Perhaps it is a matter of perspective but, I believe the battle was concluded by the time Kirk discussed saving and then opened fire on Nero. In Scotty’s immortal words, he was dead already. Technically speaking, the “climax” of the film was the defeat of Nero, which had already happened and the reason for this debate. The escape of the Enterprise was an “encore”, but part of the downward slope of the narrative away from the defeat of Nero. So technically I think this part of the film qualifies as dénouement, and though debatable is certainly not deserving of a literature lesson.

#262. Shatner_Fan_Prime wrote: “I’m still seeing a double standard from some fans. Are you also displeased that Kirk and Spock didn’t beam Khan out of the Reliant before it blew? And was it really necessary for Kirk and Sulu to completely destroy General Chang’s Bird of Prey once it became visible and was damaged? How many Star Trek films before ST 09 ended with the bad guy being ‘brought to trial?’ That’s right – none.”

I don’t see a double standard. I see a one time offense in this film, that is not repeated in the others. Justifiably killing anyone is a fine moral line that will likely be debated as long as the practice continues. Nevertheless, there are ethical standards by which human beings attempt to conduct themselves, which are voided in this film.

1) TWOK is NOT the same thing. Khan was actively trying to destroy the enterprise. The only thing they were doing was putting as much distance between the Reliant as possible. They never discussed saving Khan, nor even discussed Khan again, and they certainly didn’t blow the Reliant out of the sky to get even.
2) I don’t think you are remembering TUC correctly. Spock & McCoy modified a photon torpedo to target the BOP’s exhaust in order to locate it, once the torpedo impacted it revealed the ship, and without knowing how much damage it had caused, or how long they would have their edge, both ships immediately fired on the revealed target to prevent it from returning fire.
3) There was no bad guy to rescue in TMP or TVH. Kirk repeatedly demonstrated his humanity in TSFS and Maltz quite likely was brought to trial. I don’t believe the bad guy was destroyed in TFF, in fact the Klingons ended up apologizing to Kirk. GEN’s bad guys were both killed actively fighting. FC faced a foe that will never give up … you can’t save a Borg. INS once again dealt with a bad guy who died fighting as did NEM – both trying to use their awful weapons decisively. Did you do ANY research before you wrote that statement?
4) Nero was dead in the water. A sinking ship – doomed to die as he and his ship were ripped apart in a black hole. No threat whatsoever. He and his crew were summarily executed after a short deliberation. Plain and simple.

And anyway, what previous films or episodes did is not the point, it’s what this film chose to do when they could have taken a higher road. Nevertheless, I am seeing a higher standard of perceived ethics in previous Trek, which I have come to expect.

#262. Shatner_Fan_Prime wrote: “only Orci can say for sure why the Enterprise fired on the sinking Narada”

While that may be true, like many other things Orci has said off-screen, they are not canon if we can’t see them in the movie. The casual audience is unlikely to ever hear Orci’s explanation, so it is moot. What is evident on screen is that Kirk & Spock conspire to show no mercy to Nero and essentially kill the survivors of a sinking ship out of revenge with grins on their faces.

Then both audiences I saw the film with howled with laughter in error. I’l be sure to pass along your correction to them if I see them at the cinema again. “AJ says you laughed wrong.” I’m sure they’ll take care to be very somber next time, and probably send you thanks for your expert correction of their mistake.

First, a denouement takes place after a climax. The scenes following the final battle (Kirk’s promotion/two Spocks/Enterprise launch) would have qualified as denouement, but not the battle itself.

Second, I’m still seeing a double standard from some fans. Are you also displeased that Kirk and Spock didn’t beam Khan out of the Reliant before it blew? And was it really necessary for Kirk and Sulu to completely destroy General Chang’s Bird of Prey once it became visible and was damaged? How many Star Trek films before ST 09 ended with the bad guy being ‘brought to trial?’ That’s right – none.

As I said, only Orci can say for sure why the Enterprise fired on the sinking Narada…

Assuming the “Jellyfish” has a warp core, I’d assume that Spock set it to explode upon impact, which I think is what the Kelvin did (based on the actual size of the explosion before the film’s credits).

That being the case, it was already proven that 23rd century weaponry had little or no impact on the Narada, so the dramatic shot of the E shooting at it is just that: dramatic. Shooting at a sinking ship with rescuable people on board.

Hence, Bob Orci should weigh in.

Nero’s death scene was not “played for laughs.”

Kirk did offer Nero & Co. the chance to be rescued. He then deferred to his new best bud Spock before hearing Nero’s irrational rant. And then, as Nero’s ship sank and disintegrated, the E came in with full phasers to make sure everyone was stone dead.

Implications in the “Star Trek” universe:

1. The Vulcan High Council is deprived of the ability to meet and try those who destroyed its people’s homeworld. That is pretty crappy.

2. Kirk, as a stowaway on the E, who was then promoted to First Officer, and then who coerced its acting Captain to try to kill him so that he could replace him, murders Nero and his remaining crew. This, after he had the chance, on board the Narada to take Nero into custody. The Enterprise was fully capable, during the film’s denouement, of transporting unconcious Romulans aboard for incarceration before trial. This is proven by Kirk’s ease of escape with Pike.

I think, the older, more detail oriented “Trek” would have thought this out, and perhaps Messrs Orci and Kurtzman thought Kirk’s request to save Nero’s crew fulfils the “moral” obligation to observe the law. But it’s not the same as a violation of the Prime Directive. Kirk and Spock actually murdered wanted and untried criminals. If Nero had self-destructed, it would have been different.

DEFINATELY!

(d’oh!)

For me….it’s being able to change “teh” back to “the.” Because of the frequency of that typo, it’s become a part of our lexicon. Sadness….

Use NERO! Start the sequel by showing flashbacks. They already filmed a bunch of scenes of him with the Klingons! Might as well get their money’s worth… It could help to explain how the Klingons change from a technological standpoint. It would also help tie the first movie in with the second film. Would be nice to have a perfect trillogy of films ala II-III-IV