Sock FTW!

Well, I’d say the 2Q definitely shows this ST did not and will not make a profit at the BO. I’d say that awaits your projected $400 million in disc sales. And the only other thing to note is that Spyglass isn’t going to see any money until long after Paramount recoups all its “expenses” – not to mention CBS if you are right about the profit participation.

And as Orci takes on more and more projects, e.g. LICENSE TO STEAL, chances are his involvement in ST:SS’s actual writing will diminish. It will be interesting to see if he makes it to the final draft.

1) Everything Orci has said, o/b/o himself and Kurtzman, indicate that he will not change his position regarding MWI QM. Since they, Abrams and Lindelof are calling all the shots, their vote certainly weighs in heavily. Interestingly, Lindelof is using traditional time-travel rules on his show LOST: i.e. the past effects the future. I don’t believe Abrams has weighed in, but has supported Orci as the keeper of Trek canon.

2) Trek has not made MWI QM canon. At anytime, Abrams and Lindelof could override Orci if they wanted to make a story using the Guardian, or the Mirror Universe. This would have the effect of making Orci look like an idiot, but otherwise does not violate ANY established canon.

3) We are engaged in idle speculation here. If Abrams doesn’t do a film about The Guradian, or Mirror universes or Time travel, then there is no need to worry about what physics laws Orci personally thinks are in play in this universe. There have been plenty of effective fan retcon explanations of why Spock Prime does not behave as I would expect him to, or why Daniels or some other time police don’t come back to fix the problem, the least of which is Spock Prime is formulating a way to most effectively fix the timeline, which won’t happen until a new team takes over the franchise and permits traditional time travel. With any luck Mr. Nimoy will be alive to make that movie that finally returns Spock to his own universe.

4) The reality is that as long as Abrams makes money at the box office, the current producers could go on for 10-15 years. I would expect at least 6 or 7 films with this cast due to their age and based on the sustained success of the franchise and ability of the actors to do other work which keeps them coming back. What’s sad, is that adhering to MWI QM means no more time travel stories. Who cares if Trek’s traditional view of time travel doesn’t adhere to modern scientific theory? Time travel is good clean fun. Audiences enjoy it and it makes for good dramatic story telling. It’s escapism at its best and is particularly relevant to Sci-Fi. There’s great irony that it is used to good effect on LOST yet disdained in Trek. The most successful films in the series involved time travel: TVH & FC. ST09 doesn’t really count since the time travel is not the point of the film – there’s no fixing the polluted timeline. Some of the most popular episodes in the franchise are time travel related. It’s because it’s a good dramatic device which has the same effect for the audience as the enormously successful Christmas classic “It’s A Wonderful Life”. Sadly, if Orci had his way there would have been no Jimmy Stewart classic, as Jimmy could have never gone back to his own universe to learn his lesson after visiting the Mirror Universe.

OK. I understand what your saying. I just think Orci isn’t the one to decide to change whatever he wants in Star Trek. If he decides that only his way is the way, then for me, he has crossed the very fat line that Star Trek has between good and bad. And I for one want him to know that he has.

WTF? Is he the only one who can call the shots now. Does he make the rules? YES and NO.

If he tried so hard to not break canon with Star Trek 2009, then he can’t just break canon now forgetting that time travel in Star Trek exist, and not just his Red Matter time travel.

To Mr. Orci:
You do not make the rules for Star Trek, so stop it. The Guardian exist and you can’t do anything about it.

Don’t take offense to my comments. I just want you to know how I (and probably more fans) feel about your decision to disregard all that came BEFORE you.

The point is as long as Oric is driving, the plots are going to adhere to MWI QM. Which means, Spock cannot go back to his own universe, No Guardian of Forever, No slingshotting around the sun, etc.

I personally see this movie as a reboot. Period. For me this is no different than Batman Begins. I could care less if all the pieces from the old series & films fit together with the new. I’ll just enjoy whatever they see fit to offer up (and criticize accordingly ;-). Afterall, it’s not real, it’s just fiction.

But unless Orci changes his mind, there will be no new fiction involving time travel, or inter-universe travel. So, there’s no need to worry about whether The Guardian works the same way or not, or if it even still exists.

Would you not watch the movie “The Time Machine”, because it’s version of time travel isn’t real?

For me, every time travel scene counts. You can’t just forget about all that came before. There are various ways of time travel in the “TREK UNIVERSE” (fiction).
I believe (in trek universe) that you can time travel with guardian of forever, slingshot around sun, blackholes, wormholes, and advanced and future technologies and lifeforms.

ITS FICTION. NOT REAL.

I must agree with *John from Cincinnati*

I also think that Prime Spock dosen’t have to fix anything, he just has to go back to his universe. And FIN.
We already have the new actores in their new roles (new faces for old characters). Now they can be in the Prime universe without problems. They are just the new faces introduced for all our benefits. They can make the Pre-Trek now without having to use Alternate universes as new Prime universes.

Its all Fiction. Science FICTION at that. I don’t care about the tecnologies as much as I do for the incredible stories told.

ANY and EVERY thing should count.

My friend you have totally missed the point of what has been discussed for months on this forum.

Orci has stated that MWI QM is theory which provides for time travel. There will be no more linear timetravel as long as he is writing. Therefore, no Gurdian, no slingshotting around the sun, no Atavacron. And yes, it is a different application of physics than understood for TOS.

The fact that Lt. Uhura said “an alternate reality” on camera only confirms that Spock’s reality is different from her own. Not that they are living in an alternate universe.

Calling Spock “Prime” does nothing to establish his importance vis-a-vis canon. Canon = On Screen, NOT cut scenes, dialogue, merchandise, novels or writer’s elaborations. All I infer “Prime” to mean in this case is “first”.

Bottom line, nothing you’ve proposed matters as long as:

1) Orci does not make MWI QM canon and/or
2) A future writer does decide to go back to the traditional method of time travel.

For now, there will be no more traveling through time or universes, probably for a decade or more. I contend by that time, Pine and Quinto will have supplanted Shatner and Nimoy and not only will future producers NOT go back to the “Prime” timeline, the “alternate” timeline will have supplanted the “Prime” timeline as the defacto Trek universe for all future generations. But that of course IS speculation.