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	<title>Comments on: Library Computer: Review &#8211; &#8220;Star Trek Countdown&#8221; Trade Paperback</title>
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	<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/</link>
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		<title>By: kitofnine</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1825507</link>
		<dc:creator>kitofnine</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 May 2009 08:55:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1825507</guid>
		<description>It wasn&#039;t until after I read Countdown that I really became overtly excited about the new movie. 
Countdown is amazing, it&#039;s just amazing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It wasn&#8217;t until after I read Countdown that I really became overtly excited about the new movie.<br />
Countdown is amazing, it&#8217;s just amazing.</p>
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		<title>By: noirgwio</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1735607</link>
		<dc:creator>noirgwio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 17 Apr 2009 05:05:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1735607</guid>
		<description>Yes, it&#039;s quite good portent... C&#039;mon May 8th!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, it&#8217;s quite good portent&#8230; C&#8217;mon May 8th!!</p>
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		<title>By: Doktor Mandrake</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1733252</link>
		<dc:creator>Doktor Mandrake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 16 Apr 2009 14:37:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1733252</guid>
		<description>IF ANYONE IS STILL WORRIED ABOUT SPOILERS THERE ARE LARGE AREAS OF COUNTDOWN PLOT DISCUSSED HERE





Having just read the graphic novel (I consider it too well constructed and executed to term it a &#039;comic&#039;) and being a trek fan of many many years I would like to make a few comments.

It seems to me that most posters criticizing Countdown just haven&#039;t read it particularly carefully.  People are getting caught up in knots about whether things might or might not be possible based on things we don&#039;t understand and then of course there are the canon pointers.

I will restrict myself largely to issue 1 for reasons of post length, but for this reason only.

In general there seem to be enough pointers that the supernova in particular is not behaving as one might expect that any criticisms about speed of light/amount of damage feasible are pretty baseless.  If strange things that don&#039;t make sense happening because something or other upsets subspace in some way aren&#039;t canon then unfortunately pretty much everything but TOS is stuffed.  Get over it, these plot points aren&#039;t that bad, and as is pointed out by many trek &#039;science&#039; isn&#039;t so squeaky clean that it&#039;s fair to use it as a club to beat something you had no intention of liking in the first place.  If you can do better, go and get published.

When considering reboots/re-imaginings people seem to only really be able to think of BSG.  I would imagine any graphic afficionados would consider it rude that the &#039;Crisis on Infinite Earths&#039; or even Frank Miller&#039;s &#039;Dark Knight Returns&#039; is never mentioned as a successful reboot.

Wikipedia has a very good article on &#039;reboot (fiction)&#039; for anyone wishing to research before flaming further.  Both the fantasy reboots mentioned above were generally good things for anyone appreciating a more mature story line, although both greatly annoyed many self styled &#039;true fans&#039; initially as they basically threw away accepted Canon when it became too cumbersome.  I have no problem accepting the well-executed graphic novel alongside high-brow old-school SF, but possibly this is a generational thing.

Having just had my general rant, on to some considered specifics:

Most definitely Nero considers that Spock used him.  He says so (P19, issue 4).  The first few pages of issue 1 make it clear that Nero was actually a good captain in the moral sense before he broke.  Various charecterisations of Klingons or even Romulans would have been likely to abandon the crew on the surface rather than risk sending a shuttle to beam them off and hitting the escape button only when they are back on board.  He clearly cares about his people.   

As has been previously put forward, the Romulan Senate ignored Spock and laughed the threat out of court.  (&#039;Preposterous!&#039;, &#039;How can ONE STAR destroy an EMPIRE?&#039;) Their basis was that they didn&#039;t believe a supernova at that range could impact their way of life and that as Decalithium was so rare and valuable, anyone wanting lots obviously intended to try to destabilize their economy.  (&#039;Where do you expect to find the technology for that?&#039; &#039;Vulcan&#039; &#039;Vulcan?&#039; ...  &#039;This is all a vulcan plot!&#039; ... &#039;...Decalithium is a rare and valuable raw material in the Empire.  We will not willingly hand it over to the Vulcans, despite your well-intentioned supplications&#039;)(ps 9 &amp; 10 i1).  Nero then calls out from the public gallery that he has seen this phenomena first hand and that he believes they should at least take a closer look.  They thank Nero for his comments but still say &#039;No., basically writing it off in much the same way our own politicians have treated activists concerned at Global Warming over the past couple of decades.  Nero brands the senate &#039;Bureaucratic fools&#039;.

Nero then decides to throw in with Spock in an attempt to save the Empire, regardless of the fact that if caught &#039;hanging will be the least of our problems&#039; (p14, i1).  His heavily pregnant wife consoles him as he comes to the conclusion that he must betray his empire to save it by telling him that so long as he does what he knows is right he cannot fail.  (para, but p11 i1).  He then goes to see Spock.  He offers the services of his ship and crew and advances a plan that he knows the location of a good source of Decalithium that they could go and mine, and take straight to Vulcan.  Spock gives the legalistic warning that basically Nero&#039;s life would be over if he were to help in such a way.  Spock presumably at this point fears a trap, hence the caution.   Nero then makes his big loyalty speech &#039;...But if I do nothing I lose them all the same.  This is not a decision I make lightly.  After my wife, there is nothing I love more than the Empire and I will do anything to save it.&#039; (p12, i1).  Spock then offers to show Nero the star.

This is the much debated &#039;telescope&#039; scene.  The device outwardly resembles a telescope.  However it is clearly overlaying analytical data on the viewed image (not legible) and has a science station-like menu structure down the side (partially hidden by speech bubble)  It would seem extremely unlikely that this is a regular optical instrument.  Apart from anything else, a regular telescope would be destroying eyesight with an image like that.  Also, why would a highly regarded member of the highly technologically advanced 24th century need to muck about with a tube full of glass when sensors are so common-place?  It may seem an anachronistic form for a scanning device, but it&#039;s actually quite well suited to the simple roof garden Spock is holding this audience in.  Unless he has very messy builders he seems to appreciate having a rock garden of sorts to contemplate.  Looking at the cityscape beyond his terrace this would seem to indicate ascetic tastes rather than local norm.  This would seem to be in character for a Vulcan.

I regard Countdown as a good thing.  I do consider that it&#039;s a bit wild in scope saying that one ship might simultaneously be a credible threat to three empires but be vulnerable to the actions of a single comparatively ancient vessel, but I want to see this!  At the moment I trust the movie will be blinding!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>IF ANYONE IS STILL WORRIED ABOUT SPOILERS THERE ARE LARGE AREAS OF COUNTDOWN PLOT DISCUSSED HERE</p>
<p>Having just read the graphic novel (I consider it too well constructed and executed to term it a &#8216;comic&#8217;) and being a trek fan of many many years I would like to make a few comments.</p>
<p>It seems to me that most posters criticizing Countdown just haven&#8217;t read it particularly carefully.  People are getting caught up in knots about whether things might or might not be possible based on things we don&#8217;t understand and then of course there are the canon pointers.</p>
<p>I will restrict myself largely to issue 1 for reasons of post length, but for this reason only.</p>
<p>In general there seem to be enough pointers that the supernova in particular is not behaving as one might expect that any criticisms about speed of light/amount of damage feasible are pretty baseless.  If strange things that don&#8217;t make sense happening because something or other upsets subspace in some way aren&#8217;t canon then unfortunately pretty much everything but TOS is stuffed.  Get over it, these plot points aren&#8217;t that bad, and as is pointed out by many trek &#8217;science&#8217; isn&#8217;t so squeaky clean that it&#8217;s fair to use it as a club to beat something you had no intention of liking in the first place.  If you can do better, go and get published.</p>
<p>When considering reboots/re-imaginings people seem to only really be able to think of BSG.  I would imagine any graphic afficionados would consider it rude that the &#8216;Crisis on Infinite Earths&#8217; or even Frank Miller&#8217;s &#8216;Dark Knight Returns&#8217; is never mentioned as a successful reboot.</p>
<p>Wikipedia has a very good article on &#8216;reboot (fiction)&#8217; for anyone wishing to research before flaming further.  Both the fantasy reboots mentioned above were generally good things for anyone appreciating a more mature story line, although both greatly annoyed many self styled &#8216;true fans&#8217; initially as they basically threw away accepted Canon when it became too cumbersome.  I have no problem accepting the well-executed graphic novel alongside high-brow old-school SF, but possibly this is a generational thing.</p>
<p>Having just had my general rant, on to some considered specifics:</p>
<p>Most definitely Nero considers that Spock used him.  He says so (P19, issue 4).  The first few pages of issue 1 make it clear that Nero was actually a good captain in the moral sense before he broke.  Various charecterisations of Klingons or even Romulans would have been likely to abandon the crew on the surface rather than risk sending a shuttle to beam them off and hitting the escape button only when they are back on board.  He clearly cares about his people.   </p>
<p>As has been previously put forward, the Romulan Senate ignored Spock and laughed the threat out of court.  (&#8217;Preposterous!&#8217;, &#8216;How can ONE STAR destroy an EMPIRE?&#8217;) Their basis was that they didn&#8217;t believe a supernova at that range could impact their way of life and that as Decalithium was so rare and valuable, anyone wanting lots obviously intended to try to destabilize their economy.  (&#8217;Where do you expect to find the technology for that?&#8217; &#8216;Vulcan&#8217; &#8216;Vulcan?&#8217; &#8230;  &#8216;This is all a vulcan plot!&#8217; &#8230; &#8216;&#8230;Decalithium is a rare and valuable raw material in the Empire.  We will not willingly hand it over to the Vulcans, despite your well-intentioned supplications&#8217;)(ps 9 &amp; 10 i1).  Nero then calls out from the public gallery that he has seen this phenomena first hand and that he believes they should at least take a closer look.  They thank Nero for his comments but still say &#8216;No., basically writing it off in much the same way our own politicians have treated activists concerned at Global Warming over the past couple of decades.  Nero brands the senate &#8216;Bureaucratic fools&#8217;.</p>
<p>Nero then decides to throw in with Spock in an attempt to save the Empire, regardless of the fact that if caught &#8216;hanging will be the least of our problems&#8217; (p14, i1).  His heavily pregnant wife consoles him as he comes to the conclusion that he must betray his empire to save it by telling him that so long as he does what he knows is right he cannot fail.  (para, but p11 i1).  He then goes to see Spock.  He offers the services of his ship and crew and advances a plan that he knows the location of a good source of Decalithium that they could go and mine, and take straight to Vulcan.  Spock gives the legalistic warning that basically Nero&#8217;s life would be over if he were to help in such a way.  Spock presumably at this point fears a trap, hence the caution.   Nero then makes his big loyalty speech &#8216;&#8230;But if I do nothing I lose them all the same.  This is not a decision I make lightly.  After my wife, there is nothing I love more than the Empire and I will do anything to save it.&#8217; (p12, i1).  Spock then offers to show Nero the star.</p>
<p>This is the much debated &#8216;telescope&#8217; scene.  The device outwardly resembles a telescope.  However it is clearly overlaying analytical data on the viewed image (not legible) and has a science station-like menu structure down the side (partially hidden by speech bubble)  It would seem extremely unlikely that this is a regular optical instrument.  Apart from anything else, a regular telescope would be destroying eyesight with an image like that.  Also, why would a highly regarded member of the highly technologically advanced 24th century need to muck about with a tube full of glass when sensors are so common-place?  It may seem an anachronistic form for a scanning device, but it&#8217;s actually quite well suited to the simple roof garden Spock is holding this audience in.  Unless he has very messy builders he seems to appreciate having a rock garden of sorts to contemplate.  Looking at the cityscape beyond his terrace this would seem to indicate ascetic tastes rather than local norm.  This would seem to be in character for a Vulcan.</p>
<p>I regard Countdown as a good thing.  I do consider that it&#8217;s a bit wild in scope saying that one ship might simultaneously be a credible threat to three empires but be vulnerable to the actions of a single comparatively ancient vessel, but I want to see this!  At the moment I trust the movie will be blinding!</p>
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		<title>By: noirgwio</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1719323</link>
		<dc:creator>noirgwio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Apr 2009 23:58:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1719323</guid>
		<description>I broke down and read Countdown during a brief hiatus from VAN: Reap the Whirlwind, and it was good. I loved all the little nods to TNG, in the end, I&#039;m really left wanting more... More of the Spock/Trek09 story, yes. But this new story for the TNG crew too!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I broke down and read Countdown during a brief hiatus from VAN: Reap the Whirlwind, and it was good. I loved all the little nods to TNG, in the end, I&#8217;m really left wanting more&#8230; More of the Spock/Trek09 story, yes. But this new story for the TNG crew too!</p>
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		<title>By: thereare4lights</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1718736</link>
		<dc:creator>thereare4lights</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 12 Apr 2009 20:31:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1718736</guid>
		<description>For  everybody who thinks the supernova plot is unfairly criticized: do you really want to bring Star Trek to the Space &#039;99 science-fiction level ?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For  everybody who thinks the supernova plot is unfairly criticized: do you really want to bring Star Trek to the Space &#8216;99 science-fiction level ?</p>
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		<title>By: noirgwio</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1714852</link>
		<dc:creator>noirgwio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Apr 2009 14:35:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1714852</guid>
		<description>Re: 92, Vorta... I think it&#039;s probably a non-issue. That is to say, much like the new film will be a different timeline or dimension to TOS, Countdown and the novels are different too. Picard still is tery much Enterprise&#039;s daddy in the books, yet in Countdown he takes on a different roll. These stories are likely to be set in alternate dimensions, unrelated to each other. Maybe they&#039;ll sinc up down the line, or they will remain seperate. They&#039;re both killer either way!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re: 92, Vorta&#8230; I think it&#8217;s probably a non-issue. That is to say, much like the new film will be a different timeline or dimension to TOS, Countdown and the novels are different too. Picard still is tery much Enterprise&#8217;s daddy in the books, yet in Countdown he takes on a different roll. These stories are likely to be set in alternate dimensions, unrelated to each other. Maybe they&#8217;ll sinc up down the line, or they will remain seperate. They&#8217;re both killer either way!</p>
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		<title>By: Hadrosaur Dave</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1712202</link>
		<dc:creator>Hadrosaur Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 22:40:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1712202</guid>
		<description>I pre-ordered my copy of the trade paperback some time ago at BN.com.  The site has said it &quot;Usually ships in 24 hours&quot; for over a week.  However, when I called to find out when mine was shipping, they said it wouldn&#039;t be until April 15!  However, there were copies sitting at the local Barnes &amp; Noble.  I canceled my order with BN.com and picked up a copy locally.  Looking forward to reading it now -- but that was quite a frustrating shopping experience.

I&#039;m hoping I don&#039;t have a similar problem with the soundtrack album, that I also pre-ordered.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I pre-ordered my copy of the trade paperback some time ago at BN.com.  The site has said it &#8220;Usually ships in 24 hours&#8221; for over a week.  However, when I called to find out when mine was shipping, they said it wouldn&#8217;t be until April 15!  However, there were copies sitting at the local Barnes &amp; Noble.  I canceled my order with BN.com and picked up a copy locally.  Looking forward to reading it now &#8212; but that was quite a frustrating shopping experience.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m hoping I don&#8217;t have a similar problem with the soundtrack album, that I also pre-ordered.</p>
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		<title>By: vorta23492392932939230</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1709633</link>
		<dc:creator>vorta23492392932939230</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Apr 2009 02:52:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1709633</guid>
		<description>What I want to know is:

How will the Pocket Books series deal with these events?

The stardates given for Star Trek: A Singular Destiny (which I haven&#039;t read up to yet!) are 58307.7-58322.2, and the opening of Countdown has the stardate as 64333.4, which I think works out to be about a 5 year gap.

So potentially this can be seen as what the Destiny novels and thereafter are leading up to (which to my knowledge doesn&#039;t yet include Data&#039;s rebirth, but that was to be expected to happen somehow eventually!) and hopefully the Pocket authors will do something nice to bring the books into continuity with the events of Countdown, especially considering the unliklihood of ever seeing Picard, Data, and Worf on screen ever again.

I wouldn&#039;t mind hearing the story of how Picard gives up command, Data is ressurected, and Worf goes full Klingon in the intervening years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What I want to know is:</p>
<p>How will the Pocket Books series deal with these events?</p>
<p>The stardates given for Star Trek: A Singular Destiny (which I haven&#8217;t read up to yet!) are 58307.7-58322.2, and the opening of Countdown has the stardate as 64333.4, which I think works out to be about a 5 year gap.</p>
<p>So potentially this can be seen as what the Destiny novels and thereafter are leading up to (which to my knowledge doesn&#8217;t yet include Data&#8217;s rebirth, but that was to be expected to happen somehow eventually!) and hopefully the Pocket authors will do something nice to bring the books into continuity with the events of Countdown, especially considering the unliklihood of ever seeing Picard, Data, and Worf on screen ever again.</p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t mind hearing the story of how Picard gives up command, Data is ressurected, and Worf goes full Klingon in the intervening years.</p>
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		<title>By: noirgwio</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1708817</link>
		<dc:creator>noirgwio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 21:33:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1708817</guid>
		<description>Oh yes, just bought mine at Barnes &amp; Noble a few hours ago! I flipped through, but will probably wait to read it til I&#039;m done with Vanguard: Reap the Whirlwind. (Harbinger and Summon the Thunder were killer!) Or at the very least, just before May 8th... To bone up.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh yes, just bought mine at Barnes &amp; Noble a few hours ago! I flipped through, but will probably wait to read it til I&#8217;m done with Vanguard: Reap the Whirlwind. (Harbinger and Summon the Thunder were killer!) Or at the very least, just before May 8th&#8230; To bone up.</p>
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		<title>By: JP Saylor</title>
		<link>http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/comment-page-2/#comment-1708020</link>
		<dc:creator>JP Saylor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Apr 2009 16:51:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://trekmovie.com/2009/04/07/library-computer-review-star-trek-countdown-trade-paperback/#comment-1708020</guid>
		<description>#5 : Might you want to donate that extra? lol</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#5 : Might you want to donate that extra? lol</p>
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