Exclusive: Roberto Orci Gives Star Trek Sequel Update & More [VIDEO] | TrekMovie.com
jump to navigation

Exclusive: Roberto Orci Gives Star Trek Sequel Update & More [VIDEO] January 24, 2010

by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Interview,Orci/Kurtzman,Star Trek (2009 film),Star Trek Into Darkness , trackback

After the WGA Star Trek screening and panel earlier in the week (see previous report), Roberto Orci spent a little time doing a video interview for TrekMovie. The writer talked about meeting Walter Koenig, gave an update on the status of the sequel, explained why writing it feels harder than the first, and also revealed how fan interaction at TrekMovie has worked its way into meetings with the Star Trek Supreme Court.

 

Roberto Orci on Star Trek sequel and fan input and more
Video taken at the Star Trek WGA screening last week.

Highlights

 

Comments

1. Rocket Scientist - January 24, 2010

Sounds promising. Good luck gentlemen!

2. Rooster - January 24, 2010

Thanks Anthony!

3. KD6DXA - January 24, 2010

Thanks for the status update! I would still like to see some genuine exploration: “Strange new worlds.” Like Avatar, but make it Star Trek, of course. :-)

4. assimilator47 - January 24, 2010

Thanks for the interview and the inside story as it is at the moment. It’s a good thing to hear that STSC (Star Trek Supreme Court) has a fár better ear and contact with the fans than the old TPTB (The Powers That Be).
Much of which is thanks to TrekMovie.com, which provides a soundboard for all those involved; STSC and fans alike.

Good luck with the sequel, i’m sure we’re all looking forward to the development on that.

5. Jordan - January 24, 2010

Nothing we didn’t really know before.

6. Newman - January 24, 2010

Bob is the man. Its awesome that he takes the time to interact with fans. I have a lot of confidence in him and the rest of the crew behind Star Trek.

Something I have been wondering about is whether or not Kirk, as a very young captain, will still be struggling to earn the respect of of his peers in the sequel? Just something to think about.

PS We want Klingons!!!

7. Lt. Liz - January 24, 2010

Great interview; I have great faith in them for the sequel :)

8. Barclay - January 24, 2010

WE WANT BORG!

9. Sean - January 24, 2010

“we will not do a remake” – Big sigh of relief here. They can be “inspired by” other Trek, which I seriously hope they are, but a direct re-make would be a ticket straight to a flop.

Be as original as you can be while keeping it Trek. The writers proved they can do it already, so I have no worries.

10. Tarrax - January 24, 2010

Nice one Anthony. Thanks to you also Bob for your time.

My only advice for the sequel would be to make sure someone notifies the post production team this time around that the Enterprise has shields. ;)

11. Steve T. in NY - January 24, 2010

Well the whole “we will not do a remake” thing sounds promising.. Im really hoping for something fresh and new from this team. Just don’t set it right after the first film.. make it a year into their five year mission or something.. This way we have a little more ease between the characters and we can then focus on plot and storylines with some additional character development. Also, please don’t make it where they have to save Earth again.. been there , done that- many, many times..

12. Chris Dawson - January 24, 2010

Exploration Exploration Exploration!!!!

Give us a new world not another new enemy . . .
(well, maybe some Klingons exploring too!)

13. Jose Kuhn - January 24, 2010

I think there are some things that could be addressed in the movie that would be great for fans and help a compelling story.

Have the first scene of the crew of the enterprise take place in the wrapping up stage of a classic episode before they are summond to somewhere else. For example, it would be cool to see an Ahorta. Such a device could anchor what time frame we are talking about.

If the Klingon’s are the heavies in the movie you could have Colonel Worf played by Michael Dorn have a decent rolewith the equivalent weight of spock prime. You could have the Klingons have lost their way backstory where Kirk and the enterprise are about to get creamed and Colonel Worf sees it as wrong and prevents the dishonorable act from happening. This role could have both action and explain why Colonel Worf gave up on the military and became a public defendant and took up the kirk case in ST VI.

Put in a section 31 thread that could give a reason for a trilogy.

Just some thoughts.

14. dwnicolo - January 24, 2010

Great interview Anthony. Bob, whatever the fans think, don’t let it stifle you. Take chances. Thanks for the interview Bob.

15. KevinA Melbourne Australia - January 24, 2010

Since they “new” crew are on the Enterprise some 3 or 4 years earlier then what happenned in the TOS universe, I hope they do a new story.

Maybe at the end they could alude or segue into a “known” TOS situation and setup movie 3 ( or movie13 depending how you look at it)

There is room to move still in the earlier period. I’d love to watch a shake down and 1st mission that is totally new involving the new crew.

Oh and by the way, Please spend some money on engineering. I don’t want to see giant Beer kegs anymore!

16. ety3 - January 25, 2010

Why “adapted screenplay?” The story was wholly theirs, right? Not based on a previously published work?

17. Melissa - January 25, 2010

I REALLY like what Orci said about harmonizing, but still doing something new. I think the Borg would be perfect for the next film. They’re familiar to us all, would be badass villains, and it’d allow the writers to create an intense new story.

18. Kirk's Revenge - January 25, 2010

“So much for the little training cruise…”

19. Geoffers - January 25, 2010

I think we are extremely lucky we have Bob. I can not imagine any other franchise, where there would be on-board someone who a). Cares so much about it, and b). Cares so much about the fans.

Cheers Bob!

20. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

they better get a stronger plot for the next one.

Star Trek XI’s weakness that it had a very thin one, however it was stronger on character.

No Khan cause it won’t work and the Borg don’t belong in Kirk’s time.

perhaps this new universe could do a crossover with the prime, let those doubting fans realise that the prime universe is stil lthere.

I know it is but for the fans who deny it.

21. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

16

they took elements from some of the novels.

I’m amazed that this movie and these writers are getting more attention and praise than the past writers and shows.

I still think Ron Moore, Ira Behr, Michael Pillar are all better, I wih they more awards for what they did in Trek.

When I think of these writers I cannot get the crap that is Transformers 2 out of my mind.

22. gingerly - January 25, 2010

17 & 8

Borg were new once, remember? And they are TNG villians… I’d love to see a nod to them or hints that they exist or even pre-emptive actions influenced by Spock Prime…

…But I think the next film should focus on The Team going on a space adventure. Trekking through the stars, if you will. :)

They don’t necessarily need a big villian. Just an awesome adventure story.

23. nuSpock - January 25, 2010

#16–it technically qualifies as adapted screenplay because although the story was completely theirs, it was made for an established franchise…

24. Dr. Image - January 25, 2010

Allow for the passage of real time. The fact that it’s going to be three years later shouldn’t be ignored.
Good opportunity to build a proper engineering set and, yes, get rid of the bar code scanners. And darken down the bridge lighting. I guarantee it will look better.
Deepen the character scenes/relationships. It can’t be just a romp or it will fail.
Think “District 9″ not “Transformers 2.”

25. nuSpock - January 25, 2010

#16–also, what #21 said…AND because they alluded to other nonTrek stories in the film…although this part is iffy…the scene with Kirk and ElderSpock in cave: alluding to Luke and ObiWan in the desert on Tattooine…the destruction of Vulcan: alluding to the destruction of Alderan in Star Wars… the supernova destroying Romulus in Spock’s mindmeld flashback: alluding to the beginning of Superman when Krypton exploded… also the whole origin story is loosely adapted from the Prime Universe’s course of events and hearkens, as #21 said, to several novels… not to mention JJ’s Easter egg in the San Francisco skyline of the Tagruato Corporation logo on a building, alluding to Cloverfield… also, in a very abstract way the entire layout of the film, if you really examine it, echoes loosely to the layout of the first major blockbuster film JJ wrote…the Bruce Willis film Armageddon…

26. Chris Fawkes - January 25, 2010

I just hope we see interaction between Bones, Spock and Kirk as they face insurmountable odds.

Interaction that we are familiar with yet we can see how it creates the building blocks Kirk needs to make the decisions that save the day.

I would love to see the movie start with them getting out of one impossible situation that then leads into the main movie. I loved the opening of the new Star Trek.

27. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

25

interesting points.

I was saying to my friend that I am worried if they draw from the books then the next movie might be derivitive of other writers work rather than an original story on their own.

First Contact is an action film and it had has a much better story than the new movie.

28. gingerly - January 25, 2010

#24

I get the feeling Transformers 2 went as directed by Micheal Bay.

And darker doesn’t always = better, cooler, whatever.

The darkest Trek installment was also one of the lowest grossing and lowest quality…Hello, Nemesis.

Give me whip-smart action, crackling dialogue, interesting new cultures and races, a planet doesn’t look like Hoth or California…

And then keep reminding me why I love these characters together. :)

Give me more McCoy!

Karl Urban was amazing.

Watch Wash/Zoe (from Firefly) to see how a good healthy working ship relationship (and hey! interracial too!) w/ subtle romance can work *within* an awesome space team (psst! and without sacrificing character elements for either party!)…

She should have skills. Yes, I do remember Mirror-Mirror, but *please* don’t turn Uhura into Xena.

I think it would be *more* awesome if she thought her way out of a situation.

#26

I would love to see the movie start with them getting out of one impossible situation that then leads into the main movie. I loved the opening of the new Star Trek.

YES! I AGREE! :D

Something that pretty much establishes the badassery of the new cast and how much they *click* without being too heavy-handed with it (more Robau and George Kirk, and less Kid Kirk blaring Sabotage while driving a stolen car into a quarry).

29. paul - January 25, 2010

Apparently a cameo with Carol Marcus almost made it into the last script so I’m hoping that she’ll be in the next one.

I’m also hoping that they can build in a mix of professional and relationship stuff for Uhura. I don’t want to see her stuck as the girlfriend but neither do I want her to become something she’s not just to give her more to do. They definitely need to give her the chair when the big boys head off. I was rather annoyed when Chekov, a young, less senior officer was put in charge instead of the more mature, senior Uhura.

I do think the franchise needs an action heroine though and I’d like that to be Janice Rand. As Kirk’s assistant she is more mobile and it gives them an easy chance to play a bit of subtle jealousy with Carol Marcus.

30. Nomad - January 25, 2010

12: agreed. Exploration.

I keep saying this but i’ll repeat it: i’d like a Star Trek film, for a once to include the following:

-exploring strange new worlds
-seeking out new life and new civilizations
-boldly going where no man has gone before.

Does no-one else find it odd that they never seem to do this-??
Space is full of unknowns – that’s the appeal of it. Let’s go find a few for once – and I don’t mean aliens who are exactly like humans, except they have knobbly heads.

31. S. John Ross - January 25, 2010

# Looking to continue with “a mix” of new story ideas, and using elements from classic Star Trek that will “harmonize with canon”, but “still open to something fully original and we will not do a remake”.

It’s good to know that they’re open to originality this time, but after that recent thread, I’m going to be concerned anytime Bob uses the word “harmonize” :(

32. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

Great interview, thanks Anthony and Bob!

33. Vardonir - January 25, 2010

#4: “It’s a good thing to hear that STSC has a fár better ear and contact with the fans than the old TPTB.”
Ditto like hell! AMEN!

No remake! Yeah! I’ll start saving for those IMAX tickets.

34. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

harmonize with canon?

I thought the new movie was done to deviate from canon, which is why I don’t treat the new film as canon.

When I say its not canon I mean it does not relate to the est of Trek and is its own separate entity. So don’t slap me.

Its true i don’t think this is the best ever movie but I still like it.

35. Zed - January 25, 2010

Come back Porthos junior!
And i want to see Mandala Flynn, ad her security team!

36. JJ Savard - January 25, 2010

I personally would like to see an old villian, but not the Klingons, we’ve seen enough of them, and the Borg don’t fit, personally, I think that the Gorn fit perfectly. They can be menacing, there familiar with fans, and it gives alot of freedom creatively, sure they were a bit cheezy, but that can change, just change the loincloth uniform, and it’ll be fine.

37. Dan - January 25, 2010

Khan isn’t the reason why Star Trek II is so great. It’s what Kirk went through. Feeling old and getting back onto the Enterprise, then regaining it as captain. Finding out he has a son. He isn’t able to deal with death and then he’s forced to. Then he as to live with the loss of a brother. He grows because of all of this, he evolves and by doing so he feels young. Kirk deals with his humanity, and grows because of it. Oh and the acknowledgement of his son. his regret of not chosing to be with Carol Marcus and a father. BTW Khan is just a plot filler to push events into action. What the main characters were thrown into, the villian could of been anyone. Kan was just a dumb stereotypical meaningless vengeful villain. there really was nothing sound why he wanted to kill Kirk, it was a celestial event that caused her death, the planet Kirk marooned them to was green and lush at the time. I say blame God or the fates. It wasn’t Kirks fault, stupid Khan!

38. S. John Ross - January 25, 2010

#37: “Khan isn’t the reason why Star Trek II is so great.”

Aw, don’t ruin the fun by talking sense :) Common wisdom remains that STII kicks ass because it brought Trek what it had needed all those years: villains worth killing, by thunderous holy God! Villains worth laying a good killin’ on! [hawks, spits]

To the point where they took a character that had been a brilliant foil in his original appearance, and villainized him for the purpose :( Instead of being a problem to be solved, he became a villain to be defeated.

Great flick, but its success taught many wrong lessons, and we’re still paying for it.

39. Cygnus-X1 - January 25, 2010

I’d like to see the video, but it’s been deactivated.

I even joined that Vimeo site, and it won’t let me watch it.

40. me - January 25, 2010

-exploring strange new worlds
-seeking out new life and new civilizations
-boldly going where no man has gone before.

AGREED!!

41. TREKKIE - January 25, 2010

NOOOO EVIL VILLAIN!!!!!!!

42. my opinion - January 25, 2010

Make it 3D!

Create an intelligent, understandable villain (like Dukat, Damar, the Talosians, the Romulan commander in the Balace of Terror or at least Chang).

No more Shinzons or Neros!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

43. KingDaniel - January 25, 2010

I think epic armies of 100,000 trenchcoated and helmeted Klingons storming some planet would be great fun. Just make the ones in charge smarter than the “Hulk Smash!”-style TNG/DS9 ones. Read the old Trek novel The Final Reflection – that’s the sort I mean.

Mr Arex would be great in STXII. We have the technology!

And keep the brewery, just to annoy the technophiles (and because I thought it was really cool). Please.

Good luck! Don’t make it suck!

44. KingDaniel - January 25, 2010

Oh, and get those damn nuTrek novels published!

45. mark - January 25, 2010

@30

Yes exploration, new worlds. Real Aliens

A little like Avatar.

Make it a Star Trek (not a Star Wars) movie!!

46. AJ - January 25, 2010

Great job, Anthony, on keeping a great forum where we can interact with the current PTB via Mr. Orci.

Star Trek Lives!

47. Hugh Hoyland - January 25, 2010

Bob already said that in almost any sequel to this type of movie, there is a villian, and he’s right. The idea of the crew of the Enterprise going off to match wits with some unknown space cloud simply will not cut it. There will be a villain, its just a matter of who (my vote goes for Khan and the Gorn), and yes make the movie in 3-D. Using Avatar as the template.

48. David B - January 25, 2010

No Khan or Mudd everything else, go for it!

49. Quatlo - January 25, 2010

Passage of real time will show on the actors so go with it to the degree that suits you and embrace it; better bridge and engineering sets; (as #24 already mentioned).

More of the original central trio and less Uhura fawning over and taking advantage of her fling with Spock; an upgraded and improved Big E design that can be shown more without fear of Dolly Parton nacelle syndrome and faster due to less aerodynamic drag from said big king sized DP nacelles. Cheers and good luck on your nomination BO.

50. RoobyDoo - January 25, 2010

The emotional core of #2 should belong to Kirk and be as powerful as his Edith Keeler decision in the primeline.

And thank you once again Bob Orci for all you have done, and all you will do, in service of Star Trek.

51. villain of the villain - January 25, 2010

NO EVIL VILLAIN AT LEAST!

You can create someone following different, opposing agendas. But don’t make the agenda evil, just opposing ;)

52. Capt Mike of the Terran Empire - January 25, 2010

Lets make it about the doomsday machine and have Tom Hanks play Decker. Also. Lets see Scott Bakula in a small role as Admiral Archer. Maybe Jolene Blalock in as well. Maybein the end of the Movie the Camra pans out and we see the S.S. Botney Bay.

53. tut - January 25, 2010

NO REMAKES OF OLD STORIES OR VILLAINS.

54. me - January 25, 2010

Make it new and original!
Something that surprises us with its humor, action and intelligence, without being a clone of old stories.

55. Tony Whitehead - January 25, 2010

Star Trek: The Search For Porthos

56. Tony Whitehead - January 25, 2010

Followed by . . .wait for it. . .
Star Trek: The Wrath of Porthos

Thank you and goodnight

57. Damian - January 25, 2010

A few notes on what I’d like to see in any new movie.

Some scene or event to finally establish the friendship between Spock and Kirk once and for all. I get the impression that their friendship transcends universes.

For all my complaints about set design, I do like consistency and am not interested in seeing dramatic changes. What’s done is done. ( I don’t mean to rag on Scott Chambliss, his sets are otherwise great, they just did not fit with establish Trek–new universe does not necessarily mean Star Fleet Headquarters would look totally different). However can someone show me where the warp core is on the Enterprise. That was always the central part of the engine room in all the shows.

I like Pegg as Scotty, as well as the comic release he offers, however Scotty was excellent in command and of course an engineering genius. Would like to see that angle as well in a sequel. Also more McCoy, Urban was great as McCoy and more than any other, he reminded me of the original, DeForest Kelley. And of course he was a key to the whole friendship with Kirk and Spock.

And lastly, how about a Scott Bakula cameo as Archer, since he is apparently still alive. Okay, this is a pure fanboy request. Something hardcore fans would recognize, and not important to the casual fan.

58. P Technobabble - January 25, 2010

First, I think Bob Orci will go down in history as the most accessible Hollywood screenwriter ever…

Second, I imagine there is tremendous fear and pressure while looking at a blank page, knowing you’ve got to come up with something spectacular. With a Star Trek movie, you can’t do “just another episode,” you’ve got to do something really memorable. What is right, and what is wrong, about Star Trek movies, IMO, is whether or not they are memorable. Whereas TWOK or TVH were movies that may have stuck with you, INS or NEM may not have stuck so much (I acknowledge that some people didn’t like TWOK or TVH, but loved INS or NEM).
But Bob and the Supreme Court have to come up with a memorable Star Trek movie, especially since Trek09 was such a big hit, a quite memorable film. Now they have to top themselves. There’s got to be a lot of danger in that. Think of how Spiderman 3 had so much going on, it was hard to keep track of everything… but it was an attempt to outdo the previous two films. If you ask an audience to suspend their disbelief over one thing in a film, it will probably work. If you ask the audience to suspend their disbelief over multiple items in a film, it probably won’t work.
When I listen to Bob Orci, or read his statements, he seems like a very conscientious guy, who really cares about Star Trek, cares about the qualities that make good Star Trek. What more could we ask for?

59. Uncle Twitchy - January 25, 2010

I’ve said it before, I’ll say it again. Open the film with a James Bond-esque stinger involving the end of dealing with the Doomsday Machine. Starts it with a bang, recognition factor for the diehard fans, and sets the crew up to be already weakened and exhausted when their next mission starts, adding to the dramatic tension.

60. Damian - January 25, 2010

#21–I liked the new movies and the new writers (a nice mix of harcore fan and casual fans). I agree at times there were a few too many coincidences, but it was a good way for them to go in a new direction without erasing 40 years of established canon. I also enjoyed all the other shows and movies and thought the writers in the Berman, Moore, Braga years also wrote good stories.

It seems some fans try to pit one group of Star Trek against another (i.e. Rick Berman vs JJ Abrams). To me, it’s simple a new group taking over for another. The prior group gave me many great years of Star Trek. I happily continue to read the relaunch novels of all those series and for me the story continues to go on. I also look forward to the new stories that will come out of this new group. I don’t see any reason why a fan of the last 40 years cannot be a fan of the new Trek.

61. Chain of Command - January 25, 2010

The next film is years away, which means there is plenty of time to do it right. No cameos from other incarnations of Trek are needed, nor is rehashing old villains with new actors. Just tell a good, mature story about the main characters and have them experience something that allows them to grow as characters.

62. Damian - January 25, 2010

#58–I loved all the movies, even Star Trek V (though I felt there was missed potential there–the book for that was a great story). And I was always confused by the reception to Nemesis. I thought it was one of the better movies. I just don’t get it. Some of my favorites were of course the II to IV trilogy, VI, and First Contact. The new movie was great too. But my favorite is (don’t laugh), ST:TMP. I know it seemed plodding at times, but understanding how Robert Wise makes movies, it worked for me. Also, for 1979 it had some great special effects. Loved the first look at the refit Enterprise also.

63. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

60

I do like the new film and will be happy to watch more, I just don’t think the new movie is the best ever. Thats all.

64. LCDR Arch - January 25, 2010

42. Good advice on Reading “Final Reflection.” I hope Orci reads the book for inspriation. Those are the Klingons I want to see…. not the teenage bored Klingon captain surrounded by Klingons with brests falling out of uniforms and tight pants like in STV! yuk. Made a movie for thoughtful adults not 14 year old boys.

65. Buzz Cagney - January 25, 2010

No disrespect intended…… but four months to come up with the story for Trek ’09? huh? Really? I am honestly surprised by that.

66. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

Kirk and Khan is sent in as a elite force duo team to steal the cloaking device, a la mission impossible style, covert agents.

A theme about how good friends in this reality (Kirk and Khan) can become enemies over ideology/morals/ethics. Khan has previously passed the Academy in 6months after being rescued by the USS Iowa and is being integrated back into Earth culture and have become good friends with another strong captain, Kirk.

How Kirk resolves his loss friend (Khan) through his other friends (Spock/McCoy).

Khan’s conflicting ideology/morals/ethics gets them captured and tortured. Khan takes over the Klingon ship with Kirk and brings it back to the Federation despite Kirk urging Khan not to do so, as their mission only is to copy the plans for the cloaking device. Khan doesn’t listen and is punished/disciplined from Starfleet upon arrival with the Klingon Battle Cruiser equipped with the new cloaking device. This very act is a act of war against the Klingon Empire, something the Federation wishes to avoid and only wishes to partake in cold war style missions/games.

Khans thirst for power, worship and expansion is his own self doing. Khan steals Starfleet plans and the Excelsior and offers the Klingon Empire his skills and services as he feels Starfleet does not coincide with his character trait, which is to conquer not just to explore and help.

Kirk is sent to bring back Khan at all costs to be frozen in time via suspended animation. A classic clash of 2 friends/2 captains trying to out maneuver each other through space/time/politics and against the newly built excelsior who is equally matched to the USS Enterprise. The race is on to prevent full scale war against the Klingons, Kirk needs to capture or kill Khan his one time good friend and bring him back to Starfleet and return the Battle Cruiser or all is lost.

There is a surprise twist as both the excelsior and the enterprise has cloaking technology, this story will spark the Treaty of Algeron a few years earlier than in the prime universe.

67. RoobyDoo - January 25, 2010

And Bob, please give Damon a little downtime after he finishes the final season of LOST. That kid works hard and deserves a rest. A weekend should suffice. ;-)

68. Damian - January 25, 2010

63–Sorry, my thoughts there were brought on by your earlier comments, but the overall idea was directed more generally at some fans who try to pit one segment of Star Trek against another. Sometimes they seem to indicate that you are either an Abrams Star Trek Fan or a Berman Star Trek Fan, that you are not allowed to be both.

69. MarkNH - January 25, 2010

I want to ask him what was the fleet tied up with in the first movie? and could it be dealt with in the second?

70. P Technobabble - January 25, 2010

62. Damian

I am a big fan of TMP, also… in spite of the fact I don’t think it was as memorable a film as TWOK. As for INS and NEM, I saw them both and couldn’t tell you anything about either of them. I’d have to watch them again to remember anything. I know TFF has taken a lot of hits over the years, but I blame Paramount for that more than anyone else. I think Shatner should have been allowed to do a Director’s Cut, to see if it could have been improved (I’m sure it wouldn’t hurt).
I kept seeing scenes from Trek09 in my mind for days after seeing that film. It’s certainly one of my favorite Trek movies.

71. P Technobabble - January 25, 2010

62. Damian

I am a big fan of TMP, also… in spite of the fact I don’t think it was as memorable a film as TWOK. As for INS and NEM, I saw them both and couldn’t tell you anything about either of them. I’d have to watch them again to remember anything. I know TFF has taken a lot of hits over the years, but I blame Paramount for that more than anyone else. I think Shatner should have been allowed to do a Director’s Cut, to see if it could have been improved (I’m sure it wouldn’t hurt).
I kept seeing scenes from Trek09 in my mind for days after seeing that film. It’s certainly one of my favorite Trek movies.

72. P Technobabble - January 25, 2010

Sorry, for the double post, that was an accidental double-click…

73. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

68

I do remain adament in my thought that the story for Trek XI is pretty weak and suffers from some iffy plotting but when I do watch the movie I do find it great fun to watch.

I do feel First Contact, Wrath of Khan and Undiscovered Country are the best three of the movies.

74. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#73

I would add in there ST09 and Voyage Home. I can watch these 5 anytime, sometimes I wish you can erase memory of movies and watch them again for the very first time.

75. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

68

I love all Trek, watched all five shows and the movies

I am not a fan of some of the changes that Abrams made, but I chose to see the film despite my initial concerns. I did go in thinking I would hate it but I actually did enjoy the film.

it is a fun movie but it is not the best ever.

76. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

74

The Voyage Home would be my number 4 choice after The Undiscovered Country.

I prefer to call new movie Star Trek Xi rather than Star Trek 09, I even hate referringto Tim Burton’s first Batman as Batman 89, I like to just call it Batman.

I love watching all the movies of Trek and yes despite my gripes with the new movie I still love watching it on blur ay, it is one of my fav blu rays.

I just happen to prefer other Trek over the new film.

77. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

Am I the only one who likes Insurrection. I actually found it to be a lot of fun

78. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#77

Insurrection was not a movie, it was more of a straight to DVD type movie. Such a shame that they could even call Insurrection a Star Trek movie, it was more of a episode and it was a crime to charge people money to watch it. Pity Q never got his chance to be in a TNG film, he would have been a better story than the Baku/Sona and face lift technology, nothing grand about Insurrection, Michael Piller is capable of so much more.

79. VOODOO - January 25, 2010

Nomad #30

I agree with what you are saying, but unfortunately I don’t think that an intelectual/realistic version of Star Trek would have mass appeal at the box office.

I don’t think Paramount would green light a picture that varies too much from the formula that worked so well financially in Star Trek09.

P.S. That last sentence isn’t an indictment on anyone. It’s just a financial reality.

80. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

Gosh I had no idea Michael Piller passed away from cancer :(

81. Trek Nerd Central - January 25, 2010

I’m glad to hear the Supreme Court isn’t considering a remake.

Klingons would be nice, I agree. But PLEASE, don’t go overboard with the effects-laden action setpieces. Some in-depth character development would be nice.

I agree with #50. And with #41, in principle. A smart, flawed, interesting antagonist would be great — but the franchise doesn’t need another Khan-esque Miltonian wingnut mourning the death of his wife.

The most welcome element, in my opinion, would be an emphasis on The Big Three. Presumably Kirk and Spock are all done hating on each other — I hope so! — and we can see the iconic trio in fine form.

That’s what I’ve always loved most about “Star Trek” — the sense that these three guys (and the rest of the bridge crew) know each other so well, and work together so beautifully, that they can solve any challenge the cosmos throws at them.

82. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#79

Agreed, somethings that work well for television would not work for the movies/box office.

83. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

*some things

84. Damian - January 25, 2010

I enjoyed Insurrection, in as much as I am a full blooded Trekkie. It still had good special effects, good characters and of course excellent music by Jerry Goldsmith. Probably as an episode of the Next Generation, it could have been one of the better ones. As a movie, I agree it seemed to be a bit limited in scope, but the potential was there.

Also, Q was one noticeable element missing in the 4 TNG fills. Q and the Borg were two things I think fans most wanted to see in a TNG movie. They got the Borg, but forgot Q. Maybe someone can convince Abrams to someday redo TNG with Q, just to feed the need, LOL.

85. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

since the ne movie made tons of money with the mainstream its a sure bet that this ‘supreme court’ as you call them will probably go a route that will piss off the hard core fans.

I look forward to the next movie and I hope they work on a stronger script for next time.

86. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#84

A reboot of TNG would be amazing, imagine the Enterprise D redesigned with a younger crew, Troi can be played by Megax Fox heheh…..

87. Janice - January 25, 2010

I’m sure the writers will do an excellent job—I know I’ll like anything as long as Admiral Pike is in there somewhere!!
I want PIKE!!
Bruce Greenwood was amazing!!

88. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

I never said Insurrection was my favourite but I do enjoy the movie

but a point I make is why is a negative comment on here against the new movie make people call that poster a troll, yet its ok to bash Insurrection, Nemesis, Voyager and Enterprise without being called one.

89. rogue_alice - January 25, 2010

#26 – “I just hope we see interaction between Bones, Spock and Kirk as they face insurmountable odds.”

I totally agree. That interaction was important, if not the soul, of TOS. The insurmountable situation should include a moral dilema over which Bones and Spock could spar (and Kirk has tennis neck between them).

Spock needs to warm up to Kirk in the next movie. He needs to evolve a respect for Kirk (above the obvious acknowledgement that Kirk’s decision to “save” Earth turned out to be the logical course after all).

Though I don’t mind the Uhura/Spock relationship it needs to be lowered in importance with regard to crew relationship, in general. This crew needs to “smile” every once in a while (as a crew).

Scotty needs to show his engineering prowess over and above the “transwarp equation” which was given to him….anyway.

Some one noted that Marina Sirtis could play the computer voice. Great idea!! The computer was a “character” in TOS.

Reiterating that: The Enterprise is a character as well. She needs a bit more relevant screen time. We need more size clues. The crew using her hull as a platform for repairs. Give her a majestic shot or two. Harkening to the flybys she had when at low warp she cruised past the camera view. We need to hear her perturb space as she passes us.

Show more of the Fleet. I am on the side of patterning any new ships on the E design (she is the flagship, after all).

Bring back the beagle!! grin.

I don’t get the interest in Harry Mudd but a synthetic life form would be an interesting addition (even if our first solid android cast member appeared in TNG).

The crew merely walked the cooridors. Where is the activity inherent in a military vessel? Can’t we see one antigrav pallet device or supplies being levitated to storage?

I’d love to see Kirk in this sequel (though, with all due respect, he needs to understand the movie is not about him or his Kirk). Sorry Mr. Shatner, I feel strongly about this. But please, say yes to being in the sequel.

Where is Nurse Chapel? I want to see her (not just hear Bones bark at her).

Lt. Kevin Riley was a great character. He could appear in Engineering. And a guilty pleasure is to hear him hum “I’ll Take You Home Again Kathleen”.

I am on the side that Engineering needs a remodel. Make it awesomely powerful. Scotty needs high tech challenges that take more than a wrench or a screwdriver to handle.

Set up a few characters to use in future films. Lt. Marla McGivers? Zarabeth? Yeoman Rand?

A transporter accident? Giving Bones a foundation for his TOS fears.

I will stop but…one of the engaging aspects of the TOS that captivated me was the awe and wonder that it evoked. I have missed that in most all of the incarnations of Trek since TOS. Partly, this awe was the novelty of this ship and crew (making it to mid 60’s TV). ST had a tangible solidity to it. A viseral, pit of your stomach, “anxiety” related to what comes next? What new mysterious world will we encounter? How will the crew carry forward the ideals of (our future) society and impart those ideals with courage and geniune belief that their mission in Starfleet is what will make the Universe better for all?

Now…forget everything I said because the Supreme Court did a great job on the latest ST. Though, I’d absolutely love to bend their ears for a half a day. (I can fly anywhere…..grin).

90. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#88

I think valid points are always welcome, Bob always love feedback good or bad and the reasons behind it.

91. Capt Krunch - January 25, 2010

More interaction between Spock and Bones indeed!…
I agree that a grittier, darker sequel would fit the mold of most successful sequels//ala Dark Knight, Wrath of Khan….TMP was awesome though stuffy…antesceptic even…..I like an idea of following Kirk and Khan’s life over the length of the next film.. flashbacks like we see in LOST…to 21st c Khan and the Eugenics Wars..to the point at the end of the film where we see Khan and crew man the Botany Bay…perhaps end as the Enterprise discovers it adrift..
We need Klingons of course…probably take it easy on the Romulans…had them for the last 2 movie villians…would like to see a more ruthless Klingon that kill first and ask questions later, but I don’t think I would want to see a lead Klingon like Chang from TUC…I guess they could do Kang, Kor, Koloth, and Kirk…
Though the deleted scene from TREK shows what appears to be a compassionate Klingon asking Nero about the future…and Nero seemed very capable of kicking their butts….. we’ll see
Again I throw out the idea of Starfleet against Klingons searching for Khan’s genetic supermen..kind of a race in space…winner take all to rule the galaxy!

92. Damian - January 25, 2010

#89 mentioned about an Enterprise flyby at slow warp. One thing I missed was the warp effect of the later shows and movies (the streaking star effect). The new movie modified that into a sort of tunnel effect which I was not as much a fan of. Some have criticized the “space lake” effect. But even in space the shortest distance is a straight line. It would seem awfully ineffecient to be zig-zagging arround space just for the helluvit (And didn’t Voyager mention once that to make sharp turns at warp would rip the ship apart–something about the stresses).

93. Harry Ballz - January 25, 2010

Throw in Tom Hanks and the Gorn……mix well. Then I’ll be happy!

94. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

92

Yea the new movie use the hyper drive effect from Star Wars. lol

I prefer the star streaking effect.

95. rogue_alice - January 25, 2010

#92 – Well, I didn’t so much have a issue with the foggy/lakey warp effect. I guess I saw it as more realistic in the since that the star streaks always gave me the impression that now matter the distance the Enterprise was “passing” thousands of stars. It is a given that the universe has a bahzillion stars I didn’t ever think they “pass/warp by” that many.

Though, I, like you missed that effect.

I was thrilled with the “gunshot” to warp idea. The ships were there and then, just….not. Loved that whole idea.

The E can haul can’t she? Even powered on beer. grin

96. ensign joe - January 25, 2010

No Khan, less plot conveniences, less fan nods, more Enterprise.

There you go boborci.. there is your mantra :)

no seriously..

97. Chris Fawkes - January 25, 2010

For those of you who do not think Star Trek should be Star Wars. As i understand it the original idea for Star Trek was to be wagon train to the stars.

Lots of shoot em up action should not be considered out of place.

98. Daoud - January 25, 2010

Perhaps we’ll see Keenser leave Enterprise to become the next editor of “Nacelles Monthly”.

99. EM - January 25, 2010

More Pike.
More of him being fatherly.
More of him mentoring Kirk.
More of him being “old school” badass and tough.
Greenwood is awesome!!!

100. Damian - January 25, 2010

#95–the gunshot effect to warp in the new movie was one cool similarity to Star Wars, though I kind of wish they added the flash effect of the other Star Trek series to add consistency to other series and separate it from Star Wars a bit.

101. Damian - January 25, 2010

#97–I think what some fans have issues with is that in some areas of the film, the Star Wars influences seemed to override the Star Trek influences, especially regarding the special effects. For me, it’s not a huge deal as long as the writing stays Star Trek centered. As long as the Federation is not taken over by some Emperor with Kirk as Darth Vader, I’m ok with some influence. I still want Star Trek to maintain an optimistic theme, with the Federation as the good, altruistic organization it generally has been in past incarnations.

102. Mac - January 25, 2010

Here’s an old issue: the size of the ship. Don’t know if they hashed that out yet, but it can still be a nit-picker. If it’s bigger than the Enterprise D, then those are some might big port holes/windows whatever you want to call them. Just having fun. Trek is in Stellar Hands with these guys. Whatever they come up with is fine by me. Keep up the good work!

103. iams001efni - January 25, 2010

Neat! What a cool guy! Thanks much!

104. 750Mang - January 25, 2010

The quickness of scripting is troubling. And as much as I have come to really like ST09 I do think that the script was weak.

However, after seeing Avatar the script for ST09 is like Shakespeare.

Good luck guys.

105. Buzz Cagney - January 25, 2010

#99 I agree. Incredibly it wouldn’t feel like proper Trek without Greenwoods Pike!. Needs to somehow be central to the story as well and not just chucked in there.

106. rogue_alice - January 25, 2010

102 – “If it’s bigger than the Enterprise D, then those are some might big port holes/windows whatever you want to call them.”

Picture windows where popular in the 60’s. Maybe they made a comeback. grin.

“In space…everybody can see you scream…and eat a snack or sleeping or using the privy.”

Also, those big windows will be great when a huge space faring alien with gigantic eyes peers in on an interior shot. grin

107. rogue_alice - January 25, 2010

“wagon train to the stars”

I border on spamming today. Sorry.

Plot synopsis: The flagship Enterprise and her crew must herd 1000 head of space cows to market though a treacherous and desolate region of space called “the region formerly known as Vulcan”.

108. colonyearth - January 25, 2010

See! Ah HA! I knew it! Anthony, you may not be in on it, but I knew Bob was using us as his own little focus group. That’s great!

You’re very slick there, Bob, but no less wonderful!

109. Captain Pike - January 25, 2010

Tell Orci and Kurtzman to go with the freedom the new timeline brings. I would be very interested to see what they can do with the Klingons. I think the movie should take place during the ongoing mission. I would love to see KOR that would be cool. I think they should go with the freedom the new reality gives them and continue to add rock n roll to Star Trek.

110. YARN - January 25, 2010

I don’t see the point in agonizing about old story lines.

Wrath of Khan revisited an old story line and is the best film in the bunch.

The good news is that this ‘verse has wiggle room – you could revisit the same planet, the same scenario, but have a different outcome.

Why not cherry pick the best premises and plot lines from old Trek? It’s not like you have remake the episode.

I’d simply like to see less lazy writing and plotting the next time around. They got away with the “fate card” once, but I wouldn’t push it.

111. Rocky - January 25, 2010

KEVIN SORBO FOR KHAN!!!

112. YARN - January 25, 2010

“Something I have been wondering about is whether or not Kirk, as a very young captain, will still be struggling to earn the respect of of his peers in the sequel? Just something to think about.”

Well yeah, he went from punk cadet to captain in one mission, a mission during which he attempted mutiny on the bridge.

It would be more interesting to see Kirk internalizing these change rather than just being challenged by the other Muppet Babies.

113. Kirk1701 - January 25, 2010

I’ve put my two slips of latinum in an earlier post, but I’ll summarize here. Please, Bob, buddy, let’s give Bones more to do. The triumvirate is essential to this era of Trek.

114. RoobyDoo - January 25, 2010

If a Mugato does not appear in the sequel I will boycott the movie!

115. Kirk, James T. - January 25, 2010

Dear Mr Orci and the rest of the Supreme Court,

I loved the first Star Trek movie, in my opinion it was indeed the best movie of 2009 (however much i loved Avatar).

Speaking of the sequel. With the success of Avatar will Star Trek be shot in 3D and also break some of it’s own ground (perhaps being shot in Imax entirely or feature new technology of some kind) and also If rumours are true Star Trek “2” will have some stiff competition in 2012 with the third Batman movie due out. I’m worried that perhaps because of the huge success of The Dark Knight, Star Trek won’t have the mass appeal to fight off such a heavyweight like Batman without being bigger and better than it’s rivals – i feel that although the first movie was a great success, Star Trek globally didn’t do all that well in comparison to other summer blockbusters. I believe this to be a result of far more marketing done in the US than in countries like the UK and the countries of East Asia. What will you be doing to ensure that Star Trek can A) be a massive financial hit in the face of Batman 3 and B) become as big and as memorable in the mainstream long term as The Dark Knight and Avatar?

116. Josh - January 25, 2010

I’d really like a movie about the Breen. We haven’t really seen much about the Breen except at the very end of DS9. Having a feature film with the Breen as the baddies would be pretty cool and different.

117. "Check the Circuit!" - January 25, 2010

I liked the concept from on e of the recently canceled novels…the value both friends and enemies see in the future knowledge of Spock Prime. Everyone is after the power of what he’s already experienced. (At least as a major subplot.) This would give Leonard Nimoy a reason to return for the sequel.

And I’d like to see the Kirk/Spock/McCoy triumvirate really start to form.

118. Damian - January 25, 2010

113–Karl Urban is the man. He was like a 25 year old DeForest Kelley without ever forcing it. Probably the closest to the original actor of all. If I closed my eyes I can almost imagine hearing DeForest saying the same lines in the same tone of voice. Of all the actors, he is the one that needs more screen time of all.

119. Nick Tierce - January 25, 2010

Even with Spock’s rapid development as a character, he should still be able to take his place in the “Holy Trinity.” Kirk must reconcile Bone’s passion tempered by Spock’s logic.

This was the key to the narrative drama in the most successful of TOS episodes, and it’s infinitely applicable, regardless of what the immediate concerns of the plot are. (Which should, on their own, be ambitious.)

120. boborci - January 25, 2010

65. Buzz Cagney – January 25, 2010
No disrespect intended…… but four months to come up with the story for Trek ‘09? huh? Really? I am honestly surprised by that.

—-

Well, the basic story came quickly, but the details and transitions of the story took longer.

121. boborci - January 25, 2010

75. captain_neill – January 25, 2010
Just curious — do you think ST09 was the best ever?

122. MC1 Doug - January 25, 2010

#77: “Am I the only one who likes Insurrection. I actually found it to be a lot of fun.”

I like it too… a lot!

123. David Brown - January 25, 2010

Question for Mr. Orci: With so much to explore in the new timeline and so long to wait until the next movie, is there any chance that your team/Paramount would consider creating a series of webisodes in parallel with production of the new movie along the lines of the Lost “Missing Pieces” webisodes? Would love to see mini-adventures of Keenser, Admiral Archer and his missing prized beagle, tribbles, ANYTHING. Obviously there are comics and books for this, but would be so cool to see new filmed content ASAP…

Thanks for your work.

124. Damian - January 25, 2010

Has anyone noticed subtle similarities between the Scimitar in Nemesis and the Narada? Especially when the Scimitar was preparing to deploy the thalaron device and the wings of the ship starting spreading. Something about the sharp angles and points at the end of the wings and the points and angles of the Narada. Also, I got the same feeling when first seeing the Scimitar decloak and the Narada emerge that this is one bad ship that can kick some ass.

125. rogue_alice - January 25, 2010

Damian, the scene of Picard ramming the E into the Scimitar was a very cool one for me. Again, as I consider the ship a character, the scene had impact (no pun) for the fact that the E was sacrificing for the crew.

I did get a twinge of recogition from the Narada and the Scimitar.

126. MC1 Doug - January 25, 2010

#78: “Insurrection was not a movie, it was more of a straight to DVD type movie. Such a shame that they could even call Insurrection a Star Trek movie, it was more of a episode and it was a crime to charge people money to watch it…. he would have been a better story than the Baku/Sona and face lift technology, nothing grand about Insurrection.”

If all you got out of ‘Insurrection’ is that it was about face lift technology, I have to wonder what else you think are worthwhile themes for film.

Did you miss the whole theme about forced relocation of a people, much like our nation did to the native American tribes? Did you miss the themes of love of life and leading a simpler life? Or of refusing to blindly following orders just because those orders came from a higher rank?

The morality of ‘Insurrection’ is clearly evident unless you go in just wanting to see explosions and space battles.

127. Desstruxion - January 25, 2010

I remember Uhura ordering a Cardassian Sunrise in the bar. That means that they (the Cardassians) are known in this universe. I’d like to see just how the Federation gets along with them in this era. We could see the start of the Bajoran occupation. A Section 31 vs. Obsidian Order (with Kirk and co. caught in the middle) storyline would be interesting. I’d like to see TOS era versions of the Cardassian warships as well. Gimme more ships!!

128. Danpaine - January 25, 2010

…feel compelled to say here – and I’m considered ‘old school,’ I suppose (43) – I and many friends felt the “fan nods” in Trek 09′ were absolutely necessary, and much appreciated.

That’s what makes it TREK, people.

Without nods to what came before (which 09′ did wonderfully, IMO), it would just be another generic ‘space’ movie – and there’s plenty of those.

One of the best things about this film was that it Respected What Came Before. Please keep doing so.

129. Mel - January 25, 2010

@ boborci

Will Keenser be in the next movie?

I hope so because he is one of the very few aliens we have seen on the Enterprise and the Enterprise needs more aliens! He also looks in contrast to Vulcans, Romulans and Orions not like a human with pointed ears or green skin.

If you include him in the next movie, please give him a cool unexpected ability. For example he could be a good fighter despite his size.

I also love the interaction between Scotty and him. More of it would be nice, too.

130. Mel - January 25, 2010

@ boborci

A Horta in the next movie would be nice, too. I love strange looking aliens!

131. Hugh Hoyland - January 25, 2010

Ive seen most of ST Nemesis, I think they had a good idea trying to bring in fresh ideas with a director that really didnt know much about Star Trek to begin with. But I also think as with almost all of the Star Trek motion pictures besides ST 09, it was held back by buget restraints, and editing. I read somewhere that there is almost an hour of filmed material that never made it to screen. Not all usable perhapes but thats still a lot.

132. matthias wieprecht - January 25, 2010

Great Respect Mr. Orci, you have talent!!!

Well, I would LOVE to see something lieke “… strange new worlds, final frontiers” ;) Really, we have had so much movies with more or less stupid opponents, but we really need a movie that shows the fascination for the strange, new worlds out there, maye a little bit like aliens, but NO copy, of course. First contact was a little bit like aliens somehow…. but not in the way i would like to see it. in the original series the crew often finds strange things like a hole in space or something like that.

prdon my german english…

llap
matthias

133. Hugh Hoyland - January 25, 2010

#66 interesting IMO. I dont know about the friendship part, but maybe have Khan pretend to be a good guy, then as the story goes on he shows his true intentions.

134. Hugh Hoyland - January 25, 2010

Or maybe Khan as a third party of some sort. Causing trouble from behind the scenes. For his own purpose.

135. Damian - January 25, 2010

127–Star Trek canon never clearly established when the Federation came into contact with the Cardassians. A Cardassian can be seen in an episode of Enterprise, though in the background. There is a 3 novel series called Terok Nor that goes into detail about the Bajoran Occupation. This was an excellent series. According to this story (non-canon of course), the Cardassians were a deeply religious people until their world became desolate. The military too over and they started conquering surrounding worlds for resources. I would guess that at the time of the 2009 movie, they were just starting to become militarized and probably were not a threat to the Federation at this point. The border wars did not occur until roughly 100 years later.

Another good Cardassian novel was the Deep Space Nine novel “The Neverending Sacrifice” which does a good job giving backround into Cardassian Society from the end of the Occupation to the fallout of the Dominion War.

136. S. John Ross - January 25, 2010

#128: ” I and many friends felt the “fan nods” in Trek 09′ were absolutely necessary, and much appreciated. That’s what makes it TREK, people.”

According to this logic, the original series, when it aired, was not “TREK.”

Perhaps there’s something special about being TREK in all caps that distinguishes something from simply being Star Trek. If that’s the case: less TREK, please, and more (any) Star Trek.

137. Desstruxion - January 25, 2010

Thanks Damian. I may have to look into those. I’d still like to see a TOS era Cardassian ship though. If just docked at a starbase in the background.

138. Damian - January 25, 2010

#131–Stuart Baird had only directed 1 or 2 other films before Nemesis. He is a well established editor (he actually edited Casino Royale and The Omen). Some of the actors criticized him for not knowing enough about TNG. Ironically, some of the complaints for Nemesis were the same as for the 2009 movie, that he did not respect what came before enought (I do not necessarily agree with that for either movie). Jonathan Frakes stated he would have directed Nemesis given the chance. It does make me wonder how the movie would have been with Frakes as director. Also, Paramount did make a dopey decision releasing it when they did, competing directly with Harry Potter, Lord of the Rings, and Die Another Day. You talk about dooming a film to failure. At least for Star Trek 2009, they learned their lesson and released it at a time without such stiff competition. (even though we had to wait another 6 months).

139. Mustard Shirt - January 25, 2010

Mr Orci if you’re reading this (i know you are!)… will we see more of the supremely talented Simon Pegg in the next film… I have to say that that was my one gripe about the first movie – Scotty showing up around 80 mins in… was it a worry for you guys that he showed up so late?

Keep up the good work!!!

140. Danpaine - January 25, 2010

136. S. John Ross – January 25, 2010

Pardon me, Fellow Geek, for not explaining to your satisfaction what I think ‘fan nod’ means. Obviously, if you’re a fan of TOS, and dare I say all of the Star Trek that followed it, any reference to anything past, in a new work, is a ‘nod.’ My opinion, of course.

Yes…saying ‘TREK’ that way was yelling. Please excuse my yelling. I was trying to make a POINT.

Thank you. Sorry to have to clog up the works by responding to nonsense.

141. JP - January 25, 2010

Just make sure JJ casts Jolene Kay again in the sequel. And let her have a speaking part this time. That woman makes my heart skip a beat :)

142. Jefferies Tuber - January 25, 2010

Bob,

“It’s been a looooong time…” since I posted, and it sure is nice to have ST09 on demand with my MacBook Pro.

I think you should avoid “new life” because those episodes are rarely feature-worthy, but “new civilizations” is a little easier to manage.

The thing is, you really aren’t “done” with setting up Star Trek, because ST09 did not establish the [Cold War] tone of relations with the Klingons. We need a solid story about a planet that both the Federation and the Klingons want. We need to see that they can beat a Federation starship, and what they’ll do to a planet if it’s theirs.

As for the Khan debate, I’ll restate what I’ve said here before: The Botany Bay will almost certainly be found by a ship that is not the Enterprise. Instead of showing the risk in coddling criminals/terrorists [the Prime Khan narrative], any new Khan narrative should be based on the original un-scorned Khan, the sexy, charismatic upper caste Indo-European who raised an empire and has the technology and ambition to use Eugenics to rule the world. That’s undiscovered country in ST and gives you total freedom to toy with canon. If Khan took control of another ship disabled and all transponders, he could land on a colony or alien planet and raise an army of better-than-humans in 5-10 years.

Tuber out.

143. S. John Ross - January 25, 2010

#140: “[...] Any reference to anything past, in a new work, is a ‘nod.’ My opinion, of course.”

A broad but certainly workable definition. In response: my prior comment stands.

“Sorry to have to clog up the works by responding to nonsense.”

Likewise, I’m sure.

144. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#126

I was merely commenting about the epic scale and failures of Insurrection, it is a very good episode but not a movie imo.

145. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#126

Avatar nailed it, Insurrection blew it.

146. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#126

The movies I enjoy are ones that invest in the project and not skim from it.

I can tell the difference between a tv movie/episode versus a film like say Forest Gump which had both great themes/character/themes and special effects.

The items I named in the original post was just a snap shot of a few items, I did not like in Insurrection. Besides, Star Trek is not about shit blowing up (I have said this many times on this site) but rather about the Human Adventure.

147. Capt Mike of the Terran Empire - January 25, 2010

No matter what the next Star Trek movie has to be made in 3d.So Mr Orci and the Court. Make it in 3 D ok. Avatar was a huge hit and i have no doubt you will give us a fantastic story and with a fantastic story and in 3D well. Cha Ching$$$$$$$$$$

148. Capt Mike of the Terran Empire - January 25, 2010

Hey Anthony. How about a new poll. Should Star Trek be in 3D

149. Charley W - January 25, 2010

Just PLEASE, no more Kirk hanging from a cliff!!! (Sheesh, 3 times in ONE movie. How ori-GIN-al!)

Also, I think villians seeking Revenge for dead wivesas a motive pretty much has run its fair course. How about a woman seeking Revenge for a dead husband? THAT’s never been done before to my knowledge.

You want to redo an episode from the original series? How about “Balance of Terror”- they know about the Romulans now. Or “Amok Time”; that one’s been blown out of the water, too.

150. ensign joe - January 25, 2010

Star Trek vs TREK

Red Shirt
from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redshirt_(character)

“In many episodes of the original Star Trek series (1966-1969), security officers and engineers, who wear uniforms with red shirts, accompany the main characters on landing parties. The officers usually die violently soon after.

The eleventh Star Trek film features a red-uniformed character who joins Kirk and Sulu’s landing party and, in an homage to the original series, dies soon after the mission’s start.”

homage
from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homage

“Homage may occasionally be perceived negatively by critics as a technique often associated with amateur creators. Use of homage may be regarded as fannish or as an excuse for lack of originality.”

151. Charley W - January 25, 2010

Sorry, the previous message was a draft that got screwed up. It should have been:

You want to redo an episode from the original series? How about “Balance of Terror”- they know about the Romulans now. Or “Amok Time”; that one’s been blown out of the water, too.

Also, I think villians seeking Revenge for dead wives as a motive pretty much has run its fair course. How about a woman seeking Revenge for a dead husband? THAT’s never been done before to my knowledge

Just PLEASE, no more Kirk hanging from a cliff!!! (Sheesh, 3 times in ONE movie. How ori-GIN-al!)

152. Anthony Pascale - January 25, 2010

RE: capt mike 3d poll, did it last week
http://trekmovie.com/about/index/pollsarchive/

Cygnus-X1
Video is working, it isn’t supposed to be visible at vimeo, it is set to be embedded at tm and tm only. I do that for some of my exclusive videos

153. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#147

I recall seeing that poll a few days ago.

154. rogue_alice - January 25, 2010

“Just PLEASE, no more Kirk hanging from a cliff!!! (Sheesh, 3 times in ONE movie. How ori-GIN-al!)”

I think that was akin to TOS Kirk getting his shirt ripped every episode. :)

155. star trackie - January 25, 2010

#121 “75. captain_neill – January 25, 2010
Just curious — do you think ST09 was the best ever?”

Bob, I maybe going out on a limb here…but my first guess would be no. lol

But I thought Trek09 rocked the Kazbah! The fact that it doesn’t have Shatner naturally prevents it from being the best, but I’ll be damned if it can’t come in a strong #2!

156. Damian - January 25, 2010

154–I think Bob Orci was going for sarcasm here because captain neill stated a few times that this was not in fact his favorite.

I hope the next avoids any major cameos by the original series actors. Like First Contact after Generations, it’s time to let the new cast spread their wings. I still would like a Scott Bakula cameo, but I don’t think I’m contradicting myself here since he played a different character in a different series altogether. I somehow doubt that wish will come true though.

157. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#121

I think it was the best for 2009 if Avatar did not steal the Thunder.

ST09 is my top 3 favorite Star Trek movies.

Up there with The Undiscovered Country and First Contact.

158. Krazy Joe - January 25, 2010

To Bob Orci:

Bob, I don’t know if JJ, Alex or yourself are aware of it but there has been a desire among Trek fans to see Marina Sirtis from ‘Next Generation’ take over as the voice of the Enterprise’s computer after the passing of Majel Barrett. It would be a nice touch because she’s a part of the franchise’s past (like majel) and played Majel’s daughter on the TV series.

I saw Marina Sirtis at a comic convention in June of 09 and told her that I thought she should be the next Enterprise voice. Her reply was, “I love the idea. I want you to start a website and twitter everyone you know to make it happen” — so she’s game for the idea.

Please concider it. I really can’t think of a better person for the role. Majel did the voice of the computer for every series and every movie. Now that she’s gone, I think it should be “kept in the family” so to speak.

Thanks.

159. boborci - January 25, 2010

158. Krazy Joe – January 25, 2010

Noted.

160. S. John Ross - January 25, 2010

#150: Well done, sir.

161. Damian - January 25, 2010

Another possibility with ties to the past if Marina Sirtis falls through could be Judi Durand, who did the computer voice for the Enterprise in Star Trek III and for Deep Space Nine.

162. Jeyl - January 25, 2010

Well, if they’re gona look, I’ll convey.

1. I’m not a big fan of profanity in Trek, especially in the amounts that Trek09 had. Not saying that a little here and will hurt if it’s appropriate, but some of it came off as gratuitous like Bone’s “And no g**damn first officer”. It was better in the trailer.

2. Character traits do not sum up the character. It’s easy to look at a character like Scotty and think he fits the bill as the ‘comic relief’ character, but to write him as being nothing but a comic relief character is sort of disingenuous. Scotty has had a lot of dramatic moments when compared to every one else. Whether it was disobeying orders from an ambassador, being framed for murder, being unable to fix a problem (has happened), watching his nephew die, being out of place and unwanted, ect. He may have a lot of fun memorable moments that we enjoy watching, but they hardly sum up what his character is about or capable of doing. Take NuScotty’s line about the Enterprise being well endowed and making harassment jokes. Would you talk that way about a lady you don’t know? That’s something the classic Scotty would have issues with. He treated the Enterprise as something to respect and admire, not as an object for his own selfish desires.

3. Where’s the budget? When I look at Star Trek’s 150 million dollar budget, two things come to mind.
A. That’s more money being spent on this one movie than any of the Star Wars prequels (AOTC being the most with 120 million).
B. This should be able to give us a lot of what Star Trek wasn’t able to give us in the past.
But alas, nothing we got was anything new. I would say it looked less than new. All of the previous Star Trek series, movies and even cartoons didn’t use any practical locations for the interior sets of their ships (with the exceptions of the holodeck simulations). Sets like the the Engineering section from other Star Treks have a pattern to follow that can give the audience depth and perception, and of course something for the characters to do. In the brewery, Scotty is just running around and talking while not really doing anything. I’d take Scotty working in the Jeffries tube moving magnets around any day over him just running around talking in front of a display.

4. Khan. I honestly don’t care. Anything can work if it’s done right and I know that if Khan were to appear in the future, it wouldn’t be anything like what we saw previously. The circumstances are too different. And if I wanted you to write something new, I would have started by saying you should create a whole new series of Star Trek characters and situations.

5. The women. I’ve mentioned this hundreds of times, but Trek09 was a big step back for women in the Trek franchise. There are no mentionable female characters of authority, Nero’s sole female crew member doesn’t even have a close up, Uhura’s contribution is done off screen and only mentioned while she’s stripping, her communications related assignments are done by other characters and having her be romantically involved with Spock in the way it was portrayed was vague and out of nowhere. Aren’t build ups important? What was their first meeting like? What was the attraction? How did Spock pursue this relationship? What are their common interests? What does she see in him? I’m not opposed to a Spock and Uhura relationship, I would just like something to have developed between these two, rather than just given. Last thing Uhura needs is the old Disney cliche of having the lead female character being destined to be with the man of her dreams. It’s nice that she has all these skills in linguistics and knows a lot of alien languages, but it doesn’t mean anything to the story, plot or character if she doesn’t use any of it. While some of you may state that it got her a post on the bridge, she doesn’t do anything at that post but leave it no less than least three times during a crises for personal reasons. Un-freaking-proffesional.

163. Mike - January 25, 2010

Bob,
Just watched Trek 09 again on Blu Ray – what an awesome film! You guys have earned the right to “indulge yourselves” with the next one story wise.
As for a few personal wishes:
-More McCoy and more development of the Kirk, Spock, McCoy relationship.
-I know Klingons are popular, but I’d like to see something new.
-I’d like to see Scotty a little more restrained and soulful. He shouldn’t be only comic relief.
-If there’s any way to film and include the Spock/Shatner scene, as a flashback or whatever, that scene should be put on film.
Can’t wait for more info on what you’re planning.
Thanks.

164. boborci - January 25, 2010

160. S. John Ross – January 25, 2010

You’re funny. If our movie wasn’t called Star Trek (which existed previously) you might have a point.

165. M51 - January 25, 2010

I love the Sirtis idea, but I always wanted Jenifer Lien to take over as the computer voice. I just love hearing her speak.

166. I LOVE BOBORCI - January 25, 2010

Yo Bob!

One thing…

BRING BACK TRIP TUCKER!

Pleaseeeeeee

167. gingerly - January 25, 2010

#157

Agreed. :)

And the best Trek movies were good for different reasons.

Smart political intrigue.
Awesome resonant villains.
Levity and humor -Yes, I include the one about the whales. :)

But the one thing that overlaps *all* the good ones is awesome recognizable team-love and chemistry.

The worst one of the bunch, did not have that. It just felt *all* wrong.

The one thing I’ve always loved is how everybody *always* has everyone else’s back, through hell and high-water.

And that they trust that, not just because of the talent and skills on display, but because of the mutual respect, friendship.

That’s why that scene with Spock mind-melding the unconscious Romulan while Kirk backs him up, was just perfect. :)

And why it was so significant that Spock called Kirk, “Jim” in the Jellyfish.

…Because we saw how he (…and everybody in the Team, throughout the film!) had earned that. :)

168. Damian - January 25, 2010

Jennifer Lien does have a soothing voice. I’d love to have her read me bedtime stories.

169. S. John Ross - January 25, 2010

#164: “You’re funny. If our movie wasn’t called Star Trek (which existed previously) you might have a point.”

I’m funny _and_ I have a point, but don’t over-read it … I’m not opposed to homage at all, just excessive homage that calls too much attention to itself (both of which approach absolutely subjective matters of taste, so, okay, in this case I have no point, good call) ;)

I’m funny and I _frequently_ have a point :)

170. PJays - January 25, 2010

This is just a thought regarding the Khan issue.

Didn’t a lot of us have issues with the Original Cast being recast, saying it can’t be done. I was even a little worried. Now it is done and a lot of us liked it. I don’t want to come off as supporting Khan because I am neither for it or against it. I just believe if the acting is there (big shoes to fill) and most important the story is there, I believe it can work. The writers and cast made me believe that it is possible from the past movie and how well it was put together. Feel free to disagree as I understand where fans are coming from.

Personally thou, I would like to see the Klingons.

171. Cobalt 1365 - January 25, 2010

Bob it is so cool to hear that you take the opinions of the fans on Trekmovie seriously. It makes me feel like a part of the process. Thank you for taking time to listen to us! I don’t have any specific suggestions, just keep doing your thing, man.

172. Lost Forever - January 25, 2010

Throw away comment here but a real fan pleaser would be if we had the Borg assimilate the Klingons after a horrendously bloody battle no? Although I wouldn’t do this in the sequel but maybe in the third film.

But please stay away from Khan. There’s only one Ricardo Montalban. However Khan’s gloves can come back any day!

173. Anthony Thompson - January 25, 2010

I enjoyed that interview. Bob keeps it real, as always. Bob, if you see this, one of the aspects I loved about the movie you wrote was the interaction and problem-solving among the bridge crew. That sometimes happened during TOS but not as often as it should have (maybe some egos got in the way). I hope that you keep that sense of teameork in the next film.

174. Brett L. - January 25, 2010

Agree with 171. Thanks, guys.

Just to add my two cents: please avoid the token obsessed villains (Soran, the Son’a, Shinzon, etc). Although better overall, even Nero falls into this category. Please continue to think outside the box and keep in mind that one of the most successful outings (ST IV) arguably had no villain (at least in the traditional sense).

175. Trek Nerd Central - January 25, 2010

I’m another one who absolutely loved all the bones thrown to the fans. Every winking reference said to me, “Yes, Hoary Old Fandom, we acknowledge and appreciate your existence even while we’re trying our damnedest to attract the younger generation. You don’t actually suck.”

The best moment, in that regard, was the plunging death of the redshirt.

But I’m STILL waiting for Kirk to do that flying double-leg kick to the chest. Just isn’t “Star Trek” without it.

176. VeratheGun - January 25, 2010

Speaking on aliens, please bring back that guy who was sitting in the bar, minding his own business, when Kirk and Uhura were having a conversation over him.

The expressions on his face were priceless!

177. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#175

Yea, I remember watching it on opening night at IMAX and these teens were yelling out, OMG SWEET RED SHIRT DEATH ROFL LOL.

178. Larry - January 25, 2010

Bob, thank you for your wonderful comments of your fellow fans and how you channel our opinions to the rest of the “Jury”. It is pleasing to know a fellow fan now has the control over Star Trek. I go for that harmony and new as well. Please come up with something new and harmonizing with cannon. I would think I am the biggest fan of the “Grand Jury”. I am also pleased in what you guys are doing with Fringe.

179. Oogaboogawooga - January 25, 2010

I’d like it if the next movie had approximately the amount of action that Star Trek 6 did: a decent amount, but not so much that the character saga was overshadowed. And the whole “start in medias res” thing sounds cool: a la Indiana Jones. I always liked Indiana Jones.

…Oh, and Nemesis sucked because Stuart Baird cut out all the good scenes. Google the script and read it. It’s AWESOME.

180. 24th Century Rockstar - January 25, 2010

I’m telling ya Orci, “NuTrek II: Everbody’s Shirtless” is SURE to shut out the Twi-hards and bring in that summer crowd for no freaking doubt! I’m totally GIVING this one to you man – I’m seeing dollar signs from here to Andoria!

Seriously though, my best wishes to you guys. :)

– 24thCRS!

181. Damian - January 25, 2010

176–kinda reminded me of Morn on DS9, except it was eye expressions with Morn. It would be cool if the bar alien became a mainstay. Somehow he was always there whenever Kirk was in a bar, but like Morn never says anything.

182. TrekFreak - January 25, 2010

@ 16. ety3 – January 25, 2010
“Why “adapted screenplay?” The story was wholly theirs, right? Not based on a previously published work?”
—————————————
Not entirely true. Roberto Orci and Abrams have been using already established elements, and then repackaging them with a slightly different shade of paint. If you were to look at J. J.’s “Star Trek” and Lucas’s “Star Wars” at the same time, you will notice that J. J.’s “Star Trek” mirrors Luca’s story. Just with already established elements of “Star Trek”.

After watching the video a few times, I actually agree with Orci’s comments about the direction of the first film. Since there was 40+ years of “Star Trek” to draw upon, the only option for the ‘re-imagined’ “Star Trek” was to make a movie that complimented established lure.

Now, if they used Klingons, Romulans, Borg, Khan, time-travel, or Andorians in the next film, they would only be making the original mistake that crippled the franchise. Repetition ultimately made “Star Trek” stale.

I would push very-very-very hard to make the second film completely new. Instead of drawing on characters or species that have already been established, I would create a brand new (unknown) enemy and situation. if they can take a full leap into originality, while maintaining brand, I will take the leap and watch the next film. Anything else would just be repackaged repetition.

183. Anthony Pascale - January 25, 2010

RE: computer voice in sequel
I don’t like seeing people say they can speak for star trek fans by saying things like ‘fans want’. It is true some fans may want it, but I doubt there is a clear majority. We can test this, so I added a poll.

that being said, if Sirtis ever wants the gig, she is going to have to do some backtracking after her namecalling of JJ Abrams and Paramount execs after it was announced they were doing a prequel instead of another TNG movie

184. gingerly - January 25, 2010

#182. TrekFreak – January 25, 2010

Anything else would just be repackaged repetition.

…And would be very difficult to make narrative sense, given the built-in cheat-code they have in Spock Prime’s presence.

185. rogue_alice - January 25, 2010

#184 – given the built-in cheat-code they have in Spock Prime’s presence.

Cheat code. Love that! I wonder though, is all of Spock’s pre-knowledge of specific value in this new parallel universe. Certainly his science knowledge is but of actual events? Given, he had knowledge in the new universe that Vulcan would most likely be destroyed (since Nero stranded him to watch). But, could he have for seen that his father would live and his mother would die?

I think Spock’s has value to Sfleet but he as more value to Sfleet’s enemies.

I am trying to wrap my brain around the existence of Spock Prime…now, in the new timeline…as there are always possibilities.

186. Impending Doom - January 25, 2010

All I want is red bussard collectors.

187. Christine - January 25, 2010

“We will not do a remake” was a huge sigh of relief for me. Thank you, thank you, thank you. A remake is the LAST thing we want!

I like the “harmony” wording. Sounds nice. I like harmony. I think leaning towards the “entirely new” is good, but still having a little harmony to keep all us fans happy… Well, for me, anyways.

Good luck, gentlemen! As usual, we’ll all be watching for more updates.

(Oh… and thanks for doing this, Mr. Pascale. You’re the best!)

188. TrekFreak - January 25, 2010

184. gingerly – January 25, 2010
” …And would be very difficult to make narrative sense, given the built-in cheat-code they have in Spock Prime’s presence.”

————————

I nominate Gingerly for quote of the day. I could not agree more.

189. Damian - January 25, 2010

How about a sequel based on one of the novels, namely “Chain of Attack” by Gene DeWeese (1987). That has to be my favorite novel and I always thought that would it make a cool movie.

Basically, the Enterprise gets hurled to another galaxy, and is heavily damaged in the process. They start to explore (in an attempt to find a way home) as repairs are made and come across planet after planet of destruction (some by nuclear war, some biological/chemical war, some orbital bombardment). Eventually they come across other ships that attack the Enterprise. Eventually Kirk arranges a truce and finds out war has been going on in this galaxy for centuries. By the end, Kirk negotiates a cease fire and finally after centuries of war peace seems possible. Of course, the Enterprise eventually does get home.

This novel would be great on screen. It has some exploration, jeapordy, battles. and represented the best the Federation has to offer with Kirk negotiating peace in a galaxy where war is a way of life. And it has some metaphors with today’s society (i.e. war on terror).

190. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

Bob

I did not mean to keep sounding like a broken record but I dont want to sound like a hater. I gave Star Trek XI an 8 out 10. I had some gripes with some ofthe changes you and JJ Abrams made from past Trek, but I guess that comes with being a fan of Star Trek for so long.

What was Kirk said to Spock in Star Trek VI “People can be very afraid of change”

I do like Star Trek XI, I think its a great film, but I do miss the stuff that came before. I love what you did in your movie but I probably place it in 5th place.

191. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

do I make sense, I never said I hated the film but I feel the Trek I love is getting overlooked with all the attention on this one movie.

Can I like both? Hell yeah

First Contact was the movie event of my early teens

192. The Disinvited - January 25, 2010

While I admit Sirtis having played Majel’s character’s daughter does have a certain pull, my nomination for Enterprise’s computer voice would have to be the only person who did a computer voice in the first series that’s still alive: Barbara Babcock.

It would be fun if they could revisit that Matriarchal planet’s repair of the ship as a way of “auditioning” the various voices for consideration.

193. Denise de Arman - January 25, 2010

Mr Bob- Shirtless Kirk and Spock in the next movie and you will have twelve-year-old girls coming back 3 and 4 times to see the movie. I’m just sayin’…

194. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

My worst nightmare is Michael Bay directing a Trek movie

My second worst nightmare, Trek is turned into Twilight

195. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

Damian

Thanks for saying you liked Insurrection, felt I was alone in enjoying this movie.

196. dmduncan - January 25, 2010

I would love to see a Trekmovie contest for best fanwritten intro to the sequel to see how different fans fantasize about how the next movie begins.

Beginnings are so important. Each time I hear that Giacchino score begin, the hair on my arms stands up.

197. gingerly - January 25, 2010

#191

hah! If you remember being an early teen for First Contact? You haven’t been a fan for *that* long. ;)

198. Harry Ballz - January 25, 2010

#193

Oh, Denise, how transparent can you be??

“Twelve-year-old girls coming back 3 and 4 times to see the movie”

M’yeah, I’m sure you’re pleading for THEM!!

199. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

Bob

will you be addressing the sudden rise from Cadet to Captain? Say jealousy amongst some officers or a determination to prove himsef.

It was a story point I was not a fan of but it the reactions of it would make sense to me.

200. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

197

I have been a Trek fan since 1990

The first Trek movie I seen at the cinema was Star Trek Vi and it is still one of my all time fav films.

First ever Star Trek I ever saw was The Wrath of Khan, this is my fav StarTrek film.

What I was saying that in 1996 seeign First Contact was a thrilling experience and I can remember the agony of waiting 9 months to rent it on video and then a further 7 months to buy my own copy onto video.

I am 26 now, Just was trying to indicate how big First Contact was too me when it hit.

201. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

197

I find it hard to believe First Contact is now 13 years old, I can remember seeing it like yesterday and at the time I as a full Trek junkie. TNG was on re runs on UK Terrestrial TVand I was buying the videos of DS9 and VOY

The 90s were a great time for Trek at its peak. I hope with future movie we can get to that peak again.

202. gingerly - January 25, 2010

#200

Oh, don’t worry, I was just teasing. :) You are just as legit as any fan.

203. Anthony Pascale - January 25, 2010

capt neill

what i have said to you about spamming. I think 15% of the posts in this thread are from you, mostly replying to yourself and saying the same thing over and over.

is there any way you can find a way to maybe be more concise? or at least stop replying to your own posts over and over?

204. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

202

Star Trek is the best thing ever

Loved it for over 20 years and I will go on loving it.

Yes I have gripes wit hthe new movie but I still enjoyed watching it. I love Trek.

205. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

203

Im sorry

guess I can go on a bit when I am passionate about something

I will try and be more concise from now on

206. Captain Hackett - January 25, 2010

That is cool!

I want to see a very original and neat story in next movie.

BTW… Happy Australia Day, Australian Trekkies/Trekkers! :)

207. dmduncan - January 25, 2010

Hey, captain_neill just bumped Star Trek 2009 to 5th position on his all time favorites list.

I’m pretty sure he used to list it as 6. No. Strike that. VERY sure he used to list it as 6. Very. Sure.

Leave him be. He’s making progress.

208. VZX - January 25, 2010

#183: Anthony: What did Marina call JJ and co?

Dang, if she really did, it might have cost her the computer voice job. But, I still think it is a great idea.

I would also like to nominate Nichelle Nichols for the computer voice.

And, I would like to nominate myself to be the science consultant for the movie (hey, why not?)

209. Capt Mike of the Terran Empire - January 25, 2010

Hey Anthony. I was out with the flu last week and missed the poll. Sorry about that. Dr. Mccoy was not available to give me his usual potion.

210. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#207

In a few months perhaps captain_neill will name it top 3, or when the sequel comes out, everything starts to click and he is forever ours.

211. Robofuzz - January 25, 2010

What I do not want is something that feels like a two hour episode of TOS with better special effects. I want a story that matters to the greater Trek universe at large. I think some hints and tying in to events that happened in TOS or later would be cool as long as it’s not overdone. But I think that Nero being in this new timeline for 20 years would have some sort of effect on how things in this new timeline unfolds. Especially since he was in the custody of the Klingons who are the enemies of the Federation. Imagine if the Russians in the 1950’s captured someone from 2010. They would do there best to use that future tech and knowledge to gain an advantage.

212. gingerly - January 25, 2010

If I were to rank the films, right now?…

STAR TREK would have to be my top choice, right now, for the sheer rewatchablity factor. Followed by Khan…

I still cry like a baby when Spock stands and straightens his suit jacket near the end, Just dignified unto death.

And yes I noticed the nod during the hearing! I grinned big.

…The others would be Country, Contact. and the whale movie.

I think a lot of the revenue for TREK came from people going back to see it again.

Heck, I remember theaters being packed well into August!

There are a lot of good films that I see and don’t need to see anymore after that.

…Usually biopics.

People always dismiss this genre as *light* or *popcorn* entertainment, but it’s can’t be easy to make a movie that actually gets better with viewings.

And this may sound like kissing up, but given the task JJ had, rebooting this franchise and striking just the right balance between satisfying picky Trekkies and gaining new fans?

He should be getting some award attention, IMO.

213. P Technobabble - January 25, 2010

After the poor performance of both INS and NEM, I am surprised Marina Sirtis would criticize Paramount for pulling the plug on TNG. In addition, GEN wasn’t received all that well. Were it not for FC, the TNG folks wouldn’t have any film to make any great claims about, IMO. I’m not saying there aren’t people out there who dug those films, but they didn’t fare too well at the box office, and, as far as Paramount is concerned, that’s the bottom line, isn’t it?

214. Damian - January 25, 2010

Since we are on the movie ranking, from top to bottom
Star Trek: The Motion Picture (again, don’t laugh)
Star Trek: First Contact (the Borg & Dominion were my favorite adversaries)
Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan
Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country
Star Trek: Nemesis
Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home
Star Trek III: The Search for Spock
Star Trek (2009)
Star Trek: Generations
Star Trek: Insurrection
Star Trek V: The FInal Frontier

Mind you, I loved them all and could watch any one at any time.

215. Jenna - January 25, 2010

I know you guys read the comments here and I heard on the interview that you have a Star Trek Supreme Council of sorts. I thought that if you were looking for some ideas you could check out:

http://www.fanfiction.net/movie/Star_Trek_2009/

Some of these people have some pretty cool ideas in their fanfiction about what they believe should happen after the movie. I believe there is one that incorporates a klingon prison camp, an Andorian, and a Cardassian all in the same story as well as some of the vicious animals of the Star Trek universe that is written really well. Just thought since you guys are looking for some ideas that maybe this will help. ^_^

216. Bucky - January 25, 2010

I have 3 #1 Star Trek movies: Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan, Star Trek: First Contact & Star Trek

All of those movies have different crews infront and behind the camera and they play very well to Trek and non-Trekkies alike. And they all have pretty heavy revenge themes, but I think that’s more of the case of FC and ST making a reference to TWOK. And someone yelling angrily: “KAAAHHHNNN!!! KAAAAHHNNNN!!!” “NOOOO!!! NOOOOOO!!!” “SPOOOCCKKK! SPOCKKKKK!!”

Hey, you’re allowed to have 3 #1s. Parallel universes and time travel and all that jazz allows for Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combination’s. Or stuff.

217. patrick - January 25, 2010

firstly, my feeling is that TREK, in general, declined in popularity because Paramount Picture milked that old-cow to death. there aren’t too many people involved in TREK-production that haven’t said the same. one series after another (with movies appearing in the theatre) and no apparent attempt to do anything but entertain hard-core fans (like myself).

however, JJ Abrams’ status at the studio, did ensure that TREK wouldn’t simply be revived as a budget-constrained project (as TREK’s 2-10 were).

now, regarding TREK’s “reinvention”. it seems to me that each incarnation of TREK has reflected new elements and changes that reflected the tastes of the TREK-filmmakers. Even Gene Roddenberry himself, have become even more socially-progressive over his post-TOS years, began the TREK-revision with his sterile/peaceful dramatic approach of TOS/TNG. Nick Meyer emphasized military aspects and uniforms quite new to TREK which satisfied his “submarine in space” and Captain Horatio Hornblower appetites. Michael Piller and Ira Steven Behr added volumes of lore to the TREK-series while expressing their focus on the deeper-emotions of it’s characters. and ENTERPRISE reflected the Sci-Fi Channel sensibilities of it’s creators with an emphasis on super sexy lead-characters (regardless of their relative acting skills) and action/fight-scenes. even Shatner pushed his Kirk character into a somewhat reckless rock-climbing thrill-seeker when, in TOS, he may have enjoyed a good fight, he only risked his life because it was his duty as Captain or friend. not simply because danger was exciting.

so by rewatching TREK2009 for about the 20th time, i conclude the new TREK-makers appear to have felt TREK would be better if it contained:

more convincing action-packed scenes and quality FX. most everyone agrees that they succeeded at this goal and it’s something fans have always felt TREK should have had more of.

rock and roll music. funny i never watched TREK listening to the soundtracks of Alex Courage, Goldsmith, Horner, and wished I was listening to contemporary-rock music. in fact, I think that idea already died with the theme to ENTERPRISE.

car chases – once again, never occurred to me that TREK would be more interesting if it incorporated elements of C.H.I.P.s? and I’d have thought that the pointless “space-jeep” chase in NEMESIS kinda suggested TREK is better without such scenes.

(PART A – with apologies for the lengthy thoughts…)

218. patrick - January 25, 2010

a complete character-makeover -recreated as bitter/cocky person with attitude (except, perhaps, for the busy Chekov and mostly absent Scotty). for instance, i enjoyed that, when an intoxicated TOS-Sulu took to the corridors of the Enterprise brandishing a fencing-foil (in “Naked Time”), he was demonstrating some deep fantasies. however, AFTER recovered, he returned to his studies of maths, plants, pistols, etc, lol, etc. the NEW-Sulu can’t wait to join a fight so he can brandish his custom-made weapons.

a better Kirk-character. Prime-Kirk must have bored these TREKmakers. Shatner’s-Kirk, apparently very popular for 45years, is quickly dispatched. the dedicated, hard-working, long-serving Lt. Kirk is replaced by the filmmaker’s vision – an angry brawler who’s only claim to greatness lies in his uncanny luck and his COOLness. no time for serving under other distinguished officers (such as Captain Garrovick “Obsession”) or earning medals for his work on peace-missions.

Scotty being less of a nerd (always happy to study his tech-manuals). Prime-Scott only satirized his “miracle worker” status later in his years. in TREK2009, he’s an endearing braggart marveling at his own invention.

a more exciting Uhura, since here the character has been radically altered. once again, i never watched Uhura thinking she’d be more interesting if she spent her screen-time chasing a man around. nor feeling that Nichelle’s performance lacked because she was rarely bad-ass (although she sure can be – see “Mirror Mirror”).

an Engineering-section that looked more like a tidy beer-factory (instead of the Engineering Rooms in TOS, TMP, TNG, ETC). the use of sets from the TV-series in the TREK-films (including Engineering), diminished the WOW-factor that TREK deserved. so TREK2009’s sets were expected to change from what we’ve seen before. however, it was quite a surprise to see people looked at a beer-factory and pictured Scotty spending his life down there. and more specifically, i don’t think that visually, it provided any scientific-illusion of what might be going on. even the TOS-Engineering had a right/left side of the room. a top/bottom, and some kind of glowing core behind the screen. however, this Engineering just seemed a large, busy room – unclear about what went on where in the place. besides, Scotty already could have a drinking-problem – should he really work 24hrs-a-day near all that tasty-brew? lol

i list these items as changes that surprised me. Because, in so many ways, TREK2009’s creators apparently do like many of the same elements of TREK that appeal to me. the Director’s commentary on TREK2009 shows me that guys like Bob are affected and charmed by previous incarnations of TREK, just as I am.

(PART B – with apologies for the lengthy thoughts…)

219. somethoughts - January 25, 2010

#218

Great comments and thoughts.

There is this great show on the food network called restaurant makeover, they send this executive chef and designer to bring old stale restaurants up to date to bring in new business and revenue. The executive chef works with the existing chef to come up with a new menu that is exciting and current and the designer updates the restaurent with sexy colors and style. The result is a restaurant that is popular and can stay in business. The existing clients love it and new clients keep going back.

The executive chef and designer was able to harmonize the past and integrate with the new, thus keeping the business open.

Most of the time the owner is reluctant as he feels his clients would hate it or not come back, they are always wrong ;)

220. patrick - January 25, 2010

love the analogy! thanks.

221. Bucky - January 25, 2010

217 – is it really that much of a problem they used Sabotage by the Beastie Boys in the movie? It was more of a tonal transitional thing right after the heavy emotional opening you go into a car chase and Sabotage (there’s also some good audio editing, check out the “Wooaaahhhh!!” line when the cop’s foot slams down and the audio transition to the shot of Vulcan). I don’t remember people harping that much when Zefram Cochrane busted out “Magic Carpet Ride” on the Phoenix’s first flight.

222. Daoud - January 25, 2010

Keenser would make a lot of sense in a Jeffries tube. Small, fits in easily. Every ship’s engineer should have a Keenser.

I hope to see Smilin’ Transporter Room Guy again. Can’t remember the actor’s name, but he smiles really well. The Mirror Universe Frownin’ Transporter Room Guy would be cool. Beard and a cowboy hat. Seen that before on his myspace page.

If they learn anything from Twilight, it’s don’t have any aliens that in any way suggest vampires, or werewolves. We’ll be quite tired of them by 2012.

But more than anything…

@ Boborci: Thank you Bob! You make online Trek fandom rather zesty fun again.

One of the best things Babylon 5 always had going for it was that J. Michael Straczynski would interact with fandom online. All were richer for the experience.

I hope that your interaction here continues, and continues to enrich your efforts with the ongoing production of Trek.

223. patrick - January 25, 2010

#221 – no, nothing at all “wrong”. since TREK is entertainment, if it works for you, then it’s succeeded, right?

however, i don’t recall the music in FIRST CONTACT continuing as a background sound-element even during exterior shots. if i’m not mistaken, the Beatsie Boys tune continued in the sound-mix even after the car went off the cliff? at that point it became part of the film-score, right? that and the Robot?-Cop who apparently was unable to make any kind of computerized 22nd century database to determine the owner of the speeding vehicle (and any of it’s possible occupants – no photo of the son of George Kirk on file, i suppose).

of course, the scene didn’t HAVE to make any sense as it was appears to have been simply a “fun” scene (especially after the poignant scenes which established Jim Kirk’s motivation for stealing the car where deleted from the film).

224. Bucky - January 25, 2010

223# Magic Carpet ride plays over the exterior shot of the Phoenix blasting off, exactly the same way Beastie Boys song plays even after it goes off the cliff. It’s an audio transition as more of an editing thing (Beastie Boys also isn’t on the soundtrack album anywhere).

As for the “fun” scene it’s an integral tonal thing because it flows better from the ending of the Kelvin scene to a car bursting out onto the road as opposed to slowing things down with the George Kirk Jr. bit which is kind of a heavy scene immediately after another heavy scene. It’s a pressure release valve for the audience after the intense emotional sacrifice of George Kirk. Also it keeps the movie moving at a zippy pace, and the pacing of the film was one of the best things about Star Trek.

225. MC1 Doug - January 25, 2010

I didn’t know JJ co-wrote ‘Armageddon.’ Interesting. I didn’t care much for it, especially when compared to the similarly themed ‘Deep Impact,’ which I think is an infinitely superior treatise of the topic.

I’m always gratified to see Mr. Orci in here. He’s a great communicator and a fan to boot.

I guess I was a bit surprised by the comment questioning why it took four months to fashion a script for the film. Do some people actually think these things materialize over night?

226. Bucky - January 25, 2010

Also I don’t get how it doesn’t make sense for the Future Cop to chase after Kirk driving the car considering how it’s a 12 year old kid behind the wheel of a potentially dangerous vehicle. Is he supposed to just let him fly by? Geez, even if the future, kids can’t drive cars.

227. ryanhuyton - January 25, 2010

The great thing about what J.J and Bob did with “Star Trek” 09 was to open doors to new possibilities. I do think the sequel needs a villian, however, simply because today’s casual audiences won’t be interested in a “Voyage Home” or “Motion Picture” type of film. I would guess the sequel will be fast paced, but also intelligent in its “message” and theme.
That is why “The Wrath of Khan” and “First Contact” were so successful.
Those films had great villians and visual effects, but the stories and character moments were what made those films great. The new “Star Trek” had good character moments, but since the crew had just come together, there is still room for it to grow in the sequel. A great villian is born from a great hero in my opinion. And vice versa. The new timeline has opened doors for new “versions” of classic villians. Khan, Gorn, Tholians,Klingons, Romulans and even the Borg could be done again without rehashing what has come before, but by “updating” while staying true to their “essence”.

As for whose voice should be used for the sequel, I think they should use the recordings of Majel Barret Roddenberry if they can. Other than that, it is a tough decision for me. I don’t think Marina Sirtis will or should, simply because she’d be too recognizeable. Also, I don’t think the Paramount executives have forgotten or forgiven her for ripping into the company or J.J Abrams. She made the mistake of biting the hand that fed her, and Paramount will NEVER forget it.

Also, I would like to ask Bob a couple of questions if he is still reading:

1) What are your favorite episodes of TOS?

2) I know you are a busy man, but would you be interested in doing a direct-to-dvd animated TNG movie?

3) Have you watched any of the other spinoffs(Deep Space Nine, Voyager, Enterprise)?

Once again thank you for the great movie you and your friends gave us.
I have no doubt you will outdo yourselves with the sequel.

228. patrick - January 25, 2010

224 – hadn’t seen FIRST CONTACT in years, so i appreciate your point certainly

having seen the deleted scenes, i agree they’d have dramatically have slowed the non-stop pace of TREK2009. however, it changes the context of young-Kirk’s behavior so completely. in the original conception, he’s an obedient, hard-working boy suffering from child-neglect and possibly even physical abuse. his theft of the car is a break-through, break-out moment of change for the boy.

without that motivation, the audience is left with young-Kirk appearing as nothing more than a reckess truant.

229. patrick - January 25, 2010

#226 besides being able to identify young-Kirk from futuristic-databases, i’d think there’d be some 22nd century version of “spike-strips” to stop offending vehicles. lol

230. ryanhuyton - January 25, 2010

As for the Beastie Boys song, “Intergalactic” would have been more appropriate, but “Sabotage” was J.J Abram’s favorite song. He may also have felt including “Intergalactic” in a space movie was just too obvious! :-)

231. LordCheeseCakeBreath - January 25, 2010

Engineering section was so not cool. I’m into using real film and grit but come on guys! You did a great job but let’s let the 23rd century have a 23rd century engineering area. Also let the bridge look more like the drawings. Those salon lights really made no sense. I get the back lighting for contrast but if I had to work with spot lights blaring in my face I’d be pissed!

Mr. Orci this is for you!!!!!!!!!!! I’ve asked this question a billion times and haven’t gotten a single response…What do those 7-11 barcode scanners do? :-) Thanks dude!

232. Bucky - January 25, 2010

230: I still think Sabotage was a better choice if only for the way it was edited, that “I can’t stand it!” opening line when he’s breezing down the high way (and the aforementioned “Wooaaahhhh!!” as the cop foot slammed down) worked great. Intergalactic doesn’t have quite the kinetic kick that Sabotage does (speaking of which, Spike Jonze directed the video and it’s the greatest video ever made)

233. boborci - January 25, 2010

182. TrekFreak – January 25, 2010
@ 16. ety3 – January 25, 2010
“Why “adapted screenplay?” The story was wholly theirs, right? Not based on a previously published work?”
—————————————
Not entirely true. Roberto Orci and Abrams have been using already established elements, and then repackaging them with a slightly different shade of paint. If you were to look at J. J.’s “Star Trek” and Lucas’s “Star Wars” at the same time, you will notice that J. J.’s “Star Trek” mirrors Luca’s story. Just with already established elements of “Star Trek”.
—–

Star Trek was first! Had it it all, including planet eater. TREK FIRST!!!!

234. ryanhuyton - January 25, 2010

Bob, don’t forget Trek came up with the idea of a humanoid lizard, the Gorn!

235. patrick - January 25, 2010

most important thing they didn’t neglect from TOS? sexy green-skinned Orion women!

236. AdamTrek - January 25, 2010

Bob, I just want a movie that raises the stakes a bit, personally, for the crew, not saving the galaxy, but saving the Enterprise, it’s crew, and the magnificent crew coming together to defeat a great villain that has it in for Kirk and Co., etc. Great action, a little action for the Captain (if you know what I mean), as well as him not getting the crap beat out of him every time he fights someone as it happened in ST09.

I wish you well.

=A=

237. Sebastian - January 25, 2010

Bob, I’m sure the blank canvas ahead of you guys is daunting, and you’re not going to please everybody. I don’t want to suggest any plot elements, characters or casting recommendations; I have no business doing that anyway.
All I want to ask is that you write this next movie from an honest, emotional place, as you did the last one (to quote your dialogue for Spock Prime, “Do what feels right”). And since (IMHO) you did such a bang-up great job on Star Trek 2009, I just want to add this;

“Gentleman, may the wind be at your backs!”

Best of luck.
Knock our socks off (again), OK?
If you do your best, then I’ll have no worries. : )

238. dmduncan - January 25, 2010

225: “I didn’t know JJ co-wrote ‘Armageddon.’ Interesting.”

I didn’t know either! I really enjoyed Armageddon, more than Deep Impact, and its one of the few Michael Bay films I actually like.

I just finished reading “Lucifer’s Hammer” for the first time, and what a good book. Definitely not one of those happy comet/meteor strike movies, and not without hope either, just a great story well told and perfectly suited to an IMAX screen in 3D. Now when it came out in the 70’s there was no way to do that book justice given the state of the art of SPFX at the time. But it would be spectacular today.

Is somebody sitting on the rights? Has the book been forgotten? Why oh why no big screen “Lucifer’s Hammer” movie yet????

239. pock speared - January 25, 2010

b’orci
more profanity please. “shove it up yer tite green arse, ya vuclan radge coont!” (as per irvine welsh) would be great.

if that proves unpopular, just write 100 spock/kirk/mccoy argument scenes, pick the top five, and win an oscar.

also “the fans want” you to PLEASE NOT LISTEN to the fans. they are a fickle, cruel and contradicting bunch of morg.

240. Bucky - January 25, 2010

You know, I think “Star Trek” finally put a bullet in a long-held-yet-not-true conception of Star Trek that Kirk get getting with sexy green alien women, HOWEVER, not once in the series or the movies does Kirk get sexy with a green alien chick. So that’s one down?

Next thing for the sequel to do: to finally have Kirk say “Beam me up, Scotty.” Will someone just please say it already fer crissakes?

241. JohnD - January 25, 2010

Is anyone else annoyed with calling these guys the “supreme court”? It carries a presumtion that these people are infallible as film makers.

I’m starting to realize that Star Trek needed to be careful since it was a huge experiment to start doing trek movies again, but I really hope these writers take a real good look at what they are doing and actually write a real story this time.

242. ryanhuyton - January 25, 2010

“also “the fans want” you to PLEASE NOT LISTEN to the fans. they are a fickle, cruel and contradicting bunch of morg”.

I really like the “irony” of your statement. I also like how you are able to speak for everyone else. While asking Bob to listen to your suggestions.

243. gingerly - January 25, 2010

#241

Is anyone else annoyed with calling these guys the “supreme court”? It carries a presumtion that these people are infallible as film makers.

Apologies, but this just seems silly to me. You’re taking this waaay too seriously.

It’s a nickname.

244. Anthony Pascale - January 25, 2010

the supreme court is not infallible, that is the pope

the term comes from the fact that it is a group who together decide on the fate of the trek canon, but who recognize that they are only the current deciders. There were others before them and there will be others after them.

sometimes I think some trek fans go out of their way to nitpick and complain

245. jas_montreal - January 25, 2010

Dear Boborci,

My favorite Trek movie still remains Star trek 2: The Wrath of Khan. Simply because it depended on the characters and i felt emotionally attached to the “trio”(kirk, spock and bones), after a lack of this trio connection in the motion picture.

Additionally, i felt betrayed in the new Star Trek film by the lack of the trio(kirk,spock and bones) connection, although I understand this is a origins story and that it may have been difficult. This trio connection was also something that made TOS season 2 particularly my favorite season of the show. I really hope you guys play on this trio dynamic heavily in the Trek Sequel. I seldom wish the sequel be empty of this trio dynamic. This connection is my most favorite part of TOS and I hope you take this into consideration.

-jas_montreal

246. Harry Ballz - January 25, 2010

245

m’yeah, what he said!

247. MC1 Doug - January 25, 2010

#245: betrayed?

I don’t see how it would be possible for the triad to be formed in ST09. This was, after all, the first time the three had worked together as a team… The triad was just beginning to form, but I am sure it will be more fully realized in the sequel.

You could begin to see the relationship between Kirk and McCoy and McCoy and Spock forming as the film progressed, but as the three… not yet… give it time. I’m sure Orci and Kurtzman will get it right!

248. jas_montreal - January 25, 2010

@ 247

How i feel isn’t up for debate. Its how i feel….

But i do understand the relation is only starting to form… but i felt it was underplayed or it was barely visible, compared to the love triangle between uhura, spock and kirk. I felt they should have balanced the trio -vs- the love triangle.

Did I see a trio argument in trek 09 ? Nope.

Its just a thought…

P.S I don’t want people to get the perception that I’m somehow hated this movie…. Contrary… I LOVED IT ! It made my most wildest trek dreams come true ! But nothing is perfect ! I think its great that we can share our concerns with Bob on trekmovie.

249. Daoud - January 25, 2010

@233 Mmmmmm, planets. Tasty.

Trek also had TRACTOR BEAMS before Star Wars, and Wars stole that! Hardware Wars did a better job though.

Ahhhh, to find again my Millenium Iron, and the Evil Empire Toasters.

(you’ll laugh, you’ll cry, you’ll kiss ten bucks goodbye)

250. Julie - January 25, 2010

I can’t think of many good villains in TOS except for Khan. That was what I liked about it, the ideology. It was more about issues than good guys vs. bad guys. That is what made it so much better than other science fiction television. The movies were also based on this ideology love, integrity, sacrifice and just doing the right thing.

It’s been said that if either Kirk or Spock had been female, Star Trek would be considered the greatest love story ever written. Some of us still believe that. And that’s why we want Kirk Prime reunited with Spock Prime and sent off together. Give us some closure and then you can do whatever you want with the new kids.

251. moauvian waoul - January 25, 2010

Bob, looking forward to your next installment. I agree with those who want more exploration. I think space should have a cold and distant quality like we saw in the cage. Above all it should be eerie.

252. DS9 IN PRIME TIME - January 25, 2010

Mr. Orci,

You are doing great. I am sure what ever you along with the “supreme court” end up going with for the new trek movie, MOST of the fans will enjoy whole hearted. Blaze your own path to glory! Kepla!

253. DS9 IN PRIME TIME - January 25, 2010

@99

I agree. Fatherfigure for young kirk is a good idea.

@204. captain_neill – January 25, 2010

You have alot of good posts. I am your age and became a fan in 1990 as well because of The Undiscovered Country. It was amazing. After that I was hooked.

254. Syn4Ever - January 25, 2010

Star Wars owes it’s butt to Trek ahaha

I feel good knowing Star Trek will be cared for! Cant wait for the next movie! :)

255. Syn4Ever - January 25, 2010

@244
I totally agree. Its quite annoying at times all the nitpicking that happens. Just appreciate that Star Trek is finally cool again. Its a good feeling!

256. captain_neill - January 25, 2010

207

You make it seem wrong I don’t put this film in first place?

But yet I told everyone that I do like the film.

In fact I do have the urge to watch the movie again sometime.

257. Jack - January 25, 2010

I’d be thrilled with no TNG, DS9, VOY or ENT cameos, aliens or further references of any kind.

I also hope that the history etc. doesn’t get overexplained, a la Enterprise etc. I liked that TOS provided few dates.

And, I’m cool with the way the sheilds were done…

One quibble – some of the postproduction stuff showing viewscreen graphics (robau’s vitals, the three skydivers) was super cool (and please do more) but sort of made the actors reading the lines (they’re at 3000 metres) look like masters of the obvious, a la counselor troi or computer-repeating Gwen from Galaxy Quest. Spock could see the viewscreen too. ;)…

258. S. John Ross - January 25, 2010

#241: “Is anyone else annoyed with calling these guys the “supreme court”? It carries a presumtion that these people are infallible as film makers.”

Given that we use the _incredibly_ pompous term “canon” to describe the facts of the fictional history, I think “supreme court” is relatively harmless :)

259. Harry Ballz - January 26, 2010

If you’re going to “court” “canon”, it might as well be them!

260. Charla - January 26, 2010

Thanks Bob and Anthony for the interview.

Bob,

I haven’t heard of anyone else in your industry who would sit down, take the time to read our comments, post thoughtful answers to them AND also throw in a video as well! This is the one site I commit to from an entertainment standpoint, and was it ever a great suprise to see Bob’s posts!

So, thank you Bob for your time as I am sure you have little like most of us, and for thinking enough of us fans to interact with us through this site. What ever you and the rest of the Supreme Court comes up with, given what you have done with ST09, I am sure will be excellent!

Great job Trekmovie.com, Anthony- Your work is appreciated-

# 128 “One of the best things about this film was that it Respected What Came Before-” Nicely put.

That is what was a large part of what was appealing to me about the film, and why I have no doubts what-so-ever that Bob, Alex and JJ will do justice to the next one.

I hope that all the critiquing here on (imho) is only considered, and not so influential that it replaces the imagination and ingenuity of these fine writers.

I do feel our opinions ARE important, but it is like telling a Dr. how to do his job. (or anyone else of specialized training, you get my meaning, I hope)

I only write this because of some of the other posters sometimes nit-picking attitudes. Sometimes people sound like children who have everything, but still insist they don’t have anything to do. (whine) LOL

Thanks again for this Bob and Anthony-

261. Will - January 26, 2010

Space vampires.

262. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

Bob

My last question was one I was looking forward to hearing about.

I was wondering if the newly promoted Kirk was going to be trying hard to prove himself or will fellow officers be jealous of his rapid promotion?

Could add an interesting dimension to that plot point in Trek XI. Would ‘cupcake’ be jealous?

263. Jack - January 26, 2010

Remaking the Buck Rogers episode where Mark Lenard is Wilma’s former flame with a shocking secret — his head detaches… (true). Sorry, “space vampires” reminded me of that show.

Did somebody above complain that Leonard McCoy cusses too much? It’s about goddamned time.

Could we get some cool alien things that actually have alien names, rather than names of ordinary things with an alien-sounding name attached, a la Talaxian Moose, Solarian Slug, Venutian Car Keys etc. One thing Lucas did well…

And I appreciated that sparks and steam didn’t shoot out of random parts of the bridge (on the enterprise, anyway) every time they were hit, a la the movies and voyager.

Sorry, random tonight.

264. Jim Smith - January 26, 2010

Last night I dreamt I went to the UK press screening for Star Trek (2012). Which to be fair, it’s quite likely I will do.

The only bits I can remember are a long scene where these crusty blue-faced, drug-sniffing aliens in armour take hostages (including Sarek and Chekov, who had been assigned to Spock’s dad for the duration of some conference and was out of uniform) in some vast conference centre hall, which looked filmed on location. That was really exciting.

There was also a moment where Scotty was in command of Enterprise and something impossible happens on the screen and Scotty says to Uhura ”Tell the Admiral to get to f–” as the scene cuts away and cuts him off. (“Get to f**K!” being a popular Scots expression) and a bit where Spock tells Kirk “We have to find… my other self”.

Just thought I’d share.

265. DJT - January 26, 2010

If I was going to see Star Trek Something Something, here are some things that I would like to see.

Carol Marcus as a love interest. A glimpse of that “life that could have been but wasn’t”, but *might* be in this timeline.

Russell Crowe as a Klingon.

More stuff from the books.

Me in the movie. :) jk.

266. Damian - January 26, 2010

The current “supreme court” of Star Trek must feel like they are pulled in 6 directions. Some fans want purity regarding canon (fans of all series), some fans only care about the original series and want them to ignore or outright contradict the other series never existed, and some are fans of the new movie and could care less if Spock, Kirk and McCoy’s friendship ever happens, etc. And each segment sometimes think they represent the most important one.

I say you can probably satisfy everyone in regards to canon. You have a new universe that runs parallel to the so-called prime universe. This frees you up to do new stories. You still have to be careful of Enterprise, not to contradict anything there since it would still apply. But this is no big deal. I doubt Abrams, Orci and the rest of the court will do a story that would have anything to do with what happpened in Enterprise anyway. The other series were all after and obviously would be affected. However they were also over 100 years in the future at this point.

So I do not see that there is really a need for conflict between the camps.

267. Damian - January 26, 2010

233-boborci (TREK was first)

And some people think Star Trek fans are fickle. I’ve known some die hard Star Wars fans in my time. They are practically rabid.

And when it comes to on screen time:
Star Wars–6 feature films, a smattering of television and animated specials (most of which no one but die hards remember) and 1 tragic holiday special

Star Trek–11 feature films, 5 live action television series (3 of which had 7 seasons), and an animated series, none of which falls under the tragic category

268. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

267

Trek was first and is still the superior show.

I love all the Star Trek shows and movies where as in Star Wars I only like the original trilogy.

Also there is more variety that what can be done in Star Trek in regards to story telling.

Star Trek is about exploring the galaxy and learning about exploring the human condition. With Trek we get to see a positive future where we embrace differences and war and hunger have been eliminated. That is a great philosophy.

269. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

253

Thank you for your comment, I also love your ID.

270. somethoughts - January 26, 2010

#234

“Bob, don’t forget Trek came up with the idea of a humanoid lizard, the Gorn!”

The Gorn (humanoid lizards) has visited earth millions of years earlier and continue to do so and work with the underground civilizations.

http://www.subversiveelement.com/Dulce_Index.html

271. Hugh Hoyland - January 26, 2010

After watching Bob in the interview you can see his enthusiasm for Trek. Its so cool to have someone who is obviously a big fan of the series in charge of the new direction of the franchise.

272. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

Guess I have to get the crapiness of Transformers 2 out of my head lol.

273. Janice - January 26, 2010

#99–EM
Absolutely agree with you regarding Pike!!
I want Pike in the sequel too—Bruce Greenwood was indeed amazing.
I’d love to see a continuation of the mentor relationship between Pike and Kirk! There’s lots the writers could do there.

274. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

Bruce Greenwood was great as Pike

I would like to see more of him

275. Janice - January 26, 2010

#274 captain_neill

ME TOO!! I want to see more of BG as Pike and I really want to see PIke in the sequel!!

276. Bill Peters - January 26, 2010

I’d Like to see the Gorn and Klingons and see Marina Sirtis do the computer Voice. Also wouldn’t mind seeing a few Mentions more to TNG and DS9 Species!

277. TrekkieJan - January 26, 2010

Thanks for the interview, Anthony and Bob! It doesn’t really make the wait for the new movie any easier, but I can’t think of better company while we wait (and you work.) I don’t have any real suggestions or requests except to keep being a fan yourself. :) (Well, it would be nice for Scotty to have something that looked like a main station where he could control stuff. And stuff. He was sort of running around, looking like a headless chook during the final crisis in the last movie. But then again…I can see where present company wants to avoid being too static. So …ignore me! :D )

278. P Technobabble - January 26, 2010

There’s just no way the Supreme Court is going to supremely please everyone. For every fan that wants ___________, there’s another fan who wants _________ (fill in your own wants). I still think the best thing we can do is show our enthusiasm and support for these guys, and go into the theater with an open mind. I’m sure many people know the Zen story about the student who goes to learn about Zen from an old master, and proceeds to tell the old master everything he already knows. The old master is pouring a cup of tea, and keeps pouring as the tea-cup overflows. The student says, “Master! Stop! No more will go in!” And the master says, “Like this cup, your mind is too full of what you already know. You must empty your mind in order to learn.” I’ve paraphrased the story a bit, but this is the gist of it.
Let go of “old” Star Trek, make room for some “new” Star Trek. This is how I see it…

279. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

I don’t like the term Supreme Court, seems a bit pretentious but I do hope they deliver something good.

278

I love old Trek and it will always have a special place in my heart, but I treat the new movie as a separate entity.

But I am one who want s the new fans to check the other Star Trek shows and movies out.

280. S. John Ross - January 26, 2010

#278: “There’s just no way the Supreme Court is going to supremely please everyone.”

Indeed. Nor is it their job to.

“I still think the best thing we can do is show our enthusiasm and support for these guys, and go into the theater with an open mind.”

I agree wholeheartedly with the open mind part. Prior to the release of ST09, I had a mixture of excitement and concern about it based on the trailers and things I read here, but I went in and had a fun time with it. I think it failed on every level for me as a Star Trek film, but as an action-comedy spectacle it delivered. Liked it a lot, saw it twice.

Disagree with the showing enthusiasm and support as a global thing. Would suggest, rather, that those who feel it should show it. Those who don’t feel it benefit no one by fibbing and pretending they do.

“Let go of “old” Star Trek, make room for some “new” Star Trek.”

If you’re visiting an old Zen master you presumably believe strongly that his teachings are valuable. To receive valuable teachings, it makes perfect sense to do what is necessary to learn. That doesn’t necessarily map to tie-in franchise popcorn entertainment, especially at the rate you cite. Again, I have an alternate idea: if they succeed in tempting me with the trailers and other marketing techniques, then I will pay the price of a ticket, and then it becomes their job to give me entertainment value proportionate to that ticket price, and they will either fail or succeed. And I’ll save the Zen metaphors for things with more tea in them.

They already did one thing that hadn’t happened in a while: they got me to _not_ skip another Star Trek movie, a habit I’d settled into pretty comfortably. But it’s one I don’t mind returning to. It’ll be up to the trailers and advance material, as always.

‘Cause it’s a movie. Not Zen mastery.

281. skyjedi - January 26, 2010

It must be great to be a superfan like Bob Orci and being able to get to write star trek movies. Not only that but getting to have a hand in shaping the future of the franchise and its legacy. As a fan that must put a great weight on your shoulders, because they last time someone screwed up Trek it was to be canceled forever. If not for the JJ abrams project it would have stayed canceled.

To me as a Superfan of Star Wars and not Star Trek i can only relate that to being able as a fan to write the next star wars episode, which would never happen. But in Trek all things are possible.

282. John from Cincinnati - January 26, 2010

Bob Orci is a great fellow. I never met him but any Hollywood screenwriter who takes the time to chat with fans to get their input is pretty awesome. What a breath of fresh air, so different from the normal egotistical Hollywood types.

283. skyjedi - January 26, 2010

The new movie may not have seemed Trek enough, but for me was the best action adventure film since star wars ’77. Bob and everyone should be proud of their achievement they made a film that is a blast to watch. A fun film. When was the last time Star Trek was fun, or Star Wars for that matter?

284. Buzz Cagney - January 26, 2010

This fan is entirely and completely indifferent to Sirtis as the computer voice. Hope that helps clear that confusion up.
Besides, I doubt she’d be able to maintain the ‘accent’. She certainly didn’t bother herself too much during TNG’s run.

285. The Disinvited - January 26, 2010

227. ryanhuyton – “Also, I don’t think the Paramount executives have forgotten or forgiven her for ripping into the company or J.J Abrams. She made the mistake of biting the hand that fed her, and Paramount will NEVER forget it.”

I don’t think you could be more wrong. Things are in flux at Paramount. People come and go. The Paramount she dissed isn’t even the same Paramount that fed her.

Never? You do realize Michael Eisner isn’t the head of any Paramount anymore and the current chief’s only held that position for a handful of years?

286. skyjedi - January 26, 2010

Yeah i think the new paramount exec is doing things right. Hopefully we will see a new tv series as some point. But Perhaps they are afraid to have a show in competition with the movies.

Me i want more Trek whether books, films or tv. The new JJ Verse would be a great thing to transition into a weekly television series but they don’t want to kill the goose that lays the golden eggs.

287. Damian - January 26, 2010

285–Paramount would not think twice about Sirtis doing the computer if they thought it would be a few more dollars at the theatre. I agree with new people at Paramount, her prior statements are meaningless. She may still have to make up with JJ Abrams, but Paramount will not be an issue.

It was the new Paramount regime that brought JJ Abrams on board. The prior idea for a new movie by Eric Jenderson was going to be about the Romulan War (as an avid fan, that idea intrigued me, but I’m not sure how that would have flew with John Q Public). It was probably for the best because his script did not involve Archer’s Enterprise at all, and how could you have the Romulan War in his time without the Starfleet’s flagship. Luckily the Enterprise novels have decided to tackle that story (let’s face it, the War will never be seen on screen). I only hope with all the changes at Pocketbooks that we will someday see a continuation. The first book really left me hanging.

288. P Technobabble - January 26, 2010

280. Sir John

Sorry, I was not implying that it is the Supreme Court’s job to please everyone… I simply stated there was no way they could do that. An obvious observation, perhaps, but I wonder if some people don’t have a very solid grasp of the obvious, based on some of the comments I read here, at times.
Also, I guess I should have been more specific about who would be enthusiastic and supportive of the Supreme Court. I realize there are people out there in Trek-land who don’t care for what they’ve done with Star Trek, and I don’t really expect those people to be supportive, nor am I encouraging anyone to lie about how they feel. I, personally, think some of the constant badgering about the movie and the Supreme Court gets out of hand, but I’m really not trying to tell ANYONE what to do, especially in a Star Trek forum, God forbid…
Meanwhile, there are numerous ways to market a film, and they’re not always very truthful. How many trailers made the film look promising, then when you went to see the film you realized the trailer contained all the best seconds of that film? It’s happened to me plenty of times. But, again, as I’ve said many times before, I don’t think any film-maker sets out to make a piece of crap. Of course it’s their job to deliver “the goods,” but if I don’t happen to like the film it does not mean they didn’t do their job. It just means I didn’t like it. There may be lots of others who did like it, just as I really liked Trek09 and some people didn’t. I’m not saying I’m right and they are wrong. All I’m saying is that the film-makers delivered the best movie they could make, given whatever circumstances or limitations the film was made under.
As for the Zen metaphor, I thought it was somewhat appropriate, since the gist of the master’s message was meant to apply to everyday living (whatever that entails) and not just to learning about one thing. I will try to speak less metaphorically in the future…

279. neil — the term Supreme Court doesn’t bother me one bit, because I don’t get the feeling (from reading or listening to Bob Orci, or Alex Kurtzman, or JJ Abrams) that these people are taking themselves that seriously. They are being humorous, it’s tongue-in-cheek. I do not believe it is being said out of arrogance or pomp. This is how I see it, and I’m saying right up front I’m taking responsibility for my own perspective. Everyone is free to see it any way they want.

289. S. John Ross - January 26, 2010

#288 “An obvious observation, perhaps, but I wonder if some people don’t have a very solid grasp of the obvious, based on some of the comments I read here, at times.”

Fair comment.

“[...] nor am I encouraging anyone to lie about how they feel. ”

Fair enough. I hope you can at least see how I interpreted it that way (especially given the genuine presence here of franchise fans who feel that “true fans” literally owe their support to the franchise no matter what).

“But, again, as I’ve said many times before, I don’t think any film-maker sets out to make a piece of crap. Of course it’s their job to deliver “the goods,” but if I don’t happen to like the film it does not mean they didn’t do their job. It just means I didn’t like it.”

100% agreement, of course. It’s down not only to differing tastes, but differing priorities.

“As for the Zen metaphor, I thought it was somewhat appropriate, since the gist of the master’s message was meant to apply to everyday living (whatever that entails) and not just to learning about one thing.”

Of course, but it still presumes the value of the new thing is worth “letting go” of the old thing. To build directly on the metaphor: if I have a cup of tea, and you are offering to fill it with an unnamed fluid from an opaque jar, _and_ you’re giggling and picking your nose, _and_ the last time we went through this you tried to fill my cup with store-brand “Compare to Kool-Aid(TM)” equivalent soft-drink powder mixed with water you found in a puddle and sugar you scraped from your scalp … well, I think I’ll just keep my tea and not empty my cup, thanks. This, right now, is where the AbramsTrek team is for me, though as before I’ll be happy to let them sell me on their product when the time comes.

290. RZ - January 26, 2010

In response to #183, Mr. Pascale: I totally agree with you! In all honesty, if Paramount had come back with another TNG movie, I would have skipped it altogether. I respect the fans who enjoy TNG series and movies, but TNG was never something I could relate to. As far as Marina’s comments, she should have been more careful if she wanted to remain part of the Trek franchise.

I will praise Trek’s Supreme Court until the end of time for revamping Trek and bringing it back. The fact that ST Nemesis brought in $43 mil at the box office and JJ’s brought in $258 mil leaves me to wonder how the previous cast and “powers that be” even considered bringing TNG back for another movie (at least during this decade). JJ, Bob, and Alex brought Trek back to life and I wouldn’t have changed a thing in ST09 after I saw it in the theatres. To me, it was perfectly presented and blows the rest of the Trek movies away. Also, they had the task of not only presenting a great movie, but, at the same time, having to clean up the mess that Berman and company left. I’m looking very forward to ST 2012.

Just my thoughts (and I’ve been a fan of Trek since the mid-1970’s)

291. Damian - January 26, 2010

I’ll admit when I first saw Star Trek (2009) I was in shock at all the changes. It did take me a while to digest it all. The one thing that finally got me on board was the whole alternate universe idea (which has been explained in the past–TNG episode “Parallels” is probably the best in- universe reference for the idea). I love all Star Trek and when I first saw it my thought was, my God, they just erased 40 years of established Star Trek (except Enterprise). Of course with a closer look I did find out this was not true.

I also think one thing that helped is really the novels. Some fans go to conventions, some are collectors, I am an avid novel reader. The novels taking place in the other series have continued in their respective relaunches as has books based on the original series. I like the continuing stories in the realunches and how one leads to another, and like the individual stories that are done also. I was dissapointed books in the alternate universe (the JJ verse as I heard it called) were postponed, but I suppose Paramount wants them to wait until they see where we are headed in the next film. But the books keep the other series going for me, and I hope that continues.

As an aside, I am curious to see how the novels will treat the story behind Nero in the 24th century. I would like to see them reconcile with the Countdown comic book series somehow. He came from 2387 and right now the new Typhon Pact novels will take place in 2382, so they have a few years left. But it would be nice to see some of the changes we see by 2387 gradually start to take place (such as Picard becoming an Ambassador to Vulcan, Crusher getting a command, Data’s resurrection, etc).

292. The Disinvited - January 26, 2010

#208

The alarming thing isn’t that Marina was chauvinistic about her TNG. It was a large swath of her life that actually put food in her mouth. What’s nonplussing is how close TBBT came in depicting some reactions to it.

No one bears a grudge quite like a Trekkie whose faction’s been rebuked.

293. The Disinvited - January 26, 2010

#208

The alarming thing isn’t that Sirtis was chauvinistic about TNG. It was a large swath of her life that actually put food in her mouth. What is surprising is how close TBBT came in depicting reactions to it.

No one bears a grudge quite like a Trekkie whose faction has been rebuked.

294. The Disinvited - January 26, 2010

Sorry for the duplication something was bit-bucketing the say-its. Took a while to figure it out.

295. Red Skirt - January 26, 2010

#289 S. John Ross, LOL, I love reading your comments … my boyfriend may have reason to become jealous. ;-) … “sugar you scraped from your scalp” LOL

However, I do think there is merit in P Technobabble’s observation and application of “you must empty your mind in order to learn.”

Many longtime fans dislike some of the changes in the film and are resisting them. The only arguments they can put forth is because that’s the way it was created by Gene Roddenberry (who had more than his share of bad ideas for the franchise) and should not be tampered with or changed, without realizing their opinion is colored by having seen it presented only that way for over 40 years, since no one ever tried it any other way.

Orci and Kurtzman have some fresh ideas, like Spock & Uhura for instance, which should be explored. There is no reason not to. The only thing I see preventing fans from embracing some of these ideas is a long standing grip on the way it has always been done, resisting change because their mind is full of these old perceptions. In the Fall of 1966, the first, least developed episodes of Star Trek began to air, and in my opinion are some of the best, without any knowledge of the character’s future relationships, in fact the series was cancelled only after these relationships were fully developed. This offers proof that Star Trek can evolve effectively without relying on stale predictable relationships which may not adequately reflect the ideologies of today’s audiences. The writers had the freedom to explore these relationships in the 1960s, don’t restrict Bob & Alex from doing so now, by holding them to the course the original writers explored as some sort of holy scripture.

Change is good, and indeed has been good for Star Trek. Let them run with it. But insist they make the changes coherently with good depth and plot development! No scalp sugar in my tea please! LOL

296. ensign joe - January 26, 2010

#295 Well said. With emphasis on: “But insist they make the changes coherently with good depth and plot development!”

and hold the sugar :)

297. Damian - January 26, 2010

We seem to go back and forth between why you should or should not like it. Hey if you hated it, fine. I’ve got no beef with you. The good thing about Star Trek is there is tons of it around. Some like one show and not another, whatever, that’s cool. The only thing that bothers me is if someone (not anyone in particular here) infers that you are somehow inferior for liking or not liking a particular show/movie. I love it all and see nothing wrong with loving Star Trek: Nemesis and Star Trek (2009) all at the same time. All the shows and movies represented Star Trek’s vision well for me.

298. Kruge - January 26, 2010

RE: Siritis

there is a difference between being chauvanistic and supporting your show and just having no class. She said JJ Abrams and Paramount were “killing Star Trek” when the prequel was announced in 2006, essentially killing off the last chance for another TNG movie. That is just low class. Plus she mocks other series like calling DS9 “Deep Snore Nine” and she has criticized Enterprise too. She has no class

Good thing the current poll has only 16% wanting her to do the voice. She should never get another paycheck for Star Trek

299. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

233. boborci – January 25, 2010

@ 16. ety3 – January 25, 2010
“Why “adapted screenplay?” The story was wholly theirs, right? Not based on a previously published work?”
—————————————
@ 182. TrekFreak – January 25, 2010
Not entirely true. Roberto Orci and Abrams have been using already established elements, and then repackaging them with a slightly different shade of paint. If you were to look at J. J.’s “Star Trek” and Lucas’s “Star Wars” at the same time, you will notice that J. J.’s “Star Trek” mirrors Luca’s story. Just with already established elements of “Star Trek”.
—————————————
@ 233. boborci – January 25, 2010
Star Trek was first! Had it it all, including planet eater. TREK FIRST!!!!
—————————————

When it comes to plagiarizing the:
– Farm boy living with his step parents.
– Farm boy learning from an older man who knew his father.
– Farm boy going out into the world to embrace a larger destiny.
– Farm boy living with is step parent in a desert location.
– Farm boy meeting up with another guy who he doesn’t get along with, and then he eventually teams up with him at the end of the movie.

“Star Trek” didn’t define those elements into movie or television canon until the new movie. “Star Trek IV: The Voyage Home” (1986) only told you that he grew up in Iowa; however, it didn’t go into deep detail about his youth. None of the television or movies episodes touched upon Kirk’s earlier childhood. Even though “Star Trek” as a franchise was created earlier, those elements listed above were taken from “Star Wars: A New Hope” (1979).

Yes, “Star Trek” existed before “Star Wars”; however, the new “Star Trek” movie elements came from “Star Wars”. Its a repackaged Lucas story, which was slightly twisted to fit the “Star Trek” universe.

300. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

http://www.wimp.com/treksteals/

301. The Disinvited - January 26, 2010

298

To borrow a line from THE PRINCESS BRIDE : I don’t think that word (chauvinistic) quite means what you think it means.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chauvinistic

302. ensign joe - January 26, 2010

#299 TreakFreak

That’s a bit unfair isn’t it?

Look at the story for Avatar.

The themes presented in Star Trek 09 and Star Wars have been around for a long time.

Try looking at it from a bigger perspective.

Star Wars : History : Writing
from
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars_Episode_IV:_A_New_Hope

“Lucas started again on a completely new outline, this time borrowing heavily from Akira Kurosawa’s The Hidden Fortress, so much so that he at one time considered buying the rights to the film. He relied on a plot synopsis from Donald Richie’s book The Films of Akira Kurosawa and wrote a 14-page draft that paralleled The Hidden Fortress, with names and settings reminiscent of the science fiction genre.”

303. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 302. ensign joe – January 26, 2010
That’s a bit unfair isn’t it?
——————–

I don’t think its unfair.

Here was the original question being asked:
——————————–
@ 16. ety3 – January 25, 2010
“Why “adapted screenplay?” The story was wholly theirs, right? Not based on a previously published work?”
——————————–

304. Damian - January 26, 2010

#299–you make some interesting circumstantial links. But that is all they are. There is no doubt JJ Abrams is influenced by Star Wars (he said as much himself). And you could argue the special effects are very similar to Star Wars (well, except maybe the lens flares). But coming out of the movie, my first thought was not, ohmigod, they copied Luke Skywalker. Some key differences

–Kirk’s father was a hero who sacrificed himself for 800 of his shipmates, his wife and newborn son (not exactly Darth Vader)
–Luke grew up in a desert with his aunt and uncle. Kirk grew up in farmlands with his mother and stepfather
–Young Kirk was portrayed as a rebellious youth, Luke while a rebel, was not hitting on girls and picking fights; and he was not cocky
–Spock is about as far from Han Solo as you can get

O could go on, but there are some very key differences between the two. Somehow I don’t think the writers thought, gee how can we make Kirk like Luke. And as much as I enjoy Star Wars now and again, Captain Kirk can wipe the walls with Luke Skywalker.

305. Scott - January 26, 2010

The one thing I’d like to see in the next movie is Kirk get his ass kicked.

In the Abrams film, he had nothing going for him but bravado–he didn’t really ever use his intellect or leadership or negotiation skills, he just barged into situations and always happened to make the right choice. In the second film, I’d love to see him use that bravado and make a terrible choice, destroying half the Enterprise or something in the process. Then he could have a crisis of confidence, which Spock could help him out of, and by the end convince us all that he really deserves the keys to the Enterprise.

Other than that, I’d love to see a movie do a Naked Time-type thing where the whole crew goes INSANE!

306. Nieuwe Films » Nieuws » Star Trek schrijvers over de sequel - January 26, 2010

[...] maar wel het gevoel hebben dat de pre-productie dit jaar al kan beginnen. Bekijk het hele interview hier. Meer informatie over dit onderwerp:  – Star Trek meest illegaal [...]

307. Devon - January 26, 2010

“When it comes to plagiarizing the:
– Farm boy living with his step parents.”

It was his Uncle Frank. Not sure where people got that it was his “stepparents.”

308. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 304. Damian – January 26, 2010

Actually:
~ Luke’s father was a cunning hero who sacrificed himself to a larger cause.
~ Luke’s aunt and uncle were his step parents.
~ Luke lived on a farm in the desert.
~ Spock and Kirk’s relationship mirrored Luke and Han’s relationship. They both didn’t get along until the movie’s end.
~ Luke and Kirk’s mother died before he was of age.
~ Luke and Kirk visited a bar with aliens, and they were both involved with a bar fight.

http://www.wimp.com/treksteals/

If you played out the movies side by side, they really do mirror each other at a fundamental level. Orci’s movie was not an “original idea”.

309. P Technobabble - January 26, 2010

295. Red

The scalp-sugar thing really is quite funny, but I wanted to assure you, and everyone else, that I shower and wash my hair each and every morning and, apart from the occasional nervous head-scratching, my scalp is free of sugar, dandruff or any other yucky things… ;-)

310. S. John Ross - January 26, 2010

#295: “S. John Ross, LOL, I love reading your comments … my boyfriend may have reason to become jealous. ;-) … “sugar you scraped from your scalp” LOL”

Aw :) Hugs to you, too.

“However, I do think there is merit in P Technobabble’s observation and application of “you must empty your mind in order to learn.””

Oh, I agree with it, absolutely. I just think that a prerequisite for applying it is some measure of faith that there _is_ something to learn, something of value. I did a buttload of mind-emptying* before seeing ST09 (my initial hesitance toward the film, replaced by growing sincere enthusiasm and hope for it, is chronicled here), and … well, I believe another applicable axiom is “Once bitten, twice shy.”

* Yes, logically this implies that I emptied my mind into my butt, or at least into someone’s butt. This could explain _so_ much.

“Many longtime fans dislike some of the changes in the film and are resisting them.”

Indeed. For my own part, I’m fine/happy with something approaching 100% of the changes (including absolutely 100% of the timeline-specific ones). I’d have been fine with lots more, really … I wish they’d done a whole-hearted reboot instead of the timey-wimey thing, since that particular gimmick just saddled the film with extra narrative demands (and they already had the heavy requirements of an origin-story-plus-ensemble). As a pro-Keenser, pro Spock/Uhura shipping, pro-brewery, relax-and-let-canon-go fan of the film, I often feel like its biggest apologist, even though I know some would never see me that way. I have a lot more complaints with the gratuitous fanservice winks (and the substance they displaced) than with the changes …

“The writers had the freedom to explore these relationships in the 1960s, don’t restrict Bob & Alex from doing so now, by holding them to the course the original writers explored as some sort of holy scripture.”

I’m sure I never would, and I think I’m clearly on record as being against the holding of “canon” entirely. I’m not at all interested in seeing new Star Trek cleave to the path of old Star Trek, only to its standards.

“Change is good”

Stagnation is bad. But change … change is just change.

“Let them run with it.”

I’m still harboring warm hopes that they might one day walk with it. The only thing keeping them from running, is them. It’s not up to me or any of us here.

311. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

Wait! You are correct Devon. They were his aunt and uncle. D’oh. That makes it even worse. Lol..

312. Red Skirt - January 26, 2010

#303, Trekfreak, while I don’t dispute the similarities you outline, your response has_nothing_to do with the original poster’s (#16) question.

That question asked why it was in the adapted category since it did not appear to be an adaptation of a pre-existing story, but original to the writers

Your argument suggests that category labeling applies to films which may recycle ideas presented in other works. Nothing could be further from the truth. Adaptation means based on a pre-existing work. Not pre-existing ideas. While Star Trek has many similarities with Star Wars and many other films, just as Star Wars has similarities with pre-existing works, neither film’s script was based on a_specific_pre-existing work.

However, Star Trek_was_based solidly on pre-existing characters and story elements which were created by someone else. Therefore, they adapted them in a different way. This is no different than a film based on a book in which major story points have been altered. As far as the WGA is concerned, Star Trek is an original story based on specific pre-existing concepts.

Star Wars qualified as an original script. The Empire Strikes Back and all subsequent scripts qualify as an adapted screenplay, not because they are based on ideas you may have seen in other non-related works, but because they are derivative of the original creation. They are sequels.

313. S. John Ross - January 26, 2010

#312: “Star Wars qualified as an original script.”

Kurosawa notwithstanding, since the adaptation was, ah, unofficial ;)

314. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 312. Red Skirt – January 26, 2010

Whatever you tell yourself is fine with me. All I know is that J.J’s version of “Star Trek” was not an original idea (or script for that matter). It had been done before. All they did is splash on some new paint, and then they made slight changes to fit it into the “Star Trek” universe.

315. boborci - January 26, 2010

299. TreakFreak – January 26, 2010

Read HERO WITH A THOUSAND FACES for origins of all.

316. S. John Ross - January 26, 2010

#315: LOL.

317. Bucky - January 26, 2010

Where was the part in A New Hope when Luke made out with a green alien chick in her underwear?

318. Bucky - January 26, 2010

Where was the part in A New Hope when Han Solo cheated on his exams in the Imperial Academy?

319. Damian - January 26, 2010

308–You’re still making some circumstantial links here. Ok maybe you can argue Spock and Kirk developed like Han and Luke, however Luke and Kirk, and Spock and Han are nothing alike. Maybe Han and Kirk, but even Han did not pick fights in bars over girls.

And more importantly Kirk and Spock’s relationship in the movie do mirror that in the television series. In “Where No Man Has Gone Before” Kirk and Spock are not close friends. Gary Mitchell is Kirk’s best friend until his death. Kirk gets angry at Spock for being cold and unemotional. It is not until the end, when Kirk states that there may be some hope for Spock that they start moving in that direction.

And Bob Orci and the others have noted the Star Trek novels for some inspiration. While not considered canon–novels have established that Kirk grew up on a farm. I would say that is where that came from more so than that Luke grew up on a farm.

320. S. John Ross - January 26, 2010

Bucky, the movie is called Star Wars. “A New Hope” is something they tacked on in the 80s. Try not to buy in; it only encourages them.

And originally, Han Solo cheated on his exams, but in the remastered version, Greedo slipped the answers to him.

321. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 315. boborci – January 26, 2010

I already understand the concept. If you took the new “Star Trek’s” screen play and turned it into an outline, you will notice that it mirrors the “Star Wars” screen play. You guys can live in denial all you want, but the new “Star Trek” movie is “Star Wars” at its core.

If you were making the argument based upon the script’s usage of only a few elements, I would agree with your point of view. Unfortunately, the issue I am talking about is a “collection of recycled elements”, which mirrored the outline used to create “Star Wars”.

J. J.’s “Star Trek” has already been done before. Its called “Star Wars: A New Hope”.

322. Bucky - January 26, 2010

Where was the part in A New Hope when Wedge Antilles discovers the secret of transwarp beaming as related to him by Jan Dodonna Prime?

323. Bill Peters - January 26, 2010

Trekfreak, The New Star Trek didn’t steal anything. it stuck to Trek lore and by the way Jim mom didn’t die and also Star Wars was a good flim series but had nothing to do with the people of Earth or the Future of the people of earth. I for one Like the new Star Trek and will enjoy seeing what we get in the next movie.

324. Red Skirt - January 26, 2010

#310 as always the dispassionate voice of reason.

All I’m saying is fans shouldn’t intentionally place obstacles in the writer’s path to prevent them from running with it. Or, likewise, within fan’s own minds to prevent them from enjoying a good idea when the writer’s do stumble across one. ;-)

Uhura and Spock is a perfect example. Roddenberry’s revisionist thoughts on the matter notwithstanding, such a pairing could never be explored in the 60s, nor with Kirk for that matter. But in watching the early episodes, I saw hints of it. In my mind I can hear the network censors asking Roddenberry, “what are your intentions with these scenes?” and quickly nipping the development in the bud. So who is to say Roddenberry didn’t want to explore it then? Nevertheless, we did get the exploration of the unrequited love of Chapel and Spock for three seasons. So, why do that again? Why not explore what would happen if Spock did find love with a woman? Especially a young Spock who is still struggling with his emotions. Who is to say this was not part of Spock’s development all along? Oh yeah, right, the nostalgic change adverse fans who can’t see Spock in any other way than he was depicted for the last 40 years.

325. Bucky - January 26, 2010

Where was the part in A New Hope when Moff Tarkin travels back in time and kills Luke’s father thereby skewing the timeline into an alternate reality?

326. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

Guys, I am not hammer on the movie. All I am saying is that its not an original idea. Its similar to how “Star Wars: A New Hope” has elements that mirrors “The Wizard of Oz.”

Its not a new concept. What makes it stick out more is that there is a “collection of elements’, which mirrors someone else’s original piece of work. It wasn’t just one or two story pieces.

327. Damian - January 26, 2010

317, 318 and 322–LOL, I missed those parts too.

For every similarity to Star Wars that is put out there I could probably tell you a equally compelling difference.

Influenced, yes. No one has denied that. But plagiarized, I don’t think so. I somehow doubt we’ll see Nero come back in the next film to tell Kirk “I am your father”

328. Bill Peters - January 26, 2010

Star Trek 09 stuck ot Trek Lore and did many things we haven’t seen in Trek. Star Wars was good TreakFreak but it isn’t Trek. Trek has things Star Wars could never have like dealing with the Positive Future of the People of Earth and also has more hope in it. If it was not for the Gene Roddenberry’s Star Trek there were would be No Star Wars Period. Star Trek is and always has been the best for Mankind. Star Trek is it own thing Yes there were similar Ideas inbetween the Old Star Wars Movies and Trek 09 but Trek 09 stayed in the Trek Universe and did what Trek has always done, It stole Nothing!

329. S. John Ross - January 26, 2010

#324: “as always the dispassionate voice of reason.”

Oh, now you wound me! I am many things, none of them dispassionate.

“All I’m saying is fans shouldn’t intentionally place obstacles in the writer’s path to prevent them from running with it.”

I agree. But, sincerely: do you think anyone here has done so, or has tried to do so, or is even in a _position_ to do so? All we can be here is consumers: satisfied, dissatisfied, or in-between (I’m in-between). Orci’s participation here, and any extent to which he takes any comments to heart, are voluntary on his part.

“Or, likewise, within fan’s own minds to prevent them from enjoying a good idea when the writer’s do stumble across one. ;-)”

Indeed, though as the copyright office reminds us: it’s all about the works.

330. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

Wow! They really suckered you guys into accepting this movie as being an original idea.

Hahaha…

331. Bill Peters - January 26, 2010

TreakFreak, it was Original and it was a new take on Trek, Why are you here if you hate Star Trek so much? Huh? Orci and the rest did a great Job, why insulut them? There was no Plagiarism in Trek 09, Also I agree with #324 that Change in Trek is good!

332. Damian - January 26, 2010

I only dispute that they plagiarized, your words, Star Wars. With all the movies out there, there are no real original ideas for movies anymore. I never said their idea was completely original. I can name half a dozen Star Trek movies, shows and books that are similar to Star Trek (2009), along with other movies and shows. The argument here is whether they plagiarized Star Wars or not. I see influences from Star Wars, but I also see influences from dozens of other films.

333. P Technobabble - January 26, 2010

314. Treak

How, exactly, would you define “original?” What, precisely, hasn’t been “done before,” in some way? Everyone is influenced by someone or something else, something that’s come before. The Beatles were influenced by Elvis, Buddy Holly, Smokey Robinson, etc., yet they are considered to be one of the most original groups of all-time. The Stones and Led Zep were influenced by Muddy Waters, and other blues artists. Metallica, and other metal bands, were influenced by Black Sabbath, who were influenced by the music they grew up with, and so on and on… That’s how it works. No one (generally) accuses any of these people of plagarism. Even more specifically (for example), there was a scene in FC where Picard reaches out to touch the rocket that would lift Cochran’s warp-drive vehicle into space. That scene is an exact lift from 2001 where Floyd reaches out to touch the monolith. Frakes, himself, said as much. I don’t recall anyone busting his chops about that. Everyone is influenced by someone or something else… That’s my story, I’m stickin with it. Hmm, I think that comment comes from someone else, too….

334. Anthony Pascale - January 26, 2010

warning to trekfreak

find a way to make your points without insulting others

335. Bill Peters - January 26, 2010

I agree with Damian, I can see where the Influences from Star Wars may have come but I can see influences of other shows and Films as well as past Trek Shows and Movies and books1

336. Bill Peters - January 26, 2010

Very cool # 333. Totally Agree!

337. S. John Ross - January 26, 2010

I for one am far more disappointed by the warmed over Khan than by the warmed-over Skywalker.

And as the old saying goes: stealing from _one_ source is plagiarism; stealing from _two_ is research. :)

338. TrekFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 331. Bill Peters – January 26, 2010

#1 – Its not an original idea.
#2 – I don’t hate the “Star Trek” franchise.
#3 – I didn’t insult them. I disagree with everyone.

Everyone here has a right to their own opinion, and I am not bashing anyone for their perspective. I just disagree with Orci’s personal bias about the new movie’s script. I also disagree with everyone else who has adapted the logic, “Star Trek can do no wrong” philosophy. Its a very narrow minded perspective. Sorry I don’t belong to your collective.

339. Damian - January 26, 2010

I think the problem with trekfreak that has gotten everyone else up in arms is his accusation of plagiarism. That is quite a strong charge to make, one that I doubt George Lucas would agree with. Maybe he used it in jest, but that is not a word I would throw out there just for fun. Now if he does not like the film, cool. That’s his opinion. Or maybe he likes some parts and not others, I don’t know. But there is a big difference between saying they were influenced by Star Wars and that they plagiarized elements of Star Wars.

340. Bill Peters - January 26, 2010

TreakFreak how is it not a Original Idea? Sence when has Star Wars created a Parallel Universe? Also we don’t hold the Idea Star Trek can do no wrong, it is just the fact that Trek was here first! Also Star Trek 09 has many Original Ideas and Themes and yes it does pick some Ideas up from Outside Trek but Plagiarism no! Also Trek 09 has Revitalized Trek and has given us more to think about on what we want to see for the Next few Trek movies and Hopefully someday soon Trek will be back on TV!

341. SpockLikesCats - January 26, 2010

Mr. Orci,

As a fan since 1966, I’m not only envious of you, but I congratulate you and Alex for breathing a wonderful new life into our “mutual treasure,” Star Trek.

Please tell JJ, a little less intensity on the lens flares! I imagine all the actors and crew going home with migraines every night!

Nichelle Nichols for Enterprise Computer Voice !

No super-villain! Have a societal-political inter-species civilization problem to resolve. Look at our present-day dilemmas and extrapolate.

Continue Spock and Uhura’s relationship. Yes, make some reference to why Spock found her so attractive: “I had never met any Earthwoman except for my mother who had your mastery of my native language.”

Have Spock and Uhura’s relationship in the background: a look exchanged. Eating dinner or snuggling together and being called away for a Red Alert.

I like the idea of Kirk still “earning” his credibility with the crew, but only if the next movie starts right after the first one. Otherwise, skip on down to the Kirk/Bones/Spock triumvirate with Uhura as Spock’s sounding board and interrogator of Kirk. She could be someone Kirk looks to for a reality check.

And, PLEASE, if the senior staff are all away, have Uhura sit in the center seat. She could speak to the aliens in their own language!

I agree with those who say Scotty needs to have an Engineering Bay that doesn’t look like a brewery.

Don’t bother with 3-D. Just a ripping good yarn. And, speaking as an original fan, I love the Star Trek in-jokes. Please keep them coming.

Domo Arigato, “Mr. Roberto.”

342. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

well there are only so many stories you can do that are wholly original. You can do a new take on it but there are only certain stories that stay through time.

This movie is not a remake of Star Wars Episode IV: A New Hope, I can see elements from the movie that they drew upon but to me this film does have the spirit of the Original Series and I do find it loads of fun

TrekFreak I feel you are too harsh and I want to apologise if I sounded harsh earlier.

Bob I am really sorry and I am glad you do take to time to convese with the Trek fans.

I do love your film and you did prove me wrong, I just hope Star Trek XII turns out to be great.

343. TrekFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 333. P Technobabble – January 26, 2010

TreakFreak,

“How, exactly, would you define “original?” What, precisely, hasn’t been “done before,” in some way? Everyone is influenced by someone or something else, something that’s come before.”

—————————————-

Even though this particular argument is not ‘they should do original storytelling’, I will respectfully answer your question.

First, just so you know where I am coming from: I am someone who has an education in fine arts, design, sculpture, and art history. You are correct in saying that everyone is influenced by something else; however, there are hundreds upon thousands of art movements that spawned into original concepts. Expressionism, Impressionism, Modernism, Post Modernism, Renaissance Art, Egyptian Sculptures, etc… I have probably seen more ‘original’ works of art than the average individual, so I have a attendance to quickly see deep into the details of another person’s piece of work.

Second, you do have to learn from previous art styles, so you can create your own original piece of work. Unfortunately, the post-modern art movement we live in has yet to produce anything original. Art and storytelling are very similar with how each has progressed. Even though our technologies (tools) have evolved, the post-modern movement in art and storytelling has been stuck in recycled hell. An example of this is from the current onset of ‘rebooted’ movies and television shows. Since no one has a new ‘original’ idea, we are stuck in a creative loop of recycling and cannibalizing.

344. Red Skirt - January 26, 2010

TrekFreak, I guess I just don’t understand your point. Is Star Trek bad because it has similarities to other movies that came before it? If so, there are_no_good movies.

You keep comparing it to Star Wars, but for my money it is a direct rip off of Star Trek: Nemeses, and didn’t have to go very far back in the franchise to find a template for the current story either.

You of course are entitled to your opinion, but if it were a boat, I would not try to go sailing in it.

345. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

Trek Freak

I feel you were too harsh

I have gripes but I stil lenjoyed the movie.

346. Charley W - January 26, 2010

I don’t think ‘step-parents’ is really an accurate term. A step-parent is someone who marries one of your real parents. If Uncle had married Luke’s mom, then he’s be a ‘stepfather’. ‘God-parents’ or ‘foster parents’ is probably closer to the actual legal situation, no matter which the script uses.

This is not the place for my review of Trek ’09, but I really WANTED to like it. In the end, though, I don’t think it delivered as a Trek movie, and on its own was alright, but not great. It was a goulash without the stock, so to speak. Too many changes, but not enough. You have Spock and Uhura having a ‘relationship” (whatever you want to call it), which is a major change in both characters from the TOS; but Pike still ends up crippled. No Gary Mitchell (a major element in Kirk’s life, even if TOS forgot it later), but everyone keeps their catch lines.

Nowadays, when you’re dealing with Science Fiction (and related gendres, such as anime and comics), you can rationalize ANY changes as “it’s an alternate universe”. I remember reading one article that figured that almost a third or so of TOS took in alternate universes from each other because of various changes, mostly minor slips by the writers. One thing that I enjoyed about TOS and made me a Trek fan (as opposed to Star wars or ‘___’) was the implication of a whole organization for exploration and a universe to explore. I didn’t get that from Star Wars, which has nothing without the political conflict wiht the Empire, or Galatica (either version), with its own conflict. The only other televison series which gave me the same feel was Babylon 5. But the later series (except for the early episodes of Enterprise, and, oddly enough, DSP), lost that, and became Our Crew against the Rest of the Universe, especially Our Own Team, keeping only the name of Enterprise (which got dropped eventually), and finally Majel as the computer voice being the only unifing theme.

You want MY $8 for ST ’12 (probably $10 by then)? Stop relying upon the minor gimmicks, like Kirk’s torn shirt, and redshirt deaths, and McCoy’s “i’m a Dr, not a ___” lines, and get back to seeing the background which Rodenberry created. Quit blowing up EVERY other ship other than Enterprise!!! You REALLY do NOT need to kill EVERY other Starfleet officer that we meet or make them corrupt. Quit trying to figure out who the gay ensign is, and pay attention to how the military chain of command actually works, and why.

347. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

Seriously folks I do want to apologise

I felt I have given the wrong impression but I don’twant any hate.

348. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

I think steering away from a past enemy and Khan definitely would be a wise course of action.

To me everyone wants to see Khan and the Borg but Star Trek is much more than just fighting the Borg and Khan.

I think a new threat and something unique to the ideals of Trek is the best direction.

349. Lore - January 26, 2010

I just hope Scotty is still brewing beer down in engineering. JJ, go back to the Budweiser plant for more scenes.

350. TrekFreak - January 26, 2010

344. Red Skirt – January 26, 2010
Is Star Trek bad because it has similarities to other movies that came before it?

———————-

What is important is how affective you write the story, and if you can pull your audience into the environment. Mr. Orci’s “Star Trek” does pull you into the ‘here and now'; thus, you experience the moment with the characters. Not many movies do that now a days, so I consider that to be a plus for this movie. Since he was able to pull you into the moment, I personally believe that makes him a good storyteller.

What I would have loved to have seen is him to push his artistic license. Instead of drawing upon older species and plot devices that have already been done in “Star Trek” (Time Travel & World Destroyer), I would have appreciated the movie more if it gave us something brand new. Something that we have never-ever experienced before.

351. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

350 guess its tough after 700+ episodes and 10 previous movies

352. Charley W - January 26, 2010

Sorry, Folks, I’ve been having connection problems. Again, my corrections didn’t register and this time, the last several paragraphs were lost. But my point is basically made.

353. TrekFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 351. captain_neill – January 26, 2010
I agree with that perspective. I absolutely agree with your statement. I mentioned something similar when talking about why the franchise had stalled. It is a tough obstacle to overcome.

Look at “Stargate: SG-1″ as an example. Unlike how “Star Trek” fought to remain unique over its 40 years of history, almost every single element from “Stargate: SG1 & Atlantis” came from “Star Trek: TNG & TOS”.

If anything significant came from this movie, I would give the writers and art department credit for widening the gap between the two franchises.

“Stargate: SG-1 & Atlantis” take home the gold for heavily plagiarizing “Star Trek” on multiple levels.

354. Red Skirt - January 26, 2010

#343. “you do have to learn from previous art styles, so you can create your own original piece of work.”

And most likely steal from the former in the process. This is a tired argument. Most of the revered artists in various mediums notoriously plagiarized from each other in their own works, I have particular familiarity with it in Classical and Romantic music. The only difference between the 18th century and now is that we are so much more interconnected that even the common man on the street can recognize an idea “lifted” from another source.

Simply because an idea is recycled does not make it bad. How that idea is communicated and improved upon is paramount. Not everything has to be original to serve a purpose. If you want to comment on whether Star Trek failed to make good use of the ideas it “borrowed” from other sources, go right ahead. But to criticize the movie for simply borrowing them serves no purpose in my opinion, unless it is truly wholesale plagiarism.

355. TrekFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 354. Red Skirt – January 26, 2010
But to criticize the movie for simply borrowing them serves no purpose in my opinion, unless it is truly wholesale plagiarism.
———————

As you said yourself, that is a matter of an opinion. I just don’t share yours.

356. Red Skirt - January 26, 2010

#353, while I am not in a position to debate the similarities between SG-1 & Star Trek, I think that underscores my point about recycling ideas.

SG-1 is one of MGM’s biggest franchises, as important as James Bond. It has a huge fan base. For many of those fans, I would be curious as to whether they came to Stargate from Star Trek, or discovered it on their own. In which case, you have a perfect case for fans who were exposed to ideas they may have not seen on Star Trek. Or perhaps it is the very similarities that Star Trek fans embrace (of which there must be some).

Whatever the case, based on the success and value of the franchise, I would say if it is mostly recycled Trek material it was handled extremely effectively. And that’s just fine by me. I have seen some SG-1 episodes and_never_noticed any blatant similarities, not saying there aren’t any.

What I am not prepared to do is acknowledge that SG-1s fans are somehow less intelligent, or less discriminating, or whatever the point there is, simply because they don’t see the alleged similarities, or let them interfere with their enjoyment of it.

357. VZX - January 26, 2010

I don’t care that ST09 and Star Wars are similar, I liked them both. Hell, Star Wars ripped off Lord of theRings which ripped off Wizard of Oz.

But in the end, why does it matter? So people like TrekFreak can complain about it on the Internet? Whatever

I love Star Trek 09. It is my favorite Trek movie.

358. Bill Peters - January 26, 2010

Agree with VZX!

359. TrekFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 356. Red Skirt – January 26, 2010

Unfortunately, there is no topic on this site to examine such similarities. Since many-many of us know both franchise well, I am sure we could make such an examination. If we were to make a list of similarities, many people would spin on their head when noticing them. Woof.

I agree. Not here. Not now.

360. TrekFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 357. VZX – January 26, 2010
@ 358. Bill Peters – January 26, 2010

Hmmm… Sings of the collective are showing themselves. Did you two know that creativity is an act of a rebellious mind at work, and it can only achieved by working against the collective mindset of like minded individuals?

361. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

Trek Freak

The new Star Trek film was a lot of fun, I liked it but its not right to insult people for liking it as their favourite.

Its a fun movie and I hope it brings new people into the fold and enjoy the Trek we have loved for years.

362. TrekFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 361. captain_neill – January 26, 2010
“…its not right to insult people for liking it as their favorite.”

—————-

Who said that?

363. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

Its not my favourite but I try to respect IDIC

I prefer Shatner over Pine and it does get on my nerves if someone prefers Pine but I know I will always prefer Shatner.

The Trek I love is still there

364. P Technobabble - January 26, 2010

343. Treak

You make some very valid points, and I appreciated the way you presented those points.
If we follow the chronology of things, we could make the argument that most creative endeavors were far more “original” in their infancy. Wikipedia notes the world’s earliest film was produced in 1888. That would have to be considered pretty original, since there were no films before it (Edison not withstanding). As time has gone on, and more and more people began making films, telling stories, developing technologies, and so forth, we would certainly begin to see more similarities, people being influenced by what they had just seen, wanting to build upon that, and go beyond it. Regarding Star Trek, Mr. Roddenberry, himself, stated that he was influenced by “Forbidden Planet,” “Buck Rogers,” and other sci-fi serials. So, from that perspective, Star Trek, itself, was not a “wholly original” piece of work.
There have been movies that have seemed to be “original,” say, something like “The Sixth Sense,” but it was only “original” in the sense that the audience was manipulated in a slightly different way than usual, I think. I’m sure that Shyamalan could tell us what influenced him as he wrote that script… Hitchcock, perhaps?
I will agree with you, to a point, there does seem to be a Hollywood tendency to take few chances. From a business standpoint, it would seem that many studio executives believe “if it was a hit once, it can be a hit again.” Certainly, I disagree with that notion.
However, I do not believe Star Trek, itself, belongs in such a category. Star Trek is, in its own way, far more unique an entity. The heart and soul of Star Trek is something that has touched people in such a way that it has risen above the average tv show, and has become something of an icon. I believe there is far more reason to keep Star Trek alive than a mediocre show like “The A-Team,” which will hit theaters in the not too distant future. The likelihood that “The A-Team” will become a major blockbuster like “Star Trek” is, IMO, akin to the chances of hitting the lottery, being struck by lightning, and hit by an asteroid all at the same moment. Could, and should, Hollywood execs take more chances, instead of playing it safe? I think so, but then I don’t have millions of dollars at stake.
Star Trek has certainly suffered from the effects of stagnation over the past two decades, until now. You may not think Trek09 is very original, but the movie I saw was unlike any other Star Trek I’d seen before… so, in that sense, I think it was as “original” as it could be, being based upon the Star Trek I grew up with (TOS). This, I believe, is why the new film was considered to be “adapted.”
I don’t think anyone (and, if I may be so bold, including the writers) would consider Trek09 to be “wholly original,” inasmuch as it is based upon Star Trek created by Gene Roddenberry. I did not find it to be a rip-off, unless we have to acknowledge that Star Wars was also a rip-off, as are so many other films, including the recent blockbuster Avatar. I’m not saying these films ARE rip-offs, I’m just saying if it applies to one, then it has to apply to all. None of these films are created out of a vacuum, right? We can always find reason to say, “This looks like that; that looks like this…” I honestly don’t know if we will ever see anything truly “original” again, until we start seeing movies from another the galaxy.

365. Bill Peters - January 26, 2010

Hey Bob,

Find some how to put the Prime Directive and IDIC in the next Movie! Also Klingon’s or Gorn would be cool, Like to see more time for Scotty and Bones!

366. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

To me the new movie has the spirit of the original series

However I do think two decades is a bit long for stagnation.

Trek was at is peak in the mid 90s, Generations had a cover on Time Magazine and First Contact was one of the biggest of the Trek movies at the box office.

Yes in the last decade it was declining with over saturation but you know what I still loved it all. Guess I just don’t want people forgetting the stuff that came before.

I will always prefer the originals over these new actors, thats a given but I still enjoyed these new actors. However, I will always be a Shatner as Kirk and Nimoy’s Spock.

I cannot see these new actors eclipsing the legendary status of the original actors. But I do like how they played the characters, I do think Simon Pegg was too comedic but Karl Urban made me think of a young DeForest Kelley.

I cannot forget the Trek I love and always will have a preference for it but I can enjoy the new movie for what it is, a fun movie, one so fun that it will get newbies to check out the other 5 shows and movies.

Bob I do apologise if I seemed rude about not liking this as the best one but please believe me when I say that you movie works as a fun movie.

Hope you can understand my love for First Contact as well as The Wrath of Khan.

367. S. John Ross - January 26, 2010

#363: “Its not my favourite but I try to respect IDIC”

Though in fairness, the new film had more IDIC than usual, since it had product placement from Nokia _and_ Budweiser. We haven’t had that much IDIC since STIV, when Michelob and Apple were there (though we’ve had bits of IDIC from Levi’s and Dom Perignon, of course).

Truly, one of the great Trek ideals, IDIC is.

368. I, Mugsy - January 26, 2010

Dear Mr Orci,

Please take Star Trek out for a new and FRESH adventure for the sequal. Star Trek USED to be a means to tell an interesting tale, quite often with a ‘sugar coated’ social moral being disguised into the fabric of the story. It would be cool to somehow do that with this sequal – something that would really make Mr Roddenberry proud if he were still with us.

I think the problem with Star Trek lately is that… it’s been aping ITSELF? It’s very self conscious now because of all the back stories and – eeeek! – canon!

The new crew are successfully in place, ready for NEW stories. Lets not waste that golden opportunity.

When younger I was always hoping we really would see STRANGE NEW worlds and civilisations once budgets allowed that in the films. Instead we had ‘villain of the week’ films or yet another space battle or klingons YET AGAIN. This isn’t what Mr Roddenberry would have wanted……. They were fun, but I always felt a bit of a wasted opportunity. With the exception fo Star Trek IV which did dare to be different, and tell a social tale.

I remember the amazing science fiction artwork on book covers I loved from 60s/70s novels, and always hoped we’d see something like that for Star Trek. With today’s CGI we really could have some outlandish alien landscapes to make jaws drop. Instead everyone just seems to use CGI for ships and explosions and buildings and destruction and not much else. Is THIS the optimism of Trek? Lets really have something breathtaking to behold – another action film would be SUCH a let-down. Villains have been done to death now and are – quite frankly – boring. Must Trek be about revenge all the time now?…

You have marvellously and ingeniously bought Trek back from death’s door – something many thought wasn’t possible – so this next film really IS the biggy! Lets have this new crew explore some NEW worlds and really put Trek BACK at the top of the PROPER science-fiction film pantheon. Be bold and create something that’ll have people THINKing again – not just a popcorn flick. We have too many of those now.

Please dare to be different, and treat the audience with respect rather than an action film designed to keep the ‘5-second attention span’-ers focussed before they check their mobile phones yet again!

PLEASE put the TREK back into TREK ;)

Thanks for reading, Sir.

– I, Mugsy

369. dmduncan - January 26, 2010

@295

I welcome each opportunity given to re-present my argument in response to someone who mis-represents it.

“Many longtime fans dislike some of the changes in the film and are resisting them.”

Yes, I am a longtime fan. Therefore what? That is about as important to mention as that a cube has six sides. But you mentioned it, and keep on mentioning it, as if it has some argumentative merit.

I’m a longtime fan of the franchise, Red Skirt is a short time fan of the franchise, and she is already so attached to a Spock/Uhura romance that she criticizes opposing viewspoints on it. But for her to then criticize others for being unwilling to embrace change is doubly ironic given how fast her own mind has set around a plot element so new to Star Trek, and less than a year old in her own mind.

“The only arguments they can put forth is because that’s the way it was created by Gene Roddenberry”

Oh, I agree with the principle expressed here; repeating something merely because that’s how Gene Roddenberry did it is a lousy reason to keep doing it the same way. But that’s a straw man.

This is neither “only” nor EVEN an argument I am making.

The issue isn’t reverently aping Gene Roddenberry, just doing it “because that’s the way it was created by Gene Roddenberry” — but intelligently preserving the unique perspective that Star Trek presented for contemplation.

You write: “The only thing I see preventing fans from embracing some of these ideas is a long standing grip on the way it has always been done, resisting change because their mind is full of these old perceptions”

Well that may be “the only thing you see,” but what you “only” see is not necessarily all that is there.

As I posted elsewhere:

Star Trek held a balance between the internal ontology of the Star Trek universe and the ontology of Star-Trek-as-art in OUR universe, which the functional relationships between the major characters addresses: Spock = cold logic, McCoy = uncritical compassion, Kirk = the balance between.

TOS maintained that balance under its creator’s guidance.
I agree with Star Trek’s creator on that issue.
I’m not opposed to Bob and Alex changing things.
That is not one of the things I want to see changed.

The reason for keeping those functional relationships between the major characters the same is an ARTISTIC reason (not from a disagreement about the imagined ontology of the Star Trek universe purporting to deal with questions like “Can Vulcans feel?” or “Can Spock have a relationship with Uhura?”), and that reason is this:

To DRAMATIZE an idea regarding how emotion and logic function in relationship to each other, both when separate and together, which Kirk, Spock, and McCoy represent.

And that, my dear friends, is a unique contribution Star Trek has made to culture, and the fact that I’ve had to state it over and again multiple times for the benefit of those who still don’t get it shows how needed expressing that same idea still is.

Old? How can those who don’t get it while looking right at it dare complain that it’s old and pick the irrelevant quality of age as the reason NOT to keep doing it? It’s new to them because it’s obviously the first time they’ve been introduced to it if it takes this much work on my part to try and get them to see it.

So the issue is soooo very far from merely doing things the way they’ve always been done, or because it’s “old perceptions.” The issue is about whether these ideas Star Trek uniquely conveyed are still important! The issue isn’t what Gene Roddenberry did. The issue isn’t the age of some neurons, or the age of an idea. The issue is the relevance of the ideas themselves. And that Gene Roddenberry made it that way is IRrelevant!

Good ideas do not grow “old.” That’s why Plato and Aristotle and Marcus Aurelius and Plotinus and Spinoza and Liebniz are still in print. But if folks want to do something concrete to make the accusation that they’ve dumbed down Star Trek stick — well they can start by ignoring those central ideas that Star Trek conveyed, and which nobody else does in popular culture. And I mean “dumb down” literally not emotively, in this case, as in “to make less intelligent.”

Whatever the patriarchs of our beloved franchise do, I hope at least they will consider the rationality of these ideas and weigh them against what they will gain or lose by disposing of them.

370. Bucky - January 26, 2010

Yeah, well, as for the Trek/Star Wars comparison: Spock Prime is to Obi-Wan Kenobi is to Gandalf the Grey is to Morpheus is to Dumbledore is to Optimus Prime and Kirk is to Luke Skywalker is to Frodo Baggins is to Neo is to Harry Potter is to James Whitwhicky. You see these themes repeated again and again in heroes journey stories.

371. dmduncan - January 26, 2010

295: “In the Fall of 1966, the first, least developed episodes of Star Trek began to air, and in my opinion are some of the best, without any knowledge of the character’s future relationships, in fact the series was cancelled only after these relationships were fully developed.”

Post hoc ergo propter hoc? Because the one had nothing to do with the other. It almost seems as if you are trying to say that the series was cancelled BECAUSE of the very thing I am defending in it!

Star Trek struggled from the very beginning! It was a fight to keep it on the air for both the first and second seasons. Gene Roddenberry himself orchestrated massive campaigns, unbeknownst to NBC, to keep it on the air for both first and second seasons. He didn’t do the same for the third season because he knew it was the final season. So he basically abandoned the show in the third season and left it to others to handle while he moved to a different part of the Paramount lot and continued collecting a paycheck!

372. dmduncan - January 26, 2010

295: “This offers proof that Star Trek can evolve effectively without relying on stale predictable relationships which may not adequately reflect the ideologies of today’s audiences.”

As opposed to what? Fresh unpredictable relationships — like we see eight times a year in every chick flik in which I have to sit, painfully cognizant of where all the emergency exits are? (Okay, I enjoyed The Proposal, but that was an exception).

Because that’s what “stale predictable relationships” means to me. I know what’s going to happen in every one of those movies before it does. And I damned sure don’t want the same thing in Star Trek.

So if you really mean what you say, then you may just have to accept that a romance in Star Trek between Spock and Uhura does NOT turn out the way you want it to, which would be the same stale and predictable way romances turn out in just about every chick flik. Including AVATAR.

Nah, never seen The Boy get The Girl and live happily ever after before. No staleness and predictability there, nope.

And never seen The Boy get and then lose The Girl before.

Hmmm. This poses a dilemma. Seems like stale bread is the only bread on the menu. Which means the “stale and predictable” argument is toast.

373. JDM - January 26, 2010

Given their influences, I wouldn’t be surprised if they tried to turn this into a stand-alone trilogy. I doubt Paramount will be able to invest in more than two more films with this “crew” of filmmakers anyhow, even if they want to, especially given the number of other things that Abrams and co. have their hands in.

To that end, it’s likely that whatever the story is, it needs to follow up on an element of the first film, and assuming you go in a new direction (instead of remaking or remolding a prior Trek story), there are a lot of options. For example, I think there should be a Vulcan villain, not like Star Trek V, but someone with a better motivation. It’s canon that Vulcans have never been entirely approving of humans, even though their very nature requires tolerance and allows for interaction and teamwork. I don’t think the destruction of Vulcan can sensibly be left as an isolated incident and I also think that trying to force the Kirk-Spock relationship to be in the new time line what it was in the old would be very difficult. You can interpret it a number of ways, but if not for the mission’s success and the words of Spock Prime, I do not think that the new Spock would have volunteered to be Kirk’s first officer, especially since the new Kirk hasn’t come up through the ranks the way Spock has. If no lingering resentment or trepidation is there, then they’ve missed an opportunity as well as overlooked something pretty obvious.

As for TNG, I love the series and like the first two TNG films, but I agree that they did not translate well to cinema. I think Roddenberry used TNG to be more overtly topical and philosophical than he could have been with Kirk and crew, which suits television better than film because you have the time to explore those topics more satisfyingly. I don’t think anyone will ever bring back the TNG crew or recast the characters. I think that series succeeded well enough in its first run that it really doesn’t have anything to prove and will be harder to forget than the original series, which only ran for three seasons and was never brought to cinema the way it was really remembered.

374. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 364. P Technobabble – January 26, 2010

Someone who gets it! Yes!

Thank God. Someone who can handle an adult conversation without considering my approach as an attack. You sir do live in the real world. Even though we may or may not agree on certain points, you get where my approach to these conversations comes from.

——————–

@ 369. dmduncan – January 26, 2010

Another person who is growing into an adult. Thank God! “Star Trek: TOS’s” secret is the function of ‘the triad’ (Spock, Kirk, & Bones).

I have absolutely no problem with change, for as long as the changed material keeps true to the logic that has been laid out before hand. “Star Trek: TNG” would not have existed without embracing change.

When Orci and Abrams broke ‘the triad’ apart, I personally believe it fractured some of the importance of what made ‘the original series’ function.

Spock = Brought the unwavering logic to ‘the triad’, which was based upon emotionless/scientific observation and actions. (Scientist)

Kirk = Brought the adventurous out-side-of-the-box thinking to the ‘triad, and then made command choices based upon the conflicting perspectives between Spock and Bones. (Military)

Bones = Brought a humanistic perspective to ‘the triad’, which was based upon injecting an emotional opposition to Spock’s logic. He also brought comical commentary when Kirk chose some outlandish path to tread down. (Doctor.Psychologist).

Once Orci and Abrams broke ‘the triad’ apart, they took away the soul of what these characters were about. Now we are stuck with an emotional Spock who sleeps with Uhura. What the hell is up with that?

375. dmduncan - January 26, 2010

Bob is right about Campbell. Those myths resonate with us for deep reasons, and from the standpoint of box office it would probably help Star Trek to follow the mythic patterns because people do gravitate towards those stories no matter how many times they are told, when they are told in new and interesting ways.

Star Wars, Avatar, Lord of the Rings, Indiana Jones, ET, Titanic, Gone With the Wind.

And following those patterns does not preclude the possibility of doing classic type Trek stories because even those stories follow those patterns.

And stop giving Star Wars credit for everything and saying ST.09 follows Star Wars. Is that the first time a farmboy longed to get away from his little acre of cowpoo and experience adventure in the city; is Luke the first boy who ever longed for and felt destined for more? Did Star Wars invent the dogfight or sword battle? Why does Darth Vader look like Dr. Doom? And which came first? The floating cloud city of Bespin? Or the floating cloud city of Stratos

376. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 375. dmduncan – January 26, 2010

“And stop giving Star Wars credit for everything and saying ST.09 follows Star Wars. Is that the first time a farmboy longed to get away from his little acre of cowpoo and experience adventure in the city; is Luke the first boy who ever longed for and felt destined for more? Did Star Wars invent the dogfight or sword battle? Why does Darth Vader look like Dr. Doom? And which came first? The floating cloud city of Bespin? Or the floating cloud city of Stratos”

——

Maybe I spoke too soon. More collective thinking here.

377. dmduncan - January 26, 2010

Really, giving George Lucas credit for all that is like giving Tropicana credit for inventing the orange.

378. dmduncan - January 26, 2010

@376: It’s true. One day when I have the time I may just match every TOS episode against its mythic counterpart.

379. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

@ 375. dmduncan – January 26, 2010
@ Everyone Else

My issues with collective thinking is that there is a lack of creativity, and there is a quick jump to destroy someone with an alternate opinion. Too many people within this community think the same. When someone with a unique perspective comes in to play, some of you quickly jump to tell them, “Shut Up! – or – “Stop Thinking That Way!” – or – “Don’t say such crazy things”. – or – “Because you reject the new movie, you must hate Star Trek as a whole.”

I try to keep my individuality intact, so I can preserve my unique perspective on the world. I welcome alternative perspectives, for as long as the other person (within the conversation) also respects an alternative perspective. If we all shared the same philosophy, religion, hair color, soda, or type of car, the world would be a very-very hellish place.

I personally don’t like Orci’s script. Not because it had cause change, but the type of change it had caused. We naturally change if we seek to do so, but NOT ALL change is considered to be good. Its a mater of personal preference, and what type of change I would personally like to see happen.

From my personal perspective, the new “Star Trek” is the old “Star Wars”. No one on this site will change my perspective, and I also don’t seek to change anyone’s perspective by crying foul. I hear and understand everyone’s argument; however, I just don’t agree with your counter assessment.

It is normal to be different. It is normal to have a unique perspective. Even though your perspectives do not match my own, I will not tell anyone to “stop thinking in such a manner”. I embrace chaotic thinking and alternative perspective based upon personal preferences.

Many of you guys and gals need to realize that the world outside is filled with people who don’t think the same, and we live in a world where alternative perspectives breeds freedom, creativity, and individualism.

I am allowed to remain here because the owner, on some level, understand the concept of ‘individuality’.

I respect Mr. Orci as a human being, and I am glad he did attempt to change “Star Trek”. If I may also be bold, I also think he understands my criticism. Why? He is a fellow artist. Even though we have different tools and platforms to express our ideas, criticism both harsh and constructive feeds the fire of creativity.

When you have 1,000 ‘yes men’ in the room, you continue to make the same errors over and over again.

Everyone should find their voice offline before coming online, or you will be consumed by the onslaught of an unbending online collective.

380. TreakFreak - January 26, 2010

I apologize for repeating my observations about the dysfunctions of belonging to a collective, but I hope some of what I said got through to some people. Embrace your unique sense of individuality, and also respect that other people are also built with a unique sense of individuality. Don’t slam someone for being unique.

381. Anthony Pascale - January 26, 2010

TrekFreak

you are really starting to get on my nerves calling people a ‘collective’. will you please stop making wild wide sweeping accusations of the community here as if they are all part of a cult. This site has seen a myriad of viewpoints since day one and didn’t need you to come here to ‘shake it up’…we have done just fine so far. Dive into any thread for the last three years and people will debate anything and i mean anything, even cakes

so please, get off your ‘i am here to save you’ high horse

All i ask is people be polite to eachother and especially not throw blanket statements and labeling people, especially ‘everyone here’

382. dmduncan - January 26, 2010

TreakFreak

Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.

383. Zebonka - January 26, 2010

@ 37
You’re right, but you’re wrong. Khan -could- well have been just any old movie villain, but Montalban made him watchable – nay, not just watchable, but absofreakinlutely memorable.

If Khan had been played by anyone else I’d heartily agree with you, but Montalban’s work on that movie is just brilliant!

Though you’re right about the rest of it. The real worth of Star Trek 2 is the humanity of it, and that applies to the best moments of the movies to follow.

384. devon - January 26, 2010

I am a fan of Insurrection too! I think the Planetbound scenes are visually stunning… I think the cinematography is breathtaking… the mountains, water, Ba’ku village. I think Insurrection gets a bad reputation moreso for following the highly popular First Contact and people expected another high energy, shoot em up style movie vs. a more thoughtful but slower ride.
As for the next film: Further develop the triumvirate Kirk/Spock/McCoy dynamic as it works and is enjoyable!
Develop each of the 7 main characters, everyone should be highlighted as each brings something special to Trek!
Let Uhura speak other languages: Swahili, Romulan, Klingon, or any alien language as applicable to storytelling.
Let Uhura sing in a scene, and have Spock play his Vulcan lyre, or show Sulu fencing or in the Botany lab with Janice Rand, or have Chapel assist McCoy in Sickbay or in the MedLab, or Scotty,Keenser, and Kevin Riley in Engineering in brief scenes before an alarm sounds to battlestations!
Let Uhura take the center seat for once!
Show Lt.Arex and M’Ress @ various bridge stations to acknowledge their presence and contribution to Trek lore, easily accomplished with CGI and today’s makeup!
More McCoy, Karl Urban is the best ever!
Further develop Spock/Uhura relationship!
I think the Gorn would be a neat underused adversary rather than the overexposed Klingons and Romulans.
More alien presences in background shipboard scenes, and more female involvement! Uhura in center seat with M’Ress @ communications and Janice Rand @ transporter or helm and Chapel running Sickbay while the men are off ship during crisis!

385. Daoud - January 26, 2010

We also need to see Kirk on a horse! We know from Generations that he rides. Imagine the fun of Kirk, Spock and McCoy making their FIRST camping trip in the old west, with horses.

Mmmmm, marshmelons! A cross between Pike and Vina’s picnic and the Triad’s scenes in Star Trek V. That secret ingredient appearing in the Trekquel would be marvelous.

386. DS9 IN PRIME TIME - January 26, 2010

@299. TreakFreak – January 26, 2010

You are talking in circles. Its the chicken and the egg. Sure Star Wars talked about a farmboy and put it on the big screen, but WITHOUT Star Trek you dont have Lucas thinking up Star Wars.

387. DS9 IN PRIME TIME - January 26, 2010

@299

Not only that, in ST IV they could have had Kirk say he was city dweller and ran his grandfathers porn shop, and JJ and Orci would have develpoed that in ST XI. They are focused on the early years of Kirk and Spock. They had to develope what was already said in “the future” in ST IV.

388. captain_neill - January 26, 2010

Trek Freak

I agree with a lot of your points just I learned its not a good idea to argue because you get get remarks towards you if you don’tshare the same opinion

I love this new movie but I don’t love the best like most other people do but I have to accept the fact that there will people who consider this a better Trek.

I for one prefer the stuff that came before, I prefer William SHatner as Kirk but I guess it better to accept not all people will agree with that.

It does frustrate if someone prefers Pine overShatner because Shatner made the role but I can’t go about want to punch people because their opinion is different from me.

However, just because I won’t punch them doesn’t I likethe thought of people prefering the new actors over the originals.

In fact to me they aren’t even the same characters,

389. Christopher Mulrooney - January 27, 2010

Bob, I do agree with others on here the New StarTrek Movie should be in 3D.

Just saying that would be great!!

390. captain_neill - January 27, 2010

3D is not a must but itf it is decided then please make it subtle

I don’t want the next one to feel gimmicky due to 3D shots, do it like Avatar

391. Colorado_Gamer - January 27, 2010

To Bob Orci,

Some items I would like to see…

I think it would be nice to have scene where Jennifer Morrison (Winona Kirk) and Ben Cross (Sarek) talk to each other about their respective losses and how they are proud of Jim and Spock.

Meeting McCoy’s ex-wife could be fun, giving Karl Urban more stuff to work with.

More of the old races in crew positions, Andorians, Tellerites, etc…

Klingons done with a tip of the hat to John M. Ford as in the novel the “The Final Reflection” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Final_Reflection

As far as a “bad guy” goes; some of the best “bad guys” at the start of a story end up helping out the “good guys” against a common problem and are redeemed at the end of the story.

392. P Technobabble - January 27, 2010

388. neill

I really have to take issue with your comment: “..I learned its not a good idea to argue because you get get remarks towards you if you don’t share the same opinion…”

I have never seen Anthony stop anyone from stating their opinion. What he has always commented on is the WAY some people state their opinion, or outright mean-ness. That is completely different than criticizing someone for having a different opinion. As he stated in post 381: “…This site has seen a myriad of viewpoints since day one…” And this is absolutely true, cos I’ve been here since day one, and I’ve seen every pro/ con argument, and guys like Bob Orci slammed with some of the most ignorant comments imaginable.
Anthony’s request: “…All i ask is people be polite to each other…” seems simple enough, but some people (and I am not pointing a finger at any specific person AT ALL) just don’t know how to play nice.
This site is ALL about Star Trek for Star Trek FANS. Yes, we are all pretty passionate, and, yes, sometimes we veer off course. I think Anthony and his team does a fantastic job maintaining this site, and keeping it current and fresh and interesting on a daily basis. That isn’t easy to do!!! Look at the “official” Startrek.com. The “news” is from 2007! (sorry, had to get that in). Trekmovie.com is THE place to be, and we should all be eternally grateful to have a home like this. Anthony is the Captain. Let’s follow his “orders,” and play by the rules. That’s the “human thing to do.”

393. captain_neill - January 27, 2010

392

I did not mean it to come out like the way it did, but it is a vibe I got on IMDB message boards.

394. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

Boborci: “Read HERO WITH A THOUSAND FACES for origins of all.”

Bob who is the author? I googled that title but so far I havent found it.

395. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

Also Bob, this might be something of interest to JJ and the rest of the SC.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Digital_Cinema_Camera_Company

396. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

391: “Meeting McCoy’s ex-wife could be fun, giving Karl Urban more stuff to work with.”

Perhaps a brief glimpse of the woman who drove McCoy offworld? That could be funny.

Maybe sort of like the little flashback we get in Transformers about Sam Witwicky’s highschool football career.

@394: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Hero_with_a_Thousand_Faces

397. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

ah ok, thanks. I used to watch a program on public TV where Joseph gave about an hour or so lecture about a lot of different things. I found it interesting.

398. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

When people complain about how much Star Trek “ripped off” Star Wars (I prefer “borrowed,” myself), it tells me there’s still a few people out there who don’t know how much Star Wars “ripped off” many other sources, including Fritz Lang’s Metropolis for C3P0.

Bless their innocent hearts.

399. TreakFreak - January 27, 2010

381. Anthony Pascale – January 26, 2010

“TrekFreak, you are really starting to get on my nerves calling people a ‘collective’. will you please stop making wild wide sweeping accusations of the community here as if they are all part of a cult.”

———————

Hmmm… You don’t know your own community than.

400. P Technobabble - January 27, 2010

Treak

There are all sorts of ways people agree on things, and disagree on things. What people like or dislike is a purely subjective matter. To put people into various categories implies judgement, and in order to judge something, one must presume one is separate from what one is judging. Quantum physics, in general, is on the verge of showing us how nothing is separate from anything. This universe, this existence is all one “happening.” The “collective” you refer to not only reflects your view of others, but it also says something about you separating yourself from others… when, in reality, there is only THIS…. whatever the hell THIS is.
“I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together…” I think that says it perfectly!

401. Boborci - January 27, 2010

398

and as a matter of trivial fact, we referenced Donner’s Superman for Kirk’s side of childhood (which us only half our story), not Star Wars.

402. boborci - January 27, 2010

Joseph Campbell wrote Hero with a Thousand Faces.

403. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

@400: Oh! Hadn’t noticed that. But yeah! Luke and Clark both lose their dads (Luke to the Dark Side) and both Luke and Clark look beyond their little patch of farm to more than just an ordinary life.

And that resonates with me too. Luke looking at the twin suns of Tatooine was the single most powerful moment of Star Wars for me. I know that feeling. I also grew up without a dad, and I used to look towards the Manhattan skyline from the divider in the middle of a street in Queens and have that same feeling.

These themes wouldn’t resonate with so many people if there weren’t so much to identify with in them.

404. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

Bob thanks, yeah I found it. You might want to take a look at that wikip site a few posts up. Could be something to work with.

405. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

I’d bet “real money” Bob is already familiar with Joseph Campbell.

406. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

404 Im sure he is, I mean the one I posted #395

407. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

Those are cool cameras. I wonder if that’s what Mann used for “Public Enemies.”

408. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

406, not sure, the site says he filmed it in HD format instead of the standard 35 mm film.

409. P Technobabble - January 27, 2010

400. Bob

I’ll bet most of us wish we could be a fly on the wall while you guys are hashing out the sequel. You mentioned previously that you were looking at some other sci-fi, including Arthur C. Clarke (one of my favorites!) for inspiration.
I was wondering if there are any particular science writers — like the very popular Michio Kaku — you might also be reading these days?
Sometimes the quantum stuff gives me a headache, but it sure is fascinating!

410. Damian - January 27, 2010

Maybe I’m too big picture, but some of the things some fans get hung up on boggles my mind. Earlier it was Spock/Uhura (sorry, S/U). Now Star Trek supposedly plagiarized Star Wars and apparently anyone who cannot see that has been brainwashed. Yes the S/U thing was a shock. Yes I see similarities with Star Wars (not to mention a half dozen other films, shows). I love all Star Trek but I just cannot get all hung up on some of these issues. I care about canon and maintaining consistency, but I don’t think I nitpick too much (my complaints about some of the sets notwithstanding). I’d like to think I have a discerning eye for a good film. After all, I love Alfred Hitchcock and Stanley Kubrick movies.

You know, I remember hearing some of the same complaints about respecting canon when Star Trek: Enterprise came out. I thought they did a good job with canon. Did they mess up here and there, sure, but it still is just science fiction. (and I loved the episode “Regeneration”, so there, now it’s out;)

411. Damian - January 27, 2010

I know some want to see the Klingons as villains in the next movie. For some reason I have a hard time seeing them as bad guys. After all by the Next Generation they are out allies and the other series fleshed them out quite a bit.

One request I have is if they do become villains, it would be nice to see some of those traits maintained, such as their honor code. I’d have a hard time seeing Klingons take hostages or kill civilians for a laugh, for instance. They are more than just token bad guys. Also, I’m not sure if they will be with or without forehead ridges in your films. The only thing I’d ask as a Trekkie, is that the explanation for why some don’t is not changed from what was done in Enterprise (like they had operations to alter their appearance, instead of it being a genetic experiment mishap as noted in Enterprise).

412. Daoud - January 27, 2010

@Boborci. Bob, Donner’s Superman was an interesting model to think about. Did you originally contemplate young Kirk trying to outrace a speeding train while being chased? :)

This is good news in that if you continue towards Superman II as an analog, you must bring in some recorded echo of George Kirk to guide young Jim Kirk. Oh… wait…. you did, tu diablo…. that’s Pike!

Greenwood as Brando as Jor-El. Good one.

And as Clark gives up hero-dom for a life with Lois until seeing he’s needed as a hero, will we have a parallel of Kirk giving up captain-dom for a life with Carol until he sees he’s needed as a captain?

413. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

It’s such an odd thread. Arguing the degree of originality in ST09 is like arguing the nutritional content of a Snicker’s bar. It’s candy … if you want nutrition (or even the slightest shred of originality) you don’t turn to a summer blockbuster for it (it’s not specific to ST09; this comment would apply to any other bit of brain-dead, balls-dead summer fluff as well).

That said, Bob, the Superman thing is bit of a stretch even for you … that part of Superman was about youn Supes knowing his dad and then _personally facing his loss as a young adult._ RM Kirk and Luke Skywalker share in common that their dad’s death is off-screen when they were too young to know him personally (on a more subjective level, RM Kirk and Skywalker are both whiny little douchebags who need a hard punch in the mouth, while Donner’s Superman was humble, caring, and likeably goofy).

414. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

(and by “off-screen” I obviously mean in character perspective, since in ST09 the audience did get the treat of seeing the movie’s one and only good guy, George Kirk, check out in the film’s one great scene).

415. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

(and Kent, moreso, got to know and lose BOTH father figures … another vast difference)

416. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

With the mention of Superman, and Superman having the Fortress of Solitude and an interactive hologram of Jor el, Bob has no doubt already considered that angle for a possible Shatner appearance. In fact, it wouldn’t surprise me to learn that was their inspiration for the Shatner scene as well.

And I’m sorry, but the Shatner scene is just too good to let go of. And it would be good either to see IT or something very much like it in the next movie.

I feel for Bob and Alex. Coming in here and reading us and then trying to balance so many different concerns must be like trying to balance several dozen spinning plates at the same time.

417. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

Pine Kirk appears to me to be fairly like what I’d expect a young, immature Shatner Kirk to be, particularly since we see a thoroughly enjoyable rogue Shatner Kirk in TSFS.

But Pine Kirk is not Clark Kent or Luke Skywalker. They walk a similar path, follow a similar pattern, but if nothing were different they’d be the same and then Bob could be attacked for “ripping off” Superman with some legitimacy rather than exaggeration.

I can identify with Kirk more than Kent, despite the fact that I can run faster than a speeding locomotive (Lionel) and bend steel (the thinner the better) with my bare hands, because my childhood resembles Kirk’s more than Kent’s.

418. boborci - January 27, 2010

412. S. John Ross – January 27, 2010

A stretch? LOL!

I am merely recounting the historical fact that when we pitched our initial story to the studio, we referenced Superman as a model for taking the time to see our heroes grow up and experience loss before they become the heroes we know them to be.

419. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

#417: “I am merely recounting the historical fact that when we pitched our initial story [...]”

I don’t doubt for a minute that we’re not the first group you tried it on ;)

420. boborci - January 27, 2010

418. S. John Ross – January 27, 2010

You flatter yourself if you think I would spend any energy lying to you.

421. boborci - January 27, 2010

Q: What were your specific concerns?

Abrams: “It only would work if you believed the characters, and that requires actors who could deflect the burden of playing iconic roles, not impersonate the original actors. The model that we had was Richard Donner’s Superman.”

from this interview

http://www.fandango.com/commentator_interview:j.j.abramsbeamsaboardstartrek_233

422. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

#419:

Man what? I think you’re letting this thread (one where I _haven’t_ been part of the dog-pile for once) get you a little oversensitive.

(A) I very clearly indicated that I believed you when you said it was part of the pitch. In case it wasn’t clear then, again: I believe you when you say it was part of the pitch.

(B) Why make it personal? Your post about the Donner thing wasn’t directed at me, so it’s nonsensical to make it about me, retroactively. All these people accusing you of ripping stuff off, and I’m accusing you of NOT ripping stuff off (rather, just engaging in the making of genre fare) … take a breath. Gather perspective.

(C) This is a written medium, and as such I’d never accuse of you of spending energy on it ;)

423. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

@421: lol. St. John, you remind me of one of those dirty wrestlers who pulls something out of his spandex and then gouges the eyes of his opponent when the referee is distracted, and then throws his hands in the air and pleads innocence when the ref accuses him of illegal tactics.

424. Damian - January 27, 2010

The actors and overall story were, IMHO, this movies greatest strength. I had no problems accepting the actors in these iconic roles.

Story, no problem. Lots of influences, but nothing is 100% original anymore. There are worse things to be influenced by than Star Wars, Superman: The Movie or 2001: A Space Odyssey. And those who don’t like it still owe Orci and Kurtzman a thank you for keeping the prime universe intact. They could have made it simple and just had Nero come back in a linear timeline and made everything else irrelevant in their story. If you don’t like it, the other shows and movies still apply as a result. They were respectful enough to leave alone what has been done the last 40+ years.

425. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

#422:

If I were pretending to be Mr. Nice Guy, sure … I’m on public record many times over as having lukewarm amounts of respect for Orci & company’s work (but also as having a lot of genuine respect for Orci, personally, for choosing to put up with us here). I’m not pretending to be Bob’s buddy or anything, but look above … I’ve been barely commenting here because I really do genuinely think it’s a nonsense thing to take a genre movie to task on, at least at the serious level some folks have done here, as if having Star Wars elements is some kind of creative crime in the post-Star Wars era (and the same would go for post-Donner Superman, and any number of other films).

As I said before, nutritional content of a candy bar. There are lots of things about ST09 I’m happy to join in complaining about when the time comes, but this time, I’m really not part of the Mister Meany Brigade, and I think Bob is just reacting on automatic and assuming I am.

426. captain_neill - January 27, 2010

Bob

Never really thought of the Dick Donner nod but its a nod a like, Superman is a great film.

Bob I am grateful that you did this film in a way that allowed the rest of Trek to stay intact and that this could be enjoyed as something new.

I actually want to watch the new movie again.

Bob when I saw the film for the first time I was so glad that the film was good fun. I have always enjoyed it.

Just at times I do miss the prime universe, but at least it is always there.

Bob I hope you can accept my apologies about earlier posts.

427. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

424: “…this time, I’m really not part of the Mister Meany Brigade, and I think Bob is just reacting on automatic and assuming I am.”

The ambiguity of comment # 418 makes Bob’s interpretation possible. That’s how I read it too.

428. P Technobabble - January 27, 2010

I don’t understand why Star Trek is not being taken for what it is, as it is. There is so much being read into things, some people are making all sorts of presumptions, spouting innuendos, and the guy who actually wrote the thing is being badgered, and goaded into having to explain his every thought. This isn’t a damned trial, for crissakes!

429. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

424 well Im not so sure about that. You say your not down grading ST 09 at all, you just dont “like” some things about it. yet you post a veiled slam like this…..

” It’s such an odd thread. Arguing the degree of originality in ST09 is like arguing the nutritional content of a Snicker’s bar. It’s candy … if you want nutrition (or even the slightest shred of originality) you don’t turn to a summer blockbuster for it (it’s not specific to ST09; this comment would apply to any other bit of brain-dead, balls-dead summer fluff as well).”

note the comparison of ST 09 to brain-dead, balls-dead summer fluff.

430. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

#426: That’s fair, entirely. But I’ve since clarified it. Here’s some more:

(A) I think it’s absolutely unfair and silly for anyone to suggest that ST09 is a “ripoff/knockoff” of any single film [the possible exception is Red Skirt's suggestion that it's a knockoff of Nemesis ... I haven't seen Nemesis so I cannot agree or disagree with that one].
(B) I think there are plenty of elements visible from other films … multiple other films, making the “knockoff” comments irrelevant. Personally, I’m more disappointed in the film’s dependence on prior Star Trek films than I am with the occasional riff on other genre stuff.
(C) I do happen to think RM Kirk shares more crucial elements in common with Luke Skywalker than with Donner’s young Superman, especially re the father-figure stuff and the personality … but I have no trouble at _all_ believing Orci when he says that the way they got there had Donner’s Superman, rather than Star Wars, at the roots. I believe him, flat-out.
(D) Just because I’m not part of this dog-pile doesn’t constitute a claim that I’m not eager to be part of the next one.

Hopefully that clarifies my position.

431. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

#428: “You say your not down grading ST 09 at all”

No, I said no such thing. I

432. captain_neill - January 27, 2010

Yes I have gripes but I try to make logical reasons for why it didn’t work for me.

I am always going to prefer the originals because I grew up watching them on video and on re runs on BBC2 in the 90s

I have watched Star Trek for so long there is a way I like my Trek so yes the changes were always going to annoy me but I do admit the film was fun.

433. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

#431: “Yes I have gripes but I try to make logical reasons for why it didn’t work for me.”

Which makes you, IMO, one of the more valuable posters here, and I always enjoy reading what you have to say.

I suspect Red Skirt is cuter, tho’.

434. P Technobabble - January 27, 2010

I saw Nemesis once, couldn’t tell you anything about it. Saw Trek09 twice and I have scenes, sequences and lines of dialogue burned in my mind. For me, that says it all.

435. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

#433: “Saw Trek09 twice and I have scenes, sequences and lines of dialogue burned in my mind.”

Same here.

“For me, that says it all.”

100% agree :)

436. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

IMO ST 09 had all of the elements that TOS had. TOS could range from hard core life and death drama, personal loss (city on the edge of forever), to the almost damn silly (Mudds Planet). It could have great action (for that time period) and then produce the goofy Kirk vs Gorn fight sequence. Sometimes the interpersonal relationships seemed real to watch, sometimes they looked a little shallow, if not forced. Sometimes the plot was “intelectual” sometimes rather “banal”. Either way it was still Star Trek and we fans love it. The success of Star Trek is that Bob and the SC brought all of the elements of TOS in a new time frame. I think it worked great. And remember that one persons idea of a “deep” story line is another persons answer to insomnia.

437. Damian - January 27, 2010

429–You know, I was going to note how different Nemesis and Star Trek are. I don’ t agree with Red Skirts assessment that Star Trek was a rip off of Nemesis. For one, while Bob Orci, as a professed Trekkie, may have seen it (I actually am not positive of that, he would have to say), I don’t think Abrams and some of the other key players did. However, there were some similarities in themes that I can see after careful thought. I don’t believe similarities were intentional, but don’t forget, that movie involved Romulans too, so there were going to be a few similiarities.

Nero was obsessed with destroying anything he believed responsible for not saving Romulus. Schinzon was obsessed with the idea that he was the mirror of Picard. I think the idea was that as long as Picard lived, Schinzon would always be a reflection. And he totally renounced his human heritage and wanted to destroy Earth. The underlying theme for Picard is what would he have become if he grew up under Schinzon’s circumstances. One key difference is Schinzon lured the Enterprise to Romulus with a promise of peace. Nero emerged and attacked, he gave no pretense that he was at all interested in peace. A similarity–they were both ready to commit genocide (Nero largely succeeded with Vulcan, both wanted to with Earth).

I always liked Picard’s line about the Scimitar, “She’s a predator” which could easily be applied to the Narada as well. Both films did a good job of introducing the enemy’s ship, gradually with some menace.

I loved both movies, and I get confused when some Trekkies say they hated Nemesis. But the overall feel was much different for both movies. They both had cool battle scenes, but the pacing of Nemesis was much different. And if nothing else, Nemesis had a few less lens flares.

438. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

Cool. Star Trek (2009) makes it into the new Apple iPad video:

http://www.apple.com/ipad/#video

Got some ST fans over there at Apple?

439. Daoud - January 27, 2010

With all these movie analogies, I’ve realized another. ST’09’s Kirk is also similar to Fievel in An American Tail!

“After an army of cruel cats destroys their village, the Mousekewitzes—a Russian-Jewish family of mice—decide to immigrate to America, where all mice know there are no cats. During the trip, little Fievel Mousekewitz gets separated from Papa and washes overboard in a storm. The Mouskewitzes arrive sadly in America believing they’ve lost their son.”

“After an army of cruel Romulans destroys their starship, the Kirks—an Earth family of humans—decide to immigrate to Iowa, where all humans know there are no Romulans. During the trip, Commander George Kirk gets separated from Winona and crashes in a storm. The Kirks arrive sadly in America believing they’ve lost their father.”

Wow. Just as long as they don’t follow An American Tail 2, it should be good. Although Dom DeLuise as Harry Mudd… hmmmm….. More like Cyrano Jones. However, I still think and “Old West” sequence with Kirk, Spock, and McCoy’s first camping trip on a shore leave would be a great start or finish scene. Horses, marshmelons, “Twinkle Twinkle” on a banjo. Oh joy.

440. VeratheGun - January 27, 2010

I am struck over and over again by how superbly the film was cast.

I can’t even imagine how difficult it must have been to step into the shoes of actors who have played a particular role for 40 years.

Pine, in particular, is a real find. True leading men don’t just grow on trees. He and Pinto carried that movie with such assurance, it was extraordinary to see.

And Urban–just perfection.

441. Anthony Pascale - January 27, 2010

TreakFreak/MacTrek

Either you find a way to debate and discuss without being insulting to others or you leave, as simple as that. And changing your name doesn’t reset the warnings either

discuss our policies at
http://trekmovie.com/about/feedback

442. Boborci - January 27, 2010

426. No apologies necessary.

443. ryanhuyton - January 27, 2010

Bob, have you watched any TOS lately?

444. The Chief Engineer - January 27, 2010

Mr Orci!

Bob, i’m so bowled over that you take time to read these threads… good and bad. It’s incredible to think that fans can have their concerns, hopes and views taken onboard. With that in mind i’d like to agree with some of the posts regarding concerns about Scotty’s characterization.

The thing i’m most looking forward to seeing most over the next couple of movies is the blossoming of Scotty’s relationship with his only real true friend… the Enterprise… the one person he would raise his fists to defend (TOS: The Trouble With Tribbles)! This fierce attachment shown towards the Enterprise can’t have been something that just developed overnight when he arrived in the water pipes… hopefully this relationship will be explored in some small way in the next film.

Perhaps one of Scotty’sbest traits is his dedication to his profession (to the point of being almost obsessive)… it must have been devastating to him to have been exiled to an ice planet! Not to mention embarrassing for making *gasp*… a mistake. An act which must have happened regardless of the Time Shift… so how then does a disgraced, exiled engineer elevate himself to Enterprise 2nd Officer (the man who routinely takes command of the ship in Kirk and Spock’s absence (TOS: Bread and Circuses))! That’s a pretty significant character journey (on a par with young Kirk!) which I hope we’ll see.

If you read this… thanks.

I apologise. I’m just a proud Scotsman like the man himself.

445. boborci - January 27, 2010

444. The Chief Engineer – January 27, 2010

Noted!

446. Anthony Pascale - January 27, 2010

ST09 scotty has already shown some Trek love, “ample nacelles”, “I like this ship” and he didnt even seem to mind being trapped in the pipes

ST09 does have a more comedic Scotty. It will be interesting to see if this Scotty can sit in the captains chair. In the sequel if Kirk and Spock are off doing whatever, who is in the chair? If it is Simon Pegg Scotty, i imagine it will have to show a less jokey scott, one where the humor is more subtle perhaps.

447. S. John Ross - January 27, 2010

#446: “If it is Simon Pegg Scotty, i imagine it will have to show a less jokey scott, one where the humor is more subtle perhaps.”

If they can write it; I have no doubt that Pegg can perform it … he’s shown some real range and sensitivity when it’s demanded of him.

I often wonder if comedy isn’t the acting equivalent of swinging two bats … lots of actors can do drama but can’t quite manage comedy, but if they can do comedy it [often] seems a given that they can knock drama out of the park when needed. I think comic acting requires a lot of precision and discipline that maps well to other modes.

448. P Technobabble - January 27, 2010

It will, indeed, be interesting to see how the new cast get to play out the characters, now that we are past the “introductions,” as compared to the TOS characters. I am very glad the new cast are not doing mere imitations of the TOS cast, and the new cast seem to have a good handle on the characterizations.
However, I don’t think anyone wants to see Simon Pegg Scotty, for example, as comic relief only. If he plays things too comical, it will certainly be difficult to see him as a man capable of taking command.
I think (I’m speaking generally) we want to see the Kirk/Spock/McCoy trio portrayed more like they were in TOS, for sure, as a close, tight-knit unit. Seeing the supporting players in more substantial roles is also a plus, simply because each of these characters has their own loyal following. Seeing Uhura, for example, given more significant tasks than just saying “Hailing frequencies open,” etc. is certainly a plus!
I have no doubt that the writers are taking all of this into consideration, to some degree, and will do their best to accomodate everyone. Again, there’s only so much room to play with in 2 hours… unless they decide to really take some risks and start making 4 to 6 hour movies… (I’d be all for it!)

449. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

Simon Pegg can definitely do the serious Scotty jig. Pegg is awesome.

450. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

Pegg was great in shawn of the dead lol. But I also think he would do a good job in a more dramatic role.

451. Hugh Hoyland - January 27, 2010

Bob how many hours a day do you have to work on the story, 8 hours, or is it really more like 24/7, Im not a writter so I would imagine it has no set hours.

452. dmduncan - January 27, 2010

Nick Frost as Cyrano Jones! Pegg and Frost are great together. Can’t wait to see “Paul.”

453. Hateya - January 27, 2010

Mr. Orci,

I’m both an OLD and NEW Star Trek fan. Until the 2009 movie, I’d been away for a long time.

Thank you for bringing me back!!!

If possible, in one of the sequels, could you please REDEEM the Vulcans?

I had never regarded them as racists/speciest or xenophobic until I began watching a certain ST television show. Now xenophobia seems to be their calling card and that is wrong, wrong, wrong, especially for one of the founding members of the Federation.

Making Vulcans xenophobic appears to have been the goal of other writers. I’m asking you to consider an alternative.

When a person from a diverse background intermarries with a person from a homogeneous background, we can’t expect either party to make the switch to the other side… easily, if at all.

Unfortunately in the West, diversity always looks good and democratic and homogeneous looks bad. That is WRONG.

I live in a homogeneous society (the society in which aspects of Vulcan, Klingon and Romulan cultures were originally based) and have discovered that there are rules:

1) Rules for “us”
2) Rules for “those who marry and breed with us”
3) Rules for “not us.”

If children are born and raised in the homogeneous culture, then they belong to “us.” They generally do well unless a parent (say… Sarek) screws up said child by trying to overcompensate for his/her choices of mate.

As a diverse person who lives and functions in a homogeneous society, I didn’t particularly feel disdain for the way the Vulcans treated Spock. Yes, the kids were bullies and yes the VSA minister was an ass, but Sarek is also just as responsible for the mis-communication as everyone else.

Ultimately, Spock was too violent. He had no control over himself and every time he came upon something he disliked, he showed his ass. His behavior was human, not Vulcan. Why are some of us surprised by the Vulcan attitude?

Sarek wanted Spock to be stronger, better, faster in order to justify *his* decision to marry Amanda. In doing so, he inadvertently alienated his own son from the society in which he was born as a member of “us.”

Those who are a member of “us” are conditioned to “hammer the nail that sticks out” by any means necessary even by using the words “human whore.”

Spock, thankfully, made the RIGHT decision. He left and now he can be the person he has always wanted to be: A VULCAN!!!

Unlike many others, I don’t think being SpockVulcan is about DNA. It’s akin to being something like…a Buddhist. It’s a way of life. It’s a set of internal doctrines that govern his behavior.

Personally, I find his struggle to be disciplined and controlled to be gushworthy and so does Nyota! He can love her and still strive to reach this goal.

You can bet my next post will be pro Spock/Uhura

Thank you for reading my ramblings. I’m not asking that you agree with what I’ve said. I’m only asking that you consider another perspective when presenting the Vulcans.

Trek Rulz!

454. ryanhuyton - January 27, 2010

Scotty became too comedic for this simple reason: he works in a brewery.
Bob, you of all people should have known the consequences of assigning a drinker to a brewery :-) Heh heh!

455. The Chief Engineer - January 28, 2010

#445: Thanks. Just figured there was a large swing of fortunes on the cards for poor old scotty. On another note… would anyone have minded if Pegg had kept Ginger hair?… certainly more Scottish looking…

456. DS9 IN PRIME TIME - January 28, 2010

@444
@Boboric

You thought out that thread very nicely. I always thought Scotty was very proud and humbled to be the chief engineer of the flag ship of the Federation.

In TNG’s “Relics” when talking to La Forge he says “I may be a captain by rank, but…I’ve never wanted to be anything else but an engineer. Take the Conn, Geordi.” I think this shows his appreciation at his position of being head of engineering.

Also, Scotty says “Enjoy these times, Geordi. You’re the chief engineer of a starship… it’s a time of your life that’ll never come again… and once it’s gone… it’s gone.”

He is a consummate professional and feels a nostalgia for the glory days when he was young and on top of his game. I think he feels like he could do anything in those days.

The “Supreme Court” has a chance to show this younger Scotty at his best.

457. captain_neill - January 28, 2010

hope they tone down on the comic relief of Scotty

I felt that Pegg’s interpretation of Scotty was a bit off and not the Scotty I know and love. However, Pegg’s performance was good.

458. The Chief Engineer - January 28, 2010

#456 Thanks. To go from exiled failure (Archer’s beagle) to miracle worker is huge leap… let’s hope Scotty shines next time around.

459. Damian - January 28, 2010

#453–Enterprise showed the Vulcans as evolving. By the 4th season, their growth was clearly shown. They started growing a respect for humanity and a belief that humans, with all their emotions and lack of logic, had a special gift for peace and exploration. That growth was most clearly seen with Ambassador Sovall. In the beginning he felt humans were not ready and was downright arrogant about it. By the 4th season, he was thanking Archer for stopping the Xindi, because Vulcan would have been at risk as well. Also during the coup d’etat when T’Pau took over as the new leader, Sovall was key to helping the Enterprise. By the end, Sovall was clearly representative of Vulcan’s future. Still logical, but with a respect for humanity and their resolve. And they were a key member of the Coalition of Planets and a founder of the Federation with their headquarters on Earth. I think that shows a significant amount of respect for humanity and their role in the quadrant.

A shame the 4th season did not happen during the 2nd. Enterprise may have gotten it’s full 7 years. You finally began to see the links to the original series. Manny Coto finally redeemed that series in the eyes of some Trekkies, even if only for 1 season. A shame he did not get a 5th season. It would have been great to finally see the Romulan War, instead of having to read about it. How about the founding of the Federation. All things we will likely never see now.

460. The Chief Engineer - January 28, 2010

#452: Nick Frost as Scotty’s assistant!… sorry Keenser.

461. ensign joe - January 28, 2010

When I think of Scotty I think of him in those Jeffries tubes..

http://www.startrek.com/imageuploads/200303/tos-007-scotty-works-in-the-je/320×240.jpg

462. dmduncan - January 28, 2010

What I liked about Doohan Scotty was that he had a great sense of humor but as an engineer dealing with cause and effect, with known quantities and calculations, and sharply aware of what he did not know and could nae’ guarantee, he wouldn’t tolerate nonsense. And that carried through to his command style. See A Taste of Armageddon where Scotty coolly detects the Emeniarans deceptive tactics, and you get the sense that yes, if the Emeniarans want trouble, Scotty’s going to let them have it. Cause and effect. No diplomacy, no politics. Let go of the Captain or we blast your cities to bits. It’s really just that simple. What’s to discuss?

463. dmduncan - January 28, 2010

@460: I would seriously love to see Nick Frost in Star Trek in some capacity, preferably humorous. Perhaps telling Scotty, “I’m sorry Scotty…no, I’m SORRY Scotty.”

464. dmduncan - January 28, 2010

Oh! Of course the Enterprise must have already had a chief engineer before they left port, right? You can certainly write it that way. Then Scotty comes aboard and takes over that position. Now wouldn’t Nick Frost make a great grumpy, slightly resentful former chief engineer whom Scotty replaced, and who now functions as second in charge down there?

465. dmduncan - January 28, 2010

Or was that who Olsen was supposed to be? The imbecile who flamed himself on the platform?

466. Damian - January 28, 2010

I could be wrong, but I thought the chief engineer was killed when the Narada attacked, along with the former CMO.

467. dmduncan - January 28, 2010

@466: Olson was just called “engineer Olson.” McCoy reported Dr. Pruri killed, but no one else. I’m not sure where else it would’ve been mentioned.

468. Damian - January 28, 2010

Next time I watch it, I’ll keep an eye out for it. As I said, I could be wrong. I don’t even actually remember seeing the chief engineer when they set out. Also, I was not entirely sure, but is Scotty now the chief engineer? Maybe Bob Orci can help us out here.

469. Damian - January 28, 2010

I’m kind of embarassed. I pride myself in knowing the ins and outs of the story of Star Trek, from World War III to the stories following the events in the “Destiny” books. And I don’t know who the chief engineer of the Enterprise is. I’m so ashamed of myself.

470. The Chief Engineer - January 28, 2010

#468 Surely Scotty still has to prove himself with the odd miracle before he becomes Chief Engineer…

471. gingerly - January 28, 2010

About Scotty…

Remember the former chief engineer, Olson? He died doing the redshirt thing.

It was pretty clearly established that Scotty was the very talented highest ranking officer now available, replacing him.

He got his post the same way McCoy did, because someone else died.

The miracle he proved himself with was getting away from the black hole, saving everyone.

Just like every other team member he’ll continue to prove his worth, I’m sure. :)

472. The Chief Engineer - January 28, 2010

#471: Not sure it was clearly established that Scotty had even been pardoned or even cleared to leave the ice planet he had been exiled to… nevermind walk in as chief engineer…

473. The Chief Engineer - January 28, 2010

#471: … but i agree with you, i’m sure he’ll prove his worth. :)

474. gingerly - January 28, 2010

#471: … but i agree with you, i’m sure he’ll prove his worth. :)

If weren’t for Scotty the Enterprise, the entire crew, would be micron particles squished into nothingness.

HE ALREADY HAS.

As for the ice planet? I got the impression that he was reassigned there, not *formally* punished.

Hence, Scotty’s own words of speculation about the roundabout way it was done.

475. The Chief Engineer - January 28, 2010

Ain’t speculation fun! They should set up a place where people can discuss! lol

476. dmduncan - January 28, 2010

471: “Remember the former chief engineer, Olson? He died doing the redshirt thing.”

“It was pretty clearly established that Scotty was the very talented highest ranking officer now available, replacing him.”

Olson was merely referred to as “engineer Olson.” On a ship that size there’s probably a dozen “engineers,” hence the distinction between “engineer” and “chief engineer.” I didn’t catch any reference in the film to a “chief engineer.”

472: “Not sure it was clearly established that Scotty had even been pardoned or even cleared to leave the ice planet he had been exiled to… nevermind walk in as chief engineer…”

Yeah, I thought of that too. Abandoned his post! But if they promoted Kirk, they’d have to let Scotty slide for that, since he was a major factor in saving the day in at least 3 ways.

477. The Disinvited - January 28, 2010

#476

If I recall correctly Scotty thought Kirk and Spock Prime were his scheduled but much delayed relief. I got more of a sense that he blamed the DELAY on Admiral Archer being miffed as opposed to implying that he had been officially sanctioned.

478. The Chief Engineer - January 28, 2010

Which then would beg the question ‘why was he there in the first place?’… It’s not exactly a federation hotspot of activity which anyone would choose as a place to help further their career.

479. The Disinvited - January 28, 2010

#478

One can be “disfavored” by one’s superior without being sanctioned. It merely means Scotty doesn’t get the cream of the crop assignments that he thinks befits his abilities. But someone has to be assigned to the various tasks that Starfleet deems necessary – even the unpopular ones.

If Scotty was being sanctioned why would the Admiral post him within 10 feet of a functioning transporter?

480. dmduncan - January 28, 2010

477: Scotty was waiting for food to arrive, not relief, is what I recall. Sandwiches. Now you are going to make me go watch it again. I’m going to be able to recite every line in the movie before 2011, I’m sure.

481. Hateya - January 28, 2010

@Damian

I am still struggling to get through Season 2 of Enterprise. It’s fairly difficult to do, however, I did begin reading the books beginning from the Kobayashi Maru and I find a great deal of merit within them. I agree that it is unfortunate there wasn’t a 5th season to showcase the Romulan War.

“I think that shows a significant amount of respect for humanity and their role in the quadrant. ”

I’m not worried about alien species showing respect for humans. If I were concerned, I’d concentrate more on the reverse situation where humans learn to show respect for others and their roles in the quadrant. You know, like not beaming down to planets where the populace has stated unambiguously that they want no contact with the Federation. Thankfully, that isn’t my issue where the 2009 movie and sequels are concerned.

I mere want Vulcans shown as members of a homogeneous society where Spock is concerned and not a xenophobic one. The whole implication that every single Vulcan (sans Sarek sometimes) can’t stand the thought of Spock grates on me.

I wholeheartedly agree that Spock should have returned to the Enterprise and I’d love to see it where he makes this decision after determining that it was best for him and the other Vulcans. I’d like to see them *support* that decision.

Admittedly, having Sarek in essence tell his son that he was the result of love and not a science project did go a long way!! Thanks Bob and Alex.

Now keep that Uhura/Spock flame alive and burning hot, gentlemen!!!

482. Damian - January 29, 2010

#481–I think the Vulcans will probably by a lot different now that there are only about 10,000 left. I think in the prime universe, the Vulcans were always a little skeptical about how Vulcan Spock really was, at least in the beginning.

Re: Star Trek: Enterprise–maybe try starting with the 4th season (maybe starting at the 4th episode, as the prior 3 were linked to events from season 3) and working your way back. I know from these reading these boards that many fans felt this was the best season and was more clearly linked to the original series. Then if you like that work on the 3rd season (the Xindi arc) which had a lot of good episodes.

483. gingerly - January 29, 2010

#482

I think in the prime universe, the Vulcans were always a little skeptical about how Vulcan Spock really was, at least in the beginning.

Her point, I believe, is that Vulcans as portrayed in the Enterprise series were this monolithic group, while humans are were too often portrayed as infallibly “better” than the aliens, for all our charming cultural insensitivities.

Not all Vulcans would think of Spock as one way *or* the other.

And human Federation members have all the right answers, even when they are wrong? That characterization is part of what made me despise Archer, tbh.

Save, all-to-few episodes, there wasn’t enough moral nuance within the races in that series, IMO.

484. gingerly - January 29, 2010

#476

http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/Olson

485. dmduncan - January 29, 2010

@484: Unless Bob clarifies that or someone can find the place in the movie where he is called the “chief engineer,” that stub should be corrected.

Maybe I missed it in the movie or where Bob said that’s who he was in a Q&A. I’m going to have another look at it tonight.

486. dmduncan - January 29, 2010

After watching it again, even though Olson is only called “engineer Olson,” I think the fact that Pike goes to him for a status report is meant to convey that he’s the top guy down in engineering.

487. Hateya - January 29, 2010

@483, gingerly.

This was definitely one of the points I was making.

I guess if one only lives in a certain society and never lives (as oppose to visit) in another society long enough to recognize the rules, it’s tough to see how complex culture is.

For me, the 2009 movie made a case *against* Spock, not for him. Where I live, most people thought he was a prissy brat who deserved to be smacked because he didn’t know how to behave in public. Not surprising from a homogeneous society with so many unwritten rules. Curiously though, they cheered when Spock beat down Kirk. Go figure.

To Mr. Orci and Mr. Kurtzman.

When one lives outside of one’s own society, the rules change, too. For the most part, once you get over what you *think* you need, things are easier.

Was Spock truly accepted at Starfleet or did he just not give a hoot about what they thought? Did he overwhelm them with his intelligence? Probably. Does this mean they want their daughters pumping out potentially green-blooded (or red-tainted-green blooded) pointed-eared babies? I serious doubt it.

Spock didn’t need to be accepted. He was untouchable because it’s likely the standards the humans set are far less rigorous than the ones the Vulcans set.

In the end, I’m only arguing against making homogeneous societies appear xenophobic when the world’s far more complex than that.

Give Spock a Vulcan friend or mentor please. It would be nice if he appeared with a non-DNA-related Vulcan who didn’t think he was a prat. Bonus points if that Vulcan isn’t a rebel.

Thank you for your time, gentlemen.

Uhura/Spock Rulz!

488. Lonzo5 - January 30, 2010

NOOOOOO KHAAAAAAAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

489. Hugh Hoyland - January 31, 2010

I read that the sequel was already discussed and moved forward in march of 2009 (a month before Star Trek was released. Bob is that actual?

490. Hugh Hoyland - February 1, 2010

I really like the idea opening up with Enterprise fighting (put your fav TOS villian(s) here”___________” at the start of the story, They would actually be in the later part of the battle and evenually defeat it foe’s in rather fast order. After the battel is over the ship and crew start gathering themselves and the ship together, and the senior Brige staff give SFC a debreif on the now ended mission…….From that point the story moves forward into the crew has been given orders (by Admiral Pike) to investigate an anomomly and the loss of contact to several Federation out posts in some distint sector. While on the way to investigate the A and the out posts, The Enterprise descovers “the “botony Bay”. On the Bay they discover humans in a frozen state. Bones and Scotty knowing that the ships systems are failing and if they want to save them, the must be beemed over to the Enterprise fast, Kirk orders it done, but FAST. Then the Enterprise proceeds on its mission to the A and lost outposts……………..

491. Damian - February 1, 2010

#483–Star Trek being told from the view of the Federation (and humans) really goes back to one of Gene Roddenberry’s key requirements. I remember reading about the Next Generation episode “First Contact” (not related to the movie). It was a huge deal that it was told from an alien perspective. I think Roddenberry wanted humanity portrayed as having grown a great deal since today and being capable of so much. The whole point of Star Trek was showing that one day, instead of destroying ourselves, maybe we will some day solve the problems with poverty, pollution, greed, etc.

That being said, I have no problem with giving aliens (whether they be Vulcans, Andorians, or anyone else) a more positive role in the new Star Trek universe. But that does not have to necessarily diminish humanity’s role in the Federation.

492. Hugh Hoyland - February 1, 2010

Dang I wish there was a way to proof read and edit a post after you realize there are spelling errors among other things lol

493. Hugh Hoyland - February 1, 2010

I dont envy bob and the SC in the least. Tough job for sure writting the sequel, but if anyone or group can do it, its them. Expectations are going to be high on this one.

494. Mack Daddy - February 2, 2010

I, for one, hope they take advantage of future Spock’s knowledge and jump start technology with the old crew – making the Enterprise a ship to be feared by combatant races. This seems like ti would go along with the edge Abrams,et al., instilled in the first movie. If you have a Vulcan from the future pop up in a new universe, there is no reason for the Federation to be outgunned in every battle.

495. Dave Corson - March 3, 2010

as much as I love the new trek I still have one over riding concern now that you have paired Spock and Uhura how are you going to handle the ponfar
just because the planet Vulcan is gone dose not mean that the that
drive is gone he has to under go the madness just as Spock prime
had to .

My question is how will Uhura be able to handle a Spock who is under
going this even in the prime universe Chapel had to run for it how dose
she Uhhua plan on defending her self.

TrekMovie.com is represented by Gorilla Nation. Please contact Gorilla Nation for ad rates, packages and general advertising information.