Watch: Cumberbatch and Quinto Reveal Into Darkness Villain Details + Chris Pine Talks Kirk Romance & More December 12, 2012
by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Spoilers,ST09 Cast,Star Trek Into Darkness , trackback
There are more MTV video interviews with Star Trek actors to share. Benedict Cumberbatch reveals some actual details about his villain character and Zachary Quinto reveals some more. Plus Chris Pine talks about whether or not Kirk has time for love in the new Star Trek Into Darkness. We also learn a bit more about Alice Eve’s character. Find out all the goodies below. SPOILER ALERT.
Cumberbatch: John Harrison is a Terrorist
Talking to MTV, Benedict Cumberbatch did some reveals about his character John Harrison in Star Trek Into Darkness, saying "he is a terrorist." And fueling to speculation he says "He has extraordinary physical powers, but also mental powers. He can sow an idea, which is as powerful as gunshots or close-hand combat, which he’s masterful in. He tears into the fabric of both the world and the Enterprise family, and he leaves behind him a trail of devastation. It’s quite exciting to watch.”
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Quinto: You Should Worry About the Lives Of The Crew
Zachary Quinto says "there is reason to worry" about the crew of the USS Enterprise because Benedict Cumberbatch’s villain is "entirely different" and there is an "insidiousness, a ruthlessness and a fierce intelligence" about him that "almost infiltrates and undermines the connectivity of the crew."
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Pine: No Time For Carol Marcus Hookup But She Does Help Save The Day
With the reveal that Alice Eve is playing Carol Marcus, Chris Pine was asked if he has a love interest in Into Darkness, and Pine said "so much happens, the action and plot is so fast, there really isn’t much time for Kirk do do anything but save the crew." However he did note that "Kirk loves a blonde" so there is some "flirting" at least. But more importantly, Pine revealed that Marcus’ "scientific knowledge" is a key to resolving the crisis posed by Cumberbatch’s John Harrison.
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Comments
Khan!
As a terrorist, this villain is also able to sow dissension among the crew. I like the term “insidious” as applied to him.
Not Khan! lol. But seriously, the more I learn about the movie the more excited I am to see it.
Detonate :)
Awwwww man! “He has extraordinary physical powers, but also mental powers.” Back to confusing the issue… I was starting to think he was just a former Starfleet officer or something. Why is May so far away???
Its NOT Khan
Dancing! Star Trek: The Musical. Haha. I love Quinto and Pine. They seem to play off one another pretty well.
“He can sow an idea, which is as powerful as gunshots or close-hand combat, which he’s masterful in.”
I love this quote! Very excited to hand my money over!
If Sybok and Khan had a kid.
Only 9 comments yet?
I Must install flash player :(
Not bothered who the villain is, it’s going to be immense either way. Worried about the crew? Chekov in red? …..
Look forward to all the crow eating to come. I hope they post as ferociously now as when they were claiming to be right.
No matter how great a villain Harrison will be he will pale into insignificance when compared to Ahdar Ru’afo, the man who was willing to engage in genocide just so he could look pretty.
(Ducking and running…)
:)
The only ToS characters that come to mind as successfully sowing dissension among the ranks with their powers of persuasion were Dr. Sevrin and Lokai.
This sounds…. badass?!
Ill say this for Star Trek it has me more excited than Man Of Steel from the one teaser alone! I’m a massive fan of ST and Supes but this looks more fun and not so dreary for crying out loud!
The first movie just plays like a demo reel of what is now possible for a ST movie. I hope this one is more involved and takes us somewhere.
As Spock said to the gatekeeper….
Why must your answers be couched in riddle?
Time for those who have the answers to get
off the pot….rather then sit there – pissing and
moaning about it all…The movie may sail but
it won’t soar majestically – we’d know that.
6.
Saying that won’t make it true! With the revelation about his physical and mental powers, it does sound even more like Khan….Also, the key point about ‘returning’. That’s central to Khan who returned in Space Seed. Mitchell etc did not return. And Khan was a terrorist, of sorts. Mitchell etc weren’t. Moreover, the glass-scene in the Japanese trailer screams Khan – pun intended. This sounds more than ever like Khan: the best single bad guy in Trek. Don’t ruin his legacy.
On Marcus, I just hope they don’t make her a feminist or her being a woman an issue. She should just be accepted. Unfortunately, in Trek 2009, every scene Uhura had was one where she was telling the audience she has a right to be on the ship: replace the useless communications offer, fluent in all dialetc, oral sensitivity, top student, etc. We know; we know. None of the other characters had to tell the audience that they actually deserved to be on the ship…..
“Sorry, this video is unavailable from your location.” :(
Sounds cool, though.
On a funny note if you read this page on an iPhone each video has the play icon over the actors face so they all look the same lol!
How could I have been so stupid?!? Obviously, the enemy is ROJAN of the KELVANS!!!
Guys, as always, sorry but there is nothing we can do about country encoding (or lack of mobile versions). Take it up with the publisher of the embed, in this case MTV.
Think I just hit my spoiler limit! o_O
My excitement for this movie has increased tenfold!
Thank you, Bob Orci, (and the rest of the SC) for giving us something new (and relevant to our times if what these interviews reveal is true). Telling an exciting, allegorical sci-fi tale is what Star Trek is all about.
I agree with folks in some other threads on this website that even if John Harrison is not an actual character from canon, perhaps the origin of his superhuman abilities is! I will have a huge geekgasm if the explanation refers back to something we saw in TOS.
15.
Dr. Sevrin and Lokai!
This film is going to use big, famous villains, not people even fans may have forgotten!
It’s going to be Khan, the Klingons, the Borg, a new villain or a combination.
This is going to be Kirk’s nemesis in the same way that the Joker was used in that other franchise, not the Penguin or the Calendar Man!
Interesting because I have been able to watch all three videos. Normally I can’t see MTV videos. They are a little slow in loading though.
I wonder if young son has signed onto MTV – hmmmm?
Love those actors and their interviews – cool guys. I can see similar happening between Quinto and Pine, as it did three/four years ago, when they were being interviewed together. Good and not so good. Zachary sure can talk…that’s all I will say.
“Sorry, this video is unavailable from your location.”
Can you not copy them to YouTube via TrekMovies account?
Not all Trekkies live in the US …
If its not available, don’t advertise it. #sighs
I can’t watch these videos. Apparently I don’t live in the God Almighty country of US of A. Its the %^$#@! Internet for Christs sake! Its a world wide thing, let me play the &^%$#@! video!!!
Sounds like Sybok. Ugh!
http://londonphile.tumblr.com/post/37800506681/thank-you-to-yassammez-for-sending-me-this-big
He does it.
God, Cumberbatch is so articulate and intelligent…
14 – LOL. well there was more to it than that, but yeah.
As for who it is. Seems like Mitchell has been all but eliminated. It could still be Khan, but I think doubtful. I think Garth is a better bet than Khan, but even that sounds not very likely at this point. I’ll be interested to see for what cause he is trying to fight for.
It could perhaps be Augment related I suppose (though not Khan) if he was superior mental and physical abilities. We don’t really know exactly what Carol Marcus’ scientific expertise is in, but the Genesis device would require a mix of physics, chemistry, and biology, specifically genetics I would think (which could come into play if there is an augment angle).
Also, you all are spoiling us with all this information now. I’m sure you can’t keep it up for 6 months and we’ll all go into withdrawal….
I got it… it’s not Khan, but another offspring of the eugenic experiments that spawned Khan. Thus, it may be argued that the character is “in canon.”
Why… all the descriptions of Harrison match those that might be applied to Khan… the physical and mental abilities, quest for vengeance (having been exiled as a ‘failed’ experiment) and something that’s alluded to here, he power of persuasion. Remember in Space Seed, Khan was able to turn an Enterprise crew member against Kirk. Also, one of the trailer depicts Harrison mentioning some type of generic cure… again, an apparent callback to eugenics and Khan.
If Harrision was more of a Gary Mitchell offshoot, surely we would have seen some hint of telekinetic powers at this point.
So, John Harrison can sow thoughts….he’s a Jedi?
‘Terrorist’ is such a popular synonym for ‘bad guy’ these days :-/
It’s one of the Eugencis Warriors — a descendand of Khan. We’re going to get a Khan-centric story here — mark my word.
And don’t be surprised if the movie ends with them finding the Botany Bay.
37 – If Cumberbatch uses the term “terrorist”, he has got good reasons for it. Believe me. He is enormously well read and won’t mistake a baddie for a terrorist.
@37. Terroist and bad guy are not synonyms. A bad guy is someone who steals your wallet and has and affair with your spouse; a terroist blows up your bank and takes your wife hostage. Big difference dude.
Sounds the Mule from Foundation
“WHO IS KHAN”? Carol Marcus in Wrath of Khan.
@ 20. alec – Chekov was also always proving his worth, the only one who could lock on to Kirk and Sulu with the transporters during their fall from the drill. And also being the only one other than Spock who figured out the Titan trick.
As for Uhura, I’d say she wasn’t trying to prove herself because she was a woman, but rather because she was sleeping with her teacher and wanted to prove that she got her grades and position on her own merit, not because she was sleeping with Spock.
I think he could techically be Gary Mitchell. In this is an alternate universe/timeline Gary Mitchell is probably not his friend and is not a crew member. Gary Mitchell didn’t have anything to be angry about either, no need for vengeance. He just became god like and couldn’t deal with it. What if Harrison is the crewmember that has the highest ESP abilities on the Enterprise and the same thing happens to him? Maybe the comic is accurate only in that the same galactic barrier exists. Maybe in this version the person who gets the powers has a reason for vengeance to go with it, unlike Mitchell.
Please enough with the Mitchell stuff — why we he be in Starfleet still with the name of John Harrison if he were Gary Mitchell, who is/was a Starfleet officer? It’s not like he can hide under a fake name — officers he served with and went to the academy with would recognize him.
The Mitchell thing is 99.99% dead now. Just like I predicted two weeks ago, with 75% of the people here not believing me. I TOLD YOU SO!
I’m starting to believe that he’s indeed an Augment. Not Khan, not one of Khan’s followers but a character that might have a history very similar to Khan’s. That would make perfect sense if you take into consideration what Kurtzmann, Orci and Abrams have said about the villain. An Augment who is a Khan-esque character but not Khan himself would in a way pay tribute to the original franchise and canon yet the character could still be as original as possible… or maybe I’m completely wrong, I just hope, that Harrison isn’t too much of a “comic book villain” and that there’s just the right amount of “trekkiness” in him…
I don’t mind this movie being dark, but I do hope it isn’t too dark. Star Trek was always intended to show a bright future, not a bleak, relentlessly gloomy Gotham City-like future.
Maybe Harrison was the captain of the Valiant, that first crossed through the barrier, this time surviving and returning.
With all the possibilities opened by rebooting and reimagining the franchise, BC could still be Khan, or Gary Mitchell, or Gary Khan, or anyone. Think way back to how Gene Hackman’s Lex Luthor didn’t take off his wig and become (in physical appearance) the LL we all knew until the very end of Superman: The Motion Picture. In the same way John Harrison might in many ways not “become” Khan (or G.M.) until the movie’s last act. With rebooting, all things are possible, and the film makers probably know that it’s the variations on what we expect that will excite/anger us — in either case, engage us.
@15
“Dr. Sevrin and Lokai.”
I know this isn’t the answer but I’ve been saying that for over a year. At least the Sevrin part. Would be funny for them to draw on one of the most reviled episodes (in most people’s minds, but me) for the movie. I mean, those space hippies almost took down the ship. Soonest, like he said. It starts to chime.
I keep throwing dollar bills at my computer monitor, but nothing happens. Why is it not May 2013 yet?
49 – It is Superman: The Movie… :)
“He has extraordinary physical powers, but also mental powers. He can sow an idea, which is as powerful as gunshots or close-hand combat, which he’s masterful in. He tears into the fabric of both the world and the Enterprise family, and he leaves behind him a trail of devastation. It’s quite exciting to watch.”
*sigh*
It’s khan. What a bummer. Is it too hard to come up with an original plot in Hollywood anymore?
The villain ” tears into the fabric of both the world and the Enterprise family, and he leaves behind him a trail of devastation….”
Sounds like my ex-wife.
#45 Please enough with the Khan stuff and enough with the I TOLD YOU SO.
I think that it is safe to say that absolutely anything can happen in the film and it could be explained just by saying “in the Original Series there was a ton of time travel and by the timeline being rewritten in the last film, any and all events can play out 100% differently… Even if they were put into motion before Nero emerged from the wormhole thingy.”
Which, to me, is 100% exciting. They can have their cake and eat it too.
Perhaps John Harrison IS one of Khan’s supermen…
The big reveal to me is that Cumberbatch is a “leader.”
What if he is just John Harrison but JJ is making him to be just like Bin Laden? He could be against Starfleet and The Federations policies so he decides to gather an army to wage war against them?
He could also use genetic engineering to advance his cause
Try this folks (if allowed). It is what’s circulating among the extra-US Cumberbatch fans… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ovFhw__etbI&feature=player_embedded
ME WANTY PICS OF NEW KLINGONS!!!
Hey MJ, i think that you are a very intelligent dude , but you must now admit
that Khan has nothing to do with the new movie….come on man!
Well, Khan has everything to do with the movie. Think about it. Khan really is another way to say con. And one who lies is a con. We know we have an admitted liar conning us about what is and is not happening in the film.
That’s right.
Beware the Wrath of Con, Bob!
Could this Harrison character be a vulcan/human hybrid (sans the vulcan ears)? I know I have mentioned this before. However, it may well explain the extraordinary physical and mental powers. Harrison has worked on developing these and/or he may have been born with them, but they have remained latent/dormant until later, after he has fully matured physically and mentally.
I speculate that John Harrison may also be of Vulcan descent, but brought up in London, Earth because he looked more human than vulcan (we saw how the young, more vulcan looking Spock fared on Vulcan – not well, ref. ST09 and TOS episode Journey to Babel). However, the destruction of Vulcan hit him very hard and he blames Starfleet for its seeming lack of preparedness.
I don’t know if there has been any record of any human being able to mindmeld with another. This seems to be very much within the realm of (sci) fiction/fantasy and when you consider it, the Vulcan (and likely, Romulan) ability to mindmeld is quite extraordinary. Both Spocks and Sarek proved themselves more than capable and even more when prime Spock was able to successfully mindmeld with a totally alien silicon-based lifeform, ie the Horta. Also Sybok, Sarek’s son to a vulcan princess, also had these kinds of abilities, without any kind of genetic manipulation or augmentation. Vulcans and Romulans are generally stronger than humans as well.
Anyway, that’s my take on what I have gleaned so far from the promotional material and interviews taking place since late November. It is quite possible to create a whole new character and not just recycle Khan and the Botany Bay, Gary Mitchell and others who have already had their episodes/movies of glory.
Gosh, I hope I am right about there being no Khan etc, even if I am not right about John Harrison’s heritage…
Nero committed genocide by destroying an entire planet. How can the stakes possibly get any higher than that?
That’s probably something J.J. should have thought about when he made the last movie. It will be in the back of my mind as we see Spock chasing Harrison through a space mini mall.
it does sound a bit like Sybok..he could will people to do his bidding and tak awa their pain by helping them face it… I wouldn’t have called him a terrorist in the sense of destruction, but he did come between the crew at one point…..he’s obviously not Vulcan, unless he was surgiclly altered, but whoever he is…Cumby (i really don’t like calling him that)..”I’m Cumby dammit and I want revenge!!!”….will play it well!!!
Why do you fools keep saying Cumby has pointed ears?
He doesn’t! Are you blind? Hahaha!!!
@39: Okay, I’ll go with your judgement.
However, let’s call him a frightening cool terrorist ;-) ’cause he doesn’t sound like a ‘regular terrorist’.
“For fear of being thrown in JJ Jail,” nice
I was hoping there would be some more characters from the 1966-1969 TV series. Carol Marcus is OK, but I would happier with Dr. Dehner.
Well, maybe in the third one we will get some Kor, Kang, Harry Mudd, etc., like characters.
Cumberbatch and Quinto can play brothers.
John Harrison does not have pointed ears. Even if he is a human/vulcan hybrid, he inherited the human shaped ears.
Mad Man
Why do you think there is no Mudd in this one? He might be supplying the terrorists…
This is such a microcosim of the U.S. Despite being presented with facts and logic, people will still cling to irrational beliefs and fantasy.
Human being sold out to Klingons who genetically alter him (al la augment); or, human captured by Klingons and experimented on; or human who willingly uses Klingons to gain super strength, etc, for his own cause.
Gotta keep the Klingons in the mix.
Rose, what if Starfleet works with the Vulcan Science Academy to create a hybrid to help repopulate the species and he turn on them?
Clearly the villain is Thelev.
From the Journey to Babel Wikipedia entry: Thelev’s mission aboard the Enterprise, Kirk and Spock presume, was to sow distrust among the Federation members and weaken the Enterprise (by killing Kirk) prior to the attack.
After all, Thelev was supposedly an Orion masquerading as an Andorian, so how much harder would it be for him to pretend to be a human? Not much.
In Journey to Babel the Orions wanted to disrupt the admission of Coridan into the Federation. In the new timeline, perceiving weakness in both the Federation and Klingon Empire after all the damage done by Nero, the Orions wish to further destabalize the galaxy and create new opportunities for trade in weapons and green women.
Chris Pine is so *coy* about what Kirk and Carol get up to when they are not doing the dance…could that be a clue? Kirk and Carol meet while dancing, perhaps doing a little dirty dancing…:) Geez, these guys must have some life outside Starfleet/work. Time to show and tell.
Rose, forget what I said earlier your idea in post #65 sounds good be wouldn’t that be just like what Nero did? The destrution of Romulas hit him hard also because he lost his wife.
so … Kirk still loves a blonde… a scientist blonde!
Well… Whatever… the villain is charming…
And Trek guys look AWESOME!
;-) :-)
Will Special K seduce the historian and turn her against the crew again? Maybe he will seduce Scotty and turn him against the crew. That would be some impressive powers of persuasion!
I also hope they aren’t redoing Star Trek V. I never did like how Sybok turned the crew against Kirk, Spock and McCoy against them with gettting rid of their pain.
#78. Rose (as in Keachick)
I’m curious about what boborci prepared to us… about Kirk I mean… Well, at least we know Kirk will be wearing a wet suit… lol
;-) :-)
Couldn’t have said this better myself… JJ has gone too far, and now he’s going to start pushing people away from the theatre.
http://io9.com/5967942/dear-jj-abrams-just-ing-tell-us-who-benedict-cumberbatch-is-playing-in-star-trek-2-already
Clue? Is there any empathy or was there any empathy for Khan? I never had any, he was a dictator a bully to me. In TOS anyway.
He’s not Khan, he’s not Gary Mitchell, he’s not Sybok and he’s not Ballok either, he’s John Harrison – now if he has been enhanced then that enchantment may have come from something explored in the prime timeline
This movie is going to be immense, I saw Man of Steel trailer and what a downbeat, dull trailer. This movie just seems so more lively and exciting and just so interesting.
Can’t wait
@85: No he’s not. Don’t be as ridiculous at this stupid rant article.
Re: 20 –
Uhura has “aural” sensitivity, meaning superb hearing, not “oral.” Though I’ve always thought they meant it as a double-entendre.
As far as all the villain back and forth goes it seems to me a few folks around here really need to take a step back. Why is it getting so personal? I think we need Counselor Troi to step in. Either that or phasers at 20 paces.
As for me, I don’t like the idea of a straight villain per se, and I’d rather not see Khan, but I do like the idea of a terrorist — topicality was always a part of TOS. What’s most important to me is a smart, emotional story and that the characters ring true.
Peace and Long Life, children.
Sound’s to me like John is an Augment. If he is Human then that is the only explanation.
88 – JJ says this film is for non-trek fans, if so… they don’t care if the bad guy is named ‘Bob Smith’… they want to know what the movie is about… to decide if they want to see it… it makes no freaking difference what the name is…. everyone here will go and see it… fans will go even if the entire cast stands in the middle of a big room and makes noises for two hours.
Everyone else.. wants to know what the film is about…
JJ is just messing with the fans, and laughing all the way, just like he did on Conan, and just like he is laughing right now.
It’s possible that John Harrison is revealed to be someone else by the film’s end.
@49. You forget the WNMHGB comic with Gary Mitchell. That rules what you are saying out. Orci had creative control over those comics.
#27. alec
Let me get this straight. You’re saying a new unknown character is less unknown than two preexisting characters that have become equivalent to unknowns?
Disinvited
That is always me reaction to people who say “X” can’t be in New Doctor Who because “the new fans don’t know X” and therefore some new foe has to be made.
I’m always like — well, if it has to be a foe you assume no one knows, it can’t hurt to do one some might know…. after all…
BC is someone whom Kirk recognizes on Qu’oNos. Perhaps they knew each other at SFA, and he is an augment, caught earlier by another ship, who enlisted and rose quickly through the ranks.
That GATT2000 guy looks more like a ‘Khan’ than Ben does, for sure.
LOL at idea that people won’t watch the movie because JJ won’t tell us who Cumberbatch is
I’m somewhat cautiously favoring the augment-but-not-related-to-khan storyline a bit. Cautiously because there is still so much unknown that there is a very good chance it is completely wrong as with all of our previous suggestions.
I also doubt the Botany Bay will make an appearance at the end. If it makes an appearance at all, it will be part of the movie with Harrison trying to wake Khan (I think unlikely). I doubt JJ wants to set up the expectation or requirement of creating a series where all Kirk does is fight off augments, however, if that indeed is what this one is about.
Sybok the worst idea ever in ST would never be rehashed into another movie!
Benedict Cumberbatch: ‘I am not playing Khan.’ http://www.accesshollywood.com/benedict-cumberbatch-im-not-playing-khan-in-star-trek-into-the-darkness_article_73762
Well that seems clear enough.
Zachary Quinto on John Harrison -
“there is an “insidiousness, a ruthlessness and a fierce intelligence” about him that “almost infiltrates and undermines the connectivity of the crew.”
If John Harrison is a vulcan/human hybrid, then he has something in common with Spock. He may use this to try to put a wedge between Spock and Kirk.
I am thinking about the picture of two hands pressed against *glass*. It is clear that posting this picture was meant to trigger memories of a similar scene from TWOK – not exactly hard, since most people appear to be obsessed with this movie and especially with Khan. Kirk met the pretty blonde long before he met Khan, so I fail to see why having Carol Marcus in the movie should necessarily have anything to do with Khan.
My best guess is that hands this side of the *glass* belong to either Kirk or Pike.
However, the immediate reaction was that the hands on the other side must be Spock’s because of the vulcan salute and the guy is wearing SF Science Officer blue. What if, however, the hands belong to John Harrison, who has managed to get himself promoted to Science or Medical Officer? He would be as capable as Spock of giving the vulcan hand gesture. I think everyone may assume that this scene takes place aboard the Enterprise. What if it is not?
There are lots of brigs and no doubt, medical quarantine facilities about on earth, other starships, space stations, colonies on planets… The hands could belong to almost anybody and be almost anywhere. It is not certain whether this person is confined to a brig or medical quarantine facility.
I am not sure I am playing this *game* properly. I’ve never been really good at a lot of games and, at times, not that good a team player either. Often not sure what the rules are supposed to be…oh well…
Isn’t it odd we haven’t seen even had a flash of Peter Weller? Or even an interviewer ask about him.
The more I read about the villain, the happier I am that all the Khan and Mitchel chat can be put to rest.
It seems we have a fresh story with a new adversary, an exciting adventure, and extreme danger!
… sounds like solid Trek to me! (good job boborci!)
(For the record I had placed my bet on the villain being Lt. Kyle!)
Remember when Talia wasn’t in DKR?
Yes, he could be telling the truth or not. Hard to know. It’s clear what he said, but not clear what is true.
Here are links I found to the interviews, for people who can’t watch the MTV ones:
Pine and Quinto: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xvv1qm_zachary-quinto-and-chris-pine-on-star-trek-into-darkness-will-someone-die-does-captain-kirk-have-a-l_creation#.UMj6_-R9LgE
Cumberbatch: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xvv0pd_benedict-cumberbatch-says-star-trek-into-darkness-villain-is-a-terrorist_creation#.UMj7AOR9LgE
Abrams: http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xvuzjk_j-j-abrams-calls-star-trek-into-darkness-villain-frightening-and-cool_creation#.UMj6-OR9LgE
To be fair to Bob, in the (What I like to call.) “Bob and Alex Save Christmas and Birthdays for Us All” thread Bob Orci did actually reveal that the lie he told was that he told a lie.
Mental powers? Sheesh…I’m back to thinking its The Mitch (Gary Mitchell)) again!!
27 alec I want to marry you
More ammunition for Khan. BC says his character is a leader. Of course, Khan was a leader of his superhumans.
Ok…..so my STID spoiler appettite has been whetted….the next time someone see BC ask him how does Sherlock survive the @#%$&% fall ? (Although I think I know)…..
@108. It’s funny how with every bit of info, a Khan-centric story seems more and more likely. What a difference a few days make — what a huge comeback for those of us predicting a Khan story!
@ 20 Your forgetting Khan did not have healing powers..this gut does. Foe christ sake forget Khan ..its not Khan. If it was it would be cheap and bad movie making .
Let me say it one more time Khan is ..done!!
“Foe christ sake forget Khan”
So the foe is Jesus instead of Khan? Huh???
100 Rose
If he was a hybrid then he’d be like Spock and have the ears. There it goes the hybrid.
Those were the hands of Kirk (against the light) and Spock (in the light, behind Kirk’s).
A brief check on Chris Pine’s hand shows you that’s his against the light, and it doesn’t make sense for any other vulcan or half-vulcan to make the vulcan salute slowly like it was a painful moment while Kirk falls. So it is Spock.
The thing is that they changed it this time, right before that w see in the trailer Kirk inside the radiation room. If you can’t do the maths here…
And Marcus being in the movie doesn’t necessarily mean Khan is in it, people only point her presence linking it to Khan because she’s one of many factors that add up to prove he’s the villain. If it was just her, no one would try to link her to Khan.
What do you mean with all the last two paragraphs I have no idea, maybe you should pay attention to the trailer, it could solve some of your “doubts”. Did you watch TWOK?
No time for Kirk romance due to the fast-paced current of the film…
Sounds like the crew are going to be running everywhere in this one, too.
Can you imagine Shatner’s Kirk having no time to get with the hot alien babe because he’s constantly running around everywhere? Shatner’s Kirk would have MADE the time. And then some.
Maybe Peter Weller is Khan and Benedict Cumberbatch is his padawan, Darth Harrison :-)
#27. alec
Also, in that other franchise Bane was used in the most recent installment even though THE BTMAN movie franchise had previously cast him into the one-note charicature obscurity of which you speak.
@99. Thank You, Classy M! It is NOT Khan!
~FS
Is it May yet? No? How about now?
#80 – Yes, anything is possible. I think the desire for vengeance is triggered by a very traumatizing event where what/who you may love most is taken from you.
If you add into the mix, a strong political/religious belief system that sees people and events in black and white terms, then you have someone hellbent on avenging his own personal loss, as well making the organization, ie Starfleet right again, by “separating the wheat from the chaff”, even it means “detonating Starfleet”…
“He can sow an idea, which is as powerful as gunshots or close-hand combat,”
So true.
Also, I’ve discovered that Khan IS in the movie. But he’s still frozen in his pod which Paxton is using as a coffee table in his office.
@117. I’m not surprised by his quote. He’s not Khan, but this is going to be a Khan-centric story.
@99 @117
HAHAHA
Benedict is incredible, he always does that, can’t you see?
He did not say “I do not play Khan”!
He said
“I play a character called John and not THAT OTHER NAME*”
And then proceeded to talk about how the main objective is to fulfill the director’s expectations and not the public.
Whoever the character ends up being (even if you insist on believing it’s not Khan), he will be modified from whatever the original base was.
(*my emphasis)
@122. Thanks razzo — you assessed this quote better than I did. He might actually be Khan himself still then. Either way, this is going to be a Khan-centric story.
dmduncan
I just watched the Cumberbatch interview clip.
Careful, dmduncan, I think Mr. Cumberbatch could challenge you for “eloquent bastard of the year”!
….and I say that with all due affection.
112. MJ “Jesus”
TOLD YA!
John…remember that Kirk calls his brother “hey Johnny!” when he’s steals the corvette…it’s Kirks brother!!! or whoever that kid Johnny was!
A couple of years ago, at a sci-fi convention I met Richard Hatch, the actor who played Tom Zarek on nuBSG among other roles. While I’m not a collector of autographs, I was so impressed with that show and his performance, i stopped at his table and he spoke with me and my teenage sons for about 15 minutes about BSG mainly. He told us that he played Zarek not as a terrorist but as a man who knew in his heart that he was right in his beliefs and he hoped that motivation shone through in his performance. Mr. Hatch acknowledged that the writers had Zarek commit the unspeakable act of murdering the Quorum, but he tried to play that scene with a sense of deep regret and distaste.
An antagonist that is sympathetic, intelligent, and has personal motivation that is far more than just evil for the sake of being evil is certainly more interesting and I hope JJA and BC pull it off. I”m getting excited about what I’ve read so far and can’t wait to see it.
@126 I honestly can’t believe there are people still insisting on this.
If there’s one thing they ACED in the 2009 movie was the casting of family/younger versions of characters.
Look at Chris Pine. Look at Chris Hemsworth. Now look at Cumberbatch.
There’s a reason why they decided to cut Johnny from appearing any more than that scene. Forget Johnny.
I bet they don’t find out he’s Khan until the last 5 minutes of the movie.
50 Andy Patterson
I had guessed Garth. But Sevrin now makes much more sense. As long as you take away the hippie nonsense. Technology gave him a disease so he has motive. He’s a carrier so he could be called a WMD. He wasn’t entirely human so he could have super strength. They could write him in as a starfleet doctor so there’s the uniform.
Something to think about.
#7
“Dancing! Star Trek: The Musical. Haha.”
Mel Brooks version of Star Trek: “T’Pringtime for Hitler.”
When I read the name John Harrison I immediately thought of John Harriman, captain of the Enterprise-B.
#120. dmduncan
If you didn’t steal that from FUTURAMA, you should be writng for them.
It must be tough for those guys not to be allowed to say ANYTHING.
I’m taking my hat off to them.
However, I am very curious what that JJ jail must look (and smell) like..
You know reading all the “theories” about the villain is making me insane. Some of you just need to let go and let the movie happen. As I read the comment thread, I was quickly reminded of William Shantner’s advice in the old SNL sketch: “Get out of your parent’s basement. Kiss a girl, for god’s sake! Get a life.”
124. Harry Ballz – December 12, 2012
dmduncan
I just watched the Cumberbatch interview clip.
Careful, dmduncan, I think Mr. Cumberbatch could challenge you for “eloquent bastard of the year”!
….and I say that with all due affection.
***
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyLdtG7KZvw
@127 Try to think of yourself as a head of a multimillionary company that will invest millions in a huge mainstream movie.
As soon as someone came up with that to you, your answer would be “Who the hell is Zarek? Is he big? In how many movies did he appear? What? How many episodes? Is he at least recognizable? I want something Loki big, don’t waste my time, come back when you have a decent villain. I want a movie that will make the public go ‘AVNGRS, WHO?’”
133. Disinvited – December 12, 2012
Don’t watch Futurama. Thanks.
#113 – “If he was a hybrid then he’d be like Spock and have the ears. There it goes the hybrid.”
Why would he have to have ears like Spock? That’s the point – being half human and half vulcan means that the person inherits traits, physical and mental, from both sides. Ever heard of dominant and recessive genes? In the case of Spock, the gene prescribing large pointed Vulcan ears was dominant in Spock, hence the pointed ears. However, I suggest that the genes that prescribe large pointed vulcan ears are recessive in this John Harrison character, therefore he has ears of a human. However, John Harrison may still have inherited the more Vulcan traits like strong mental abilities like being able to mindmeld, but that would not be written all over him in neon lighting.
As better half points out, guys tend to take after their father more and girls after their mother. Just suppose Harrison’s father is human and mother is vulcan. It would also explain his name.
Those were the hands of Kirk (against the light) and Spock (in the light, behind Kirk’s). A brief check on Chris Pine’s hand shows you that’s his against the light, and it doesn’t make sense for any other vulcan or half-vulcan to make the vulcan salute slowly like it was a painful moment while Kirk falls. So it is Spock.
That is just a complete assumption on your part. As I was trying to point out here and on other threads, these pictures actually show little of genuine fact. You assume that they are Kirk’s hands. More than likely they are but it is not a given. This was a still photo, so how do you know that Kirk falls? He is simply placing his hand on the *glass*. I can think of three possible places this could be showing – reactor containment area (TWOK scene reversed), brig or medical quarantine facility. There is no absolutely no way of telling which one of these he is in.
When Spock or other vulcans give the salute, not only does it mean “Live long and Prosper” but it is also a sign of respect. Prime Spock in TWOK did that salute to Kirk for both reasons and Kirk tried to return the sign of respect to Spock.
This is what is happening in this picture. Whether it is Spock or John Harrison, it is given as a sign of respect. If it is John Harrison in science officer blue outside in the light and either Pike or Kirk on the darker side of the *glass*, it means, even though they may be enemies, he still has respect for him. Not improbable or impossible at all.
I am speculating just like everybody else, but basing it on what the Supreme Court has chosen to reveal to us, and not on a movie that is 30 years old. Yes, I have watched TWOK…duh
122: Yes, it’s a fine distinction. BC is a master of the English language and you really have to pay attention to what he says. When you listen to him it feels more like a chess match than a mere conversation. Which makes him a phenomenal antagonist.
121: You may well be right, MJ, but Cumberbatch will make it his own. I haven’t forgotten that Benedict – or maybe it was his mum – described his character as ‘iconic’.) That’s not a term that comes to mind with John Harrison. Well, not yet anyway.
Has anyone looked here for clues? http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0708447/fullcredits#cast
136. dmduncan
Hmmmm, yes, I can see how that is a reasoned argument against my statement.
@141 Been there, done that. Welcome to the party.
What’s with all the Khan stuff? How many times do the actors, the director and the writers have to tell you that this isn’t Khan for you to finally get it?
@109 porthoses bitch — Oh wow! I have no freakin idea how he survived. They have me totally stumped! I can’t wait another year to find out…
break break
With all of the rumor swirling around CAPT April=Harrison, is it possible that this is a retelling of The Cage, in which April/Harrison (instead of Pike) is abandoned by Starfleet before re-emerging with Talosian-aided super powers?
The entire movie takes place in the mind of John Harrison who is a prisoner on Talos iV.
#95. Garth Faction, #130. Dilithium_doublebock
Thank you, for your support.
Lokai had powers too and, while not human, he and Bele had been at it for 50,000 years. You have to figure he learned a little something about infiltrating human societies and blending-in – if you pardon the pun.
139 Rose
You seem to be simply a fangirl. Dear, do you have any idea how RARE is Spock? Vulcans don’t go out having relationships with humans everyday.
Stop insisting in such a silly point with desperate forced reasoning.
It is not an assumption, dear, check Chris Pine’s hands, for heaven’s sake!
How can you be so blunt?
You CLEARLY don’t even know what we are talking about. Why do you mention the still photograph? What the hell does that have to do with the hands scene??
That scene, back in TWOK happens from different sides of a DIFFERENT room, not that still pic’s room, jfc.
Kirk and Spock are in different sides of the ‘wall’ of the radiation room, and one of them dies. That’s what happens there and will happen now.
No you haven’t watched TWOK, if you did you wouldn’t insist in such silly arguments that are dismissed by the very movie.
@144 That’s the thing. NO ONE said it.
I repeat. NO ONE.
Khan Noonien Singh, R.R.J.(Ruler of Rajasthan and Jammu)
rearranges to spell:
John Kennig Harrison
JOHNNNNNNNNNNN! JOHNNNNNNNNNN!
To Vulcanno #137:
Not sure what you’re getting at. It sounds like you think I want Zarek in the film but that’s crazy.
What I was saying was that if Harrison is written and played as a sympathetic character (like Zarek was in BSG) who believes for logical reasons that he’s right and others are wrong, he will have the depth to be a great antagonist rather than a one-dimensional villain. Nero was flat as far as bad guys go because his motivation was very weak and made little sense.
@149
Yes, because actually telling you the guy’s name means he’s someone completely different, amirite?
Definitely!
I don’t even know what to say about this sort of delusions you people are having.
Wasn’t the last movie about terrorism? Not that it isn’t a worthy subject to explore, but seeing as how the Dark Knight trilogy and many other films have used this angle over the past dozen years it does seem like a well-worn path at this point. Trek seems a bit late on this one.
Like having a Russian—a Russian serving with Americans!—on the bridge, isn’t it time to move on to other subjects?
Just asking….
Spock’s not going to die in this movie. Not even a little bit.
Interesting about Cumberbatch’s character being insidious, persuasive and undermining the crew. Briefly noting that Khan was good at that in “Space Seed,” let’s make the point that a guy who goes around saying “you have been told that your worlds are safe, this is a comforting lie” might thereby have the ear – so to speak – of someone whose planet was utterly destroyed a year earlier. ;)
#141 BCIsNotKhan
I have and I’m still puzzling over what an obsolete role of “meter maid”, i.e. non-gender neutral job title, is doing in a script that takes place in the 23rd century? Even weirder the actor credited is male.
@ 45 MJ – this is not the case but what, you don’t think they have advanced methods of altering someone’s face in the 23rd century. If he wanted to change his appearance it would not be an issue.
I think John Harrison is a Talosian giving Kirk and crew the illusion that he is human. In the ‘Cage’ Vena did say that the Talosians planet had been destroyed by war. In the synopsis, it says Kirk and crew go to a ‘War Zone’ planet.
This enemy is “entirely different” (Quinto’s quote) than any the crew has faced in the past.
Pretty much another nail in the coffin against the antagonist being a TOS canon villain, folks…
No Khan, no Gary Mitchell. New character by the name of “John Harrison.” Possibly an augment, but not definitely so. Definitely a terrorist of some kind.
So…any flat-earth Khannabes still left? ;-)
@149 razzo
Cumberbatch said it:
http://www.accesshollywood.com/benedict-cumberbatch-im-not-playing-khan-in-star-trek-into-darkness_article_73762
Pegg said it:
http://trekmovie.com/2012/05/29/simon-pegg-reports-about-cumberbatchs-star-trek-sequel-character-a-myth/
… you can take your fingers out of your ears now…
151
I meant ”Zarek” as any John Doe, or John Harrison.
Which means I disagree with you.
Also Nero was just an excuse to play with time-travel and jumpstart the series in an alternative reality ad not have it bound to the previous films and episodes.
# 156
Pointed~
But Vina said the Talosian war ended thousands of centuries ago. That wouldn’t make it any more of a ‘war zone’ than dinosaurs are a current traffic hazard….
He’s not a Talosian, he’s not Gary Mitchell and he’s not Khan. Bob Orci already said that his bit about the villain being a ‘canon character’ was possibly a lie.
#148 – Go put it where the sun don’t shine, you rude twat and I am NOT your *dear*.
Don’t tell me that I have not seen what I clearly say I have seen and many times for what it is worth, which is right now, not worth much.
Yes, I do know how RARE Spock is. So is kakapo RARE, because less than 100 of the birds exist on the entire bloody planet. Rare does not necessarily mean, one and only one. At least, understand the words you use.
Nothing has been confirmed about who is in front or behind the *glass* or where it is exactly. Kirk was standing in a corridor in the trailer that just preceded the picture of the two hands.
My suggestions are as good as anyone’s, which is not saying much really. You appear to have made few if any suggestions about who John Harrison might be, just rubbished someone else’s.
Go shove it!
http://www.trekbbs.com/showthread.php?t=196981
It seems that BC will be playing Capt. April and for some reason he will have his venegance! Maybe in course of the JP Trailer glass scene?!?! The Guy of the original article also told a year before or in 2007 about the 09 Movie!!! And he was damn right :) But look by yourself especially in course of April’s Bartling gun !!!
its vejur in human form
http://m.hitfix.com/motion-captured/a-day-at-bad-robot-gives-us-a-better-look-at-star-trek-into-darkness
The original article !!!
@149. razzo
Actually Simon Pegg has said it & if you click one of the links above Benedict Cumberbatch himself has said it in a new interview!
And Peter weller playing Admiral Marcus
@152: He did not say the character name, and you have to add that to the fact that no other major representative of the series said thet Khan will not appear, will not be the villain or not be BC’s character.
@158: Did you just send me the same link the deluded person posted a few posts above?
READ THE INTERVIEW.
He DID NOT say he doesn’t play Khan.
And do you even know how to read?
Simon was saying, in the same interview
“It just spoils the film,” he complains. “It masquerades as interest in the movie but really it’s just nosiness and impatience. You just want to say, ‘Oh f— off! Wait for the film!’”
He was ANNOYED by the speculations, and it is Simon Pegg, why would you take him for source? He’s awesome but don’t take his word for gospel, he likes to be sarcastic.
#141. BCIsNotKhan
My bad. I thought you were pointing to the sequel
In THE NAKED TIME episode there is a Dr. Harrison which ties in better with offering to cure the girl.
147 Disinvited
You are welcome. I have this kind of debate with my Doctor Who friends all the time (I’m more of a Doctor Who fan than Star Trek, but I still am more of a Star Trek fan than the average person).
With this being a reboot, one of the things people need to realize is this: the same people, more or less, are going to be out there. They will be different, to some degree, because the events in their lives will be different, and yet — they will still be there, the same essential persons, and many will likely cross paths with Kirk and crew. I don’t see why bringing them back hurts anything, if done well. Obviously if it is all pastiche, that’s one thing – but if it is a new way to deal with interesting characters in the past, I’m all for it.
And it’s reasons like this Garth really attracts me as an option.
At this point, Chekov is being played for the accent gag because his character doesn’t have the political significance that he had. I’d like to see a Middle Eastern character, and the same or another character who is actually religious. Maybe an observant Sikh? He’d have the stigma of having the same last name as Khan, plus other challenges. Starfleet allows Bajorans their earring and allowed Worf his sash, so how about the turban, beard, dagger, and bracelet?
@166 Read my last comment on Simon.
And r e a d the goddamn interview.
NO, BC DID NOT SAY HE DOESN’T PLAY KHAN.
Stop it, you guys are starting to look desperate.
158 — being different from what the crew has faced — doesn’t put the nail in the coffin for anyone. This could mean the new Trek crew, in the new universe, have not experienced someone like him, or, if they mean the whole of the Trek universe, then it could still be someone from the TOS who has added features.
@168
Hah, sunshine, you really should take a deep breath and fend off the epileptic trees.
You screaming and pouting won’t warp reality.
I want Cumberbatch to be Khan and for him not to die at the end of the second film. I’d be much happier if he was also involved in the 3rd in the trilogy.
@174: Are you serious? I can’t believe you choose to ignore the facts, but okay, if that makes you happy.
What facts? XD
Of course they have to deny it’s Khan at this point because some of us may have actually figured out the truth about that scam. If they want to surprise anyone in theatres, they simply have to negate any references to Khan. You wouldn’t give away your villain’s true identity if this ID is the very core of the mystery the film’s based upon!
The name “John Harrison” is so unimaginative and dull it has to be a disguise. The writting’s on the wall. He will revealed to be someone else, most likely Khan or any other name from TOS canon. There IS a major revelation about this character’s identity and it’s certainly not “John Harrison”… Someone really important will RETURN, someone who has been on Star Trek at some point and someone who not only die-hard fans but also general audience will recognize. Otherwise the “anouncement teaser” doesn’t make any sense…
People expect someone from Trek lore to return… it’s clearly stated in that teaser’s voiceover directly adressing the audience. Your casual terrorist named “John Harrison” would be a laughable excuse for a big return… it has to be someone we are familiar with, either from popular Trek lore or maybe even from real-life history. Jesus? Hitler? I don’t care… but “John Harrison” is a hoax.
“Who are you?” that father asks…and he smiles. There would be no point in that if he only was an average augment or renegade Starfleet officer named “John Harrison”… What would be the point of his RETURN then? It simply doesn’t compute…
But then, on the other hand, they screwed up the final episode of “Lost” as well… are they really giving us another Tom, Dick and Harry nobody cares about, no matter what his motives or origins are? If so, this would be a HUGE let-down… There are about 20 really worthwhile TOS villains and plots to be revisited and they come up with an average augment called “John Harrison”??? Really? Nope. I don’t believe in that until the closing titles role…
@177: Oh, so you don’t even remember what you started this discussion over? Uh, your problems are serious. Good luck.
Sometimes I think you only see Khan, Mitchell or Garth as the villain ….
But maybe finding the truth is not in your interests!!!
Most probably Robert April is the villain and will do his revenge to Pike or/and Kirk! And maybe it’s Pike saving the day by his own death! You see at the beginning the Memorial Speech and the Aircrafts in missing Man Formation …
Another evidence of April … He and his wife have as i don’t know exactly something with her ages as mentioned in an episode about aging backwards so how he can help the little girl which is aging presumeably!’n
@172
Look I agree Khan or another Augment is the nost likely ‘Secret Identity’ for this guy I’m just pointing out Simon Pegg did say “It’s not Khan, that’s just a myth” and BC has just said “I play a character called John and not that other name”.
See, I have read the interview!
Did anyone read Hitfix article about the Bad Robot day? Finding an open production book in the room open to a page which had that massive gun Cumberbatch wields in the trailer. According to mr. Mcweeny at Hitfix the gun was labeled ” Aprill’s Gatling gun”. Could Cumberbatch be regenerated young Robert April? He’s British. And Weller is old April? The theory was interesting. I now can type “Cumberbatch” faster than my own name!
@179: Oh, I do remember. Let me put it this way:
You think your speculation is safe?
It is an illusion.
It’s all just speculation, really. And none of you people have any fact whatsoever to support your Khan, your Gary Mitchell or your whatshisface theory. Just speculation. There are no facts in this.
The facts are: pretty british boy is playing a pretty terrorist named John Harrison. Boring name. So are all of yours.
Here’s what we know.
1) Cumberbatch plays a character named John Harrison.
2) John Harrison comes from Star Trek Canon.
Period.
This means, it’s NOT Khan. NOR Gary Mitchell.
We have been told by the powers that be, that the character’s name is John Harrison. That means it’s not Khan or Mitchell pretending to be John Harrison, or using John Harrison as an Alias. The ONLY way it can be Khan or Mitchell is if those characters literally changed their names — something along the lines of: “Stop! Don’t call me that, my name is John Harrison, I am no longer Khan Noonien Singh.” And the likelihood of that phrase, or something like it ever coming out of Khan’s mouth, or Mitchell’s for that matter, is pretty unlikely.
So there we have it. Unless Orci is lying (and he never lies).
So to solve the riddle of what character John Harrison is from canon, we most likely have to look at characters who either changed their names (permanently), or characters who could take on the identity of John Harrison, without it being claimed they were merely character X impersonating Harrison. Or we literally look for characters named Harrison, and so far the only direct connection from Canon seems quite unlikely. So that leaves chracters with the name John, where no last name was ever given. It also leaves offspring and relatives of characters from canon, which I consider a cheat, but nevertheless possible. Tink Ben Finney’s daughter. Perhaps a character that was mentioned had a child, brother, etc., but never named? And now that relative wants revenge?
If you want to understand John Harrison, perhaps you need to think of Richard Brook
181: Yes you did, congratulations.
What exactly is your point, though? You just repeated that BC did not say he doesn’t play Khan, and Simon was annoyed and in a “You just want to say, ‘Oh f— off! Wait for the film!’” mood, making his statements basically that.
What I’m saying is that when they go to such extremes as to not even MENTIONING a name, you cannot deny there is a reason for such.
And that there is no major representative’s statement that declares Khan will not be in the movie, not be the villain or BC’s character.
@183 Oh my God.
You’re so childish. Why do you keep insisting on avoiding facts?
I’m honestly too tired to search for my previous posts in other recent articles to ctrl v/ctrl c it all in your face. If you want, feel free to search them
By now, I’ll let you be happy.
Go on believing on whatever makes you feel better.
I’ll ask you to apologise later, “Boring Vulcan”.
@178 Smike,
“There IS a major revelation about this character’s identity and it’s certainly not “John Harrison”
THIS IS EXACTLY RIGHT!!
This is exactly what will happen and you’ve phrased it perfectly, something no one else of which I a, aware has yet done.
The character’s IDENTITY is a MAJOR REVELATION … NOT his NAME!
And this is more or less what I was getting at in my usual long-winded fashion.
And I think this is exactly what Kurtzman was alluding to about finding some way to make this fresh.
I believe the hope is that we will all be dumbfounded when we are presented with, or figure out, John Harrison’s connection to canon — and as you suggest it will be something major, which none of us have figured out yet, or come close to I’ll bet.
All this Khan stuff surely has to be a smoke screen, homages to the TWOK as that was the second of the Prime films, just like this is the second of the Abrams films. Because if it’s not, then they have lied to us. Perhaps justified, but lied none-the-less.
Cumberbatch plays John Harrison, but his name is not important, it’s his identity that counts!
“We have been told by the powers that be, that the character’s name is John Harrison. That means it’s not Khan or Mitchell pretending to be John Harrison, or using John Harrison as an Alias.”
How do you know that for sure? If some of us had been right about that “alias” thingie, they certainly wouldn’t admit it prior to the movie’s release in order not to spoil the audience. No, they would openly deny any connection to Khan or any other potential villain from TOS / Trek canon. Nolan wouldn’t have revealed Miranda Tate’s ID either…
JJ, Bob and BC may say what ever they want at this point. It may be the truth or it may be an attempt to desperately protect their secret because they have just been outsmarted by some fans about the truth behind “Harrison”… In their position, would you come out and say: “Alright…those geeks at Trekmovie are really clever. They’ve unmasked BC’s true ID…Let’s finally admit it’s Khan!” Really? I don’t think so…
@183 just read #178
@187
Why are you always so angry?
Anyway, yeah, let’s wait for the film, I’ll let you apologise then.
Nice touch with the name calling, btw. Not childish at all.
148. Vnn
“If he was a hybrid then he’d be like Spock and have the ears. There it goes the hybrid.”
???Are you serious Vnn?!? You sound like you haven’t met many people in families of mixed “races”. Even in “non-micegenated” families the children can and do have a variety of features. There goes nothing!
“139 Rose
You seem to be simply a fangirl. Dear, do you have any idea how RARE is Spock? Vulcans don’t go out having relationships with humans everyday.
Stop insisting in such a silly point with desperate forced reasoning.”
Again- ????? I’m sure Rose can/has/will defend herself quite well but Vnn YOURS is the forced reasoning here.
And Rose (as in Keachick)-
Dominant and recessive genes?? Sure, but we’re talking about fictional characters, a fictional race, and ALL at the whim of writers of fiction. ANYTHING is possible in fiction.
I must say people are warming to the possibility of SYBOK! Heh heh heh. I did not predict that character and I didn’t and don’t expect him. I only hope for it and think it would be very very cool. For reasons I’ve stated before and will again, in the future. Right now I’m hungry. Time for dinner.
“and as you suggest it will be something major, which none of us have figured out yet, or come close to I’ll bet.”
Actually, I do believe we’ve already figured it out at some point. So many possibilities have been explored over the last couple of days that I cannot believe there is any option left that hasn’t been mentioned yet. We know Bob is around this site regularily and we’re giving them a hard time hiding the truth from us.
This may even be the reason behind these denial statements recently given. I read it as a desperate attempt to bury the truth that may have already been revealed online incidentally by someone. And I’m not saying it’s me.
@178: I don’t think it’ll go as a let-down like LOST’s end. This time they’re not messing around in TV, a LOST episode wouldn’t cover half the paycheck of a main actor of this new movies. There are more people interested in this movie not being a let-down, it’s quality will probably gonna be taken very good care of.
I think it has already been mentioned in some other threads, but that boy in ST09 being passed by young Kirk in that Corvette, wasn’t he called “Johnny”? He has some resemblence to BC… Could he be Kirk’s brother? He would be considered Trek canon… and perfectly fit the “family issue” stuff…
192 crazydaystorm
Yes, Rose can defend her/him/itself.
But anyways, speaking of mixed ethnicities doesn’t equal to speaking of mixed “races”.
Race can be used to distinguish Vulcans and Humans.
Ethnicity is a variant of phenotypes within a race.
Using a mixed-ethnicity example to talk about a mixed-race one does not make any sense.
Spock is a mixed-race being, and his physical traits are most likely a fix pattern.
And I fail to see what exactly is your problem with the second quoting that you did.
@148, Vnn,
I find your language towards Rose condescending and sexist. Clean up your act!
Hey, stubborn Khan believers, this is how you do it.
*chews up her humble pie*
I was wrong about Cumby playing Joachim, but I’m excited to see exactly who this Harrison person is.
I’m also pleased that JJ said he went out to make a quality film first, and THEN a trek film.
That’s how it should be.
Being slavishly devoted to canon is why so many adapted films fail.
“I was wrong about Cumby playing Joachim, but I’m excited to see exactly who this Harrison person is.”
Huh?
@145 spoiler
Look for the scene that means nothing……..for it tells you everything….
Now back to our regular scheduled show………
Is anyone else thinking Raiders in the prolouge of Kirk running thru the high red grass ?
Yeah, It’s been confirmed that he’s not playing Khan or Joachim or Gary Mitchell…
http://news.yahoo.com/benedict-cumberbatch-im-not-playing-khan-star-trek-212619493.html
He’s Harrison and that’s not a red herring.
I swear some of you are going to see the movie find out the Villain is not KHAN, and swear that we will find out in the third movie that it really was KHAN all the time. Give it up people it is not KHAN, that ship has sailed
@200
YES!!! :D
Back when Orci was asking for suggestions I did say it should have an Indy in space kinda’ feel.
Other suggestions have also been confirmed (opening with a cool adventure set-piece a’la bond, making sure the villain is better developed etc), which just tells me that the writing/production team has impeccable taste. ;)
Now, I can only hope the film lives up to the hype or dare I say it?…
Surpasses it AND we get extended canon and backstory on the level of the Lord of the Rings series for the worlds and races inhabiting Trek at that official website.
My geeky brain lives for that kind of minutiae!
#180
I’m leaning that way…but my husband demanded I stop theorizing.
@201 No offense meant by this, but you are not really paying complete attention then to EXACTLY what is being said in these quotes/info.
196. Vnn
“Spock is a mixed-race being, and his physical traits are most likely a fix pattern.”
?!?!??!!?? You say this based on what? I can’t, honestly can not, believe you are serious. Do you realize there is no evidence, scientific or otherwise, to support what you’re saying. I have to believe pulling my leg or just plain trolling. If not….???
I’ll right now give you credit and assume you’re pulling my leg. Ya got me. ;-)
@205
Hahah. *sigh*
I do admire and boggle at your stubbornness.
Just promise me one thing, when it IS confirmed, with finality that it’s not Khan will you come back here and eat your virtual humble pie, good sir?
197 MJ
How exactly? If you mean the use of “her/him/itself”, it was used with the opposite intention of not offending the user by assuming it’s a woman just because the name is Rose. Some people can be touchy about it.
I’d appreciate if you didn’t accuse me of being any -ism.
#196 – It’s herself to you.
You talk as much nonsense as you claim I do. How do you know that his physical traits are most likely a fixed pattern for all human/vulcan hybrids?
It is also likely that certain biological principles apply in the 23rd century, just as they do, just as they have always done, hence humanoid people (not just humans) having dominant and recessive genes. These occur in everyone, whether they belong to the same family or someone of a completely different race.
Although it might be hard to see, but a black and white person will have children where, in one child where the fairer gene is dominant, they will not look as dark as a sibling where a dominant gene for darker skin colour is present. The difference might be subtle, but it is still there.
Therefore, it is just as valid for one human/vulcan hybrid to be born with large pointed ears and another not to have large pointed ears. Are you saying that one race (vulcans with their larger ears) would automatically dominate genetically speaking over another race, in this case, human? I’ll answer the question – perhaps, at times, yes, but not all the time. Nature is not that stupid…
@193 Smike,
“Actually, I do believe we’ve already figured it out at some point. So many possibilities have been explored over the last couple of days that I cannot believe there is any option left that hasn’t been mentioned yet.”
With all due respect to everyone posting at Trekmovie, I think this is a pretty smug statement. Every idea I have seen, and believe me, I have read a lot of doozies, they all strike me as being incredibly OBVIOUS.
There is little or NO OUT-OF-THE BOX THINKING going on here (as alluded to by Kurtzman), including from myself. And a lot of that is likely because they gave us the expectation it might be Khan and Gary Mitchell by many of their comments early in the development, right up to the “leaks” we’ve been hearing during and after filming.
All I’ve really seen here is obvious bigger-than-life villains from TOS suggested as the antagonist of this film. We’ve been thinking like Nicholas Mayer adapting Khan from Space Seed to TWOK, rather than thinking the way Orci and Kurtzman think. Which really isn’t our fault considering that’s really the only adaptation of a Trek villain to the big screen we’ve seen, short of First Contact, which sort of did the same thing.
But I refuse to believe Orci and Kurtzman are going to go back to that same bucket of ideas from which to drink. Their style is more to hold up a prism to that bucket and follow an tangential idea which radiates from the splintered spectrum produced by the otherwise obvious.
All I can say, is if you truly believe that John Harrison is really an alias for Khan or someone else, then you are not only short-changing yourself, but Orci and Kurtzman as well. And if that’s really what they have up their sleeves, then it’s going to be really dissapointing after ideals they’ve espoused.
However, I’m going to look at this from another less hackneyed angle for new clues, since the direction everybody else has been going has run its course. I mean seriously, if this is a game, and the journey is the reward, which is more fun: to keep trying to squeeze a Khan peg in a John hole, or look for another solution which fits perfectly?
@200 porthoses bitch
Yes, it looks like a scene from Raiders of the Lost Ark and a homage to Butch Cassidy And The Sundance Kid when they jump off the cliff.
@Seriously, why would someone say this in this way:
“I play a character called John and not that other name.”
He’s “called” John.
See!
BTW, yes, I will eat humble pie and virtually kiss everyone’s feet if the movie is not a Khan-centric story. :-)
@210 “All I can say, is if you truly believe that John Harrison is really an alias for Khan or someone else, then you are not only short-changing yourself, but Orci and Kurtzman as well. And if that’s really what they have up their sleeves, then it’s going to be really disappointing after ideals they’ve espoused.”
I recommend you start psyching yourself up to be disappointed then. :-)
206. crazydaystrom
Are YOU serious? Do you know anything about the words you’re using?
Do you think I would lay a genetics lesson in a random post on the internet just because someone is having issues with what I write?
Try to do it otherwise, if you’re so absurdly interested in proving me wrong, show me evidence that I am wrong.
You seem to have enough time to waste over this, anyway.
209 – Rose
Okay, as I said to the other uneasy fellow, I will now lay a full free lesson in genetics for you guys.
If you’d like to prove me wrong, then educate yourselves enough to do it with real arguments.
Saying “you can’t say this”, “you can’t say that”, “this doesn’t make sense” simply doesn’t hold up if you don’t have anything to prove it.
*not
**I will not lay (…)
#214. LOL :-) wtf?
If you are trying to pretend you are knowledgeable in this area, It’s not very convincing, my friend.
195. Johnny had blonde hair. http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/George_Samuel_Kirk
They dyed BC’s hair black.
218 k7
Well, then it’s a good thing that what I am or am not doesn’t depend on what random internet people, like you, think of me.
This past September, in the BBC1 live Tv program ‘One Show’ (xx-Sep-2012), Benedict was asked about the identity of his character in the Strak Trek movie –while, at the same time, one of those leaked pics from the shooting was being shown on set on a screen–.
Look at Ben’s reaction and answer… and the way he SMILES after that:
Min. 10:46, and specifically min. 11:06 !!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BH4VFNbPXmE
Now, tell me…
This man is pure intelligence, wit, cleverness and… charm.
It’s not surprising he is equally great at drama and comedy, play superbly an angel or an evil, a vulnerable being or a commanding, imposing person…
Whoever the ‘villain’ he is playing in ‘Strak Trek Into Darkness’ it will be epic in his hands and will bring a new dimension to the franchise, dramatically and cinematically.
I can’t wait to see him in STID, his Julian Assange, his Brian Epstein, his ‘Little’ Charles Aiken, his Smaug…
@219: Thanks for the link, it not only shows the hair thing, but make it clear the status of the character itself, from their creative perspective.
I hope people drop this Johnny thing once and for all.
@208. Vnn, spare me your platitudes and pontificaion trickery.
I call it like I see it. Your comments towards Rose were sexist, personally insulting towards her, and unnecessary.
“I don’t know how to define pournography, but I know it when I see it,”
– Potter Stewart, US Supreme Court
@221: Yes, he is a fantastic actor and an intelligent bloke, but calm down with the fangirling.
Also, did you wait to post when your post would make the 221º one?
223 MJ
What are you talking about? Stop accusing me of -isms.
If you have a prejudicious view on what other people write, it doesn’t mean they have the intentions you THINK they do.
A NEW interview of Bendict: Meet the New ‘Trek’ Villain: Benedict Cumberbatch
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wFmr1GuZLY
(Original source: http://www.etonline.com/movies/128105_Meet_the_New_Star_Trek_Villain_Benedict_Cumberbatch/)
@225. Nice try!
Next?
@ disinvited
You’re welcome
Few of these bullish guess posts lead me down a surprising path.
#221- you nailed it! Whoever Cumberbatch plays will be epic! He seems to be making his way into all my fandoms. Next thing, he’ll make an appearance on the Simpsons! Wait! What!?
^^
few of these VILLAIN posts
@226: Thanks for the video!
Freaking Cuberbatch!!
Check this out, in the interview, it goes like:
Interviewer: …everybody is speculating, is it Khan?
Cumberbatch: I LOOOVE SPECULATION! *goes on about how speculation is awesome and a part of mvie culture and important and etc. *
214. Vnn
OK
@224
1– I’m not fangirling. Come on… The man is purely and simply Mesmerising (!!)
2– Because of the shrlockian number 221B? No. LOL. Pure coincidence.
I’ve not been the one who has been saying “you can’t say this” or whatever. It has been you who has rubbished my notion that John Harrison could be a human/vulcan hybrid, because he would have to have large pointed ears. I disagree.
It’s not like either of us are exactly experts in Vulcan biology. However, we do know what is possible when Sarek and Amanda got together with some help from state of the art artificial reproductive technology and IVF. Anything is possible. I am coming from the perspective of the glass being half full, not half empty.
BTW, I did find your tone insulting, what with you calling me “dear” and then tearing apart my speculations as to who I think John Harrison might be in terms of his backstory, The fact is that I had thought of this idea even before Cumberbatch’s character’s name was revealed and gave my reasons for why he need not have the same ears as Spock. I hope I do not need to repeat my reasoning, because it seems that no one has been able to properly discredit it. Rubbishing something is not the same as providing credible evidence as to why it may not be a sound idea. We are talking science fiction here.
Maybe instead of bringing back Khan they brought back Colonel Green from the Eugenics Wars.
The Chekov in red would explain why he wasn’t part of the bridge crew when Khan took over the Enerprise, he was reassigned to another part of the ship.
That is if Peter Weller is Khan in this alternate universe. I’m betting the Klingons found the Botany Bay and that explains Cumberbach “doing anything for his family” and fighting Klingons on their homeworld.
Alice Eve as Carol Marcus affirms that Gary Mitchell is the villain. “John Harrison” is a ruse. It plays off Gary telling Kirk in WNMHGB he aimed the “little blonde lab technician” at him, and Kirk replies he almost married her.
235. TrekTech – December 12, 2012
Maybe instead of bringing back Khan they brought back Colonel Green from the Eugenics Wars.
***
Green is a villain with excellent potential to out-Khan Khan because his future is unknown and he has no fanbase to disappoint. If they had sleeper technology in Khan’s time, why not Green’s? Or better yet, life extension technology where Green just moves through time frozen in his age, changing his identity, and slowly implementing his scheme against starfleet, with Paxton, we discover, the biggest henchman in his game.
So it’s a different Starfleet guy who goes nuts? That seems to be the ultimate fate of a lot of people who serve in Starfleet, isn’t it?
@211 Yah I’m thinkin’ they run thru the jungle ala Indy then jump off the cliff ala Butch and Sundance ( andd thelma and Louise ) and just before they hit the water they’re snatchedd in a transporter beam ( much like ST 2009)…..then you see the big E rise from the water…hit the fanfare and were off. The whole scene is a heart pounding James Bond opening and I wtll asume its all Imax…bring it on baby….
@237 DesiluTrek
Nope. Cumberbatch told Access Hollywood yesterday in a interview that his character is indeed named John Harrison, a ‘terrorist’.
http://www.accesshollywood.com/benedict-cumberbatch-im-not-playing-khan-in-star-trek-into-darkness_article_73762
His words:
“I play John Harrison who’s a terrorist and an extraordinary character in his own right,” the Brit said. “He’s somebody who is not your two-dimensional cookie cutter villain. He’s got an extraordinary purpose, and I hope that at one point or other in the film you might even sympathize with the reasons he’s doing what he’s doing — not necessarily the means and the destruction he causes. But it was a great ride, not just because he’s the bad guy and the antagonist but also because he has a purpose and it’s hard not to see his point of view at certain points.”
He say’s in the first sentence “an extraordinary character in HIS OWN RIGHT” That means he is not Khan or Gary Mitchell but someone new.
@229: Yes! Also The Simpsons. I’d forgotten that.
And more important: Sherlock-3!! (shooting stars March-2013; airing aparently end-2013).
Well, if hardcore Trek fans are burning to know the villain’s identity for the new relesae, they cannot imagine how Sherlock fans, and viewers in general, were left absolutely astonished,’in shock’, at the end of the last episode of season-2: “The Reichenbach Fall”. A cliffhanger with almost 2 years of waiting and speculation about [...] the lead character.
BTW, Cumberbatch’s words in the STID Teaser Trailler could be EXACTLY the same pronounced by Sherlock when he finally get back:
“You think your world is safe”
“It is an ilussion”
“A comforting lie told to protect you”
“Enjoy these final moments of peace”
“for I have returned, to have · my · vengeance” S.H.
…
If Marcus is a Lieutenant (as I read on another site) and is assigned to the Enterprise, even if it’s short-term, doesn’t that mean Kirk *can’t* have any kind of relationship with her, since he would be her commanding officer and they’re too far apart in rank? Sure, Kirk romanced all the pretty female officers on his ship in TOS, but that was a mixture of “we need to show how suave/cool/virile he is” and the norm of ’60s-style boss entitlement/sexual harassment.
Technically Kirk could legally get it on with McCoy (precedent set by Robert April and his CMO wife, plus Picard and Dr. Crusher later on), Spock (I’m guessing, since he’s even closer to Kirk in rank and power level), or maybe Scotty (same rank as McCoy). If he wanted to. Uhura and Spock are only two ranks apart, as well, and it seems okay for them. I think the furthest Picard ever went was two ranks – he dated a Lieutenant Commander in that one episode.
Which pretty female officers did Kirk romance on his ship in TOS?
In reality, he kept himself apart, most of the time, from the crew, both male and female. Kirk’s females were ones he’d known previously, like the female prosecutor lawyer in Court Martial. It is uncertain as to whether she had ever served on any starship.
The only time Kirk took an obvious interest in someone was in the last scene of Mirror Mirror, when he saw the new yeoman seemed to be the same woman his alternate version was in a relationship with in the “norm of 60s-style boss entitlement/sexual harassment”. Ruth was another, maybe even a figment of his imagination and desire, because she only appeared in Shore Leave…
The kind of relationship he may have had with yeoman Janice Rand was left open…Just because he might have been attracted to her means nothing in itself.
Cumberbatch is RedJack!
It kind of makes sense. Insidious, and he somehow reminds me of what everyone thought Jack the Ripper was like.
Oh well, just throwing it out there…
Jason
It’s been effing five years already! Ugh. Come on, JJ!
What I am most looking foward to is seeing the backstory of Carol and Kirk so that is what I have been thinking about, not the villian.Now
that we know ‘the villian’ can spread thoughts and apparently mind
control.. what if he forces Kirk/Marcus into a relationship? Now, quit
your laughing — Kirk never needed any reason as we all well know.
But maybe this particular relationship needed a little help from both
sides. (The writers’s could have gotten this idea from PLATO’S STEPCHILDREN.)
If this is the case that would explain a lot.. they were never really in
love and it would make it easier for Kirk to just ‘stay away’ as Carol
wants.
Just a thought. (Tomorrow is my birthday so please be kind when
you totally laugh out loud at this theory.)