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Five Page Preview Of Star Trek Countdown #4 Comic March 26, 2009

by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Comics,Star Trek (2009 film) , trackback

The final issue of the hottest Star Trek comic book ever arrives in comic shops next week. IDW have sent TrekMovie the first five pages of "Star Trek Countdown" #4 to get you started. So check out these spoilerific pages to the ultimate Star Trek movie prequel, and maybe learn something more about the movie.  [SPOILERS]

 

Star Trek Countdown #4 – 5 page preview
(click images to enlarge)

The fourth issue starts off right after the issue 3 cliff-hanger, with General Worf of the Klingon Empire leading a fleet against Nero (now tattooed) and his Narada, newly enhanced with Borg/Romulan-tech.

 
 
 
(Star Trek Countdown #4 cover & first five pages – click to enlarge)

Pre-order Countdown #4 or the TPB
Countdown #4 comes out April 1st (available in comic shops and via the Android and iTunes). If you have been buying the individual comics, it is a good idea to pre-order issue #4 at your local comic shop or TFAW.com. The official release date for the Trade Paperback is April 7th for book stores and Kindle II (April 8th for comic shops). However, Amazon has sent it to some pre-order customers. Currently Amazon does not list it as ‘in stock’ so you can pre-order and you will likely get it sometime in the first week of April.

Countdown #4
@ TFAW

Countdown TPB
@ Amazon

$3.19
(April 1)

$12.23
(April.7)

Nero M.O.? – get the captain?
[MOVIE SPOILERS]

There is an interesting parallel here with the Star Trek movie. During the attack on Vulcan (as seen during the 20-minute press preview in the Fall), Nero (Eric Bana) demands that Captain Pike (Bruce Greenwood) go over to the Romulan ship, the Narada. Many of the scenes from the trailers show the orbital skydive of Kirk (Chris Pine), Sulu (John Cho), and Olsen (Greg Ellis) where they are jumping from a shuttle. That shuttle is being piloted by Pike on his way to the Narada (after Pike put Spock in command and deemed Kirk first officer).


This shuttle is being piloted by Captain Pike, on his way to the Narada

This ‘come to my ship’ demand that he gives Worf and Pike seems to be part of Nero’s modus operandi, and could explain where Captain Robau (Faran Tahir) is during the attack on the USS Kelvin, and why first officer George Kirk (Chris Hemsworth) was ‘captain of a starship for twelve minutes.’


George Kirk in command of the USS Kelvin…where is Captain Robau?
 

Comments

1. cpelc - March 26, 2009

Nice – went to my comic store today just to check and see if they had recieved the TPB yesterday by accident. No such luck.

THis is what I wrote March 18, in the thread from Countdown 3

SPOILER THEORY
I’m thinking that when Spock attempts to implant the red matter he runs into Nero and the Narada. Spock is successful in creating the black hole, but it effectively sucks both his ship and Nero’s in throwing both into the past.
Nero, with his plans to destroy Vulcan in his present thwarted, decides to destroy Vulcan in the past. In the movie he is trying to drill and collect decalithiumin hopes to recreate the red matter and return to his own timeline.

Hoping to see if some of it is coming true….

2. Jared Butcher - March 26, 2009

I have to say that I have never been a fan of Star Trek comic books in the past. Despite being both a Star Trek fan and a comic book fan, but this limited series has been some of the best comic book material I have read in a long time.

3. Alex Prewitt - March 26, 2009

It’s too bad the artist didn’t have photo reference of Michael Dorn as Worf.

4. Mr. AtoZ - March 26, 2009

Interesting…indeed.

5. cpelc - March 26, 2009

I’m wondering if this is the big Klingon battle that Bob Orci said they had to cut out of the movie….

I remember it was either him or JJ that said it was something like 40 Klingon ships destroyed.

6. Sean4000 - March 26, 2009

Oh my God, he better not off Worf!

7. Newman - March 26, 2009

Worf is my boy. He will mess you up.

I have to agree with #3. It is a poor resemblance of Michael Dorn.

8. The Governator - March 26, 2009

My, this is an interesting plot. Just when I thought it couldn’t get any more interesting.

9. Sean4000 - March 26, 2009

This comic is the first I have ever read since the TMNT Mighty Mutanimals.

10. Peter N - March 26, 2009

Looking forward to my birthday next week – which will include a stop at the comic store!

11. cpelc - March 26, 2009

Maybe Worf does a little ear-trimming on Nero

12. Sean4000 - March 26, 2009

Happy early Birthday Peter N!

#11: I’m thinking the same thing.

13. Chrono - March 26, 2009

I haven’t picked up the individual issues in favour of getting the trade (glad to see each issue sell out) but the wait is killing me. I’m so glad IDW is releasing the trade so soon after the fourth issue.

14. The Governator - March 26, 2009

5. cpelc

*SPOILER THEORY*

I bet you’re right, because part of the movie is suppose to take place in the 24th century, so it makes sense. My assumption is that the movie will begin in the 24th century and show Nero in the prison, his escape, going back in time, etc. Either that, or they show all the 24th century stuff in a flashback and the movie begins with the attack on the Kelvin. J.J. likes to do stuff like that.

15. freezejeans - March 26, 2009

It looks like today IS a good day to die, at least for Worf. Hopefully he goes out in a blaze of glory and takes down half of Nero’s crew.

16. AJ - March 26, 2009

Anthony:

These are not spoilers, as Bob Orci has refused to claim “canon” on your site no less.

17. AJ - March 26, 2009

14:

I think the “Rura Penthe” years must be those conveniently spent by Nero & Crew as Kirk grows up in the 23rd century.

No?

18. DJT - March 26, 2009

Hotness! I am so buying the TPB.

19. The Governator - March 26, 2009

16. AJ

Did you read the WHOLE article? Its labeled as “spoilers” because of possible hints towards the plot of the new movie, not because of canon issues.

20. Anthony Pascale - March 26, 2009

there are actually two kinds of spoilers, there are comic book spoilers…like worf, then there are the spoilers in the bottom section talking about Pike and Robau.

21. AJ - March 26, 2009

Read it again.

Let’s see how it pans out!

AJ

22. Dustin - March 26, 2009

My guess is that the Kelvin captain is killed. And George Kirk takes command of the Kelvin as the last man to try to keep Nero busy so he doesn’t go after the evacuation shuttles.

Maybe Nero is going after the Kelvin to try to stop Kirk from being born?

I just dont understand why Kirk is that important to Nero.

23. S. John Ross - March 26, 2009

This has been a good comic; I’ve enjoyed it. But man, the individual issues have felt so skimpy.

24. The Governator - March 26, 2009

22. Dustin

That was my original thought.

25. Aaron R. - March 26, 2009

Worf gets Neros ear I bet!!!

26. Aaron R. - March 26, 2009

Worf goes Mike Tyson on Nero… what a thought

27. Kevi - March 26, 2009

I wonder how Michale Dorn is going to react when someone tells him his characters been off’ed in the prequel comic when they inevitably ask him about his thoughts on the new movie.

and Dustin nero blames spock for not preventing the devistation of romulus’s populace and the death of his wife and for that he wants to really hit’ em where it hurts so hes going after his closest future friends and family as a way of making him as lonely as he is.

28. Rick Moyer - March 26, 2009

I found these comics on iTunes (like you said) and downloaded them for only 99 cents an issue. My ipod touch does a great job presenting them! I can’t wait till April 1st for the next one. WOO HOO!

Great books by the way.

29. Chris Fawkes - March 26, 2009

I would like to see them take some story telling risk and kill off a major character like Worf. I’m wondering though if it is Worf who captures Nero and takes him to Rura Penthe.

30. Kevin - March 26, 2009

Well with the ear thing it looks like he gets nero aganst a wall, and just narrowly got him with his fighting blade on the right ear, But I wish you we’re right Chris but its looking grim for worf in this universe.

31. Deebo Shanks - March 26, 2009

I didn’t remember that this book wasn’t canon–has it really been stated that it’s not intended to be canon?

The comic has indeed felt rather skimpy, of course I probably would have preferred a movie leading up to this movie! Haha

32. Kevin - March 26, 2009

It just hit me… Star Trek is cool again. Life is good!!!

33. Simon - March 26, 2009

Looks good.

One nit: Klingon disruptor blasts are green.

The ships appear to be a new type of Bird of Prey, kind of like the new Raptor they are planning for the MMO.

34. thorsten - March 26, 2009

Good point, Anthony.

He will tell Pike in the orbit of Vulcan “You will surrender on behalf of the Federation”

Maybe the Narada has a guest room where all the captured captains hang out together and are forced to watch Romulan soap reruns…

35. Trekkie88 - March 27, 2009

Borg/Romulan technology? This reminds me very much of William Shatner’s “The Return.” They should have made a movie of that book when it was written!

And why did Worf leave StarFleet? I hope they don’t kill him off. They have no respect for anyone that has come before.

#3: Is it not obvious by now that JJ & crew really don’t care what the people who played the characters originally looked like, or played the character like?
ie: Kirk is now blond & Pine based his acting on Harrison Ford, not Shatner.
Nero doesn’t look like a TOS or TNG Romulan, he looks more like a wrestler, & he has no olive skin, & from what I have seen of the trailers he doesn’t have a typical Romulan personality either.
Simon Pegg looks nothing like Scotty, & I have a feeling that he is just going to be used as comic relief, & not as the genius miracle worker that Jimmy Doohan made him famous as.

Other than the cosmetic mistakes, I think it will be a good yarn!

36. Steve - March 27, 2009

35. I think you should put all that aside and enjoy the movie.

37. Chris Pike - March 27, 2009

Today IS a GOOD day to die!!!!!!!!

38. Will_H - March 27, 2009

Worf as a Klingon General makes that look like a bad fan fic

39. Italian Guy - March 27, 2009

#17

I agree.

40. David - March 27, 2009

Worf comment about the Romulans trick to fire through cloak was abit odd considering the Scimitar in Nemesis did it.

Also, looks like the Remans didn’t get a mention when their planet got destroyed by the supernova as well.

41. Commodore Redshirt - March 27, 2009

re: 32. Kevin, you said
“It just hit me… Star Trek is cool again…”

Am I SO un-cool that I thought it has ALWAYS been cool? :)

42. Capt Mike of the Terran Empire - March 27, 2009

I think we may see a small battlr between the Enterprise E and the B and the narada. But they escape and spock was able to go and chase them with his ship. But thats just my thery.But i do believe no matter what we will see the Enterprise E in the Movie.

43. Daoud - March 27, 2009

Perhaps this is a different man with the same name? Worf, NOT son of Mogh but instead Worf, son of Some Other Dude?

44. Christine - March 27, 2009

” … The fourth issue starts off right after the issue 3 cliff-hanger, with General Worf of the Klingon Empire leading a fleet against Nero (now tattooed) and his Narada, newly enhanced with Borg/Romulan-tech. …”

What?! Borg technology? Oh, snap.

Now, of course, at the end of the movie, our youngen crew of the Enterprise will be victorious, but… daaaaaang. If they’re incorporatin’ this Borg technology thing into the movie, then we’re gonna have a heck of a fight! :D

#41 :: “… Am I SO un-cool that I thought it has ALWAYS been cool? :) …”

Nope! :3 I felt the same way after seeing TWOK for the first time. x3

45. Selor - March 27, 2009

A shame that I will have to wait till end of April… (sometimes I hate international releases of such things… especially german ones… no Star Trek Kellogs (we still have those Clone Wars extra Lightswords…), no single Comics to collect only the Collection in April… etc. etc.)

46. SonOfMogh - March 27, 2009

I am so disappointed in all of you. Where’s the love and support for the Son of Mogh? You honestly think Nero is going to get the best of Worf? Did you read the last thing he said?! “Klingons NEVER surrender!” Never in BOLD. Worf has something crafty up his sleeve that’s the only reason he’d agree to Nero’s terms. He is not going to get “off’d”, he’s Worf and dying at Nero’s hand is not a good day to die. One way or another I think he’ll come out on top and Nero will come out SCHOOLED. He will take that filthy Romulan down!!!

“Grr…ROMulans.” – Worf in Generations

47. Artrek - March 27, 2009

I received my copy of Countdown from Amazon a few days ago and of course have read all four chapters. It has added to my anticipation for the film, which I did not think possible, but it did!

48. harris250 - March 27, 2009

Could be that Nero is going after Kirk because he learned that Kirk stuffed the Romulans so many times in the past.

49. DEMODE - March 27, 2009

Ah man…. how badass would it have been to start the movie with General Worf fighting the Romulans??? Missed opportunity for a fantastic nod to TNG, if you ask me!

50. Mr. X - March 27, 2009

Kill of Worf and I’m gonna be angry.

51. thereare4lights - March 27, 2009

when you get into a black hole, you’re torn to atoms not sent back in time. duh.

52. Mr. X - March 27, 2009

And how many times will we have that lame “Oh no, they can fire while they’re cloaked!” thing.

That was excellent in Undiscovered Country. It was absolutely lame in Nemesis. And now it’s totally annoying.

53. WhatInBlueBlazes?! - March 27, 2009

You’d think that something as large and sprawling as the Narada would be relatively easy to hit, even while cloaked…

54. uss cowbell - March 27, 2009

Yeah, I’m thinking Worf may get the best of the Nero. After all, we do know that Nero winds up in Rura Penthe at some point…a Klingon prison.

A few minor gripes but overall this series has been giving good cowbell.

55. Mike Stivic - March 27, 2009

It was really stupid for IDW to prepare to release Countdown on the 25th, for Amazon to be shipping it, and then to pull back a week when some people already have it.

56. CaptainRickover - March 27, 2009

I bet Worf will send Nero to Rura Penthe.

57. Jay El Jay - March 27, 2009

Heroes dont live forever guys…. offing Worf would be a good move

58. SonOfMogh - March 27, 2009

I hope Worf schools Nero AND eats some of his ear.

Filthy Romulan.

59. Mr. X - March 27, 2009

But not in a friggin’ comic, Jay!

60. Twelve - March 27, 2009

Star Trek XII Hybrid Sequel: TFB + TNG!

Possible Cameos: Old Kirk, Seven of Nine, Q, Guinan!

61. Kirk's Girdle - March 27, 2009

Three options:

Worf flies over to the Narada in a shuttle packed with explosives – quite possible.

Worf flies over and challenges Nero to armed combat and wins – seems unlikely, since Nero doesn’t seem to give a damn about honor and would not allow his plans to be jeapordized in such a manner.

Worf flies over and orders his ships to open fire on the Narada as it’s shields are lowered to let him in (or some similar deception). He then either boards the ship and captures Nero or the situation forces Nero to retreat (I’m not sure when Rure Penthe fits into the plot).

As for Kirk: He may not have been the intended target of Nero’s actions at all. The Kelvin may have simply been in the wrong place at the wrong time. But something causes Nero to time jump at least twice, and if not the Kelvin, and Kirk, then I’m not sure what that is.

62. Ensign Ro- (short for Roland) - March 27, 2009

I find it odd that some fans are claiming this comic series to be “non-canon”. These events take place after we last saw the TNG crew…or any Trek crew for that matter. Seems to me this is fresh story writing territory and what is being written is new, continuing “canon”. Just my opinion.

Bring on May 8th…I truly am getting anxious.

63. Husher315 - March 27, 2009

Just to point out, it has been said that at some point during the movie, Nero is in Rura Penthe, the Klingon Prison. Maybe Worf succeeds….

64. Jefferies Tuber - March 27, 2009

If Worf walks away from this alive, it’ll be with Nero and without the Narada.

Y’all have to admit, “You’re boring me, General” could be a line straight out of Kirk’s mouth in TWOK

65. Closettrekker - March 27, 2009

Would Worf not be happy to die in battle against such an enemy? I mean, as long as he gets his shots in first?

Isn’t that what TNG/DS9 made the Klingons all about?

I mean—did they not become snarling cavemen in space who eat live food, howl, sing opera, and can’t wait to die in battle for glory and a sense of “honor”?

I wonder if chewing off a piece of Nero’s ear is an act which is “worthy of song”….lol.

66. Rich G - March 27, 2009

27: I wonder how Michale Dorn is going to react when someone tells him his characters been off’ed in the prequel comic when they inevitably ask him about his thoughts on the new movie.

There’s an out for it. You’ll see. (does not involve changing history, etc)

67. Chris Pike - March 27, 2009

painting torpedoes, that’s the way around those pesky cloaked ships…!

68. The TOS Purist aka The Purolator - March 27, 2009

#65 – Closettrekker, that was an EPIC post. I can’t tell you how hard I laughed at that – it’s so true!

Don’t forget that not only did they become cavemen in space who eat live food, but they eat live WORMS.

69. thorsten - March 27, 2009

@37…

yes.

70. WhatInBlueBlazes?! - March 27, 2009

34 –

And here I was, thinking that Nero wouldn’t be so much depraved as desperate…

71. John from Cincinnati - March 27, 2009

What about the people that go see this movie who haven’t seen Star Trek before and haven’t read these new comics? Will there be a prologue in the movie to bring everyone up to speed?

72. DGill - March 27, 2009

#34

Yeah, they probably have to watch “The Enterprise Incident” again and again and again…Shatner’s acting in that episode alone would drive any man insane! :D

“Kill meee….Kill meeee!”

73. John from Cincinnati - March 27, 2009

57.

Here here! If they can off Jame T. Kirk by falling off a bridge, they can certainly off anyone in any way.

74. Antni - March 27, 2009

i wonder also if when the Captains go over to Nero its also a way for Nero take out his anger on them for the death of Romulus like he may give them an epic beating then kill them.

75. Shane - March 27, 2009

60.

What’s TFB?

76. Planet Pandro - March 27, 2009

#74 Antni

That could be…and since Pike winds up over there, I wonder if he’s beaten very badly by Nero, but before he’s killed possibly Kirk and Spock arrive in time to save him. Thus, ending up paralyzed and futuristic-wheelchair bound. I know that’s not how it happened the 1st time through, but since this is an altered timeline you never know. And didn’t Bob Orci say that they’re honoring the interprtation that the universe tends to order itself a specific way…even if timeline events change, things often end up in similar circumstances, if not exactly they way they were before.

Of course this is mere speculation on my part…

77. RAH - March 27, 2009

I am betting TFB is The Future Begins!

78. ucdom - March 27, 2009

#75

The Fudge Balaclava

Keep up!

79. Kaiser The Great - March 27, 2009

Why is Worf always working for the Klingon Empire in the future? He’s Starfleet, dagnabbit!

80. Closettrekker - March 27, 2009

#68—Definitely always been an area where you and I are in complete agreement.

:)

81. starfleetmom - March 27, 2009

Got mine 2 days ago! I pre-ordered from amazon.
:-)))

82. I'm dead Jim - March 27, 2009

71 – In a previous post from another thread, Bob Orci said that the movie goers would get some back story but it would be different. I don’t know if he meant a different story or just much less detailed than the Couuntdown comics.

83. Lord Garth, Formerly of Izar - March 27, 2009

Ahhhh please for the love of god no more Bird of Prey!!!!

NO MORE I SAY!!!!!!

Boy Worf is a crappy tactician

84. Rich G - March 27, 2009

61:

none of those happen. Worf does not exactly come off very good in this. Nero makes reference to studying Worf’s databank file…and says he has found his weakness.

85. Electron - March 27, 2009

first!. couldn’t help myself

86. Electron - March 27, 2009

well, I thought I was first. You guys respond quick

87. Daoud - March 27, 2009

#62 Agreed… Actually Orci essentially did everything right to the edge of calling Countdown ‘canon’. He did say he wanted us to be the judge of that, and not he and the staff (a/k/a Supreme Court).

I think we should for once accept Countdown as canon in the sense of the story as it’s portrayed happens as canon, just the dialogue might not be exact.

I’m not pushin’ for an Expanded Universe Memory-Gamma type Trek Universe, but just an Alpha-Plus version. Oh well….

Only one more frackin’ month… it’ll be out in Sydney by this time next month.

#65 I think the Klingons can be “explained” in that the “cure” for the Augment Disease overshot the mark just a bit. Perhaps it regressed the Klingons a bit more than it should have. The lesser-bumped Klingons such as Chang and Gorkon seemed to have more of the best of both types of Klingon.

If O&K get Kirk-era Klingons in the sequel… I hope they don’t open a can of worms and go with a Kor/Kang type Klingon. Maybe just a hint of head bumps (somewhat like Colicos’ forehead actually looked) and just stick with the Augment idea which in retrospect made a helluva lot of sense.

88. Daoud - March 27, 2009

^Read that in 87 that I hope O&K “don’t open a can of worms and NOT go with Kor/Kang types”.

89. Christine - March 27, 2009

#87 :: “.. Maybe just a hint of head bumps (somewhat like Colicos’ forehead actually looked) and just stick with the Augment idea which in retrospect made a helluva lot of sense. …”

Yeah, ’cause remember, it wasn’t all the Klingons that were affected by the strain, only like.. half, or whatever. :3

90. Shatner_Fan_Prime - March 27, 2009

#87 … “I think the Klingons can be “explained” in that the “cure” for the Augment Disease overshot the mark just a bit. Perhaps it regressed the Klingons a bit more than it should have.”

Wow, that’s really reaching.

91. Jeyl - March 27, 2009

Eric Bana vs. Michael Dorn.

Ooo. That’d be epic.

92. Perry Wilson - March 27, 2009

As one of the (few? many?) who already received the Countdown:TPB from Amazon, I will avoid going into too many spoilers, and just pose a couple of questions:

1) Will they do a sequel series to this, set in the 24th century, and show us that Worf recovers? Because, although he is still breathing, it sure didn’t look survivable! It reminded me of a scene in “Aliens” (you’ll know which one when you see the artwork)…

2) Is “red matter” going to play as much of a deus ex machina role in the film? Of course, Trek is famous for wrapping things up very quickly in the last few minutes… but this was very quick.

3) Apparently Nero and Spock have no idea that the singularity will take them back in time, so when exactly is Nero going to decide to use this discovery to do nefarious deeds? How long will it take Spock to figure it out and realize he has to stop him?

93. The Governator - March 27, 2009

92. Perry Wilson

I know you don’t want to spoil things to much, but does Rura Penthe play a role in #4 or is that something we will see in the movie only?

94. Closettrekker - March 27, 2009

#83—“Ahhhh please for the love of god no more Bird of Prey!!!!

NO MORE I SAY!!!!!!”

Amen to that.

TSFS really screwed that one up. It never should have been a Klingon ship to begin with.

Painting ships “like a giant bird of prey” was established early on in “Balance Of Terror” as a tradition of the Romulan Star Empire, as was the “cloaking device”—which suited the mystery that surrounded them.

Neither should have ever become a staple of the Klingon Empire, which is far better represented by heavy battlecruisers, IMO.

#87—My problem with the TNG-era Klingons was never their physical appearance, but their behavior and demeanor. TOS-era Klingons were seemingly far more evolved than their 24th Century descendants. They were as cunning and well-spoken as they were ferocious and brutal. Intellectually, Klingon officers like Commander Kor and Kang were every bit the equals of their Starfleet counterparts, and more than worthy adversaries for Captain Kirk.

I think the mistake in TNG with regard to the Klingons was probably taking Kruge and his men (IMO, what was most likely intended as a “rogue” band) as a model for Klingon culture, which Ron Moore expanded upon in a poor direction.

…The endless singing, heavy drinking, howling, growling, silly rituals, and the ridiculous obsession with “honor” was always a turnoff to me.

Kor (“Errand Of Mercy”) and Kang (“Day Of The Dove”)…Now *those* were Klingons.

Even the deviant Kras (“Friday’s Child”) and the snivelling Koloth (“The Trouble With Tribbles”) were memorable characters.

95. DGill - March 27, 2009

#94

General Chang was a cunning villain.

96. AJ - March 27, 2009

94:

Closet:

I have identical sentiments.

The Klingons got stupid when Riker boarded their ship in “A Matter of Honor.”

I didn’t mind the two dudes and the Captain from “Heart of Glory,” but Klingons simply were later retconned into drunk buffoons. When DS9 brought back Kor, Koloth and Kang as new-style Klingons, it was a shame they had to use the mannerisms of DS9 Klingons (Though Michael Ansara made me smile in his cameo in VOY).

In TOS, Klingons are cunning and devious. They are vicious occupiers and murderers, and their society relies on internal surveillance to maintain order. They have no qualms about mass murdering populations with particle weapons. They also respect a worthy opponent, but the deathwish mentality to “die in battle!” is a later add-on. “A thousand throats may be cut in one night by a running man” is not the saying of a bloated latter-era Klingon, but of a cold and efficient killer.

It’d be great to return to that.

97. AJ - March 27, 2009

95:

Yes, Chang was old-school (and well-acted).

98. Steven - March 27, 2009

Looks great. Can’t wait to get my copy. I’ve pre-ordered both Countdown #4 and the Trade Paperback. At least the wait between comics won’t be too long now.

God bless!

99. Paul from Florida - March 27, 2009

I got the countdown today. I preordered through Amazon. This will make the movie so much more understandable.

100. Bay Area Nick - March 27, 2009

Here’s a review of Countdown TPB: http://groknard.blogspot.com/2009/03/ot-review-of-star-trek-countdown-tpb.html . No big spoilers

101. Jorg Sacul - March 27, 2009

I have to agree.. the TOS Klingon captains were some serious bada$$es. I always wondered, do you think Kirk and Kang hung out together after the alien was banished from the ship? I could SO see the two of them slugging back Saurian brandy, and parting company as (if not begrudging friends) at least respected adversaries. Probably why Koloth was sent to gum things up at K-7… the Empire knew Kang wouldn’t be such a sneak with Kirk.

Just thoughts… can’t wait for May 8th!

102. Shane - March 27, 2009

I really have to disagree with the characterization of Klingons that has been presented as being found in TNG and DS9 (and, to some degree, ENT).

We saw many instances of just the sorts of things which have been portrayed here as lacking in the later series. In fact, ENT presents a rather interesting comparison to make. In ENT, Klingon society is depicted as being based on rather animalistic, irrational concepts, and we see a dramatic difference by the time of TNG.

For example, honor is regarded as very important to the Klingons. While it was not per se mentioned specifically in TOS, we can certainly see the idea of honor being important to one degree or another, most notably in the case of Kang. By the time of TNG and DS9,honor is likewise important to Klingons, but with one big difference from ENT: the idea of honor that these future Klingons have is much more, well, honorable. To Worf, Martok, and their contemporaries, there is no honor in defeating an inferior opponent. To quote Archer’s advocate in his trial, honor, to 24th century Klingons, is earned.

Certainly, we see a fair share of growling, throwing food around, and that sort of thing in 24th century Klingons, but do we not see the same in segments of 20th century human society? Why is it not unreasonable to assume that in Klingon culture, there are those who live as did the men on Riker’s exchange program, and there are also those who live as did Worf, Gowron, Martok, et al? There is in every society the group of those who are, perhaps for lack of a better term, “more civilized,” and the group of those who are less.

Is the distinction between Martok, Gowron, or Worf and the crew serving under Riker really that different from the difference between Kang, Koloth, and Kor and the “everyday” Klingons who insulted Kirk and picked a fight in the bar on K-7? I propose to you that men like Martok were where they were because they were more distinguished then men like those howling in the galley of the Klingon cruiser. This also calls to mind an important point: there are plenty of instances of Klingons who, when not sitting down to eat and relax, executed their duty with dignity.

I also have to disagree with the supporting characterization of the Klingon’s customs as “silly.” Every culture has it’s own customs. Surely what seems to us as reasonable ways of celebrating marriages, funerals, birthdays, and so forth may seem ridiculous to those people living in other parts of the world, and vice-versa. This claim, above all, seems to me to be incredibly shortsighted and not consistent with the understanding of diversity we have today amongst several dozen cultures all having developed in the same place under relatively similar conditions, never mind how it would apply to the thousands of cultures developing under thousands of different sets of conditions which one finds when traveling the stars in the Star Trek universe. I am reminded of T’Pol’s criticism of Archer in Enterprise’s pilot when he reprimanded a woman he thought to be abusing her child. He was thinking in a very limited, earthbound scope.

The sum point is that I really do not in any way see the depiction of Klingon society in TNG and DS9 to be any kind of disappointment or mistake. Indeed, we have had cultures on our very own planet which have been very similar, notably the Nordics. Why it’s problematic that the Klingons have been given a full and respectable cultural identity, rather than just being depicted as a homogeneously evil, cunning, and nasty people as TOS portrayed them as, I cannot fathom.

103. Nemesis4909 - March 27, 2009

I do not own and Iphone or Ipod Touch so if i were to buy the countdown comics on itunes would i be able to view them on my pc?

104. KMKProd - March 27, 2009

Just got an email from Amizon… my TPB is shipping now and will be here soon. AWESOME!

105. Sean4000 - March 27, 2009

If someone would be so kind, could you please completely spoil #4 the comic for me?

My email address is digianswrs at the y place dot com.

106. Thomas - March 27, 2009

103. Nemesis 4909
I don’t think so. I asked that same question in another thread, and I found the answer. Because it is an app, it will not work on your PC> So the answer is no,

107. AJ - March 27, 2009

102:

Your argument is quite fair. However, I am open to other cultures’ differences. Klingons are a fictitious culture on a TV show, and I am not criticizing their culture, but how their depiction as a culture has fundamentally changed.

In TOS, the Klingons were the Chinese, and the Romulans were the Russians. The Klingons were depicted as ruthless and brutal conquerors, and the Romulans as honorable and thoughtful opponents.

TNG brought Klingons to the brink of absurdity not because of their societal structure, or the government or judicial system that we saw. It was Lursa and B’etor and the loud “bloodwine’ drinking fights and singing sessions. It was Robert O’Reilly over-acting as Gowron, and the loud grunting which seemed to become their de-facto language. Show me more Kern and less Gowron/Martok, and it’ll be better.

As for comparing the Klingons to the ‘Nordics,’ they bare no resemblance to them whatsoever. I spent the last few years living in Sweden and Norway, and am 25% Swedish. The ‘Nordics’ look at the Vikings as the early creators of a consensus-based government system when they weren’t drunk and/or pillaging. The Norwegians also think Swedish men are effeminate, the Swedes think the Norwegians are morons, and they both hate the Danish.

Doesn’t sound like Klingons to me.

108. The Man from Del Monte - March 27, 2009

92:

I think somewhere on here there’s a mention of a “not-so-secret” followup project to Countdown coming this summer.

109. Shane - March 27, 2009

107.

I obviously picked the wrong group of people to compare to. Apologies! My main point in that context was that earth has seen it’s warrior/honor based cultures. I was thinking more of the sorts of cultures that are depicted in Beowulf, but obviously they are not the only example. In fact, in the middle ages a version of the Gospel was written replacing Christ’s disciples with warriors, and placing a great deal of emphasis on honor and whatnot. The point was to evangelize the peoples who were coming from northern Europe and considered these kinds of things important. I wish I could remember the name of the work – I’ve been trying to remember it for years so I could try to get a copy and read it.

As far as the drinking songs and so forth, I think my point really is that that’s being presented as though that’s *all* there was to Klingons in TNG and DS9, whereas the reality is that it’s a *part* of it. What’s wrong with the Klingon culture having that as a component to it, while also having other parts?

The thing is, I really don’t like the TOS depiction of the Klingons as the Chinese so to speak. I think it is unrealistic and unfair. Why? In TOS, like I said, the Klingons were rather homogeneously lumped together as ruthless, nasty people. The TNG and DS9 depiction of them adds depth to the race, making them out to be not just a universally nasty and ruthless bunch, but a people with its own culture, spirituality, classes, etc. etc. It’s a real culture – just like those on earth. Some Americans are brutal and nasty. Some are not. Likewise for the French, and so on. There are some things that tie them all together, but they’re not all the same. Likewise, some things bond all Klingons together – a devotion to the concept of honor being one. Yet there are many differences, and I much prefer this to the depiction on TOS.

110. Closettrekker - March 27, 2009

#102—“…honor is regarded as very important to the Klingons.”

Not in TOS. That was part of the TNG retcon of the Klingons, just like the howling, singing, silly rituals, heavy drinking, feudalism, and live food.

“While it was not per se mentioned specifically in TOS, we can certainly see the idea of honor being important to one degree or another, most notably in the case of Kang. ”

Most notably in the case of Kang? As AJ pointed out above, how does “A thousand throats may be cut in one night by a running man” mesh with that ridiculous later obsession with honor or nobility in battle?

Where is the ‘honor’ in ordering the execution of civilians en masse on Organia (Kor–“Errand Of Mercy”) or the cowardly and dishonest practices of Klingon Commanders like Kras (“Friday’s Child”) and Koloth (“The Trouble With Tribbles”)?

It wasn’t there in TOS. They were wonderfully colorful villains—that’s it.

TNG/DS9 forgot all of that and turned the entire race into something else.

“I also have to disagree with the supporting characterization of the Klingon’s customs as “silly.” Every culture has it’s own customs… This claim, above all, seems to me to be incredibly shortsighted and not consistent with the understanding of diversity we have today amongst several dozen cultures all having developed in the same place under relatively similar conditions…”

Thye characterization of it as “silly” is, of course, subjective—and very much my own opinion—but that isn’t even the point. The point is that the Klingons in the 24th Century fell far from the tree that bore them in TOS. They might as well be an entirely different people, IMO.

“Why it’s problematic that the Klingons have been given a full and respectable cultural identity, rather than just being depicted as a homogeneously evil, cunning, and nasty people as TOS portrayed them as, I cannot fathom.”

The fact that their culture was expanded upon is not what I find disappointing—just that the direction chosen resulted in them being near totally unrecognizable from the Klingons we knew from the Original Series, IMO.

I do not particularly care for that creative decision, and it seems that opinion is shared by some other fans as well.

I think it is a quite valid opinion.

It is perfectly okay if you disagree and think well of the creative direction taken with regard to the Klingons in the spinoff series, but to suggest that our opinion is somehow the result of thinking which is ” incredibly shortsighted and not consistent with the understanding of diversity we have today”, or “limited” is rather insulting.

It has nothing to do with intolerance of diversity, but everything to do with simply not caring for where Berman-era Trek went with the Klingons in particular.

If they had depicted another race altogether with the same sort of ritualistic culture and obsession with honor, I would not have cared.

But with the Klingons, it seemed to me (and apparently to others) to have come “out of nowhere”, and based loosely upon the behavior of a seemingly rogue group of about a dozen Klingons who were in a cloaked scoutship that was painted in a Romulan fashion in TSFS—instead of episodes like “Errand Of Mercy”, “Friday’s Child”, “The Trouble With Tribbles”, and “A Private Little War”, where we actually see the Klingons in action.

Instead of intelligent, well-spoken, yet cunning and murderous people who are as comfortable with stabbing you in the back, cutting your throat while you’re alseep, or engaging in deviant subterfuge as they are meeting you head-to-head in battle, we get half-drunken cavemen in space who make some of us question how they ever developed warp-drive—much less rose to become the political and military equals of the Federation in the 23rd Century.

The howling, growling, loud singing of drinking songs, the preference of blades over more sophisticated and efficient weaponry available, the rituals, feudalism, live worms, smacking each other around, “honor” etc., etc. does not remind me at all of the Klingons I knew in my youth.

As much as I like Ron Moore’s work on “Yesterday’s Enterprise”, I was very disappointed in his take on Klingon culture—and I do not (nor should I) feel the least bit “intolerant of diversity” for voicing that opinion.

111. Shane - March 27, 2009

Cloesttrekker

One important clarification. I didn’t intend to suggest that folks who didn’t like the direction of the Klingon culture as being insensitive to diversity merely for that fact. That statement was specifically directed toward the argument (or suggestion) that the Klingon’s rituals, concerns with honor, drinking/war songs, etc. were silly or not becoming in some way of an advanced civilization. It seems from your most recent post that that was a misunderstanding on my part, and that your problem with these things was that you (and others) see them as different from the Klingons from TOS.

My only real objections, or I suppose disagreements, to your recent post would be twofold.

First, after the little dialogue that’s been going on about this issue, I still do not see (nor as anyone attempted to explain) why it would be impossible for people in a culture to both behave this way at some times or in some contexts, and yet to behave more “normally” at other times.

Second, it seems to me – and please correct me if I am wrong (I do apologize if so) – that those who don’t like the “Ron Moore Klingons” like the fact that in TOS, the Klingons were essentially homogeneously evil. They were ruthless villains, but there was no depth to the culture, as if a man was evil specifically because he was Klingon, as opposed to Klingons having individual moral characters which could develop, progress, regress, or otherwise. In TNG etc., we have seen the culture/society as a whole develop, as well as individual Klingons. Thus, while Kang, Koloth, and Kor were agents of evil and murder in TOS, they had, by the time they set foot on DS9, become far more neutral. They had lived 100 years and were in a different time and a different place. Their actions in TOS could be viewed in this light as the duties men had in serving their “country” at the time, rather than just the actions of men who were under the blanket of being Klingon, and so evil. Does that make sense?

112. AJ - March 27, 2009

The overriding reason for “reforming” the Klingons was that they are now allied with the Federation, and GR wanted it to stand as a badge of progress. “Heart of Glory” actually shows a UFP logo behind the Captain. His writers’ guide insisted that the Klingons no longer be portrayed as adversaries. That was during “glasnost'” and the rise of China as a world power and trading powerhouse.

It made sense to re-jig the Klingons and the Romulans from that perspective.

But the Klingons were scary. If they come to your planet, you may be pulled out of your house in a round-up and killed with your wife and child as your possessions are seized. These guys were scarier than the Borg.

The ultimate goal of TOS Klingons was the annexation of new systems to boost an economy which included many poverty-stricken planets. They did so by ruthless force in order to quell any chances of time-consuming negotiation, and with a general disdain for others’ rights. They stopped short of genocide for economic reasons.

It is more of a regime issue than a ‘people’ issue. In any case, the ‘honor’ thing was not a part of the Klingon psyche until TSFS. They were then dumbed down to match the 1980’s ‘Mr. Lovey-Dovey’ version of Trek. I am sure they’ll be re-vamped yet again.

113. Jotin - March 27, 2009

The thing is # 110, you forget that Gene himself said that he could not imagine the klingons on the show the way he wanted to due to budgeting and when the movie finally came around he was able to. He was also there through a good portion of TNG to see the evolution of klingons with more funding. I love the Klingons as they are now. They love to party but they also show how smart they are in battle and just because you cant see the technological side of them through the show doesn’t mean its not there. But i mean come on… it is a tv show. How the hell did the borg come to be?? Really…

114. AJ - March 27, 2009

111:

Shane, the Klingons in TOS were ‘following orders’ but were also the frontline Captains of the Defense Force. The only difference is that, Kor and his ilk, if the Klingons had actually allied themselves with the Federation, would have been prosecuted for their past crimes.

Kor was pretty sure he was rounding up those Organians for mass execution, yet he sat comfortably on DS9 as a drunk, and no one arrested him. We’re still looking for old Nazi guards who participated, under orders, in attempted genocide. “A different time and a different place” doesn’t excuse mass murder.

115. Dannyboy - March 27, 2009

I’m dying to read this series but I don’t want to spoil the new movie. Can someone who’s been reading the comic tell me… is it safe? Does it give too much away? Should I read it now or wait until after I’ve seen the new movie?

116. Robert Saint John - March 27, 2009

#115 – I think somebody already mentioned my review today of TPB at my blog (which itself is spoiler light), but I did not feel at all spoiled by it. I would read it now to help “quench your thirst”. At the same time, I wouldn’t want to read it a week before seeing the movie as it may set some expectations (not spoilers) about the film.

If anything, things that happened in the series and in Issue 4/TPB have left me with more questions about the movie. I now think some of the details we’ve surmised about the story aren’t quite right. In the end, I feel less spoiled!

117. Steve - March 27, 2009

Does anybody think that it is not necessary to read the comics. That the movie will explain what has happened in the beginning and the motivations of Nero and why he looks up James Kirk, Romulus being destroyed, etc.?

118. Bob Tompkins - March 27, 2009

I don’t know about any of you, but i could have sat still for a true ‘re-passing of the torch’ movie that had included something like this as the extended prologue. I am sure most of the TNG cast would have happily done this- and I have nothing against 3:15 movies, especially if it is Star Trek.

119. GaryP - March 27, 2009

It’s going to be interesting to see how Kirk and co of the 23rd Century defeat Nero and his crew of the 24th. I mean, let’s say that the Allied Forces had predator drones and F-22’s when they stormed the beaches of Normandy during World War 2. It wouldn’t even have been a fight. They probably could have stormed the beach without a single casualty.

What I’m saying is, you have a peace of technology that’s over 80 years ahead of its time with the Narada and it’s being placed in the 23rd century. PLUS the Narada has been equipped with Borg technology, which means that it’s even ahead of it’s time in the 24th Century. How the heck is Kiddie Kirk going to defeat that kind of threat? hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

120. RD - March 27, 2009

#118 Paramount is NOT INTERESTED in PASSING THE TORCH.

The audience is not going to know ANY of this minutiae … if it comes out that the Romulan ship is enhanced with Borg technology during the movie, I will be SHOCKED. First, it won’t mean anything to anybody in the 23rd century and that’s just the kind of thing that Abrams and Co. want to eliminate, unnecessary technobabble that just gets in the way of the story.

Spock is passing the torch. PERIOD. TNG, VOY, DS9, ENT were all failed endeavors, with audiences shrinking with every new incarnation. Paramount went back to the roots. Notice they did not decide to reboot TNG!

This comic is ONLY TARGETED at the HARD-CORE FANS. PERIOD. Paramount wants to make sure the “geeks” show up to see the movie which they have now had to admit has nothing to do with the original series or any subsequent canon. The comic is an olive-branch to entice the last remaining vestiges of the 80s/90s Trek fans to take an interest in what wasn’t really even their Trek to begin with.

Frankly, I can’t really blame them, I wouldn’t want that box-office disaster of a cast from TNG anywhere near my movie. This Trek REBOOT has NOTHING to do with TNG and that’s the way it should stay.

121. thereare4lights - March 28, 2009

TNG was actually the show that gained Star Trek its mainstream popularity. Its audience continued to rise from season 3 onward so don’t be stupid. The only failed endeavors were Voyager and Enterprise.

122. Mr. X - March 28, 2009

Actually just Enterprise.

And even Enterprise had mostly more viewers each episode than BSG for example. BSG’s series finale drew 2.4 million, the most viewers since it’s pilot.

The first season of Enterprise had 6 million viewers average, the last season almost 3 million. So Enterprise did a hell of a lot better than BSG, although its considered to be the worst thing happening to Trek.

123. Mr. X - March 28, 2009

Source 1.

124. Mr. X - March 28, 2009

Source 2.

125. thereare4lights - March 28, 2009

BSG was on cable, Enterprise on syndication –> viewer difference.

126. TNG rules - March 28, 2009

RD, you sound like a sad, sad, bitter and angry person.

TNG blows TOS out of the water buddy. Newsflash. Just because Stuart Baird sunk Nemesis doesn’t mean TNG failed. It never did and never could, because it’s freakin’ AWESOME.

Some fan polls show as much as 60% of the fans prefer TNG as their favorite Trek show. TNG won like 18 emmys… and to say Voyager is worse than Deep Space Nine, come on, you’re insane. DS9 was the most static Trek outing ever. “Let the SHIPS come to US” give me a break. You don’t know what you’re talking about. RD, keep the attitude toned down when you’re talking out of your–.

127. thereare4lights - March 28, 2009

#126 you were on the right track till you mentioned Voyager. That show emasculated the Borg, ffs.

128. Closettrekker - March 28, 2009

#111—“First, after the little dialogue that’s been going on about this issue, I still do not see (nor as anyone attempted to explain) why it would be impossible for people in a culture to both behave this way at some times or in some contexts, and yet to behave more “normally” at other times.”

It certainly is *not* impossible. I do not think that anyone is suggesting that it is so.

“Second, it seems to me – and please correct me if I am wrong (I do apologize if so) – that those who don’t like the “Ron Moore Klingons” like the fact that in TOS, the Klingons were essentially homogeneously evil. They were ruthless villains, but there was no depth to the culture, as if a man was evil specifically because he was Klingon, as opposed to Klingons having individual moral characters which could develop, progress, regress, or otherwise. ”

I do not feel that is a “fact” at all. The Klingons (as a race) in TOS were not depicted as one-dimensional, IMO. For example, both Kor and Kang had qualities that made them admirable as adversaries to some degree. They had a certain regal dignity about them. It would be difficult to imagine those two behaving like the cowardly liar and cheat, Kras, who lacked any sort of character at all—or the terrorist, Arne Darvin.

I do not believe that the Klingons depicted in TOS were, as you put it, “homogenously evil”. I do think they were nationalists, and each with his own personal qualities. Each believed he was acting for the greater good of the Klingon Empire he served, and let’s just say that each had a “particular set of skills” with which to contribute. I don’t think for one minute that Kang, for instance, believed himself to be evil, nor do I believe that he ever demonstrated that. I *do* believe that TOS Klingons subscribed to the theory that “the ends justify the means”, and unlike their 24th Century counterparts, they never acted under the pretense that “honor” had anything to do with it.

And make no mistake—I would never suggest that Ron Moore was canonically out of line in any way—it is simply a matter of taste. I like 23rd Century Klingons. I do not care for their apparent descendants.

129. Shane - March 28, 2009

128.

Alright then. This is actually somewhat ironic. From what I recall you saying about Ron Moore in the past, we’re really of opposite opinions of him, generally. There’s so much that he brought to Trek that I really was not a fan of. I don’t like his belief that in order for a show to be interesting you have to have the good guys doing bad things or tension stemming from the relationships of the crew or whatnot to some moderate degree. I can see here and there, but I think he certainly went slightly overboard with the idea. On the other hand, I love what he did with the Klingons.

130. Closettrekker - March 28, 2009

#126—“TNG blows TOS out of the water buddy.”

Not even close. I certainly wouldn’t agree with much of anything “RD” has to say—but that is ridiculous. The characters in TOS are “popular icons”, while the characters in TNG are merely “geek icons”.

“Just because Stuart Baird sunk Nemesis doesn’t mean TNG failed.”

But let’s face it, as a film franchise—TNG paled in comparison to the originals. TNG worked quite well as a television series, but quite poorly as a feature film series.

After adjusting for inflation, TNG movies make up 3 of the 4 worst box office performances in the history of the 10 film series. Only FC performed respectably, and even that film ranks *far* below TMP and TVH in ticket sales, despite playing in far more theaters.

Heck—even *without* adjusting for inflation—TVH did $17 million more (just domestically) than FC despite opening 10 years earlier!

131. Closettrekker - March 28, 2009

#129—Lol.

Yes, I suppose that is interesting, but it just proves once again that Star Trek fans and their tastes are quite diverse.

It is certainly true that some of the things that Ron Moore believes made him feel constrained while working on the Star Trek spinoffs are some of the very things that turned me off about TNG.

And while I obviously do not particularly like the way in which he chose to flesh out the Klingons, I do give him credit for writing my favorite episode outside of The Original Series—“Yesterday’s Enterprise”.

132. SPB - March 28, 2009

Man, oh man…

…that “Countdown” dialogue continues to reek. Who writes this stuff, 16-year olds? Good grief.

133. The Governator - March 28, 2009

120. Shane

I agree with you, except in your assessment that TNG was a failed endeavor. It was most certainly not. In fact, it was extremely popular and still brings in good viewing numbers on networks. It is true thought that the TNG movies were a fail (except FC) as well as the other three series. To be honest, I found DS9 to be insanely stupid. A space adventure that revolves around a space station? So much for exploration. It didn’t really get good until the Defiant was brought in and all that mess with the Dominion. Voyager I liked a lot. Enterprise was good, but it had a really, really bad start with tons of unoriginal ideas and crappy episodes. Season 3 was an experiment that only partially worked. Season 4, however, was really, really good and I think one of the best seasons of all the Trek series. Too bad they had already lost their audience. Another season like 4 to complete the series would have been most welcome.

But you are right. This is a new incarnation that does not need to be polluted by the baggage of Berman/Braga Trekdom. It is it’s own thing. The audience does not need to know that the Narada was enhanced with borg technology to know of its capabilities. Nor does the audience need to know of Data and Picard’s involvement in Nero’s story. It is unnecessary. Remember folks that the Countdown was written as an afterthought. The movie was written first and had it come out at Christmas, we would never have gotten the Countdown series and known the whole back story. Its all an ode to the fans of the past 20-30 years. So enjoy it for what it is, but the movie itself is it’s own thing altogether.

134. thereare4lights - March 28, 2009

For everyone arguing TOS is superior to TNG: compare Picard with Kirk. ‘Nuff said. The answer lies here.

135. Praetor Tal - March 28, 2009

I would be very interested if this story were to be novelized. It bears fleshing out.

136. Closettrekker - March 28, 2009

#134—Boy, is that the wrong tree to barking up!

IMO, Picard is one big ‘snoozefest’ compared to James Tiberius Kirk.

If there is any one area where ST:TNG doesn’t hold a candle to Star Trek, it is in trying to match the wonderful and iconic characters–particularly Kirk, Spock, and McCoy. Even a “bad” TOS episode is somewhat salvaged by the interaction of those characters, and even secondary ones—like the iconic “Scotty”.

There are about 20 episodes of TOS (in 3 seasons) that I would put up against anything in network television history—while I cannot even think of 20 episodes of TNG (in 7 seasons) that I would even want to sit through again.

Give me the two-fisted action, humor, sexuality, alien monsters, great banter, romanticism, heart, and above all—the legendary characters of The Original Series, and you can have the USS Hilton, the holodeck stories, the android pinnochio, howling Klingons, Earl Grey tea, children on the bridge, ship’s counselors, etc. of the 24th Century. I’ll take colorful villains like Khan, Kor, and Kang, and you can have “Q”…

Really…go ahead. It won’t hurt my feelings a bit!!!

Seriously, help yourself to Nemesis, Insurrection, Generations, and STVIII: “Picard Goes Rambo”…I’ll stick with TMP, TWOK, TSFS, TVH, and TUC. I’ll even keep “The Great Trek Turd Of ’89” for you!!!

:)

137. Shane - March 28, 2009

133.

I didn’t write #120 lol. I loved TNG

138. Closettrekker - March 28, 2009

#137—I think he mistook RD’s post for yours…lol.

139. The Governator - March 28, 2009

Oops, I meant RD, but I’m glad you liked TNG. lol.

140. The Governator - March 28, 2009

note: TOS is still my favorite.

141. Mr. X - March 28, 2009

Which is why DS9 is the best Trek show. Sisko and Kirk are equally great characters.

142. Oktoberfest - March 28, 2009

I think the Breen were pattered after the Danes. At least that’s what a Norwegian told me.

143. Spanish Brock - March 29, 2009

Amazon sent me my Countdown trade paperback on Friday and I note that, in the first issue, they have resolved the “Spock on Romulus” issue. Now instead of saying he lived there for forty years, it says, “My home for the last twenty years.”

144. Sisko's Ghost - March 29, 2009

With regards to the Klingon argument: You can’t really compare TOS and TNG/DS9 Klingons because TOS Klingons AREN’T ANYTHING. They’re stock villains with no culture, nothing notable. They don’t even have to be klingons–in TOS, Klingon was genre short hand for ‘bad guy.’ They worked as an easy way for writers who wanted to use conflict without having to develop a new villain. That’s it–stock genre characters. The movies, TNG and DS9 mark the true beginnings of the Klingons as characters (not storytelling devices).

As for TOS vs. TNG, I just watched TOS straight through for the second time in a couple of years…while the characters are certainly iconic, pound for pound on a quality level, I have trouble ranking it much higher than Enterprise. Outside of its 20 or so outstanding, classic episodes, the writing is atrocious and the story’s (not just the effects and acting and sets) are campy and didactic. That’s not to say that TNG was never campy or didactic, but sheesh, TOS is just hard to watch at times. I can usually watch a full season of Trek in about a month, but it took me three months just to watch season 3. I can’t help but think much of the TOS-love is sheer nostalgia.

Regarding the Kirk/Picard debate–TOS Kirk was about as interesting as those stock-Klingon villains. Maybe he’s fun for some people, but I find TOS boring in how predictable Kirk’s behavior is. We could practically make madlibs using Kirk’s responses for most TOS episodes and plug them in — I bet Kirk is going to fly in the face of authority and do what’s right then sleep with an alien woman. Yippee… Picard is more interesting, but also somewhat predictable. My hands down favorite captain is Sisko. That’s right.

DS9: The main reason I felt I had to post here is that there was a lot of DS9 hate going on with no one sticking up for it–DS9 is, in my estimation, the richest, deepest, most interesting, most fully formed and least predictable Trek. It was the first Trek to make the bold move of working out a huge arc that ran through most of the series, and despite a few missteps within that arc, everything was pretty consistent and engaging. Most importantly, the characters were fallible and real, and rarely predictable. Sure, the show was occasionally didactic, but DS9 had a good deal of respect for its audience, and let us wrestle along with our own conclusions without trying to spell everything out for us. Who cares that the cast wasn’t zooming around the galaxy running into one all-powerful energy being after another and breaking the prime directive 15 times a season–DS9 was about the idea of home in the Star Trek universe. To this day, no Trek has offered as unique or challenging run as DS9. While I look forward to the new Star Trek movie, I know it’s going to be muscle-Trek. There’s a place for that, certainly. But saying that’s the only thing Trek can or should be does a disservice to what should really be remembered as this franchise’s golden age.

Oh yeah. That golden age? Were we to pick a five year span to call Trek’s golden age, I think anyone would be hard pressed to find a better five years than 1991-1996. This time saw STVI, Generations, First Contact, TNG seasons 4-7, DS9 seasons 1-3ish, and the beginning of Voyager.

There was no, nor will there probably ever be, another time when so much excellent Trek is being produced at the same time.

145. thereare4lights - March 30, 2009

Geee, i wonder how the Star Trek future would’ve looked if there hadn’t been any TNG or DS9 to bring some fresh air in this stale concept. Two remarkable works of art come to mind: Star Trek New Voyages and Star Trek Of God and Men.

146. Bob Tompkins - April 2, 2009

Wow. I didn’t think so many viewpoints could pop out of the fact that I can sit still for a longer movie.

Trek is the only franchise that has enough backstory to make a jump between such diverse elements of the same series feasible. As to RD’s snide remarks, I will be very surprised if no homage is paid during the movie to what came before- or is it after?- whenever.

147. blu-ray player - September 17, 2009

I am clearly not as dedicated a fan as others on this page but I do love the movies regardless. The ultimate is surely to watch all the trek movies on blu-ray back-to-back over a long weekend, mm, star trek heaven.

148. Date4Ever - May 31, 2010

Yey!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Data Lives!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D xxx

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