Shot-By-Shot Analysis Of Star Trek Into Darkness Domestic Theatrical Trailer + Did Title Cards Clue The Villain? | TrekMovie.com
jump to navigation

Shot-By-Shot Analysis Of Star Trek Into Darkness Domestic Theatrical Trailer + Did Title Cards Clue The Villain? April 16, 2013

by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Spoilers,Star Trek Into Darkness , trackback

The new domestic theatrical trailer for Star Trek Into Darkness is now online. There are tons of goodies to see so once again TrekMovie takes a deep dive with a shot-by-shot analysis. Check it all out below, but beware of Spoilers.

[UPDATE: Did the title cards give us the biggest clue yet?]

 

Star Trek Into Darkness Domestic Theatrical Trailer Analysis

As this is the fifth trailer for Star Trek Into Darkness, this analysis will focus on the shots that are new, including variations or extended bits from things we have seen before…Shall we begin?

(Click images to enlarge)


Look at London skyline from “Father’s” (Noel Clark’s character’s) apartment


Kirk in San Francisco

Dialog   (Voice Over transition to scene)

Pike: You think you can’t make mistakes. But the choices you make can get yourself and everyone under your command killed…but I believe in you Jim.



Admiral Pike (Bruce Greenwood) talks to Kirk (Chris Pine)


Starfleet HQ – San Francisco

Dialog  (Voice Over)

Harrison: Darkness. Is. Coming.



Starfleet HQ gets attacked by Harrison

Dialog (voice over)

Kirk: This could just be the beginning.
Admiral Marcus: Beginning of what?
Kirk: All out war.


Room full of tubes with windows (possibly cryo-stasis chambers) – with two unknown characters leaving


Saucer of ship (possibly ‘Dreadnought class’ revealed at CinemaCon last night) slices through downtown San Francisco


Harrison (Benedict Cumberbatch) flees from a scene



Kirk talks to Admiral Pike at Starfleet HQ meeting

Dialog

Kirk: I request permission to go after him.



Starfleet “Surveillance” image of “John Harrison” from (presumably) London attack — note under his name it says “Unknown”



Spock (Zachary Quinto) confronts Kirk on USS Enterprise

Dialog

Spock: I cannot allow you to do this.


Sulu (John Cho) on bridge of USS Enterprise


Kirk in captain’s chair on bridge of USS Enterprise

Dialog

Kirk: Let’s go get this son of a bitch.


USS Enterprise prepares to leave Earth station



Zoom in shot of USS Enterprise bridge with Kirk standing next to window/view screen

Dialog (voice over)

Harrison: You are a pawn, Kirk.


Uhura (Zoe Saldana) on Enterprise bridge – in her wetsuit from Nibiru mission

Dialog (voice over)

Crewperson: Sir, there is a ship heading right for us.


Kirk looks at something

Dialog (voice over)

Harrison: You cannot even guarantee the safety of your own crew.


Scotty (Simon Pegg) looks through window at something (he may be in a shuttle craft)



‘Dreadnought class’ ship warps in front of USS Enterprise – and it is huge!


Dreadnought-class ship faces off against Enterprise


Spock and the bridge crew stare (presumably) at the giant black ship

Dialog (voice over)

Harrison: Now, shall we begin?



Dreadnought aims giant gun at puny looking Enterprise



A dejected Kirk turns to face his crew

Dialog

Kirk: I’m sorry.


Enterprise gets fired on (presumably by Dreadnought)


Klingons rappel out of ship on Qo’noS


Klingon soldiers stand ready on Qo’noS


Harrison reveals himself to the Klingons


Harrison lands after jumping down and killing poor Klingons


Kirk in civilian clothes on Qo’noS with a weapon (not standard Starfleet phaser)


Kirk space jumps between Enterprise and Dreadnought-class ship


Harrison jumps through glass door in San Francisco


Spock chases Harrison through San Francisco


Harrison jumps onto floating barge in San Francisco


Scotty talks to Kirk

Dialog

Scotty: The ship’s dead sir. She’s gone.



Kirk and Scotty run through halls of Enterprise which appears to be having major malfunction of the gravity plating



Kirk looks determined while sitting in captain’s chair

Dialog (Voice Over)

Kirk: No she’s not.


Harrison fights Spock on floating barge in San Francisco


Klingon ship fires on civilian shuttle (with Kirk, Spock, Uhura and some other crewmen on board)


Harrison attacks Starfleet HQ meeting in some kind of small craft


Explosion on Dreadnought-class ship


Scotty looks worried and Kirk is running behind him – on board USS Enterprise


Harrison in command chair of (presumably) Dreadnought-class ship

Dialog

Harrison: No ship should go down without her captain.



Some kind of small object flies from Dreadnought and fires on Enterprise



Enterprise takes severe damage


Kirk at scene of Starfleet HQ attack

Dialog (Voice Over)

Pike: I believe in you Jim.

More thoughts: Kirk still on journey to greatness

Firstly this trailer is clearly made with a more Trek-friendly audience in mind than the full-length international trailer – which is of course by design. Like what was done with the trailers for the 2009 Star Trek film, this trailer focuses on Kirk and shows that he is still struggling with his command of the Federation’s flagship. While other Trek episodes and films (especially Star Trek III following the death of his son) have shown us classic Kirk in distress, Chris Pine’s Kirk is still on his journey.

The Kirk presented in this trailer is at time’s dejected (even apologizing to his crew) but also determined (in a personal way) to get John Harrison. But woven into that is Pike’s vision for Kirk that he has the ‘greatness’ within him to be that Kirk that we know.

It is nice to finally see some ship-on-ship action for this trailer with Paramount finally revealing the ‘other Starship’ which is a ginormous black Federation ship. And it seems once again the USS Enterprise take a serious beating – even more than the damage it took from Nero’s Narada in Star Trek 2009.


The USS Enterprise faces off against a giant dark ship (again)

 Overall this is clearly another big tentpole action movie for the summer. The film seems even bigger than the 2009 Star Trek film. The trailer also presents Into Darkness as a more serious film. While we know there are humorous elements of the movie – they are not evident from this trailer. The tagline (via title cards) makes that clear but also includes Star Trek’s core message of hope “This Summer – Beyond The Darkness – Lies Greatness.”


A message of hope

…one more thought….a Khan-ection?

Reports that Benedict Cumberbatch is actually Khan Noonien Singh have been going since the movie was in production (and even before that too). Well could it be that the trailer has yet another clue (and I’m not talking about those cryo-tubes). The original Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan trailer contains a voice over which starts “Beyond the darkness, beyond the human evolution…is Khan..” Watch it.

More ‘shot by shot’ analysis

Check out TrekMovie’s other analyses:

 

Comments

1. TrekkerChick - April 16, 2013

Spock’s uniform is mirror-imaged in the trailer (SF insignia on his right side, rather than the left) @1:50 during the chase. Maybe reflection in glass, or ‘oopsie’

2. Malgrk - April 16, 2013

AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

3. Kevin - April 16, 2013

INCREDIBLE. Best trailer yet.

4. HubcapDave - April 16, 2013

FIRST!!!
OMG, what a trailer! I can;’t wait for May 17th

5. Hawkeye53 - April 16, 2013

I’m going to be the first to say it. Looking a these trailers all together and looking at the size of that ship. I can’t see the Enterprise surviving this one. I of course hope I am wrong. I really do. Plus did anyone else get a lump in their throats at Scotty’s line, The ship’s dead sir. She’s gone. I did.

6. Tim Struble - April 16, 2013

Can’t Wait

7. Lou Sytsma (@OldDarth) - April 16, 2013

‘killing poor Klingons’

That made me laugh out loud.

8. giez - April 16, 2013

sweet

9. Dr. Image - April 16, 2013

I like what I see… for a trailer. (1st.)

10. Grok_Spock - April 16, 2013

31 days and counting. Damn it I can’t wait.

11. Me - April 16, 2013

Great! Another Narada. Rinse and Repeat. Only difference is that it appears to be yet an even more freakishly huge Federation ship.

12. nanook177 - April 16, 2013

My Thought Is That Dreadnought Silhouette Looks An Awful Lot Like An Excelsior Class Ship (Sorry For The Caps, My Phone Is Acting Weird)

13. Tanner "The Dude" Waterbury - April 16, 2013

Whats with the wide mouth shots? First Marcus does it screaming, and now Harrison is doing it…

14. xandercom - April 16, 2013

I recon the huge ship is built by the klingons who stole plans from star fleet via defector John, who the Klingon then tried to screw over by then giving him no involvement from then on, but John knew all along they were going to do that and was all a part of his plan to steal the ship and blow the hell out of people in starfleet HQ who genetically engineered, then abandoned John and others like him because they are too dangerous.

John awakens the other starfleet augments to help him wage war against the federation.

15. NX01 - April 16, 2013

How many times are they going to destroy the enterprise? We just got this one!

16. robbysteve64 - April 16, 2013

i think that civilian ship is mudds ship from the comics

17. Thomas - April 16, 2013

If you click on the shot of the Cryo-tubes, and zoom in on the one front and center, am I the only one that can sort of see a face? If you lean your head to your right, you can sort of make out the brow and nose of a man’s face.

18. DarthMcWord - April 16, 2013

Always love the analysis, thanks guys.

Are the Klingons holding Bat’leths as they repel?

19. Kevin Marshall - April 16, 2013

@1
Common thing for trailer editors to do – flop shots to keep horizontal action consistent. Won’t be flopped in the actual film.

20. loungeshep - April 16, 2013

Is it just me or does that Dreadnought have kind of the same shape as Enterprise D.

21. LLAP - April 16, 2013

The Dreadnaught-class ship looks like an early /JJverse version of the Galaxy-class, doesn’t it? Look at the profile of the saucer and the way the engineering hull blends into the saucer.

22. jamesingeneva - April 16, 2013

the klingons look flipping retarded. I was ok with the helmet idea but I really hate that helmet. Oh well, I LOVE the trailer and can’t wait to see it in theater.

23. T'Sarah - April 16, 2013

Fan-freaking-tastic.

I loved the other trailers but this is it. The crew, bound together… That’s trek!

Just one complaint… Where the hell is Chekov?

24. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

the dreadnought looks more like a giant Excelsior to me (but with normal nacell struts

25. Steve J. - April 16, 2013

So they still have breakable GLASS doors at that time in the future…? Why not transparent aluminum…?

26. TyrusX - April 16, 2013

@17 the faces do look human to me.

27. Sunfell - April 16, 2013

I wondered about the multiple times we’ve lost the Enterprise, too. What is this- five?

Still, I look forward to seeing the movie. 31 days left!

28. TrekkerChick - April 16, 2013

@18

I know. Just found it interesting… especially since that happened with one of the stills (iirc.. and, again with ZQ) for the 2009 movie.

29. Rene Quebec - April 16, 2013

The Dreadnaught is missing that third nacelle…however, it looks like it gained a ‘Macross Cannon’ :-)

30. Sunfell - April 16, 2013

Is that a Vulcan woman in the shot with Pike at the Starfleet HQ meeting? Sure looks like one.

31. NFXstudios - April 16, 2013

15: The Enterprise has only been destroyed twice in 47 years, and the last time was 19 years ago. Sorry if that’s too often.

32. Sam1701 - April 16, 2013

My BABY!!!!!!!

33. Travis - April 16, 2013

@ 17: Thomas: What you are seeing is the result of the SS Botany Bay ( Khan’s men in cryo-sleep )

34. Phil - April 16, 2013

How’s that Kirk promotion working out for you now, Starfleet? Never send boy to do mans job….

35. MORN SPEAKS - April 16, 2013

My theory: After the destruction of Vulcan, Starfleet creates a powerful ship (similar to the the Defiant after the Battle of Wolf 359), but instead of being helmed by Starfleet officers, it is supposed to be run by cloned genetic soldiers of the Botany Bay as canon fodder similar to the Jem Hadar?

36. Bob - April 16, 2013

#30 3 times. 1701-1701 C-1701D.

37. StelArian - April 16, 2013

‘After lands after jumping down and killing poor Klingons”!!!!
HAHAHAHAHAAAAA… Love it :)

38. Travis - April 16, 2013

The quote from Harrison…. ” You are a pawn… Kirk “…. That sounds exactly like a quote that Khan Noonien Singh would say! But what a tick what am i saying…. The man IS Khan Noonien Singh!!!!

39. Rich Civil - April 16, 2013

In the context of the trailer the tubes look like they may be coffins.

40. Mantastic - April 16, 2013

Is it just me or are there even more lens flares in the movie than the last one? You can’t even see the other ship properly when it warps in because of a giant lens flare!

On top of that, the camera showing the action when the Enterprise gets attacked acts so spazzy that I can barely see what the heck is going on.

More and more I’m worried that I’m going to not like this movie.

41. Bob - April 16, 2013

Has anyone heard the cast say the name “John Harrison”? If not then all options are still on the table as to just who this guy is.

42. RobWestgate - April 16, 2013

Funny, the first thing I thought of in regard to the new mystery ship was the Enterprise-C. It has already been bounced around time and space quite a bit.

43. Bob - April 16, 2013

#38 Negative. Coffins don’t have moisture inside which these do.

44. Vorus - April 16, 2013

So, the ridiculously over-sized Enterprise wasn’t enough? They had to give Starfleet a ship that is around 1.6 kilometers long?! That’s as long as a SW Star Destroyer. (Or have they decided to acknowledge the fact that the JJ-Enterprise is closer to 350m, which makes the “dreadnought” more like the size of a Sovereign Class ship?)

Yes, the trailer looks exciting, but it is clear that JJTrek has jumped the shark. A “Go bigger!” starship mentality and a major rehash of plot points from the last film (Kirk loses his command, and has to “earn it” back, just like getting banished in the last film. An attack on SF, just like the last film, Enterprise facing a giant ship, just like last time…) just make it look like they have run out of originality, and have just decided to “go with what works, just bigger this time”.

Rather disappointing, overall.

45. Curious Cadet - April 16, 2013

@14. xandercom,
“…John knew all along they were going to do that and was all a part of his plan to steal the ship and blow the hell out of people in starfleet HQ who genetically engineered, then abandoned John and others like him because they are too dangerous….”

STOP right there … This dreadnought changes everything. Isn’t the first part of your plot ENOUGH now, without involving augments and Khan!?

This movie has absolutely nothing to do with Khan or the Botany Bay. It seems fairly clear now, if it wasn’t before.

It was a ridiculous idea before and it’s even more so now. This movie is about the Prime Directive, a covert Starfleet organization leveraging Narada technology, and Klingons. No Khan.

46. VOODOO - April 16, 2013

That “dreadnought” looks like Picards Enterprise.

47. VOODOO - April 16, 2013

If rumors are to be believed, how does Leonard Nimoy’s Spock prime figure into this?

48. NuFan - April 16, 2013

Not impressed by all those Klingons. Couldn’t even defeat an ordinary human operative of Starfleet Intelligence.

49. The Mighty Chip - April 16, 2013

I pointed this out awhile back but the new trailer shows it a lot more clearly now:

In the shot of the Enterprise warping away from the starbase, you can see another ship docked below, hull number NCC-0718 I believe.

Except for the half-saucer, that ship is dead on TOS style: Matte beige hull color, round nacelles with round red caps, etc..

I don’t know if it means anything at all but I found it extremely weird: it is the only TOS-style ship I’ve seen in the JJ-verse. Anyone up for some wild speculation as to what its purpose is?

50. Punkspocker - April 16, 2013

I, too, believe in you Jim!

51. Ed Vance - April 16, 2013

The voice that says “You are a pawn, Kirk.” is clearly not Benedict Cumberbatch’s voice. Ironically enough that sound clip sounds really old. It sounds like Khan’s voice. And I agree that the dreadnought ship looks like Picard’s enterprise.

52. josh - April 16, 2013

i like these kirk – pike – moments. BUT hope also, it won´t be another mutara nebual battle at the end…

53. captain spock - April 16, 2013

the dreadnought in this photo is from 2371 it looks like the one in the trailer

http://planetside.firenebula.com/startrek/ships.php?id=541

54. Andrew - April 16, 2013

The Dreadnaught-Class reminds me more of the Excelsior than it does the Galaxy actually.

Anyway, awesome analysis. So excited for this.

55. Vorus - April 16, 2013

@ 45, 50, 52

Let’s kill that rumor before it starts, shall we? The “dreadnought” is absolutely, positively NOT a Sovereign class starship. PERIOD. (To me, they don’t even look at ALL similar. It looks MUCH more like an Excelsior Class. Probably intentionally.

56. J - April 16, 2013

@24: we are not sure when transparent aluminum was invented, and also they haven’t saved Earth from the probe in that timeline yet, so has the 1986 polluted by “transparent aluminum” by Scorry happened yet…? ;)

57. Thorny - April 16, 2013

With those whimpy “pew, pew!” phasers we saw in ST09, no wonder the Enterprise is dead…

58. Philip - April 16, 2013

The dreadnought-class ship reminds me of Ralph McQuarrie’s design studies for a new Enterprise for the original Phase II.

My reckoning is that they may want to kill the new Enterprise – or at least damage it enough to warrant major reconstruction – because fan reception to it’s design has been so negative. The dreadnought-class looks more along the lines of what you expect a ship of the same configuration as the Enterprise would look like, albeit leviathan in size. If the Enterprise is destroyed, could we see something like this being renamed for subsequent movie(s)?

I’m also wondering if the Scotty shot with Kirk running could be an engineering set rather than the beer factory of the last movie? Something more akin to what we expect and love from what came before.

59. Frederick - April 16, 2013

Another rogue Starfleet Admiral. They should outlaw that ranking!

60. AyanEva - April 16, 2013

#5- I did (got a lump in my throat). We barely knew her! lol

Not seeing how the Enterprise makes it out of this one. Refit time, I guess. It’s a good thing money doesn’t work the same way in the future because Starfleet has gone through A LOT of ships in one year…

I like that this trailer shows lots of exciting stuff and…we’re still not sure of the overall plot. I give up trying to figure out how it all fits together and I’ll just be surprised!

I’ve already gotten May 17th approved for a day off from work- I’m assuming there will be a midnight showing Thursday that I will certainly be at and no way am I making it into work after that. (Took the day off after Harry Potter too.)

61. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

“…one more thought….a Khan-ection?”

oh FFS really?

62. Star Trek: Nemesis blows, is the point - April 16, 2013

The Enterprise-D was destroyed how many times between Season 1 and Generations?

Why is it now a big deal if the original Enterprise is destroyed in this movie?

63. Frederick - April 16, 2013

The zoom in on the window of the bridge reminds me of the zoom in through the roof dome in “The Cage.” It’s nicely done here and looks so real, establishing that they are really inside this huge ship.

64. Phil - April 16, 2013

Easy come, easy go…

65. CaptainRickover - April 16, 2013

I like the trailer, promising a great action ride, phantasic effects and some dramatic twists and some fine acting (Pine’s Kirk).
BUT:
Why the hell is the other starfleet ship twice the size of the Enterprise? What purpose should that serve? And why is it dark gray (or black)? What purpose should that serve (beside to let the moviegoer know “I’m the bad guy’s ship, I’m sure you wouldn’t have notice it”)?

USS Reliant was not twice the size of the E nor was it black, but it nearly beated Kirks Enterprise and was menacing enough, because of it’s mad commander (Khan). I’m not sure, why three Star Trek movies in the last decades needed big, black enemy-starships (Scimitar, Narada, Dreadnought).

Sometimes I miss the good old days, when Star Trek doesn’t have big budgets and needed clever storytelling instead of bombastic effects.

66. Anthony Pascale - April 16, 2013

OK guys I updated the article with what may be a huge Klue. Scroll to the bottom

67. Frederick - April 16, 2013

That image of Pine looking serious in the captain’s chair really channels Shatner there!

68. Carolina Alliance of Star Trek Fans - April 16, 2013

#30 – LOLOLOL. I guess for some purists, destroying the Enterprise even once is too often. Once every 20 years ain’t too bad.

69. SFC3 - April 16, 2013

“this ain’t no khan”

So please, stop. I hope to laugh at you in the cinema when he isn’t.

70. NCC-73515 - April 16, 2013

SurveillEnce? XD

71. Garth Faction - April 16, 2013

Several things.

Just because it is bigger doesn’t mean it is better or more powerful. It could be an older, obsolete class ship, easily wounded, with less firepower.

While I believe all the rumors of him being Khan are true, nonetheless, a certain part of me keeps saying, “Garth” fits his M.O.

72. SFC3 - April 16, 2013

#60

… interesting

73. CaptainRickover - April 16, 2013

# 60
This isn’t the Original Enterprise. That ship was already destroyed in Star Trek III. That’s an Alternate-Enterprise.

And who says, the Big E gets destroyed? I’m sure, Scotty and Kirk will find a way to save crew and ship in the last second and strike back at the dread Dreadnought

74. AyanEva - April 16, 2013

I’m still not convinced it’s Khan, I’ve just gotta say it. I won’t be convinced until Harrison looks right at the camera and says, “Hey guys, I’m Khan.” lol

75. Philip - April 16, 2013

63: I agree. The fact the Reliant was on par in capability (if not a bit below) with the Enterprise was to probably emphasise Khan’s “superior intellect”. Instead of using better technology, it wss a battle of wits. a chess match. Being a modern Hollywood blockbuster, though, such nuances are probably lost on audiences; who needs intellect when your guns are bigger? All this, despite a chess metaphor!

76. NCC-73515 - April 16, 2013

Shot 31 (!) shows that the dish has large holes in its design…

77. Curious Cadet - April 16, 2013

@64. AP,
“OK guys I updated the article with what may be a huge Klue.”

You are really fanning the flames of misdirection now … They must be paying you a lot, or else this movie’s gonna really disappoint … LOL

78. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

@77

Oh, he’s Khan.

John Harrison Khan, the great grandson of some guy who used to live in India 100 years ago

79. Smike - April 16, 2013

It simply has to be Khan. Listen to the “You are pawn, Kirk” utterance. The voice! The voice! I’ve always assumed they cast Cumberbatch for his voice. This line has got written “I’ll chase you round the moons of Nevia…” all over it. They originally wanted to have a Hispanic actor again, but then Cumbie popped up, doing his Khan voice…

BTW: That ships that goes down on Frisco is supposedly just a ship from orbit all going 9/11 and it’s neither Enterprise nur Dreadnought.

Dreadnought though looks exactly like from the future…a mix of Enterprise E and Scimitar (the weapon!)…

80. NCC-73515 - April 16, 2013

Must be the USS Scimitar :p

81. Dunsel Report - April 16, 2013

The comparative small size of the Enterprise underscores that its mission is mostly one of exploration and peacekeeping. Starfleet Battles players will recall that the Dreadnought has assault capabilities lacking in the Heavy Cruiser, with its science laboratories and lack of drones.

82. Tony Whitehead - April 16, 2013

I’m just glad that Pike’s in the movie. Such a great actor. Did I miss it, or have they named April yet? Is that character actually in the movie?

83. frederick - April 16, 2013

And in the film Harrison stands up on the dreadnaught’s bridge and moves aside as a shadowy figure comes in and sits down, revelaing himself as the true power behind the attack. He is future Mirror Universe Tiberius Kirk (Shatner) here to have his revenge.
Wouldn’t the fanboys fill their pants in the theaters for that? :) I include myself among those.

Just a humorous thought.

84. Keachick - April 16, 2013

I thought that the original TV TOS Enterprise was almost a mile long, ie 1.6 kms.

Military submarines are black.

85. Smike - April 16, 2013

@78: Jeez…come on…It’s not any average Indian feller but a specimen of superior augmented DNA, perfect to be homegrown by Section 31 to become one of their top agents. It’s not THE Khan, it’s freakin’ clone of Khan’s DNA, turned into a one-man weapon of mass destruction, using protomatter to grow him fast. They thought they could control him by conditioning and brain-washing but they just created doomsday…

86. Lady Valkris - April 16, 2013

Am I the only one confused about the Countdown comics seemingly not having any real connection to the movies?

(based of course on what we’ve seen in trailers)

87. frederick - April 16, 2013

I’m not convinced that the ship crashing is not the dreadnaught, the engine and secondary hull shapes (angular and not curvy) are the same.

88. Lords Of Kobol Book - April 16, 2013

Check out the pic with the caption “Enterprise gets fired on (presumably by Dreadnaught [sic])” …

It appears as though the ship has a large open space in the center of its saucer section.

89. Never Say Canon Again - April 16, 2013

He’s the Khan.

90. Selor - April 16, 2013

Ah… listen… Section 31 salvaged some Narada Parts and/or got some Intel from the Klingons and build a giant Ship “to protect” the Federation…
Harrison as a (maybe Ex-) Section 31 Agent now goes on a spree because of something SFHQ is doing, maybe being unable to stop a war with the Klingons or the exact opposite, wanting Peace whereas S31 wants the Klingons gone? Do we perhaps meet the Organians in this Movie… (or was Harrison a normal Human now possessed by an Organian?)

Can’t wait :D

91. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

86 – No obvious connections as of yet, I’m sure there will be. Some thoughts:

1) Harrison probably has a connection to April somehow, either as a follower or someone else

2) One of April’s fears was that the Klingons were preparing to fight a war with the Federation. Kirk says something about worrying about a war in this trailer. I wonder if that’s connected.

3) It’s possible that April himself is connected to all of this somehow, if not behind it.

92. cottoncandy - April 16, 2013

#79 Cumberbatch is a hell of a lot more than his voice. The focus on his voice bugs me. He’s one of the best actors in the world and can do anything. The voice is just the cherry on the top.

93. Jenna - April 16, 2013

@92 Oh yes for sure. (Not at all “hired for his voice”)

94. Jack - April 16, 2013

Wow, they don’t show McCoy at all and they show the back of Uhura’s head in that Star Trek II trailer. They ignore the blessed trio, give Uhura elevated importance *and* there’s no optimism. I’m definitely not seeing that on June 4th.

I really don’t think that’s a huge Khlue.

65. “Why the hell is the other starfleet ship twice the size of the Enterprise? What purpose should that serve? ”

Well, if you made a top secret dreadnaught designed solely to pulversize the enemy, whomever that is, it would probably be pretty freakin’ big.

95. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

I prefer to call him Yumberbatch

96. Phil - April 16, 2013

@84. Nope, TOS Enterprise was about 288 meters (947 ft). JJ’s people have been a bit non-committal on the size of nu-Enterprise, but from eyeballing the size of the shuttles estimates range from 725 to 760 meters in length.

97. Elvis Shatner - April 16, 2013

Why are some military aircraft black?
For Stealth, in conjunction with stealthy design characteristics and surface coatings designed to reflect away/absorb some radar energy….

I would expect a warship constructed in secret by, say, a Section 31-type organization to utilize the same principles…

98. martin - April 16, 2013

So exactly how sure are we of the “civilian shuttle”?

Since the first trailer with this ship in it, I found it remarkably plain and domelike on one side of it.

Almost as if it came from the bottom of the saucer. Could it be the Captain’s Yacht?

99. William Bradley - April 16, 2013

Grasping.
At.
Straws.

Really, give it a rest.

> The tagline (via title cards) makes that clear but also includes Star Trek’s core message of hope “This Summer – Beyond The Darkness – Lies Greatness.”

…one more thought….a Khan-ection?

Reports that Benedict Cumberbatch is actually Khan Noonien Singh have been going since the movie was in production (and even before that too). Well could it be that the trailer has yet another clue (and I’m not talking about those cryo-tubes). The original Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan trailer contains a voice over which starts “Beyond the darkness, beyond the human evolution…is Khan..” Watch it.

100. William Bradley - April 16, 2013

FIRST the geniuses heard Cumberbatch’s British accent and thought that he’d said:

“You are a POEM, Kirk.”

This was supposedly something Khan would say. (Because it makes no sense, at all??)

THEN they realized he had actually said:

“You are a PAWN, Kirk.”

Now this is supposedly evidence that Harrison is Khan.

It’s evidence of something, all right …

ROTFL

101. Caesar - April 16, 2013

“I’m sorry?”

Not “Evasive action?” “Sulu, get us out of here?” “Fire”?

WTF kind of captain is this d-bag?

102. Frederick - April 16, 2013

Harrison’s jump through the plate glass window is funny, in that he goes through hands outstretched, breaking the “glass” with his fingertips. All anyone would get doing that would be broken hands.

103. CaptainRickover - April 16, 2013

# 79

No, that’s not another ship, it’s the Dreadnought, that’s crashlanding into Frisco. The hunt through the city is the final of the movie (as one can conclude very easy if you look a the uniforms the crewmembers and Harrisson are wearing).

104. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

100 – well, I thought he said “poem” at first too, though I didn’t really give a reason as to why lol

101 – we don’t actually know the context. It’s clearly no the same scene where Spock walks up looking shocked. It may not even be the scene where they face the big ship at all.

105. Robman007 - April 16, 2013

For those who keep complaining about the size of the Enterprise…stop, and pay attention to what has been said before….

…the size was, if you wanna call it this, retconned back to it’s normal original series size. Just look at the new Revell model kit. 1/500 scale would be about 5-6 feet long if it was at it’s original size. It’s only around 22″ long.

The ship size was changed…besides, who cares. Such a nit picky thing to get all drama queen about.

106. Legend of Link - April 16, 2013

My theory: The Dreadnought is a classified project. Maybe it was constructed after the destruction of Vulcan, when they realized what kinds of threats could possibly emerge in the future; a preemptive effort. I’m thinking Admiral Marcus might be behind it.

As for Harrison, he’s either Kahn himself, or his loyal disciple. Maybe he learns of the Dreadnought and commandeers it to prove that the Federation isn’t the “peacekeeping armada” Pike made it out to be.

I noticed a parallel between the trailers, too. Not just with the use of the word “darkness”, but “vengeance”, too. Crazy stuff. Can’t help but be even more excited. C’mon, May 15th!

107. Robman007 - April 16, 2013

@101…that’s a d-bag comment. I can see why he’s apologizing to his crew..did you not listen to the Pike speech. Seems like Kirk took his crew off without paying much attention to what Pike said and, at that moment, it looks like it’s going to cost his crew their lives. He’s realizing he made a mistake because HE thought he could do anything.

It’s all part of the story arc of Kirk BECOMING Captain Kirk. Humility.

Geezus.

108. Dee - lvs moon surface - April 16, 2013

thrilling…

109. Damian - April 16, 2013

I wouldn’t read too much into the title card yet. I know, I’m still in denial about Khan. But the team has made no secret about their admiration for Star Trek II. I wouldn’t be surprised if they used similar wording just for that reason alone (and this team is famous for misdirection too).

I actually hope John Harrison is just John Harrison, an original character created by the current team from scratch. I would be hugely disappointed if he turns out to be Khan.

Wouldn’t it be funny if he was the same Harrison we saw briefly in the original series though. In one universe a benign character that evidently made little impact on the Star Trek universe in this alternate universe is a huge villain with a big impact. Certainly would prove the whole “In another time and place, life could be different” theory. And I guarantee you, you’d never look at Harrison in those brief moments in the original series the same again.

110. Frederick - April 16, 2013

107, I agree, this is a great character-building arc, not Kirk as he was in the series. I have no trouble with the differences in him or Spock or Uhura, since it has been stated these are younger, less mature versions who have yet to become the seasoned, tightly-knit crew we knew.

111. B.T. Dubbs - April 16, 2013

in the next movie i want to see a viking captain. he just goes around plundering other civilizations and taking their priests as slaves

112. Calastir - April 16, 2013

“Kirk: Let’s go get this son of a bitch.”

No no no no no no…

113. Tom - April 16, 2013

Why can’t they just show the damn klingons faces, abrams stop masking them up.

114. Buzz Cagney - April 16, 2013

ah ok, this trailer actually gave me the first flicker of excitement.
I’ll fan the flames a little over the coming days and hope to be well entertained when i see it.

115. The Mighty Chip - April 16, 2013

@101 Caesar:

“WTF kind of captain is this d-bag?”

A young, unexperienced one who was promoted to captain WAY too early. It’s my understanding that “Kirk not being quite as ready as he should be” is supposed to be a major running theme of this movie. Hence, the “I’m sorry” scene is perfectly appropriate in STID. He’s not supposed to be the Shatner-Kirk you want, at least not yet.

116. Gary - April 16, 2013

Hey…has anyone else noticed that the bridge window has increased in size relative to the rest of the saucer? It looks like the scale of the ship has been brought back down – more in line with the classic version…

117. Smike - April 16, 2013

It’s truly unbelievable (while being your prerogative for sure) that are still some people who don’t believe it’s Khan… for months we have been bombarded with evidence…evidence the fan does understand without giving a definite answer in order to keep it a surprise for those who DON’T want to know. That’s why the didn’t frankly say Khan…Plus…the fact that the crew doesn’t know either and the audience should share their point of view…

It all started with Benicio Del Toro being the first choice to replace Montalban as Khan, the obvious choice for the second film. They even wanted to include Botany Bay after the last film’s credits but decided against it.

It is CLEARLY obvious they are following the Dark Knight pattern (look at the posters, trailers etc)…So the most iconic, popular villain is the obvious choice. However, they combined this villain with a TDKR-like deception (Thalia Al Ghul anyone)…

Now we get Carol Marcus, rapid aging, these hands on plexiglass scene, the cryotubes, Khan’s ribbed collar…still people don’t think it’s Khan.

There cometh teaser and trailers that emphasize on the words “vengeance”, “darkness” just the way the TWOK trailer once did. Too obvious?

Harrison says “I’m better…at everything”…Still some people don’t believe it’s our favourite genetically superior bad guy.

Here come the actors being glad about not having to lie about the movie anymore…lie about what? The only common lie could have been “It’s not Khan!”

They’ve been playing too long and to extensively with our memories…Why would they want us to believe it’s Khan and then say… “April Fool! It’s Harry Mudd’s son or a mutated Killer Tribble”??? Why? To disappoint us on purpose?

They’ve been ripping off TWOK for three generations now time and again…starting with Kruge in TSFS…I think it’s finally time to see the original (or a version of him) again. Don’t you think?

118. Kapten Kerk - April 16, 2013

The Dreadnought-class (USS Star Empire?) is not an Excelsior, Ambassador, Galaxy or Sovereign class. It is a Federation “cruiser-type” ship so it looks a little like all of them.
The Dreadnought is probably a top-secret Starfleet (Section 31?) black-ops battleship (like in the novel Dreadnought!) built perhaps with Narada technology.

@49 It is simply a Newton-class as already seen in ST09.
@58 Ralph McQuarrie didn’t design the Phase II Enterprise but the Planet of the Titans Enterprise(s) IIRC.

119. James Regulus Kirk - April 16, 2013

@53. captain spock

Rick Sternbach has stated that the Sovereign class is a heavy cruiser.

120. DeflectorDishGuy - April 16, 2013

First of all, getting sick of all this straw grasping.

Secondly, do we really WANT it to be Khan?? If so, WHY?!?

Why on Earth would we want some trumped up hipster messing with one of Sci-Fi’s greatest villains with some silly re-hash?

Has hollywood become that shallow and vapid that they have lost ALL creativity? There isn’t a single original idea left?! Now we are just redoing every star trek movie… only, worse?!

Please, let’s pray its not Khan. Let’s see something new, and original, and exciting!

121. Phil - April 16, 2013

Yet another super ship that no one seems to be aware of…and easily defeated in battle, again.

So very tired….

122. SuperDuper - April 16, 2013

Cumberbatch is NOT playing Khan Noonien Singh. He is playing Chief Engineer Singh from TNG.

JJ and co have duped you all.

123. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

117 – as a fan, I’ve seen no evidence – none – that it’s Khan. However, I have seen hints that would suggest it’s not Khan

124. SuperDuper - April 16, 2013

Also, I wonder if Pike believes in Kirk. We don’t seem to get any indication of this.

125. The Great Bird Lives - April 16, 2013

Rumors abound, yet logic would dictate, that since we know the plot has something to do with genetic manipulation considering Harrison’s advanced physical capabilities, and the mention of saving the ailing child. We can assume that since The Eugenics War is part of Trek’s history, and since this is a new reality- It’s only obvious that Khan Noonian Singh must- at the very least- be mentioned. It would be ridiculous NOT to.

126. Robman007 - April 16, 2013

@112….yes, yes, yes, yes. Fits perfectly with a young Captain who is hell bent on bringing to justice the man was responsible for so much death, including his mentor and father figure. Seems in line to me. Seems in line with an older Captain Kirk who, went talking about the Klingons said “Let them die”…or did you forget that even Captain Kirk of the Shatner quality had a few sharp edges at times?

127. Smike - April 16, 2013

@120:
Actually I think it’s much more original and exciting to have a familiar character handled differently in all-new context than creating a new character doing his Khan-thing without being Khan. We got Shinzon and Nero already, General Chang, Soran, Ru’afo, Kruge… all of them being on some sort of “Let’s outkhan Khan” mission. Now THIS was not original…
Bringing back Khan himself (or a clone of him) under completely different circumstances however is a creative way of recapturing what made TWOK a great film without doing an exact remake. There’s a huge difference between blad remakes (as often done by Hollywood these days) and further elaborating on existing material.

So nope, I’m praying he is Khan…wrong…I know he is! Sorta…

128. The Mighty Chip - April 16, 2013

@118 Kapten Kerk – Thanks for the info! I’m afraid I’m not familiar with the Newton class and don’t recall seeing it in ST09. Could you point me to the correct scenes or give me additional info if you have the time?

129. Smike - April 16, 2013

@123: Then I can’t help you any further. The evidence is all over the place, presented in small dosages so that it doesn’t become too obvious for people who want to be surprised.

I agree that each of these tidbits on their own could be incidental…placed there to misguide some interested viewers. But TOGETHER they present hard evidence in my book. Because the Supreme Court and their marketing guys know excatly what fans would recognize about Khan and TWOK. One or two parallels may be neglectable, even three or four. But there are more than a dozen hints hidden in those trailers and interviews. Why placing them there in the first place to say: bad luck, you Khan fans and canon-lovers, he’s just John Harrison, just another Khan rehash?

Forget it! There is NO way this guy isn’t at least some version of Khan. “You are a pawn, Kirk…and I’ve done far worse than kill you…”

130. Winkie - April 16, 2013

Very exciting trailer – looks terrific and has some good music going on, although this is probably generic trailer stuff rather than bona fide score from the film.
However, I have been duped before by good trailers that ended up being a laughable mess (IMO)… I’m looking at YOU Prometheus! …. so I’ll wait and see.

If this movie has Khan in it (and I’m sure it won’t), I’m never seeing a Trek film again; I don’t care how well it’s done. Originality please.

131. Khan 2.0 - April 16, 2013

Beyond The Darkness – Lies ANOTHER villain out for revenge!!

132. James Regulus Kirk - April 16, 2013

@75. Philip

The Reliant had mega phaser cannons on the rollbar. The term is ‘fanon’ but it seemed to be visually implied that they were more powerful than standard phaser banks. There were also rear firing torpedo tubes on the weapons pod, which the Enterprise lacked.

133. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

@129

and, exactly, what “tidbits” are there to suggest that he is Khan? It’s speculation based on speculation

134. Khan 2.0 - April 16, 2013

Beyond The Darkness – Lies Lots of Explosions and Lots of Revenge!

135. adjunct37beta - April 16, 2013

more than a match for poor enterprise

136. Khan 2.0 - April 16, 2013

Beyond The Darkness – LiesMore Darkness

137. MidnightLich - April 16, 2013

Does anyone else think the black Federation ship might be from the Mirror Universe?

138. Steve Johnson - April 16, 2013

The big gun on the ship… April Cannon, eh? EH?

I had a feeling Enterprise was going to get her poor butt beaten in by somebody.

She didn’t really take any damage in the 2009 film. Not in a stand up fight. This time it looks like we get to see what the crew and the ship are really made of.

139. CJS - April 16, 2013

That huge ship looks like Abram’s version of the Galaxy Class Enterprise.
The lead-in comic features an Enterprise and a Captain from the past.
The villain of the movie speaks with an English accent and his name is John.
John. John. Jean. Jean Luc.
The movie features an Enterprise and a Captain from the future?

140. Khan 2.0 - April 16, 2013

Beyond The Darkness – Lies An Unexpected Fall into an Avenging Darkness

141. Khan 2.0 - April 16, 2013

@139

Beyond The Darkness – Lies Captain Picard from the mirror universe despite him looking nothing like Prof X or Bane

142. Smike - April 16, 2013

@133:

“It’s speculation based on speculation.”

No, it’s educated guessing based on deliberately placed hints that have to be there for a reason. I’ve pointed out most aspects in question post #117. If you’re not able to spot the mountain because you’re on top of it, there is nothing I can do. There are TWOK references all over the place and they wouldn’t be there if JJ & crew hadn’t decided to put them there. The only way I could figure it’s not Khan would a large-scale deception to make us believe it’s Khan and disappoint us. But why?

This is not grasping at straws or fanfiction…it’s real. Those words, those secenes, those clothes, those people, that voice…it’s in there. It’s beyond me how anyone would argue otherwise. But what does it matter. I know the truth and that’s all that matters right now…

143. Zom B. - April 16, 2013

…i’m sneaking some Tranya in to the midnight showing in my hometown…

144. Saiyan - April 16, 2013

A bit disappointed with the size of the ship. I always imagined John’s ship being small, quick and powerful. I thought the ship would be more a reflection of his apparent fighting style i.e. hit you where you’d hurt most before you’d realise it not the ” Arm the I win cannons” that it appears to be.

145. Kapten Kerk - April 16, 2013

@128 The Mighty Chip
No problem! Here for starters:
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/schematics/stxi_ships.htm
http://www.shipschematics.net/startrek/images/federation/heavyfrigate_newton_nu.jpg
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Newton_type
http://memory-beta.wikia.com/wiki/USS_Newton_(alternate_reality)

146. Khan 2.0 - April 16, 2013

i wish i hadnt watched it – i had no idea there was going to be another fed ship >:(

AGGGGGGGGGRRRRRRAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!! why cant i have more will power!!! >:(

147. The Mighty Chip - April 16, 2013

@ Smike –

You make a lot of very valid points, so please don’t think I’m trying to argue your overall idea.

However I would just like to point out that there is a great many of us (myself included) who would not be disappointed at all if it’s not Khan. Likewise there are many of us (again, myself included) who would be VERY disappointed if it does turn out to be Khan.

If you are excited about seeing Khan in this movie then that’s awesome, and after reading your post in #127 I can totally understand why you would want it to be Khan.

But please don’t say that it would “disappoint us” if all the Khan talk was misdirection. There are tons of us who would actually be very disappointed if it wasn’t.

148. Keachick - April 16, 2013

#124 –
‘Pike: “You think you can’t make mistakes. But the choices you make can get yourself and everyone under your command killed…but I believe in you Jim.”‘

149. Khan 2.0 - April 16, 2013

no one laughs at my jokes. so now im on the verge of turning into a revenge obsessed villain!

150. Exverlobter - April 16, 2013

I think this movie broke the record on trailers that were released. This is the fifth one!

151. Khan 2.0 - April 16, 2013

its the enterprise F commanded by Captain John Harrison Picard (Jean Lucs son)

152. Riker's Beard - April 16, 2013

Young Pavel shouldn’t have worn that red shirt… Others must’ve said this but the other ship looks a bit like the Enterprise E, right? So Harrison is actually a younger Picard on his future ship coming back to the past to blow stuff up? Cool.

153. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

@142 –

“Now we get Carol Marcus, rapid aging, these hands on plexiglass scene, the cryotubes, Khan’s ribbed collar…still people don’t think it’s Khan.”

Yes, they may be referencing STII with the plexiglass. We don’t now the context though. And paying tribute to STII doesnt equal Khan. We know Kirk meets Marcus early in his career. That proves nothing. We don’t know what the tubes are. And a ribbed collar? really?

“There cometh teaser and trailers that emphasize on the words “vengeance”, “darkness” just the way the TWOK trailer once did. Too obvious?”

The last FOUR movies have had vengeance largely as a theme, if not against the Enterprise, against someone else. Picard was driven by vengeance against the Borg, the Son’a against the Baku, Shinzon against pretty much everyone, and of course Nero against Vulcans and the Federation. It’s not exactly a new concept in Trek.

Harrison says “I’m better…at everything”…Still some people don’t believe it’s our favourite genetically superior bad guy.”

A lot of Trek bad buys are “better at everything”

154. Tombot3000 - April 16, 2013

USS DEATH STAR! ;-) I’ll be glad when we come out if all this DARKNESS into the LIGHT!

155. TrekDude - April 16, 2013

Section 31 anyone? Harrison keeps reminding me about it….

156. Kapten Kerk - April 16, 2013

Is it possible that Dr. Leonard “Bones” McCoy has some involvement with this Dreddnought ship?

157. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

@142 – on the other hand, we can address things we know about Khan, namely his character.

His motivation is conquest, pure and simple. He can be reasoned with, but he’ll only cooperate with you if he feels that it’s to his ultimate advantage to do so.

Now, knowing that, how does that fit into either:

1) J.J. Abram’s contention that Harrison will have a motivation that is sympathetic (even if his actions aren’t), and/or
2) He ends up working for starfleet

158. smegger56 - April 16, 2013

LOVE IT!!!!

I’m so HYPED for this film. Hurry up May :D

Can I just say that Pine, in terms of his physical appearance, feels more like Kirk. In the image under the Shatner one, he just looks so much more… authoritative. Superb :)

159. Cygnus-X1 - April 16, 2013

Looking forward to seeing “Star Trek 2: The Wrath of Harrison.”

160. BiggesTOSfanever - April 16, 2013

Spock is not the only one who got mirrored, Kirk in the captain’s chair, right after Sulu, is also flipped.
I wonder why they do that.

BTW, 29 days for me…

161. Newdivide1701 - April 16, 2013

Because they used the term “Darkness,” then Shinzon’s Reman Viceroy would also be the villain because from the Star Trek: Nemesis trailer, “In darkness, there’s strength.”

162. Craiger - April 16, 2013

I wonder if they based STID off this book?

http://www.amazon.com/Dreadnought-Star-Trek-No-29/dp/0671038524

163. marko - April 16, 2013

OK firstly the JJ enterprise isn’t the size of the E or D.. Because the windows (and viewing window) on the bridge would be huuuuuuggggeee.
Therefore the dreadnought thing is about the same size as the sovereign class.
Its all about scale and windows.. The JJ enterprise is the right size.

I just hope this isn’t a star ship from the future again… Because that flag ship now looks very very small!

164. Josh C. - April 16, 2013

@161

I think you nailed it. It’s a Reman ship and Harrison is a surgically altered Reman.

FINALLY THE TRUTH

I mean, people ARE comparing the ship to the Scimitar, right? Clear evidence that Remans are involved.

165. CPelc - April 16, 2013

How about this. Big ship is Called USS April in honor of Marcus’s “lost” former CO. Marcus is the captain of this ship and the giant weapon it has qualifies the April giant gun sound effect.

166. PC3 - April 16, 2013

It looks somewhat obvious that Kirk is grieving, and that in all probabiity Pike has been killed and it is Kirk that is out for revenege and retribution.

167. THX-1138 - April 16, 2013

I’m glad that JJ made it easy for me to know who the bad guys are:

Big black ships = bad guys!

168. Joachim - April 16, 2013

Even if he is Khan, or a clone of Khan, wouldn’t this be the Space Seed, not the Wrath of Khan timeframe? Shouldn’t he and his followers be adrift in the USSBB?

I’ve suggested to friends that having some other vessel find the USSBB (thanks Nero timeline), get taken over by Khan and his followers, sets up all the Horatio Hornblower naval action of TWOK (Khan and Kirk battling wits each with a starship at their command) without the constraints of the 1967 NBC budget that forced the in-ship set action of Space Seed – with no need for the Genesis McGuffin.

169. Brevard - April 16, 2013

Can we please stop with the Khan crap? Really. If Harrison turns out to be Khan, that would be the dumbest plot device ever. And as a fan, I’d be done with these movies. This coming from someone who really liked ST 2009. Saw it 5 times in the theater.

170. Pavel - April 16, 2013

Where is CHEKOV?

171. Daystrom Institute - April 16, 2013

Wouldn’t it be cool if there was an M5-type computer running the ship? I don’t see other crewmembers…

172. Chris Roberts - April 16, 2013

I just don’t think that’s Harrison talking, when Kirk is called a pawn. @1.04 trailer.

Sounds different.

173. Daystrom Institute - April 16, 2013

@165 – no. Not after the events of the IDW comic series…

174. Dave1119 - April 16, 2013

I don’t know if he’s Khan or not, and I don’t care as long as it is a good movie. Although I do agree that the evidence is becoming overwhelming that it is Khan. For those of you that are worried that it will be a rehash of TWOK, or that it won’t be original, I think you can set your mind at ease. If he is in fact Khan, he will be under completely different circumstances, and he will be different because of it. For anyone that watched Fringe (Abrams/Orci/Kurtzman) you know that they loved to put the same characters in totally different circumstances, and then see how they react. Thats exactly what happened to the crew, especially Kirk. So don’t be surprised if we see Khan under circumstances where he does become a sympathetic character, or maybe even a hero, at the end.

175. Steve Johnson - April 16, 2013

It’s not Khan, and the evidence is not mounting that it is. There’s virtually no evidence to suggest Khan at this point.

If anything, this is basically replicating the TDKR formulate. Harrison is the for-front villian, and either either Marcus (Carol’s paps) will be the main villian, or as others have suggested, ‘April’ will appear to be the main mastermind. There will be no Khan. There does not need to be a Khan. Khan had his movie. There’s nothing more to be said with that character.

176. Exverlobter - April 16, 2013

No underwear-shot this time.
I guess the domestic audience is too prudish for that, lol.

177. I AM BETTER - April 16, 2013

31 Actually the Enterprise has been destroyed 3 times. The Enterprise C in Yesterdays Enterprise!!!!!

178. Exverlobter - April 16, 2013

The first teaser trailer and the superbowl trailer were still the best ones.

179. Exverlobter - April 16, 2013

@ 178
” Actually the Enterprise has been destroyed 3 times. The Enterprise C in Yesterdays Enterprise!!!!!”

Actually, the “destruction” of that Enterprise was off-screen. We never actually saw it. Maybe the ship is still drifting through space.

180. Matias47 - April 16, 2013

I have friend who won’t look at or listen to anything about the movie so it will all be a surprise — though that’s not my personality, part of me wishes I would have joined her.

BTW, Anthony — it should be “Klingons rappel –,” not, “repel.”

181. NX01 - April 16, 2013

That is to often #31. We just got this one. Sorry if I get emotionally attached to Enterprises. Real Star Trek Fans are emotionally attached to the Enterprise. The thing is is barly one movie old!

182. Exverlobter - April 16, 2013

@181
I dont think the ship will get destroyed. Remember all the beating of the Enterprise in Nemesis, and she still survived that film

183. Curious Cadet - April 16, 2013

@175 Steve Johnson,

Agreed, there is even less evidence than before that Khan is involved in any way.

However, I wouldn’t say there is nothing more to be said with the character. I think an alternate take on Khan would be interesting. But this ain’t it. An entire movie with Khan masquerading under a different identity, ony to reveal he really is Khan at the end would be a travesty, and do a horrible injustice to the character, all because what, Benecio Del Torro couldn’t commit?

184. 11 - April 16, 2013

Where’s Data when the Dreadnought shows up?
“Oooh sh*t”

185. ajdczar - April 16, 2013

Even the way he pronounces “Kirk” sounds like Kahn.
Oh, the horror

186. James Regulus Kirk - April 16, 2013

163. marko

Memory Alpha says 725.35 meters, and that’s from multiple official sources. Yes, the windows would be quite large.

187. GermanTrekker - April 16, 2013

“Beginning of what? All out war” …. with whom? The Klingons?

188. NCC-73515 - April 16, 2013

Guess John sits in a small attack sled from the Dreadnought novel… http://de_vos.tripod.com/Rifts-Trek-Ships/Federation_Arco.jpg

189. TonyD - April 16, 2013

The trailer looks suitably epic and exciting but it also makes the movie look very much like a retread of the prior film: inexperienced Kirk still trying to prove himself, Kirk/Spock relationship still strained, Enterprise once again outgunned, outmatched and facing off against another oversized dark spaceship, villain who is again out for revenge, another space jump, etc.

I know the demands of a summer tentpole movie require a very specific kind of story but this appears to be an utterly unoriginal by the numbers adventure based on what I’ve seen so far.

190. RetroWarbird - April 16, 2013

Stuff to like here.

My speculation leans toward Harrison indeed being one of the Augments that the Klingons got their hands on, and who they trained and enlisted as secret weapons against the Federation, except, well, you know, “Superior Ambition” and all that – Harrison’s used them and will kill them, too.

I also thought the Dreadnought had a very Excelsior profile to it, which looks right on a Federation-type ship better than Enterprise. The stealth-black elements to it give a definite ‘Section 31′ vibe, too. A Black Ops starship?

Also noticed the Bat’leth-esque shapes some of those Klingon warrior caste were dropping with. And that one or two of them have long, frizzy TNG-era warrior’s death metal hair – hoping for a lot of diversity in the Klingon makeup – some “Noble House” TNG era looking guys, some Imperial Soldier clean-cut TOS era guys, some pronounced cranial ridges, some augment-virus reduced ridges, some paler skin tones like Koloth or the guy the dude from Police Academy played (the blonde Klingon, “Soldiers of the Empire”) and some dark-skinned guys. More variety = more nuanced and believable ‘alien empire’.

I wonder if we’ll meet any non-warrior caste. Some techno-caste or some subjects (who I presume are actually other aliens, dominated by the empire).

Looks good.

191. AJ - April 16, 2013

The explosion scene in London now, unfortunately, reminds me of the tragic bombing in Boston.

192. reswes - April 16, 2013

look at the dreadnought and compare to the ship crashing alcatraz in the other trailer(s)…they have the same angular shaped form…must be the dreadnought crashing into sanfrancisco bay…i am not sure, if i want to go into the movie knowing how the enemy ship is destroyed in the movie…

193. RetroWarbird - April 16, 2013

Also, actually hearing people call Jim “Jim” by name helps me out a lot. I seriously hope he gets to call Pike “Chris”. TOS-era Kirk was on a first-name basis with his contemporaries, and it sold his prestige.

194. Hawkeye53 - April 16, 2013

I’ve just noticed; Why are Kirk and Spocks badge insignia is on the wrong sides. Come-on Insignia goes over the heart, thats how its always been. Screen shot’s 18 and 41. Hope this is sorted out before release.

195. Lord Garth, formerly of Izar - April 16, 2013

So enterprise is either 740 or 1100 meters according to which canon you prefer
That means dreadnaughtprise is either 1600 or 2200 meters in length
Dreadnaughtprise is bigger than an imperial star destroyer

196. Exverlobter - April 16, 2013

Well this super big Starleet ship is still tiny compared to the Narada. No big deal!

197. James Regulus Kirk - April 16, 2013

170. Pavel

Last time I saw him he was running, wearing a red shirt.

198. omegaman - April 16, 2013

My thoughts…

They wanted Benicio to play Khan… deal fell through… rewrote the script to suit a new British actor…

Don’t think it matters much. The movie looks awesome!

199. Aurore - April 16, 2013

More proof that John Harrison is Khan Noonien Singh :

In a recent interview with India’s The Hindu*, Mr. Cumberbatch had this to say about his character : “… he is a ferocious warrior…”

He meant Sikh warrior, of course.

…Knowing that I would throw a tantrum (as usual) if he said he was portraying Khan, he refrained from saying too much…He lied by omission to “protect “… ME.

‘Love ya, Benedict!

:)

*
http://trekmovie.com/2013/04/13/cumberbatch-on-what-john-harrison-is-fighting-for-new-into-darkness-images/

200. CoffeeProf - April 16, 2013

44

Just stop it an go away. If you had this movie and JJ Abrams so much then why do you find it necessary to troll on this site?

201. xandercom - April 16, 2013

HE IS JOHN HARRISON!

If you freeze frame the “starfleet security” footage of him with destroyed london in the background, the image on the screen clearly states his name as “john harrison”

Still, I find it unlikely that a terrorist would use their real name, so obviously, it’s khan.

202. Ricko - April 16, 2013

195… Trouble is if the JJ Enterprise is that big.. Then the windows are massive and out of scale. Also there’s not enough windows on the saucer edge to have the amount of decks a 700m+ ship has.

The JJ bridge windows is clearly visible and in relation to the shot of kirk standing there the ship is not 700+ meters.

If that’s the case the dreadnought is about as big as a sovereign class.

Again look. At the windows!

203. thandrahan - April 16, 2013

It is KHAN!!!!

204. Ricko - April 16, 2013

Oh and just to add to the fact the JJ enterprise is the same size as the “old” 1701 / 1701 A…. Look at the shot of the saucer section in the trailer… There’s only TWO rows of windows on the saucer edge. Thats 2 decks Just like the old enterprise.

The JJ ship isn’t 700m long! Never was!

The bad guy dreadnought is about as large as a sovereign class by the looks of it (if not just over)

205. Aurore - April 16, 2013

@199. Aurore – April 16, 2013
More proof that John Harrison is Khan Noonien Singh :

In a recent interview with India’s The Hindu*, Mr. Cumberbatch had this to say about his character : “… he is a ferocious warrior…”

He meant Sikh warrior, of course.

______

Man….

See? That is what I call… “EVIDENCE”!

:))

…Oh, yes…I’ll believe it when I see it !

206. Travis - April 16, 2013

199 Aurore: Yep. Benedict Cumberbatch is KHAN… The evidence is all there! It’s amazing some people post on here…. There isn’t any evidence that John Harrison is Khan! Some of these band wagon fans need to do some research of who John Harrison and Khan Noonien Singh are…. You’ll be surprised how close they are!

207. George Zip - April 16, 2013

Yeah, I know he’s playing a great villain and all, but I sure wanted to see Cumberbatch as Gary Seven.

208. John from Cincinnati - April 16, 2013

KHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNNN!!!!!!!!!!

209. Travis - April 16, 2013

@ 205 Aurore: Let’s say this together… You ready??…. Khan… KHAN…. KKKKKKKKKKKHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAANNNNNNN…… KKKKKKKKKKKKKKKHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAANNNNNNNNNN!!!!! Don’t think I can say this any clearer!

210. Aurore - April 16, 2013

The only real evidence, for me at least, will be the movie itself.

For now, we are all free to post *opinions* on this here site…

:)

211. Aurore - April 16, 2013

@209

Oh…Travis?!

:))

Are you alright ?!

212. James Regulus Kirk - April 16, 2013

@195. Lord Garth, formerly of Izar

One should have to be a five-star admiral who wears a CAPE to command such a vessel!

213. gingerly - April 16, 2013

IT’S NOT *BLEEP*ING KHAN!
This is as embarrassing at that “lion” rumor from Cloverfield,

214. John from Cincinnati - April 16, 2013

All the newbies are in denial it’s Khan. Kind of poetic justice since the last movie they were all “get over it”, “it’s a new universe” “just accept the changes”. Now the noobs will have to accept an orginal villain Khan, and the movie will be hugely successful.

Deal. With. It.

215. gingerly - April 16, 2013

*sigh*

Newbies and oldheads alike should be logical enough to know that man named Khan Noonien Singh IS NOT a pale British man.

It’s

Not.

Khan.

You might as well have a Latino play Sulu.

216. John from Cincinnati - April 16, 2013

The Cryo tubes
“Harrison’s” black hair
Carol Marcus
Shot of spock’s hand on the plexiglass (a la Wrath of Khan)
Beyond the Darkness title card

Clues have been getting dropped. You’d have to be in complete denial to not see them at this point.

217. ObsessiveStarTrekFan - April 16, 2013

So many questions. So many possibilities. I have absolutely no idea who the ‘villain’ really is. All will be revealed when I see the movie, if the suspense doesn’t kill me first.

218. TrekMadeMeWonder - April 16, 2013

I got a bad feeling that this “Dreadnaught ship” is somehow Borg-related.

The Borg are boring.

219. Curious Cadet - April 16, 2013

@186. James Regulus Kirk,
“Yes, the windows would be quite large.”

After following this debate after the first movie, I’m of the impression that the windows are all floor to ceiling observation windows like the bridge view screen. This continues with the rationale that such a ship built for security would have as few windows as possible, and the bridge would be buried deep within the ship. The windows then only make sense if they are there and maximized for observation.

220. Jefferies Tuber - April 16, 2013

Image 21: I’m totally intrigued by the multi-colored circles at the top of the bridge.

221. MORN SPEAKS - April 16, 2013

Is that the Mutara Nebula?

222. James Regulus Kirk - April 16, 2013

@202. Ricko

The Dreadnought DWARFS the Sovereign. The Sovereign is smaller than the Galaxy, almost as long as the 2009 Enterprise at 685.2 vs. 725.35 meters, but not nearly as tall.

223. Jonboc - April 16, 2013

Now, that’s what I’m talking about!! This movie can’t get here fast enough!

224. Steve Johnson - April 16, 2013

@216 John From Cincinnati

Cryo tubes were seen in many episodes of Star Trek. By this logic, this could be taken as a hint that the villian will be the wallstreet guy from “The Neutral Zone.”

…Hair color!? So Spock is Khan, because he has black hair? How about the fact that it simply works better for a dark villain to have dark hair and helps him stand apart from Kirk visually?

Marcus is a popular well known romance of a young Captain Kirk. This is most likely a reference to Star Trek II, not an apeing of it. (No different than the slugs used to make Pike talk in Trek 09 being a reference to Trek II)

The hands on the window is also likely just an homage. It doesn’t prove anything about who the villain is. They’re using iconic imagery.

The phrase “beyond the darkness” is simply trailer hyping. It’s been used in many things, and the context within this trailer is totally different from the TWOK card. Here it’s talking about HOPE, in that trailer it was talking about the evil and superiority that is Khan.

These are not “clues.” It’s simple desperation by fans who can’t accept that they’re not going to just Xerox TWOK and slap new effects on it.

225. gingerly - April 16, 2013

Serious question…

If you already saw Wrath of Khan why are so many Trekkies so excited to see THE EXACT SAME THINGS, AGAIN??

I just. don’t. get it.

This is a new movie, new timeline. The villain’s name is John Harrison.

As a Trekkie, I would actually be pissed if anyone tried to remake Khan.

Anyway, I’m sure there will be more references to TOS canon, but just 2009 was a brand new story, I’m sure this will be and I for one am glad.

226. Craiger - April 16, 2013

How could Khan join Starfleet? Wouldn’t they scan him and find the genetic enhancements and how could he hide his strength without someone knowing?

227. Curious Cadet - April 16, 2013

@216. John from Cincinnati,
“Clues have been getting dropped. You’d have to be in complete denial to not see them at this point.”

Or completely gullible.

228. The inner sight - April 16, 2013

Chekov dies …

229. Craiger - April 16, 2013

I think STID could be reflecting the times we live in. Just like how the TOS films reflected the Cold War and John Harrison is just a 23rd terrorist and not Khan.

230. gingerly - April 16, 2013

@228

I’m afraid you’re right, but man, I hope not.

231. Craiger - April 16, 2013

^ Sorry I meant 23rd Century Terrorist.

232. commhealy - April 16, 2013

Those torpedoes looks like the ones from nero’s ship.

233. James Regulus Kirk - April 16, 2013

@204

Original 1701 and 1701-A primary hull were ONE deck thick at the edge.
Size comparison from the Blu Ray:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-SRvedYdQtEo/TVfoA5IfX1I/AAAAAAAACdk/aAPtsXMEoNc/s1600/Picture%2B012.jpg

234. Phil - April 16, 2013

@226. Starfleet does not have any entry requirements, remember? They drag drunks out of bar fights and promote them to Captain. Starfleet probably has a terrorist retention unit, too…

235. TrekMadeMeWonder - April 16, 2013

Nice James.

Question. Why does the original look so much more awesomer?

236. Jefferies Tuber - April 16, 2013

215. “man named Khan Noonien Singh IS NOT a pale British man.”

The race thing with Khan is such a losing argument. Montalban was Mexican, but he was genetically Spanish and was bronzed to the gills in “The Space Seed.”

237. Dr. Fridgehead - April 16, 2013

Whoah. Okay, that is clearly not an older or smaller ship than the Enterprise. Looks like part of the saucer opens up and the ship has freakin’ rail guns pointed at the Enterprise. I wonder if the Enterprise’s command codes will be used against it because it looks to me like her shields aren’t up and they’re not firing back.
Oh, to the guy that said the Enterprise used wimpy pew-pew phasers: this larger ship is using them and they’re partly ripping up the Enterprise with them (I personally thought they’d be blue, but what ever).
Could that be the Bird of Prey the Klingons are repelling from?
Just to interject about the size of this new Enterprise. I really don’t think it’s as big as a Galaxy class. The size of the view ports, air locks, and the comparison between the other Starfleet ships, I would place it around the same size as the refit Constitution class. This dreadnought is said to be three times bigger than the Enterprise, so I’m guessing it’s roughly the size of an Ambassador class. Opinion out of the way, enjoy the movie.

238. Unwanted - April 16, 2013

@225 Serious question. Why do people like you assume that if Khan was used in a story that it would automatically have to be exactly the same story we have already seen?

Come on already, even if Khan is Cumberbatch (which I doubt btw, though NOT because of skin color), the story is so obviously something new that you are essentially saying that if he is Khan then despite the evidence of our eyes and ears this is the same story we already saw, sorry but that is just dumb.

239. Lord Garth, formerly of izar - April 16, 2013

Nope sorry ricko the official Ilm and official revealed size of JJPrise was 735ish meters and the portholes are much larger the bridge cap is two decks high with additional halls along side the hull of the bridgecap with the actual bridge sandwiched on the bottom middle. In fact the main viewer window which is roughly the size of the outer saucer window is in fact about 8 ft high and twice as wide. Far bigger than than the old port holes
In addition the new hangar basis more than 3 times the size of the original stacked on both sides with much larger shuttles than the original
The original canon size was to be over 1100 meters this according to john eaves (the guy who designed the E-E)
The art of the film also states a canon size of 1100 meters which by the film was released was officially officially stated as 735
It’s canon bro just depends on which canon you believe 735 or the1100 figure which actually lets the large sets fit much more accurately

Either way Dreadnaughtprise is indeed larger than an Imperial Star Destroyer according to official JJtrek scale

240. Kirk - April 16, 2013

I think Harrison’s last line (before he dies) will be “Darkness is coming” like in the trailer. It could be an allusion to the corruption he sees in Starfleet, also referring to his own death.

241. RoobyDoo - April 16, 2013

Booked a single for Thursday May 16th IMAX 3D (can’t make it Wed) and will take the whole family again on Sunday. Excitement is building.

242. Philip - April 16, 2013

@118: According to “The Art of Star Trek” (Judith & Garfield Reeves-Stevens, pp.54-59), the design STUDIES (not the final design) were by Ralph McQuarrie & Ken Adam. Adam fleshed out designs that were originally committed to paper by McQuarrie.

243. James Regulus Kirk - April 16, 2013

@235. TrekMadeMeWonder

“Young minds, fresh ideas. Be tolerant.”

But seriously, I had noticed that too. Perhaps it’s because the Abramsprise looks more like a hot rod than a starship?

244. gingerly - April 16, 2013

@238.

“…sorry but that is just dumb.”

Nowhere near as dumb as answering a question with a question.

Rehashing the same villains in a reboot in a new universe is boring and lazy no matter how anyone might twist the story to make it “fresh”.

Also, of course, not because Khan would not an ethnicity that fits his name because that would be too much for people reared on a Hollywood whitewashes as common practice.

Just because it’s sadly still common doesn’t mean it makes a lick of sense.

245. WaylanderNeo - April 16, 2013

@ 23 and 170 – Just a thought – Chekov wasn’t on the Enterprise during Space Seed, just saying ;) Reassigned hence the red shirt?

246. Unwanted - April 16, 2013

@244 I notice you made no effort whatsoever to actually answer my question, which means its a complete waste of my time to try to communicate with you, bye now.

247. gingerly - April 16, 2013

@236
Montalbahn was cast over 40 years ago. Even for the racially turbulent sixties, they at least made an effort to cast, at least an actor of color.

I would hope that we’ve evolved some since then…but judging from the justifications.

*sigh*

We really haven’t.

248. TrekMadeMeWonder - April 16, 2013

Yeah. But if you scaled down the JJPrise to the size of the TOS E, it may have a nicer and more detailed look.

I agree with Lord Garth, formerly of izar, amd Dr. Fridhead concering the ships sizes.

Wow, did I just write that?.

249. gingerly - April 16, 2013

246.

“Truly, you have an dizzying intellect.”

250. WaylanderNeo - April 16, 2013

@240 – Odd you should say something like that; A similar thought popped into my head about his last lines would be – however I focused on the lines “No ship should go down without her Captain” – which the trailer is designed for us to think its directed at Kirk, however I feel if you look at his body language, his eyes are transfixed to the viewscreen, could be watching the Enterprise go down or it could be that it Harrison is either monologging to himself as the ship goes down towards San Fransisco Bay (very Khan genesis device of him) or in response to a hail offering him to beam off the striken dreadnought.

251. Captain Karl - April 16, 2013

So how many ships on steroids will we need? The Enterprise is too freakishly huge to begin with (bigger than Enterprise -E) so let’s make one even bigger! SMH

With each venture into their new sandbox, it just gets sillier and sillier.

252. Etoposid - April 16, 2013

One thing that bugged me ( and may be totally silly ) that in the IMAX 7 Minutes before the hobbit, in the hospital we see this father who gets approached by mr harrison about a cure for his terminally ill child.

Far out there: Could this african american looking girl be actually Uhura ? ( in some sort of flashback ? ) adding an even more personal touch to the whole Harrison deal ? 20 years later … we have Harrison fallen from grace and attacking the federation ?

253. kmart - April 16, 2013

242 Phillip,

That ART OF STAR TREK book is full of goofs, and even though the writers did a better job on their Phase 2 book, the stuff about McQuarrie being on first prior to Adam is unlikely, given McQ’s stuff is much more developed (in a bad way, IMO.) The Adam sketches suggest speed lines, whereas the McQ is more like an Imperial Tortilla Chip with a goofy saucer stuck on. McQ took Adam’s largely interesting (but not quite there) sketches and produced a really awkward looking mess, which is reflected in those study models built (and seen decades later on TNG.)

As much as I wish we’d gotten PLANET OF THE TITANS instead of TMP, I do have to say that the E design would not have thrilled me. But the idea of having Ken Adam and Derek Meddings doing production design and miniature fx (and Jordan Belson doing opticals) is mindblowingly good.

254. Travis - April 16, 2013

@ 224 Steve Johnson: Before you see STID I want you to watch The Dark Knight! When you are finished, come back to me and tell me how good it was and maybe just maybe you will finally drink your V-8 Juice and finally get what JJ Abrams is doing!

@ 225: Gingerly: Whatever you just wrote made me do a ” facepalm! ” It’s called a Reboot and yes of course you can bring the same characters back and place them in this alt. universe timelines with a different story and different situation! You say that this movie is going to be like ” The Wrath of Khan? ” Maybe you should watch The Dark Knight as well with your V-8 Juice and come back to me and tell me how good that movie was…. Come on man…. Wake up!!!!!!

255. Jeffrey S. Nelson - April 16, 2013

It is logical to hypothesize that the cryo stasis chambers contained Khan (Harrison). This time around, he was resurrected elsewhere than on the Botany Bay, is all.

256. kmart - April 16, 2013

250,

I was thinking the same. I also wonder if the shots of Kirk & Scotty running are set on the other ship, not the E. Is it possible Harrison is letting them get off while he goes down with the ship? Would fit with the idea that this guy is an antagonist more than a villain, that he has ethical stature. If you’ve seen THE QUESTOR TAPES (the last thing Gene Coon wrote before dying), you’ll know what I mean.

That would change my view of the Abramsverse immensely (not that it has anywhere to go but up anyway.) Not holding my breath though, especially given those goddamn lens flares.

257. Nony - April 16, 2013

@252 Etoposid

It is not a flashback, because the scene is set in 2259, the year after the events of the last movie.

258. Curious Cadet - April 16, 2013

@172. Chris Roberts,
“I just don’t think that’s Harrison talking, when Kirk is called a pawn. @1.04 trailer. Sounds different.”

I agree. It sounds completely different than the rest of Cumberbatch’s voice over.

259. Jonboc - April 16, 2013

#244. “Rehashing the same villains in a reboot in a new universe is boring and lazy no matter how anyone might twist the story to make it “fresh”.”

Good thing they aren’t making the film for you then, as you will most assuredly dislike it, should Khan rear his head.

The rest of us…the ones who can’t wait to see it, regardless of who the villain is, and the ones who cant wait because they’re hoping Cumberbatch is Khan and ones who wouldn’t know Khan from Mr. T., but can’t wait because they loved the first film… are the ones this film is being marketed to. And we are the ones who will make it a huge success…much to your disgruntled dislike I’m sure. :)

So sit back, put in your earplugs, sip some earl grey and watch TNG, because the buzz is loud….the momentum is building…and you’re not going to be able to stop it. Sorry. :)

260. TrekMadeMeWonder - April 16, 2013

The JJ-Prise looks a little more in scale in my retouch. I just wanted to see how that looks. Here it is for your viewing enjoyment…

http://s1236.photobucket.com/user/TrekMadeMeWonder/media/JJEvsTOSE.jpg.html#/user/TrekMadeMeWonder/media/JJEvsTOSE.jpg.html?&_suid=1366156966265046751526609956256

261. Ben - April 16, 2013

Rumors I’ve read indicated the size of the Enterprise would be firmly established in this move. I can already tell they’ve downsized the vessel compared to her appearance in the 2009 outing.

Note the picture of Kirk standing at the view screen and the preceding wide shot; you can easily tell the ship has been more correctly sized based on the revised bridge window.

I think they are going with a size larger than the TOS Enterprise but perhaps a little smaller than an Excelsior Class starship.

262. Superman - April 16, 2013

#49: that ship with the “missing saucer pieces” is the Intrepid type ship from Enterprise:

http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/schematics/earth-ship1a.jpg

263. spock - April 16, 2013

The ship that jumps infront of Enterprise and shoots at it, doesn’t look like the starship in the side by side shot.

264. TrekMadeMeWonder - April 16, 2013

Concerning a possible Borg tie-in…

http://s1236.photobucket.com/user/TrekMadeMeWonder/media/JJEvsTOSE.jpg.html#/user/TrekMadeMeWonder/media/BORG-LIKE.jpg.html?&_suid=13661569446400656504065377878

I don’t know. The tech is looking similar. In fact it looks like Picard’s old Enterprise, only coverered in Borg tech. Am I reaching?

265. TrekMadeMeWonder - April 16, 2013

Not so, Super. @262.

266. RNase-free Jeff - April 16, 2013

Can’t wait for this one to hit the theaters!

267. TrekMadeMeWonder - April 16, 2013

I could see Orci geeking as he wrote a story about Trek’s worst foes going up against Kirk.

268. EonStrife - April 16, 2013

what is that captain John Harriman with his Enterprise-B doing here ?

Eh wrong person, it’s John Harrison.

269. WaylanderNeo - April 16, 2013

@259 While I like the idea – the corriders look too much like the E to be any other ship – Of what we have seen of the dreadnought they have gone to great length to overemphasize the “darkness” of that ship. Dark bridge, Dark exterior and if we are to assume the images of Harrison fighting and Scotty in the “cargo bay” are also taken from that ship then the logical assumption would be the corridors are also “dark”.

From everything with been provided so far; I wouldn’t expect any more nobility fron Harrison beyond going down with the ship.

270. Huggybear - April 16, 2013

@58 Re: the shot of Scottie possibly being on a new engineering we versus the “beer factory”. I thought the same thing and very much hope so. The beer factory juxtaposed against the iBridge always sat really wrong with me – didn’t seem possible they were on board the same ship in the same decade, or even century,

271. Jack - April 16, 2013

You guys and your clues. Sure, there are plenty of clues. Big, clunky clues. Which is exactly why Khan seems way too obvious.

Trek ’09 DVD commentary, talk of casting Del Toro, internet leaks, black hair, Carol Marcus, cryo-tubes, he’s better at everything, darkness, the cast saying they’ve had to lie… all clues, but not real evidence.

Still could be, but I really hope it’s not quite that simple.

272. Ted C - April 16, 2013

Dreadnaught? Why does Anthony keep calling it that? Where is it written from the movie production that that is what it’s called? Yo Tony, dont make stuff up for crying out loud.

273. Jack - April 16, 2013

“Now we get Carol Marcus, rapid aging, these hands on plexiglass scene, the cryotubes, Khan’s ribbed collar…still people don’t think it’s Khan.”

You understand that none of these things necessarily have anything to do with Khan, right? They just, other than the cryotubes, happened to appear in the same movie. Are we saying only Khan can wear ribbed collars?

What does rapid aging have to do with Khan?

Genetic manipulation, sure.

274. Jack - April 16, 2013

272. Because it was mentioned in the preview scene reported earlier today, wasn’t it? Either that or Anthony has a copy of the script on his desk.

275. Jack - April 16, 2013

254. Every movie trailer looks like the movie’s ripping off Dark Knight Rises… even Nicholas Sparks stuff.

Why not wait to see the movie before calling it derivative…

276. I stab at thee! - April 16, 2013

The shot of the Enterprise v. the Dreadnaught. Looks like a certain Nebula..anybody got $5.00 on it being the Mutara Nebula?

277. Curious Cadet - April 16, 2013

@276 I stab at thee!,

OMG, another KLOO!! It MUST be Khan!

278. Yanks - April 16, 2013

Holy crap. I’m more excited now than ever.

This is going to be one hell of a ride!

It’s still not Khan, but they could be setting the 3rd movie up for Khan though.

Anthony, thanks once again for a GREAT shot-by-shot. I don’t know how I saw ST09 without coming here.

Here is the Sovereign looking Dreadnought.

279. Yanks - April 16, 2013

Sorry, click “Yanks” above for the pic.

280. Jack Zymurgy - April 16, 2013

I’m sure the Comics/April connection will be made when Chris North’s character turns up in the film.

https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-kWW6_tbGtvA/UQFIrPhmwwI/AAAAAAAAAEc/L_ROUR09puA/s757/IsNorthPlayingApril.001.jpg

281. DonDonP1 - April 16, 2013

@1 As did the shot of Captain Kirk saying “Let’s go get that sonuva.”

282. Son of Jello - April 16, 2013

#120 DeflectorDishGuy

“Trumped up hipster” love it!

To the other two that will remain numberless “retarded? spazzy?” This is Star Trek fellas were better than that.

I hope there is not going to be some Star Trek fan yelling abuse about JJ Abrams and storming out of the cinima when they see something they dont agree with. Like the 2009 incident in the cinema I saw ST09.

The black ship certainly has a very similar silhouette as the Excelsior class the primary hull seems to have voids in it. I have seen images similar to this one.http://www.suricatafx.com/wp-content/flagallery/portfolio/shipconcept.jpg I cant remember where I have seen them wether they are fan based designs, from the online game or from the TNG Enterprise E era.

I really hope they steal the Enterprise.

283. Aix - April 16, 2013

I hate that the Man of Steel trailer is raining on STiD’s parade. Haha.

284. Hugh Hoyland - April 16, 2013

What a great time to be a Trekker! I have a feeling this movie is going to rock.

These guys have elevated Trek to a whole new level IMO. :]

285. Logical - April 16, 2013

Did anyone consider that the Enterprise-E followed the Narada back and its crew was killed?

286. Travis - April 16, 2013

@ 275 JACK: I’m sorry did you write something? I forgot to put my glasses to see that small writing! Lmao

287. Travis - April 16, 2013

@ 285 Logical: The Enterprise-E at the time Nero and Old Spock near went thru the black hole!

288. The Observer - April 16, 2013

The Not-Khan guy would give me more confidence if he could come up with a viable alternative. No way I’m buying Harrison is just Harrison. They gave us Nero’s name months before production. You don’t play all these games when all you got is John Harrison. And with the cast now openly expressing relief that the game is almost over…

And don’t get me started on super powered April.

289. Steve Johnson - April 16, 2013

254. Travis

What in the name of Sagan’s first born are you talking about? First, I’ve seen The Dark Knight. Second, we’re all just as aware as the next person of what the people behind STID are doing. We all have our opinions. That’s what the discussion is about.

And I dislike V-8, you can have it.

290. Dilithium_doublebock - April 16, 2013

It has to be Khan. He has a ribbed collar. Didn’t you people see the ribbed collar? Ribbed collar = Khan. Of course, Kirk and crew also had ribbed collars in WOK so it could just as easily mean Cumberbatch is in starfleet. Oh wait . . . He is in starfleet. Is this still a Klue?

Not Khan.

291. Superman - April 16, 2013

If there’s any doubt:

http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/4223/stidintrepid.jpg

292. Valenti - April 16, 2013

All this back and forth about Harrison being Khan or not strongly reminds me of Mass Effect’s indoctrination theory, as concocted by a bunch of fans.

One side seems to be -completely- convinced it’s true and tries to draw the rest in, while the other side just calls it bull.

Anyway!

Loved the trailer.

293. pock speared - April 16, 2013

Chekov is toast. Is expired. Is an ex-perogi.

Bones: “Don’t worry kid, I’ll get that space-email to yer mom!”

294. Curious Cadet - April 16, 2013

@288. The Observer,
“No way I’m buying Harrison is just Harrison.”

Of course not. He’s a character from canon. Bob Orci said that months ago.

295. Keachick - April 16, 2013

“What does rapid aging have to do with Khan?
Genetic manipulation, sure.”

Or – progeria?

296. Trek Fan - April 16, 2013

It’s not Khan. I am certain of that. The character is completely different from what we know of Khan. Why would Khan be in Starfleet? Khan would never be a “follower” in Starfleet. His ego is too big, he is a ruler… he is a dictator.. he is a leader. He would never be in Starfleet.

The whole Khan rumor is a marketing ploy to create buzz. It’s good business to have people speculate who “Harrison” is … heck, it’s good for Trekmovie too… get more people discussing it… get more hits… etc. Smart marketing that you don’t have to pay for! But no… won’t be Khan.

297. James Regulus Kirk - April 16, 2013

@293. pock speared

I’ve had a bad feeling about this for about a year. I hope I’m wrong but I had the same hunch about Vulcan since 2008.

298. captain spock - April 16, 2013

If you click on the pictures they get bigger & you can see more on whats in them like the one with harrison it saids unknow you cant read it with the naked eye but when you make it bigger you can see more of whats in each picture.

299. Marja - April 16, 2013

Anthony, I love the shot-by-shot analyses of the trailers. And the “awesome” and “still working on it” Kirks!

Why are the warrior Klingons wearing helmets? Seems un-Klingon to me. “This is a good day to die – in my protective helmet” – maybe Klingons are more chicken in the Alt-verse – amusing thought.

That huge, dark ship does indeed look like the designs from TNG. I like the “stealth” aspect of it, and the dark bridge – although it looks “evil” – makes a lot more sense for bridge personnel’s vision of their individual stations than our brightly lit Enterprise bridge. Black on the exterior only references today’s stealth technology – with the sensors of the future, ships should be able to read each other … hmm, unless it has some sort of cloaking technology or shielding.

Perhaps Harrison is going down with his ship, very noble – or deceptive.

I think a great many of the sequences/shots from the trailer are deceptively placed out of place from where they’ll be in the actual movie.

Kirk does a lot of growing, and I see a developing friendship between him and Spock. “I cannot allow you to do this” sounds a lot like TOS Spock to TOS Kirk, who would stubbornly reply, “It’s my responsibility!”

Khan, not-Khan, Feh! It would be interesting if it’s Garth – redeem a powerful, crafty, crazy character from a terrible ep from the original series. Why not?

I think Harrison and Adm Marcus are in cahoots. Harrison is the spearhead bad guy and Marcus now has a justification for his Black Ops vision. Section 31 or something very much like it.

I say again, I love the new Enterprise. I don’t care what size she is. She is beautiful and I hope they don’t redesign her. I loved the old Enterprises too, but in their time and place. This version is gorgeous. So I hope Scotty puts her together just the way she started out in ST2009!

And lord I will be very disappointed if Pike dies. I love Bruce Greenwood in the role.
It’s ALL CONJECTURE! ; D

Looking forward to seeing how all this fits together. Heaven help me, I can’t seem to resist spoilers.

Must … stop … reading

300. DeflectorDishGuy - April 16, 2013

IT’S NOT KHAN!

301. Marja - April 16, 2013

A question:

Who or what is this GATT2000 of which you speak?

302. Anthony Pascale - April 16, 2013

To be clear the ship is described (from the CInemaCon preview) as a “Dreadnought-class” ship. The name of the ship has not been revealed.

303. Admiral Nogura - April 16, 2013

SPOILER ALERT!!!

Cumberbatch is Arne Darvin, the surgically altered Klingon from Trouble With Tribbles.

304. BC - April 16, 2013

@ 292 i agree.can we please just be logical here? wait and see the movie. khans indian in origin not british and everything would have to be exactly as canon as the “original reality” up until 2233 so its not khan, its not the excelsior, its not the reliant, its not the nx-01 lets wait and see the movie. be patient its almost here.

305. Lemingsworth Bint - April 16, 2013

294.

Who?

306. TrekkerChick - April 16, 2013

@299

The ship was launched early…and the final exterior paint was scheduled to be done next Tuesday.

307. Kev - April 16, 2013

NFXstudios – no three times, once honorably with the original (wish they could have saved her in 3, I miss that one and her matt militaristic sets)

then the enterprise C off screen

then the D which was in peak condition unlike the other two by a wimpy 20 year old bird of prey, and a faulty warp core ejection system that never works when you need it to

and both of those were the ones people really cared about, the Refit original and the D.

and yes they made it so she had a glass jaw alot in the show, but that’s bad writing at work, not the fault of the ship.

just bad writers along the lines of the ones who wrote that voyager nearly got taken out by a cheese based infection with its gel packs by NELIX

difference this time is well honestly I dont care its an ugly ship anyways, both of them, too buck rogers and Apple store for my taste like modern car design and I’m getting rather tired of the enterprise dealing with superships all of a sudden

first the E with the Romulan supership, then Nero with a supership, then this one with a gigantic rail gun throwing balls at the faux enterprise.

hell we’re going to need a new star trek 4 at this point that’s upbeat and fun a 100% of the way, because this is getting ridiculous

and with what happened yesterday in boston in my backyard the plot is not exactly kosher anymore to me

and for me to care for this enterprise and its crew its gotta earn it, so far from what I’ve seen of the trailers and this one and the previous, I’m not looking forward to it.

and STOP SAYING THAT LOOKS LIKE X SHIP or my enterprise D, the excelsior or any of the greats, it doesnt look anything like that

looks like the BLOODY USS Grissom if anything on viagra!

and I’m gonna do like I did the last time, wait a week for the movie to come out and then listen to Matthew, SFdebris, Linkara and the Cinema snob and then decide if I want to go see it, but this trailer with the black supership again just killed it

and Tombot post154 has the best comment hands down!

and with the previous Khan ship keep in mind, point blank to the engineering section.

I believe he had studied the plans of the original ship in space seed and knew right where to hit with the shields down and a ship with good firepower at point blank to the part of the ship that creates power

both parts of the ship that produced power, the warp drive and impulse, a 1, 2 punch

and doesnt matter if its a .22 or a .45 point blank its gonna do some serious damage, especially if the main energizer is right under the hull instead of well hidden in the engineering section like it was in TOS, really wish they had made a point to explain that had been fixed in the A along with making her more aerodynamic but that never happened sadly.

although I think the idea of him going after him for revenge if its pike dieing does make sense, I just cant believe how sort of dorky the new enterprise with the tos uniforms looks compared to the other ship and the black uniforms

its like a rockstar beating up a hipster with this weird TMP color scheme and TOS uniforms, no wonder they switched over to the dark red ones with ST 2, as it looks like an explosion in a rainbow factory on the big screen with the old ones.

I’m sorry it does, I kinda wish it had stayed in the past.

308. Walt Kozlowski - April 16, 2013

Love The Dreadnaught! Would make a great model kit! Unlike Nero’s 7 mile long pine-apple .Don’t get me wrong, the Narada like the Borg Cube were unique and there size menacing but neither looked like a spacecraft.

309. Jax Maxton - April 16, 2013

@303

Dude! I’d be on board with that!

310. Ran - April 16, 2013

Again, this movie is going to be an ILM extravaganza. JJ cannot tell a story without blowing up $150 million on visual effects. I hope there are more dialogues than the 2009 movie and that I don’t have to check my brain at the door.

311. Son of Jello - April 16, 2013

I really dont like the idea of Khan being in STITD I think its a bit of a cop out. But if he is Starfleet could have found the Botany bay and recognising them for what they represent as a resource. They are handed over to a 3rd party to keep there distance from them (plausable deniability). And SF has been using them to do there dirty work. In a way this use of them could give them no recourse or rights and Harrison while a part of this group but not Khan could be out for revenge due to becoming P.O. by his people being treated as expendable. And while superior to an average human being kept and used as lower forms in the human chain has gotten Harrison very upset by what he has seen happen to his people. The cryo tubes could just be the botany bay crew in storage to be taken out and used by starfleet when they want grubby work done.

They may have been given the tools and the support of Starfleet equiptment and taken their orders from SF but are not recognised as being a part of or protected by the federations philosophy when in comes to the rights of sentient life forms . Maybe the speil from SF to them is that they have been given the protection by SF as they are all wanted criminals and should be greatfull for this and the freedom’s granted to them. But the price to them is to die quietly doing as they are told with no posibility for there own recogniton as being a part of Humanity and being afforded the same rights as the rest of the federations population. If you dont do what we tell you to do you will be exposed and we will no longer be able to protect you.

Either way they are under a death sentence but co operation is the better of the two options. Like a lot of people have mentioned Nero could have really freaked SF out and they are acting out of fear and not acting to Federation principles. Sounds like I lot of governments in the modern world. That put what they stand for aside to do things in the dark and justify it to themselvs by saying its the only way to keep their population safe.

312. John Bigbooté - April 16, 2013

Cumberbatch is playing Picard, people.

Search your feelings. You know it to be true.

313. Jim Phelps - April 17, 2013

Those smoke trails leading to the Enterprise nacelles and blowing them up is its own photon torpedoes (the ball things) being used against them. You can see where the smoke trail clearly leads out of the front of the torpedo launcher on the neck and towards the Dreadnought and then turns back. Looks like the Dreadnaught somehow rerouted the torpedoes back to the Enterprise.

314. Son of Jello - April 17, 2013

Heres an ugly thought. When Starfleet found the Botany Bay they executed Khan because they new they could never controle and take advantage of his people while he was still alive. Called it an acident with a cryo tube and morned with his followers to gain their trust.

315. Son of Jello - April 17, 2013

The missles/torpedos behave in a similar way to the ones from Nero’s ship.

316. kmart - April 17, 2013

267,
Worst villains? Do you mean you expect to see the Pakleds turn up?

317. Oxford - April 17, 2013

@299 Marja
Aren’t they wearing helmets to cover the dishonour of their lack of brow ridges because of the Klingon augment virus?
That Enterprise era part of the timeline hasn’t been reset.

318. Theatre Historian Levi - April 17, 2013

303) can you back up your claims on this?
At one point months ago I suspected he could be, but I suspect now thats unlikely.

319. Theatre Historian Levi - April 17, 2013

If Khan is in the story, then I am willing to bet that he isnt played by Benedict.

320. Phil - April 17, 2013

@318. I doubt it…

321. MB2088 - April 17, 2013

i think it’s an excelsior. two reasons.

first. it looks like one. the saucer and stardrive sections look right on, and so does the main deflector. And so does the fat dark neck that connects the two sections. i always thought that ribbed neck was the most distinguishing feature of the excelsior class. sure, the nacels are big and dopey, but so are the enterprise’s. that’s how abrams likes his nacels…big and dopey. also, ok, this new excelsior is wayyy bigger than it originally was…but just blame that on alternative-universe future romulan tech stuff.

second. in the TOS movies, the excelsior class was supposed to be bigger, faster, more badass than the enterprise. remember, it was like the “next big thing” and kirk and crew, particularly scotty, were kinda jealous of it. so it would make sense for a movie set in the same time period for the dangerous more powerful ship that the enterprise has to face to be an excelsior.

322. Colin - April 17, 2013

I am not liking this new ship. This behemoth has the height of the Empire State Building, and is nearly a mile long, and has a BFG. On top of that, it can go to warp 24. Color me not impressed.

323. Jim Phelps - April 17, 2013

@322 Collin

If you stood the Titanic up on it’s end, it would have been the height of the Empire State Building

324. Kapten Kerk - April 17, 2013

@242: The design studies of Star Trek: Planet of the Titans NOT the design studies of Star Trek: Phase II
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Star_Trek:_Planet_of_the_Titans
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Star_Trek:_Phase_II

@260 I like yours better.

@291 No. It’s the Newton-type from ST09: http://www.shipschematics.net/startrek/images/federation/heavyfrigate_newton_nu.jpg

And I still believe that the DREDDnought is Dr. Leonard “Bones” McCoy’s ship ;-)

325. Mee - April 17, 2013

Prediction…

Pike gets killed

“The ship is dead… meaning the one in the bay..

Trailers do show a military style funeral and an even more personal motivation for Kirk to go after Harrison..

Just saying.

326. Ben R - April 17, 2013

For everyone saying that John Harrison is playing Khan…

No matter how much some people really don’t like JJ Abrams, he doesn’t like to just rehash plots that have already been done before. That of course could lead into the whole Star Wars/Star Trek 2009 argument but that’s a whole other thing…

Here is my opinion on who John Harrison is… what if he’s just a guy who’s an analogy for the modern age (now) and for the 9/11 environment that was created by the destruction of Vulcan? The producers have said that Vulcan’s destruction had that effect on the Federation. If there’s more to him and he really is someone fantastical from before just re-imagined by a great actor? How is that not good?

And lastly… here’s my number one argument by how John Harrison NOT Khan. True the movie may elude to Khan BUT the Eugenics War has not been changed by the Abramsverse changes. Therefore? Khan should still be in a freezer floating through the galaxy. Those who’ve seen the 9 minute IMAX preview know where Harrison starts out at… and therefore he is NOT in a freezer. Also this is supposed to be even BEFORE the Enterprise sets out on the 5 year mission, right? So Khan should be WAY far away from this story… in theory. Maybe Star Trek 3?

Anyways, that’s my… ten dollars? I personally think Harrison is just an analogy for today (political agendas, xenophobia possibly? Isolationism and war mongering?)… which is not exactly unheard of in Star Trek…

327. Michael - April 17, 2013

It’s probably Khan, there’s tonnes of hints that way. The other ship is not the enterprise E and John Harrison is not Picard. Only a fan boy would ever think that was a good idea, or even a possibility. So many levels of dumb in these comments.

328. Oliver Wergers - April 17, 2013

Maybe this Ship is some Kind of Narada Killer.

Built my Section 31 and the Klingons. (They maybe knew something about the technology because they were on the Narada)
Section 31 helpt building it to prevent further Attacks. Section 31 promised the Klingons to defend them with this Ship.

The Federation disagred with Harrisons Plans, because technology from the Future would harm the Prime Directiv.

Harrison wants revenge because he could have stopt the destruction of Vulcan.

He wants the Control over the Federation.
At the same time he is hunt by the Klingons. He have not saved the Klingon fleet destroyed by the Narada and is now a Target of the Brotherhood…

329. Platitude - April 17, 2013

That ship is HUGE!

330. Son of Jello - April 17, 2013

#301 Marja

Gatt2000 This is about all there is . http://trekmovie.com/2012/12/10/alice-eve-character-7-more-star-trek-into-darkness-characterstory-details-revealed-at-bad-robot-visit/ He kind of sounds like Lobot from Star Wars

331. chrismireya - April 17, 2013

PREDICTIONS/THOUGHTS:

1.) Kirk meets with Pike following his violation of the Prime Directive. This is when Kirk says that he is sorry.

2.) Pike dies in the attack on Starfleet HQ — where Kirk has been reprimanded for violating the Prime Directive.

3.) “Johnathan Harrison” is one of the genetically engineered super humans from the Eugenics Wars (one of the 84 who survived) — created in the same vein as Khan. He may have been “rescued” by Section 31.

4.) Information gathered from either Spock Prime (Nimoy) or the Narada (or both) was used to intercept the Botany Bay (and prevent disasters like dead humpback whales, etc…) — but the info is also intercepted or stolen to create this new Dreadnought ship.

5.) The Dreadnought ship will be built by the Klingons using Klingon armor and a cloaking device. Harrison gathers an army of Klingons to join him after he shows his “superior intellect” and super strength.

6.) John Harrison is fighting against his “creator” — the people who engineered him and then revived him for selfish purposes and whose “reeducation” attempts failed.

7.) One member of the crew will die. However, the Enterprise will not be completely destroyed…but overhauled…and it will more closely resemble the movie Enterprise.

332. Star Trek: Nemesis blows, is the point - April 17, 2013

@177. The Enterprise-D is destroyed at least 5 or 6 times in “Cause and Effect.”

333. El Chup - April 17, 2013

Am I the only one who saw the two ships facing off and immediately thought of the climax of Nemesis?

Hardly a good sign!

334. Classy M - April 17, 2013

Why on earth would anyone think Cumberbatch was playing Picard because ‘they sound identical’?

He and Stewart sound nothing alike. I can only assume people coming up with this daft idea are not British and have no ear for the massive differences in the two actors’ accents.

Stewart is a Yorkshire man and though his accent is blunted, it’s still apparent. Cumberbatch is a Londoner and sounds like it (albeit with Public School overtones).

Seriously, it’s like saying Al Pacino should appear in True Grit because he sounds just like John Wayne!

If Cumberbatch wasn’t English like Stewart, what evidence is there for this cockamamie notion? Would someone please enlighten me because I don’t get it.

335. NuWisdom - April 17, 2013

I see JJ and crew borrowed from obscure Trek novels again…. this time a very old series of books, TOS books, called the Fortunes of War saga, Dreadnought and Battlestations! specifically. Perhaps others too.

336. Jason Buffalo - April 17, 2013

Just a quick note: the Starship that crashes in SF is NOT Harrsion ship but another Starship, the saucer section of each Starship does not match, also
the nacelle struts are closer together on the Dreadnought (but hard to see) then the one Crashing in SF Bay.

337. Fluke - April 17, 2013

That “Dreadnought” bears a striking resemblance to John Eaves Doughnut ship, not the science one but the other one. The profile of the nacelles with the earth backdrop matches up the similarities in the open saucer with central command decks. Not exact but has a lot of similar ques to them in various places.

http://johneaves.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/starship-e.jpg

JJPrise cannot be any smaller than 400m any smaller and areas of the ship become impossible to move in. Not to mention things like the struts start getting way to skinny say 4ft thick or so. Saucer rim at any length below 300m is only 1 deck thick, remember you have more than just the 8~10ft deck but all the crap in the floors and ceilings. The shuttle bay even in a TOS layout breaks as well as the neck of the ship becomes way to skinny even for a basic turbolift. not to mention various known details like docking rings become 3f dai holes. Get a trail copy of max or lightwave dl any of the models out there for the jjprise scale it to a avg human height of 5’10” and you will see the mass just does not work at those sizes. This trailer it is obvious they had a fiddle with the whole bridge area, I just hope they checked the ship over before using the scale took in maya or whatever they used for this.

Even scaled at a conservative 400m that dreadnaught is huge. 1200m.
Overall the ship screams ugly STO (not the stuff eaves did early on but the wtf kitbashing latter design work)

338. nachos - April 17, 2013

So is anyone else thinking that the bad guy is Picard ?

339. Olli - April 17, 2013

@338:
No!
Sorry but why and how should it be Picard???

340. nachos - April 17, 2013

Also maybe it is NCC-1701-E and going through the black hole caused Picard to age backwards? Maybe it also caused his mind to go “bad” and that is why he becomes what he becomes.

341. Aix - April 17, 2013

Could that big ship be Admiral Marcus’? Weller did say he has a ship in the movie.

342. Josh C. - April 17, 2013

Has anyone pointed out yet that Picard is French, not British, yet?

343. Khan 2.0 - April 17, 2013

283 – i know its like “oh wow new star trek is that Picards Enterprise wow it all looks pretty co..HOLY F***KING SH*T SUPERMAN!!! OH MAN IT LOOKS AMAZING” blah blah etc

(MOS does look great though lol)

344. Ben Yoris - April 17, 2013

@342

Je n’aurais pas dit mieux.
(I couldn’t have said it better.)

345. Jack - April 17, 2013

The speculatron’s overheating.

346. Ben Yoris - April 17, 2013

A young Picard ?

Tom Hardy already portrayed that. With the success that we know…

347. Sherlock - April 17, 2013

@291 Superman

It’s a Newton-type Starfleet Vessel. It’s already been there in the first movie.
See here
http://www.google.de/imgres?imgurl=http://www.scenicreflections.com/files/USS_Newton_Wallpaper__yvt2.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.scenicreflections.com/download/496609/USS_Newton_Wallpaper/&h=768&w=1024&sz=355&tbnid=gqdiC6PL2uSYgM:&tbnh=90&tbnw=120&prev=/search%3Fq%3Duss%2Bnewton%26tbm%3Disch%26tbo%3Du&zoom=1&q=uss+newton&usg=__aXebYg0mdeseDbUf4eVsGr1ObQA=&docid=SFzArh54id4eVM&sa=X&ei=rpluUZaiEMGCtAaZ-YCgAQ&ved=0CD8Q9QEwAg&dur=661

And there
http://www.google.de/imgres?q=starships+star+trek+2009+art+of+the+film&um=1&client=opera&sa=N&rls=de&hl=de&tbm=isch&tbnid=n0BV4SqStEFVcM:&imgrefurl=http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/schematics/stxi_ships.htm&docid=cOL77whDSLnK9M&imgurl=http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/schematics/stxi-concept-chart.jpg&w=706&h=1051&ei=35huUZj8IsXatAbiy4CABg&zoom=1&iact=hc&vpx=12&vpy=12&dur=360&hovh=274&hovw=184&tx=46&ty=59&page=1&tbnh=144&tbnw=95&start=0&ndsp=40&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0,i:85&biw=1680&bih=832

348. Sherlock - April 17, 2013

@ 280
excellent analysis. Somebody’s using evidence. Fascinating.
Anyhow it HAS to be Khan. Anything else would be a crime against fanboy religion and highly speculative.

How come my posts always get deleted anyway?

349. drumvan - April 17, 2013

i would rather look at the jj-prise all day everyday (even with it’s dimensional inconsistency) than the ugly duckling that is enterprise-d or the bathtub that is enterprise-b. now refit/a and f are top of the heap imho.

350. drumvan - April 17, 2013

opps i meant refit/a and “e” are top of the heap.

351. Damian - April 17, 2013

I’m afraid I’m in the non-Khan camp. I agree there is evidence to support Khan, but I would be hugely disappointed. First of all, Cumberbatch is nowhere near the right nationality for Khan, neither Hispanic like Montalban, or Sikh like the character.

Based on what I’ve seen so far, I’m more in the camp that Cumberbatch is not actually Khan, but that Khan is a background force, maybe an inspiration to what is going on with Harrison. That’s sort of my take.

352. Elias Javalis - April 17, 2013

Some fans here mention section 31..I could believe that..Dreadnought has the same color as the uniforms..sounds edgy but still possible:)

353. Admiral_Bumblebee - April 17, 2013

1. So we know that the dreadnaught gets destroyed and crashes into Alcatraz ;)

2. How big is the dreadnaught? The Enterprise is supposed to be 725 meters long. The dreadnaught looks like to be three or for times the size of the Enterprise. So it must be next to three kilometers long… Come on, how big can ships get?

354. CJS - April 17, 2013

I’d be surprised if Harrison is Khan. It’s possible, but not likely. Related to the original Khan story-line (i.e. an augment or one of the other men in stasis on the Botany Bay) would definitely make more sense. Of course with this writing and directing team, sense is not always and option.

355. Superquerulant - April 17, 2013

That`s what I think:

Admiral Marcus wants to protect his projects at any costs – That`s why he is willing to destroy the Enterprise.

But much more important for the ending of this movie will be that he probably even tricks Harrison by telling him that his fellow augments are dead – That`s why Harrison looks so sad when he takes over the command of the battle cruiser (and always remember: “I`ll walk over your dead bodies”).

So the big revelation at the end will be: Despite the fact that Admiral Marcus and his evil ship (which could start a whole “hot war”) have been stopped Harrison`s fellow augments aren`t dead and one of the last shots may be the waking up of Khan or the scene with the cryo tubes…

356. Sherlock - April 17, 2013

@ 352

depends on the laws of physics in your universe…
http://www.theforce.net/swtc/Pix/cg/bop/xvt-bop.jpg

357. Curious Cadet - April 17, 2013

@331. chrismireya,
“Johnathan Harrison” is one of the genetically engineered super humans from the Eugenics Wars (one of the 84 who survived) — created in the same vein as Khan. He may have been “rescued” by Section 31.”

Why does it keep coming back to Khan and the Eugenics wars augments?

If a shadow organization within Starfleet like Section 31 wanted to experiment with genetic manipulation, they don’t need Khan, the Botany Bay, nor any other 20th century augment who may still be hibernating in a deep freeze. They have all of the research from the scientists who created them, Enterprise confirmed that.

People keep trying to shoe-horn Khan or the augments into John Harrison as working in league with them … But again why would a Section 31 try to re-educate soldiers from the 21st century, much less trust them, when they could build their own, loyal from birth? With better technology!? I mean who here really believes gene manipulation technology from the 1960s was more advanced than it will be 250 years from now?

The only reasonably plausible explanation for a Khan et al would be if he were trying to infiltrate and take over Starfleet on his own, having been awakened by a Mudd, or the Klingons. But then there’s no real motive for John Harrison’s agenda as Khan, much less revenge on the whole of Earth (other than he has gone insane — so tired). And the revelation of the Dreadnought, April, Admiral Marcus etc. all speaks to something much larger and more sinister than Khan.

While I concede there was once some possibility Harrison was Khan, that is all but gone now. A conspiracy story within Starfleet will more than fill a two hour movie without trying to wedge in an overly complicated plotline involving 20th century eugenics experiments and grafting an ill-fitting story onto one of the most inspired characters to emerge from Star Trek, just to be able to use his name as a shocker for hard-core fans only at the end of the film (because the rest of the audience won’t know who Khan is, much less care).

If you wanna go down the whole eugenics rabbit hole, I’d rather take the background extra character Harrison seen in Space Seed and others, assume his first name is John, and volunteer him for a Captain America-like shadow project transforming him into a loyal Starfleet super soldier. To explain him to fans, all you have to say is his pale skin is a side-effect of the gene therapy (much more reasonable than Khan underwent cosmetic surgery and more gene manipulation to disguise his identity from a population who have no idea who he is/was much less care). Then you have a home grown loyal Starfleet insider, trusted with secret ops information, whom you can screw over a la Bourne Legacy without a bunch of Khan baggage that has to be bastardized to reconcile with what we’ve seen so far.

358. Curious Cadet - April 17, 2013

@356^^^ MORE,

But that’s IF you really need a genetic manipulation story at all.

The April/prime directive plot line offers enough to build a good original story, unique to Star Trek, without rehashing generic Jack Ryan/Jason Bourne plot lines.

I really hope they stay far away from any genetics related sub-plots at all.

359. filmboy - April 17, 2013

Some good thoughts and theories on what STID could be. I found this trailer to be far and wide the best one they have released to date. The music is pitch perfect and the focus on Kirk is appropriate and welcome.

First, I will say that Section 31 will be play a part in this film. I keep thinking to myself what Starfleet would do, internally, after the Narada. The destruction of Vulcan is the equivalent of a major US city being destroyed or a section of the country being destroyed.

I can imagine the US would be open to more morally questionable things in the aftermath of an attack of that magnitude. So could Starfleet. I would imagine that Starfleet dramatically expanded Section 31 and it’s scope and power after the events of the first film. There would be more counterintelligence, more development of defense systems, and even some shady dealings to secure the safety of Earth.

That Dreadnaught vessel was born of this expansion of Section 31. Now whether it was constructed as a result of shared knowledge between Starfleet and the Klingons (i.e. Narada blueprints) remains to be seen. But it definitely was built in response to the arrival of the Narada.

But here is where things get kinda confusing me. We know that it took almost 3 years for the Enterprise to be completed. We see her under construction when Kirk is in Iowa and then she is completed when Kirk is set to graduate. If the Dreadnaught ship was constructed after the events of the first film, how did they build it so fast?

If it was already in existence, then why was it not deployed when the Narada attacked Vulcan? That to me is a question that I would like answered. Was it simply that Section 31 didn’t want to reveal their hand, so to speak, and decided to not deploy that ship? If so, then there is definitely some responsibility on their part for the destruction of Vulcan.

I don’t know, if this movie were set 2 years after the first one then it makes more sense to me. But only 9 months, well that raises questions like the ones above.

360. Khan 2.0 - April 17, 2013

one thing no one seems to have picked up on is why has Pine got his hair styled the opposite way to Kirk had in TOS?? (and how Pine vaguely had it in ST09 – as if to foreshadow the classic Kirk forelock over the forehead)

is it a subtle nod to the fact that this is all taking place in an alternate universe/dimention where things arent quite the same? like in the Roy Thinnes (David Vincent) movie Journey To The Far Side Of The Sun (aka Doppleganger)

361. Khan 2.0 - April 17, 2013

its even more surprising when you take into account Pine has it combed the correct Kirk way in interviews to promote STID!

362. Khan 2.0 - April 17, 2013

@1 & 160 regarding the ‘mirror’ shots

the same thing happened occationally in TOS…but seems odd they would do it in a 150m movie

ironically Kirk has his hair parted the correct Shatner TOS way in his mirror reverse shot

363. Michael li - April 17, 2013

It looks like a galaxy class, the enemy ship. Like enterprise D, Picard’s ship.

364. Markus - April 17, 2013

It is not Harisson saying “you’re a pawn”, but an American accent, like Admiral Marcus…

365. RDG - April 17, 2013

I highly doubt that I’m right about this, but I’m going to throw it out there because I haven’t seen anyone mention it.

Dr. Bashir is genetically enhanced, worked for Section 31, and speaks with an accent. Just saying.

366. JohnRambo - April 17, 2013

@363. Michael li

..no

367. rogerachong - April 17, 2013

I am almost certain that in the Enterprise vs Dredd-Naught faceoff pic we see as the bacdrop the Eagle Nebula.

It is catalogued as Messier 16 or M16, and as NGC 6611, and is also known as the Star Queen Nebula. It is a young open cluster of stars in the constellation Serpens, discovered by Jean-Philippe de Cheseaux in 1745-46. Its name derives from its shape that is thought to resemble an eagle. It is the subject of the famous “Pillars of Creation” photograph by the Hubble Space Telescope that shows pillars of star-forming gas and dust within the nebula.

How appropriate as this encounter occurs far from Earth???!!

Also last December with the Bad Robot visit AP posted a “new” pic of Kirk with a dark background. This shot is seen in this trailer when Kirk says “Sorry”!! The Dredd-Naught provfides the dark background.

368. Curious Cadet - April 17, 2013

359. filmboy,
“If the Dreadnaught ship was constructed after the events of the first film, how did they build it so fast? If it was already in existence, then why was it not deployed when the Narada attacked Vulcan?”

Finally some real thoughtful discussion without pointing to obvious red herrings to “prove” it’s khan.

A few thoughts — the Dreadnought is indeed top secret, not to be rolled out except in the case of the most dire circumstances — yet. Most likely Starfleet would like to amass a fleet of them before they reveal its existence. This one is a prototype. Also, I imagine it was under construction prior to the Enterprise, but being considerably larger and more technologically complex took longer, not to mention it was being built covertly, without the benefit of the mass workforce and materials that could be employed on a public project being built in the Iowa corn fields.

As for Vulcan, it’s entirely possible that even 9 months out, it was not fully functional or flight worthy. An untested ship could have been a disaster at Vulcan and might have destroyed Starfleet’s well laid plans. However, there’s also a more practical reason … The entire fleet was engaged in something in the Laurentian System. It could be the ship had been secretly deployed to that system in the event the tide turned on the Federation. Alternately, the events of Vulcan unfolded rather quickly, with no radio contact. Only Kirk it seems realized it was a trap on the way to Vulcan, so it’s a fair bet Starfleet was in no hurry to deploy their most secret weapon on something it was assumed the small fleet of ships deployed could handle. Considering all the events transpired in a day or two, and no ships from the Laurentian system arrived in time to help the Enterprise defend Earth, it’s entitrely possible the dreadnought literally could not be dispatched in time, assuming it was fully operational, and anyone was even able to communicate the magnitude of the situation to it. So Starfleet shares no real responsibility in the destruction of Vulcan under the circumstances.

Using Nero logic, however, that would not stop someone from finding them at fault. Certainly making Harrison a Vulcan would explain a number of things about Harrison, including giving him a motivation for revenge in this case. But surely they wouldn’t just repeat the plot of ST09 with a better actor, right?

369. Unwanted - April 17, 2013

@359. Is it possible that the beginning of the movie is 9 months to a year after ST09 while later portions of the movie are farther along in time?

I remember an article that said Kirk was going to get demoted for violating the Prime Directive on Nibiru, which is the red plant planet we see in the trailer. This article said Kirk was then made first officer to Pike once more, and mentioned a possibility of Spock being transferred to another ship.

I think it’s possible that after Kirk’s demotion we might get a jump ahead in time to a year or so after that. Naturally I don’t really know, but I think it’s at least a possibility.

370. chrismireya - April 17, 2013

@ 357 Curious Cadet: I didn’t say that he was Khan. I simply said that he could be one of the same super soldiers in the same genetically-engineered vein as Khan.

I have a strong feeling that data gleaned from Spock Prime (Nimoy) or scanned from the Narada will give a clue to the location and potential danger of the Botany Bay (as well as other dangers that played out in our original STAR TREK timeline reality).

Spock Prime can avert disasters by sending a message to V-Ger, sending Humpback whale sounds into space and preventing any other dangers to the universe that could be prevented or averted by such knowledge.

What would Section 31 (or some other groups including, as you mentioned, Klingons) do with this knowledge?

Someone might travel to the Botany Bay, awaken one of the individuals who was frozen (not even knowing which one was Khan) and ignore (or even “permanently discard”) the rest.

The result?

This Harrison could pretend to have good intentions, like you said, but the “superior intellect” could be predisposed to a unquenchable desire to conquer, rule or even something as simple as “learn.” This man could “learn” that he was nothing more than the culmination of a genetic experiment with a “programmed” destiny (to conquer) and decide to take revenge on Starfleet.

OF course, this is all a theory. However, the technology for the Dreadnought-class ship is “before its time.” So, it seems that the ship was either from the future…or constructed from technology gleaned from the future. The soldier seems “super powered” in a sense — as well as “super strong” (from footage in the trailers). This leads me to believe that it could be a Eugenics Wars product — just like Khan.

Has anyone considered that Abrams & Co. actually WANTED Khan to be in the film (hence the desire to hire Benecio del Toro) but opted to focus on a different super soldier once del Toro said “No thanks?” Del Toro may have been meant to play Khan (or a Khan type of clone). Once that didn’t pan out, they could have gone with Plan B.

Just a few thoughts. :-)

371. Sherlock - April 17, 2013

Anyhow, our heroes and hero-ship will survive…

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Star_Trek_Ongoing,_Issue_21

372. Noropolis - April 17, 2013

It’s not Khan! At 0:51 in the trailer there is some one on a Padd looking at the villian and it says “John Harrison”!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Khan is floating somewhere on the SS Botany Bay. Now could this film link to Khan? Yes. But it’s not Khan!!!!!

373. Damian - April 17, 2013

I find it amusing that so many here think there will be some nod or reference to Section 31. This team has worked very hard at separating themselves from the Berman years (outside a few Easter eggs here and there).

They are not going to bring up Section 31 at all. There may be a Section 31 like organization involved, but it will be referred to as something else and have nothing to do with Section 31.

Also, if Augments are involved, they will not be referred to as Augments, but more likely supermen or something of that sort.

FInally, I also think it likely if Klingons are seen, ridges and all, they will likely disregard the episodes of Enterprise explaining the lack of ridges in the original series (they’ll probably portray Klingons as never having looked any different).

Just a few thoughts.

374. Silvereyes - April 17, 2013

# 353 I don’t know where you get that the Enterprise is 725 meters long. That’s Enterprise E. The original Enterprise (Constitution class) is 300 meters long.

375. dswynne - April 17, 2013

#374: Memory Alpha and ILM is the source. Besides, the increase size of the JJ-Enterprise is in response to the Nerada’s incursion into the past, while the new Dreadnaught ship is in response to Vulcan’s destruction. What’s so hard to accept this?

376. chrismireya - April 17, 2013

@ #375: Good point. I know that people were angry when Abrams “changed the Enterprise” for the 2009 film. However, the same thing happened for THE MOTION PICTURE too. In fact, the Enterprise in TMP was much larger that the ship in the original series. This wouldn’t qualify as an “overhaul.” It was literally an entirely different ship.

377. Superman - April 17, 2013

Sherlock,

Thanks for the link and the info! Seems they definitely cribbed the dorsal profile of the Intrepid class, but it’s quite different otherwise.

378. Anthony Thompson - April 17, 2013

Khannnnnnnn!

379. Silvereyes - April 17, 2013

# 375 Thanks for the info. Had no idea…

380. Silvereyes - April 17, 2013

#376 Not wanting to harp on the subject but I must disagree. The TMP Enterprise was in fact still 300 meters long, according to blueprints for the refit Constitution class

381. Defiant - April 17, 2013

I’ll stick with the ~366m Enterprise, the 725m or even longer versions don’t make any sense at all, if you look at the details closely. I don’t buy the “Narada attack, Vulcan destroyed” thing…

382. chrismireya - April 17, 2013

@ #380: Really? Every comparison that I have seen shows two completely different ships in terms of length, height and size of the saucer.

For instance:

http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/blueprints/Adam_Heinbuch/StarfleetTop.jpg

http://www.cygnus-x1.net/links/lcars/blueprints/Adam_Heinbuch/StarfleetFront.jpg

http://endofinternet.ro/wp-content/uploads/2012/03/star_trek_vs_star_wars_ship_comparison.jpg

http://www.suricatafx.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/enterprise_comparison.png

The point? The OS and TMP ships were just too different to be called the “same” ship.

383. kmart - April 17, 2013

Andy Probert very specifically worked with the notion that the TMP refit was 1000 ft long — that was based on the intended scale of the miniature, which was 100″ long. Art director Richard Taylor discarded the earlier model built for phase 2 because at something like 5.5 ft, he felt it wouldn’t be able to depict the size without showing itself to be a model at close scrutiny.

I do believe Probert liked the idea of the ship being more like 1200 ft, but that was more just his view, nothing more.

384. TrekkerChick - April 17, 2013

@380

And, in some non-canon references (“The Lost Years” books), it was referenced as being a refit of the space-frame from the TOS 1701.

In “A Flag Full of Stars”, iirc, it is mentioned that the primary hull of the 1701 was docked planet-side for the refit — under the rationale that some reit tasks were best done while the ship was powered-down, in a 1g environment.

385. Silvereyes - April 17, 2013

#383

“it is mentioned that the primary hull of the 1701 was docked planet-side for the refit — under the rationale that some reit tasks were best done while the ship was powered-down, in a 1g environment.”

Which would seem to support the reason why the JJ Enterprise was built on Earth. Still makes no sense to me. Build the components on Earth, assemble them in space, but that’s just me and I’m not a Starfleet engineer…

386. Scott Gammans - April 17, 2013

@137: That was TOTALLY what I was thinking when I saw that huge black ship appear.

If you think about it for a second, it makes sense. All the rumors about the producers and writers mining classic Trek for story ideas were right on the money… they just had the wrong episode. It’s not “Space Seed” writ large that we’ll see next month… it’s “Mirror, Mirror”.

387. Trekman_dave - April 17, 2013

I think we are being diverted from wha we may have been shown

1. Kirk and Harrison jump from Enterprise to another starship
2. Harrison wants to make a stand against what Starfleet has or is doing
3. Admiral Marcus daughter is a weapons expert and in Starfleet (just thnk what she can invent with an admiral as a father)
4. We have been told that the admiral has a ship
5. We know that trailers are designed to be miss leading and therefore I believe the tru villain is admiral Marcus and the pawn is Harrison

388. Dunsel Report - April 17, 2013

#373: Yes, I agree. These guys are making movies as if the last word on Trek to date was the release of the Franz Josef Technical Manual, and I love it.

389. captain spock - April 17, 2013

I clicked on the picture of the one with the possable cryo-stasis chambers picture to make it look larger ,it doe’s looks like some one is in the cryo-stasis chamber tubes .if you look very carefully you can see some one or things eyes.

390. Missing Point - April 17, 2013

Don’t know if anyone noticed/posted this yet, but it sounds damn familiar…
DREADNOUGHT!
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Dreadnought!

391. captain spock - April 17, 2013

look carefully at this picture what do u see in the cryo-stasis chamber

http://scifanatic.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/stid-t5-08.jpg

392. TrekkerChick - April 17, 2013

@385

I’m still not persuaded (recalling that this is fiction, after all) by the construction of the entire ship, planet-side, either. But, heh, I wasn’t given money from Paramount to write ST:2009 or STID…. even if I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

My recollection from way back was the primary hull of the TOS Enterprise was supposedly capable of being detached and used as a ‘lifeboat’ since it had the (supposed) impulse engines (see Franz Joseph Designs, albeit not in canon) for maneuvering. Even in canon, I believe in Blish’s adaptation at least, there was a reference to – either in “The Apple” or “Return of the Archons” (been awhile) of a plot device of separating the ship from the stardrive section to make an escape.

But, this is work of fiction after all… and not a paper written for the journal “Nacelles Monthly” or “FedJourPhys.”

393. chrismireya - April 17, 2013

@ #391 “Captain Spock:” It looks like a Klingon in cryo.

394. chrismireya - April 17, 2013

@ 391 (again) – Look at the “ridges” on the foreheads of the individuals in the cryo tubes. They look like Klingons.

Maybe “John Harrison” will be a survivor from the Eugenics Wars and he decides to create a race of Klingon super soldiers?

395. M_E - April 17, 2013

<>

Has anyone speculated on the size based on the “Alcatraz being smashed” sequence? The complex looks awfully dwarfed there…

396. Markus - April 17, 2013

@391: What do you see? I see nothing specific.

397. Peter - April 17, 2013

In the last frame it painfully obvious that Kirk is grieving, and that in all probability Pike has been killed and it is Kirk that is out for revenge and retribution; especially with Pike being heard saying “I believe in you Jim” as if Kirk is recalling what Pike had recently said to him.

398. Jonathan archer - April 17, 2013

@391 that is a very strong possibility. If you look at the logo that is on the Cryors tubes. and the logo that’s on the bird of prey from the fourth issue of countdown the darkness the logos are very similar.

399. Captain, USS Northstar - April 17, 2013

One thing is for certain: there are plenty of images in all the trailers that will have an entirely different meaning once we have the whole story in front of us — red herrings that are then matched with audio clips to throw us completely off.

I am one of those believing that if Khan does appear in this movie series, it will be in the third one.

I will also predict that somehow — some way, Kirk will save the Big E. Remember — Scotty is always whining about the ship. But Kirk — perhaps in partnership with Spock — will find a way to alter the decaying orbit, skip off the atmosphere and prevent a fiery descent.

It’s going to be one heck of ride in one month’s time!

400. Damian - April 17, 2013

388–I just watched Star Trek (2009) last night (over the last 3 or 4 months I actually decided to watch all 11 films sort of gearing myself up for STID).

I know people will probably jump all over me, but each time I watch it I like it a little less. I feel bad about that too. I still love the film (as I love all Star Trek–even the much maligned TFF and Nemesis), but each time, I lose just a little love for it.

I still think the story is great and the actors did a great job. I really think it’s set design. I was never a fan of the production design, but I sort of overlooked it. But each time it bugs me a little more. Starfleet headquarters looks nothing at all like what we’ve seen since TMP all the way through the various TV series up to Enterprise. The ship design also pulls me out of the story a bit. Engineering looks dirty and grimy, like a Klingon ship would look. Starfleet ships all the way back to the original series always looked pristine and well cared for, and clean. Scotty would never accept anything less (a la TWOK when Kirk was looking for dust in Engineering and didn’t find any).

I know there are those who liked the so called “realism” of Engineering and other parts of the ship. But I’ve never been a big fan of retconning. And just me personally, I get enough “realism” on the news. It’s nice to go to the movies to see fiction.

But that’s just my humble opinion and take it for what it’s worth. I still love Star Trek (2009), but it drops slightly for me with each watching (unlike the first 10, which have always stayed steady for me–as far as how much I liked each).

401. Missing Point - April 17, 2013

Not quite sure why the link I posted above is not working properly (the exclamation point at the end of the address does not seem to be active) and linking to a different page (about the dreadnought ship rather than the novel DREADNOUGHT!). Copy and paste the entire address rather than clicking and it will take you to a page about a 1986 Star Trek novel by Diane Carey with what looks like a VERY SIMILAR PLOT LINE to Into Darkness. So similar that I thought it at first the the page might have been doctored to reflect the new film… Or maybe this is where the ”new” plot came from? Link again (perhaps it will be intact this time):
http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Dreadnought!

402. Unwanted - April 17, 2013

@391, 396.

The picture does seem to me to show people inside the tubes, zooming in on the closest I believe I could distinguish an eye, but otherwise I could not make out any real details of the face. I do believe these are some form of cryogenic tubes, so maybe the story involves that Klingon Battlecruiser that Picard originally dealt with that was launched during Kirk’s era with it’s crew in cryostasis, maybe these are normal 20th century humans who froze themselves in hopes of escaping terminal illness like that other bunch of popsicles Picard dealt with.

Just because we seen people in tubes doesn’t mean they have to anything in particular. For all we know those are really cloning chambers growing new Vulcans to assist the species survival, they could use DNA samples from all surviving Vulcans and have the chromosomes randomly combined for maximum genetic diversity. If they ensure that no individual clone has more than one chromosome from the same donor they limit the number of total clones they can create, but they limit the potential effects of replicative fading or “clonal inbreeding” as I call it as well.

Just an alternative speculative thought.

403. chrismireya - April 17, 2013

@ Missing Point: Interesting! That could very well serve as a basis for the film!

From Memory Alpha:

“A prototype starship is stolen by a conspiracy of Starfleet officers who are old friends of a young new lieutenant named Piper, who was recently posted to the Enterprise. An admiral insists on taking his personal flagship and accompanying the Enterprise to apprehend the stolen starship, where it turns out that the new starship was stolen not to start a war, but to prevent one. The crew of the Enterprise and the hijackers must work together to foil a plot by the admiral to use this new ship to begin a military coup of the Federation.

The story is told from the point of view of a young Ms. Piper, a cadet at Starfleet Academy, undergoing her Kobayashi Maru examination. Upon graduation, she is requested by James T. Kirk for posting as a lieutenant to the USS Enterprise. Also posted on board, a couple of weeks prior, is a former friend of hers: a Vulcan named Sarda. The USS Star Empire, the prototype of the new dreadnought starships, is stolen by a group of rogue officers lead by Commander Paul Burch, former assistant to Admiral Rittenhouse, who had commissioned the dreadnought and had her built in secret. Kirk requested Lieutenant Piper to be assigned to the Enterprise, as they had already received a communique from the terrorists detailing a time and location for a meeting, and that a further message would require Piper’s biocode to open. Lieutenant Piper is unaware of how she fits into any of this.”

404. Unwanted - April 17, 2013

@401, 403. Yup I noticed the similarities a few days ago when Anthony reported on the cinecon footage and commented on a different thread about it. The book also includes Kilgons, and Captain Kor.

405. thereare4lights - April 17, 2013

He is Picard……PICCAAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRDDDDDD!

406. CarlG - April 17, 2013

@401, 403: Ugh, I hope not. I like Diane Carey’s writing, but the plot of that one novel… let’s say you have to do some serious mental gymnastics to figure out how an Eeeeeeevil Starfleet Admiral (yup, another one) will use a Dreadnought to impose a socialist reign of tyranny on what is already a post-scarcity utopia… :P

407. captain spock - April 17, 2013

what are the klingon holding in their hands it looks to me like huge bat’liths or some other kind of weapon

http://scifanatic.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/stid-t5-32.jpg

408. Factchecker - April 17, 2013

Deltan navigator?

409. Defiant - April 17, 2013

@407

At least the Klingon on the upper left is definately holding some kind of Bat’leth. The other one to the right seems to have some movie-style Klingon disruptor.

410. Rickover - April 17, 2013

Why is the JJ enterprise SAID to be 700m long when its clearly only 2 decks (two window rows) thick at the saucer edges.. Just like the 1701 and 1701 A?.

Are people retarded?

JJ enterprise is not 1701-E size.

411. Disinvited - April 17, 2013

Recommend this site:

http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/articles/new_enterprise_comment.htm#size

if you are going to be comparing sizes of the ships.

412. Killamarshtrek - April 17, 2013

The more I see that ‘giant gun’ zeroing in on the Enterprise, the more I’m thinking it may belong to a ship named after a distinguished Captain lost 20 years earlier – the ‘USS April’, hence ‘April Giant Gun’!

413. kirkwannabee - April 17, 2013

could it be john harrison from the mirrorverse. there couldnt be a federation ship of that size in their current time.

414. Basement Blogger - April 17, 2013

I hope STID is Star Trek. The trailer looks great. And that Dreadnought is one scary ship.

415. DaddlerTheDalek - April 17, 2013

Damn! The Dreadnought looks really Impressive!

416. Tanner "The Dude" Waterbury - April 17, 2013

I’m gonna yell this to get attention, so bare with me: WHO IS THAT REALLY HOT BLONDE IN THE REDSHIRT ON THE ENTERPRISE BRIDGE IN THE BACKGROUND? Not Alice Eve, but the Extra.

417. pock speared - April 17, 2013

Chekov is one ex-perogi.

There will be an abundance of space-tits.

I like saying “Dreadnought”.

418. pock speared - April 17, 2013

416.
noticed her. rand as in “randy”.

419. Red Dead Ryan - April 17, 2013

#376.

The TMP refit Enterprise was 305 meters long, whereas the TOS version was 286 meters in length. I don’t know where you got the idea that it was much larger.

We know its only slightly larger than the TOS version because of scale models featured in the Enterprise D and E conference lounges.

420. Curious Cadet - April 17, 2013

@410. Rickover,
“Why is the JJ enterprise SAID to be 700m long when its clearly only 2 decks (two window rows) thick at the saucer edges.”

I see 5 decks. Clearly. Not sure what you are looking at, but the saucer edges are 5 decks thick.

421. RAMA - April 17, 2013

End of story:

Unlike these various statements insinuate, the ship has not been designed by Ryan Church to be that huge in the first place. In an interview for the Cinefex magazine #118, ILM Art Director Alex Jaeger says: “The reconfigured ship was a larger vessel than previous manifestations — approximately 1,200-feet-long compared to the 947-foot ship of the original series. Once we got the ship built and started putting it in environments it felt too small. The shuttle bay gave us a clear relative scale — shuttles initially appeared much bigger than we had imagined — so we bumped up the Enterprise scale, which gave her a grander feel and allowed us to include more detail.” So the ship was designed at 1200ft (366m) by Ryan Church, and was later scaled up by a factor of 2!

422. Jack - April 17, 2013

Movieline has a poll on which trailer — Man of Steel or Into Darkness — is “more powerful.” The author goes with Trek, but right now Man of Steel’s winning in the poll…

POLL: ‘Man of Steel’ Vs. ‘Star Trek Into Darkness': Which Trailer Is More Powerful?

http://movieline.com/2013/04/17/poll-man-of-steel-vs-star-trek-into-darkness-trailers/

423. Unwanted - April 17, 2013

Now then, has anyone answered the most important question? This being, who, exactly, is providing the voice of the computer? I dunno about a lot of people but that is a more important detail to me right now than who John Harrison is or whether he is the real villain of the film or not.

I personally still hold out hope that Marina Sirtis got the part, just cause.

424. Jack - April 17, 2013

423. Barbara Babcock’s still alive…

425. captain spock - April 17, 2013

if you look in the middle of this picture at the explosion , at the top of the fire ball to the right is anotehr klingon ship chaseing the civilian ship.

http://scifanatic.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/stid-t5-49.jpg

426. Jonboc - April 17, 2013

#391… Holy smokes. To keep this spoiler free, I’m just gonna say it again…holy smokes…the business with the shirt…it all makes sense now. Orci, you’re a tricky one! :)

427. scottevill - April 17, 2013

Assuming Harrison is an augment, the question is: what happens to the others? Are they awakened by the end of the movie? Or do they end up in somebody’s custody – still frozen – still a potential threat.

Further to the latter — in the shot of the possible cryotubes, who are the two figures seen leaving that dark room? Their costuming does not suggest they are Starfleet.

Wasn’t there a rumor that Leonard Nimoy shot a cameo? Could the figure in white be Spock Prime who uses his knowledge of the future to end up taking the rest of the Botany Bay sleepers (including Khan?) off the board… thereby saving many lives, including, not incidentally, his own…

But now the sleepers would be in the custody of New Vulcan. Will they be able to resist the temptation to fall into the same trap Harrison’s Starfleet handlers did? Thinking the superior intellect can be controlled.

If that’s the end of the movie, it would be another nod to Raiders. Is the movie book-ended with nods to Raiders?

Just a thought.

428. Adolescent Nightmare - April 17, 2013

I have decided to make a bold and startling prediction. Cumby is playing

Khan

429. Mr. Scott - April 17, 2013

Kirk saves the Enterprise and sends the Dreadnought crashing to Earth. The nacelles are wrong. Too skinny and set further apart than the Enterprise

430. somethoughts - April 17, 2013

Harrison could turn out to be good, maybe he realized that shady admiral is building a fleet of dreadnaughts to control the galaxy, military coup.

The explosion in London maybe is to prevent war by detonating the fleet of dreadnaughts. Even though Harrison is correct he goes about his cause by also killing innocents ie terrorist. The weapon of mass destruction is the dreadnaught.

The real villain is kirks love interests father.

431. kmart - April 18, 2013

421,

That may be end of story, but you’re leaving out the middle, which is when Eaves worked the thing out to being over 3300 feet long. I’m pretty sure I went over this with you on another site a couple years back, because the Eaves post was pulled or disappeared from his site, but was ‘archived’ someplace else.

BTW, I’ve interviewed Jaeger, he is a very nice guy, but like most ILM guys, you get the ‘he has taken a Dale Carnegie course’ feel that basically means you’re going to get the company line, not anything that offers a dissenting or negative view.

About the only exception to that (and I’ve interviewed at least 75 ILM staffers by now — did 43 in 3 horrible days for a PHANTOM MENACE article — was a great opticals guy named Josh Pines (think he may have helped found Battlebots too, maybe?), who was very cheerfully off the charts with his criticisms of Lucas (he found the shittiest lenses on the planet with the worst distortion imaginable’ is what I remember him saying.)

Whenever I hear something like ‘case closed’ it makes me think of that poser Gerald Posner and his single-shooter ‘defense’ of the Warren Commission. Anything but closed.

And while CINEFEX is a s good a reference as you’ll find for VFX, it still isn’t necessarily gospel truth. Lots of times stuff got redlined when it went out for factchecking, and not because it was incorrect.

My last experience like that when I was the staff writer at the mag was about RED PLANET, where one actor had taken out a restraining order against another, yet they still had scenes to do together. So a lot of their stuff was shot at different times for the same shot, without motion control, and then the two passes had to massaged to put the two of them back in the shot together. We were absolutely not allowed to print any of that back then, even by finessing it and describing it as ‘performance enhancement through combination of multiple takes.’

432. Tiger - April 18, 2013

I still believe Section 31 will have a heavy influence of some kind. I think the dreadnaught will be their ship and more of a battle ship than one to explore. I dont really care about the whole Khan thing, especially if its a skinny British guy running around pretending to be him. I dont care if hes in it, but the black op storyline would interest me more. Section 31 was one of the more interesting things we learned about Starfleet and would love to see it futher explored. If the Klingons are there to help Harrison, it could be a lead off to a big stand off with them. Kirk did say there might be a war so you have to ask, with who? Klingons seem like the obvious suspects.

Anyway I trust Abrams enough it wont just be a rehash of what came before and even if he has to include a TOS villian to please the old timer fans, at least do it in a very creative angle. I like Trek though when it ties a lot of the universe together. I like knowing what happens to Kirk and company now can have repercussions of a Picard and Sisko a hundred years from now…even if its not OUR Picard or Sisko! In other words, that all that came before and after matters!

433. stunkill - April 18, 2013

@374~The enterprise E is 685 meters long, not 725 meters. TOS enterprise is 289 meters long, and TMP enterprise is 305 meters long. ST09 enterprise is indeed 725 meters long as officialy announced by the creators of it. No amount of wishfull thinking by other people will change that. There are plenty of FX shots proving it. You dont see anybody nitpicking the size of other enterprises by viewing FX shots of them? Its only brought about by JJ-prise haters or closed minded purists whom are rigidly opposed to any kind of change that causes they’re singlemindedness to split into multiple directions of concept. I get an image of them slapping the side of they’re heads like rainman whenever they think of new trek.

434. SchnuDu - April 18, 2013

this ship…
http://scifanatic.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/stid-t5-31-tt.jpg

… is not this ship:
http://scifanatic.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/stid-t5-25.jpg

435. topas - April 18, 2013

@2:07 is the small attack craft making an evasive as an AA projectile flies towards it. Kirk has only a phaser rifle and the rocket/missile looks big, maybe cavalry arrived to help him?

436. LogicalLeopard - April 18, 2013

“I’m sorry.”

Wow.

You know, with the griping and complaining that we hear about the differences between “Nu-Trek” and “Old Trek”, we don’t often hear any good analysis on what this contemporary product really can accomplish. With different circumstances, how do the character’s function? I don’t know if I’d ever hear Kirk Prime say “I’m sorry”, because he rarely appeared to know how to lose. But instead of the polished Kirk that we’re used to seeing, who had been an officer for a number of years and a captain as well, we’re seeing a guy who has barely been a tolerable human being for half a decade, and has been a Captain for six months. To think of Jim Kirk turning around and facing a crew of living breathing human beings, not assets, and knowing that he got them all killed…..that’s powerful stuff. Presuming that’s why he’s saying “I’m sorry”, it could be for anything, but I’m hoping that’s what’s happening.

This/these movies really help expand on the character of Kirk. It brings up a lot of interesting thoughts on his personality.

437. PaulB - April 18, 2013

#434 – Since there are two ships in both of the pictures you posted, I assume that by “this ship” you mean the non-Enterprise ship in each photo, right? Well, I think you are very mistaken. Looks like the same ship, no reason to think it’s a different ship, and nothing to suggest it’s a different ship.

Do you have a reason for your claim that it’s not the same ship facing Enterprise in both pics?

438. kmart - April 18, 2013

433,
No, we’d rather be slapping the sides of heads of the ‘creatives’ involved. As in ‘knock sense into them.’

As far as nitpicking stuff with past ships, all you need to do is go back and consider how the number of decks on the E-e varied from film to film (and that all led from a ship that actually HAD a physical representation, which should have precluded such issues, or so you’d figure) to realize, yes, there were folks scrutinizing all the past ships and the odd little or big discrepancies.

439. Chain of Command - April 18, 2013

Yeah, those are cryo-tubes of some kind. You can see faces through the glass. Who k

Who knows at this point who or what anyone is in this film. If it’s a new character (Harrison) then that’s fine. if not then, well, we can only hope the new take on an old idea is a good one.

440. James Regulus Kirk - April 18, 2013

@433. stunkill

Agree 100%.
I’m always running into individuals who seem to firmly believe that the reconciliation of parallel concepts into a serial continuity of thought is the path to enlightenment. It’s as if their brains would explode when presented with what they initially perceive as a paradox.
Certainty is not a human capacity, nor an entitlement, therefore it is non obligatory to rectify every apparent incongruity.

441. M_E - April 18, 2013

#437 – Do you have a reason for your claim that it’s not the same ship facing Enterprise in both pics?

Perhaps we are being tricked by weird angles but the ships facing the Enterprise and crashing on SF bay seem to lack the odd “hole” on the saucer section clearly visible in one of the shots… Maybe the ship can open parts of the hull to expose her big guns?

442. SchnuDu - April 18, 2013

Right, no holes in saucer on crashing ship

http://scifanatic.wpengine.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/stid-mtvclip-1.jpg

443. cpelc - April 18, 2013

Anyone else notice the bald-headed woman sitting in Chekov’s seat in the shot of Kirk looking outside the ship?

Lt. Ilia?

444. Phil - April 18, 2013

Well, if John Harrison is leading an insurrection on earth or against the Federation, why would we assume he has no support, or multiple ships (and crews) who support the cause?

445. Curious Cadet - April 18, 2013

@313. Jim Phelps,
“Those smoke trails leading to the Enterprise nacelles and blowing them up is its own photon torpedoes (the ball things) being used against them.”

That is not what I see happening at all.

The balls themselves are launching weapons at the Enterprise.

It also appears that both ships are trying to destroy the balls. But I’m less sure about that.

446. Keachick - April 18, 2013

These balls remind me of a race mentioned in ST Enterprise. I have not seen all of Enterprise and only have the first season on DVD (so far).

The balls on that episode were bigger and not as colourful…

I wonder if this means anything.

447. falcon - April 18, 2013

A lot of folks have mentioned that Adm. Marcus is the real villain, and Bob Orci has said the villain’s name is from canon. So the villain’s name is …

… drumroll please …

Admiral David Marcus.

Hold your applause, please. :-)

448. Warp 10 - April 18, 2013

Want proof that they are covering up John Harrison’s identity?

Listen carefully to the dialogue track at :54-:56. It’s not a clean audio edit.

Please explain how the same audio clip is used twice in the trailer. Once partially on camera and then entirely off.

Pike’s “I believe in you, Jim.”

449. Unwanted - April 18, 2013

@447. Admiral Marcus’s first name is Alex, not David, he is David’s potential grandfather.

No applause for poor deduction, that doesn’t even match up to publicly available confirmed information.

450. Phil - April 18, 2013

@448. Kirk is standing in the wreckage of Enterprise, and Christopher Pikes words are burning in his ears…I believe in you, Jim’. Failure – Kirk has hit bottom….brash, cocky, and arrogant, John Harrison has just driven home the point he is in way over his head, overmatched, and nothing more then the punk kid who got lucky. This JTK has just f**ked anyone who went to bat for him…

Lets see him do something with this…recall, this movie is about Kirk finally growing up, not establishing John Harrison as king of the Federation.

451. Keachick - April 18, 2013

#101/#112

Since when does apologizing make a person a douchebag?

The phrase “son-of-a-bitch” is a common one and has been around for a while. Interesting that Chris Pine gets to say that for a second time in a movie. The first time he said (in character) – “We’re gonna run this son-of-a-bitch down!” in reference to the triple 7 beast. Now he (in character) says it, presumably, in regard to John Harrison.

Thankfully, he doesn’t say, “Let’s go get this motherf*cker”, another common slang term in the modern vernacular. It might be entirely possible that John Harrison is just some son-of-a-dog, but using the feminine in a derogatory way is just so much better sounding and easier to say. I hope it was good for you too, Chris Pine and writers…:(

In some ways, other posters may be right in that people should not refer to some Cumberbatch fans as Cumberbitches, despite the fact that they choose to be called that name. I am not sure what this group of Cumberbatch fans chose to prove by referring to themselves in this manner other than to look, at best, particularly stupid…oh well, not my problem.
I also realize that many Cumberbatch fans do not refer to themselves by this word, thus showing common sense, therefore Benedict Cumberbatch should not feel so bad or embarrassed.

452. Keachick - April 18, 2013

#450 – Phil – *charming* to the last, as always…:(

453. Unwanted - April 18, 2013

@450. I think you aren’t far off the mark there, but from the uniform and lighting in the shot I think he is standing in Starfleet HQ right after the attack on the fleet brass. Look at Kirk when we hear the echo of Pike’s “I believe in you Jim”, he is wearing the new grey dress uniform since you can see the epaulets on his shoulders, and the lighting on the wall is the red of emergency signals, just like it is during the attack at HQ shots we have seen.

I don’t actually think I’ll ever see this Kirk as being just some “punk kid who got lucky” since that is not what I got from any part of ST09, but he will probably feel that way about himself at some point in this movie.

But for all those saying that Kirk apologizing is a sign of weakness, or anything of the kind, it takes a much stronger person be sincerely sorry.

454. Phil - April 18, 2013

@452. To the last? Are you leaving?

The only other thing that would be hammering home the inadequacy of young Kirk in everything is if in that wreckage, Pikes lifeless body is lying at Kirks feet, dead due to the incompetence of his young mentor….

I’m beginning to like this Harrison…shame he has to die.

455. Phil - April 18, 2013

apprentice…excuse me.

456. Keachick - April 19, 2013

As I said *charming* as always…:((

No one knows who actually dies in this movie, so your post #454 is rather nasty as well as stupid.

457. Phil - April 19, 2013

@453. Could be, while we have seen enough now to have a general feel for what is happening in the movie, we won’t know specifics for a bit longer. Regardless of how others feel, this Kirk’s ‘I’m sorry’ does seem to be his epiphany moment, recognition that he has been masterfully played by someone better then him ‘at everything’ , and as they say on the farm, the chickens are coming home to roost.

Hopefully the production team makes the most of this. If they do, that will forgive a lot of the sins left over from Trek 09.

458. Phil - April 19, 2013

@456. Coming from you, the master of the vapid, I’ll take that as a complement. Thank you.

459. Curious Cadet - April 19, 2013

@457. Phil,
“Regardless of how others feel, this Kirk’s ‘I’m sorry’ does seem to be his epiphany moment, recognition that he has been masterfully played by someone better then him ‘at everything’”

I tend to agree. And congratulations on taking any hint of Khan out of that statement by Harrison.

However, I hope that the producers do not follow the usual Hollywood formula of “executing” the villain, but instead treat him like a Magneto type villain who might return to fight another day. I had a little too much cowboy justice in the last film.

Perhaps ‘Harrison’ will be escorted for internment at the Elba II asylum as Spock and Kirk reflect over lessons learned, much like TOS used to do.

Admiral Marcus on the other hand will most likely have to die, which has interesting ramifications for Kirk and Carol Marcus. Frankly, the universe will be better off without David Marcus — this would be one instance of a Prime timeline mistake healing itself …

460. Green - April 19, 2013

I don’t know, the more I learn about the movie the less I want to see it. Yet another slug fest with a giant super-ship.

461. Picardy - April 19, 2013

Some have said on here still seem to defend the massive scale of the JJ ship. But the fact is it was scaled up for a couple of shots.. Wrong move IMO but they did it. The actual scale is still between constitution mkII and Excelsior.

Look at the windows and compare that against larger ships… The JJ enterprise has two rows of windows along the edge of the saucer… In the first teaser trailer showing the e’s construction there are two decks with bits above middle and below that are narrower for all the “stuff to go.

Look at the spaces of all the windows across the ship. If the JJ ship was as nearly as large as the D and E then.. Well… those are HUGE windows and there’s not many of them if that’s the case! Hahaha.

The dreadnought is a E size ship.. By the looks of it. Perfectly doable to build in the TOS era if some special evil club wanted to make a super ship.

I guess we will find out in a few weeks!

462. Curious Cadet - April 19, 2013

@461 Picardy,
“those are HUGE windows and there’s not many of them if that’s the case!”

Yes they are huge windows. Floor to ceiling. Each one constitutes an entire deck. And yes, there’s not many of them. There shouldn’t be in a starship that is primarily built for defense. The windows that are there are substantially reinforced like the one in the bridge, and are there for specific observational purposes. Unlike the “D”, which carried around families, there are no windows in every living quarters — that’s just a ridiculous notion for a ship that may have to go into battle at any time.

Until proven otherwise, I have no trouble imaging this ship as big as they say it is.

463. James Regulus Kirk - April 20, 2013

461. Picardy

There’s a rumor that ship was 366 meters long originally, but it was scaled up to 725 meters, apparently without a redesign, likely due to haste. Budgeneering and the vast hangar deck would not fit in a 366 meter Enterprise.
We’re not advocating the larger size, It was officially stated by members of the production team on multiple occasions. The size is the size, you have the right not to believe it until it’s mentioned on screen, but such occurrences are rare.

464. James Regulus Kirk - April 20, 2013

Oh, and the dreadnought makes the Scimitar look like a Bird of Prey. The Abramsprise is the size of the D and much bigger than the E, which is a heavy cruiser, not an explorer like the D.

465. John Slivinski - April 20, 2013

It has taken me hours over 2 nights to read this whole thread. 1: You all are a truly intellectual & fascinating bunch (even the griefers are entertaining). 2. I just re-watched Space Seed on Netflix with Closed-Captions on and there is a crew-member on the bridge who succumbs from Khan turning off Life Support & his name is Harrison (I kid you not, ha ha!) And 3: I only got 33 out of 50 questions correct on a recent Star Trek collector’s magazine quiz so I don’t know why Marooned Khan from Wrath of Khan knew who Checkov was because Checkov did not appear during Space Seed episode, and I don’t remember how Khan could possibly know who he was. And for the record, I am thinking the trailers for the new movie are deliberately misleading to keep the true plot points of the film obscure. Love you guys, truly :)

466. Rene Robles - April 21, 2013

I have a theory about the backstory and premise:
At some point Star Fleet, not necessarily Kirk, finds the Botany Bay. Knowing all about Khan and his followers history, they decide to exterminate them because they are considered criminals and dangerous.
John Harrison, likely one of Khans followers, somehow escapes cryo freeze when they are first discovered. He later learns of what star fleet did to the rest of his people and decides to infiltrates star fleet, serve as a agent for a unknown amount of time, and eventually turn on star fleet to bring it down in revenge. He could even be Joachim, Khans right hand guy in The Wrath of Khan.

467. Dennis C - April 21, 2013

My theory on the tubes: One of the closing scenes, akin to the wharehouse scene at the end of Raiders.

468. 1nfinityCraft - April 21, 2013

I remember reading one of Simon Pegg’s tweets saying that “harrison will manipulate kirk” I think that when he says “you cant even guarantee the safety of your own crew” “shall we begin?” he’s trying to manipulate him by telling him he cant be sure he’ll win and is asking one more time you sure you want to risk your crew? Remember also his line about “is there anything you would not do for your family” They also reference to kirks crew as “the only family he has left” maybe he’s manipulating him trying to get him to side with him, convincing him he will lose his crew and his life if he doesn’t . Remember also how in TOS he is very attached to his crew. And when a baddie offers him a choice his crew always wins?

469. wi-kiry-lan - April 22, 2013

The TOS Enterprise actually fits nicely inside the TMP Enterprise.
Detach the saucer and add an exterior layer around it because the motion picture saucer is larger. The TOS neck fits inside the TMP neck again there’s an expansion layer around it. The secondary hull of the TOS enterprise gets a new shuttlebay and shortened a bit and it fits nicely in the TMP. New Warp nacelles.

So while it may seem very counterintuitive that keeping the internal structure and redoing the exterior and interiors was worth the trouble vs. just building a new ship from scratch and keeping the old enterprise as a lower performance ship – it does work in terms of size. And real navy ships have gone through equally drastic modifications.

470. Trekker - April 23, 2013

The Enterprise D had a sign on the bridge saying “to bring light INTO the DARKNESS”. So my idea: Cumberbatch is actually playing Picard.
This conclusion is as stupid as taking title cards as a reference to this wrath of kahn trailer!

471. tim - April 27, 2013

This movie is just like one of the soundtracks that gets released with music “inspired by” a film. Into Darkness is inspired by Star Trek, but it’s not really trek. Probably would be a great movie if not trying to rewrite the mythos of specific characters and ships.

Despite what you may argue, JJ’s vision has replaced the prime universe making it like it never happened. Why would you believe it doesn’t when in every other time travel story, the present is changed by the past (i.e. First Contact for starters.) Or are we to believe that Nero and Spock travelled back in time to a parallel timeline and nothing in the prime universe changed?
Unlikely.

472. Anthony OLeary - May 13, 2013

We call upon Paramount Pictures to restore the Star Trek Timeline and restore Vulcan. The latest film negates so much of what we love.

Why?

I love Star Trek always have and always will HOWEVER – This new film is not Star Trek, or at best it is a non – canon film. I have seen it twice and I am still devastated by it. The events that negated so much of Trek Lore or continuity. The First film we destroy and now we have a Khan that is not Khan – as Khan is pre – JJ Trek – that timeline should not be effected.
JJ is an amazing director – he can save Star Trek
Firstly, anyone who loves the series would know that Gene Roddenberry would not have approved of Vulcan being destroyed. Vulcan is the soul of the Star Trek universe. This new timeline (if it is accepted) negates 40 years of continuity.
The attacks on Rick Berman are a joke. He worked with Gene on the development of the TGN and Gene knew of the plans for Deep Space 9. Let alone hours of fantastic television. Who could forget the emotion of The Visitor.
He led a team that gave us hours of the best Trek. If in doubt watch again Generations and First Contact.
Secondly, this new film has so many links to Star Wars I am surprised that George Lucas hasn’t sued:
Young Kirk / Anakin in car / pod racer.
Bar scenes – New Hope
Snow attacks – Hoth monster / Kirk monster.
Spock / Yoda links
Battle scenes – Return Jedi. etc

I just hope that people who love Star Trek can retake the franchise and bring it back to watch Gene imagined. Not just a film that rips of star wars.

In terms of the timeline. There is only one true timeline in Star Trek. It has been manipulated on many occasions, but always corrected, in accordance with the temporal accords etc. Some fans are confusing the mirror universe which is different. If we accept this new film as canon it DOES wipe out everything we know. Why do that? Why destroy things that are loved by many for no reason?

For example see these examples from
http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Alternate_timeline

In 2344, the USS Enterprise-C responded to a distress call from a Klingon outpost on Narendra III, which was under attack by Romulan forces. In the “real” timeline the Enterprise saved the outpost and strengthened relations between the Federation and the Klingons. However, during the battle with the Romulans a Temporal rift opened and the Enterprise, badly damaged and disoriented, traveled to 2366, in the presence of its successor, the USS Enterprise-D. Because the Enterprise-C was not there to save the outpost it was destroyed and the Klingons declared war on the Federation. For the next 22 years, the two powers engaged in a bitter war that cost 40 billion lives and left the Federation on the brink of defeat. In this timeline, Tasha Yar was still alive and serving as tactical officer aboard the Enterprise-D in 2366.

Guinan began to feel the change in time as “not right”. She advised Captain Picard of the changes and eventually convinced him to send the Enterprise-C back through the rift. Yar discovered through Guinan that she died in the other timeline and felt that she could help aboard the Enterprise-C rather than where she felt she didn’t belong. The Klingons attacked the two ships as the Enterprise-C flew toward the rift, while the Enterprise-D defended her. The Enterprise-D was likely destroyed by the Klingons, but the Enterprise-C made it through the rift and restored the timeline, erasing the war from history. (TNG: “Yesterday’s Enterprise”)

However, during the battle with the Romulans, the Enterprise-C was forced to surrender and prisoners, including the alternate Yar, were taken. Yar had a child with a Romulan and was later executed. The child, Sela, became a commander in the Romulan military and encountered the Enterprise-D several times. (TNG: “The Mind’s Eye”, “Redemption”, “Redemption II”, “Unification I”, “Unification II”)

In Enterprise we see something happen that is similar to that of Vulcan.

The effect of a Delphic Expanse anomaly leaves Archer unable to form any new long-term memories. Twelve years later, he wakes up one morning and is stunned to learn the outcome of the Human-Xindi conflict, including the loss of Earth, and the near-annihilation of the Human race. Jonathan Archer wakes in his quarters in the midst of battle. He rushes to the bridge only to see Earth destroyed by the Xindi superweapon. The story restores the timeline.

Together Trek fans can have the Best of both Worlds a new trek for new fans and keep the faith we all those fans that kept the dream alive the timeline can be restored.

Live Long and Prosper
Anthony O’Leary
anthonyoleary@bigpond.com

TrekMovie.com is represented by Gorilla Nation. Please contact Gorilla Nation for ad rates, packages and general advertising information.