Take a ‘Sneak Peek’ At Star Trek Movie Scoring Session December 19, 2008
by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Music, Star Trek (2009 film) , trackback
One of the most highly anticipated elements of the new Star Trek movie is the score by Oscar-nominee Michael Giacchino. While we will have to wait until next year to learn and hear more about the new music of Trek, ScoringSessions.com has put up an interesting ’sneak peek’ of their visit with Giacchino and the Hollywood Studio Symphony.
See Trek’s new music being recorded – courtroom style
Due to the NDAs and secrecy of the Star Trek movie, ScoringSession is not allowed to release their full set of photos from this Fall’s Star Trek recording at Sony Scoring Stage until next spring. However, Trek composer Michael Giacchino suggested they could recreate some of the photos now, using ‘courtroom style’ sketches, which they put online today.
Composer Michael Giacchino, scoring mixer Dan Wallin, additional orchestrator Chad Seiter and orchestra contractor Reggie Wilson
Director J.J. Abrams, score coordinator Andrea Datzman and composer Michael Giacchino
Visit ScoringSessions.com for more images and larger sizes.
Dan Goldwasser of ScoringSessions tells TrekMovie he hopes to have the full story up ‘Marchish.’ Dan also confirmed that everyone on the ‘crew’ (the people in the booth) were wearing Star Trek uniform shirts on the day of the shoot.
Jeff Bond’s take
Geek Magazine editor Jeff Bond (also author of "The Music of Star Trek" and contributor to Film Score Monthly as well as TrekMovie), was at the same scoring session and he will be reporting on it this Spring as well. Regarding what he has heard so far, Jeff tells TrekMovie "it looks like we will be getting another great Giacchino score, and another great Star Trek score.”
Giacchino’s Oscar turn
Earlier this year Michael Giacchino was nominated for his "Ratatouille" score, but didn’t take home an Oscar. However, he will be getting a consolation prize. Recently it was announced that Giacchino has been selected to be the music director for the upcoming Oscar ceremony on February 22nd. So the next time someone runs long in their acceptance speech, it will be Giacchino in the pit conducting the orchestra playing them off. Regarding his selection the composer told AP:
I anticipate it being different but having a lot of fun doing it. I also anticipate it being very tense and counting every second. At the same time, it’s always like that when you’re scoring because you’re constantly watching the clock, checking to see if you’re on time and making sure you’re on budget, so it may not be that different.
In addition to his Oscar work and Trek, Giacchino for two additional feature films in 2009, "Up" and "The Land of the Lost" and that is in addition to his work on "Lost" and "Fringe." So it is a big year for Giacchino and his fans.
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I guarantee this will be, at the very least, the Third Greatest TREK Soundtrack of All Time (after TMP and TWOK, of course).
But judging from Giacchino’s work on “Lost” and THE INCREDIBLES, it has the potential to be THE best!
Glad to hear that Giacchino will be handling the music for the Oscars. Bill Conti’s music was really starting to sound tired and dated.
Hopefully we’ll be hearing Alexander Courage’s classic Star Trek “opening credits” music in the new film.
first? Giacchino is awesome. I loved his score for ‘The Incredibles’ I’m sure his ‘Trek’ score will be amazing!
Very much looking forward to this movie!!!
The really important question is: Are those real T-shirts and if so will they be commercially available?
My score order:
I
V
X
IX
II
III
VIII
VII
IV
I really hope he uses Goldsmith’s Enterprise theme.
Did they REALLY wear trek t-shirts?
I do believe I see an Apple computer! Smart people they got there ;-)
#6
Where’s the love for VI? You didn’t even give it an honorable mention! ;)
VI is actually my second favorite score behind II & III (really the same score just rearranged).
@7 I am Kurok: The article says they did
TMP and TWOK are great. But I’ve always been a big fan of First Contact, and VI.
My score order:
II > III > VI > IX > VIII > I > IV > V > VII > X
First Contact and The Undiscovered Country have always been my two favorite scores. I also liked the score to Nemesis, even if the movie was a bit iffy.
Oh, and the all time best piece of Star Trek music is hands down “Stealing the Enterprise” by Horner, followed by the Opening theme of Undiscovered Country by Eidelman.
Wow, that drawing looks nothing like JJ.
Wow. We’re going to complain about the drawings of the people who were present at the scoring session. This is a disaster.
Our journey is nearly complete.
Hope they finish the score quickly. Wallin and Seiter are wearing red shirts, which means they’ll be dead shortly.
#14—”…the all time best piece of Star Trek music is hands down “Stealing the Enterprise” by Horner”
That is a great one, but I like the music in TOS the absolute best. Its placement was sometimes questionable, but when it was on cue—-it was fantastic!
#17—Lmao!
LOVE the drawings.
hah, Chad Fryes drawings totally rock :))
My score order:
I > V > VI > IV > VII > VIII > II > X > III > IX
I’d say this new film has a good chance of getting into the top 3!
They had better have some real good themes & cues on this score. There’s been very few scores the last 5 years that had any good themes in them and used them effectively. Even Goldsmiths work on Nemesis, Insurrection and first contact was a shadow of what he could do prior to that. Outside of him, James Horner & John Williams there’s no one out there that really excites me.
having said that, the trailer music was OUTSTANDING and I know it was ripped off from Children of Dune, but it really did build excitement, epic-ness and brutally strong theme which this film needs. PLEASE DONT GIVE US A WEAK SCORE………!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
#23. Mike Jones stated: having said that, the trailer music was OUTSTANDING and I know it was ripped off from Children of Dune, but it really did build excitement, epic-ness and brutally strong theme which this film needs. PLEASE DONT GIVE US A WEAK SCORE………!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
——–
Quoted for truth, brutha! There’s been a trend in film lately for scores to be more atmospheric and less lyrical. I’m hoping Giacchino gives us a powerful and memorable score. The kind that gets stuck in your head, humming the themes for weeks.
@23…
what about Hans Zimmer, Mike?
I should say ‘2 steps from Hells’ version of the children of dune music..btw how DO they get away with virtually copying music like that and no copyright issues???!?
Oh yea Zimmer ok..him too:))
What also matters is what they choose to stick on the soundtrack CD. I’d love it if they could do a Lord-of-the-Rings-style “every-f***ing-thing we recorded” CD, assuming the score is any good.
Which I think it will be. Just bought the Ratatouille score!
Sneak peak? At what and why?
Looks like something straight out
a stoners dream after watching them
in their so called concert.
This belongs in MAD magazine not here.
It’s so utterly laughable that its shameful.
I have nothing but faith in Giacchino, after ‘Lost’, ‘The Incredibles’ and ‘Ratatouille’. The man is great. He’s not Goldsmith (at least, not yet), but I could see him giving Horner a run for his money. The music should be fantastic.
the closing credits to undiscovered country. the signing of their names is probably the coolest end credits ive ever seen, great send off plus the ST theme kicks in just as bill signs his name… awesome. also 8,9 and 10 soundtracks are cool i loved jerry goldsmiths scores for trek
But I just dont find myself going back to his music that often, I loved the Gladiator but I wore out on it eventually. Batman was great but theres very little to hold onto when most of it is atmospheric, schizophrenic (works great in the movie) not so good at home. I never get bored of the 1st 3 trek soundtracks or some of their other works (horner, goldsmith & williams)
like wine they get better the more one listens?
That trailer music was really really good though…the trumpets especially so exciting
Undiscovered Country music..frankly sucked. The theme was pretty poor and just didnt grab ME..
So, who is the real killer according to these sketches?
30: thats what worrys me, Incredibles & Ratatouille where nice but not a real action movie on the scale of trek..I hope he didn’t forget that!
I keep seeing Giacchino mentioned for his scores for Lost, MI3, the Incredibles……and there’s been some debate in past threads about his capabilities and talents……I think that his score for Incredibles was fantastic for the style called for by the movie. But having heard his scores for PC games, especially the Medal Of Honor series (hear it….you’ll love it,) I do believe we may be in for the best score Star Trek has ever seen. Giacchino’s own words about listening to Horner and Goldsmith are encouraging. And he’s had tracks so far that sound as good as anything from James Horner and even the best years of John Williams.
Giacchino is probably my current favorite film score composer so I’m very pleased he’s in the captain’s chair on this one. Tastes have changed dramatically over the past decade and I felt the last few Goldsmith scores were leftover relics from times past. Gone are the days when scores overpower the film. Don’t get me wrong, I love Goldsmith, Williams, Elfman and Morricone but nowadays it simply isn’t neccessary to overpower the filmgoer with bombastic, melody-driven film music. Goldsmith and company filled a neccessary function in the pre-cgi days — painting an emotional musical vista to fill in for most sci-fi films’ special effects and budgetary shortcomings. It’s no surprise to me then that more subtle composers like Giacchino and Hans Zimmer are being utilized more and more. As much as I *hate* Rick Berman’s stranglehold on his TV show composers and his dictum that the music be less cinematic and less melodic (with their budgets TNG through ENT could’ve benefitted from this sort of musical padding) he ends up being kind of right — ENT’s cornball opening ’song’ notwithstanding, of course — the music should merely convey mood, not tell its’ own competing story.
Just watched (and I’m sure I’m not the only one here) The Dark Knight followed by Tim Burton’s Batman and the musical contrast was stunning. Danny Elfman’s descriptive, operatic score now smacks me over the head while Zimmer’s accentuates and never overwhelms. I can’t, however, imagine simply listening to a Zimmer or Giacchino score on its’ own. Not like the scores of those I mention above. The new approach is more toward synesthesia — a perfect balance of all the arts involed in filmmaking as opposed to the old style where the composer forcefully imprints his mark on the sum total of the package.
Giacchino’s work on Lost is superlative. Can’t wait to feel the complete experience of this new film.
Not even close to that…yet..
“best years of John Williams.”
37: I agree with you to a point, but I still think there NEEDS to be some well developed themes the audience can relate/hook into..it WORKS and works well if done right..I feel like there’s something missing if I dont hear that in a movie score. Danny Elfmans stuff does tend to whack you over the head with his style, but I think Horner Goldsmith and Williams have been able to strike that balance on occasions in the past.
If the music is just so-so or bad it can really ruin a movie.
Jerry Garcia is doing the Trek score?
Another fantastic piece of work by Giacchino is the sole piece of music from “Cloverfield,” “Roar! (Cloverfield Overture).” It’s the only piece of soundtrack music from the film, and it plays over the closing credits. An extended length version is on iTunes.
It is a fantastic and just so PERFECT homage to classic giant monster movie scores like the old Godzilla themes. Just outstanding.
I’m not worried about Giacchino at all. His score will be outstanding.
41. wow that does sound like an old school monster movie, a bit over the top and there’s no real ‘theme’ just meanders on..
I cant imagine myself humming that tune walking out of the theater..thats the trick…;)
#37
I gotta have a stand-alone score I can listen to a million million times over on the train to work! It would be nice if it could make me cry too.
No pressure MG
As I’ve said, to all those people hoping for or expecting a 1980s-era loud, hummable, melody-driven score, I don’t think it’s gonna happen. I don’t think it SHOULD happen. Rewatching movies from the 80s is still fun but boy those filmscores are overpowering. We don’t “need” the music to pick us up and carry us anymore. I also loved Howard Shore’s Lord of the Rings scores but even they feel overblown to me now (though I’ll forgive them because of the operatic nature of the film’s source material).
No, The Dark Knight and Lost are excellent examples. It isn’t neccessary for filmmusic to pummel us to death like James Horner’s Titanic score or even Morricone’s excellent-yet-overpowering Untouchables score.
A good story, compelling characters and believable visuals preclude any need for excessive musical landscape painting. I’d rather have the whole cinematic package come together nicely than have an overwhelming DUM-DUM-DUM! musical score bitch-smacking me in my theatre seat.
42 – I don’t know, there are several themes used in the Cloverfield track. There’s the big & brash deep horn theme, the subtler Japanese-ish portion, etc.
And there’s nothing wrong with the theme from a giant monster movie being a little over the top. :)
41. Kevin Buchanan –
“Another fantastic piece of work by Giacchino is the sole piece of music from “Cloverfield,” “Roar! (Cloverfield Overture).” It’s the only piece of soundtrack music from the film, and it plays over the closing credits. An extended length version is on iTunes.
It is a fantastic and just so PERFECT homage to classic giant monster movie scores like the old Godzilla themes. Just outstanding.”
I agree with you on that. I have been a huge fan of Akira Ifikube, the composer responsible for many Godzilla and Japanese sci fi films, and Giacchino’s endcredit music for Cloverfield is an impressive homage to his style. I think he’ll do a great job.
@26:
Copyright laws allow up to 45 seconds for sampling of music which is one reason you always hear famous songs in lame car commercials, but in the case of the trailer music; ‘Two Steps from Hell’ is a group who does music specifically for movie trailers. I believe it says that on their website, so they most likely got paid for the production of the music. Whether or not they get royalties is another question.
44. ucdom –
“#37
I gotta have a stand-alone score I can listen to a million million times over on the train to work! It would be nice if it could make me cry too.”
Giacchino’s work on Lost has brought me to tears many times. Of course the tight storytelling, well-cast actors and rich characters go a long way to helping that happen as well.
#49
Sure, that’s partly what I mean – listening to the score brings to life the movie and recreates the story and acting. I have to admit – though you may not like it – that the Titanic score did that for me quite well.
Plus, with Trek, there’s just *something* about THE fanfare, it’s almost like a character. We’ve heard it done so many different ways, and I’m looking forward to hearing a new rendition.
48: Yea but its virtually identical to a piece of music from Children Of Dune!!!
Not that Im complaining just point it out. I love it
50: YEA it’d be great if its in the movie, it was at the end of the trailer and gave me gooseybumps lol
Typo Alert! Conciliation prize should perhaps be consolation prize.
Sincerely,
C.S. Lewis
The music does need to be a character, and know when to let itself be known or sit back!
53: Permission to beam you back to troll land?
@26/48
They didn’t rip the music. They payed for a non-exclusive Master Use License for the trailer. Always costs money. Yes, and the composer and publisher will receive royalties, but not from US theatrical screenings, I think. And there is no law that allows you to sample up to x seconds of music. These are just legends. There are always rights/copyrights attached to a piece of music, even if it’s just a few notes, sometimes even only a specific sound.
50. ucdom –
“#49
Sure, that’s partly what I mean – listening to the score brings to life the movie and recreates the story and acting. I have to admit – though you may not like it – that the Titanic score did that for me quite well.
Plus, with Trek, there’s just *something* about THE fanfare, it’s almost like a character. We’ve heard it done so many different ways, and I’m looking forward to hearing a new rendition.”
Believe me, I understand where you’re coming from. Like you and many others here I’ve spent decades of my life listening to film music CDs on headphones, re-living those great moments we associate with them. I’m simply saying Hollywood’s approach to filmmusic has changed in the past decade and in many ways it’s understandable and even a good thing. At first I really hated Batman Begins in large part because Danny Elfman did such an incredible job on his two previous Batman scores and Hans Zimmer’s music left me seriously wanting. But upon revisiting those earlier movies I’ve realized things have changed. Subtle works, too.
If there is indeed a huge new Trek fanfare and even a big opening credits (I seriously doubt there will be opening credits beyond a single title card — the trend nowadays is to put all credits at the end and dive straight into the movie) I won’t object to it. I just don’t expect it. Watch Iron Man, Dark Knight, etc. No opening credits, it’s all held til the end. Present day audiences get bored if you give them long credits and musical overture before the action begins. Watch J.J.’s other shows. Fringe has very brief opening cards and Lost’s title card and ‘music’ last about 3 seconds.
Yeah, back in the day the opening credits sequence was longer than the movie.
58. Enterprise –
“Yeah, back in the day the opening credits sequence was longer than the movie.”
It may seem that way to some current audiences. And if you go back to the sixties and earlier most films put *all* their credits up front and left none for the end. They’d list everyone and everything before you even got to see any action and then the film would be over with that ol’ “The End” card. After nearly a century filmmakers realize audiences mostly don’t care about all those names so it’s best to put them at the end when everyone’s making for the exits.
Or in the case of the new Batman movies, they don’t even put the title at the start of the movie anymore. I always sit through the end titles because sometimes directors put special scenes at the end of the credits like in Iron Man, or the Pirates of the Caribbean movies.
I am actually watching the credits because I respect all the folks working on that movie…
60. Enterprise –
“Or in the case of the new Batman movies, they don’t even put the title at the start of the movie anymore. I always sit through the end titles because sometimes directors put special scenes at the end of the credits like in Iron Man, or the Pirates of the Caribbean movies.”
I wonder if we’ll get anything special at the end of Star Trek? And if we’ll get any kind of heads-up from trekmovie.com before opening day so I’ll know whether to insist to my wife that we stay through the end credits!
#5 – I think Roddenberry Enterprises (or whatever Rod Roddenberry is calling his company) does sell Trek t-shirts with the Starfleet delta and the departmental colors and emblems.
61. thorsten –
“I am actually watching the credits because I respect all the folks working on that movie…”
Agreed. And if what rumors we’ve heard here are true I’ll want to read the cast listing closely to see if I missed any big names making cameos under tons of alien make-up.
I think for the titles, Abrams and Co. will probably bring the starfield at the front back and give Giacchino the first two or three minutes to just play with the original theme(s) and start the score off right.
I know it’s not the most popular thing to do these days, with a lot of this summers big films not having the titles (in the most extreme case Dark Knight doesn’t even mention the title until the start of the end titles), but the series that have had it, kept it, ie. Indiana Jones had its titles in the exact style, I think it was even the same typeface. So, since Star Trek movies have traditionally opened with a big title sequence, I think Abrams will want to keep that style going. I knew Nemesis was no good when Baird decided to kill that tradition.
Plus, I think Abrams is one of those directors who likes to play around with titles at the start of the film, Mission: Impossible III had a very cool opening, the best of the series, and the only reason why Cloverfield didn’t have a title sequence at the start was to play with the idea that the film was made of “found material” in the park. I know Alias at one point had a long title and Lost and Fringe only have their brief ones because they have so much content already in a fixed runtime. With movies you can go on as long as you want, so the titles aren’t much of a problem.
Plus, he has Michael Giacchino doing the score, and who wouldn’t want to have a long sequence where we just have listen to his brilliant work. Can’t wait to see/ hear more of his work from the film.
How I rank the Trek scores:
TMP
TWOK
TFF
FC
TSFS
TUC
INS
GEN
NEM
TVH
I cannot state this clearly enough: The music of Star Trek is VITALLY important. I won’t mind some experimentation, as this is a new Star Trek, but…I badly want to hear Goldsmith’s Trek theme. As a child of the 90s and a TNG fan, it’s iconic and immediately “Star Trek” to me. Up there with Williams’s work on Indy, Star Wars and Superman. Indispensible.
For the opening credits. It should just say “Star Trek” in gold font at the start, and you just hear the classic sounds of the Enterprise bridge. Then, fade out, and the movie starts.
I physically *need* to hear this score!
That was my only gripe about the Dark Knight — Zimmer’s soundtrack served the film decently, but not much more than that; and it certainly can’t hold a candle to the gothic awesomeness of Danny Elfman’s work on the first two Tim Burton Batmans.
I have every confidence that Michael Giacchino is going to do Trek proud, no matter what style he goes with, but personally I’m hoping for a big, huge, operatic, over-the-top, glorious mess of music. :)
Just thought of something. Giacchino is very good at homages to other composers. Wouldn’t it be brilliant if for the end credits he included a bunch of music from TOS? Think of it — how amazing would it be to hear the theme from the Doomsday Machine on a theatre soundsystem? Or the evil universe theme from Mirror, Mirror? The word “epic” springs to mind….
One piece of soundtrack work that I think needs a shoutout is Klaus Badelt’s in Pirates of the Caribbean. He also did a couple pieces for Extreme Days, and both of those are endlessly listenable. I’m not hoping for anything quite so over the top as Pirates for Star Trek, but it had better be worth listening to alone.
I pretty much agree with DaveSchilling’s ranking of the scores.
I’ve stated several times in the past, and I believe it has been posited by others in the past as well, that the best analogue score wise for Star Trek is probably Mission: Impossible III, for the following reasons:
- Both Based on classic TV series franchizes with iconic themes and styles.
- Both produced and directed by JJ Abrams.
- Both have a huge fan following.
- Both are attempting to bring a faster pace and greater scale to proceedings.
- Both are composed by JJ Abrams.
Based on this, listen to Giacchino’s work on Mission: Impossible III, and it may reveal something of an approach to the movie:
- Include original themes and basic instrumentation.
- Expand on that base, and create new themes and more elaborate orchestrations.
- Invoke the original style, but modernize it for the ride on screen.
We’ll get the Original Theme, at least the opening Fanfare, as a primary component of the score.
We’ll get some intimate, quiet music for some of the more personal moments between the characters.
We’ll get some kick-ass action scoring for many sequences.
We may hear a badass theme for Nero, perhaps with a middle-eastern/mongolian type twist (or at least, that’s how I’d go, perhaps with some dissonance).
There might be themes for Kirk and Spock, with Spock being a strong one. Perhaps vaguely similar to Goldsmith’s Vulcan music, or Gerald Fried’s music for Amok Time.
It will need to be strong thematically, and may have a slightly more nostalgic edge than M:I:III.
This is just educated guesswork, and we’ll se if I got it completely wrong, or if I guessed correctly on something.
I’m looking forward to adding it to my CD collection.
Idea for the start:
Action packed sequence of some kind, perhaps involving something we’ve heard spoilers about.
Then we get something similar to the moment STAR TREK came up at the end of the trailer, then we start to introduce young Kirk and Spock.
I still think Danny Elfman’s music for Batman is still the best. I prefer the bombastic scores with signature themes for the characters. I think the lack of themes these days makes the scores more bland these days as they are too samey.
Dark Knight lacking a theme was the one thing that was underwhelming for me, everything else I loved in The Dark Knight. It just never made the impression that Elfman’s music did for the first two. First time I watched Batman I was blown away by Elfman;s music, in fact it is the music I still identify the most with Batman. I think there is a blandness in music and film styles these days, they dont have the individual flavours they had 10 years ago. Music seems to be fading away these days.
I want a more operatic score and epic score, I miss Goldsmith. I hope Hiacchino gives us a score that would make Goldsmith proud. Have a great score.
“Giacchino’s work on Lost has brought me to tears many times. Of course the tight storytelling, well-cast actors and rich characters go a long way to helping that happen as well.”
Absolutely! The music in LOST is absolutely phenomenal. I dare anyone to watch the final two miraculous minutes of “Walkabout” and listen to the stunning score without tearing up.
65- I wish they would have more films with titles.
20 years ago I use to like the fact that the odd film had no titles like RoboCop but I get annoyed when nearly every film these days never has a title sequence. I would love to see more films with title sequences thes days, like the old days, it helped me get into the movie.
I also notice these days that many films have great visuals in their end credits and I think these would make great opening credits.
Of course, you should probably watch the whole episode first if you haven’t so that you understand why the final two minutes are so miraculous.
TWOK is fantastic, its the only score i actually bought on CD, it is simply stunning. I hope this score is good, scores can make or break a movie IMHO
I put Fred Steiner’s “Corbomite Maneuver” and Gerald Fried’s “Amok Time” on top of my list.
Can you imagine if Giacchino adapts the fight music to the Kirk/Spock fight in the new film?
Maybe not ;-)
I asked Bob Orci this the other night and he did say there would be TOS musical cues in the soundtrack. The Spock theme is probably a given.
Oh, and as cute as the pictures are, this is the most useless article ever. PICTURES OF A SOUND RECORDING?!!!!
AND WE HAVE TO WAIT UNTIL MARCH TO HEAR ANY OF IT?!!!!!! ARGHHHH!!!!
Gahhh! I want to hear the score dammit!
And anyone who wants to hear Goldsmith’s “Enterprise” theme…not gonna happen. It may have started as being the “Enterprise” theme, but The Next Generation adopted it. I’ll be happy as long as they bring in the old theme…thoughtfully updated, of course.
“And anyone who wants to hear Goldsmith’s “Enterprise” theme…not gonna happen. It may have started as being the “Enterprise” theme, but The Next Generation adopted it.”
Huh? How does that make it not the Enterprise theme anymore? Last time I checked, TNG was about the Enterprise too.
I simply love Goldsmith’s TMP score, one of his finest, although I don’t like the actual title theme, which they also used for TNG. But the rest of it is truly great. Someone here mentioned Eidelman’s overture for StarTrek VI, and I agree it’s a great piece, although it’s very much inspired by Elfman’s Batman theme, with a bit of Stravinsky’s Firebird thrown in. And I’ve always liked DS9’s main title, and I think McCarthy’s alternative version for StarTrek Generations is pretty good, grander, more Coplandish.
Goldsmith ruined his incredible score for TMP by using it to bookend every later trek film he got his hands on. That works great for an episodic film saga like John William’s Star Wars, but it’s half-assed when your score has been used so disjointedly on the small and silver screens.
Not to take away from the brilliant individuality that Goldsmith brought to his three TNG films, but I’m hoping this new film is more individuality (like ST:IV and ST:VI) than same-old same-old star trek fanfare that Goldsmith brought to us almost 30 years ago.
#14 – You know “Stealing the Enterprise” was lifted, note for note, from Prokofiev’s Romeo and Juliet, right?
Horner steals from Prokofiev. Zimmer steals from Mozart.
Goldsmith stole from Goldsmith.
84: what part/Mvt?
and that is why Goldsmith won
#62
“I wonder if we’ll get anything special at the end of Star Trek?”
I’m betting on Shatner stepping out of the shower, and saying, “I had the strangest dream…”
I would also wet myself laughing if the Amok Time theme were to be used – as I did when it got used in Futurama
Star Trek is all about memorable musical themes. I hope there’s some in the film; and preferably nothing like what was in the trailer. Can’t stand that stuff… it could’ve been made with Garageband.
When I realized Giacchino was the same guy who had done The Incredibles, I breathed a sigh of relief. He gets it. He understands that music plays a big part in the process. His work for The Incredibles was spot-on perfect.
I have no worries.
Of course, the fanfare HAS to be a part of it.
And I’m supposed to believe that they all wear Star Trek uniforms to work. Riiiiiiiiight.
#86 – It’s called “The Death of Tybalt” on some recordings…I’d have to dig out mine to find out…
Is it kinda sad they couldn’t even take pictures at a recording of music for a movie?
6- My score order I, II, IV, V, III, VI, X, IX, VIII, VII
My biggest disappointment- John Williams has never been given a shot at scoring Trek.
Trek has always had great music. I just saw The Incredible Hulk. By comparison, I couldn’t make out the melody with a dog and a cane. I heard growling plodding noises, but no tune, man! I can’t remember many recent themes. Trek’s birth in the 60’s may have a lot to do with the stress on great, memorable scores. Anyway… hoping for hearing the best.
Speed Racer… not a hit I know. I have to say that MG’s music made that movie. I own the movie and I own the soundtrack. It is funny that the music had immense character in most of the race scenes. You know the SR theme was peppered through out the movie. To my amazement there was theme extension from the original Japanese version was added to the mix for good measure. The ironic part is when I listen to the soundtrack I notice where his music blended in the film and where it punctuated its character. I have no doubt that what ever is done in the film his part in it will be fun.
oh no its Michael Moore!
92. Imrahil –
“#86 – It’s called “The Death of Tybalt” on some recordings…I’d have to dig out mine to find out…”
You mean the piece right before “Death of Tybalt” “Romeo Decides To Avenge Mercutio”. It’s definately not “note for note” but it’s a fair bet to say Horner was thinking of the piece at least for the beginning of that scene in ST3.
It’s closer to say Eidelmann’s opening overture for ST6 was a huge swipe of Holst’s “The Planets” — which it was.
…specifically the “Mars God of War” movement.
He should’ve won for Ratatouille. It was a great score. Fringe sounds too much like Lost at times for my taste, but he’s a wonderful talent.
As a musician, I can honestly say that Mr. Giacchino is a very talented and capable composer. I have no doubt that he has come up with a score that is interesting, creative, thrilling, emotional, and most of all, memorable. I can’t wait to hear it at
12:00 a.m. on May 9th.
Andrea looks great, I hope I’ll also have once such a beautiful assistent :-).
My score order:
I
V
IX
VIII
II
VI
X
III
IV
VII
It would be beautiful for me, if the score was composed by Elliot Goldenthal, when a Jerry Goldsmith score is no more possible.
The time goes so quickly, in 2009 we will remind us 5 years after Maestro Goldsmith passed away….
re: 57
“Present day audiences get bored if you give them long credits and musical overture before the action begins. Watch J.J.’s other shows. Fringe has very brief opening cards and Lost’s title card and ‘music’ last about 3 seconds.”
Not a good thing.
Those who feel that they should take the example of “Dark Knight” is dead wrong.
Hum the original Batman (1989) theme, Superman, Raiders of the Lost Ark, Star Wars, Jaws, etc. People will pick up and know EXACTLY what film they’re from.
Now hum ANY piece of music from “Dark Knight” and unless you’ve seen the film recently (or a dozen times) I challenge you to find someone who would know what film it was from.
Film is not just the visual. It’s the sound, and music is part of that art.
#9…forgot about that, I *knew* I missed one!
I’d place it below “Generations”.
It’s not a bad score, but it’s just a TREK-ified version of Holst’s “The Planets”…which is exactly what Nicholas Meyer asked Cliff Eidelman to do.
Well XI was my absolute favorite Trek score. But again I love The Planets,
Generations I put at the bottom, Dennis McCarthy is not a film composer, for me it ranks with Rosenman’s score for IV!
I choose the troika of Goldsmith, Horner and Eidelman!
-cs™
Btw I want those t-shirts, please tell me they exist or will when May 2009 rolls around!
-cs™
I guess I should weigh in with my list of trek scores, and just to kick things off again, best cues. Nemesis always disappointed me because the main theme (end credits rather) was played so slowly, it sounded …old.
1. TMP (I),best track is ‘The Enterprise’
2. TWOK (II),best track is ‘Genesis countdown’
3. TUC (VI), best track ‘Sign off’ and ‘Star Trek VI suite’
4. TSFS (III),best track ‘Stealing the Enterprise’
5. First Contact, best track is ‘First Contact’
6. Insurrection, best track is ‘The Healing Process’
7. TFF (V), best track is ‘A busy man’
8. TVH (IV), best track ‘Home again, end credits’
9. Generations,best track is ‘To Live Forever”
10. Nemesis, best track ‘Lateral run’
However, any of these, except maybe TMP have a long way to go to beat, say, Adventure on Earth from ET, or the main theme to Jurassic Park (Journey to the Island).
I would also love to hear what Elliot Goldenthal would do with a Trek score, as well as John Williams, or Howard Shore. I think that has the sequels all sewn up…?
THE GENESIS COUNTDOWN -JAMES HORNER Gets me fired up before final exams.
106. Smittmaestro –
“Well XI was my absolute favorite Trek score.”
“XI”? Huh?
As far as Williams themes in opening credits, Jurassic Park and Raiders of the Lost Ark had no opening fanfare; the credits ran over the action in progress. whereas as Star Wars had a very distinct retro opening and Superman had one of the longest credit rolls in history.
With Goldsmith, the problem got to be with him “phoning it in” quite often. For every Poltergeist, Planet of the Apes, and The Omen, and Patton you had dozens of scores like First Contact and Air Force One, whose main themes are almost interchangeable.
Granted all these guys do so much scoring I’m sure it’s hard to keep adding fresh elements. Horner’s music is very easy to recognize and his themes from Apollo 13 and The Perfect Storm are also nearlt interchangeable.
Even John Williams gets bogged down sometimes. Parts of his score for “Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets” sounded just like parts of “Star Wars Episode II: Attack of the Clones”, which he scored simultaneously. He did redeem himself, however, with the highly original “Prisoner of Azkerban” before deciding he’d had enough of the Potter franchise.
As for Lost and Fringe sounding alike, it’s probably safe to say that episodic incidental music is not high on Giacchino’s list of priorities right now as a high profile scowcase musical score for Star Trek. Of course, by that token there was no excuse for the last 10 minutes or so of “Mission Impossible III” for sounding EXACTLY like Lost. And as much as I liked “The Incredibles”, I don’t think he should get too much credit for such a blatant ripoff of John Barry’s James Bond themes and “The Adventures of Johnny Quest”. I prefer to think more of “Ratatouille” since it is completely original and sets the mood perfectly.
108. ucdom –
“However, any of these, except maybe TMP have a long way to go to beat, say, Adventure on Earth from ET, or the main theme to Jurassic Park (Journey to the Island).”
Wow, interesting opinion. Personally, the two John Williams pieces you mention here are my all time least favorites! I’d say Goldsmith’s treacly, precious score for Insurrection comes close to evoking the kind of diabetic seizure those two scores bring me to. Sorry, they are all far too sugary confections for my palette. But each to his own, I suppose.
Okay, here’s my countdown:
1.) TMP (of course) – At times the film itself becomes an excuse for Goldsmith’s music. Simply beautiful.
2.) TSFS – I love the Klingon theme (even if it’s something of a variation on the Khan theme I like it better here) and the Stealing the Enterprise scene ranks among the greatest moments in Trek cinema in large part thanks to Horner’s music. Some great thoughtful moments, too.
3.) TWOK – Another great score, so great that Horner pillaged his own material when he scored “Aliens” and raided his Khan theme again.
4.) TFF – A lousy B-movie blessed with a moving score. It still manages to stumble here and there (Kitaro >cough<) but overall the best thing you can saw about that film.
5.) GEN – This is truly my guilty pleasure and it imbarrasses me to even admit it! I despised McCarthy’s tv music, just utterly unlistenable crap — especially his early first season theme for Wesley. But he surprised me with GEN. The opening theme is a slowburner that builds nicely and the theme he developed for Kirk is somewhat moving. Again, not perfect but a valiant effort.
6.) TUC – Only for the opening titles. Sure, it’s got plenty of Holst and Stravinsky and even a nod to Horner thrown in but it’s still rousing. The rest of Eidelman’s score is forgettable.
7.) FC – It’s okay.
7.) Tie for TVH, INS and NEM – TVH definately feels dated. It felt dated in 1986! It’s just goofy and makes absolutely no daring creative choices. It could’ve been lifted straight from any number of other comedies at the time. INS, as I said, is warmed over and more suitable to a chick flick where ‘people make difficult choices about things’. NEM is simply forgettable. I seriously cannot recall one cue from the entire film.
But those are just my opinions.
Dan Wallin looks like Willie Nelson, and Andrea Datzman looks like Jennifer Gardner in those pics!
I have high hopes for Giacchino’s score. Of all the new talent in the movie scoring business, he is the only one who will join the ranks of Goldsmith, Williams,Horner, and going back even further, Max Steiner, Franz Waxman and Miklos Rosza. He is THAT good.
To be fair on two issues. TMP lent itself to Goldsmith’s sweeping score due to the fact that there were large portions of the film where nothing was going on, and Horner was given very little time to score Aliens and wound up merging chunks of Goldsmith’s score with pieces of his own generic action music.
Which reminds me of another great Goldsmith score, Alien, written simultaneously with TMP.
Horner was so pissed he swore he’d never work with Cameron again. Of course, he eventually reconsidered and the result was a multiple Oscar win for Titanic.
What I’ve noticed lately is that if you think a score sounds almost like somebody, say you can’t tell if it’s Horner, Elfman, or Thomas Newman or Don Davis – it’s probably some new guy seemlessly blending all of the above. This happens all the time and I end up going to IMDB to check it out.
They need something really new and great. A driving, powerful new theme, beautiful, emotional moments and hard, beating actionmusic. One addition: I would have liked to listen to Bill Contis STAR TREK Score. Unfortunateley he never published one! I hope they will need some of the TOS themes. Some of them, expecially by Fred Steiner, were great!
I’m jealous Jeff Bond got to be there for it. I guess I should be alternately glad for him too. I’m just jealous right now. Sure bet it was cool. Wonder if the great Rick Baptiste is holding down duties in the trumpet section. Too cool.
So….Bill Conti’s out as the Oscar orchestra conductor this year? That’s breaking, what I think, is a long running tradition. Hmm.
116
“I hope they will need some of the TOS themes. Some of them, expecially by Fred Steiner, were great!”
I hope they do too. Talk about bridging the gap between audiences. If there’s anything that could co it……..
regarding 83
I felt it cheapened the TMP score by using it on TNG. I never liked that.
118. Andy Patterson –
“I felt it cheapened the TMP score by using it on TNG. I never liked that.”
I felt the same way. Maybe Goldsmith even felt that way since he made a new theme for Voyager years later.
ditto on the use in TNG
I agree with anyone that has posted about Star Trek VI which was another great sound track. Of all the soundtracks thus far I would put them in this order
1. Star Trek TMP: All that stuff that was done for the v’ger organism was incredible, I loved that part the most. But you cannot skip the fact that it introduced the friggin star trek theme, the most recognizable peace of music ever produced by star trek, and probably good for a top ten list of most recognizable themes.
2. Star Trek TWOK: This was just a solid fun score, nothing surprising, but it was great fun. And, although TMP gets my nod for best soundtrack, the music that is played durring the scene were kirk and kahn battle for the first time, and durring the prepartion for battle in the Mutara Nebula bit, are my favorite peices of music from a sountrack.
3. Star Trek First Contact: This one is so close to being second in my book, all becuase of the opening credits. It is an intensly emotional bit.
4. Star Trek Undiscovered Country: Here, Nicholas Myer dared to ask for something diffrent done with the score. And what he got was a brooding forboding work that was just plain fun. I did not put this one higher on the list because it just didn’t quite have the artistry or finess that First contact did, and wasn’t quite as fun as TWOK.
5. Star Trek Insurection: You can’t go wrong with Jerry Goldsmith, and I would actually put this one on the same level as Undiscoverd country. It is not higher then undiscovered country though because although I absolutly love the baku’s theme (it literally can make me teary eyed) the battle/actions themes are a just a smig pedestrian (only a smig).
6. Star Trek “The Whale Movie”: Okey, so although It’s still a bit far down on my list I actually am quite fond of this movie score in light of movie scores in general. It totally fits the feel of the movie, even though you can’t believe your listening to this music and watching a star trek movie. However you must admit that even without the score, it is the least star trekish of all the movie. You can’t tell that the score durring the hospital scene isn’t just fun to listen too. And what can I say, I like the credits theme too (I am a fan of the Barroque style).
7. Star Trek Nemesis: Although a rehash of some of the First Contact themes, I liked it better then the other movies further down the list.
8. Star Trek V: Another rehash from Goldsmith, although the scene were they pas through teh barrier and see the planet is nice, it really is a rehash.
9. Star Trek Generations: You know, I didn’t find anything really new or “above and beyond” about this score. Even though I have it on my I-pod and I generally listen to the entire album once every two weeks or so, I thought I was a little more cut and paste then some star trek scores have been.
And now for my least favorite score of any star trek movie…..
10. Star Trek The Search For Spock: How’d you guess? Okey so it was the only one left. I’ve never been a fan of anything really done with this score, mostly because it is a total cut and paste from TWOK. and that bit for the scene in which the Enterprise enters Space Dock just didn’t work for me. Blah.
So there you have it my top ten list for star trek film scores. Having looked at the new composer work for Lost, and the Incredibles, I am sure that it will probably kick First contact out of third place, or maybe even TWOK out of second place. However, you can’t kick TMP out of first place. Too many themes and ideas were introduced for the first time in that movie.
I noticed someone commented earlier that movie scores don’t need to be big anymore because of CGI.
I couldn’t possibly disagree more. As an audience we have been so SATURATED with CGI we’ve become completely unimpressed and de-sensitized to the most incredible visuals now. It’s Hollywood unbelievable reliance on CGI that has created this growing indifference. Ironically it is this indifference that will force Hollywood to do what is necessary to keep us all interested.
As an artist myself I completely understand and appreciate the need for dazzling visuals, but in order to actually EXPERIENCE and not just SEE a movie, we need something that taps into our emotions directly, and nothing on Earth does it as effectively as music.
Let’s face it , most of us here love TOS, and TOS had all of those incredible “moments” when the music flawlessly illustrated the emotion and excitement of a particular scene. All of the greatest films in history have these “moments” within them and if this new film is to be great, it will need to have them as well.
I just saw the remake of The Day the Earth Stood Still. It was so FLAT and boring I could not believe it. The scene where everything stands still is a perfect example. In the original, Bernard Herrmann’s score perfectly captured the awe and strangeness of what it would be like if that actually happened. The new one…..not so much.
: )
Wow, great thread.
Random thoughts:
I also never like TMP theme being used for TNG. Cheapened it. Especially since one of the most critical elements of the piece is the pipe organ. TNG’s version did not have the organ, or if it did, I can’t hear it.
I disagree with the idea that the films should not share a common set of musical cues. Like it or not, Star Trek is a series, and the films are basically episodes allowing us to visit with the familiar characters, in new situations. The music cues are an emotional link, arguably as powerful as the visual design of the ship.
For this reason, I never liked the idea of having separate themes for each film. Even TWOK, while enjoyable, disappointed me the moment the fanfare ended, and the new Horner music kicked in. The music was great, but the break in musical continuity was a letdown. This is one of the redeeming features of TFF (of all things). The prologue and segue to the original fanfare against the starfield and reprise of the TMP theme were the film series’ best evocation of the original structure of a TOS episode.
Don’t like Elfman.
Hope Giachinno uses some of Steiner’s cues.
Question: I have read that Goldsmith and Alexander Courage were close collaborators over the years, with Courage orchestrating many of Goldsmith’s scores. A musician friend of mine once said that Courage’s TOS theme (the actual theme, not just the fanfare) is actually found in the structure of Goldsmith’s TMP theme. (Also that Courage was even involved with Goldsmith’s recording of the original TMP theme.) Supposedly, the chord progressions are very similar, but in different times and (march vs. whatever the TOS piece is) structures. I am a “play it by ear” guy, so I am out of my depth. Anybody know what he meant?
123
Yay, on almost all you’ve said.
I really do hope they use familiar themes from TOS. I remember the scene where Khan does the “buried aliiiiive” speech and Horner definitely used some elements of first season cues during that scene. I remember that making me very happy and tied it all together for me. That’s the smart thing to do….but we don’t always seem to do things like that these days do we?
The Undiscovered Country and First Contact have always been my favourites. I hope the new score has the emotion and intensity of both of those scores.