New Ships and Behind Scenes Images + Box Office Update + more ST09 tidbits May 19, 2009
by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Great Links, Star Trek (2009 film) , trackback
In the new Star Trek movie there are a couple of glimpses of some Federation ships besides the Kelvin and the Enterprise and we can now get a closer look with a new image from now available online, along with some more behind the scenes images. We also have the latest box office numbers, Trek’s ratings with movie viewers online and more.
Ships image + more behind the scenes shots + Mindel interview
The International Cinematographers Guild site has an interview with Star Trek cinematographer Daniel Mindel, which also includes a great shot in space giving us a good look at a couple of the other ship types in the movie. There are some behind the scenes shots too. Here are the images, click to see them larger and read the interiew.
Enterprise and other ships ready for warp
Behind the scenes shooting Star Trek
Box Office Update: Another good Monday for Trek
Star Trek continues to battle it out against Angels & Demons, but on Monday the Tom Hanks movie edged out Trek a bit to take top spot at $4.7M vs. Trek’s $4.5M domestically. Star Trek is now up to $152.2M domestic with $219.9M globally. Paramount has run ads about Star Trek saying it is ‘this year’s Iron Man’ referring to the hit movie from 2008, which proved to have very long legs. So it is good news that Trek’s second Monday sales ($4.5M) are higher than Iron Man’s ($3.9M).
Star Trek online ratings sky high
We have already noted that Star Trek has the top ratings at movie review aggregator sites Rotten Tomatoes and Metacritic, but the New York Times notes that it is no surprise Star Trek has legs, pointing to new movie site Flicketz, which rating films on a number of factors, including fan reviews, and Star Trek has a perfect ‘fan score’ of 100. Speaking viewer reviews, Yahoo Movies readers give Star Trek an average of an ‘A‘, and on IMDB, Star Trek has a rating of 8.4, which ranks it as the 71st highest ranked film on the site (in the same range as films like Pan’s Labyrinth, Aliens, and Raging Bull.
More Star Trek Celeb Watch
Links to the latest from the cast of the new Star Trek moie.
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Comments»
Abrams, et al. – Do yourselves a favor and release some errata with class names, etc. for the ships. It seems silly, but nerds like me (us) go crazy for that kind of detail.
Sweet; been waiting for some more ship shots. The one in the upper right looks like it has a bit of Miranda in her crossover support. Did anyone catch a glimpse of the Kobyashi ?
Nice stuff! This site continues to impress me.
Even though Star Trek will be facing some tough competition from Terminator this week, I predict that Kirk, Spock, and the gang will ultimately best John Connor and his bunch in overall box office earnings.
Miranda ‘09 & ENT-Intrepid ‘09!
I’m worried when comparison are made – this year’s Iron Man – Maybe I’m superstitious, but the adage about pride & falling always comes into my mind with comments like these.
It is a very strong film – well balanced – which will help it in the box office. I’d prefer it if Paramount would sell it on its own merits without the comparison to blockbusters past.
Nuff said. Don’t want to jinx anything. Incidentally, 4 of my high school students were raving about it today before class. Nice to see a diff demographic excited about a show they never watched before.
#4: I agree. Based on the reviews so far, ST will make more money, at least domestically. I don’t think Terminator will cross $200M domestically.
Nice to see that Dan Mindel is getting some notice for his work, hopefully it leads to an Oscar (or at least a nomination).
I’m confused…
When Watchmen came out they had TONS of amazing art from the film books, amazing photographs of the characters in a big book, behind the scenes book you name it. They had it all, same goes from Batman, Hellboy, Iron Man etc..
Why isn’t there anything on this film? A big fancy worth every penny kind of a book??!!??!?
Is there something in the pipe line?
I like the film way more than I thought I would but guys??? What’s with the ratings on these sites… it’s REALLY not that great. It’s good. Pretty good. But not an 8.6…
I love the new ships. Toy replicas should be sold in the stores.
I belong to what you’d call a “redneck-y” club here in Maryland… total “roadhouse” type joint. And last night the bartender, a 50-something year old woman who says she’d never seen a Star Trek in her life, told me unprovoked that she was dying to see “that Star Trek movie” because she’d heard it was so good.
This person was the absolutely last person I’d ever expect to mutter the two words “Star Trek”, so at this point I figure JJ & Co. have successfully reached out to absolutely every demographic possible.
Paramount must be beside themselves with giddiness. Of course you know this means we’re going to get one of those stupid parody films called “Space Movie” now.
C’mon, everybody, lets keep going back to see it until it hits Dark Knight money!
That one ship looks a lot like a Miranda-class starship with a misplaced warp nacelle. I like it!
The smaller ship is in D-A-C as the Fighter Class.
Trek tech is so sexy, if REAL 23d Century tech doesn’t catch up with it, it’ll be a disappointment. Real life might not be as cool as Trek, frankly, and that would be too bad.
For all we know, however, somewhere in the world, the father of the discoverer of warp or some other kind of interstellar drive has just been born.
Trek, or some form of it, could still be true. :-)
@ 12
Great story! Very indicative of the substantial crossover power this film possesses.
Well, T4 is tanking in the RT review department (25%). As we’ve seen, that’s meaningless. Trek is still the best-reviewed film of the summer.
Ships are great. I agree: Classes and specs, please!
#16 recent research by a string theorists postulated a Warp like drive FTL technology but the math indicates you have to burn the mass of Jupiter to make Warp 1
http://dsc.discovery.com/news/2008/07/28/warp-speed-engine-02.html
@12 Uulio, love the story and unfortunately there will probably be a film called ‘Space Movie’ (it’s probably being written on a napkin as I write). I’m hearing alot of stories from my friends that are going or have gone to ‘Star Trek’ and it’s all been positive feedback. All of these guys are not Trek fans so for them to talk this way is amazing! FYI, I’ve seen it 3 times in IMAX and I do think it is one of the better Trek efforts but Star Trek II is still the Trek to beat.
#18 Perhaps a Tech Manual to coincide with the DVD Release which should be November if keeping with recent summer hits
I’lll take as many FX shots of the Enterprse and the other ships as they’re willing to offer.
I’d especiallly enjoy any unused shots of the under-construction Enterprise at the shipyards. Those shots looked *incredibly* well done and gave the “E” a great sense of depth, dimension, and reality. I was hoping we’d see even more!
I am already looking forward to the DVD/BR release with all kinds of delicious extras and a JJ commentary :)
Great, more ugly ships… ‘Hey, let’s stick a bunch of nacelles on here!’.
Finally more ship images! That ship above the Enterprise looks a lot like a Kelvin technology Reliant would look like. Just remove the middle nacelle…
Me thinks they adapted some tech from the TOS tech manual
http://www.amazon.com/Star-Trek-Fleet-Technical-Manual/dp/0345340744
http://www.scribd.com/doc/13745897/Star-Trek-Star-Fleet-Technical-Manual
19, I read that too. But the mass has gone down considerably — it used to be many orders of magnitude greater. Maybe theoretical advances will reduce the energy requirements still further.
#7, it’s not just Terminator. Night at the Museum made over $250 million domestically and over $570 mil worldwide. Night at the Museum II actually has about the same reviews on RT as the original. Between T4 & NM2, we’re really going to find out who has not seen Trek yet who has no other interest in anything else. I personally still don’t think A&D is done either, because it is a whole different audience, for many of whom, this weekend will be the first to get away to the theatre and relax.
I love the new ship designs….all of them…..better than any version of Trek….
Can’t wait to see the new versons of the NewCanon Excelsior Class, Oberth Class and Miranda Class however…..trust me….they will come…. They are the most popular classes besides the Constitution……
I also can’t wait to see the new version of the Klingon Bird of Prey…..
This movie is the new version of Star Trek……what a start !!!! what a beginning…. It is the NEW canon…. I don’t even acknowledge Enterprise as a prequel…. Everything from JJ and The Supreme Court is in my mind the new beginning…the new Star Trek…..from this movie onward……
Hey guys, just one more reason the new “E” is about the same size as the original.. Look at the rec-room windows on the saucer just by the port nacelle.. It looks like there is a person in there.. so unless that person is three stories tall.. i would say that one person fits in that one window.. therefore the scale is the same as the Enterprise from TMP at least..
I just want a clear pic of the new Klingon Warbird!
It is only on screen for a few seconds and the Burger King toy version is Super Deformed, but you can still make out new weapons and forward shuttlebays.
Oh and Mattel is releasing the Movie Enterprise and the Narada in its’s new line of toy ships, but so far the Movie Enterprise is MIA from this release. The picture on the back of the boxes shows a TOS paint job with Orange nacells, so maybe that is what delayed it.
A new tech manual has to be made….
It has to include:
The Narada
Spock’s Jellyfish Ship
The Kelvin
The Enterprise
All of the Shuttles
The other 6 starfleet vessels that made up the Vulcan Armada that were destroyed by the Narada
The Klingon Warbird
The USS Kobayashi Maru
The ship docked at SpaceDock prior to the Enterprise Warping (see in lower left hand of screen)
Space Dock
And of course all Star Fleet facilities
1.
Same here. One of my favorite things in Trek is the glimpses at different types of Starfleet vessels. Class, name, origins, etc. I enjoy details.
I know, I’m a dork.
The thing I love about the new trek film is that new ships were designed by CGI……note to ILM…do not lose the files…..remember Star Trek First Contact…..you lost the Norway Class methinks…..or was it the Sabre ????
I look forward to some new designs in future installments……
Good job ILM, et al.
Ahhhhh….it was the Norway Class CGI file that was lost…..I just checked on the First Contact page on Memory Alpha….
OK…now that I am mentioning Memory Alpha….they must make a Prime Universe Page and a new Alternate or JJ Abramverse/Alternate Reality Page to seperate each universe and to further avoid confusion to make things easier…. Of course the new universe page would start with the events of the new film….with references to the Prime Universe of course ;)
29 Throw away line
{In Delta Vega Outpost}
Scotty: So I tested it on Admiral Archer’s Prized Beagle…..
32. Spot on. We need a new “Scottys guide to the Enterprise” book me thinks
#4: “Even though Star Trek will be facing some tough competition from Terminator this week, I predict that Kirk, Spock, and the gang will ultimately best John Connor and his bunch in overall box office earnings.”
Overall, I agree with your prediction, but not for this weekend. Terminator will rule this weekend.
As Han Solo once said, “don’t get cocky, kid.”
#9: “When Watchmen came out they had TONS of amazing art from the film books, amazing photographs of the characters in a big book, behind the scenes book you name it. They had it all, same goes from Batman, Hellboy, Iron Man etc.. Why isn’t there anything on this film? A big fancy worth every penny kind of a book??!!??!?”
Because in the past, at least in the latter years of the TREK journey, Paramount has not had confidence in its property. Need facts? Budgets far less than this film; involving a few directors and writers who knew nothing about the series; further evidence?
The Star Trek Encyclopedia has not been updated since 1999 yet in that time there has been one additional film released; “Voyager” completed its seven-year run and the much maligned four-year voyage of “Enterprise,” which IMHO should have been permitted to complete the seven- year cycle that its sister programs did.
UPN did not treat the program with any respect, so of course, it did not, in executives’ eyes, succeed. Now, all of a sudden we have a winner and Paramount is caught with its collective pants down unprepared for the success they have so long sought.
Is this any way to treat a flagship franchise?
Wasn’t one of Gene Roddenberry’s rules that starships would only have two nacelles due to the way warp physics worked?
Totally off topic.
But… has anyone seen that animated movie BOLT.
Upon viewing I caught two references that made me smile.
1) “Larak tarath” – the mak’tar chant of strength from Galaxy Quest.
2) “It’s a good day to die” – a reference to the Klingon/Worf saying.
On topic – Nacelles Monthly.
The nacelles on those ships are FUBAR. Except maybe on the Connie II: Fast & Furious.
9
Yeah I’m holding out hope that the great business the movie is doing will inspire Paramount to release a lot more merchandise.
Hell, even ST:Insurrection got a “Making Of” book! lol
Just got back from my 4th viewing. Tuesday night, still strong beyond belief here in San Francisco. IMAX at 7:30 totally sold out, and a line-up out in the lobby for another regular showing. I really can’t remember the last time a Tuesday night was so busy. It looked like Friday!
Anthony,
This is the best website in the entire world; no, the Universe; no, actually in the Mulitiverse.
That said, why can’t words be spelled correctly? I think today was the worst. The article headline actually says “Scenese.”
It’s a real juxtaposition: the great care and love that goes into this site in every other way, and the consistently awful spelling. I don’t get it, especially since the spellchecker was invented well over a decade ago.
36
Not sure what you’re talking about because Memory Alpha has already done just that. For instance:
http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/James_T._Kirk
http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/James_T._Kirk_(alternate_reality)
“Where No DP Has Gone Before”
hahaha
Hey Anthony,or Quaksbartender, or Veron-Say it aint so! I saw the Enterprise D deflector dish from the giant illuminated model at The Experience for sale on ebay with a sad notation stating the Enterprise did not survive her battle against the evil minions at the vegas Hilton! Anyone know anything about it?
Am I the only one that gets goosebumps in the new movie after Kirks heroic dad gives his life in the opening scene to be replaced by the gigantic stone Starfleet delta shield slowly rotating to the front as the gigantic title star trek in classic tos font fades in with the new theme horns blowing the new title theme? Wow! The first time I saw that on the huge Imax screen I almost had a tear in my eye and I knew Trek was back…likewise at the end when the camera goes over the big E and Spock starts the familar phrase and the classic theme starts as the Enterprise thunderously disaapears–goosebumps I tell ya!
Thanks to Bob Orci,Alex, JJ and all involved for helping to show non trekkies why we love this franchise and her characters!
I love that opening title. Inspired!
#49: No, you’re not alone. I experienced the same physical symptoms… :)
#49, same here. Plus my eyes still well up with tears, even the fourth time out!
I want to see a “Making of” book.
#49 hate to admit it but I cried like a baby through the whole Kelvin start of the movie. it almost happened again the second time I saw it!
I think my innner ten year old was finally so happy to get the Star Trek movie he always wanted.
#40: “The Star Trek Encyclopedia has not been updated since 1999 yet in that time there has been one additional film released [...]”
Speaking of, now that we’re presumably done with the real (er, Prime) Star Trek universe for at least the next several years, now is an excellent time to put out “complete” versions of the reference material, up-to-date with all of the pre-JJ material from the existing shows and films.
The ship in the upper right corner looks like a miranda-esque design while the ship in the lower corner, the four-necelled one reminds me of the constellation class, i do prefer the designs of these ships, i think there was another class, if you look at the starbase, i’m sure there was another three-necelled class, it looks simlar to the the three-necelled miranda type but 2 necelles are up and the third where it is on that top right ship but the necelles have a rollbar between them.
#13. Harry Ballz
No.
I treat the film as a separate entity from the rest of Trek. As it is a diff universe it makes the most sense.
I loved the film but it feels different.
I am treating the prime universe as the main canon still and treating the new movie as a parallel canon
#49
“… classic theme starts as the Enterprise thunderously disaapears–goosebumps I tell ya!”
I choked up when during my very first viewing the entire theater started clapping! First time anyone’s done that for a Trek movie since I started watching them with Wrath of Khan.
What is the new Canon ???
1. This movie and everything beyond it (unwritten)
2. FC, Enterprise, This Movie and everything beyond it (unwritten).
or
3. Enterprise and this Movie and everything beyond it (unwritten).
My pick personally is #1 because it is better for the new fans, general audience, plus its a fresh new beginning and start, a re-boot and it opens the possibilities for new adventures…. Plus it erases the Berman and Braga crap….the unfortunate casualties are TOS, TAS, The 6 TOS films and TNG Season 1- 4 or 5. And DS9 for those fans out there, like myself.
Thanks guys-Glad to know Im not alone being affected by the titles in the new movie! It is an extremely confident and gutsy bombastic title sequence promising larger than life heroes and thrills and chills and epic scale which the movie then proceeds to give us and live up to and even exceed those promises! Damn but JJ is good and yes he knows it! Best title sequence since Superman the movies titles helped convince the audience a man could fly! In Star Treks case the whole movie flies…
However !!!
This movie acknowledges that the Prime universe still exists….without it the events of the prime universe past Nemesis, this movie and the incursion of the Narada in 2233 would not have occured.
So the Prime universe is still relevant for those that want to explore it. Yet this new Alternate reality is for those who want to explore something new, fresh and exciting (ha ha Scotty “Its Exciting”) To boldy go where no one has gone before is the perfect slogan for this new Alternate Reality….
So perhaps Enterprise, and a lesser extent FC and the Prime universe are indeed integral and linked to this film….2000’s TOS. I can say that Enterprise is a prequel…despite some of its flaws, mind you Season 3 and 4 were stellar :) Yet Ent is also a prequel to 60’s TOS…. Ent and FC are prequels to both Realities – Prime and Alt. Remember that Ent was quite contemporary…made in the 2000’s…a perfect link to this film…
However, my thoughts on the engine room… It looks very industrial and less modern than the Ent. engine room because of the negative effects of the Earth Romulan War…. The damages must have been so great that it threw Star Fleet Tech back by decades….. Yet in the TOS Prime reality….tech looks even more advanced in the engine room…. Perhaps some aspects of Tech improved due to the Narada’s interference and others stood still or regressed due to the Narada or lack of/slow pace of re-building after the Earth Romulan War
My 2 Cents…
I believe the Quantum Physiscs and believe the original timeline still exists parallel to this new one.
There is no way that I will allow this film to over write the Treks I loved. They still exist and this whole movie is a parallel timeline.
I loved this movie but it is not the best ever Trek fim. Wrath of Khan, First Contact and Undiscovered Conuntry still have the edge over it.
The new movie is high up for me in the top 11 but I treat it is a parallel timeline. If this movie had erased the past 40 years of Trek I would have just ignored this film. It exists parallel and I can still enjoy the past 5 series and 10 movies.
Stop treating JJ Abrams as a man who can do no wrong. I still think Kirk going from cadet to Captain within 2 days was extremewly contrived but it did not ruin the enjoyment of the film for me.
I want to enjoy this film as part of the Trek family, not as a film which overwrited all that I loved just so it can appeal to the ADD generation.
I have already seen the film 3 times and will be dseeing it a 4th time this weekend but I wanted to say that some of the past movies have the edge over this one.
Hope this makes sense/
#46 –> I wager “36″ meant a Memory Alpha more aesthetically consistent with S.T.A.R. (which is the virtuosic/genius and deliberate acronym for the new picture, Star Trek [Alternate Reality]. No more unpronounceable alphabet soups [excluding TWOK, which, pronounced, could be a Klingon or Vulcan delicacy of some kind]). A Trek Nouveau Memory Alpha embodying the newer, richer design wisdom of the film.
#49 –> Exactly my response as well. Involuntary ecstasy.
#44 –> Robert, which IMAX was this? Metreon? I’m locally IMAX-illiterate.
#4
As much as I’m a fan of Trek, I think the new Terminator movie will usurp NCC-1701 as the new box office champ. I’m not trying to be a gloom and doom guy, I’m just trying to be realistic. Christian Bale (AKA Batman) as John Connor in a post apocalyptic Skynet setting? Are you kidding? I think the new Terminator movie is going to be AWESOME!!! Plus there’s a parallel with Trek. “Is Shatner going to be in it?” “Is Arnold Schwarzenneggar going to be in it? I think they both got left out.
So I regress my previous stance and incorporate ENT into the new canon because of it contemporary role….2000’s and the fact that Scotty mentioned Admiral Archer, thus solidifying ENT into this canon….. However I am throwing FC out since that crew (TNG) may or may not exist in the future of this new Alternate Reality – the JJAbramsSupremeCourtVerse…..
Mind you we now have to canons that are linked….the new one (ENT – Star Trek 09) and the old one (Prime) (ENT – NEM and the events of 2383 that lead to the Narada/Spock/Jellyfish) leaving and going into the past and creating the new Alternate Reality)
Pick one, or the other or both….they are each Canon and are for all of those to explore the greatness of STAR TREK….. Remember the Prime Reality still exists, is still relevant and is vitally important….it was acknowledged in this film and without it the events of this film and the creation of this reality for new fans, general audiences, current fans, fans won back (disgruntled/disconnected), new fans won over, and those just interested/curious was just the best masterstroke ever….It Makes Sense…this Alternate Reality is Very Relevant…. A New Beginning !!!
Rejoice…
Congrats JJ and Supreme Court… I look forward to the new adventures in this new Universe/Reality….Your 2009 film Star Trek was just phenomenal and I just loved it…my fav Trek Film and one of my top 10 films of all time !!! Yet I look forward to exploring the great adventures of the Prime Reality as they are very exciting too….
Live Long and Prosper Trek !!!
I’m surprised nobody addressed the issue of cinematography, which IMHO was pretty bad. The camera shakes far too much and far too often – it did not add to me experience, it detracted from it. I hope the next one takes advantage of what steadicams do (ie, be steady). Also, the end credits reminded me of Lost in Space – couldn’t we have end shots that matched the grandeur of the opening?
Herringbone canon! Trek, start writing novels!
I see this Film as the New Canon…..Alt Universe…..
And the Prime Universe as the Old….
However….ENT is the prequel to both….okay even FC…. I loved that film….
So we now have the Alt Canon and the Prime Canon and of course their respective prequels….FC (21st Cent) and ENT……
They both Co-Exist and the are both intertwined….they are both as relevent…. Yet I am favouring the New Alt Canon because it is fresh and new…. Yet I do love and admire the original canon and it does still have a special place since it was what I grew up on and made me fall in love with Trek… I could never ignore it and toss it out…it would be a disservice…
Long love Trek…
That Narada sure changed things…
69….Lost in Space ????
Are you Kidding Me ???
And none of the Novels are Canon…..
The only written material that IS Canon would be the Countdown comics…. And maybe ST Online because it acknowledges the loss of Spock and the loss of the Narada…and especially the destruction of Romulus…..
#73 –> That being the case, pretend I said “screenplays” instead of “novels”.
67…..T: Salvation Reviews are just terrible….see RT… Just mention that the director of the 2 Charlie’s Angel’s Films made it…..and audiences will stay away… Perhaps McG should do preview screenings of his previous films for those wanting to see T4….. Esp. the 2 Charlies Films…. and then folks will scream with BLOODY HORROR…. MCG is a Hack….a terrible filmaker……
The cinematography was aweseome.
I think that the 2 Charlies Angels films are the worst pieces and wastes in Cinema History….
Even the much derided Clone Wars film last summer garnered better reviews than T4…. And it was just the big screen pilot for a well done and crafted state of the art animated series that is a great addition to the Star Wars universe, canon and legacy….plus it will fit perfectly between Ep 2 and 3 and tie in well with the Genny T. classic animation CW series… It was definetly laid out and planned…
The only mistake was releasing it theatrically….could have been better received if it was aired as a TV pilot…. It was better than critics said…totally unfair… I loved it !!! Pure and classic SW….
OK…
Both Charlies Films beat their budgets, the 1st one was 68% and the 2nd one was only 42 % on RT….. Plus the 2nd one was 259 million global BO….
I think they sucked tho….
T4 : 29 % on RT – however Bale’s performance is being praised….and he has the two massively successful Batman films behind him….
And McG has recognition with the 2 Charlies Films…plus Arnies “Cameo” and the fact that this is a sequel to the Massively Popular Terminator Franchise….this could be BIG…
Other than that other competitors to trek incl….Land of the Lost, Transformers 2 and of course GI Joe…..
Yikes…CW had 18% on RT…it was not that bad !!!
And of course Night at Museum 2
Berman and Braga SUCK !!!!
LOL
Buttman and Bravis….
Beavis and Butt-Head
Huh Huh Huh…..I Said Butt…man
Berman and Braga wrote Grade 2 Elementary School Style Scripts…Especially the ENT Series Finale…
“These Are the Voyages” – Utter Crap……and VOY “Threshold”
They both Really Sucked !!!!
After seeing the first teaser trailer and everyone after that I was hoping there would be a seen in the movie of the Enterprise launching from Earth !
Beavis and Butt-head could do better than Berman and Braga….
82..
That would have been awesome !!!!
After Kirk flew off to the Academy….they should have had a wipe in to night…..showed a scene of the welder dude, the welding and everything from the 1st teaser trailer from Cloverfield….
Then fast forward to 3 years later….following the Kobayashi Maru they should have made a scene of the Enterprise launching into space, moving out of Riverside and approaching SpaceDock in synch with the shuttle with Kirk and McCoy leaving the Academy….perfect…
JJ…Take note for the Extended Edition of the Film for DVD/Blu Ray
Or following the welding scene they could have flashed forward prior to the Academy 3 years later and as part of the welding interlude they could have had various scenes showing its construction and launch into space….yet that would have made the shuttle scene at space dock seem irrelevant….and anti-climatic…
Anyways they should have thrown in the scene from the 1st Teaser in thers somewhere it would fit….I loved it….no launch tho….it would be anti-climatic…
I consider ship design (exterior and interior) in ST09 THE single most annoying letdown of the movie. This isn’t Star Wars, this isn’t BSG (reboot), Trek ships have Warp Drive and not glowing blue exhausts like Imperial Star Destroyers.
Yes, I know, it ain’t exhaust ports, the glowing parts of the Warp Drive have simply been moved from the sides to the back. Still, it’s an all too obvious imitation of Star Wars aesthetics, like the supposed increased ship size. Long live the total assimilation of all SF aesthetics… for me to poop on!
. .. . and Jeffries “simply” recombined rocket tubes and flying saucers. Rather overtly at that. All art is synthesis.
Try relaxing, it may add years to your life.
@85: A launch scene (while visually spectacular, I suppose) would really have been anti-climatic (sp?). The intention was for the audience to discover the (finished) Enterprise just like Kirk and Bones discovered it.
If they had shown the ship launch before that the element of discovery would have been lost.
And showing a flashback to the launch AFTER the shuttle scene would just have been distracting.
I wouldn’t be holding my breath for new tech manuals and encyclopedia’s folks.
Remember, one of the reasons for setting the new movie in a parallel timeline was to ditch the “unbearable weight of 40+ years of source material”.
I think they’re going to keep the “official reference materials” available to the public at a bare minimum to continue to give them flexibility in this universe.
#2 :: Wasn’t the Kobayashi more ENT-era…? I have a hunch it was. But just a hunch. I could be/probably am wrong. ^___^;;
Anyways, nice shots! I like those ships. :3 And it’s always cool to see the behind-the-scenes action.
#80 :: I don’t think that’s really fair of you to say. While they did have a lot of low points as writers, they also had some high points. Aside from “These Are the Voyages…” season four of ENT was very, very good, in my opinion.
But, as they say, to each his own.
87 Gyo Obata: Why do you take it to a personal level and what tells you I’m not relaxed? If I may return the favor of good advice: Try not to judge people (or anything) based on minimal information.
As for the factual contents of your post: I think synthesis is something else than imitation. The synthesis Jeffries made was original in its time – at least I don’t know any similar spaceship designs from before 1964 – even if he recombined familiar elements. That’s different from imitating the established aesthetics of another franchise, and imposing them on the also established aesthetics of your own franchise.
37
i agree..how could this be Admiral Archer’s prize beagle…this is over 100 years later!…2155 vs 2258..”Porthos’ great great great grand puppy?”
though if you have read the novelization you know what becomes of our favorite beagle…
A&D is dead!..T4 is next…I believe our only comp will be UP!…and beyond that probably Harry Potter, but that’s way on down the road….
71 Trek: DC comics had a similar situation by the early eighties. They fixed various continuity problems by introducing the multiverse concept. And it was much more complicated than in JJTrek, at that. Then they decided it confuses the readers and abanoned the multiverse in the ‘Crisis on Infinite Earths’ series, only to reintroduce it two decades later in the ‘Infinite Crisis’ series.
Fascinating stuff, all these multiverse complexities. But for me, the only Trek continuity I’m looking forward to watch unfolding is named Phase II.
“The Supreme Court”… how arrogant is that?
A couple of things, since we appear to be venting about things that in no way should take away from our enjoyment of the movie –
1) The U. S. S. Kobayashi Maru? I think Bob and Alex may have needed a little more homework on this one. “Subject vessel is a third-class neutronic fuel carrier.” Possible that it would have a U. S. S. prefix, but if it’s the same test as shown in the opening sequences of TWOK, then perhaps that scene should have been written the same. Plus, if the KM was really the bait for a Klingon trap, you wouldn’t necessarily see it on screen (Remember when Uhura (TWOK) said, “Captain, I’ve lost their signal?”). Granted, it would have involved lifting the original scene almost directly from TWOK, but might have been a nice touch.
2) The ship designs. Yeah, this one bugs me a little bit, too. I get that JJ wanted this to look and feel different from Treks past, but methinks there was a little too much emphasis on “different.” I feel that the art department was only told that they had to use nacelles and saucers, but everything else was fair game. Since this is Trek, after all, and since there is a pretty fair amount of science to back up the science-fiction, it seems there should have been more attention paid to function over form. Just because they “look” like Star Trek ships doesn’t mean they are Star Trek ships. Of course, there will be unofficial technical manuals coming out any day now, you just wait. And then we can have this argument all over again when they tweak the design for the next Trek movie.
And @19, as far as warp drive is concerned, here’s something everyone seems to miss – the matter/antimatter reactor at the heart of the warp drive is only there to provide the energy to create the warp field. That’s why they use matter and antimatter – the energy produced by that reaction is several orders of magnitude greater than simple atomic fusion or fission, which is why you don’t need as much of either to produce the same amount of energy as a fusion reactor.
Now, how the plasma created by the M/AM reaction is used to create the warp field – that’s a whole ‘nother story, but I bet Rick Sternback could chime in on that one.
For the next film i’d like to see Klingon’s that i could hate.
Lets see something that really sets the scene for Kirk’s long term hatred towards them in a way that we can sympathize.
After that due to the changed time line lets see the Borg and see how Kirk handles them. Lets make them actually threatening too.
96 falcon: “venting about things that in no way should take away from our enjoyment of the movie”
Well, why shouldn’t it? My enjoyment of the movie was tremendously impaired by it. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t want to spoil anyone’s enjoyment of the film – if you like it, that’s fine and I’m happy for you. But on the other hand, whenever someone complains in here someone else comes up and tells him to ignore it and enjoy the movie instead. What’s going on? Where does this unwritten rule come from that everyone is required to enjoy the movie?
I don’t want to attack you in any way, I just keep wondering about this requirement to enjoy that seems to be in virtually everybody’s mind.
For the record, I agree with everything else you posted.
99, it’s because if you tend to be too fastidious about a fictional universe, people tend to look at you funny. :-)
#1-
Sam errata is a list of mistakes Is that really what you meant? Not criticizing’ here, just askin’.
#9-
Me too! But what you said, a “worth every penny ” book!
#49-
Kirk’s Dad’s sacrifice is for me the most emotional Trek scene ever! Moreso that Spock’s death in TWOK, Kirk’s reaction to Edith Keeler’s death in TOS’s COTEOF and Jake Sisco’s longing and loss in DS9’s The Visitor (my personal fav Trek ep, bar non)
And #’s 1 & 33 -
I’m a geek. What am I doing hanging out with all of you nerds and dorks?! ;-)
Call me crazy…
To #51:
I so agree with you, that opening title gave me goosebumps as the Starfleet Delta turned in to the frame, with Michael Giacchino’s new fanfare, WOW! A new era for Star Trek was born on May 8, 2009.
I really do hope that Paramount will release some new books on the movie, there is so much great new information to take in.
100 Hat Trick: I’m used to that :-)
Eventually, I’m still expecting Kirk and Co. to take the Big E to Wally’s Nacelle Hut and get something a little more sporty. I like the new designs, kinda, but with mammoth nacelles, ya gotta wonder about things like stress factors. I know that some of these wouldn’t live long as Estes Rockets, that’s for sure. (You laugh — my Klingon Estes flew and crashed so many times, in the end I was glueing pieces of glue back together. Loved that thing!)
One of the things I wished they had done in this film (i haven’t seen it yet so stop me if I’m being presumptuous) is to introduce the glowing warp nacelle grills that flash when a ship goes to warp that are present in all star trek’s except TOS (and I attribute this mainly to the budget). I mean if the ships in enterprise had it surely these new ones could.
Then again they have almost totally redone the style and it looks rather cool so I shouldn’t complain too much.
p.s.- Never bet your life or your ship on a little orange and white plastic parachute.
I can’t believe people are still making the Berman/Braga comments. Enough of that already. They did the best they could whether you like it or not. They gave us Trek for a long time, lets be happy.
The new is here (whether you like it or not–I sure do!) Time to celebrate!
Bring on Star Trek II-Alt. Universe Version!!
PS-bring it on, but leave behind all the shaky cam and light flairs–enough already!!
In regards to someone else’s comment about form over function…that is probably my biggest beaf with the movie. I simply didn’t believe that this enterprise was real, it was just far too off the scale of believability. The scale, layout, lighting, engine room. None of it felt like something that would exist in a real future star ship. As much as JJ talked about realism, the movie kind of lacked it in a lot of areas. The FX looked real, but the physical ships were kind of silly.
Correction Berman/Braga were raping Trek for a long time…
That duo didn’t do the best they could, because even if they weren’t very passionate about Trek and derailed it into the pit of the Saarlaac on Tattooine, they STILL could have hired better writers and directors…
They didn’t, this was their milking cow, they just wanted to milk it for all it’s got. Shame on them.
I have no respect for that duo, after what they did with the ending of Enterprise. That show was bad in so many ways, but to screw the audience AND the crew was WRONG!
Ok – forgive me for bringing in some brutal speculation, and digging up a chunk of Roddenberry’s past – but maybe, JUST MAYBE, the blue nacelles and the rest of engineering’s overall design, not to mention the displays on board the E, can be directly attributed to Earth: Final Conflict.
Ahh, forgot about that did you? Yeah, the Taelons primary color was blue, and the technology was not far off from this E’s basics. Granted, their ships looked more like the Dominon’s flying roaches from DS9 – but Rodenberry originally had the Taelons as part of the ST universe.
The SI war mentioned in the first few seasons of E:FC (pre-Atavus crapfest) had it’s correlation with WW3 in the ST Universe. And E:FC takes place roughly in the early 21st century – putting it prior (or part of) the start of the ST universe (no matter which one you look at).
I’ve been wondering if anyone has ever fully tied the two together, but I am sure that without access to his notes, the only ones who could are both now stardust.
Anyway – it’s just a concept.
Star Trek got to $150 million in 11 days. Out of movies which got to $150 as fast, none have made less than $200 million (indeed, the least a movie which got to $150 this fast has made is $214.9 million made by X-Men United.
The average domestic haul for the 6 movies which also made it to $150 million in 11 days is $254.1 million.
Star Trek should most definitely pass both Wolverine and Fast and Furious after Tuesday’s numbers, putting it #2 for the year overall.
80, 81 – interestingly enough, I was watching First Contact on DVD and had Berman and Braga’s commentary on, and while I’m not 100% sure when they recorded this commentary (it sounded like when Enterprise was on TV), they were discussing the future of Trek. One of the thoughts they talked back and forth about quite extensively was the idea of rebooting Trek, and they were talking about how the canon had gotten so unwieldy as a writer and whether it would still be “Star Trek” if it got rebooted, etc. It was very interesting to listen to given the new movie.
New ships look pretty swell.
As for Klingon designs, they shouldn’t be THAT much different, right? I mean, they did encounter Nero a bit, but who knows exactly what went down there? I guess we will see in the deleted scenes. The battle cruiser looked pretty standard during the kobayashi maru test.
I’m interested in seeing what the romulan ships look like in this timeline. Also, I’d like to see a couple of bolians or andorians (or M’res?)–they have grown on me. I do like the new races, however.
Although this isn’t the subject, I would like to put myself down alongside the others that thought the score was a little lackluster. I liked the delta and the inital beats, but it just dissolved into ho-hum (the rest of the score was just OK as well). Not that I didn’t clap still, heh.
-P
I haven’t seen Terminator and I don’t plan to go see it because I am not a fan of the series, but mostly because all bad reviews. You know, movies can open big, if they have enough hype, but they won’t last long if they are plain bad. Besides, the last Terminator wasn’t that great too.
Secondly, boxoffice (the website) is foreseeing a $65M opening weekend for Terminator, with cumulative box-office of $195M. They are usually pretty good in their estimates. Unless UP surprises, I am starting to believe that ST can finish as the biggest box-office of May this year.
About Night at the Museum 2, I don’t know why, but I have this feeling that it isn’t the kind of movie most people will want to see again. Looks like more of the same to me. I wouldn’t be surprise if ST ends the weekend not too far behind it. I also believe a weekend of $25 for ST is quite possible.
And by “pretty swell” I mean “close enough that my enjoyment isn’t impaired, and they look star treky and pretty neat.” I would like a little bit more diversity in saucer design, but it makes sense that they would have roughly the same nacelles (one nacelle fits all = cheaper). I did enjoy the various nacelle designs of the other treks, however. Its a give and take I guess. The different configurations are nice though–that is something I missed in TOS. Of course, they have insane budget restraints so…
Also, and this I know is a nerd-pick, I don’t care for how far forward the deflector is. Looks like the E has a beer belly. Just saying…
Still like the movie though, just nitpicking while I’m waiting for my boss to get back to me.
-P
Applauding movies? That just seems odd to me. A nice gesture to the makers of the film (even though they aren’t there), but I have never been to a movie where anyone clapped at the end. Laughing yes, shock yes, maybe even cheering the hero (rarely). But never clapping. Hmm… maybe it’s an American thing? (I’m British).
114.
I agree about night at the museum. I saw the preview and I found I was embarrassed for everyone in it–looks really boring. I don’t know what the standard movie-going public is into, honestly, (though it seems ST right now) but this looks far below sub-par to me. Looks a little empty. I had more of a reaction to Transformers, and that is saying something (actively disliked the first one).
I don’t know what to make of Terminator–I haven’t been following it.
-P
116.
Normally I wouldn’t clap either. I guess I got momentarily sucked into the moment with the rest of the theatre…I think there were only 5 or 6 people that weren’t clapping and it was a full house. I felt a little obligated since, according to my girlfriend, I’m a serious ST nerd (which she likes, by the way). That was my first and only time doing so. I’ve been in quite a few movies (phantom menace (ugh), X-men, X-men 2 (when wolverine stabbed someone?), etc.) during which the crowd cheered.
-P
BUT ENGINEERING LOOKS LIKE A BREWERY!!!
JUST KIDDING!
9. Agreed. Where is/are the “Art of” and “Making of” books for this film? I’d love to see the ship and set designs.
117.
PS. I just saw Terminator part 4 or whatever… It really wasn’t that good. And I went in with low expectations too. The F/X work was stunning and the CGI Arnold was impressive, but the story was a rehash of a rehash. WHY DOES SKYNET STILL GIVE A FIG ABOUT KILLING JOHN CONNOR?! THEY EXIST, THEY DON’T NEED TO KILL HIM!!! Anyway…
118. Now i really have to see this movie. It must betruely amazing for it to get everyone clapping like that.
PS Girls who like Star Trek FTW!
120.
I recommend it.
FTW indeed! She’s great and has become a certified Star Trek appreciator (wouldn’t use fan…yet) since we started dating. I’ve almost got her through TNG and we’re about to start the movies.
She is a graphic designer as well, so she even provides great commentary and insight concerning certain design choices (especially fonts).
-P
T4 has an advantage this weekend, with Memorial Day adding an extra day off here in the States.
Still, the international take is quite important. A&D has $102m internationally (vs $51m in the USA), whereas Trek has $68m (Box Office Mojo). Perhaps it’s still a growth area for Trek. It’s yet to be launched in some Asian countries, I think (the bulk of the world’s population).
T4 will seriously dent both this weekend, though it’d be nice to see Trek kick McG’s buttocks back to 1984.
I liked Engineering, it made a lot more sense to me. It looked believable — like a nuclear or gas-turbine power plant. Plus there were the non-warp-engine-related sections dealing with water recycling and all the other processes you’d need to run a starship. Aside from areas that would require shielding — when you need to tinker with complex machinery, as Scotty often does, it helps to be able to access it from all sides, rather than have to go through crawl spaces (ahem, Jefferies tubes).
Love the new ships. They all do seem to have a commonality of design, it’s a bit of the old with a bit of the new. They do “feel” as realistic as possible, within the realm of a made-up future spaceship world, at least to me…. As to the odd-numbered-nacelle issue, they explained the Kelvin’s as being a two-in-one design; the glowing bit on the end is a thruster (seen flaring as it makes its suicide run on the Narada), not a warp field vent or anything else.
#95 ““The Supreme Court”… how arrogant is that?”
Not very, considering their Trek is, indeed, very supreme..and they are the masters of it.
#65—”Stop treating JJ Abrams as a man who can do no wrong. ”
Who is doing that?
Abrams’ film isn’t perfect, but neither were *any* of the other films, including our beloved TWOK—which was full of the same type of contrived circumstances and outrageously convenient plot points.
“I loved this movie but it is not the best ever Trek fim. Wrath of Khan, First Contact and Undiscovered Conuntry still have the edge over it.
Interesting.
TWOK is still my all-time favorite “B-Movie” period. But ST09 is now my favorite Star Trek movie. The other two you mentioned—TUC and FC—were never even in the same ballpark as either of them.
Everyone has their own taste, but this is my take:
1.ST09
2.TWOK
3.TMP
4.TVH
I love all 4 of these films for very different reasons.
(huge gap)
5.TUC
6.TSFS
These two were/are very entertaining for me.
(significant gap)
7.FC
Best of a poor TNG-era film series. Quite decent.
(big gap)
8.INS
9.GEN
Not really rewatchable for me.
(big gap)
10a.TFF (aka TGTTO89)
10b.NEM
The horror…the horror…the horror…the horror…the horror…
#Trek WROTE: “Remember the Prime Reality still exists….it was acknowledged in this film”
No it didn’t. There is NOTHING in on screen canon (which is the only thing that matters) which proves the original timeline exists as a parallel universe. Countdown is NOT canon. Nor is anything the producers say off-screen. The good news is that there is nothing to preclude it either. Basically one can believe anything one wants about the parallel universe, including whether it is a parallel universe or a single one that has been wiped over. Whatever helps you sleep at night.
I choose to see Enterprise as yet a totally different alternate parallel universe than the one Trek is taking place in. Using multiverse theory, that universe branched off in the pilot episode as soon as the Suliban changed time allowing the Klingon to crash on Earth. So we have not see what the ENT era looks like in this universe, other than general references to some of the same people who were around.
#89 – With the exception of the reported Haynes/Simon & Schuster Enterprise manual for next year, I suspect you won’t see a lot of detailed material. S&S has said for the last 6-7 years that the reference books like the tech manuals don’t sell as well as they did when we did the TNG book in 1991. That’s probably true, even with this so-called “rebirth” of the franchise. Personally, I wouldn’t want to try to make sense of the tech in this new Trek universe; it’s a bit of a mess.
#80 “Berman and Braga SUCK !!!!
LOL ”
I have to wonder if they sit around now, finally realzing just how broke and not fun their take on Star Trek was. Damn shame they didn’t like TOS and thought it inferior. JJ gets it and, in return, has been richly rewarded for his trouble. And to think the showrunners of TNG and the spin-offs actually thought it beneficial to veer as far away from the TOS formula as possible. Crazy.
Harry Ballz – May 19, 2009
C’mon, everybody, lets keep going back to see it until it hits Dark Knight money!
Hey. Im with you on that. Seen it 6 times and 3 in Imax.
Will the larger engine size age well? On some of the other ships the big honking engines really stand out too much.
#126—Well, as Spock Prime might say, “I’m forced to agree with the doctor.”
The onscreen dialogue is certainly ambiguous on the matter. And Orci’s offscreen elaborations on MWI/QM are not canon.
And I agree about ENT, although I tend to believe that the initial catalyst was actually much earlier— the Borg’s timeline incursion of 2063 (especially considering what takes place in ENT “Regeneration”).
But even barring that, it would certainly difficult for me to buy that all of the “temporal cold war”/time travel in ENT was some sort of predestination paradox.
As McCoy might say, “Poppycock!”.
So yes—in my mind, the timeline in which we knew TOS, etc. to exist was already altered long before ST09.
125.
My rating of TNG movies differs from yours–but I grew up on TNG and TOS in parallel. TOS gave me swashbuckling adventure with a cerebral, message/character-driven core, but TNG gave me science, wonder and message, but also some good characters. I think the wonder was paramount there. Just my opinion though (there is no RIGHT answer).
I agree with you though that none of the star trek movies (or series for that matter) are without fault or plot holes. Most ST films have at least one, if not many. I don’t think anyone is blindly accepting JJ’s vision as 100% perfect and without fault (and if they are, that seems a bit naive and senseless). I haven’t read anyone’s review that states that though. Everyone has at least one major nitpick (or many!). Still a good movie though. The best ST film–not in my opinion, but I respect yours.
I’ll avoid the urge to post a list…for now.
-P
#97 – We worked out the whole M/A thing in the TNG Tech Manual, with the help of some pretty smart cookies in the high energy physics field. I -could- say to JJ and Co. “My tech consultants could beat up your tech consultants!” And from what I saw in the movie, I’d probably be right. :) Many of us have said that the engineering spaces were way too contemporary and made little 23rd-24th century sense, based on what we’ve seen of warp engines in the past. Orci’s explanation of separate smaller reactors rather than a large reaction core (or two) makes sense on the surface, but that’s like throwing a few cylinders of your car engine out the back with the fuel supply cut off. There’s no reactants to make anything happen. Now if the beer tanks- sorry, engine nodules contained their own M/A supplies and injectors and reactor chamber AND plasma conduits AND magnetic containment, you might have something, but then that’s a big waste in all that duplicate hardware. Incidentally, you want way more matter than antimatter, to produce the plasma that juices the nacelle coils, because a simple 1:1 ratio gives you mostly gamma rays, which won’t make the ship go. It’s all in the book. And if you really do think of warp drive as a fuel cell car engine, you’ll slap yourself in the head over how simple it is. Fuels react in a chamber, power goes to the drive, exhaust goes overboard. I know we’ve dumped warp cores in the past, and for the sake of drama some of them became “overloaded” and dangerous, but that wasn’t my doing; I tried to explain that it really was like dropping the engine out of your car with no fuel to go boom. The dangerous stuff is the antimatter (our producer Jeri Taylor knew how to use that stuff). The deuterium is just plain cold heavy hydrogen and can’t normally ignite or explode even in the Star Trek universe. Silly writers. :)
#132—I would be surpised if anyone agreed 100% with my list, much less any kind of majority. It is difficult to get two Star Trek fans to agree on one point at all other than the fact that they both like Star Trek in one incarnation or another, much less one so encompassing as my list and ratings of Star Trek films.
I never cared much for TNG or the other 24th century spinoffs, but alot of people love some or even all of it. Good for them.
Ironically, I found ENT (especially the last season and a half) to be the most palatable of all of the spinoff series for me. It is a shame that they brought on and defferred to Manny Coto so late in the game. IMO, he was absolutely on the right track…
But it was the return of Trek to the romantic 23rd Century characters which truly renewed my interest in Star Trek. I have literally been waiting for more than 20 years for those fantastic characters to be recast and brought back to life in younger form.
As far as my Trek fandom is concerned, May 8th really was a “day of reckoning”!!!
134.
I feel you. I have friends that wont touch TOS, but tell me how great ENT is, or VOY is. Especially VOY. Man, I have to say, I just don’t see it. VOY was OK, but TOS is where it started, you’ve got to respect. Maybe this new movie will make them go back and look at what was done then. Maybe through the lens of updated TOS they can appreciate TOS, if that makes any sense. Oddly, although I grew up on TNG, DS9 has always had a special place in my heart. It seemed the first trek with all of the above AND real consequences; it felt more real. One story had bearing on the next, which is something I saw little in either TOS or TNG, or even VOY for that matter (which should’ve had more consequences than any other).
Regardless, the new movie is good and will most likely result in a resurgence of respect for TOS, and maybe even ENT. I agree, that last season was actually pretty good. The rest? Meh…boring actually. Only in the last season did they capture any of the drama in TOS, or even in TNG and DS9 for that matter.
-P
Estimates are out for Tuesday now.
A&D: $3.6 million
Star Trek: $3.4 million
Wolverine: $1.1 million
Monsters vs. Aliens (I’m including since it’s probably a race between this and Star Trek for the first to $200 million at this point): $215,000
This puts Star Trek at $155.5 million for the year, passing both Wolverine and Fast and Furious for 2nd for the year so far. This is a somewhat steep 26% drop for Star Trek from Monday, and a similarly steep 24% drop for A&D from Monday (Star Trek dropped 13% in it’s first Monday-to-Tuesday drop, Wolverine dropped 4.1% in it’s second Monday-to-Tuesday drop)
Today’s estimates:
http://www.showbizdata.com/contacts/dailybox.htm
Yearly total before today’s estimates:
http://www.boxofficemojo.com/yearly/chart/?yr=2009&p=.htm
Closettrekker:
You secretly LOVE Star Trek V. Admit it.
Its clear Shatner “gets it” with his “spot-on” characterization of the “Big Three.” It has horses, Uhura finally gets to (pretend to) sing, and the story of Sybok gives us an increased understanding of Spock’s background and character, and Sarek’s pre-marital oat-sewing days. Who knows how many other kids Sarek has pre-Amanda?
And the message continues to resonate on many levels.
I wonder what’s planned for the 20th anniversary? ;-)
Heh, ST V.
My aunt bought me this movie when I was 9? (the fourth VHS I owned). Didn’t have the heart to tell her she bought be the crappy one. I really wanted TWOK. Oh well, it was on Fox’s “Sunday Matinee” at least once a month for like 5 years, so it was like I owned it already.
-P
#128 “And to think the showrunners of TNG and the spin-offs actually thought it beneficial to veer as far away from the TOS formula as possible. Crazy”
Reading this comment made me think about Scotty in Generations. Hearing all the TNG-ish technobabble out of his mouth was very, very, very painful :)
136:
Josh:
The US numbers are becoming increasingly less meaningful.
Internationally, Wolverine is at $275.5m, with 45% coming from overseas. Trek is at $220m, with 31% from overseas.
“F&F” did $171m overseas, almost 53% of its take of $324m (!) (Box Office Mojo)
If Trek can do “F&F” numbers, I’ll be very surprised.
Trek V, down in its soul, is a wonderful TOS story with a very interesting sci-fi/social theme. I liked TFF more than any other TNG movie (even First Contact, yes). Problem was: bad directing, cheesy writing, bad sfx. It could have been way better.
140 – Not to discount overseas markets, but no one really pays attention to them as far as I can tell (well, other than you, maybe). I’m sure the bean counters do, but I’ve never really seen anything that suggests that anything but domestic performance is the most important indicator of whether a movie is ultimately successful or not. Maybe it’s because I’m not a movie insider, but you don’t very often see things like “this movie bombed domestically, but did great overseas, so it was a smashing success!”
#135—My kids have never been TOS fans, although they loved the new film and enjoy some of the original films. But they could not get past the dated look of TOS and the 1960’s era special effects, etc. before now.
My oldest son likes VOY (go figure), although I consider it the weakest of the series. He also likes ENT and (like me) some of DS9’s later episodes.
I was disappointed in TNG when it debuted, since I was expecting to see an updated version of the same kind of entertainment in TOS. And my sons (although it was pretty old itself by then) found it boring as well.
One thing is certain, though. My sons and I enjoyed ST09 together tremendously, and that makes me very happy. It reminded me of the way I used to enjoy watching TOS reruns with my dad and uncles in the 70’s.
We’re now starting to run through my top-20 list of great TOS episodes together, and they are a bit more open now, with invigorated interest in the original characters—-
“Where No Man Has Gone Before”
“Arena”
“Space Seed”
“The City On The Edge Of Forever”
“The Menagerie, Part I”
“The Menagerie, Part II”
“Balance Of Terror”
“Court-Martial”
“The Doomsday Machine”
“Errand Of Mercy”
“Journey To Babel”
“Friday’s Child”
“The Trouble With Tribbles”
“Amok Time”
“The Enterprise Incident”
“Day Of The Dove”
“The Corbomite Manuever”
“The Tholian Web”
“The Immunity Syndrome”
“Obsession”
They’ll still probably laugh at some of the “effects”, etc., but we’re already having a good time with it—and they’re full of questions.
#140, I agree. I have been looking at global numbers the whole time, even A&D is $153 mill at 67% foreign and that is just the first weekend. DVC did over $750 mil. in the end. If Trek even does those numbers …
But I have a hard time understanding this perceived competition. The only thing competition means to Trek is who is going to enter the field to dilute Trek’s take week after week. As far as I’m concerned Trek has done all it needs to and will easily clear $300 worldwide before it’s over, which is better than any Trek before it. The fact that Trek continues to hold fairly high numbers after its first week is fantastic. But A&D is holding good numbers too, not Trek numbers, but then A&D is not the same kind of audience.It is a steady earner. There is so much excitement about Trek’s opening weekend, but come on, Trek is still Trek and at some point, people with other interests are going to look at entertainment that appeals to them more than Sci-Fi as they come to market. The fact that Trek is rated s highly only helps ensure it will be a steady earner, helping keep it in the theatres, whereas in the past it was not.
142:
Josh:
“I’ve never really seen anything that suggests that anything but domestic performance is the most important indicator of whether a movie is ultimately successful or not.”
Here are some BOM numbers:
The Dark Knight:
Domestic: $533,345,358 53.2%
Foreign: $468,576,467 46.8%
Worldwide: $1,001,921,825
Angels and Demons (to date)
Domestic: $50,941,379 33.3%
Foreign: $102,060,465 66.7%
Worldwide: $153,001,844
Believe me, the international numbers are equally as important as US numbers. Sales are sales.
#137—”You secretly LOVE Star Trek V. Admit it. ”
What gave it away?
Seriously, I’ve said it before a thousand times, and may say it a thousand more before my time on Earth is done—-(IMO)The Great Trek Turd Of ‘89 is the lone pimple on the butt of an otherwise pretty decent film series (the original films), and I mean that with the utmost sincerity!
:)
#145—”Believe me, the international numbers are equally as important as US numbers. Sales are sales.”
Agreed.
When I seel product to someone in Scotland, for instance, the money spends just the same!
ST09 is doing wonderfully well in the US, but its overseas gross is nothing to write home about.
That doesn’t suggest that the type of success it is having is not significant by any means, but Star Trek is not a global phenomenon, and believe me—Paramount would love it to be. Perhaps the sequel will do better abroad, once ST09 on dvd has an impact upon people who didn’t bother to see it in theaters.
Batman Begins’s dvd release did that for alot of people—myself included. I was not excited at all about a new Batman movie, but once I saw BB on dvd, I *was* excited about TDK, and so was my wife (a typical chick-flick type).
#142 – Josh, trust me, if A&D doesn’t clear $100 mill domestically, but goes on to earn $750 million worldwide … there WILL be another Dan Brown sequel. But if Trek did not clear $100 mill domestically and did no better internationally, it’s future would be in question.
In your defense, the studio has more control of the domestic box office and therefore makes a higher profit in most cases. This is one of the reasons why foreign numbers are late being reported. Also, the USA has traditionally been the country with the most disposable income, meaning if a film is successful here, the studio can use that as a gauge of how well its ancillary products and merchandising is going to do. Hard to say if that is going to continue to be the case under the current economic climate.
Star Trek scored a perfect 100 on flicketz.com? That is the first time I think that is ever happened on the flicketz fanscore i belivee. Wow, awesome for such a great movie.
Woops. Forget to mention..I wonder how it will hold up when the new FanScore releases tomorrow. I’m predicting a steady 100!!
148.
Speaking of merchandising. I saw a display of ST toys at Meijer yesterday–they were nearly sold out. It looked like there were only 2 of what must have been at least 10-15 enterprises, two transporter playsets (out of a possible 10) and only two figures left (a scotty and a spock) out of what must have been 30. Looks to be doing OK. Also saw the small figures–they don’t seem to sell as well, but they looked to be doing better than the SW toys.
-P
#148—Yes, the current economic climate will have a larger impact upon the sales of Trek related items, but Box-Office sales do not traditionally suffer significantly under such circumstances as economic recession. That is fortunate for ST09. For some reason, people do not surrender their Hollywood escapes, even where they might put a cap on other non-essential expenses.
And yes, the studios are afforded a larger percentage of profits from domestic sales. However, that does not mean that gross sales abroad are less important. It only means that the margins are smaller!
But in fairness, I do not believe that Paramount was naive enough to honestly employ any delusions of grandeur for ST09 abroad. This is probably about what was expected overseas, outside of traditionally strong markets like the other English-speaking nations and Germany. Those relatively reasonable expectations were never going to stop them from trying to market the film elsewhere—but I don’t think there is any particular “disappointment”. If there is, then they were never really thinking straight to begin with.
One more example. Look at ST:FC’s BO numbers (same source):
Domestic: $92,027,888 63.0%
Foreign: $54,000,000 37.0%
Worldwide: $146,027,888
On a percentage basis of overall BO revenue, Trek09 is trailing ‘First Contact’ internationally by over 6 pct. points. There are many factors which can go into this, like having new “Trek” on the air at the time internationally
My opinion is that the int’l marketing centered too much on junkets and securing reviews than on actually informing the public about the film in cinemas and on TV.
One poster here, from Poland (’Jean-Luc’) posted that there has been no publicity in his country of 39m people, where sparkling new multiplexes are all over the place, almost completely unadorned with posters.
The world is a big place, and the Trek franchise should look at a goal of 50/50 US to international as its comfort zone, IMHO.
Should the (Supreme Court) consider producing an animated version of “Star Trek Countdown” in the style of: The Animatrix – Final Flight of the Osiris? >here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=asbHiZtvMhc
With all of the actors available to lend their voices to the lead character in the graphic novel –it would seem that this new content (short film) could be marketed with a remastered and edited blue ray version of STTNG: The Next Generation” Unification: Part 1 & 2 — This two disk set would not only be quickly snapped-up by the fan base but, to the New Audience you have created with “Star Trek”, become a very powerful marketing tool for Paramount / CBS for the marketing of all Star Trek franchise Disk / Blue Ray content to this brand new audience.— When Marketed next year with the Blue Ray release of Star Trek.
Rick
Our mythic touchstone and folklore fountain is….Star Trek.
Congratulations on Star Trek’s second week of Box Office success. And, thank you both for indulging the fans of the franchise with this TrekMovie Forum– and with this forum you have given us, fans of this American mythology, the possibility and or the illusion that we can help shape its future.
I love the TMP penguin suit Pike had on at the end…to bad we didn’t get the blinky lights and the yes/no beeps from “Menagerie”. That would been awesome! :-p
#152 CLOSETTREKKER WROTE: “but I don’t think there is any particular “disappointment”. If there is, then they were never really thinking straight to begin with.”
You are not wrong. Paramount knew what they were doing when Vicom split up with CBS. Paramount was left with the DVD of the films only and a percentage of the distribution revenue of the TV series. Paramount immediately cancelled Enterprise, sold all of the old TV sets , props and costumes and made as much revenue as they could before turning the assets over to CBS. Then they put a $150+ million dollar investment into re-creating a franchise that they owned – the films. They knew exactly what they were doing. Trek is an incredibly valuable franchise regardless of how well the recent movies have done. It is proven with a proven fanbase. So was Abrams. While producing any film (or product for that matter) always carries a risk, I think Paramount knew exactly what they were doing and as such, Trek carried very little risk for them. They always knew it would do well – it was hardly a gamble especially when you consider their overall motives: Trek was stripped from them and they needed to spend enough to start a new one so as to maximize the value of their existing film library.
156:
RD
I believe I read somewhere that CBS asked PP if they were going to activate the option to do another film, for which CBS gets a fee. And perhaps the rights would have then reverted to CBS had PP refused.
If someone here knows the facts, please spill them.
155.
Also loved the tmp nod.
-P
From all reports, it seems to me that Paramount didn’t invest a lot of money promoting the movie outside a few key markets. If it is true that they spent $150M to promote the movie, then maybe expending more to promote it in smaller markets was too risky. Maybe their strategy was to make sure that the movie was a success in the US, its main market, then worry about the rest of world later, when they release the DVD or with the next movie. Paramount had a difficult task with this movie, not just let people know that the movie was coming but also to convince them that the movie was different and worth seeing. I am sure next time they won’t need to spend as much money marketing it here in the US, and will be free to concentrate in the international markets. They also have the opportunity to do that during the DVD release. I can bet that the DVD release of Star Trek is going to be huge. And DVD sales can be as much as 60% of the total revenue for a movie nowadays.
#157 – AJ, CBS owns the series, the scripts, the copyrights, etc. I’m not sure the intricacies of their exact deal or the split, but CBS has the exclusive rights to license and merchandise the properties stemming from the original scripts. Paramount has to secure the rights from CBS for every film, there is no question of reverting. Whether there is some deal that allows Paramount to make movies or not without paying a license fee is irrelevant, since CBS gets all the revenue from all other exploitation except for DVD (on which they are surely a profit participant as is Paramount on the ancillary merchandise). You brought this up before, so I’m not sure your exact question. Is it that you think Paramount owns the underlying rights to Trek and will lose them if they stop making movies? If so I think that is incorrect. CBS is in no hurry to start dropping $150 million on features, as they just entered the theatrical business, but eventually I can see it. That does not preclude a deal between them giving Paramount exclusive right of first refusal to make the movies, which goes to what you indicate. As soon as they stop, or a particular number is reached, the deal is null and Paramount will have to negotiate to make another one with every other studio. There was nothing amicable about the split between CBS & Vicaom, but I’m sure everything was done legally to prevent CBS from crippling Parmount’s ability to make films based on franchises it built over its history. Since National Amusements is the majority shareholder of both, there is further incentive to make the two companies play nice together and keep their profits on one product coming from the same place. NA has no interest in seeing Sony make a Trek film because it does not directly benefit them. But CBS is its own company and is subject not just to NA but its other stock holders as well.
Flamers of Bergman and Brana,
Let me remind you of a little truth…the Great Bird picked them (at least Bergman) as associate stewards for TNG. Obviously, he wasn’t planning on dying two years later, whereupon Bergman had to take over and carry on the torch. The fact that the *creator* of Trek picked Bergman says a lot.
TNG was a quality show and a good exemplar of the many intrinsics that make Trek work. It was a huge gamble at the time, because there hadn’t been any Trek on TV in 17 years except for a season of animateTrek, which had the redeeming qualities of cast reprisal and DC Fontana. They were taking up a new crew in the series, the TOS would be forever relegated to ‘another’ Trek series…I could go on and on. But the point is, it worked. It succeeded, and Bergman had no small role in that.
DS9 is the bastard child of Trek, consistently overlooked by fans and critics. But many will say its a quality series, part of Trek canon. Some of us TrekFans would love to see Avery Brooks put on the uniform for one more time. DS9 overlapped TNG in production terms, which meant that Brannon was making two series at once for two years. Oh, and you might wanna take note that IMDB’s poll shows DS9 as third in popularity, barely beaten out by TNG. Making Trek characters less heroes and more human was a huge risk…I mean, Kirk’s kid was seen in one film and killed off in the next, because who wants a hero ‘burdened’ by domestic issues…while Sisco’s character raised his son from teenage years to a young adult while captaining a Starbase.
Voyager was good, Enterprise had some great moments as well, but I won’t labor the point other than to point out that again, Bergman and now Braga were working on two series and a movie at the same time during some of those years. And First Contact is a gem of a film.
Bergman was responsible for stewarding 18 years of Star Trek, and I keep reading ‘bum-rush’ dismissive reviews saying he ‘ruined’ Trek. The truth of the matter is, he *preserved* Trek and improved it in many cases. Of course there was rotten eggs, but even Roddenberry could make a stinker like “Spock’s Brain”, so no one’s perfect. I’m not saying that Bergman is a sacred cow in the franchise, but I maintain that he and Braga (and Moore and others) kept Trek going when it otherwise might have died. Those of us in the 70s remember “Trek Lives!” as more than a battle cry of fangirls and fanboys.
It is specious and facile to reimagine history by simply saying “what came before sucked” in the face of the currency and popularity of a novel aesthetic expression. People were saying Picasso sucked while Dali was popular, using the same ‘logic’ to justify their perspectives. Picasso didn’t suck.
Now, we are faced with a similar situation. Roddenberry (Da Vinci) *is* a sacred cow to many fans, so his eminence in the Trek heterarchy is assured. Bergman (Picasso) brought Trek into a new school and increased the Trek canon 700% over the previous one by being part of 26 seasons of Trek and 3 films. That’s an enormous body of work, to say the least. Saying Bergman sucks is almost dismissive of that entire stretch of Trek. Now Abrams (Dali) has shuffled the canon once again and projected it into 21st century sensitivies by creating a newer, faster, Trek and all of a sudden, people find Bergman/Braga to be very easy targets because their Trek suddenly seems ‘old’, or because they judge their body of work by the fact that Enterprise got lower viewership, low ratings, and was canceled. So Baywatch is better than the TOS because it has a bigger Nielson rating? Using such measures is utter b**llshit!
All is this is why I stand firm in offering my respect to Bergman et. al. It’s entirely possible (in an alternative timeline sense) that there might not even *be* a Star Trek today if it weren’t for his efforts. For many of us, but not all, Bergman’s contribution were evocative and entertaining, worthwhile of holding the Trek mantle.
It’s easy to say to be a naysayer and stick with a STFU attitude, but its more difficult to say “this is cool” when it goes against the grain. But you know what? The original fans of Trek did just that. Trek survived and thrived, and as a threadline result of that type of courage, we’re treated to a killer Trek movie in 2009. If it weren’t for that kind of fan-based effort, Trek would be in TV purgatory with shows like “Hey Landlord” (I’m sure everyone of you have heard of and admired that series, which ran contiguously on the same network as Star Trek). Actually, I doubt it.
But I don’t doubt the Trek that Berman had a hand in making.
#159—-I’m not certain, but I think $150 million on promotion is someone’s estimate. I’ll admit that I have no idea where that number comes from.
But nevertheless, I wouldn’t say that it is neceesarily wasted on non-traditional markets.
If you think long-term, those marketing endeavors may have more far-reaching payoffs. While they may not have successfully convinced people in those markets to go to theaters, they may have been effective enough to persuade them to check it out later on dvd. If so, those potential moviegoers may be more inclined to go and see the next one.
When I run ads for my business, sometimes I don’t really see the benefits right away. Advertising has a cumulative effect—and determining which ads or ad methods are most successful isn’t based upon which ones are most immediately gratifying either. This is why my cumulative notes on how my clients get referred to me are so important, and I don’t grade any particular marketing strategy I might have employed for quite a long time. Otherwise, my ability to reach a conclusion is really inadequate.
The same principle is true in this case. Determining whether the marketing efforts in those non-traditional markets were truly justified or not may not really be possible until we see how those markets perform a few years from now when the inevitable sequel is released there. If (assuming there is as much or more effeort in those markets) say, a 2011 release shows no improvement in performance over ST09 in those markets, then yes—perhaps Paramount was spitting in the wind. But if those markets show significant increase in BO for Star Trek—-then the past investment is probably more justified.
109…………Hell Ya….B&B Did Rape Trek……
Esp. These are the Voyages….which was by the way their last Trek TV production ever for those Trek and History buffs….. And Nemesis was their last film…
Other big competition that is coming ahead is Up, Harry Potter and Ice Age 3…..
163:
Closet:
I agree. And I think PP has to look at its marketing spend cumulatively over the next three films, and keep the flame/anticipation alive during the gaps.
In the past, I always had the impression that, when a Trek film was released theatrically, and then on video, that all promotion on a Franchise basis just stopped (the buzz was always ‘will there be another one?’) Money has to be spent both here (US) and abroad to grow enthusiasm and create anticipation, or else shorter attention spans (kids) will move on to whatever’s next.
And spending money to remind people of something they have forgotten about in the last two years is a waste.
In any case, I rate the current foreign gross on a pct. basis as ‘underwhelming’ for what my two cents are worth.
Heh, I just remembered this subject was about new ships. I noticed the other night (my second viewing of the film) that either the enterprise shrinks, or Pike’s shuttle inflates during the scene in which he flies over to the Narada. My friend turned to me and said “what just happened? I thought there were like 15 shuttles in there, why is his so big now?”
I smiled and said “welcome to Star Trek.”
I think it was at that moment that I realized that this is a true ST film. Ah tiny defiants, giant excelsiors and indeterminately-sized enterprises, oh my.
Loved it.
-P
This movie is the Start of a New Universe, A New Reality – Star Trek 09′ is the Start of the NEW CANON…..
#163, yeah, but there’s a whole month before the really big ones. I fully expect Land of the Lost to attract a big opening audience too.
The fact is, after three sci-fi/action films and a serious drama, all of which will do well opening weekend, audiences will likely be ready for comedies and “UP” has 100% on RT. Pixar has always done extremely well. LOTL has Will Ferrell and a huge kitsch, nostalgia base in the target demo all of which work in its favor. The reality is that by the beginning of June, there will be so many entertaining choices that it will be impossible for Trek to sustain the kinds of numbers it is getting now for the next few weeks. But the good news is, it will have all of June to recover before Harry Potter comes along and should continue to attract a steady numbers through the Summer. The HUGE numbers who saw Trek are those who really wanted to see it and they have. All that’s left is repeat viewers (and how many times can a fan really see it?) and those who don’t necessarily care one way or the other but just want to kill a couple of hours in air-conditioning.
#162 – I completely agree. I was just pointing out the fact that many trekkers outside the US were reporting that ST was being badly advertized in their countries, even in parts of Europe. So that is why I suggested that perhaps Paramount decided to concentrate their efforts in the US first, then leave the smaller markets for when the movie get eventually released on DVD (by then they would evaluate if the movie was worth the extra marketing push). That is why I think the DVD release will be huge worldwide.
But I agree with you, the sequel is probably going to open bigger worldwide, and if it is as good as the current movie, will make 30%+ more money.
BTW, just to show how bad the movie is doing in some countries, 290,000 people saw ST in Brazil so far, versus 2.5M that saw Wolverine. Just like in the US, the movies were released a week apart. 768,000 people saw Angels and Demons just last weekend. I am Brazilian but I am currently living in the US, so I have no idea how heavily the movie was marketed over there, but from the numbers I suppose it didn’t get a lot of exposition. With Wolverine, they had Hugh Jackman visiting Brazil to promote the movie.
#162, that number comes from this LA Times article and fits with a common estimate for a blockbuster, where the film’s marketing budget is roughly half of the budget per market (DOM/FOR).
http://theenvelope.latimes.com/la-fi-ct-boxoffice11-2009may11,3,3372044.story
This New Canon makes sense….I honestly don’t have the time to watch all of the series in their entireties…. I have a life, a gf and a career Ithat I am pursuing… I guess that is why I tend to prefer to watch movies over following tv series…
Because this is a new beginning to Trek, I can watch this film and see it as the new canon…. When I want to catch Star Trek, I will watch this film as the jumping off point to future adventures…. New canon, why ?
- Its Contemporary and Current
- Its Production Values, SFX, Visuals, Sets, Locations, and Sound
- Its Young Cast
- Its Popularity, Box Office and Great Critic and Fan Reviews
- Its a fresh, brand new start !!!
Plus this New Canon is great !!! People will have one adventure to watch in the Trek Universe now… It’s nice, simple, accessible and no one has to now watch hours and hours every week to stay current or catch up…no DVD box set to buy…. Just one film :) Plus this movie leaves you wanting to see a sequel !!! Trek Is Meant for the Big Screen !!!!
171.
Well, why don’t you marry it?
(kidding)
Its weird that you say that because every person that I have taken with me to see the movie that hasn’t already watched the previous ST movies/series prior, has come out WANTING to see them. This movie doesn’t work as well, in my opinion, if you know nothing. People I couldn’t get to watch ST now want to borrow my DVDs. So, at least in my case, your way of seeing it doesn’t hold water. IF that is what works for you though, that is fine. I think there is a lot of richness and excellent storytelling that you miss out on, but hey, to each their own.
For me, I love making my g/f and I dinner and sitting down together with my cat in our lap(s) and enjoying TNG or TOS. She is even more excited about the other incarnations and movies now that she has seen this movie. I too have a career and a life, but its these quiet moments that are great, that you can’t have in a theatre. If anything, I like this movie even more for getting her more excited about watching ST (TNG had already made her excited as it was–she kept asking me what was going to happen to X character or X planet).
This new movie is quite good for the reasons you mention (some have to do with budget and are superficial) but it is also good because it is the same characters that wouldn’t exist if there was nothing before it. There are just as many reasons to watch prior trek, not the least of which is intelligent commentary (which is always missing a little in ST movies). I liked this movie for its message of fathers and sons and how important that relationship is. There are also some smaller things there, but the shows are often better at bringing such things out.
Just my opinion though.
-P
#172—”Its weird that you say that because every person that I have taken with me to see the movie that hasn’t already watched the previous ST movies/series prior, has come out WANTING to see them. This movie doesn’t work as well, in my opinion, if you know nothing.”
I disagree that it is at all strange to hear, especially since giving newcomers an easy entry point was one of the filmmakers stated goals all along (and a smart one at that).
The only thing a newcomer is missing in getting everything out of the film that’s there is perhaps some of the “in-jokes”.
ST09 will probably entice some (like those you mentioned) newcomers to check out past work, but for those who do not feel compelled to make the time (probably a whole lot more, to be honest), it is set up to work just as well as a starting point.
This was a clever method of achieving the advantages of a reboot, without dictating that the adventures depicted over the last 45 years never occurred within this fictional realm (at least for those of us who care). There is a way in for those versed in canon, as well as those who have never seen a single episode or film.
There are alot of “Trekkies, please help me” type questions on the comment boards of RT. It is only a matter of time before some of these newcomers show up here too.
173.
I only meant it was weird in relation my particular case since I witnessed completely opposite reactions from roughly 6 or so of my friends (and more of their friends) (most of which only knew of star trek in passing). They seemed to have a more measured response of “I want to see more ST…now, which means previous star trek, so let me borrow x, y, x, AND I can’t wait for the next film.” Perhaps I just attract OCD people that need to get the most out of a movie (understanding all of the in-jokes and in and outs), or those who have dormant trekker genes. I am willing to accept that. Someone should do a survey or something to see what the average reaction is in terms of desire to see old trek as a direct result of seeing this movie. I think PP is actually banking on the reaction my friends, as evidenced by all of the classic star trek stuff that is coming out bearing the delta look from the new movie. Just like tons of wolverine stuff came out before that movie hit theaters. I suppose only time will tell. I would like to think that there will a lot of both reactions.
I’m actually planning on taking the researchers from my lab (I work at a university), most of which haven’t seen star trek at all, or have only seen it in passing. I’ll let you know what they come out thinking. I only have so many dvds to lend, though.
Ha, interesting. I guess we’re the “cool kids” now, huh?
-P
Terminator is at 36% on Rotten Tomatoes. I think Star Trek will have another big weekend. Your hard core terminator fans will make it the #1 movie but like Wolverine, it will drop off by week 2. Star Trek seems to have staying power due to the great reviews and word of mouth. 95% on Rotten Tomatoes is impressive.
For all the international fans who read these forums, grab a freind and take them to the move this weekend. We need to get the foreign numbers up.
173.
I agree with you that it was a clever way of constructing the movie. I think JJ and Orci/Kurtzman make a great team in this regard–checks and balances. I would’ve liked a little more Orci/Kurtzman, but that’s just me. I respect, and really enjoy, a lot of the choices JJ made though. I think they really brought some of my friends on board.
-P
It’s entirely possible (in an alternative timeline sense) that there might not even *be* a Star Trek today if it weren’t for his efforts
It would have been canceled and rebooted earlier.
As far as movies wise
1) II wrath of khan
2) III sfs
3) Star trek XI
4) VI/first contact
The music on this movie was not that good. I think the best music was in II & III by far. As far as battle scenes in this movie for 150 millioin they could have shown more, like the fed. ships fighting the narada, and also the fleet of klingon ships fighting the narada. The acting in this movie was good and I think each and everyone of them filled the shoes of Kirk,Spock,Bones, Scotty,Uhura, etc. very well.
174. TRICK WROTE: “Someone should do a survey or something to see what the average reaction is in terms of desire to see old trek as a direct result of seeing this movie. …I guess we’re the “cool kids” now, huh?”
The interesting survey would be how they respond to the the old Trek DVDs. This film and the original series, especially the spinoffs, bear NO resemblance to the Trek they saw in the theatre. If anything I would expect someone to view them and say, “oh, now I know why they said this is not your father’s Trek”, here’s your DVDs back. Though I imagine some might find it interesting enough to get into, but hardly the majority.
Also, I’m not entirely sure we’re the “cool kids” yet either. For those of us who go with our non-Trek friends who want to see Terminator or another movie, instead of insisting you go back and see Trek again, or have a marathon of TOS episodes, maybe … ;-)
#146 “Seriously, I’ve said it before a thousand times, and may say it a thousand more before my time on Earth is done—-(IMO)The Great Trek Turd Of ‘89 is the lone pimple on the butt of an otherwise pretty decent film series”
Closet, if you were to rewatch TFF today, I’m certain it would phaser its way into your heart and warp to the top of your Trek films list!
How many times have you seen ‘09 so far? In addition to the secret Austin premiere back on April 6, I’m up to 4 viewings now! Been having to take family, etc. I think I’ve got one more big screen viewing left in me…
179.
So far I’m doing OK. I have one friend working on TOS–he loves it. He blew through the movies (TOS movies are his fav, he liked GEN and FC as well) super fast. I’m trying to convince him to watch TNG next, we’ll see how that goes. Not sure how far through TOS he’ll get, but so far so good.
My g/f really likes TNG–we started it before the movie and now she’s almost done. Going to go back for some TOS love and then to DS9–she is on board.
OK so far. No one has come back with “here is your crap, don’t ever talk to me again, nerd.”
Heh, a guy can dream. Naw, I’m not interested in being cool, but I’m happy to see that people are appreciating the old as well as the new.
-P
#179 – RD Wrote – This film and the original series, especially the spinoffs, bear NO resemblance to the Trek they saw in the theatre. If anything I would expect someone to view them and say, “oh, now I know why they said this is not your father’s Trek”, here’s your DVDs back. Though I imagine some might find it interesting enough to get into, but hardly the majority.”
I agree. I am 50 and work with quite a few 20 something techie geeks. They grew up on TNG and the later series and loved SG and BSG. . Even before the new movie came out, a few decided to get together and watch some TOS episodes. They asked for my recommedations. I suggested Balance of Terror, The City on the Edge of Forever, Space Seed, The Trouble with Tribbles, and Mirror Mirror. They had trouble watching it. What was cutting edge back in ‘66, is VERY outdated to this generation born into a world of laptops and cell phones. Imagine if they had watched Spocks Brain what they would have thought. A couple realized the strong story telling, and that there was some social commentary but overall, they thought it was cheesy and hard to watch.
So if this alternate timeline began when Nero first appeared and destroyed the Kelvin, shouldn’t the Kelvin have looked like a ship from TOS? The bridge should have looked like something just short of Kirk Prime’s Enterprise, the engine room should have looked like an engine room, not a 20th century factory, etc.
I loved the new film, but I haven’t seen anyone make up a theory on this one–what do you all think?
I’m in Ireland, and I have to admit that the movie was well advertised here (in the week leading up to it). But there was nothing like when First contact came out, Alice Krige and Gates McFadden were on many Irish TV and radio programmes both Kids TV and Late night.
I think this is due to the larger cast, but it made a huge difference.
I remember the cinema being full for the Saturday of First contact.
This time the cinema was (a generous) 20% full BOTH times I went for this film. There are NO Kelloggs promotions, prize promotions or competitions, just reviews and some ads on TV.
I am not claiming to speak for euro sales (in Ireland, are you kidding me),
But the lack of any interviews or promotions here hindered the film IMHO.
Then again, going to the cinema is a rip off its €8.50, and is not deemed to be worth it, for any film.
Before I get linched, I loved this film, I just think the promotion for it was lacking.
#183 “I loved the new film, but I haven’t seen anyone make up a theory on this one–what do you all think?”
“We don’t like to talk about it.”
#185 As a fan of 35 years now I demand answers!!! :)
123 BaronByng: “I liked Engineering, it made a lot more sense to me. It looked believable”
I disagree. It may look very contemporary, but that’s exactly what makes it unbelievable. Look at a Royal Navy vessel from about 230 years ago and you’re looking at a wooden sailing ship. Compare it to a contemporary Royal Navy vessel…
I find it totally unbelievable that a spaceship from 230 years in the future should feature anything which looks like 20th century industrial equipment.
Oh, and while we’re at it, here’s my list:
1- TMP
2- TWOK
3- TUC
big gap
4- FC
5- TSFS
6- GEN
gap
7- TVH
8- INS
huge abyss
9- TFF
10- ST09
11- NEM
#180—-I’ve seen it twice (once in IMAX).
But my wife and I are going to see it again on Sunday (after I take her to lunch). Also, she’ll be out of town with my mother-in-law on Memorial Day, so there is a chance I might sneak another one in on Monday with the boys while they are out of school, although it is normally a history channel/dvd-fest on Memorial Day at my house (Patton, Band Of Brothers, etc.), followed by a pickup football or baseball game in the late afternoon.
I imagine 4 times will be my limit. After that, it’s all about waiting for blu-ray. I am just amazed that my wife is open to seeing it again. It was really enough for me that she agreed to see it once!
I have never seen a Star Trek movie during its opening run in theaters more than twice, and the last time I even did it twice was with TVH back in ‘86 (the only other time was TWOK)!
I like this movie….it’s exciting!
161
Roddenberry did not “pick” Berman to take the reins of Star Trek, it was the studio that chose Berman. The real caretakers of Trek were all pushed away by TPTB. It was Paramount and Berman choices that almost ran Star Trek into oblivion. I’ve seen the new film 4 times and I don’t like everthing they have done with it but at least Trek is alive, and there’s the propect of more films to come.
Berman did a great job with TNG, as the tremendous success of it shows. The problem, IMO, was that later 24th century shows became formulaic and unimaginative, and it even spilled over to ENT in some respects, though I love that show and its return to a more adventurous, more TOS-like approach.
But let’s be fair: TOS had become pretty formulaic by the second season already. (Just read Gerrold’s hilarious recipe for a run of the mill TOS plot in his The World of Star Trek.) And any long-running TV show runs out of fresh ideas and becomes complacent at some point.
I used to do a lot of Berman&Braga bashing with my fellow Trekkers in the past, but looking back on Berman’s run it really wasn’t so bad, and particularly so as compared to JJ’s approach.
The only thing to hold a grudge against Berman because of is the – alleged – fact that he would rather let ENT die than handing partial control of the show over to Manny Coto. If true, this really sucks and it lead up to Trek being ruined for me now (well, at least commercially produced Trek).
It makes me sad to imagine an alternate timeline where Manny Coto produces one or two more seasons of ENT and then goes on to produce a TOS based Trek movie, one with young prime Kirk and young prime Spock (obviously played by Zach Quinto).
#191—”I used to do a lot of Berman&Braga bashing with my fellow Trekkers in the past, but looking back on Berman’s run it really wasn’t so bad, and particularly so as compared to JJ’s approach.”
Lol. I think Bad Robot’s take on Trek is fantastic. I cannot even imagine a scenario where I would long for the days of Rick Berman!
I do agree with you about Manny Coto and ENT. However, I would not have wanted him to helm a Trek film production. His talent was and is for television.
Abrams is to 2009 Trek what Nick Meyer was to 1982 Trek, and I think the 3 best directors Trek feature films have ever had are Wise, Abrams, and Meyer—-none of whom were associated with the television series or had prior involvement at all with Star Trek.
As much as I love Robert H. Justman’s (RIP) work on TOS, I wouldn’t have thought he was the best choice to produce a great Star Trek feature film by any means. The same goes for Manny Coto. However, if Bad Robot ever struck a deal with CBS to do a Star Trek television series—Manny Coto would be an excellent guy to bring aboard. I can only imagine what a tv collaboration between he and Damon Lindelof would be like!
As for the present and future of the feature films, for the first time in 30 years, Star Trek has an A-list commodity at the helm—-and there has never before (even with Wise in the chair) been this kind of combination of critical acclaim and financial success with a Star Trek feature.
Criticizing Paramount’s choices in this matter is perfectly within your right—-but hardly with any merit, IMO. While Abrams’ film is certainly not perfect, there can be no realistic assertion that they could have made a better choice. The evidence is all around you, both in the fan community and in the mainstream as well.
And this notion (in #161) that Berman is somehow beyond reproach because GR selected him is ridiculous. Yes—he worked on early TNG with GR, but GR’s decision-making was not always so great.
While he deserves enormous credit for the idea of Star Trek, it was often the people around him that made Star Trek as good as it was. People like Gene L. Coon, Dorothy Fontana, Herbert Solow, and Robert Justman, and even the network executives who “encouraged” GR to make Star Trek more accessible, were key to making Star Trek what it was.
As much credit as he gets and deserves, quite frankly, I never liked the direction he took Star Trek towards the end. It wasn’t fun to me. It was almost as if he said, “Just kidding guys, this is how I *really* envision the future to be.” Gone were the people around him in the 1960’s who helped to temper some of his more questionable concepts, IMO, and those who remained answered only to him.
In many ways, ST09 is far more like Original Trek than Roddenberry’s own 1987 spinoff series ever was. Like ST09, TOS was sexy, humorous, action-oriented, dramatic, adventurous, romantic, and above all else—-fun!
#192: “Lol. I think Bad Robot’s take on Trek is fantastic. I cannot even imagine a scenario where I would long for the days of Rick Berman!”
I consider both approximately equal at this point (and “at this point” is a critical qualifier, since we’re only [likely] 33% finished with AbramsTrek so it’s a bit early to know where things will end up). Both seem to be operating with one arm tied behind their back in terms of the full two-fisted glory that was the original Star Trek.
BermanTrek had the ideals, the ideas, and the social commentary. AbramsTrek has the action, the humor, and the sexiness. Maybe we should try to combine them in some kind of freak Transporter mishap.
I think both BermanTrek and AbramsTrek are equally distant from TOS, in opposite directions.
#193: “While he deserves enormous credit for the idea of Star Trek, it was often the people around him that made Star Trek as good as it was.”
100% agree. The whole “Great Bird” worship thing does an injustice to the many folks who contributed absolutely critical components to the whole (both behind and in front of the camera).
192 Closettrekker: About Coto, Justman: Well, that’s a good point that good TV people needn’t necessarily be good movie producers. As for Coto, I think that his work on ENT was so good (dramatically and visually) that it warrants giving him at least one chance to do a movie.
There’s also a wide consensus that FC was very good, and Frakes came fresh out of TV. But overall, I agree that an accomplished movie director should be the first choice for a Trek *movie*.
“Criticizing Paramount’s choices in this matter is perfectly within your right—-but hardly with any merit, IMO. While Abrams’ film is certainly not perfect, there can be no realistic assertion that they could have made a better choice. The evidence is all around you, both in the fan community and in the mainstream as well.”
My (continued) criticism of JJ was never intended to be other than from my personal perspective. How else should it be? Yes, it is true that a lot of fans and (formerly?) non-fans love the movie. But why is that so? I hope and believe that’s because most of them like the movie because of their own personal preferences, and not because anyone else does and they are playing along.
But if the financial success of the movie is based on a majority among individual preferences, why should my differing preferences be without merit? I was not predicting financial success, I was talking about my dislike for JJ’s directorial choices.
“there can be no realistic assertion that they could have made a better choice”
That’s where I disagree a lot, however, and not just on the basis of my personal preferences. Why shouldn’t it have been possible to make an exciting mainstream movie *without* mutilating established Trek to such a degree? Why shouldn’t it have been possible to do it without an alternate timeline? There’s next to no canon about the time between ENT and Where No Man….
I believe that a financially successful mainstream DFX movie could have been made with a director who does not disrespect previous Trek to the extent that JJ does.
I believe, given your statement above, it is rather up to you to show why it’s not possible to make a better movie, e.g. a movie which is just as successful in the mainstream as the present movie, but which has the additional feature of respecting the Trek legacy to a much greater extent.
I suppose this would undoubtedly have been an even better movie (not just a movie which I personally like better) because with such a movie the, oh, I don’t know, maybe 10% of Trek fans who hate ST09 could have been taken on board, too. With only little effort.
#196: “I suppose this would undoubtedly have been an even better movie (not just a movie which I personally like better) because with such a movie the, oh, I don’t know, maybe 10% of Trek fans who hate ST09 could have been taken on board, too. With only little effort.”
I suspect that at least a few Trek fans “love” the movie not because they love the movie, but because they love seeing a product which is branded “Star Trek” make a lot of money and be popular (and, at this stage in the game, exist).
There’s an old saying: hunger is the best sauce.
197: Good point.
#81:
Wrong.
They both did subchildish scripts, and I could write better than the both of them as a 16 year old.
it’s a kick when they jump to warp..
wonder what it will sound if the speakers were the size of houses….
”punch it”
BOOM!! oh yeah