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BSG Preview: “Someone to Watch Over Me” February 27, 2009

by Rosario T. Calabria , Filed under: BSG , trackback

We are headed into the final stretch with the 7th episode of BSG Season 4.5, and let’s hope it is better than last week’s entry. Tonight’s "Someone to Watch Over Me" looks to be Kara-centric and should answer some questions. We have previews for that, plus the latest frakkin lins, f DVD art, and more, including the trailer that Richard Hatch was pushing before Ron Moore got his hands on BSG.

 

“Someone to Watch Over Me” [Season 4 Ep. 17]
US: Airing February 27th on SciFi at 10 PM (9 Central)
Canada: Airing February 27th on Space at 10 PM (7 Pacific)
UK: Airing March 3rd on Sky1 at 9 PM
 

Synopsis: Kara sees visions that may explain the nature of her true identity. Meanwhile, Boomer faces punishment for her actions in the tortuous struggle between the humans and Cylons.


Tonight’s episode has a lot of Kara


with some Chief and Boomer too

[more photos]

Preview (SciFi – USA)

Preview (Space – Canada)

Sneak Peek

 

Last Week’s Episode ("Deadlock") Roundup

The episode is not yet available for streaming, but here is the recap:

Also check out Ron Moore’s podcast for the episode, it is enlighteing.

Ratings analysis
The roller coaster continues. “Deadlock” drew a season low audience of just 1.53M viewers. That’s 12% below last week’s numbers and 28% below the season 4.5 premiere. The show had been on an upward trend the two weeks prior, averaging 1.75M viewers for week’s four (“Blood on the Scales”) and five (“No Exit”) after notching a then-season low 1.56M viewers for week three (“The Oath”). Overall, season 4.5 is averaging 1.74M viewers.”p>

Frakkin BSG links

Caprica DVD art and previews
Universal released the box art and some images for Caprica, the pilot movie for the BSG prequel series.


Caprica DVD cover art


Caprica preview image

[more Caprica photos]


Second Coming Trailer
Last week we reported that Glen Larson was in talks with Universal to bring the original 70s BSG to the big screen. Still no final word on that, but a few years back Richard Hatch pitched an idea called "Battlestar Galactica: The Second Coming", and the trailer for that is now online, check it out.

Even more BSG
If that isn’t enough for you, keep track of all your Frakin needs at our favorite BSG site, Battlestar Sitrep.

Comments

1. I'm dead Jim - February 27, 2009

Frakkin awesome! Lovin it! First?

2. khan Singh - February 27, 2009

First?
Oh I hope this episode is better than last weeks. Pleeaase.. Good show, but really cramming alot of stuff in at the last minute.

3. Jeyl - February 27, 2009

Mmm. Always heard of the second coming trailer. Never thought I’d see it.

4. Geoffers - February 27, 2009

Must admit… I do love the new BSG.. but I would have prefered to have seen “Second Comming” made…

5. Capt Mike Of The Terran Empire - February 27, 2009

Ok. This weeks Ep looks to be good and hopefully will answer the question. Is Star Buck a Cylon and if so how did she get here. Could it be that the Lords of Kobol have helped here somehow. Also will they relise that they have in fact not found Earth. I hopew we get some good stuff. i do hope that Glen Larsen gets to make the Original Battlestar galactica into a Big Blockbuster. I will be there for the Midnight Showing.

6. Montreal Paul - February 27, 2009

loved the trailer for Second Coming… I’d have watched that!

7. Capt Mike Of The Terran Empire - February 27, 2009

Oh yes. Trek Minus 10 weeks.

8. Just Wonderin' - February 27, 2009

Anything would be better than that crap last week. I can’t believe the producers wasted time on that soap opera of an episode.

9. SerenityActual - February 27, 2009

As much as I would love a new movie of the original series, I just do not think it would work after the reimagined series.

Hope they try though :)

10. bgiles73 - February 27, 2009

I’m looking forward to a Glen Larson BSG movie. I would like to see some of the old cast return. It’s a shame they didn’t cast Dirk Benedict the original Starbuck to play the part of Kara’s father! It’s also a shame that Richard Hatch’s character, Tom Zarach wasn’t given a chance to redeem himself. I really hated the character, he was a total sleaze-bag! Love Richard Hatch though so, maybe the new Larson project will see him return to a more heroic role!

11. Dennis Bailey - February 27, 2009

Loved last week’s episode “Deadlock.” If this one is better than that, great! :-)

12. Jay Kabinoff - February 27, 2009

Battlestar Galactica: Second Coming…that’s what I’ve been waiting for! Mr. Larsen please make this movie! Richard Hatch’s trailer updates the original perfectly.

13. Spock - February 27, 2009

I always liked the Second Coming Trailer. The Hatch book it was taken from was one of the better ones in the series.

14. sean - February 27, 2009

#10 – Dirk Benedict is too busy making quality television like Celebrity Big Brother to appear in the new BSG! ;) Really though, why on earth would they want him after all his whining about Starbuck being a woman?

15. sean - February 27, 2009

Wow, thank god we got Ron Moore’s thoughful BSG instead of old men in Sphinx helmets and OTT dialog like ‘you care nothing for anyone but yourself and your thirst for power!’. Oi vey!

16. Y EN A MARRE! - February 27, 2009

Wow, that trailer looks pretty bad. I’m glad the re-imagined BSG took the Star Wars ripoff stuff out of the original series. Looks like this trailer scooped up all the leftovers.

17. Locke for President - February 27, 2009

I used to practically count down the minutes all week for the next BSG episode. I really loved the show.

Now I’m counting down the minutes to the final episode, so I don’t have to be obligated to watch how this mish-mashed mess ends up.

I’ve always like Ron Moore’s work, but he really lost his way with BSG since the exodus from New Caprica. The show has become a charictature of itself.

“Lost”, of course, is building to its series’ conclusion with an aggressive pace. I thought BSG would do the same, but no such luck.

18. neal - February 27, 2009

BSG ttrailer: I love the long-zoom slow-mo shot of the heroes walking toward us. Total cliche, yet gets me every time. Was ‘The Right Stuff’ the first time we saw that shot used?

19. CmdrR - February 27, 2009

When was that trailer shot? The updated Cylon fighters look a lot like Moore’s. But, there are a few dead actors in the trailer that would indicate it’s at least a decade old.
Kathryn Leigh Scott isn’t credited… nor is (unless I’m seeing him wrong) Burgess Meredith.

I don’t think it would have been better than the new BSG, but it would have blasted the hell outta Galactica 1980.

20. Benjamin Adams - February 27, 2009

#18: It was shot in 1999, so you’re very close.

21. Benjamin Adams - February 27, 2009

Oops, I meant #19. :o

22. TOG - February 27, 2009

Second coming? Yep I would have watched it, but I believe it would have lost my interest quickly enough, more than likely for the same reasons Star Wars has… “Speculating”

The Federations demise is coming…

23. Cmdr Mad Dog, First Officer, U.S.S. Pelosi (full of bs class starship) - February 27, 2009

I have tried to be a faithful fan of BSG….first in the 70’s and with the reimagined show now. (forgive me for excluding BSG1980 but….)

I would much rather see the Second Coming then the way the current series is going. As I say, I am a fan..but even I am lost with this show.

Mr. Hatch, please bring Second Coming to the big screen!

24. Cylon - February 27, 2009

The trailer was awsome because Glen Larson had absolutely nothing to do with it. It was produced, written and directed by Richard Hatch. As much as I would love to see that story continue it shouldn’t be put into Larson’s hands. Give it to Richard Hatch. Please. Not larson. It will be Galactica 1980 all over again. That man can turn gold into a steaming turd.

25. Paul B. - February 27, 2009

Thanks for the preview–probably the best parts of the episode right there, if last week is any indication.

The new BSG started with a bang, but it’s ending with a long, drawn-out, soap-opera whimper. Even if they pull off a great finale, this last half-season has left such a sour taste in so many of our mouths…probably from throwing up a little every time they flip-flop characters for no reason.

26. Cylon - February 27, 2009

16- I read that Richard Hatch paid for this trailer on his own dime. Not Big Studio quality, but not bad either for an independent pick-up trailer.

27. weerd1 - February 27, 2009

I have been fascinated by this show consistently and am not willing to discount the entire ending because last week’s episode was a little slow. A number of important things happened in this show- we as viewers see the Final Five are really no better than humans, and in the end will prove to need humanity to survive. If Boomer knows where the fleet is, so does Cavil. Starbuck is seeing a piano I don’t think anyone else does (we’ll see tonight). Cylons can’t reproduce without resurrection. The Galactica fleet will only survive by cooperating with the Cylons. Chief still loves Boomer, and is ready to leave his “chief” life behind and become the Galen he was on Earth 2000 years ago again (great character arc BTW). Lee is in a position to become leader of the civilian side AND the military side. Lots of interesting stuff going on, even if it came off a little soapy. The minutes between Tigh and Adama as two old warhorses though I thought were gold, as is the continual decline of Adama since the discovery of Earth. I can’t wait for the next few weeks!

As for reviving the old- Look, I love the old show. It filled that magic gap when I was a kid of having something on TV like Star Wars that didn’t have singing Wookies. Going back and watching them now fills me with geek joy, but I don’t know how well it will update, particularly in the wake of Ron Moore’s phenomenal reboot. We’ll see.

28. MORN SPEAKS - February 27, 2009

I’m so sad that this series is ending soon :(

But I’m going to MegaCon in Orlando on Saturday to see Baltar and Number Six : ) !!!!!!!!

29. vorta23492392932939230 - February 27, 2009

wow, its kind of interesting how much from this (admittedly cheesy) attempt to remake BSG has surfaced in the awesome new version:

-years after the cylon war, they re-emerge in an evolved state
-the new cylon ships look like the RDM versions

I guess that’s it but still, that seems like the main premise of the new BSG!

Which actually happens to be like the best sci-fi show of all time, even though Star Trek is in a league of its own.

30. CystDrone - February 27, 2009

you guys have absolutely no sense of taste that thing is pure & utter CHEESE, however if it had been made back in the day rather than
‘Galactica 80′ then yea it woulda been cool. But for todays standards they’d need to up the game considerably. Im very happy with the current incarnation. I only hope JJ will also do the same and not be shackled by all that was wrong with Trek these past 15+ years. The shackles being the trekkies..

31. Izbot - February 27, 2009

BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!! That Second Coming trailer was 100% cheese!

Cylons in shadows with glowing eyes lifted staright from First Contact’s Borg reveal, the obligitory slow-mo running away from explosions, Apollo slo-mo jumping sideways through the air with firing both blasters, Adama’s Jor-El holographic cameo, the viper pilot pumping his fist ‘Yes!’ after hitting a target… Oh god that was awful!

32. DavidJ - February 27, 2009

15

Ha ha, agreed. I would have expected Hatch to bring a little more depth and substance to his updated version, but it looks like it would have been as cheesy, juvenile, and empty-headed as the original– only with slightly better effects. LOL

Thank god we got something with a little more ambition and intelligence.

33. Commodore Lurker - February 27, 2009

Defrakking . . .

Have to wait eight days to see eps on net now . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk . . . frakk!!!!!!!!!

Refrakking. }:-/>

34. Mirror Jordan - February 27, 2009

Last week’s episode was okay and I enjoyed it, but it certainly was slow. This week needs a does or two of action or at least mythology.

35. BaltarStar Galactica - February 27, 2009

I don’t understand all the complaining about Deadlock. I don’t know about you, but I don’t watch Battlestar because I want answers. I don’t read stories just to get to some answer about the plot. I read for the characters. I watch Battlestar for the characters. I want to know what happens to Saul at the end, what happens to Adama, all of them. It’s the same as reading a story. Look at Lost. All they’re doing is giving answers and each episode is worse than the last (except The Constant) because all I see are names being pushed around a chess board. I don’t see characters anymore on that show. It’s all plot plot plot.

All I need to know is that the final 5 are the last remaining human-model cylons from Earth, descendants of the 13th tribe that left Kobol. I don’t need anything else. Now I want to see how these characters with all their history react when Ellen returns to them. And Jane, the writer, did that. Beautifully.

If you re-watch that episode as I did today, you’ll see things and feel things you missed the first around.

If you want bland characters with plot driven stories, don’t watch Battlestar. Tune in to Lost.

Sorry, Bad Robot.

36. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

Amazing, utterly amazing.

The complete and utter lack of class of the RDM “fans” towards the fanbase of the Original Galactica.

I shouldn’t be at all surprised, it’s been this way since 2003.

If it was such “cheese” why is it

A: Remade/Re-Imagined in the first place.

B: If RDM is the Genius you all and He claim he is, why is it that he has yet to come up with ONE thing that isn’t built on foundations created by someone else. Just one? Carnival, Based on FREAKS, Deep Space Nine, well, ? GINO and Caprica, Well?!?!?!?!

C: Would you all be so happy if RDM “Had his way” with TOS Trek? Seriously, with FEMALE Spock (aka Klingon Spy) screwing around with a Drug Addicted, angst filled Kirk. Forget about the Silly Pointed Ears and Moe Hair Cut. How about a Female Dr. McCoy. How about Chekov and Sulu as Romulan spies? How about a Love Quadrangle between Kirk, Spock, Chekov, and Uhura. Hey, let’s get rid of the transporters, because that’s not realistic. Make it a weekly show about all the drama inside the Enterprise, rather than that silly 5 year mission thing. Phasers, come on. Replace those with colt 45s, and rocket based missles. Communicators? Now Cell Phones. And the costumes, come on, JC Penneys has much better clothes, right off the rack. And please, that silly insignia, we can replace that with something completely unrecognizable. As for the Klingons, they really are just a Colony from Earth, and it’s just Kirk’s drug addled delusions that makes them the enemy. And last, but not least, we’ll get rid of that Cheesy music, and replace it with Congo drums, and Gregorian chants.

Then we’ll top all that off with “fans” of all that, telling you that the Trek you loved was just Cheesy Crap, not worth the effort, because RDM is a Genius, and you must be some sort of dullard not to recognize that.

37. CystDrone - February 27, 2009

36: What on earth are you talkin about?!?!?!!? I AM A FAN OF THE ORIGINAL GALACTICA. I watched every episode as a kid, had the toys and comic books. However THIS IS NOT 1979. This is 2008..things move on & improve. As someone said Galactica was cheesy even in 1979 and if you think that trailer
for Hatch’s version would have been a success had it been made to the ‘specs’ of that trailer, then you are still stuck in the 70s my friend.
I was not happy about a lot of things they changed for the new version esp Starbuck being a female..but I must say the series has really developed the characters, the story line is for the most part very good and has really shown how you can take an original concept and made it current/fresh.

I only pray & HOPE that JJ has gone a similar route because Trek has been FAILING for many many years because fans like you insist on living in the past. I suggest if you people dont like change, lock your basement door, turn on your TV and replay TOS ad-infinitum and let the rest of humanity move forward. I thought thats what Trek was all about the future..not the PAST.

38. Dennis Bailey - February 27, 2009

#35: “I don’t understand all the complaining about Deadlock. I don’t know about you, but I don’t watch Battlestar because I want answers. I don’t read stories just to get to some answer about the plot. I read for the characters. I watch Battlestar for the characters. I want to know what happens to Saul at the end, what happens to Adama, all of them. It’s the same as reading a story. ”

Exactly so. Absolutely agreed on all points.

#36: “The complete and utter lack of class of the RDM “fans” towards the fanbase of the Original Galactica.”

Because the original fanbase behaved with such “class” toward the people remaking the show, right?

That’s why it was considered perfectly acceptable on *most* BSG fan boards to feature images of Ron Moore and/or Bonnie Hammer with bleeding bullet holes or hatchets driven through their heads.

And don’t cop that “how would you have felt if they had done this to something you cared about” crap. Here’s some news: the kind of behavior engaged in by oldBSG fans on the Internet in 2003 was not only childish, it was despicable. Why does anyone imagine that they should be treated with other than deserved contempt?

And someone will say “oh, that wasn’t me, don’t lump me in there…” Okay, fine. Just stop shooting off your mouths as if this impatient “attitude” on the part of Moore’s fans just materialized sui generis – because either you don’t know or you’re willing to make excuses.

39. Dom - February 27, 2009

Last week’s episode was a weaker one, but I still adore this show and can’t wait till Tuesday (in the UK) to see it!

The potential Larson film can burn in Hell as far as I’m concerned. BSG was made because he was a working producer. BSG 2004 was made because Ron Moore had a great take on the source material. The Larson film will be made for one primary reason: money!

Larson hasn’t worked on anything in a decade and, aside from money, would only want to make this film because he’s annoyed at the Ron Moore show getting all the critical kudos and wants control back over al things BSG. it’s kind of a Gene Roddenberry-in-1987 scenario!

Glen A Larceny’s film would nothing more than 2011’s Battlefield Earth. Universal needs to purchase the movie rights from the ageing Larson so they can exploit the property to its full potential in later years.

Maybe Ron Moore could be persuaded to make a trilogy of films about the first Cylon War featuring a different cast of human colonial characters and the Final Five. It could stand alone and and still fit in with Caprica and BSG!

40. BaltarStar Galactica - February 27, 2009

Re: 36

Armchair quarterbacks such as yourself, need to get a grip.

P.S. I don’t remember RDM ever proclaiming his own genius. And if you listen to his podcasts for each episode, you’ll learn something. That he’s humble, and the first to call out when an episode falls flat.

41. SciFiMetalGirl - February 27, 2009

Ahhhhh…..yes! John Colicos, the original Baltar! His appearance alone would have been worth the price of admission! May God rest his soul.

And ya gotta love Richard Hatch for his caring and devotion to all the small details that made the original series so wonderful in the first place! He still rocks!

42. Steven - February 27, 2009

Never had seen the “Second Coming” trailer. It was pretty cool! I hate that it never came to fruition. But I love the new “Galactica” show, and was glad to see Richard Hatch was a part of it.

God bless!

43. Dom - February 27, 2009

38. Dennis Bailey: ‘the kind of behavior engaged in by oldBSG fans on the Internet in 2003 was not only childish, it was despicable. Why does anyone imagine that they should be treated with other than deserved contempt?’

Hear hear! They still run riot on the web defaming the new show. IMDb is forever having to remove trolling comments. In fact, it’s remarkable how many comments (even ones on this board) are cut and pasted from a template.

I’ve been critical at times of the direction TNG took the Star Trek concept in, but I don’t hate it! Indeed, I bought season one of DS9 the other day to give it a proper shot! Galactica, by the time Ron Moore took it on, had been off the radar for 14 years and, even by the end of the 1980s, seemed very dated (I was between 10 and 15 then!)

The worst thing fans of the old BSG have done is soured my taste for the original show. It’s been sat on my shelf for a year (it was a present) and I haven’t looked at it. Like the Browncoats with Firefly/Serenity who helped grind that nascent franchise into the geek ghetto they have managed to make me feel soiled watching their show.

So sad. So pointless! :(

44. New Horizon - February 27, 2009

I have great respect for Richard Hatch. He came on board the new BSG and really gave that character everything he had. I saw an interview with him on Sci Fi where he said that he played his new character in as Many episodes as he played Apollo in the original. Cool guy. Wish I could say the same for Dirk Benedict, who is still trashing the new show to this day.

I watched the old BSG as a kid, but it didn’t do anything for me. It was far too star wars oriented for my liking…never grabbed me. The new BSG had me from day 1, especially with the season 1 opener “33”…gripping.

45. Paul B. - February 27, 2009

35. BaltarStar Galactica – February 27, 2009
” I don’t understand all the complaining about Deadlock. I don’t know about you, but I don’t watch Battlestar because I want answers. I don’t read stories just to get to some answer about the plot. I read for the characters. I watch Battlestar for the characters.”
****

Same for me–the characters come first–which is why I hated Deadlock. Tyrol’s decision was COMPLETELY out of character (sorry, Mr. Douglas; you play Tyrol wonderfully, but your explanation of his decision doesn’t help because it wasn’t there for the audience). Ellen was back to being uninteresting.

The CHARACTERS were what made Deadlock so rotten. And yes, the plot matters; otherwise, you just have characters sitting around and talking. That’s not very interesting.

And as for your comment:
“If you re-watch that episode as I did today, you’ll see things and feel things you missed the first around.”

Sorry, but I get very tired of this kind of condescension. I have rewatched Deadlock, but no, there is nothing I missed. It’s a rotten, boring, out-of-character episode that upset a HUGE portion of the fan base.

Feel free to like the episode, but please stop telling those of us who disliked it that we are wrong. Stop telling us to rethink and rewatch, blahblahblah…

Just accept that some of us remember when BSG gave us “33” and “Exodus,” and we miss THAT quality–THOSE characters. Maybe we’ll get that back before it’s all over, but so far it looks like BSG is slowly sliding down the drain…

46. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

RE: 37 CystDrone

As for Richard’s Trailer, I absolutely agree. More so than you know. BSG-TSC would have been awesome. Richard created that with his own money, and all the Costumes, Props, and CG Special Effects were done for FREE by many of us committed to returning Battlestar Galactica. All the performers in it were there because they felt as strongly.

And, it was done well before RDM ever touched Galactica.

As for the similarity between the RDM Cylon Raider and the “evolved” Raider in BSG-TSC, Lee Springer (who also headed up the CG Development for RDM’s series) was one of the key people involved with Richard’s Trailer. Had it not been for Lee, RDM’s Galactica would have looked A LOT different. He fought hard to make certain that at the very least, the ships in the fleet did honor the original, even if nothing else did.

No One from the original Fanbase EVER said things had to remain IDENTICAL to the 70s, however, we DID want certain things, things that many Trek fans rightfully guard, such as “canon” be maintained.

The push was always for a Continuation series, with Up to Date EFX, CG Ships, Battle Sequences, etc. Bring the stories up to date, without the confines of the old restrictive Television Code, which Battlestar Galactica was made under. Still maintaining the Space Opera elements (Heros in White Hats, Villans in Black Hats, Rogues, Scoundrels, etc) but adding a level of grittyness and depth. Yes, the original fanbase still wants the Mythology elements, the Tut flight Helmets, the “Chariots of the Gods” hooks, the Ship of Lights. the Lords of Kobol, the societal Noblity, etc.

I’ve always loved the “critique” from the RDM followers who held fast to that “You’re stuck in the 70s” argument. We got hit with all the same arguments that have been coming fast and furious from the fans of the RDM series, only this time AGAINST the proposed Larson (and hopefully DeSanto) Movie version. Now with the added sweetener of “Well, with our new, awesome, wonderful, totally genius version, why would you even bother with that old, cheesy, 70s, crap”

Tom DeSanto was working on a Continuation version of Galactica, that would have taken care of most of the arguments. They were set to start shooting early 10/2001. Then a little incident on 9/11/2001 served to bring that to a halt.

Take a look.

http://www.battlestargalactica.com/newfilms.htm

Then, along comes RDM. The Fanbase gets told we don’t really understand Galactica, or Sci-Fi for that matter, and that what we had fought to see returned was just Cheesy Crap, and that what we were being served now wasn’t the “popcorn” we had before.

The rather over-the-top “re-imagined” Trek description I gave in my previous post best describes what we got.

Now, you may like what RDM did to Galactica, HOWEVER, as a fan of both Trek TOS and Battlestar Galactica TOS, I would have been just as up in arms about someone doing to Trek, what was done to Galactica.

I hope that makes sense

47. weerd1 - February 27, 2009

36- Well, I’m a fan of both shows, but I recognize the original hasn’t necessarily aged well. I don’t think you can compare Trek TOS to Galactica TOS. Trek invented fandom really, and though a core group of fans kept Galactica love alive over the years, it’s never been a part of American culture like Trek- until possibly the RDM version which has people who typically don’t watch SF hooked. As far as RDM’s lack of originality, can you please tell me what original idea Trek TOS or Galactica TOS had? Trek was a remake of “Forbidden Planet” with a healthy dose of Horatio Hornblower, and Galactica was the Book of Mormon in spaceships with some “Chariots of the Gods” sprinkled on top. There are no new ideas, just new presentations.

48. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

RE: 47 weerd1

??? Ah, How about the base Stories. The Characters, The Settings, The base story arcs, etc.

Glen Larson and Gene Roddenberry wrotwe these. They Created them.

True, while the over riding base elements were lifted, such as space travel, the Explorers traveling long distances on a ship, firing weapons, etc.

The bottom line, Lt Starbuck, Captains Apollo and Kirk, or Mr. Spock from the Planet Vulcan were not directly lifted from someone elses work.

RDMs successes seem to all be based upon Characters and Situations created by SOMEONE ELSE.

Someone else, I might add, who doesn’t much like what he has done with them.

49. Dennis Bailey - February 27, 2009

“The Fanbase gets told we don’t really understand Galactica, or Sci-Fi for that matter, and that what we had fought to see returned was just Cheesy Crap, and that what we were being served now wasn’t the “popcorn” we had before.”

I don’t know about understanding “Galactica” but that fanbase sure didn’t understand much of anything else. Yeah, what they were lauding *was* cheesy crap – the sf world dodged several bullets when the Larson and Hatch and DeSanto versions went down the drain, thank God.

Now, maybe when Universal finds someone to run their new Galactica movie project – you know, a contemporary producer to do all the heavy lifting while Larson signs his checks and takes a title – they’ll do something interesting with it as well. It just won’t be oldBSG either, because few people in the business are that clueless.

50. Magic_Al - February 27, 2009

Did some kind of statute of limitations expire to allow that Second Coming trailer onto the interwebtubes? Glad to finally see it. It looks like it could have been an exciting adventure show but I think Ron Moore’s idea proved to be more interesting, most of the time.

51. tman - February 27, 2009

Strict remake of original wouldn’t work (too sappy, unbelieveable for the modern audience) and a movie as dark as the new series I doubt would find a market during a global recession and right after a new Terminator movie and Watchmen. I would expect something in-between, pitched as either Terminator Redemption in space but more upbeat, or a Transformers-like franchise of action adventure in space. Okay, maybe 300 in space would work too…

52. weerd1 - February 27, 2009

So, RDM didn’t create Cavil, Six, D’anna, or Simon? RDM didn’t create the situation of the Cylons being invented by man? RDM didn’t create Odo, or Sisko, or the Dominion’s caste society?

Is changing the name of an archetype creation, or presentation? If I make a Barbarian who starts out as a gladiator, becomes a thief and then becomes a warrior but name him Harvey, how much do I owe creativity-wise to Robert Howard?

Have you seen “Forbidden Planet?” The C-57D is a United Federation of Planets starship in a fleet which conducts scientific and military missions. Now, Roddenberry put his spin, and a darn good one on it, but it’s still quite the lift. We’ll see how Straczynski’s version of FP looks like a Trek rip off…

RDM took parameters and worked within them, just like Roddenberry and Larson did. I am not saying you have to like what RDM has done with anything- that’s personal preference. However the nature of Hollywood is remakes, and like they keep telling me over this new Trek movie, a new version doesn’t make my old DVDs go away. Rarely is Hollywood a question of artistic merit, but of financial viability. Any time I get to see both come together (a successful show which is actually GOOD), I am a bit happy.

As for the Trek reimagining you describe, isn’t that what Roddenberry did with Next Generation?

53. Daoud - February 27, 2009

#25 writes: “this last half-season has left such a sour taste in so many of our mouths”

How many mouths ya got on you? You like one of those “count how many eyes are in this image” on Facebook? Speak for yourself, not all of fandom.

#46 writes: “No One from the original Fanbase EVER said things had to remain IDENTICAL to the 70s, however, we DID want certain things, things that many Trek fans rightfully guard, such as “canon” be maintained.”

We? How many of “you” are there? You got copies of yourself like a humanoid Cylon? (Which by the way, were in the original Galactica, lest you forget Andromus.) The “original” “F”anbase? What exactly was that? The ratings were decent, but we’re talking about 30 years ago. Any ‘adult’ fanbase would be members of AARP. I don’t think AARP members care much about this. I was 15, and a big fan of OS Galactica. But I don’t dare to speak for ‘all of FANDOM’. I speak for myself, and I like both old and new. The old was the “seventh age of man”, and the new is the “eighth or later age of man”. With Galactica, both versions can exist.

#48 Why All The Capital Letters? I Love a Throwback to the 1700’s Myself. Why I Was Just Talking With Benjamin Franklin about This.

So, did you know Larson swiped material from ideas from Adam(a) and Eve, to Noah’s Ark (hence Adam’s Ark), to the Greek Pantheon (Athena, Apollo, etc.), to the Zodiac, to the Egyptian (Iblis), and countless other themes that already existed, not to mention the Lords of Kolob [sic] and much other Latter-Day Saint material? Adama’s just Joseph Smith leading the Mormons to that shining Deseret….

If you can’t stand the new BSG… why in the hell are you in this thread?

54. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

RE:53 Daoud

“Better Let On Wrest, Mind Eternal”

At the beginnings, the message is clear.

55. Dom - February 27, 2009

Jake Callahan: ‘Tom DeSanto was working on a Continuation version of Galactica, that would have taken care of most of the arguments. They were set to start shooting early 10/2001. Then a little incident on 9/11/2001 served to bring that to a halt.’

Seems you are all over the web! ;)

DeSanto and Ron Moore are on good terms, FYI.

None of the Galactica revivals would have worked, because the source material was low quality.

Harry Knowles (who eventually came round to watching Ron Moore’s show and admitting it was good, after being part of the GINO crowd!) said that the best idea for a remake would be, rather than remake something successful, to remake killer ideas that had underachieved and failed to live up to their concept.

Unquestionably the story of the human race being wiped out and the survivors trying to get by is a good one. But the execution of the original show was lousy. 20 billion people get wiped out, so everyone parties at a disco?!!!!!

Baltar, the arch traitor, is a lip-smacking cliche who gets to run a basestar?!

The original BSG was an underachiever that barely registered with most people. In a month’s time, we’ll have a complete Battlestar Galactica show with a beginning, a middle and an end. And for anyone who comes to the new show (and complete series sets are very popular) it’ll be that show alone that holds the interest.

PS. Sorry, but while the Richard Hatch trailer can’t be faulted for its enthusiasm, it’s awful!

56. tman - February 27, 2009

From the actors on the DVD I wonder if Caprica will even work.

57. Paul B. - February 27, 2009

53. Daoud – February 27, 2009
#25 writes: “this last half-season has left such a sour taste in so many of our mouths”
How many mouths ya got on you? You like one of those “count how many eyes are in this image” on Facebook? Speak for yourself, not all of fandom.
***

Daoud, I didn’t try to speak for “all of fandom,” as the line you quoted clearly shows. If you have paid any attention to any discussions of “Deadlock” you know that MANY FANS (not “all”) really disliked the episode. Thus, my comment about a bad taste in “our” mouths is both logically and grammatically sound.

And it clearly stated that I was NOT trying to speak for all fans–otherwise, I wouldn’t have used the word “many” (which is obviously not “all).

Feel free to love the show, and feel free to disagree with me, but please do not accuse me of taking a position I clearly DID NOT TAKE.

58. Daoud - February 27, 2009

#57 Oh puh-lease. “Feel free to love the show”? Why would you come into a preview BSG article if you aren’t looking forward to the episode?

“Many of our mouths” is ludicrous. You’re attempting to speak for everyone who agrees with you? You were elected to this post? Fascinating. Is it some “Congress of Gino”? Your comment isn’t ungrammatical, it’s fallacious. It’s called “argumentum ad populum”. Claiming to speak for many is the same fallacy as speaking for all. Unless you’re Chang and Eng (or as they say in tlhIngan Hol, chang’eng), you speak for one person.

59. Paul B. - February 27, 2009

58. Daoud – February 27, 2009
#57 Oh puh-lease. “Feel free to love the show”? Why would you come into a preview BSG article if you aren’t looking forward to the episode?
“Many of our mouths” is ludicrous…/ [blahblahblah…]

Daoud, you’re obviously here just trying to get into arguments. Your attacks on me are pointless. There was no fallacy in any of my statements, nor did I try to speak for everyone.

Observing that a shared opinion exists is not the same as speaking for everybody; if you can’t see the distinction…well, that’s your problem.

If I said, “NOBODY liked the episode,” then you’d have a case. If I said, “EVERYBODY loved Cally,” you’d also be able to complain. But your attempts to undermine my ACTUAL statements have no merit.

As for why I’d come to a preview article, yes, obviously I’m looking forward to the episode. That does not preclude disliking that PREVIOUS episode, nor does it mean that I have to like this episode. I have loved a huge amount of BSG, and I have hated a large amount. It is a very uneven show, as MANY fans have publicly stated.

Now, you can either act like the adult you claim to be and stop your pointless attacks, or you can waste your time by continuing your unfounded sniping. Either way, I have nothing further to say to you.

This forum isn’t for petty arguments with the likes of you, and I think I can safely say that NOBODY wants to see anything else being said between us. (As I’m sure the other posters would agree.)

Feel free to have the last word–preferably a nice, “Sorry, Paul”–but to be honest, I don’t give a frak.

60. OM - February 27, 2009

…Amazing. And here we’ve been told for years that Mafi…er..”Union” issues prevented Hatch from releasing the trailer except for the occasional showing at conventions. This is either a pirated copy, or Hatch has said what we all should say to the Unions – “FRACK YOU!” – and released it, knowing that the fans are more important.

61. OM - February 27, 2009

Dennis Bailey babbled:

“That’s why it was considered perfectly acceptable on *most* BSG fan boards to feature images of Ron Moore and/or Bonnie Hammer with bleeding bullet holes or hatchets driven through their heads.”

…Keep in miind, Dennis – and the rest of you – that had it not been for the severe outcry over the reports of how Bonnie “Bimbo” Hamner was going to reimage BSG, we’d have wound up with not the Ron Moore version we got, but a rehacked, regurgitated knock-off of The Starlost. Remember, Bonnie was bragging about there not being a Battlestar in her version, but a “ship of domes”. Again, had it not been for BGOS fans screaming for her head, we’d have gotten something that would have killed the franchise.

Bottom line: Just because someone’s doing something offensive does *not* mean you cannot offend them back, especially if it’s the only way to get across to them that they’re totally fracking up.

62. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

RE: 60 OM

The legality issues aside, I don’t think Richard had anything to do with it’s release to youtube. He has been very clear that legal issues with Universal kept him from doing much beyond showing it at conventions, and to the myoptic suits at Universal (who, thankfully, are no longer with Universal after NBC took over the reins).

Truth be told, I’m happy it finally got released, however it got released.

I imagine it won’t be up long, unless of course, Universal is trying to get a feel for it’s reception, before making Official the announcement regarding the new Larson./(???)DeSanto Movie.

I’m very hopeful DeSanto does stay attached to the project, as his Production of Battlestar would very much please both the Old Fanbase, as well as the New. He has a great love for the material, and a great eye for what will work with today’s audiences.

The Pre-Production Animatic material, as well as the Set Designs, Props, Ships, Costumes were right on the mark for an up-to-date Continuation.

The Script was airtight, and really moved. It was a good mix of Original Characters, and New Characters which you’d expect from the format.

Also, not a Disco Song, or Television Code friendly cliche to be found.

While not as dark as the RDM series, it still maintained the mythology and Sci-Fantasy.

63. Dom - February 27, 2009

61. OM: ‘Just because someone’s doing something offensive does *not* mean you cannot offend them back, especially if it’s the only way to get across to them that they’re totally fracking up’

Grow up!

64. Dom - February 27, 2009

62. Jake Callahan: ‘I imagine it won’t be up long, unless of course, Universal is trying to get a feel for it’s reception, before making Official the announcement regarding the new Larson./(???)DeSanto Movie.’

Whoa! Big assumptions! A rumour that’s been denied and you’re already citing producers?

What a shame all those grotty little troll boys who had finally been overriden have come back on the basis of an unsubstantiated rumour!

With luck, the Larson BSG movie rumour will simply die!

As it stands, it’d be another reboot anyway, so the weirdoes who sacrifice virgins and drink their blood under an altar with a the poster reference photo for the original movie are going to get something different again.

With luck, it’s simply a rumour about Universal trying to buy up Larson’s movie rights!

* (y’know the one: it has Greene, Hatch and Benedict pulling silly faces while firing battery torches)

65. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

RE: 61 OM

Also, don’t forget, had it not been for the outcry over the First version of RDM’s script, there would have only been the Planet Kobol, no 12 Colonies, (which also meant No Caprica)

The Galactica itself would have been akin to a long rectangular box with gigantic engines, dotted with Domes.

Remember Bonnie’s famous line regarding her idea of Sci-Fi programming “Phasers set for Fun”.

I suppose one could expect no more from the woman who made the Lifetime Network movie formula.

66. sean - February 27, 2009

#39

Dom, you’ve spoken so much truth in this thread I’m considering creating a religion around you.

“The potential Larson film can burn in Hell as far as I’m concerned. ”

I’m with you buddy.

67. Eric Holloway - February 27, 2009

I would love to see Richard Hatch’s version of BSG. Make it a direct to DVD series of movies or release it on HD Network. I would think that even the Sci-Fi channel would give it a chance since some of their other choices are, shall we say questionable. I mean considering how many versions of Stargate are out there, they should give this serious consideration. If they don’t want to insult Ron Moore set it before Caprica. I’m just spit balling here but I think there is room for both because I love both, amny do. The one thing I don’t understand from the new version is why we never saw any aliens. I’m sure there is an explanation to that but I never heard it.

68. weerd1 - February 27, 2009

67- The Cylons were aliens (lizards who later became robots), as were the Ovion in the pilot/film.

Straight to video would be the way to go. That way those who are clamering for it can get it- those who have an interest in it can get it- and the vast majority who will say things like “they made Starbuck a man?” can ignore it and the studio not loose a lot of cash on distribution.

69. weerd1 - February 27, 2009

68- …Or lose a lot of cash. I guess they could loose it too, but might never get it back when it runs away.

70. Mike Ten - February 27, 2009

I’d love to see the original Galactica back in the theaters. I saw it on TV and then in the movie theater with the surround sound. It was a amazing experience, when the Galactica was on the screen the theater shook like a earthquake was happening. I’d pay to see more, but it has to have better FX than what was in that trailer which was made 10 or 20 years ago?

71. Dom - February 27, 2009

Wow! It’s really weird to see an orchestrated campaign arrive on Trekmovie! All those little dweebits getting called away from molesting their younger sisters in their basements in an attempt to portray an interest in reviving the original Galactica.

Sad!

72. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

RE: 71 Dom

Wow Dom, that was the best you’ve got?

73. sean - February 27, 2009

Sorry, to bottom line it here, but the original Galactica just wasn’t very good. It was an attempt to cash in on Star Wars, period. It had some interesting ideas, but few of them were ever carried through in interesting ways. It was canceled for good reason. The entire reason people rave about RDM’s BSG is it took a silly and short-lived bit of 70s sci-fi cheese and turned it into a serious consideration on the human condition and the world we live in. To reverse that accomplishment and return it to its corny origins would make little sense.

74. Dom - February 27, 2009

72. Jake Callahan

Well, in my defence, it beats any one-liners in the whole of the original Battlestar Galactica! :p

Jake, pal, you don’t normally post here, so why don’t you and your sad little friends go back to trolling Galactica forums rather than spreading your vulgar little hate campaign to this site, eh?

There are STDs more pleasant to experience than the bleatings of the bring-back-the-1970s-Galactica brigade!

The brigade is not wanted and not needed!

75. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

RE: 74 Dom

Sorry to hear that STD is bothering you. You know, a short set of antibiotics should clear it up before you suffer any additional brain damage.

You really should be careful where you stick that little soldier of yours.

As for whether “the brigade” is wanted or not, hey, it’s a public board. You want me banned, talk to the Admin and get me banned, til then, I think I’ll be here for awhile.

As for “Bring back the 70s” Sorry Junior, no one has suggested that, except you.

76. Dom - February 27, 2009

75. Jake Callahan: ‘Sorry to hear that STD is bothering you. You know, a short set of antibiotics should clear it up before you suffer any additional brain damage.’

I shall, of course, defer to your greater experience of the subject!!

‘You really should be careful where you stick that little soldier of yours.’

At least my little soldier is capable of standing to attention! For that matter, at least I have one! :p

‘As for whether “the brigade” is wanted or not, hey, it’s a public board. You want me banned, talk to the Admin and get me banned, til then, I think I’ll be here for awhile.’

Cool! Then you’ll get to realise just how detested your parasitic little campaign is! You’ve been a boil on the backside of the science fiction fan community for most of the decade. The campaigns run by ‘fans’ of the original Galactica have been the most disgusting ever perpetrated by the science fiction fan community and that includes certain Doctor Who fans who, love ‘em or loathe ‘em, can make bitchiness an art form! You’re an unrepresentative embarrassment, although I’ll grant you you have made a colossal amount of noise for such a tiny archive TV interest group!

‘As for “Bring back the 70s” Sorry Junior, no one has suggested that, except you.’

Um, I didn’t!

77. OM - February 27, 2009

Jake Callahan:

“Also, don’t forget, had it not been for the outcry over the First version of RDM’s script, there would have only been the Planet Kobol, no 12 Colonies, (which also meant No Caprica) “

…Agreed. The fan outcry over “BattleStarlost Galaxitive” as it was being called made sure that quite a bit of Bonnie’s crap ideas were left not on the cutting room floor, but flushed down the toilet. I suspect one day we’ll finially get a “Making Of” book that’ll give us a breakdown of all of Bonnie’s little retarded ideas for BSG so we can all laugh once again at her bimboness, while at the same time shudderiing at what could have been had she not backed down to the fan uprising.

“The legality issues aside, I don’t think Richard had anything to do with it’s release to youtube. He has been very clear that legal issues with Universal kept him from doing much beyond showing it at conventions, and to the myoptic suits at Universal (who, thankfully, are no longer with Universal after NBC took over the reins).”

…I got the impression that it was “officially” released. With this in mind, I strongly urge everyone who wants a copy of this to grab YouTube Downloader and download the clip before some schmuck at Universal files a bullshit DMCA notice and makes YouTube take it down.

Speakiing of schmucks:

Dom blathered:

“Grow up.”

…This coming from the self-confessed socially diseased(*) schmuck who’s trolled this thread worse than anyone else? If anyone needs to do any growing up, it’s you, Dom.

(*) Q: How do the antisocial contract social diseases? By hire?

78. OM - February 27, 2009

“Wow Dom, that was the best you’ve got?”

…Probably. Syphallis can be as devastating as Alzheimer’s when allowed to go untreated.

79. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

RE 76: Dom

Glad you’re so proud of the little guy. I’m always happy when someone gets enjoyment from their short-comings.

I’m glad I make you so uncomfortable, but you really need to make up your mind, either I’ve been here forever making your world a living hell, or I just got here and must leave.

Either case, as I said Dom, since you are such a Leader in your vast Pro-RDM community, I’m sure you have the way to get the Admin here to ban me, so please Junior, step up to the plate

80. Dom - February 27, 2009

78. OM: ‘…Probably. Syphallis can be as devastating as Alzheimer’s when allowed to go untreated.’

I watched my Grandmother die of Alzheimers! Sarky banter and VD jokes are one thing. That’s another. I think you owe me and everyone here whose seen someone they love die of Alzheimer’s and apology.

You wouldn’t go making jokes about cancer victims . . . or would you? Alzheimer’s is no different!

81. Dom - February 27, 2009

79. Jake Callahan: ‘Glad you’re so proud of the little guy. I’m always happy when someone gets enjoyment from their short-comings.’

Never had any complaints yet.

‘I’m glad I make you so uncomfortable,’

You don’t!

‘but you really need to make up your mind, either I’ve been here forever making your world a living hell, or I just got here and must leave.’

I really don’t care that much! You’re a minority interest group within a minority interest group! You guys shout anywhere outside of the forum, the rest of the world shrugs!

‘Either case, as I said Dom, since you are such a Leader in your vast Pro-RDM community, I’m sure you have the way to get the Admin here to ban me, so please Junior, step up to the plate’

Far be it from me to tell Anthony what to do! But you’ll find most people here read your words and those of your sick pal OM, who resorts to jokes about incurable degenerative diseases, with contempt.

82. Jake Callahan - February 27, 2009

RE: 81 Dom

Sorry Dom, I’m not the one who brought up your STD, I figured since you brought it up, it was fair game.

If I am such a minority, as you claim, why have you wasted such time and energy on me?

Surely, if I am such a small fish in your infinite pond, there are others you’d be happier talking with, especially considering, as you insist, that what we are in favor of is such a universally hated concept.

83. Colonel West - February 27, 2009

to slightly change the direction this thread is heading and to avoid possible warnings that might appear on the horizon like a nuke launched at caprica city what’s everyones thoughts on Caprica?

I’m kind of in the middle myself, leaning towards the looking good side. I have my reservations about Espenson as show runner though, shes a great writer when marshalled but the last thing i want to end up with is Dallas set on Caprica, “No Caprica Six, I was just taking a shower…” springs to mind!

As for the cast, I’m pretty happy with it, Esai Morales was absolutely brilliant in his run on NYPD Blue and the line from the teaser “our family’s name is Adama” could have been Eddie Olmos himself in it’s delivery.

not to mention the possibilities of crossovers from the skinjobs or even one or two of the final five would be great. I’d watch Michael Hogan act all day, if ever someone deserves an award of some sort it’s him.

84. Dom - February 27, 2009

82. Jake Callahan: ‘Sorry Dom, I’m not the one who brought up your STD, I figured since you brought it up, it was fair game.’

Wasn’t complaining about that. Your pal OM’s the one who took things a step too far. I see he doesn’t have the balls to apologise!

‘If I am such a minority, as you claim, why have you wasted such time and energy on me?’

No waste of energy! I’m quite chilled out thanks!

‘Surely, if I am such a small fish in your infinite pond, there are others you’d be happier talking with, especially considering, as you insist, that what we are in favor of is such a universally hated concept.’

Well, you guys do have a habit of talking as if you’re the majority. You’ll find, reading back through the timeline of this site that most people here are fans and the 1970s Galactica brigade have generally not impinged on our party much.

As has been pointed out before in the Galactica articles: ‘If you are not a fan of the show, then why are you even reading this far down into this post? There are plenty of Trek stories so just move on. Any flaming of BSG will be considered trolling.’

You’re not a fan of the show, so what are you doing here?

85. Dom - February 27, 2009

83. Colonel West: ‘to slightly change the direction this thread is heading and to avoid possible warnings that might appear on the horizon like a nuke launched at caprica city’

Yeah, good idea!

‘what’s everyones thoughts on Caprica?’

Can’t wait!

‘I’m kind of in the middle myself, leaning towards the looking good side.’

The trailers and clips have got my juices flowing. BSG has been a great look at the remains of a civilisation after its downfall. Caprica is like looking at Rome in its heyday!

‘I have my reservations about Espenson as show runner though, shes a great writer when marshalled but the last thing i want to end up with is Dallas set on Caprica, “No Caprica Six, I was just taking a shower…” springs to mind!’

Yeah. The boxing match episode was amazing. I think she’ll be fine as a showrunner. I remember her going all the way back to Buffy, where she wrote some of the smartest, funniest episodes.

‘As for the cast, I’m pretty happy with it, Esai Morales was absolutely brilliant in his run on NYPD Blue and the line from the teaser “our family’s name is Adama” could have been Eddie Olmos himself in it’s delivery.’

Definitely! We’ve heard so much about the great Joseph Adama that it’s going to take a heck of a performance to live up to his reputation. He also looks like a dead-on match for the father of the young Bill Adama in Razor!

‘not to mention the possibilities of crossovers from the skinjobs or even one or two of the final five would be great. I’d watch Michael Hogan act all day, if ever someone deserves an award of some sort it’s him.’

Dubious about Final Five appearances. They don’t show up until the war is in full bloom, IIRC, so that’s a few years on from where Caprica season one is set. If the show jumps a few years here and there or there’s a cinema movie based on Moore’s Galactica, which (given Moore’s multi-movie deal and Universal’s attempts to bag the film rights) remains a possibility, the Final Five would be big players in the story of the first Cylon War!

86. OM - February 27, 2009

“I watched my Grandmother die of Alzheimers!”

…Yeah, and you had a cousin named Billy Joe Jim Bob who died in the War, too. I’d tell you to pull the middle leg because that feels bettter, Dom, but considering your confessed issues with STDs, I wouldn’t want to risk catching anything from you.

…As for an apology…don’t hold your breath. I don’t apologize to trolls. Ever.

87. OM - February 27, 2009

“Either case, as I said Dom, since you are such a Leader in your vast Pro-RDM community, I’m sure you have the way to get the Admin here to ban me, “

…And the line forming to second this will no doubt be long.

88. King Of All Blacks - February 27, 2009

i am incredibly disappointed in the previous 2 episodes if the final season.

I’ve resigned myself to the fact that the only episodes that matter are the 3 hour series finale “Daybreak”.

Next weeks episode “Islanded in the Stream” will supposedly answer EVERYTHING.

89. Dom - February 27, 2009

86. OM: ‘…Yeah, and you had a cousin named Billy Joe Jim Bob who died in the War, too. I’d tell you to pull the middle leg because that feels bettter, ‘

Actually my great uncle died on the deck of a ship in WWI. He wasn’t called Billy Joe Jim Bob, though! There have been quite a few members of my family who served in the military.

FYI, my grandmother would have been 84 yesterday. She was diagnosed in 2002. I helped care for her, even as her vocabulary and stability collapsed. By 2003, she no longer knew any of her family’s names. In 2004, she took to disappearing when my exhausted grandfather was trying to sleep. My grandfather looked after her as much as he could, although it destroyed his hip lifting her out of the bath. I looked after my grandfather’s general state and became very close to him. By the end of 2005, she didn’t even know she had a family.

In 2005, my grandfather went to hospital for an emergency hip replacement. My grandmother collapsed while he was in there and spent two weeks in hospital before she died. I’ll never forget the smell of vomit, excrement and urine coated with antiseptic. He wasn’t allowed to see her because the hospital had an MRSA outbreak. The last sight he had of his wife of 60 years was her banging on the window of the care facility begging him to take her home.

He never recovered from that and died last year. Trust me, if you’ve been through it, you don’t joke about it! I might throw remarks around about a lot of things, but not that.

‘Dom, but considering your confessed issues with STDs, I wouldn’t want to risk catching anything from you.’

Never confessed to having ever had an STD, but boy! did you jump on that wagon fast! No discussions about Larson’s film. No, STD STD STD! Real hobby horse there! Along with catty remarks about everyone who disagreed . . . sorry . . . ‘blathered’ at you!

‘…As for an apology…don’t hold your breath.’

I’m not. You make jokes about incurable diseases that kill old people.

‘I don’t apologize to trolls. Ever.’

I’ve been on this site from day one. If I was a troll, I’d have been banned in the dim and distant! I like this site and have a good time here. This is a Battlestar Galactica (2003) discussion page so I’m here to discuss that. Why are you here?

90. Mike - February 27, 2009

I’m never NOT shocked by the immaturity displayed here.

91. Dom - February 27, 2009

Hey Mike! Sorry! Sometimes stuff just gets out of hand!

I’m off to bed! :)

92. AJ - February 27, 2009

I check the threads here via the “COMMENTS” link, and I’m appalled at the exchange here.

I never liked the cheap SW knockoff version of BSG, but I lurk to find a reason to watch the new one. Didn’t find one today. Just two a*sholes in a pissing contest.

93. dep1701 - February 27, 2009

Wow, I’m totally going to stay out of the flaming here and ask, did anyone else notice the snippet of Stu Phillip’s “Exploration” theme played by the ‘piano man’ as he tries to star working on the ‘second movement’ of his piece? Then, Kara accuses him of plagiarism… what a great joke!

Also loved the “felgercarb” toothpaste. On original BSG, felgercarb was basically a euphemism for “bullsh*t”.

I love it.

94. lodownX - February 27, 2009

Great episode tonight… hands down one of the best of season 4.5.

try to argue that… I’m sure someone will find a way.

95. OM - February 27, 2009

Dom squealed like a stuck hog:

“I’ve been on this site from day one. If I was a troll, I’d have been banned in the dim and distant! I like this site and have a good time here. This is a Battlestar Galactica (2003) discussion page so I’m here to discuss that. Why are you here?”

…In order…or, in your case, that’s odor:

1) Who cares? Doesn’t give you the right to be a troll.

2) You’re a troll, Every single reply you’ve made in this thread proves it.

3) No, this is a Star Trek website based on the thread/reply forum model, and happens to have a BSG thread relating to the latest episode.

4) You’re not here to “discuss”, you’re here to troll and flame.

5) I’m here because I want to be. Not that you can do anything about it.

…Anyway, you’re off to bed. Do us all a favor and stay there.

———————

In an attempt to ignore Dom’s trolling, dep1701 posted this:

“did anyone else notice the snippet of Stu Phillip’s “Exploration” theme played by the ‘piano man’ as he tries to star working on the ’second movement’ of his piece? Then, Kara accuses him of plagiarism… what a great joke!”

…You’d be surprised how few apparently got the gag. On a couple of other forums and on a couple of usenet groups, quite a few of the regulars were going “Duh…huh?” Still, great joke.

96. Rhett Coates - February 27, 2009

#93 – YES, I DID, TOO! That two-note musical “theme” was THE SAME TWO-NOTE BEGINNING of the original BSG series theme INTRO, just before the dialogue, “….there are those who believe that somewhere beyond the stars, there are tribes of men who even now….” began. This was the opening Voice-Over, with crazy zodiac-like patterns generating on a star-field background during it – with that same attention-grabbing, two-tone intro:)

“da DAAAAAA…….”

And then, the full BSG theme would begin with opening credits. Hmm….. Now I’m REALLY wondering where Ron & Co. are going with this new take on the series! What does that song have to do with the Cylons, and how did Kera’s father know it at all? And just what does the child have to do with all of this – how could she create that specific image (stars?) in a simple picture? (Or did I miss something important there, because I was so stunned by the implications? Ron?) ‘Only a few more episodes left to find out, I guess….

97. Jax Maxton - February 27, 2009

Man, I love this show.

I will agree that last week was not a banner episode for BSG, but this week made up for it. Nowhere in all of TV will you find a show that can say so much in such incredible ways. Last night’s ep was another terrific character study, the kind that BSG does so well. At the same time the plot was driven forward by these character’s tales and the emotions they’re experiencing during the episode.

I believe that BSG is the most mature Sci-Fi to ever make it to the small screen. The Sci-Fi elements are more than just show or ways to make a point, but integral to the story being told. The entire chief/Boomer story used the idea of projection between mechanisms to tell a love story that seems to be continuing, yet was also used as a way to get Hera for Cavil. At the same time, it still shows the Cylons immaturity with love because Boomer used that love in such a devious way.

In every season, BSG has always stopped to take a long breath before continuing on to the big end-of-season episodes. This season is no exception. But, like music, it’s sometimes the breaths and the slowing down that make the show interesting and get viewers involved in the story.

Right now I’m torn, because I want to know the answers, yet I don’t want to see the end of my favorite characters and their stories. I think we’re in for a bumpy few weeks.

98. Requiem1971 - February 27, 2009

Ok tonight’s episode…. WTF? I never noticed Starbuck talking with any piano player before. Was he even really there? I kind of thought he was and then when Starbuck is confronted because she played a toon one the piano that the other Cylons knew, her piano player buddy is gone. So, Boomer had to make it with Halo…. LOL, all in front of his girlfriend too. So Boomer grabs Hera and takes off to parts unknown, leaving the Galactica damaged from jumping right next to it… what a hoot there. I don’t know about anyone else but NOTHING was answered for me here. I know next week is another stand alone episode, I pray it’s better than tonight’s.

99. Dave Gilmore - February 27, 2009

#36 – You hit the nail right on the head about all the things I dislike about RDM’s Galactica series. One of the things that I have found hardest to swallow about his version of the show is that the characters, who are supposed to be from a completely different part of the universe, all look, talk, act and dress like contemporary 21st century Americans. Now maybe if they were heading from Earth to some other planet I could accept it much more readily.

100. Gary Seven of Nine - February 27, 2009

I LOVED BSG TOS When I was a kid and I love the the new show as well.

However, while the original BSG has a place in the SCi-FI world, I can’t help but think that if Star Wars and CHiPs had a one night stand in a Studio 54 bathroom stall, they would have given birth to the original BSG.

Considering that BSG is about the people who are left after billions were killed in a nuclear attack, the dark dramatic tone is appropriate.

101. VOODOO - February 27, 2009

Ron Moore’s BSG is the greatest tv program of any genre ever made!!!

102. Rocket Scientist - February 27, 2009

90. Mike

I’m never NOT shocked by the immaturity displayed here.

______________

LOL! When you consider that the most important things in some people’s lives is that the make-believe characters on the imaginary spaceship behave in accordance with their wishes…well that kind of explains things, doesn’t it?

103. steve623 - February 27, 2009

Wow, what an unpleasant load of garbage this thread rotted into.
Feh.

104. Skagen - February 28, 2009

hahah… Ok, well not that I expect many more comments on this thread after all of that, BUT, i would like to say that tonight’s episode was spectacular. Nicely done! A little spoiler to anyone who makes a conscious effort to avoid the previews at the end for the next episode: The one shot of Adama siting up against a wall covered in..something?.. really grabbed at my heart and lead me to believe that this story is going to be relentless in its honest conviction of where this all inevitably going. presumably the destruction of BSG and its crew. It’s going to be painful to watch the next final episodes. I so wish this show had continued for years and avoided all of the forced convoluted story lines that this season produced out of hurrying up to the conclusion. I hope there is one little glimmer at the end of the series that could suggest that BSG could be picked up again for another season or so years from now.. but everything seems to suggest this story is closed book in a month.

105. Charles H. Root, III - February 28, 2009

Humans are Cylons, Cylons are Humans, all the ships blow up and everybody dies at what we think is the end, but after ten seconds of black screen and silence we see a Lorne Green look-a-like as the original Adama wake up from a really fracking crazy dream.

Then, as he pulls his bedsheets down, he discovers a Cylon head under the sheets in a puddle of hydraulic fluid. He hears someone at the door and looks up. The screen goes black and we hear “The Final Countdown”

That’s it… You now know the truth, suckers.

Who cares if RDM is a genius or not. BSG is clearly one of the best TV series ever produced.

So everyone play nice in here and be grateful that Dino De Laurentiis, Bad Robot or me didn’t get our hands on the BSG franchise.

is it just me or did BSG not really show Earth in a way we can confirm that it is, in fact, Earth. I didn’t see any identifiable land or water masses from space… And while on the planet none of the ruins could be identified by recognizable landmarks.

106. TrekMadeMeWonder - February 28, 2009

No gripes here. Good episode last week. Missed tonights.

33. Commodore Lurker

I completely agree. What’s up with the 8 day wait for the online show SciFi?
I wonder if the advertisors realize this. And just how much is a spot on SciFi’s Full Episodes page anyhow?

107. Dom - February 28, 2009

Yeah! Sorry for soiling myself and the thread with that exchange last night!

Trekmovie isn’t normally the place you get sucked into those sort of arguments and I got caught up out of a certain naivety. When the insults start flying, it’s all too easy to try too keep one-upping things. I should’ve shaken my head and walked away!

The above exchange is the reason I don’t post on any other fora: they’re way to full of nasty people saying nasty defamatory things, be it about Ron Moore, David Eick, Bonnie Hammer or Graham Williams.

I apologise again for the above argument and for the fact and should know better than to get involved with the ‘GINO’ hate brigade.

I hope last night’s episode was great and please everyone show your love for Ron Moore’s briliiant show here! Me? I’m off to work: I actually have a life beyond all this . . . somehow! ;)

Catcha later!

108. McCoy's Gall Bladder - February 28, 2009

Best Episode ever!

Starbuck is completely cracked!

Boomer is totally evil!

The Ship is falling apart!

Roslyn is dead!

“One express elevator to Hell, going down!” Hudson, Aliens

109. McCoy's Gall Bladder - February 28, 2009

It’s just because I’m old, and I’m feeling nostalgic, but I miss when spaceships were made of wood and plastic and were something real you could hold in your hand and not just CGI imagination fairy dust.

110. sean - February 28, 2009

#109

Spaceships have *always* been made of fairy dust. Doesn’t matter whether it’s held together with plywood or CGI.

Besides, the inside of the Galactica is made of, ya know, wood and metal and stuff. ;)

111. Paul B. - February 28, 2009

So, which five humans and/or Cylons are going to survive? It seems like that’s the direction they could be going–just like the “Final Five” are all that remains of Earth.

Ellen’s made a point of the whole “Imagine there were just five of you left” idea; Edward James Olmos has emphasized that they are left with almost nothing; it fits the “happened before/happen again” idea.

I think only 5 characters–a mix of humans and Cylons–will survive. Just not sure who.

112. Jax Maxton - February 28, 2009

111. Paul B.

i think about 12 will survive and become the “NEW” Lords of Kobol and rebuild humanity.

113. JimJ - February 28, 2009

Star Trek has TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY, and ENT. Their fans debate to this day which was the best, what they like the best, etc. Some like Roddenberry Trek, some like Behr Trek, some like B& B Trek, some like Piller Trek, some like Moore Trek, and others yet will like Abrams Trek. Some will like them all, some will like half, some a third, etc. Fact of the matter is, if there is room for that many different kinds of Trek to co-exist in a mostly peaceful environment, why can’t the BSG fans do the same instead of tantruming on a Star Trek website, of all places?!

I’m actually a fan of ALL BSG versions up to this point. Yes, Galactica 80 is pretty darn awful, but I can find a few gems in the coal. I’ll admit I liked the original the best because I just thought it was a lot of fun and I’ve always been a huge Lorne Greene fan…but… The new Galactica IS groundbreaking. Did I like all of the changes? Not one bit, but they have shown that they can make something quite special if people put aside their expectations from the past. I’ll admit, though, I don’t watch the new one anymore. I got lost on the soap opera story line when I had surgery a few years back. I have purchased all of the dvd’s and plan to watch the glorious first season all the way to the very end some time soon (maybe this summer). I’m sure I won’t be disappointed.

My point is, I bet if Larson (or Hatch, for that matter) ever got to make their newer versions, I’d like them, too. Probably for different reasons than liking the Moore version, but still…… My message to BSG fans, why not try and enjoy it all, let it all be a success? The more people you bring to “your favorite BSG universe”, the more that may check out the other versions. it’d be a win-win situation.

114. Paul B. - February 28, 2009

112. Jax Maxton – February 28, 2009
111. Paul B.
i think about 12 will survive and become the “NEW” Lords of Kobol and rebuild humanity.

That’s possible, too. Of course, the way they’ve written the show, anything is possible. Judging from the last few episodes, I’m expecting a soap-opera finish involving a cheesy wedding, lots of catfights between hot women, a table of food and drink getting knocked over by brawling groomsmen (all Leobens, probably), and a final gunfight that leaves everybody lying in pools of blood…

But yeah, either 5 or 12 will live through it as a new FF or LOK…or something really, really stupid will happen.

115. McCoy's Gall Bladder - February 28, 2009

Yeah they’re really cranking up the stupid factor in the “Final Episodes”

I want to see Baltar and his Hot Chicks with Guns doing something.

I really liked Kara’s trip into her own head. Who was she talking to when she was playing the piano? We all know that her dad wasn’t really there at all.

I love Kara because of how crazy she is.

WTF was with the feet closeup though? Was Levar Burton directing?

I’d like to see Quentin Tarantino’s BSG. He’d know what to do with the girls with guns.

116. McCoy's Gall Bladder - February 28, 2009

Sean, you take the fun out of everything :(

I was referring to the BSG: Second Coming trailer

117. ML31 - February 28, 2009

Good God… Why oh why would ANYONE want to do the original version of BG? It was crap in the ’70’s and BSG:T2ndC would have been even more crap. Especially when we have the EXCELLENT version that Sci-Fi has been airing.

I repeat.. The original Glen Larson Battlestar Galactica was crap, crap, crap spam and crap. Crap that is best forgotten.

118. Dom - February 28, 2009

113. JimJ

I don’t think anyone particularly has an issue with a reworking of Galactica in the future. It’s simply that, with the current incarnation not even finished, it’s too soon. There also has been a very nasty web campaign run against the 2003 show for a number of years.

These things need space to breathe – preferably at least five years, much as Star Trek has done before its overhaul which fans will see as an alt-universe and the public as a prequel! And BSG should be another complete revamp if it is done over, not a loop back to the original.

I mean how do you sell a return to the 70s version? Imagine the conversation:

‘This is a Battlestar Galactica film.’
‘No it’s not related to the TV series.’
‘Yes it is based on a TV series, just not that one!’
‘Actually, it’s only based on season one of that TV show, but not season two!’
‘Oh yes, I know it was called Battlestar Galactica too! It was actually called Galactica 1980 at first, but most episodes were renamed Battlestar Galactica in the rest of the world . . . but it still isn’t “proper!” The way to watch out for it is when all the actors change, Lorne Greene gets a false beard and Apollo and Starbuck are replaced with a couple of lookalikes!’
‘Yes I know Starbuck showed up in the last episode.’
‘No, the Earth stuff doesn’t count, but the lost Starbuck stuff might!’
‘Yes, they did have a fight with a basestar in our solar system at the end of season one.’
‘No I don’t know why they didn’t notice the lunar landing and spent another 11 years looking for Earth, but that doesn’t count anyway!’
‘No, Razor and The Plan are movies based on the 2003 show!’
‘Yes I know there’s a show called Caprica, but that’s a prequel to the 2003 series, not the 1979 series, which our movie’s based on. It’s not based on the 1980 series – which was based on the 1979 series – either.’
‘I’m sorry, did your head just explode?’

Galactica, is in a parlous legal state where potential brand confusion could bury the whole thing. Battlestar Galactica (2003) was a complete remake and it’s run far longer than the original and has a proper ending. The original BSG faded away through cancellation. Had Galactica 1980 not happened it might be easier, but that just adds another layer of confusion! People only vaguely remember the original show because of the Cylons (even then mostly because one walks past Dirk Benedict in the opening titles in The A Team!) and they confuse Starbuck with Faceman – not surprising since they’e basically the same character!

When a TV show with the name Battlestar Galactica has a complete run, beginning, middle and end, it’s bound to become definitive. A sane person would build on the modern show’s very solid foundations.

And also Richard Hatch is established in most BSG fans’ minds as Tom Zarek now (and he was frakkin’ great in that role, better than as Apollo!) Could most people really go back to watching him play Apollo after seeing him as Zarek? It would be as laughable as Dennis Franz playing the corrupt Sal Benedetto in Hill Street Blues, then playing good guy Norm Buntz less than two years later in the same show! Hatch, for all his attempts to bring back the original show was more than happy to move on!

In the same way that it’s unlikely we’ll see a return to the Star Trek: TNG universe after Star Trek 2009, there would be massive brand confusion at this stage with yet another separate Battlestar film so soon.

I mean look what a mess some franchises with good ideas have got into because of rights issues and over-saturation of conflicting films and shows:

Highlander is a great idea, moderately well put together in the 80s movie, followed by two Godawful versions of a sequel, an unrelated third film, an ultimately very good TV show, a fourth film based on the TV show that loses everything that was good in the TV show, a fifth film that was supposed to be the first of the ‘Source’ trilogy, which was a disaster, an unrelated cartoon series and another unrelated anime. Finally, they’ve decided to go the live action remake route!

The Exorcist is the same: three versions of the original, with the CGI-enhanced ‘George-Lucas-ised’ version now regarded as definitive by the filmmakers and the 1973 and 1999 ones buried, with only TVYNS being released on Blu-ray, two versions of Exorcist II, a massively-compromised ‘official’ sequel to the original film called Legion in its lost proper version and Exorcist II in its butchered version and two different versions of the same prequel with much the same story, different screenplays and different directors, but most of the same cast. Destination: confusion.

Terminator has two ‘official’ films, a TV show sequel to the second film which just about can co-exist with the third film which was also made by new rights holders, if you factor in the time travel issues, and a fourth film which is made by yet more new rights holders that is a sort of follow on from T3 and is yet another alt-universe from the TV show.

End of the day, this Galactica rumour is more about legal disputes over ownership and control of disparate elements of a thirty-year old property than any desire to make a good film.

People get overly passionate about this stuff (and, boy oh boy! did I ever let myself get baited after a few beers at the pub last night!) but even in a remake-obsessed Hollywood, hopefully some sort of common sense will endure!

Or not! ;)

119. Dom - February 28, 2009

Correction:

‘a massively-compromised ‘official’ sequel to the original film called Legion in its lost proper version and Exorcist III in its butchered version’

120. JimJ - February 28, 2009

Ok, that’s weird: where’d all the comments go?

121. JimJ - February 28, 2009

Oops, ok, computer glitch, they all now appear again. My bad!

122. Dom - February 28, 2009

121. JimJ

I’ve been getting that a lot with Firefox 3 lately. I’ve been having to ditch personal data to read the comments. In one case, it was annoying last night because one of my earlier more crass remarks was never even supposed to get sent! I thought I’d deleted the remark but, in reloading the page for the umpteenth time obviously managed to click the send button! I went about other stuff, put Firefox back on and . . . oops!

Firefox 3 is in serious need of a bug-fixing update!

123. sean - February 28, 2009

#116

Oh, I’m sure I could never take the fun out of complaining – you enjoy it far too much! ;)

124. sean - February 28, 2009

Personally, I really enjoyed last night’s episode, and it was a considerable improvement upon last week. Anything focusing on poor Chief Tyrol is always welcome, for me. It’ll be interesting to see if Sharon was lying or truly is still in love with him. And why would Cavil want Hera, other than as a bargaining chip for Helen to rebuild resurrection tech? How many Cylons are actually left out there after the civil war? And was Kara’s father really ‘Daniel’ before Cavil boxed him for good? Could that explain why he disappeared and never returned?

125. McCoy's Gall Bladder - February 28, 2009

I just like how cracked Kara is. Do you kids still use words like “cracked” & “bonkers” or “looney toons” ?

In any case, I still say the entire series is a dream in an autistic kid’s head, ala ‘St Elsewhere’

And baby Kara is that kid. More than likely it’s Hera since she never speaks.

And when you’re old, complaining is all you’ve got ;)

Damn kids, get off my lawn ;-P

126. GaryS - March 1, 2009

Heras Drawing isnt just musical notes,
Its a STAR CHART!
Its the key to finding her.

127. thebiggfrogg - March 1, 2009

105. I think in a podcast RDM said that the view of Earth after the end of Kara’s return was a view of North America. I don’t recall the image myself, but I seem to remember him defending that image of Earth, because if they CGIed a view of Earth showing Asia or Africa most of the audience would not be able to identify the planet as Earth. Given the dismal geographic knowledge of we Americans he is probably correct.

128. McCoy's Gall Bladder - March 1, 2009

Hey frog,

Dont paint us Americans as ignorant.

Try asking anyone else in the world where anyone else is and you’ll get the same result.

It’s human nature to only be concerned with your immediate local self.

129. sean - March 1, 2009

#125

I’ll be honest and say I do use the word ‘bonkers’, but I am usually greeted with odd looks when I do so. I also say ‘golly’, ‘bajesus’ and ‘the cat’s meow’.

Also, wasn’t the wreckage of the bridge on Earth pretty much identical to the Brooklyn Bridge? I thought they made a clear implication that wherever they landed had at one time been NYC. I seem to remember someone making a comparison shot, but I don’t know where it is.

130. Paul B. - March 1, 2009

128. McCoy’s Gall Bladder – March 1, 2009
Hey frog,
Dont paint us Americans as ignorant.
Try asking anyone else in the world where anyone else is and you’ll get the same result.
It’s human nature to only be concerned with your immediate local self.
*****

Sorry, McCoy, but as an American myself, I have to agree with “thebigfrogg.” I’ve worked with plenty of non-Americans who were very well-versed in world geography, whereas most of the Americans I know can’t find the Middle East on a globe–much less Iraq or any other place we’re dabbling in.

Want more evidence of American ignorance? When the Olympics were in Atlanta, there was a news story about a man from New Mexico (my birthstate) who called the 800 number to order tickets. The phone rep said they couldn’t handle “international sales” on that line and tried to transfer him. After arguing, the NM guy got a supervisor on the phone.

The supervisor’s reply? Something close to, “Sir, old Mexico or new Mexico, we just don’t sell outside of America on this line.”

This was echoed by a report in 1989 showing that something like 3/4 of graduating high-school seniors that year thought you needed a passport to visit New Mexico.

Still not enough? How about the guy who worked next to me when I answered phones for Yamaha in California–a guy who couldn’t find TEXAS or NEW YORK on a map and who repeatedly sent American callers to overseas numbers because he didn’t know that Ft. Lauderdale and other such places were in America.

Yeah, most Americans are woefully ignorant about world geography, and about our OWN geography.

131. Dom - March 1, 2009

I was at a US themed pub quiz in London last Thanksgiving and I knew more than the Americans!

Not all Americans are like that though! The again, given the US has every possible climate, flat land, mountainous land or whatever, why would you want to know much outside the US? Youve pretty much got everything there!

132. McCoy's Gall Bladder - March 1, 2009

Paul, where were you when I said pot smoking high school drop outs who have no other skills than playing xbox are the ones flying predators?

133. ed - March 2, 2009

Ummmm–I believe you have to be an officer to pilot the predator. At least that’s what I was told for the Air Firce. That means college.

Even if you don’t, you need at least a high school diploma to join the u.s. military. I know that for a fact.

But having a degree doesn’t mean anything. Check out Jay Leno talking to the college kids on Jay Walking. Or listen to our politicians.

Someone told me a story about her kid having to write a report on a famous American in history. The kid said he was going to write about Davey Crockett. The teacher suggested he write about Daniel Boone instead because the assignment was to write about a “real american, not a fictional one.” Yikes, I thought. With teachers who don’t know that both men were real, no wonder this country is in the mess its in.

134. McCoy's Gall Bladder - March 2, 2009

Well to be honest, Davy Crockett was a tv show and David Crockett was a Tennessee legislator and Hero of the Alamo.

In any case, we should stop teaching to a formatted multiple choice “test” and get back to the 3 r’s

Enough with the politics, bring on the blood & guts!

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