Quinto Gearing Up For ‘Imminent’ Star Trek Sequel (& Eyebrow Shaving) | TrekMovie.com
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Quinto Gearing Up For ‘Imminent’ Star Trek Sequel (& Eyebrow Shaving) October 18, 2011

by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Celebrity,ST09 Cast,Star Trek Into Darkness , trackback

On Friday Zachary Quinto’s new movie Margin Call opens and the actor says that after he finishes up his latest publicity trip he is headed back to LA to prep for the Star Trek sequel which he says is "imminent." Quinto also talks about facing getting his eyebrows shaved again to play Spock. See below for excerpts and videos of Quinto talking Trek. 


Quinto Star Trek prep "Imminent" + not looking forward to eyebrow shaving

While promoting Margin Call, Zachary Quinto talked about the sequel to Star Trek saying that it was on the "imminent horizon" and he would be headed back to Los Angeles to prep for it and it would start shooting "in the beginning of the year." Noting that while he hasn’t read the script, "everyone is gearing up" and  "getting back into that head space."

Here is the video via Cinemablend.

Zachary is also featured in the November issue of Details magazine which has an interview. He speaks briefly about the Star Trek movie and his least favorite part of playing Spock:

Details: When can we expect to see you in the next Star Trek film?

Zachary Quinto: People will have a better idea when they see me walking down the street with shaved eyebrows. That’s definitely the most tedious part of playing Spock. The first time, it took three weeks for them to come back in a way that I didn’t have to wear my glasses every day to hide them. It was probably two months before they were really thick and bushy again.

Quinto and his dog pictured in latest Details Magazine

Quinto also talked to Access Hollywood about American Horror story and Star Trek, noting that he expects to be shaving his eyebrows again around the end of the year. [NOTE: This would still be for pre-production as production doesn’t start until 2012].



1. Rob - October 18, 2011

First At Last !

Congrats on coming out, great to see the cast suggesting that activity is imminent

2. Anthony Thompson - October 18, 2011

Odd that there still hasn’t been an official announcement frrom Paramount yet RE: JJ, a release date, etc., etc.

3. Keachick - rose pinenut - October 18, 2011

Love the dog. Is that Noah? Does Zach still have the cat? I believe he adopted both Noah and a cat of similar ages several years ago where he was doing volunteer work for an animal shelter. I like people who like animals. I believe Chris Pine also had a dog and was broken hearted when he and his girlfriend separated and she took the dog…”She took the f*cking dog as well” and continued by saying that he balled his eyes out…”straw that broke the camel’s back” I guess.

Well, they did announce a release date, 29 June 2012, which we know won’t happen. Let’s just get the film made!!!

4. Charla - October 19, 2011

What a nice surprise! I didn’t know Zach was doing AHS- usually not my type of genre- horror shows, but my sister suggested I watch it. Cool!

And yes Keachick, that is Noah. Cutey! Not sure of a cat though. And poor Chris!! That sounds like the making of a bad country song doesn’t it?? lol

5. Keachick - rose pinenut - October 19, 2011

#4 – Well, Chris Pine did sing a song called “Someday Came Today” (country pop). It can be found on iTunes. Not a bad song, not a bad voice either. No mention of a dog though.

So that is Noah. OK – can anyone name the breed(s) of dog? I’m not sure myself. Noah must be quite old by now. That is such a nice picture – makes me want to give the two of them a big cuddle.

It is probably just as well that there is no picture of Chris Pine with a dog like Noah, because then I might want to give them double cuddles. Karl Urban has a big black dog too, I believe, some lab-X something.

I really think that it is about time the Trek actors came out with their dogs (Chris – Bob Orci is finding you that beagle as I write, if you have not already got a dog…aren’t you, Bob?) Lotsa pictures, thank you. I want my computer overloaded with bookmarks and imaginery cuddles.

Make it so, you guys.

Better go. I’m rambling – got dishes to do…:( (It’s called “avoidance behaviour”).

6. S. John Ross - October 19, 2011

It is slightly disturbing that, of the four images of Quinto presented here, the Spock picture has the most reasonable hair.

But still. Glad he’s looking forward to reprising.

7. njdss4 - October 19, 2011

I hope we hear that they’re gonna start filming soon! I burned through DS9 on Netflix already and I need more Trek!

8. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 19, 2011

Dee – Chris Pine, as of 14 October, looked VERY clean shaven in those photos… sign of a captain soon to sit in that chair?

9. maanrumreturns - October 19, 2011

Yes! So happy for Quinto on Spock in this next movie! Nemoy as Spock, has shaved his eyebrows for the 1960 for the three YEARS? Perhaps now is gay fashion style eyebrows removal them?

10. CmdrR - October 19, 2011

Hard to believe it takes ZQ months to grow those monsters back. He always looks like he gets 5 o’clock shadow 5 minutes after shaving.

11. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 19, 2011

I don’t think these guys do a close shave, because at the moment, it is not fashionable. Having a bit of stubble is what’s meant to be cool right now.

12. Starfleet's Finest - October 19, 2011

It’s so nice to hear that the actors are starting to hone in on Trek again…a definite sign of progress! Woot!! I can’t wait!

It’s not suprising to hear that he really hates shaving his eyebrows; I mean, to have them so thick like that then have almost half of that gone… the man probably has a few days of mourning just for the occasion. I have to admit that it is a little strange to see him without his ‘signature’ look, no matter how much I love him as Spock. Ah well, no one said the road to the Enterprise would be an easy one…

And of course Noah, is as always, adorable! :)

13. Sebastian S. - October 19, 2011

Trimming those eyebrows might be considered minor surgery! ;-D

Just kidding, ZQ. I really like his interpretation of Spock and hope very much to see him and the rest of the ST in another ST movie…. someday.

14. Duncan MacLeod - October 19, 2011


I am sorry if i come across as insensitive, are you from a non-english speaking country? I am trying to figure out what you are trying to say, but it is a little unclear..

15. Commodore Mike of the Terran Empire - October 19, 2011

Ok.. Let’s get Trek made already. Please!!!!!

16. Jorg Sacul - October 19, 2011

Set eyebrow trimmer on “disintegrate”! Go Zach GO!

17. Gordon Ramsey's knife - October 19, 2011

marginal actor at best….b-list type…u don’t have to be Anthony Hopkins to figure that out..

18. Adam E - October 19, 2011

Should us fans shave our eyebrows in solidarity with Quinto?

19. Starfleet's Finest - October 19, 2011

@18 Adam E

Is it weird to say that I would probably be on board with that? Or did my fanatical side just get over exposed?

*Cough, cough*

Ahem…I mean…psssh, who would do that?

20. Drij - October 19, 2011

After looking at Quinto and his style, is anyone really surprised that hes gay?

21. Ciaran - October 19, 2011


It’s actually not that hard to believe it takes so long for eyebrows to grow. I got my eyebrow shaved when I fell asleep at a house party back in July. It’s only now that my eyebrow looks normal again. Now I know not to fall asleep at a party again! LMAO!

And #20, you do have a point. I always thought he was gay since I watched Heroes. Not that I care, I loved him in Heroes, and he’s just totally awesome as Spock. His sexuality, to me, has nothing to do with the roles he plays.

At least we now know that when he’s kissing Zoe Saldana, he ain’t getting any kind of kick out of it the way any heterosexual guy would. LMAO!

22. Lt. Bailey - October 19, 2011

#15 Commodore,
I could not agree with you more! Lets start the film already, enough of this waiting. No matter how many Star Trek drinks I make, it does not kill the pain of no Trek…although the Romulan Ale drink will help ease the pain.

23. Rainbucket - October 19, 2011

Eyebrows don’t grow back quickly because we had no evolutionary pressure to replace them quickly. Cranial hair, left alone, keeps growing until its falling off point and picks right up again. Eyebrows mostly grow to their stopping point and then stick around.

I wonder if there are eyebrow wigs for actors with shaved brows?

24. Battle-scarred Sciatica - October 19, 2011

@21 Ciaran

“fell asleep” at a party.
that has to be one deep sleep or one uninteresting party ;)
by “fell asleep” do you really mean passed out?

i do believe NoaH is half Airedale, half irish wolfhound. cute mutt!
probably cuter than my mutt, Darwin – half doberman, half nutjob!

25. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 19, 2011

Actually Zach being gay might make it easier for him and Zoe to do the Spock/Uhura love scenes. Zoe is married and she does not need to worry about Zach becoming more (obviously) amorous towards her than he ever intended to be. I’m sure she knew about his homosexuality from the start. I think that could possibly be a problem if she and Chris were playing a Kirk/Uhura love scene, not that either of them would have intended anything. *Good* old pheromones…Probably most (if not all) of the Trek cast knew or guessed, but it is not their business to say anything.

Let the shaving and plucking begin – no time like the present!

Zach – your eyebrow sacrifice will not go unnoticed nor unrewarded. Keep up the good work.

26. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 19, 2011

#24 Thank you for answering my query about Noah’s breed(s).

Of course, it would be far better if Zachary Quinto came here to tell us about his cute mutt, Noah, and the cat?, himself. He could spend his time chatting here while those make up people are doing dastardly things to those bushy eyebrows of his.

Oh well, one can dream…

Anthony Pascale – any chance of getting new “Kirk/Spock” pair to come here. I guess this could happen later, when the guys are able to say more. Anyway, they could talk about the weather and pets…it’s all good to me. Gotta try, gotta ask!

27. Bugs nixon - October 19, 2011

That’s a sweet doggie.

28. Starbase Britain - October 19, 2011

I cant think of a better bloke to play Spock (other than Mr Nimoy of course). Looking forward to seeing Zach in full make up and uniform again. He was one of the highlights of the 2009 movie.

Greg UK

29. Dee - lvs moon' surface - October 19, 2011

ZQ interview to Star Trek.com:

And, last question. Do you have anything lined up, acting-wise, for after you finish American Horror Story and before you begin the next Star Trek film?

Quinto: There’s not really going to be much time for that. I’m going to be in full prep for the next Trek movie by the time I get back to L.A. in November. I’ll finish American Horror Story in that time and then we start (Star Trek) in January. So, with all the stuff that I need to do to prepare, I really doubt that I’ll be doing anthing else between American Horror Story and the next Trek movie.

….full prep November… filming January…:-) :-)



30. Dee - lvs moon' surface - October 19, 2011

#3. Keachick…

LOL….CP actually said…”I cried my f***ing brains out”… it’s not the f***ing dog… because I think he loved that dog….LOL

…Noah the charming best friend of ZQ….:-) :-)

31. AJ - October 19, 2011

Geez, I’ve been the Star Trek ‘head space’ since 1972. Can’t seem to get out.

Isn’t that right, Bones?

McCoy: “I’m still here. Would you like a tranquilizer?”


32. Joel1245 - October 19, 2011

I’m surprised Quinto would need to shave both eyebrows completely or is that not right? I though Nimoy only had his shaved to a point (pun intended) but maybe that’s not right either.

33. Captain Dunsel - October 19, 2011

Let us know when he’s “Earing Up” for Spock, OK?

34. Phil - October 19, 2011

Come on, Zach, NO ONE has read the script. Until there is a script (when Paramount says there is one) the only prep you will be doing are the one eyebrow push ups. At the rate the script is progressing, you are gonna have some really burly forehead muscules with all that prepping…

35. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 19, 2011

#34 Of course, the TPTB have read the script. It is just the actors who have not seen it yet. It is quite possible that the production team assistants have read some of it. It is a “need to know” situation.

Thank you, Dee. I keep thinking my quote was a bit off. I know Chris loved that dog, hence all the tears. Animals will do that to you. They are always the innocent party…

OK, shaving and plucking won’t happen until November. Anyway, the whole actor team can’t reassemble until after 23 October, because Karl is quite likely here, waiting and hoping to see the All Blacks win the Rugby World Cup! The All Blacks are in the Finals and play against the French – kick off time @ 9.00pm, Eden Stadium, Auckland, NZ, 23/10/11.

Aurore – It’s been lovely hosting the French team among others (the USA had a team here as well), but you do understand if I yell “GO, ALL BLACKS! WIN IT! WIN IT! WIN IT!” As we say, we love having all of you here downunder to watch our guys win the Cup!

BTW, I am not much of a rugby fan ordinarily, and I don’t watch much at all. But, boy, the ABs are fast. No need for JJ Abrams to tap on anything to get a shaky camera effect filming these guys…:)! Not good for my waistline, though, because I can’t stop eating popcorn and liquorice as I watch our guys play on the BIG plasma screen at a local community church hall. You’ll know where I’ll be, come next Sunday night. If they win, it’s break out the chocolates.
(I had a cup with the words, “I would give up chocolate, but I’m not a quitter.”)

36. Battle-scarred Sciatica - October 19, 2011

AB’s have no competition on Sunday.
…much like the Aussie game
at least it is labour day the day after. plenty of time for recovery!!!:)

37. T'Cal - October 19, 2011

Aaaaaaargh! More non-news about STXII!!!

38. VZX - October 19, 2011

Man, I hate it when I have to shave my eyebrows to play a vulcan…wait.

39. Keachick - rose pinenut - October 19, 2011

#36 Yes, I think you could be right. Fingers crossed. I never “light up” though “until the fat lady sings” or something like that. What does that even mean?

40. Battle-scarred Sciatica - October 19, 2011

you’ll have to ask the fat lady and her dealer!

41. Odkin - October 19, 2011

As far as I know, a proper Vulcan eyebrow only requires the actor to shave the outermost 1/2 of each outbrow. Although Quinto’s are so bushy, he just may have to start with a clean slate.

However I wish he’d commit enough to use his real hair rather than that fake too-shiny wig they use.

All I ask is please…. PLEASE drop the Spock Uhura thing. I’ve always said it was a mistake for Spock to allow himself to become entangled with a subordinate. From a story point of view, it’s illogical and tragedy has always resulted whenever he allowed himself to get have feelings for a woman. From the viewer perspective, fantasizing about piercing Spock’s veil of being “unattainability” is a big part of Spock’s appeal to the female audience. An Uhura romance just spoils the character as a dramatic device. (Which is what he is, so don’t reply with “but Spock deserves…” He isn’t real.)

42. Red Dead Ryan - October 19, 2011

Well, I too would like them to drop the Spock/Uhura romance. I understood why they did it last time, but it was also a bit ridiculous.

For the sequel, I’d like to see them both do their jobs, and just be good friends. No more, no less.

I don’t think romance is a necessary ingredient to make a good movie. I’d rather see the friendship between Kirk, Spock and McCoy, the triumvirate and the heart of “Star Trek”. Uhura is a secondary character. Not as many people care about her. Kirk, Spock, and McCoy are way more popular. Very un-PC, but quite true.

But, unfortunately, the romance is likely to continue in the sequel, just like we’re going to be stuck with the brewery again. I just hope we get some more McCoy, especially as part of a passionate philisophical debate with Kirk and Spock.

43. The Odd-Numbered Movies - October 19, 2011

I disagree that Quinto’s sexuality undercuts the Uhura romance. I always thought it lent a certain sense of ponn farr to Spock’s conflicted commitment to this woman. What is a Vulcan if not a way of looking at the Other in society?

44. Let Them Eat Plomeek Soup - October 19, 2011


watch it again at half-speed. that should last you.

jk. :P

45. DAK23 - October 19, 2011

Okay… as a non heterosexual, let me point out my HUGE disappointment with some of the above comments. Now that Mr. Quinto finally publicly admitted he’s gay, why do you all have to start with the “gay” comments?

#9 “gay fashion style to remove them?” Right… ALL gay men shave their eyebrows now just because an actor does it FOR A ROLE.

#25 While I sense no real meanness is your comment, what does an actors private life have to do with the role he plays and how he interacts with the other actors? Just because an actor happens to be gay doesn’t mean he can’t give an excellent performance with a woman. Cripes, most actors are given credit for playing a part. I read very few complaints about “straight” actors playing roles other than what they are (Liam Neeson comes to mind with his ‘American’ accent. He’s Irish, so does that mean he shouldn’t play anything other than an Irishman?).

Finally, I do wish they’d (the producers) would do something about his haircut. Nimoy’s hair seemed real to me. Simply combed forward. Quinto’s Spock looks like he’s wearing a plastic helmet. And what happened to simply shaving the sideburns to make them pointy? Now it looks like they just let the hair grow a bit longer an gel it to a point. It just doesn’t seem right compared to the good ol’ Star Trek I grew up with.

46. oldtrekgeezer - October 19, 2011

#42 well-spoken. That *is* the heart of ST…

And with that intact it doesn’t matter how silly the plots are…

doubly a pity McCoy is marginalized in the reboot when they have a fine actor in KU to portray him. what a waste..,

47. Odkin - October 19, 2011

@45 – absolutely agree with the hair as I mentioned above. I forgot all about the sideburns, you’re absolutely right. Instead of actual sideburns, they were like spitcurls on the side of his face.

48. Hat Rick - October 19, 2011

Well, how imminent is imminent? And when will they actually start shooting?

I want to see leaked copies of the script, dammit! Or reasonable facsimiles thereof.

49. Iva - October 20, 2011

Whoever is doing actors make up, please, stop making Spock and other Vulcans look like pink humans. They need to be greenish/yellowish – not caucasian baby butt white.

50. Spock/Uhura Fan - October 20, 2011

Spock & Uhura Forever!!!

I like the fact the whole cast interacts and it’s not just about three people.

I also obviously love the Spock and Uhura love story. I don’t understand why as a biracial person he can’t explore and enjoy his human half – because that’s how it was on TOS in another life? Please! I know this is upsetting to the tos purists, but stop putting Spock in a box.

51. Aurore - October 20, 2011

Spock needs to make his coming out as Nyota Uhura’s lover.

Which should not prevent him from being an outstanding First Officer, of course.

Hein, Toto?


52. chrisfawkes.com - October 20, 2011

Quinto’s understudy http://youtu.be/sKFW6QeGvns

53. Aurore - October 20, 2011

“Tonight I’m Frakking You”
(”Quinto’s understudy”)

…Well…….That was some ….crazy….Um…….. stuff…
….But,really, who am I to judge,huh?…



54. Starfleet's Finest - October 20, 2011

Zachary Quinto is an amazing actor and regardless what his sexuality is, and no matter what character he would play, he would be able to pull off convincingly and accurately. You don’t have to be heterosexual to play a heterosexual; look at Neil Patrick Harris in how ‘I Met Your Mother’. A love scene, particularly a Star Trek love scene (which every will agree is pretty restrained), will not be difficult for him to play.

And the fact that he has probably come to grips with his sexuality for most of his adult life, seems to escape people. He has probably ‘been’ gay for as long as he’s been in the public eye and just not publicized. My point being is that he has already played a convincing strait man and no one said that he shouldn’t be playing them becuase they didn’t know he was gay; so in reality, nothing has really changed. And I would even say that some (if not most) of his castmates knew, including Mrs. Saldana. So people need to back off with the whole “he can’t play … part because …”.

…but if that’s a reason to get rid of the Spock and Uhura thing, then that’s ok… :P I keed…

55. Dee - lvs moon' surface - October 20, 2011

I remember seeing an interview where ZQ said he used his own hair to play Spock… I need to find it…

:-) :-)

56. NCM - October 20, 2011

From what I’ve seen of actors who talk about doing romantic scenes before a filming crew, there’s not a damn thing hot or romantic about them. It’s acting. Some may say what’s expected of them, but I wouldn’t assume a hetero man would be any more turned on kissing Saldana under direction than a gay man would.

Would anyone deny that many straight actors have convincingly played gay roles? (Aside: Pine played a gay man in a film with Dianne Keaton).

Quinto’s a professional, a fine actor, a great Spock, and perhaps most importantly, he seems to be decent human being.

57. NCM - October 20, 2011

@41: Wow. I actually agree with Odkin – not b/c I don’t like Uhura, but he makes a good argument (that I haven’t come across) for keeping Spock out of reach.

@42: Red Dead… – Totally agree!

@43 – Good point.

58. trekrocks - October 20, 2011

41. Odkin – October 19, 2011

“However I wish he’d commit enough to use his real hair rather than that fake too-shiny wig they use.”

That’s not a wig Quinto is wearing. That is his real hair. Quinto’s mentioned that in several interviews. One with this very site:


TrekMovie: You may just be a part, but in a way you are the face of this film because you recognizable in the makeup and the ears and the wig…

Quinto: Not a wig.

His hair is very thick and luxurious, and he has a lot of it–now it’s up to the stylist to duplicate it properly. Although in my opinion–he looked just fine. As for Spock/Uhura–it didn’t bother me at all, and I’d like to see where they take it. They make a gorgeous and compelling couple.

59. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 20, 2011

Why wouldn’t Quinto use his own hair, especially now, with good hair cutting techniques, mousses, use of colouring highlights to get the hair to look the right shade of black, etc?

I agree with Iva. Vulcans have green blood, which would naturally give their skin a green/yellow/brown hue, not pink. I wonder what a person would look like if they had a combination of green and blood, like Spock, though. It would also depend of the racial background of his human mother. However, Spock would not have white/fair skin, more like the skin colour of a fair Polynesian with a greenish hue to it…That would be my guess.

Zach had better start working on his tan. Oh dear, it’s fall there now, I believe. A quick trip downunder to our spring should help things along…and we can give him a bed, Nothing fancy, mind. Only ten minutes from Auckland Int’l airport ‘n’ all.

(Of course, Chris Pine is welcome anytime as well).

60. FarStrider - October 20, 2011

Actually, I believe that Zach WAS wearing a wig for publicity stills from magazines like this one. . . in the movie, though, it was his real hair. . .

And quite frankly, I doubt that they will get rid of Spock/Uhura. . it is a new way to explore the characters. . we’ve seen the “triumvirate”. . .that is NOT what Star Trek was about. . .it’s the 21st Century. . .let’s get all the characters fleshed out. . .


61. Phil - October 20, 2011

@59. A tanning bed is much less expensive… :-)

62. Keachick - rose pinenut - October 20, 2011

True, Phil. However, you are more likely to get various kinds of skin cancers from spending too much time on a tanning bed than you are being out in the sun, even NZ’s sun with higher UVA and UVB radiation than is found in places like California.

The question, for me, living in NZ and of fair Celtic/Anglo-Saxon/Viking origin is this – do I spend most of my time out of the sun and quite likely develop osteoporosis as I get older due to longterm vitamin D deficiency or do I spend time in the sun and possibly develop some form of skin cancer? There is no cure for osteoporosis (“brittle bone” disease, degenerative and painful) but there are cures for some forms of skin cancer, if caught early enough.

I think I’ll go take some sun, especially if it is conjunction with being to swim at a nice Auckland beach.

The fact that there seem to be so many pale looking Hollywood actors is silly, especially when photographed in the middle of a Northern Hemisphere summer. The reality is that a high percentage African-Americans, in particular, are vitamin D deficient because their skin has not had enough exposure to the sun’s rays. There is a potential major health problem looming in the US and other northern European countries where many people of African and/or Middle Eastern descent now reside.

Why do you think that traditionally Scandinavians run round totally naked, as much as they are able, in their short summer? Nudity is natural and healthy, especially when it comes to people living in very northern climes.

63. Richard C. - October 20, 2011

Threading is better than shaving.. just saying! :)

64. Dee - lvs moon' surface - October 20, 2011

#59. Keachick…

It seems CP is more interested in South Africa now………………:-) :-)

65. FarStrider - October 20, 2011

@63 Threading IS better than shaving. . . but with eyebrows that thick. . . that’s some serious pain to go through initially. . .


66. sean - October 20, 2011

ZQuint has some seriously amazing hair.

67. Keachick - rose pinenut - October 20, 2011

Yes, I know. I’ve just read what you wrote on IMDb. Happy for Chris if he has found a nice woman and they are good for each other. Oh dear…wrong time, wrong place…story of my life…sigh.

68. Dee - lvs moon' surface - October 21, 2011

#67. …Oh Keachick do not despair… you know the things of the heart seem so ephemeral these days… LOL… with sure you are in the right place… and how to blame him for that if her legs seem to measure a mile… +LOL

:-) :-)

69. AJ - October 21, 2011

My two cents on the Spockie/Uhura romance is this: My daughter was 9 when the film came out, and I did my best in those 9 years to stuff as much Trek into her brain as possible before she admitted she wasn’t really interested, and would I like to play Pokemon on her DS instead.

Yet, when we watched ST09, she called out the Spock/Uhura romance as “wrong.” The expression on her face read “What were they thinking?”

I agree. That’s about as purist as it gets. ZQ and Zoe play it well, but there are other opportunities to introduce strong female characters (Rand, Chapel), and the chemistries TOS created (Kirk/Rand, Spock/Chapel) are far more interesting than the bits we saw with Spock/Uhura in 2009.

Either end it, or flesh it out as something other than a comic relief gag in the Kirk-Spock relationship.

70. Rusty0918 - October 21, 2011

#69 – Rand and Chapel are strong female characters?

Rand was pretty much a “dumb blonde” in TOS, Chapel wasn’t that much better. Don’t bring those back. The feamle chief of security idea is better.

The Spock / Uhura dynamic … the basic idea isn’t that bad, but it seemed to make Uhura more like a pining damsel. They can continue it if they have a good reason, and not just for the sake of showing gratuitous sex. I do agree with AJ that it should be fleshed out.

71. Craiger - October 21, 2011

AJ – Spock still was struggling with his human half in the movie. I don’t think he yet did the Kolinar in Abrams Trek timeline.

72. punkspocker - October 21, 2011

Only half of the eyebrows, he’d look like bob geldof in TheWall. You’re always adorable Zach.

73. FarStrider - October 21, 2011

@71 Spock never completed Kolinar in the TOS. And I doubt that Spock in this universe will ever attempt it. . .

@70 Why is it that when a character (especially a female character) is in love, they are seen as weak or “pining damsels”? We didn’t see Uhura “pining” in ST 09. . .she DID comfort her boyfriend, which, considering the situation was understandable. . .seriously, this character can’t win with some people. . . if she stands up for herself, she’s called names, if she shows some tenderness, she’s “pining”. . . Star Trek stories are supposed to explore “The Human Condition”. . . you know what, being in love, being in relationships. . .that is part of the “Human Condition” too. . . Yay to Star Trek 09 for finally acknowledging that fact. . .

@69 The Spock/Uhura relationship was much more than a comic relief gag in the Kirk/Spock relationship. . . if that is all that you got from it, than you may need to watch it again. . .



74. Rusty0918 - October 21, 2011

The Pining Damsel argument is here:

Maybe it’s a bit too strong but you get where I’m going here.

I still have instincts that this sequel will be on the level of “Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen,” but the critics regardless will bow down at Abrams’ feet no matter what.

75. Iva - October 21, 2011

@ FS 73

It could have been done well if the writers really wanted to upgrade her from a side character.

– For example -> you could have given Nuhura her command gold back. We all saw it was there in the beginning of TOS, it should have been given back. If the alternate universe is to be so different, this is hardly a big change. There should be a woman in gold on the sip.

– She could have been given a place on the Enterprise as a reward for getting and reporting the message about the Klingon fleet to the Starfleet Command. Instead of having to make a scene in public to force the only academy instructor, who is abusing his job position to have an affair with a student and fix her assignments, into giving it to her.

– During the short war, she could have been of some use like everybody else. Instead, while others give their 120% to save lives or defend planet, the only thing she does while on the Enterprise is
run around because she feels like making out with her superior. While other people cover for her.

How in the world do you make somebody who is made unnecessary during a crisis, at least seen to be necessary during a milk run or anytime in general at all?

– That moment when she receives an order to send a message to Vulcan to start evacuating, instead of ignoring it for the sake of going down on Spock, there could have been a scene about her actually doing her job. You know – make it so that thanks to her being there, the whole process was done better – her being promoted to a communications officer actually had some important impact – thanks to her more lives were saved ….. just like it was with every other character.

but – no, none of it happens. No matter how you look at it, she is the only bridge cadet who is not at her post, contributes nothing and earns nothing during the attacks, while at the same time claiming to be professional and deserving of a posting on the Enterprise.

It’s just another way for Spock and Kirk to compete and the audience to wonder who of them gets laid first, Nuhura being just another notch on the old belt, nothing more.

76. Craiger - October 21, 2011

#73 I thought Spock did in TMP. At the end of the movie he said his task on Vulcan was completed and didn’t need to return to Vulcan because he had finished the Kohlinar on the Enterprise right after finding out what V’Ger was right?

77. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 21, 2011

#75 – “Instead of having to make a scene in public to force the only academy instructor, who is abusing his job position to have an affair with a student and fix her assignments, into giving it to her.”

That is NOT what happened and Bob Orci, the writer, confirmed this himself on the very site a few months back. It is rather impertinent of you, Iva, to continue to interpret the scene for people here, some of whom may be newcomers and had not read Bob Orci’s own statement on this very scene.

“That moment when she receives an order to send a message to Vulcan to start evacuating, instead of ignoring it for the sake of going down on Spock, there could have been a scene about her actually doing her job.”

Going down on Spock? Only in your fantasies, dear Iva. You mean the scene where Spock suddenly goes into the turbolift after giving the orders for evacuation – he as acting captain in crisis leaves his post without explanation and nobody should enquire why. Really? Uhura WAS DOING HER JOB and no one needed to cover for her.

At no point did she go down on Spock. Now that would have been one hell of a scene! Whoa! My understanding of “go down on” is where Uhura stopped the lift, did anything but chastely kiss Spock on the lips (which is what she actually did, nothing more), hands going his body, unzipping his pants, pushing him against the wall of the turbolift and then going down on him and sucking until there was no suck left… Iva, stop teasing people who have not seen the movie with the notion that they are going to see some real romping and bomping et al. That simply is not the case. Please keep your Spock/Uhura fantasies to yourself, especially if you are trying to suggest that your fantasies are what actually happened in the movie.

You should apologise for being the tease you are and for interpreting relationships by your own cheap standards. Actually I did not wonder who would get laid first. Who says that Uhura would be a notch on anyone’s belt, except you? Anyway, it is hardly an “old belt”.


78. FarStrider - October 21, 2011

@76 That’s not quite right. . .In TMP, Spock heard V’ger just before completing the ritual. . . the priestess did a mind meld with him, and discovered that he still had emotions.. .dropped the Kolinar symbol on the ground and told him that his destiny lay elsewhere. . . Spock never completed the ritual, and never went back. . .


79. Iva - October 21, 2011

@76 Craiger – October 21, 2011-

sorry for the wait, took me a while to find Gene’s writing on that scene :

““Spock, your thoughts. Open them to me.”
Spock could not refuse the High Master T’sai, not even at this moment of shame. As she touched him, Spock let his mind open, in the giving and receiving of mindmeld Oneness. Kaiidth! What was there was there, and it was T’sai’s right to learn the complete truth of it.
//The Klingons weren’t destroyed. It feels like . . . like they’ve become “wall exhibits in Hell.” And it’s headed for Earth. Spock, I wish you were here to help me understand.//
Spock looked up, puzzled. That had felt like Jim Kirk’s thoughts. And yet it was T’sai who was standing here and to whom he had opened his thoughts. She was now releasing Spock’s consciousness and retrieving her own. Then her lips opened, and before she spoke Spock already knew what her words would be.
“Your answer lies elsewhere, Spock.”””

80. Jack - October 22, 2011

75. A pretty decent argument.

81. Jack in London - October 22, 2011

PS. There were no strong female characters in Trek ’09. And, yeah, the “now that Quinto’s gay,” stuff is lame. Heck, the gay Sulu jokes are lame too.

I’d forgotten how much I dislike Dean Foster’s writing (ever since that Star Wars book 30+ years ago), it’s the reason I didn’t read the Trek ’09 novelization. He did write thé TMP book credited to Roddenberry, didn’t he? His Kirk and Spock didn’t sound like Kirk and Spock to me. Wow, I’m a negative jerk.

I thought the Vulcans looked fine in the last one, makeup-wise. I still don’t love Ben Cross as Sarek though. I’m kind of hoping he’s not in this one.

82. Aurore - October 22, 2011

Aurore – It’s been lovely hosting the French team among others (the USA had a team here as well), but you do understand if I yell “GO, ALL BLACKS! WIN IT! WIN IT! WIN IT!” As we say, we love having all of you here downunder to watch our guys win the Cup!

(I hadn’t noticed this part of your comment, before.)

I grew up thinking that the best rugby teams were from the Southern Hemisphere. And, speaking of the All Blacks, I always loved the way they would try to, I believe, “intimidate” their opponents, before a match (that’s how it felt, to me, anyway).

I Know my French(rugby)men will have to be on top of their game. They are good players. I’m proud of them. And, since to be the best you have to beat the best, all I can say is : que les meilleurs gagnent!

83. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 22, 2011

What the All Blacks do before a match is the Haka –


It is something, as a kiwi, I am used to seeing in being done in one form or another. It is also part of a ceremonial greeting for various dignitaries, VIPs, religious leaders (eg the Pope and Dalai Lama). Part of the culture here. It is all very *harmless. Often a haka may be performed at Auckland Int’l Airport in order to welcome some VIPs and other people of great mana. Probably freaks some first time visitors to NZ out though, if they are also arriving when this ceremonial greeting is performed…

*In recent times, the times that the haka was not so harmless was in WW2 when the NZ Army Maori Battalion were stationed in Italy and North Africa. When the enemy soldiers (Germans and Italians mainly) heard the Maori Battalion Haka from miles away, the stories went that the Nazi soldiers and others shit themselves and ran before they even saw the Maori!

84. Rusty0918 - October 22, 2011

#81 – Yeah, Jack, there really weren’t any strong female characters. Uhura was more of a “prize” for Spock than a character. The way she throws herself at him (going out of her way canoodling in the transporter room).

Frankly, I don’t really have faith in Orci and Kurtzman in the sequel regarding this. Personally, I’d put in a female chief of security (someone who wouldn’t wear those mini-dresses), as I mentioned before. Unfortunately, I’d expect more we’d get Yeoman Rand, who this new incarnation has a fake boobs, bubbly, and Kirk offers her the job as a step up from waitressing at a Hooters (or something similar). Not to mention she’d be even more annoying than the Grace Lee Whitney version.

85. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 22, 2011

No, Uhura was not a “prize” for Spock. She was a FRIEND for Spock. There is so much negativity surrounding a 30sec/1min canoodle on the transporter that it is actually insane. Sad and pathetic. So limited in understanding of how true strength can manifest sometimes.

“Unfortunately, I’d expect more we’d get Yeoman Rand, who this new incarnation has a fake boobs, bubbly, and Kirk offers her the job as a step up from waitressing at a Hooters (or something similar). Not to mention she’d be even more annoying than the Grace Lee Whitney version.”

In YOUR dreams, mate. In your dreams. Enjoy the fake boobs!


86. AJ - October 23, 2011

Spock with a human girlfriend loses something which has always been integral to the character as played by Nimoy in TOS. That is the ‘veneer.’ It is the iconic scene in “This Side of Paradise” where Spock tells the girl “If there are self-made purgatories, we all have to live in them” once his spores have worn off. It is his perceived utter inaccessibility to emotion unless he is in the company of Kirk and McCoy, and as manifested by his consistent rebuffs of Nurse Chapel, which are key to his make-up. Spock is also ‘more than’ betrothed to T’Pring to boot. Might as well have made him a Klingon.

87. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 23, 2011

No, he doesn’t lose anything. This is Spock at a younger age. How do we know that TOS Spock did not have a relationship with a woman like Uhura but it did not work out, which could easily give truth to the older prime Spock’s statement, “If there are self-made purgatories, we all have to live in them”. NuSpock is in the process of being/becoming. So is Kirk. The older nuDr McCoy is more “set” as to who he is or isn’t, and in as far as what he wants or doesn’t, or more likely, what he feels he can handle, at the point in his life when we (and Kirk) meet him.

Both TOS Spock and nuSpock seem less emotionally rigid than some of the posters here on this board. “Fascinating”, as Spock would say.

88. Iva - October 23, 2011

“This is Spock at a younger age. How do we know that TOS Spock did not have a relationship with a woman …….”

Because we know for a canon fact that he never had a friend before TOS age in his life, besides a pet.
And that it took him quite a lot of both effort (gross understatement) and time years-wise to deal with/accept having feelings of friendship in the first place, let alone anything else.
And when he finally did, it was still only one person that got that, James Kirk. The others being only co-workers. Bones being the second, on a much lesser level.

You might consider actually watching Star Trek, not just the Abrams movie, before engaging in this kind of discussion. It would help you a lot.

89. DeShonn Steinblatt - October 23, 2011


Nah, that universe doesn’t apply to this one in the least.

90. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 23, 2011

So, Iva, what kind of relationship did the TOS Spock have for his Captain Pike that he would disobey direct orders from Starfleet command in order to take his captain back to where he knew Pike would receive a far better quality of life, even though Starfleet had deemed that part of space as a “No go” zone? Mr Spock was doing this for his captain, despite the fact that he could have been endangering himself and his crew. Are you going to tell me that his actions were purely motivated by logic?

Have you watched one of the last scenes of Shore Leave, just before Spock beams back to the Enterprise to take command while Kirk takes some R & R? You might want to check out Spock’s reactions to the two women McCoy “thought” up for Spock, in spite of the fact that he knew that the women were manufactured by the sophisticated process of this very advanced kind of amusement park. Spock, of course, declined but…

I think it is safe to say that Spock may take longer to develop feelings of friendship, trust, love for another person but it has never been impossible and that has been demonstrated at the very beginning of the original television Star Trek series. Spock is not unlike a lot of humans, actually. Being bullied as a young child would not have helped Spock to feel safe either, however, his mother in Journey to Babel does recall how upset Spock could become, on one or two occasions, as a small child.

I am not really surprised that Spock, in the alternate universe, might find it easier to be acquainted with an intelligent human female than with anyone else, because probably the only person who had ever really understood, accepted and loved him, no matter what, was his mother, also a human female. Spock did not need or want Uhura to mother him nor did Uhura need or want to mother him. Besides, he had a mother, until her death, of course and Spock is no longer a little boy. He is an adult.

91. AJ - October 23, 2011

Keachick, I’ll consider your argument, but I still consider Spock ’09 as betrothed to T’Pring, and the attempt to bond him to Uhura as some kind of blah-blah script decision which was made for test audiences.

Why not make Gandalf a woman, or James Bond North Korean? Because they are not.

Spock is an iconic character in human popular culture. His character as created by GR + team, and developed by Nimoy over the course of 40+ years is far more important than any new version as ‘re-imagined’ by the boys currently, or the one we’ll see in 20 years’ time for the nexty-next re-boot.

I am just happy that ZQ is the current ‘Spock of record,’ because he actually gets it, bless his soul. LL&P.

92. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 23, 2011

A betrothal is an engagement, a promise to marry. Spock and T’Pring’s betrothal was arranged between Spock and T’Pring’s parents when Spock was seven years old. It was tradition among Vulcans. I am surprised that Amanda even went along with such nonsense.

In Amok Time, it was clear that T’Pring wanted no part of it and frankly Spock didn’t either. They felt impelled and T’Pring wanted so much out of this traditional Vulcan betrothal crap that she was prepared to see Spock killed by his friend and captain, James Kirk. People think she was a “piece of work”, however even Spock acknowledged her fine use of logic to get out of having to marry someone who really meant nothing to her. Spock was relieved to be free of this “betrothal” also.

If, in this alternate universe, nuSpock and T’Pring are “betrothed” as they were in the prime timeline, maybe both Spock and T’Pring have together decided to ignoring the betrothal which their parents had no business making in the first place. If T’Pring could spend her time with Stonn on Vulcan right under everybody’s noses, then why couldn’t Spock do the same, especially since he is no longer living on Vulcan?

93. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 23, 2011

edit” “decided to ignore the betrothal…”

94. Harry Ballz - October 24, 2011

The Sherlock Holmes sequel opens December 2011. The first one came out in 2009.

I guess some people know how to run on schedule.

95. Harry Ballz - October 24, 2011

Oh, and did I mention that the first Sherlock Holmes movie came out December 2009?

2 years for the sequel to arrive……right on the money! That’s the way to do it!

96. T'Cal - October 24, 2011

You are so right, HB!

97. AJ - October 24, 2011


My impression from the early mumbo-jumbo between Spock & T’Pring implies some kind of mental contact, and he clearly refers to her as “my wife.”

98. Iva - October 24, 2011

A telepathic link.

99. Harry Ballz - October 24, 2011


Personally, I think it would have added weight to the statement if Spock had referred to T’Pring as the “old ball and chain”!

100. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 24, 2011

#97 It appears that Spock didn’t know about Stonn or her preference and affection for him. Hardly a very strong telepathic link. Referring to someone as your husband or wife does not mean there is necessarily any telepathic link or what was a positive link is not there anymore. Also, the reality was that the link (whatever it might have been) between Spock and T’Pring had not been physically consummated. I suspect that there is divorce on Vulcan as well.

101. Harry Ballz - October 24, 2011

Gee, 100 posts for a thread about how a guy needs to “prepare” for playing Spock by getting a Moe/Three Stooges haircut and practice lifting one eyebrow.


102. Red Dead Ryan - October 24, 2011

Well, this thread has certainly raised a lot of eyebrows!

103. Harry Ballz - October 24, 2011



104. Red Dead Ryan - October 24, 2011


EYE carumba!

105. Iva - October 24, 2011

I think it might actually be a smart move, given that humans are (in popular culture always portrayed as) the superior race of the universe (and the general audience loves having their egos stroked), to make every other alien race conform to humans. And not just any humans, mind you – but the today’s American teen shining example of humanity.
You know, like Spock, Vulcans and Romulans, both looks wise, physiology wise, psychology wise and behavior wise. We can also go on to erase their culture and philosophy completely, and replace it with something one-dimensional and non related. After all, it clearly worked for the last movie. You might even continue with the degraded version of Kirk, it’s not like the character depth the original has has any importance anyway or adds anything to the original stories. Besides, building a character around the lowest common dominator means the majority will be able to identify with him. Like with Bella Swan.
And who cares that it goes to further straighten the shallowness Gene fought against for decades, makes no sense canon wise nor is it rationally explainable by the black hole incident. It’s not like people in general care about any of it anyway. Or are capable of noticing a difference between quality and sloppy writing in the first place.

106. Keachick - rose pinenut - October 24, 2011

Who says anyone is erasing anyone’s culture? T’Pring and Stonn were raised on Vulcan, were immersed in Vulcan culture and I doubt ever stepped off Vulcan, yet see how they were behaving and that is NOT according to the present team of Star Trek movie writers, nor JJ Abrams, but according to the writer, Theodore Sturgeon, the writer of Amok Time. Gene Roddenberry was very much alive then and at that point, taking a keen interest in the production of Star Trek TOS. Take it up with Theodore and Gene!

Honestly, really. Duh!

107. Iva - October 24, 2011

“….see how they were behaving”

Being logical about family life? How very un-Vulcan.

108. Daoud - October 25, 2011

So, where’s this imminent Star Trek sequel?

I don’t think waiting from 2008 (the reboot’s original release date Holiday ’08) to what looks like late summer 2013 qualifies for ‘imminent’.

More like unimminent. And uninspiring.

109. Iva - October 25, 2011

2013? … -_-‘

110. cd - October 26, 2011

91 – I’ll agree that Spock, as originally portrayed by Leonard Nimoy, is far more important than any versions since. I don’t understand how you mean Zachary Quinto ‘gets it’. It may be because of the script, but ZQ’s Spock was whiny and emotional; in a way LN’s Spock never was, nor never would be. For example, the scene where Spock is demanding to know how Kirk and Scott got back on Enterprise. Spock almost stomped his foot: “I demand to know”. Petulant and whiny. I can’t imagine Nimoy ever portraying Spock that way.

111. Bob - October 26, 2011

So he’s gay….who gives a shit?

112. Mr. "There are always possibilities" - October 26, 2011

Everytime I have watched ST:09 I have come away with this:



Mr. Abrams and crew picked a worthy successor to Mr. Nimoy. I am looking forward to seeing him grow in the role, as Mr. Nimoy did. I eagerly await ST:12.

And to those who say that Quinto was too “emotional”: watch “The Cage” and “Where No Man Has Gone Before”…….

113. cd - October 26, 2011

Concerning Spock’s emotions:
The Cage: a smile and “The Women!”: not petulant, not whiny.
Where No Man Has Gone Before: Irritation at Kirk’s chess playing: Spock handled it coolly, not whining about it. His admission about his feelings concerning Mitchell were heartfelt, again not whiny.
Nimoy played emotional layers, Quinto so far pretty one dimensional. That could be the script, we’ll just have to see if he gets any better.

114. Rusty0918 - October 26, 2011

#112 You’re right. We saw Spock smiling in “The Cage,” and Spock did have somewhat of an emotional part in “Where No Man…”

#111 I don’t

#105 – There’s a lot of concern I have with the sequel; mostly because of Orci and Kurtzman’s other sequel effort: “Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen,” which was vile, disgusting, and putrid. When it comes to Trek, is JJ just a Michael Bay stooge? Only time will tell.

Another thing is, will it matter? “Star Trek (2009)” was hardly a masterpiece, and that’s my opinion (which would get me burned at the stake by some of you). I liked it, but I’m weary. Will the critics give it stellar reviews even if it IS another “Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen?” Yeah I know that Transformers 2 got putrid reviews, but with the right kind of propaganda and brute force marketing and manipulation, they very well could get away with it.

115. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 27, 2011

“Access Hollywood is reporting one minor bit of information: the sequel won’t be called Star Trek 2 . At this point, speculation on what the title might be is just that…”

Just a tiny piece of info I just found… Titles a blogger thought might be a good – “Star Trek: The Wrath of Shatner” followed by “The Search for Doohan”…:)

116. Chadwick - October 27, 2011

Geekout over Spock much people, wow. Frankly they can write whatever they want for Spock at this point, its alternate canon.

Keachick (rose pinenut) I can’t believe how much you post, must have a lot of time on your hands.

117. Keachick - rose pinenut - October 27, 2011

That’s because I have 25 hours in my day, not 24 like everyone else…:)

118. Rusty0918 - October 27, 2011

#115 – Funny, I actually thought it WAS going to be called “Star Trek 2,” with no secondary title, and the 2 being an arabic numeral.

119. NuFan - October 27, 2011


You said that already. 400 times.

120. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 27, 2011

More tidbits – this time about Karl Urban


I assume “October 29″ means this Saturday, 29 October 2011. I wonder how long Karl will be there (I am assuming that the part is his). How might this affect his being available for Star Trek? Other bloggs do mention that he is reprising his role as Dr McCoy, but doing a whole new movie at this stage seems a little pressured/late?

Anthony – what’s going on? (not that I am panicking or anything).

121. George - October 28, 2011

Hey Guys,

Just wanted to say check out my new shop for cool Sci Fi T Shirts

122. George - October 28, 2011


Forgot to add the link

123. Keachick (rose pinenut) - October 28, 2011

What – no Star Trek t-shirts?
My son has a Sarcasm t-shirt. It is a blue shirt with large yellow wording SARCASM and in smaller white wording – Just one of my many talents, in upper case lettering. I got it for him – thought it suited him. He wears it all the time. The wording is much less aggressive.

124. SPOCK/UHURA FAN - October 30, 2011

Re: Uhura & Uhura/Spock

“Going down on Spock”,”pining damsel”,”comic relief”…

My, my. This sounds more like some AU cracked version of the movie distributed underground than the actual film to me. I really respect everyone having their opinions, but wow.


On another note: It seems to me that some people want to live in a self-created time bubble of the late 1960’s (our time).

@Keachick (rose pinenut)

Thank you for bursting that bubble, even if it ends up reforming itself.

125. Iva - October 31, 2011

The men fight the wars, the women take their clothes off and keep the beds warm. Reboot style.

126. Rusty0918 - November 1, 2011

#124 – I’m not dropping the pining damsel argument. But smearing me for it is immature. I am not living in a self-created time bubble.

The whole “I’ll be monitoring your signal” bit in the transporter room before Kirk and Spock beam down to rescue Pike and destroy the Narada does though bring forth the “pining damsel” argument. The article on Heroine Content about this raises the issue.

#125 – well, that’s a bit extreme, but yeah.

On another note:

This reports a rumor that the Klingons will be the big bads in the sequel. I have no problem with that, as long as they take a new angle and such on them. Better choice than Khan.

127. Polly - November 1, 2011

hehe it’s true pets look like their masters eh
(I mean it in a good way)

128. captain_neill - November 3, 2011

I want to apologise for a lot of my comments in the past, espeicaly the ones which might have been too unkind to the writers.

I look forward to the next film, even though this is not the way I like my Trek. I do hope for a good film.

129. The Masked Exhibitioner - November 4, 2011

I wonder if we can bash gays now that Anthony is no longer around to protect them?

130. AJ - November 4, 2011


Well, isn’t that just a wonderful thought?

If you are being sarcastic, use a winky-face at the end of a sentence like that.

If not, then the answer is “No, You Can’t.”

131. Spock/Uhura Fan - November 7, 2011

@ #126 – rusty0918

Uhura’s job is to monitor frequencies. So, all she basically said was that she was going to be doing her job. That’s not a ‘pining damsel’ to me.


It would be nice if no one bashed anyone. I hope all is well for Anthony and everyone else.

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