that was a flashback kind of thing, but the truth is, it didn’t quite feel right. The bigger thing was that he was very vocal that he didn’t want to do a cameo.“—JJ Abrams

As Iowagirl pointed out, It reads as if the cameo was written and Shatner rejected it specifically — “the bigger thing….”. That is an inference that can be made. And again, it seems as if they have been talking to each other when that wasn’t the case…something Shatner had to clearly point out.

Let’s remember the timeline please. Shatner’s “I don’t do cameos” happened in OCTOBER, about 3 weeks before filming started, therefore having absolutely NOTHING to do with what went on throughout the year. The movie was written, the filming scheduled months previously (Nimoy told us about his schedule in August of that year). Shatner’s a busy guy so if JJ really thought he could have used him in the film, negotiations would have had to have started long before October.

82. Iowagirl - December 12, 2008

#75
– Everything in that statement is accurate, without suggesting that Abrams actually offered Bill a role. –

It *does* suggest it, that’s the point. Many people understood it that way; we did, the press did; Bill’s assistant felt impelled to write to Abrams about it (the thread is on Shatner’s site) – there wouldn’t have been such a course of events if Abrams hadn’t caused this “misunderstanding“.

– Shatner was very clear about not wanting a cameo. –

Yes, but these two (Shatner not wanting a cameo and Abrams not offering Shatner the role that was written for him) have nothing to do with each other,as Liz points out, too. That’s the crucial point. Bill’s first “I don’t do cameos” was stated about 1 year before Abrams’ cameo interview and Bill’s second interview came as a reaction to Abrams’ statement. But Abrams put it, as if these two were directly connected with each other. This.is.not.true. This is the dishonorable part about it.

– So, is that the justification for Shatner’s lie— JJ started it, by not giving me what I wanted? –

No, we were talking about honor at this point. Please, stop twisting words.

Imo, Shatner’s not lying – he’s referring to a situation (the “misunderstanding”) that has definitely taken place and he’s merely reacting to Stern’s question. I told you before that we do not know what has happened meanwhile and how the current and actual situation is. Maybe Shatner just wants to make clear to the general public that doesn’t read trekmovie.com what has been going on. I don’t know and you don‘t know – mere speculation and interpretation about this part of the neverending story.

83. Shatner_Fan_Prime - December 12, 2008

On a special Sweeps Week edition of Raw Nerve:

“Special Guest JJ Abrams sits down with Bill to discuss his non-participation in Star Trek: The New Class, while Extra Special Guest Closettrekker mediates Dr. Phil-style, to explain to both men the timeline of who didn’t say whatnot to whom.”

84. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#78—“While not a Trek fan per se, he is in the sci-fi community in general for other things and so he read the quotes from JJ, writers, Shat, all year long.”

Once again:

““We actually had written a scene with him in it that was a flashback kind of thing, but the truth is, it didn’t quite feel right. The bigger thing was that he was very vocal that he didn’t want to do a cameo.“—JJ Abrams

Where’s the part where Abrams says he offered Shatner a cameo?

Answer: He never said it.

The fact that your friend was aware of all the quotes all year long, particularly Shatner’s “I don’t do cameos” remark (the basis for Abrams’ conclusion), makes it less fathomable to me that he could have translated Abrams’ statement to—-‘I offered Bill a cameo, and he refused’.

“The misperception could be formed by folks without malice and was very real whether you accept it or not.”

Whether it is a “misinterpretation”, a “misperception”, or a “misunderstanding”, it is still a mistake—and one that resulted in a slanerous false accusation.

I still think it is different for someone like your friend (who isn’t really part of the equation) to do it than it is for Bill (who was the subject of the question asked of Mr. Abrams).

I don’t believe, for one minute, that Bill doesn’t know that isn’t what Abrams really said. If he doesn’t, then shame on him for not taking the time (2 minutes at the most) to pull up and read what he actually did say. And if he does, then shame on him for intentionally perpetrating a lie.

He wasn’t too busy to go off, half-cocked, on his webcam, so he wasn’t too busy to take a moment to read what the man said.

In the end, it all boils down to the same thing. He went on the Howard Stern Show, and both of them (Howard and Bill) said something that wasn’t true about JJ Abrams.

You work in the court system, so I’m sure you’re quite familiar with this:

“In law, defamation (also called calumny, libel, slander, and vilification) is the communication of a statement that makes a false claim, expressly stated or implied to be factual, that may give an individual, business, product, group, government or nation a negative image.”

85. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#82—“… there wouldn’t have been such a course of events if Abrams hadn’t caused this ‘misunderstanding’. ”

Abrams caused the misunderstanding? How—by making a clear statement without the slightest reference to a proposed offer?

“No, we were talking about honor at this point. Please, stop twisting words.”

Shatner’s “lie” about Abrams was the entire basis for my questioning of his honor, and specifically, his lack thereof, in the first place. I thought I made that perfectly clear.

“Imo, Shatner’s not lying…”

His assertion that Abrams said that a cameo was offered, when in fact no offer was made, is slanderous. That’s a statement that makes a false claim, in other words— a lie.

86. Iowagirl - December 12, 2008

#85

Now, we’re definitely going in circles. Liz and I made it pretty clear why Abrams’ statement on the cameo was more than mistakable and how it was the priming for all subsequent events. Obviously, there were many others who felt and feel the same. You feel differently. We disagree. That’s alright. Repeating our arguments ad nauseam won’t make our day at this point.

Whether Bill lied or not depends on how you evaluate the situation. I wouldn’t call someone a liar without knowing all the facts. If you think you know all facts, beyond any doubt, call Bill a liar. That’s alright. He’ll cope with it, and so will I.

87. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#81—“That is an inference that can be made”

Plenty of people didn’t make that rather irresponsible judgement, myself and Anthony, for example.

Why? Because that isn’t what he said. Period. Nowhere in that statement does he even reference this “imaginary offer”.

“Let’s remember the timeline please. Shatner’s “I don’t do cameos” happened in OCTOBER, about 3 weeks before filming started, therefore having absolutely NOTHING to do with what went on throughout the year. ”

Again, as you’ve pointed out, we’ve been around and around about that. It is not even the debate here. I don’t want to argue today whether Abrams or Shatner is to blame for his absence in the film, so whether Abrams determined that the role shouldn’t be offered before or after “I don’t do cameos”, is irrelevant to this discussion.

Abrams’ assertion that “…he was very vocal that he didn’t want to do a cameo”, is just an added reminder that even if the scene would have been good for the film, it was in the category of roles that Bill had already indicated that he was not interested. Abrams said as much in his response to Bill’s initial comments about it.

The fact of the matter is, Abrams said the scene didn’t work for him, regardless of whether Shatner would have been okay with the insignificance of the role. Since the scene didn’t work for him, the role wouldn’t have been offered even if Bill had never said “I don’t do cameos”. You’ll get no argument there. But it has nothing to do with whether Abrams said he offered him a role. He never said that, yet Bill is still out there claiming that he did, even months after Abrams publicly responded to Bill’s angst by clarifying that was neither what he said, nor what he meant.

There’s no excuse on Bill’s part for continuing to perpetuate a lie. It’s ridiculous and irresponsible.

88. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#86—“Whether Bill lied or not depends on how you evaluate the situation.”

Unless you actually believe that a false statement isn’t a lie, or that “Abrams claims to have offered you a role” isn’t a false statement—-then there is hardly any wiggle room for “evaluating the situation”. A lie is a lie is a lie.

If he initially “misinterpreted” Abrams’ statement, fine. But months after JJ made it clear that he neither said nor meant to imply something beyond what he actually said, the room for “misinterpretation” is long gone.

When Howard said that, he should have corrected him. He didn’t.

89. Christine - December 12, 2008

I love the Shat so much, but it wouldn’t make sense for him to come back for ST: XI. Unless he was cameo-ing as a completely different character just for the sake of having him in there… So meh.

Augh! I wanna see “Raw Nerve” so badly! I’mma die if I don’t get some Biography Channel… xP

90. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#83—“Special Guest JJ Abrams sits down with Bill to discuss his non-participation in Star Trek: The New Class, while Extra Special Guest Closettrekker mediates Dr. Phil-style, to explain to both men the timeline of who didn’t say whatnot to whom.”

Extra-special guest?

That gets me all warm and fuzzy inside!

:)

I think I’ve already exposed my “Raw Nerve”, but would be happy to oblige Bill (if he ever had reason to care who I was or what I have to say).

I could always offer to build him a custom designed and eco-friendly dining set, made (of course) from reclaimed materials off the set of STXI!

91. Shatner_Fan_Prime - December 12, 2008

Closet, Iowa. Liar Liar Pants on Fire is getting old. Could we move onto the Yo Mamma jokes?

;-)

92. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#91—-According to quantum mechanics, there is no ‘Shatner_ Fan_ Prime’, only a bunch of Shatner Fans living in parallel timelines.

Did you know that, SF?

93. Brett Campbell - December 12, 2008

71 – Its from the school of thought that says you still insulted the other gentleman’s friends (read his reaction to your post — he took it as the insult you intended) even while couching it in terms of “options” of explanation. That doesn’t lessen the insult, just by couching it as one option. It also comes from the school that says you go out of your way to be nasty and belligerent not only to Mr. Shatner but to other posters here on an ongoing and unrelenting basis.

94. Iowagirl - December 12, 2008

#88
– A lie is a lie is a lie. –

Only if everyone involved acts on the same “truth”.

#91
Yes, let’s move from Kindergarten to preschool…The only thing constant is change. :)

#92
You mean there are…countless…parallel…..timelines…in…which…a bunch of Closettrekkers…and Iowagirls…are…fighting about…a bunch of…Shatners…and…Abramses…?? *shudder*

“Angels and ministers of grace defend us” :D

95. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#93—“It also comes from the school that says you go out of your way to be nasty and belligerent not only to Mr. Shatner but to other posters here on an ongoing and unrelenting basis.”

I would dispute that I’m nasty and belligerent to Mr. Shatner. If he does or says something I agree with or appreciate, I say so (for example, I think he is becoming a great talk show host). If he does or says something I don’t agree with or appreciate, I say so (for example, making false statements about another person). I simply call it like I see it.

If it is fact, I say so (like the claim that Abrams said he offered Bill a role being a false statement). If it is opinion, I say so (like the difference I see in his portrayal of Kirk from the first 20 years to the last few outings).

If you have a problem with that, then simply skip my posts. Don’t read them. If Anthony thinks that something I have said is inappropriate, I’m sure he’ll let me know.

“read his reaction to your post — he took it as the insult you intended”

I don’t think she did. I certainly hope not. She and I discuss things all the time, and I don’t believe I have ever insulted her, even when we disagree (which is quite often, but not always so). It is never personal.

I actually like Liz. I don’t know her friends, aside from the ones we share in Chat (at least as much as you can know a person from the internet). I wouldn’t presume to conclude that her other friends are dumb. If you read my further posts about it, I concluded that they probably didn’t see what was actually said. She is a smart lady, and I’m quite sure she doesn’t need you to speak for her. If I cross the line and go overboard, I’m sure she would let me know. If she felt insulted, she could have said so.

If Liz had a problem, and there was anything I could do to help, I would gladly do so. I don’t think you know me at all.

But I think she knew exactly the point I was trying to make, and isn’t one to take personally something said about a friend of hers by me or anyone else who doesn’t know the first thing about that friend anyway (aside from the fact that he was identified at that point as a non-Trek fan).

Give me a break.

96. Closettrekker - December 12, 2008

#94—“You mean there are…countless…parallel…..timelines…in…which…a bunch of Closettrekkers…and Iowagirls…are…fighting about…a bunch of…Shatners…and…Abramses…?? *shudder*”

(Double *shudder*)

Yes. One of each of us is quite enough!

…kindergarten versions or otherwise.

Since I have a goatee, would my “mirror” counterpart be clean-shaven?

:)

97. Terpor - December 12, 2008

Never too old to play Denny Crane :)

98. David P - December 12, 2008

SHAT SHAT SHAT SHAT!!!!
IT DOESN’T GET ANY BETTER THAN THE SHAT IN ACTION!!

KHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN!!!!!!!!!!!

99. Orb of the Emissary - December 12, 2008

“He who was Kirk…” as trekmovie would put it

100. Shaun - December 12, 2008

#38 – Sorry, I’m just not interested in Chris Pine starring in Star Trek: 90210.

Then again, I’m not interested in J.J. Abrams and his constant “I was never a Star Trek fan, I love Star Wars!” and “I didn’t even know there were other Star Trek movies” schtick.

I hope I’m wrong about how lousy I think this movie will be, I really do, but I don’t think I will be.

Long live the Shat! (and long live DS9!)

101. Brett Campbell - December 12, 2008

96 – Give you a break? Consider yourself broken. I will gladly skip your posts from now on, which should cut my reading time by at least 75% with the way you usually aim to dominate threads.

102. Engon - December 12, 2008

How to get Shatner in the movie:

Kirk is missing, presumed dead. Old Spock whips out a cartridge and plays it for young Spock and young McCoy.

“Bones, Spock…since you are playing this tape, we will assume that I am dead, that the tactical situation is critical, and both of you are locked in mortal combat. It means, Spock, that you have control of the ship
and are probably making the most difficult decisions of your career.
I can offer only one small piece of advice, for whatever it’s worth–
Use every scrap of knowledge and logic you have to save the ship.
But tempery our judgment with intuitive insight. I believe you have those qualities, but if you can’t find them in yourself, seek out McCoy. Ask his advice. And if you find it sound, take it. Bones, you’ve heard what I’ve just told Spock. Help him if you can, but remember, he is the captain. His decisions must be followed without question. You might find that he is capable of human insight and human error. They are most difficult to defend, but you will find that he is deserving of the same loyalty and confidence each of you have given me. Take care.”

103. krikzil - December 12, 2008

Ack! A girl goes away to have her tires rotated and oil changed and all hell breaks loose here. ;0 I don’t even know where to start….first a funny. Well it was to me anyway.

People email me personally since my website is on my posts which I think is usually cool. Today – I guess because of the whole Liz/Closet/Iowagirl debate, someone emailed me and said that : ” You are obviously a Shatner groupie and Closettrekker is a Bad Robot shill planted on the site.” ROFLOL.

Well, at least Closet, you get paid in this scenario! ;)

And while I appreciate the thought behind it Brett, Closet and I have been going round and round this maypole for what — a year now I think? He actually has helped me on a personal level — worries over a friend during their horrible hurricane in Houston. We squabble like family, our little Trek family. I’ve also been in fandom too long to ever let a comment on a board get to me personally. Trek is my escape from RL and my sometimes brutal job.

I’m too tired to go point by point to the posts and as Iowagirl pointed out, we aren’t going to change our minds; we see it all very differently. All I’ll say is that I do think Closet is making it far more dire and dramatic than it is. I don’t see Shatner perpetuating any “lie”. I do think JJ’s statement can be misconstrued. I don’t see libel — fact of the matter is it’s actually harder to prove libel and slander when it’s a celebrity which is how the tabloids exist and profit. (Not condoning, just stating it as it sadly is.) I see 2 men for some strange reason who conducted a conversation in the media and as experienced industry folks they really should have known better. I expect if from the Paris-Hilton-attention seeking wannabes, not folks of this caliber. I haven’t brought this up yet but, heh, in for a penny….

JJ’s reponse to Shatner’s video about the cameo continued the weirdness —

“Here’s my favorite thing: My favorite thing is turning on YouTube and seeing William Shatner talk to me,” Abrams laughed in a recent interview with MTV News. “When did that become my life? How did that occur?”

Well, Mr Abrams, it occurs when you spend a year talking about an actor and his supposed demands, needs, etc in re your movie but haven’t actually spoken to him in, oh, a year. Weirdness will ensue. But ultimately, it doesn’t seem like JJ thought it was really a big deal in the end but seems to understand how the confusion could occur:

“I think what happened was, I said we made many efforts or something to get him in the movie. I think he or his people interpreted that as we reached out and tried to get him in. I meant internally,” Abrams explained. “I didn’t wanna present him with something we didn’t believe in. So we were trying to make this thing work, and it didn’t happen.”

104. Brett Campbell - December 12, 2008

Krikzil and Closettrekker — forgive me for butting in where I don’t belong, if I did. Apparently I misconstrued things from your previous associations to even your gender — in your case, Krikzil.

I primarily got irked that Shatner was accused of lying when none of us know the entire facts of the matter or the man personally or what his true and complete perceptions of the matter he has had. The same goes regarding JJ. I also apparently misconstrued CT’s remark about your friends when he appears to have meant it in the spirit of a bantering jibe between the two of you and not as a true insult. You don’t need me to defend you or them, so I will take it as a lesson in learning not to butt in.

I just wish folks would cut Shatner some slack. He’s probably felt quite hurt that Nimoy is in this but he is not. I would think it would have to sting. A lot.

Many times we may not be on our best behavior when we have been hurt or angered by other people. But I wish people would hold off from calling him a liar when a) none of us know all the facts — apparently not even Shatner — and b) none us know exactly how we would feel or behave if we had anything akin to this experience — one that only he can have and the rest of us must leave to ourselves to judge or not to judge him on as we see fit. I will try to keep myself in that latter camp.

105. krikzil - December 12, 2008

Heh Brett — No harm, no foul on my end. And I never mind when folks join in any discussions I’m having with someone. The more the merrier is my view and I hope we can continue to chat. I also think it’s really easy to misunderstand tone, etc on the internet.

I agree with you — I think Shatner is hurt and somewhat bewildered. (Nimoy was so sweet to Bill at that August Creation con trying to assuage his feelings about not being in the film. Lovely, their friendship!) Since TOS Trek revolved around his character, it’s not that surprising to me. And god knows I wish I’d been a fly on the wall during those original pitches because obviously communication wasn’t in synch between the 2 camps!

106. trekboi - December 12, 2008

I think kirk alive would be a clue someting is up with the timeline…

Shatner in the new film might have been a nice cameo but i dont want to be in the cinema watching JJ Abrams STAR TREK & hear 13 year olds yell “Denny Crane” and laugh…

107. wisteria - December 12, 2008

If Abrams had wanted Shatner in the movie he would have made it so.

As far as Shatner being too old or fat faced, just think of Capt. Christopher Pike, The Menagerie. In that episode Pike is very old and severely deformed and the Talosians brought him back to what he once was.

I’m not saying they should have made the same storyline for this new movie, but rather that when it comes to Star Trek, anything is possible.

Bottom line, Abrams wants to market this new Trek movie to the youngest audience possible. Which is why Kirk in the movie looks like he’s fresh out of High School.

108. Shatner_Fan_Prime - December 13, 2008

#107 “If Abrams had wanted Shatner in the movie he would have made it so.”

Indeed. THAT says it all.

109. Kirk's Toupée - December 13, 2008

What a legend……………….If The Shat where British, he’d have a knighthood by now, “Arise Sir Shat…..”

110. Olley Olley Olley - December 13, 2008

stop the moaning that Shat is not in the movie
Braga and Ron Moore decided to kill Kirk and Shat said “sure, no problem”
maybe he was thinking that ST8 would be the search for SHat

tough, it wasnt
Kirks dead baby

111. JWM - December 13, 2008

The Opie & Anthony interview with Shat was way more interesting.

And Raw Nerve is a terrific interview show. I didn’t expect to like it, but Shat’s style is fresh & interesting – you actually hear answers to questions instead of a host relating everything to a punchline.

I look forward to the Takei interview. Obviously if Takei wasn’t milking it for publicity and genuinely hated Shat he wouldn’t agree to it. Maybe the ‘reanimation’ of the feud is all show promotion…

112. Closettrekker - December 13, 2008

#103—-“Today – I guess because of the whole Liz/Closet/Iowagirl debate, someone emailed me and said that : ” You are obviously a Shatner groupie and Closettrekker is a Bad Robot shill planted on the site.” ROFLOL.

Well, at least Closet, you get paid in this scenario! ;)”

That’s absolutely hilarious. Where’s the check?

What’s it like being a Shatner groupie? I’m just trying to picture that in my mind.

As for being a Bad Robot spy, I’ve been accused of that before…never stops being funny.

#104—-“Krikzil and Closettrekker — forgive me for butting in where I don’t belong, if I did.”

I appreciate the gesture, but you don’t have to apologize for putting your own two cents in. I wasn’t offended. I’m well aware of my tendency to post often and long-windedly. My feelings aren’t hurt. In fact, your instincts in defending another poster you thought was being bullied are admirable, in my mind. Don’t sweat it.

As Liz suggested, our time spent here is an escape from real life, and even when it is in the form of a passionate debate, it is still quite recreational. And everyone is welcome to participate!

113. Brett Campbell - December 13, 2008

Krikzil and Closettrekker — Thank you for you forgiveness and tolerance — and CT — I apologize especially for my undue rancor with you.

Thank you both for making me feel welcome to join in on the conversation. I will try in the future not to jump to conclusions until I am certain of the facts.

I hope that each of you have a terrific weekend.

114. Closettrekker - December 13, 2008

“I didn’t wanna present him with something we didn’t believe in.”

I think this is something which could prove particularly interesting. Abrams has made clear that he did not feel the scene written for Shatner would fit, but it was not a unanimous decision. The writers felt it would work. Of course, JJ is the director. He alone will be held accountable if the movie fails, and in turn, he will be the hero is the movie is great.

What is interesting to me is the prospect of hearing, later, what the scene was about and where it would have been in the film. Would it have been beneficial to the progression of the story, or would it have felt contrived and out of place?

I have always felt that the only acceptable (to me) avenue for including Shatner in the film would have been a flashback scene (and the director and writers do not appear to agree on whether you could classify the scene written for him as that or not). I envisioned a scene, from the perspective of Nimoy’s Spock, depicting a conversation between Spock and Jim Kirk sometime before Kirk boarded the Enterprise-B. Of course, it would need to be relevant in some way to the story in Star Trek XI.

I look forward to “The Making Of Star Trek XI”, or whatever it will be called.

115. Iowagirl - December 13, 2008

#114
– As Liz suggested, our time spent here is an escape from real life…. –

You mean, in real life you’re actually a Shatner groupie…? :D
_____________________________

Brett, please don’t be shy of butting in; I’m sure it’ll bode well. I for one am glad ShatnerFan keeps watching over our discussions to prevent us from fetching our Lirpas exclaiming “Tis discussion will be to te deasssss…” :)

116. Brett Campbell - December 13, 2008

Iowagirl — Thanks for the giggle you gave me — in between working on my dissertation in fits and fit-to-be-tieds, and goofing off by checking in on this site: my escape from reality other than books.

117. Closettrekker - December 13, 2008

#115—I am quite deadly with the an-woon…

Cue the music!

118. Brett Campbell - December 13, 2008

117 – Yes, but are you as brave with mortai as you are with a phaser?

You can tell me to “mind” my own “cloud”-business if you like.

119. Closettrekker - December 13, 2008

#118—Both will kill!

120. Closettrekker - December 13, 2008

There seems to be alot of Zenite gas being inhaled on the latest Orci thread…

Isn’t there a filter mask for that?

121. Brett Campbell - December 13, 2008

Kinda thought you might give that response at 119!

And I was wondering about the Zenite (Xenite?) gas myself!

And, yes, there is a mask. It’s a cheap, plastic piece of crap. But there is a mask.

122. Brett Campbell - December 13, 2008

Hmm… 118 seems to have gotten “Lost in Space.”

123. Closettrekker - December 13, 2008

#121—I think Bob just introduced one of those masks to the Troglytes in post #752 in that thread.

124. Brett Campbell - December 13, 2008

Oops. It’s there. Guess I can’t count. What hope will I have in following the plot of Trek XII?

125. 790 - December 14, 2008

As usual Stern gets to the bottom of things!!

126. Brett Campbell - December 14, 2008

123 – Not sure if it was one of the same masks. Didn’t seem to be made out of cheap plastic …

127. Shatner_Fan_Prime - December 14, 2008

#115 ” I for one am glad ShatnerFan keeps watching over our discussions…”

As Leonard McCoy once said to Khan … “Simply trying to avoid an argument.”

:-)

128. Iowagirl - December 14, 2008

Ah, ShatnerFan the Wise, your trying is a clear indication of a superior intellect. :-)

129. krikzil - December 14, 2008

Waves at Iowagirl after grinning at her posts; Hi Brett!

“That’s absolutely hilarious. Where’s the check?
What’s it like being a Shatner groupie? I’m just trying to picture that in my mind.
As for being a Bad Robot spy, I’ve been accused of that before…never stops being funny.”

I did just see someone else accuse you on another thread and you said your checks were lost in the mail! Oh too funny!

As for the groupie thing….don’t want to cross any lines here (you get my drift), but I think my groupie days are long gone. Shatner got himself a wife my age who is gorgeous. In all seriousness, I have to say I’m more a “groupie” of the characters that Shatner and Niimoy play, rather than of the actors. Oh sure, I could really appreciate how atrractive they were (and still are imo) but I’ve always been about enjoying Kirk and Spock. I admire the careers of the actors and have followed them but never attained (or really understood) the whole groupie mentality.

“What is interesting to me is the prospect of hearing, later, what the scene was about and where it would have been in the film. Would it have been beneficial to the progression of the story, or would it have felt contrived and out of place?”

Me too! I really look forward to when Orci posts it for us. And whether it fits or not will no doubt start yet another “debate”.

“I have always felt that the only acceptable (to me) avenue for including Shatner in the film would have been a flashback scene (and the director and writers do not appear to agree on whether you could classify the scene written for him as that or not). I envisioned a scene, from the perspective of Nimoy’s Spock, depicting a conversation between Spock and Jim Kirk sometime before Kirk boarded the Enterprise-B. Of course, it would need to be relevant in some way to the story in Star Trek XI. ”

You know, as much as I wanted Shatner in the film, from the beginning I found it problematic. Even without his death in Generations, his character would still be too old to be alive. I didn’t want to see him like McCoy in TNG, thank you. However, now that Orci has gone all QM on us, I really am puzzled as to why he couldn’t have been squeezed in if we are getting New Canon. (I;ve taken to go all Coca-Cola with trek: Classic and New!)

“I look forward to “The Making Of Star Trek XI”, or whatever it will be called.”

Me too.

130. Shatner_Fan_Prime - December 15, 2008

Closet, this might get your Starfleet-issued boxers out of a twist. Bill says the whole Abrams thing has been a big joke!

http://blogs.amctv.com/scifi-scanner/2008/12/william-shatner-interview.php

131. krikzil - December 15, 2008

#130–That’s good stuff. Shat has always been an imp and I have to think the Takei thing might also fall into this category of deliberately instigating just to see what reaction you get. I’d love it if JJ did his show down the line.

And why am I not surprised that Jameson was his favorite interview? ;)

132. Brett Campbell - December 17, 2008

129 – Hi Krikzil!

Sorry … didn’t see your hello until today.

I hope you’re well! Happy Holidays!

133. shatnersukzromulanpipe - May 18, 2009

To Mr. Shatner’s credit, a long time ago, he decided to give up acting in dramas to become a comedian. This allowed him to get fat and red-faced without harming his career. To Mr. Abrams’ credit, he did not cast a fat, red-faced clown in the new Star Trek movie. It would not have been as good if the Enterprise was attacked by aliens from the fat, red-faced clown planet.

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