Speaking exclusively with TrekMovie, Star Trek Into Darkness star Zoe Saldana explains how she got a fight scene for Uhura, why she isn’t ready for Spock and Uhura to settle down and more. Watch the video below and also find out how you can win a new iPad Mini signed by Saldana (courtesy of the new a+ iPad Magazine).
Saldana not ready for Spock and Uhura to settle down
It was late in the day when I sat down with Zach and Chris and you can see it at the beginning where they were cooling themselves with bags of ice. But regardless of the junket fatigue we pressed on. Watch it below.
Highlights
Zoe Saldana on how she got Uhura a fight scene for Into Darkness…
At first it felt like it was a personal mission for me – a personal desire. And then as the years kept going I kept thinking that it would feel like a natural evolution for Uhura. Yes, she is part of Starfleet and graduated from the acadmey as a xeno-linguist, but to work in a military kind of profession you would have to be trained with some kind of military form of defense. At some point you are going to be used because all the boys are busy. I don’t know if I did this on purpose–trying to find reasons to justify my cause, but I did. And I know deep down that JJ And Damon and Alex and Bob felt that it would be great for her to do and I was happy.
As for the next movie, Saldana wasn’t sure what she wanted (except for one thing)
I don’t know where I would want to see Uhura. Definitely not married!…She has things she has to accomplish first.
But what about dealing with Spock’s Pon Farr? While Saldana didn’t know the name for the Vulcan 7-year mating drive, she was familiar with the concept.
A baby? On the Enterprise? Oh my god no! Not yet. Maybe by Star Trek 4 or 5 we can have a couple of Vulcans.
Saldana also talked about if she would like to see her Uhura become more like the classic TOS Uhura [Question from Craig of Columbus, OH]…
No. I hope not. Right now women are taking–having more participation and task-making. So I would assume that in our future, given our society today, their version of the Star Trek in the future–and I think it is a wonderful contribution to the franchise–is for women to have a more significant participation than just looking beautiful.
Saldana also said that speaking Klingon in Into Darkness was harder than speaking Navi in Avatar, explaining…
The pronunciation required a lot more effort [for Klingon]. It was a very deep tone that I discovered as I was learning it.
As for the next Avatar movie, Saldana said she expected to start shooting the sequel "early next year." She aslo confirmed that she would be in the new Marvel film Guardians of the Galaxy (playing the alien Gamora) [see previous TrekMovie article], but said she was just starting the process for that film including fitings but she was "just as excited but also just as curious" as everyone else over it.
Saldana Debuts New a+ Digital Magazine – win iPad Mini Signed By Zoe
Zoe Saldana has a cover story feature for a+, the new entertainment magazine experience covering music, film, fashion & style exclusively available on iPad and iPhone. The new digital magazine (from former GIANT Magazine editor-in-chief Smokey Fontaine) is full of videos, portfolios & celebrity interviews crafted specifically for the digital platform, not "optimized" to fit.
Zoe Saldana is the cover feature for new a+ iPad/iPhone Magazine
To celebrate the launch of the inaugural issue of a+, the magazine has partnered with TrekMovie to give away a free iPad Mini with a custom case signed by Zoe Saldana.
You can win this Zoe Saldana-signed iPad Mini
TrekMovie.com and a+ Magazine will be giving away the iPad Mini via @TrekMovie Twitter on Friday. Some time around noon Pacific Time on Friday TrekMovie will post a Saldana-related trivia question. The winner will be chosen randomly from one of the correct responses (North American residents only).
You can get a+ magazine on iTunes. You can also follow them on Facebook and Twitter.
More Junket videos
Stay tuned for more exclusive junket videos over the next few days.
Previously released:
she is doing her own thing as Uhura and I dig it…
I want to see her become more like Number #1 similar to what Gene did in the cage. And yes, no babies…..at least not yet.
According to the link Bob Orci posted on the ‘Sticky: Into Darkness Arrives’ thread, the Pon Farr issue is going to be dealt with in the next issue(s?) of the Ongoing comics. It will be interesting to see what the team end up doing with this.
For reference:
‘423. boborci – May 16, 2013
http://www.wired.com/underwire/2013/05/star-trek-after-darkness-comic/
keep an eye out for this if you go through post STID anxiety.’
Please, no babies, Vulcan or otherwise on the Enterprise EVER. Nor do I want to see Pon Farr come around, its too important to be a side plot but not important enough to warrant its own film. Who knows, they might not be together in future films. I can only hope.
I do love her comment on Uhura having things to accomplish personally. I honestly do feel like having her and Spock together takes away from that. Nearly everything she does revolves around him or supporting him. Her kicking ass was awesome, but starting fight with her boyfriend on a mission to Kronos had me rolling my eyes. I’d expect Uhura to be more professional. I wish they would break up but remain close friends and confidants and have her be fierce and in charge without worrying about Spock or chasing after him.
She has things that she wants to accomplish first? Yea, like finding out where the comms station is!
” A baby?! On the Enterprise?? Oh my GOD no!”
LOL she cracked me up the way she said that! By the way Zoe I agree completely. No babies/pon farr or marriage. Please writers don’t bring that crap in the next film. Let Miss Uhura evolve on her own without Spock. She’s a Boss and while I’d love to see her without a boyfriend, if the S/U thing must happen at least let her have things to do that don’t have with her love life. Like speaking Klingon was awesome.
The Uhura bit speaking Klingon made up fro the horrible scene in STVI where the crew was trying to bluff there way past a Klingon checkpoint and had a bunch of books open. Seriously the ship was on a diplomatic mission with the Klingons and no one on board spoke Klingon?
Bravo Zoe! Uhura got to be brave several times in the movie and I’m glad for it! The scene in which she departed the small ship to speak to the Klingons was marvelous – a pause to get herself together before going out there and possibly to her death. Then she coolly approached them and did her thing, despite the fact that most of them were twice her size. Awesome.
I liked the scene, too, where she’s helping Spock out toward the end, when she shot that one guy, Pew-pew-pew-pew until he dropped :)
I think Uhura’s fierceness is quite well-proven in this movie and hope to see her relationship with Spock continue and grow. (Saldana did not want little babies on the ship, but did not mention that the relatlionship should end. She just didn’t want Uhura to “settle down,” which to a lot of folk means “stay home and raise kids.”)
I do not support the idea that “a professional woman must not have a relationship with a significant other, that it diminishes her.” Nonsense. Tell that to any professional contemporary man. “Oh, sorry, you want to be promoted in the Navy? You have to shuck the wife, man.” “You want to get ahead at Google? Ditch the girlfriend.” Really?
Yes, Uhura’s got plenty of things to do in her future and I don’t think being with Spock will hinder her. I imagine both of them would be open to serving on different ships if necessary for career advancement.
The idea that a woman, in order to be professional, must give up a personal life with someone she loves is as ridiculous as expecting a man to give up his personal life for a job. It doesn’t happen nowadays and I think even less will it be expected to happen in the future. Most Commaders in the naval services are married or in “significant other” relationships. This gives them stability. Such stability is valued in the military, where there are many young people who’ve never had stable role models, and learn to value them.
No, babies do *not* belong on a starship [sorry, NextGen], but Pon farr is only a call to mate, not necessarily resulting in children. I would assume [and per Gene Roddenberry in “The Making of Star Trek,” this is true for Starfleet members] that Starfleet officers assigned to deep space missions are *all* on birth control. In any case I don’t think children would result from a Spock and Uhura Pon farr union, given that Spock is genetically unique.
Long live Spock and Uhura as a committed couple who are also committed to their careers!
And yes, before you say it, I do think Uhura was out of line discussing their personal business on the Qo’onoS mission, but the movie’s time limit demanded it :( …. thus the shortcut.
Agree with Rich Civil. That was a showstoppingly bad scene in STVI.
Really hope there will be more spoken Klingon in future Trek movies.
Not because I’m a linguist. Because I think it’s time for a Klingon villain.
I never thought the sole purpose of Nichols Uhura was to just sit there and be beautiful. It was more of a statement that African Americans and women can be officers on a starship.
Personally I don’t care much for this Uhura, with having a relationship with Spock and being more of an action hero. That’s just not who Uhura is imo. Of course I am a fan of TOS and not Abrams, so my opinion probably matters little here.
people always complain about Uhura being “defined” by her relationship with Spock and yet it’s just funny how most of the K/S fans (not necessarily slash) want Kirk and Spock to be defined by their friendship (that is what Spock prime said by the way) and expect everything to revolve around that and for some reason they have no issues with that but they complain about Uhura being worried for her boyfriend in a story where men are more emotional and defined by their relationships than female characters. It seems like only women has to fit a standard and can’t show emotions or have emotional scenes.
does remind of bigotries of the 60s.
Yes, I agree, Jemini. It seems that bromance is OK but not romance.
With the overall negative attitude that so many people appear to have towards there being children, I think we may be very lucky if anyone like James Kirk and others even get born.
12. Keachick
“Yes, I agree, Jemini. It seems that bromance is OK but not romance.”
so it’s not just me. I swear the hypocrisy in this fandom is mind blowing sometimes.
It’s just so ironic that people say Uhura being defined by the romance is a bad thing when the K/S friendship is canonically presented as these characters being defined by that friendship. For some fans they aren’t even Kirk or Spock the individual characters anymore, they’re the character named KirkSpock (at times Bones is also included in this “character” re: triumvirate and how the 3 characters are supposed to complete each other) . According to some Spock’s only purpose is to be Kirk’s friend and anything that represents a thing that is not part of that (like, him having a private life of his own) and is a distraction or unnecessary (mommy feelings aside).
So yeah, bromance is ok. Characters arcs and plot being predominately told from the perspective of a friendship only are ok but romantic relationship that are subtle anyway and sometimes even less in your face and screen-consuming than the said friendships, are suddenly this bad thing for the characters and the writers are so bad.
Just like in the 60s, the more things change the more they stay the same… The same double standard towards female characters, the same constant sanctifying of dudebro relationships only. The dudes with other dudes are the only ones allowed to show emotions.
Again, it’s funny all the talk about Uhura being defined by Spock when most of the male characters of this franchise are pretty much heavily defined by their relationships romantic or platonic (e.g., even Nero got batshit insane because of the loss of the woman he loved; Spock made a life-changing choice about his career and future by rejecting the offer by the vulcan science academy only because they insulted his mother.. and so on)
I got distracted and forgot to comment this cute interview by Zoe!
yeah, I agree with her that Uhura and S/U don’t necessarily need to get married with kids to have a plot. It shouldn’t be taken too for granted. Mostly I fear that if they marry them they’ll feel like they don’t need to develop the pair anymore which would be a shame for me as I think they really have a lot of potential.
Having said that, though, I wouldn’t be against the idea of a vulcan marriage that is a different thing from a human one. I’d love to see how they develop the whole vulcan mating bond thing because I had always been intrigued by this idea that vulcans share this connection with their partner that surely can have advantages but it could make some things more complex. I always wondered for example how Amanda, as a human, did deal with it since she didn’t have the biology of a vulcan. How the bond really works? Do they feel each other thoughts all the time? or do they only share some feelings like being simultaneously tuned to the same radio frequency? lol
I’d believe that Spock and Uhura should, by now, already have some sort of vulcan mental bond even if not strong like a real one. They had been together for years now and in the comics they’re intimate and he initiated the mind melds with her since the early stages of their relationship.
The trek franchise may support this theory because If I remember well in TNG T’Pol accidentally bonded with Trip after a one night stand and this somehow made him immune to the pheromones of the Orion slave girls.
13-jemimi
I think you mean ENT with trip and T’pol
Not TNG
Why must a lead female character be in a romantic relationship? Uhuru could be a strong character without the relationship. It’s kinda cliche. I always felt that she should be the one sitting in captain’s chair when Bones,Spock and Kirk would go on missions. I prefer Spock had a strong friendship with Uhuru like he have with Kirk.
You are right, Jemini. I am sick of the so-called Kirk/Spock bromance or the triumvirate/triad Kirk/Spock/McCoy trope. It seems that these three intelligent, well educated individuals can’t do without one another and even spend most of their free time in one another’s company. These three characters (in the TOS series) have been completely defined by their trimance.
But, god forbid, any one of these guys is in any way defined by a relationship he might have with a woman and any child(ren) she may conceive to him. Even more *dreadful* is the idea that a woman – Uhura, Carol, whoever, may find herself being a girlfriend, let alone, a mother to any of their children.
It is all about dudes and their dudebro relationships. They are the only relationships/friendships that matter. It seems that to the writers and producers, then and now, these male/male relationships are the only ones they are encouraged to write about, while they are often actively discouraged from dealing with any other types of relationships. It is really quite patriarchal and narcissistic…
#16: She’s a strong character. Period. Her relationship status doesn’t negate the fact that she’s a strong character.
Further, for a black woman to be shown as 1) having a career, 2) being competent in that career, and 3) being openly loved is a GREAT thing.
Because seriously, are we really going to say that a woman’s success is automatically trumped by her romantic relationship? Seriously??
18. She also be a strong black woman without the relationship. I didn’t said that woman’s success trumped her romantic relationship. All I’m saying is the writers didn’t have to put Uhuru in a romantic relationship for her to be a strong character.
I mean she can also
Odd how she almost seemed to drift into a British accent every now & then…
I wonder if making it that Vulcan’s have sex using only their left hand was done as a tribute to the 70% of trekkies who also only have sex using their left hand.
I think JJ Abrams, Bob Orci et al deserve kudos for introducing the Spock/Uhura romance into the Star Trek alternate universe as a canon relationship in the first place.
They have copped a lot of flak over this decision in the past few years, but have stuck to it for a second movie. Time will tell if they have the stomach to continue it into the future. I certainly hope so.
These sorts of relationships do form in the real world (obviously), so it seems realistic they should be shown to exist in the fictional world as well. In my opinion, they don’t need to be major plot points, they just need to be shown to exist.
I think they need to keep a balance with these characters to ensure that, while such a relationship is part of who they are, it should not be the only thing that defines them. I think the team have managed it quite well so far.
Of course, those who do not not like the relationship (and I acknowledge the dislike is for one of several different reasons, some more valid than others) would consider what is already shown is too much, hence the flak directed at Uhura for being just the ‘whining girlfriend’, or replacing McCoy, or the ‘concern’ that the relationship diminishes her character etc…
We don’t need, or want, Star Trek to become ‘Days of Our Lives In Space’, we just need to see ‘real’ people living ‘real’ lives while working in the most amazing place – the world of Star Trek.
Anyway, that’s my opinion.
#19 And therein lies the problem. That’s all we see when it comes to the portrayal of black women in the media. She’s “strong” and “doesn’t need a man”. That’s a tired trope I, as a black woman, am TIRED of seeing. Women of color do not have the luxury of seeing every permutation of their relationships in the media. We usually get stuck stereotypes such as “sassy best friend”, “plucky side kick”, “maid”, or “just there to further the plot of the white lead characters” (I’m looking at you, The Vampire Diaries).
There’s nothing wrong with a black woman being publicly loved and desired. Absolutely nothing. I commend the writers for doing it, especially when TOS made a point to portray Nichelle’s Lt. Uhura as an asexual nun, undesired and no desires of her own, who was only shown affection when mind control was involved. I prefer to see her loved by someone of their own free will, which is the case in the new movies.
24. Why do you keep bringing race into this? . Everytime Uhuru come up you seem to want to bring race up. Its not about her race. Please stop playing the race card. I sure didn’t see Uhuru that way on TOS. . She doesn’t have to be his girlfriend, she can be his friend. What’s so wrong with a platonic realtionship ? On TOS “The Man Trap” Uhuru made fun of Spock in a song. I thought was cute moment between them. They were both laughing and were. happy. In Nutrek, when they are together it be so serious and tense.It remind of Twilight the movie or soap opera.
@ 24.
Are you for real?
Have you ACTUALLY WATCHED TOS or the TOS movies?
Are you aware, and you half appear that you might be, that current movie has been made in THIS century as an action film, while the original series was made in the LAST century as a TV SHOW with all the limitations of budget constraints (time, money) and socially accepted limitations of the period.
Your sense of entitlement comes over just as much as those you appear to be rebelling against. Without putting the limits you are complaining of in the historical context of reality.
It really comes across that you are simply projecting your own limitations and what you perceive as others onto this film.
I have been a TOS fan for a long time and I have NEVER thought of Uhura as a nun! Thanks to the backstory that IS woven into her character in the series and the original films, if you actually look for it.
I doubt anyone wants a buddy buddy movie where K,S,McCoy are on screen every second, and all Uhura says is “hailing Frequencies open” but equally no-one who still wants it to be recognisable as Star Trek wants it to be the Uhura show.
Personally I’ve wanted to see Nurse Chappel in these films, having seen STID I really doubt that’s going to happen now, she ACTUALLY had something going on between her and Spock in the series, and in my humble opinion the writers left her out because they either felt incapable of writing the complexities of a 3way relationship where Chappell Uhura Spock had to work things out. Or they decided that their audience wouldn’t be able to cope.. In short spoke down to us.
Still.. I can understand this omission. Because the important relationship in TOS HAS ALWAYS BEEN Kirk Spock and McCoy spontaneity, logic and humility. These 3 facets of personality are in us all and give the 3 characters a need to be together as, together they are stronger .. This has always been and should continue to be at the heart of TOS Star Trek.
Rip that up and throw it away and it is no longer Star Trek it is simply something else.
Is there room in the movie for strong female characters, absolutely!
I find it interesting how Kirks “womanising” is being dealt with as almost an aside, a throw away “oh dear there’s kirk looking at the ladies again”
But if you have “strong women” in the future, surely they are more enlightened and have no shame attached to sex? So it becomes less about the male Kirk dominating the various female leads and more about open and free expression of a natural instinct to have a good time. It is part of their “strength” AND kirks.
I think what ticks some people off about Uhura being kick ass is that she is a comms officer .. Not a kick ass officer, its incongruous to say the least.
A little more intelligent writing could give us a tense scene where Uhura wrestles with a communication issue ON SHIP and that would satiate a lot of these complaints. If Uhura is the ONLY one able to “fix the damn computer/communicator” she is still “strong” then get her kicking some ass physically as well (within the context of a good story) and everyone “should” be happy.
As it stands it sounds like you and others still wouldn’t be happy, until its the Zoe Salanda show.
Which is fine if its your thing. It just wouldn’t be Star Trek in appearance or name at that point.
–
Ps. A thought occurred to me. Perhaps you are viewing this from the current social limitations of the time you are living in, how will what you have said, sound in 50 years time? :)
RACE and Uhura is a very interesting concept.
I think a lot of black women are leaving out their fantasies through uhura that is why they support the relationship. its like that TV show Scandal.
a lot of black women have a secret desire to be loved by a white man that is why most black women are in support of Spock/Uhura relationship.
then there is the other side of the Race issue. some white women might get upset that a black woman was able to get the unattainable…. land a guy like Spock so they get mad.
some have called Uhura a token others have said Spock does not marry a person who is in the category where the N word can be used to describe the person. that’s how bad some comments have gotten over the S/U relationship.
Both white and black people are guilty of racism when it comes to Uhura. believe me, if Spock were to break up with Uhura because of a white girl. Rebecca74 and many black women will get mad because their fantasy of a cool intellectual white man loving them has been dashed.
what is so funny is that star trek takes place in the 24th century where race does not even matter any more. human dates Vulcans, vulcans dates romilans, human dates orions and cat ladies, heck even Klingons marry humans
So I just wish the whole race thing will stop.
JJ Abrams did not think of race when he first paired S/U together. he paired them together because he felt they were more realistic and were the least predictable as a couple.
so stop with all the hate and secret fantasies.
15. ensignjack – May 17, 2013
a typo. I tend to consider everything after TOS as “new generation” to keep them separated but yeah, you’re right it’s ENT not TNG!
—
16. Desraye the vulcan girl – May 17, 2013
“Why must a lead female character be in a romantic relationship? ”
why must a lead female character NOT be in a romantic relationship to be strong?
and what’s is the difference, aside from the obvious (like “eww kissing” stuff) between close friendships and romantic relationships? what makes the first acceptable and the latter not so much
again, you guys really don’t realize what you’re implying with this double standard because you’re essentially saying (I’m using your logic) that there should be no friendships either especially when in star trek those are actually more dominant than any romance and take way more screen time and character development. Romance had always been subtle in start trek and it remains to be like that.
19. Desraye the vulcan girl
“All I’m saying is the writers didn’t have to put Uhuru in a romantic relationship for her to be a strong character.”
they didn’t have to do that and I doubt it’s their reason for putting her in a romantic relationship. She’d be a strong character on her own right regardless, the romance is just a plus because before being officers working aboard a spaceship these guys are supposed to be people. Romantic or platonic relationships are plot devices to make the characters look more real and make it so we can relate to them more.
Besides, this romance it isn’t the be all and end all for the characters, it just IS something that is part of their story and you aren’t necessarily “allowed” to see every moment between them.
Unlike the K/S friendship that defines their characters and, at times, can be a limit for the plot in that they aren’t (Spock especially) allowed to have any other arc other than that (or put the focus on them as individuals beyond the friendship aspect and how they relate to each other)
if the fandom has a problem with a tiny romance then maybe they should ask themselves if star trek is the right franchise for them because this is a story where the main characters had always been defined by interpersonal relationships. It’s a story where a friendship influenced the characters and made them, at times, act unprofessional and go against regulations to help a friend.
25. Desraye the vulcan girl – May 17, 2013
24. Why do you keep bringing race into this? . Everytime Uhuru come up you seem to want to bring race up. Its not about her race
it’s called http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersectionality
and it’s a thing.
#24 The same could be said about you bringing “gender” into the conversation, but that’s acceptable in your mind, but her race isn’t, huh? It matters, whether you want to turn a blind eye to it and ignore it to further your “point”.
#26 The point is that the limitations placed on TOS!Uhura should not continue to be placed on her in the reboots. There was a reason she was never paired with anyone on the show: racism. The American public in the 1960s could appreciate her being on the bridge (as an African, not African American), but having Ms. Nichols’ Lt. Uhura have the same romantic entanglements as Janice Rand or Nurse Chapel? Absolutely not. That’s why I appreciate why JJ & Co did with the reboots and why I question anyone that makes the statement that “she didn’t need a man in TOS” as some type of feminist statement.
I’d also like to see Nurse Chapel, but do you honestly believe the feminist would really want to see two women fighting over Spock? They already hate the fact that she’s in a relationship with him.
The IDEAL would be that our perceptions would be more enlightened in 50 years, but from the reaction of fans on this site 50 years after TOS, I’m not confident in that belief. Movies do not happen in a vacuum, and for a lot of women, seeing Lt. Uhura being openly and willingly loved IS progress. Because I know for me, seeing someone being forced to kiss her or having her mind warped so she’d show affection to someone bothers me to no end. I don’t like it when her choices and free will are taken away.
@3. ObsessiveStarTrekFan,
“According to the link Bob Orci posted on the ‘Sticky: Into Darkness Arrives’ thread, the Pon Farr issue is going to be dealt with in the next issue(s?) of the Ongoing comics. It will be interesting to see what the team end up doing with this.”
Yes, I rolled my eyes at this. It will be interesting. On the surface, it is the setup for Amok Time, but then the payoff for Amok Time they’ve already given us with STID, right? So it’s likely to go a completely different direction, unless … (No, they wouldn’t do magic tribble blood again, right?)
Side Note: does Amok Time actually accomplish in TOS what they attempted to do in STID? Or were K/S already past that point in their friendship?
As for Pon Farr, I never really followed this aspect of Trek because I always thought it was kind of stupid. But doesn’t Spock just have to have sex with someone? Anyone? Uhura, with whom he’s already having sex? Or does it have to specifically be a Vulcan (I seem to recall that from a dumb episode of Voyager). If so, I’m guessing Spock and Uhura become swingers? And if its about going back to his pre-arranged marriage, it seems to me Spock has long since abandoned his Vulcan roots and traditions. Shouldn’t he just tell his pre-arranged fiancé ahead of time that she’s free to pursue anybody she wants because he’s already got a girl? Didn’t T’Pol on Enterprise already successfully go through this?
Anyway, as you say it will be interesting.
I think a lot of people are entirely missing the point on why feminists and the critics (because I have listed on my blog excerpts from over ten reviews from big name critics for the latest Trek movie who have specifically addressed the treatment of women in this latest Trek film). It’s not that anyone is saying women can’t have a profession and be in a relationship and its not that anyone is saying one relationship, i.e. the Spock and Kirk friendship, is more important than romantic intentions either character may have towards Uhura and Carol. It centers on a theory within feminism called ‘the male gaze’ (I’d provide links but since those send posts into the mod queue just google the term ‘feminist film theory male gaze’).
The theory is this: movies (and television and advertisements) are shot almost predominantly from a male perspective. When a women is in a frame of a shot, her body will be panned over and certain parts focused on, more so than a males. Her relationships, as portrayed, are shown almost solely through how she relates to the men in her life. Historically women have almost always, with a few notable exceptions, been shown as married/dating/in the process of meeting someone to date. Never single or unattached and happy to be so. The implication there is that women need a relationship to live a satisfying life or to be considered of worth. Such an implication is repressive.
This is why the Bechdel Test came to be, because males already outnumber females in film on a three to one basis. Of those shown they’re almost always either within a romantic relationship or in the process of starting one. So much are the male/female relationships focused on to the detriment of all other relationships within a woman’s life that women within the Hollywood industry are either fired or actively discouraged to go against that grain (google ‘why Brenda Chapman was fired from Pixar over Brave’ and also ‘students actively encouraged not to pass the Bechdel Test in script writing’ and read the results, guaranteed you’d find it fascinating and disturbing).
What’s more, because we’re so used to seeing it, we come to believe it as the norm, thus women start to believe of themselves what they see or read through this ‘male gaze’. It’s called internalized sexism, where women actively become the harsher judges of their own appearance and the harsher judges of their relationship status (and those of other women) because they believe what they see to be right and true.
Historically women have been defined by who they are married to, and their relationship status (google ‘single discrimination’). So much so that certain states have passed laws forbidding the inclusion of ‘relationship status’ on applications or in job interviews. And for good reason, even in this day and age single, professional women have a hard time buying a home or even getting a loan on their own, regardless of income, i.e. even if they have excellent credit the the full means to pay off their debt in good faith. To sum up? The horrible implications of ‘spinster’ and ‘not in a relationship = unlovable and/or unworthy’ is still very much rampart.
That films even in this day and age, decades after the suffrage movement was in full swing (women were not allowed to vote in the US until 1920) are still shot predominantly in the ‘male gaze’ is a problem. And although I know some of you like that plot element, but the sad truth is that Spock/Uhura feed into this and the reason people get upset by it is that Star Trek is supposed to be about progression, not suppression.
Fact, according to the mpaa women make up half of the movie ticket purchasing population at 50%. In 2009 and 2010, they bought over half, at 51%. There is no reason, no reason at all, that ‘the male gaze’ needs to be the predominant means of storytelling within Hollywood.
And for those who argue ‘well, race makes it better because it means that the character is ‘lovable” I would argue that a person doesn’t need to be an ‘other’ to be lovable. People should be defined by who they are individually, their relationship status should not bear any weight in their appeal as a character or as a person. This goes for women AND men of any color, shape, size and form.
#27 Barney
Actually, no. That “cool intellectual white man” fantasy as you say is actually my husband.
Good try, though.
3. The article does not said anything about pon farr. They really don’t have to deal with the issue. I mean T’Pring, is dead and he already bonding mentally with Uhuru, so that is likely who Spock will turn to relieved the Pon Farr.They can also give Spock medicine like they did T’Pol.
8. ” In any case I don’t think children would result from a Spock and Uhura Pon farr union, given that Spock is genetically unique.”
It could happen. I mean on TOS “All Our Yesterdays” ( which is one of my favorite episode) Spock and Zarabeth union produce a son named Zar. Zar was introduce in novelization of All Our Yesterday.
26.”Personally I’ve wanted to see Nurse Chappel in these films, having seen STID I really doubt that’s going to happen now, she ACTUALLY had something going on between her and Spock in the series, and in my humble opinion the writers left her out because they either felt incapable of writing the complexities of a 3way relationship where Chappell Uhura Spock had to work things out. Or they decided that their audience wouldn’t be able to cope.. In short spoke down to us.
This way would turn into a soap opera or Star Trek 90210. It will be the same way if the added a vulcan or romulan woman.This would also upset the S/U fans.Although, it would make things interesting.
@33. Desraye the vulcan girl,
“3. The article does not said anything about pon farr. They really don’t have to deal with the issue. I mean T’Pring, is dead and he already bonding mentally with Uhuru, so that is likely who Spock will turn to relieved the Pon Farr.They can also give Spock medicine like they did T’Pol.”
You have to read the two pages from the teaser comic. It’s all about Pon Farr.
We don’t know T’Pring is dead.
That’s why it will be interesting, since Enterprise already dealt with this and Spock has numerous major character changes over his counterpart in TOS. That said, I don’t exactly understand how the whole thing with Prime Spock’s Pon Farr wasn’t already addressed under his previous 13 years of service with Pike.
#27 Barney
Actually, no. That “cool intellectual white man” fantasy as you say is actually my husband.
Good try, though
————————————————————————————————-
well it still doesnt change the fact that black women seceretly crave for a white’s man love. Most black women are diehard S/U lovers.
I have to hand it to you die hard S/U fans, you guys have become a very huge fanbase. Fanlore.com has the S/U relationship listed as popular the only other fan base listed as popular is the K/S slash fan base and it took you guys only 4 years to rival the K/S fanbase that has been slashing for nearly 50 years.
I do like S/U..however only in the alternate universe. I just can’t see TOS Spock and Uhura in a relationship. so I hope the S/U relationship stays solely in the JJ Universe.
I hope we get to see Kirk/Carol as a couple …S/U has too much angst and brooding so Kirk/carol will just be fun to watch.
3. The article does not said anything about pon farr. They really don’t have to deal with the issue. I mean T’Pring, is dead and he already bonding mentally with Uhuru, so that is likely who Spock will turn to relieved the Pon Farr.They can also give Spock medicine like they did T’Pol.
Maybe I missed something, but was it mentioned anywhere that he and Uhura were bonded! I don’t think they are. I know they have melded before but not Bonded.
God will they just please end this Spock/Uhura nonsense and actually give her something to do besides being worried/angry/bothered at Spock?
Right on Zoe, no babies or marriage happening here.
29.” The same could be said about you bringing “gender” into the conversation, but that’s acceptable in your mind, but her race isn’t, huh? It matters, whether you want to turn a blind eye to it and ignore it to further your “point”.
No, her race does not matter. Stop throwing out the race card.
#31 And yet I doubt there would be this must feminist angst if the object of Spock’s affection was Nurse Chapel.
Race matters because of how women of color are treated in the media today. It matters on how actresses of color are predominantly given stereotypical roles in movies and TV shows “sassy best friend”, “side kick”, “sassy waitress”, etc. It matters when characters written as non-white get whitewashed when the movie adaptation is made. It matters because we as women are NOT treated the same.
That even in 2013, the roles for actresses in Hollywood are limited by race. Because the majority of lead roles are cast as and default to white. It’s the reality. The world isn’t colorblind for all their protestations. If it were, you wouldn’t see the backlash when Idris Elba gets mentioned as possibly playing Bond or Heimdall. Or when Angel Coulby played Guinevere in Merlin. Or Donald Glover being in contention to play Spiderman. Because while these same people can accept dragons, witches, and elves, the moment you put a black person in the movie, they scream “historical inaccuracy” (and before you say it’s some fringe folks, I’ve seen those comments in what would be considered “mainstream” media).
Forgot to add… good on you, Zoe! I agree with your sentiments.
28. ” She’d be a strong character on her own right regardless, the romance is just a plus because before being officers working aboard a spaceship these guys are supposed to be people.
Its only plus to the people that are fans of their relationship.
“again, you guys really don’t realize what you’re implying with this double standard because you’re essentially saying (I’m using your logic) that there should be no friendships either especially when in star trek those are actually more dominant than any romance and take way more screen time and character development. Romance had always been subtle in start trek and it remains to be like that.
No I am not saying that. I am saying that if the wanted Uhuru to be a main character in the move they did not have to put her in a romantic relationship. That is my opinion.
Oh god here we go again..
I’ve learned to just skip right over Rebecca74 post. I already know what it’s gonna say, anyone who doesn’t like S/U or Uhura in the worried girlfriend role have race issues and blah blah. Then we get another history lesson. Anyone who disagrees is a repressed racist.
And YES. Her being with Spock is less empowering. She does a few things on her own (talking to Klingons) but in nearly all her other scenes she’s looking to Spock, or worried about Spock, or mad at Spock or nagging at Spock. That little fight she just had to pick on the way to Kronos made her look like an unprofessional fool, which we know she’s not. I can only imagine how more evolved her character could be if she were released from being the girlfriend of one of the main characters.
#39 Rebecca74:
Can’t speak for all feminist as I am but one among them, but I for one would yes, be protesting the Spock/Chapel romance as being supressive and superfilous as well.
As for race, I am well familiar with stereotypes in film, heralding from Hispanic origins myself. I don’t think romance is a progressive means towards combating it. People should be judged on individual merit. Period. Being ‘lovable’ has little to do with who one is dating or if they are dating. To combat the ‘angry black woman’ stereotype, Hollywood needs to stop writing angry black women, relationship or no relationship, i.e. it would be nice if Hollywood stopped stereotyping based on ethnicity and gender altogether.
*suppressive and superfluous… need more coffee
Nothing to worry about Pon Farr in the next film – being covered in the next issue of the comics
http://www.thetrekcollective.com/2013/05/comics-round-up-after-darkness-august.html
Barney, this is racist:
“well it still doesnt change the fact that black women seceretly crave for a white’s man love. Most black women are diehard S/U lovers.”
Are you seriously claiming the majority of a race of women secretly desire another race of men, based on the fact that some like Uhura/Spock?
…an alien figure who was in part CREATED to be an object of female desire??
Wow.
Like I said, you are racist, presumptuous, ignorant, and arrogant too (assuming you’re white).
It’s not his whiteness that’s attractive (Spock has always read as ‘other’ to me), and he’s technically not white, it’s stupid humans who have those concepts of race that are strictly a social construct.
To Spock and other Vulcans, because they are scientists…We, HUMANS are the other race.
Now, as for Rebecca’s uninformed rant.
…and for @24 who just dropped some truth that you’ve all chosen to ignore.
It’s 2013 and we just now have a Scandal, no not black woman/white male love, (that’s actually more common than black male/white woman love/sex onscreen and I can tell you, it’s not black women in charge of Hollywood who are perpetuating one with a clear fear of the other).
…it’s the fact that it’s a drama in which a black woman is the lead.
In fact, Kerry Washington only chose to be in the interracial storyline, because of the fact that Obama is in office and she didn’t want stupid people to infer anything based on it…
Gee I wonder where anyone would get the idea that people could possibly infer anything about entire races of people based on a TV show, Barney?
So, Rebecca, assuming that you’re white, I’m going to explain something to you as a black woman. DO NOT SPEAK FOR US.
You don’t know anything about what it’s like to be by default considered too sassy, and too strong for love….to be a freaking racist meme like “strong independent black woman don’t no man!” who is of course obese and sassy and asexual…
http://i.qkme.me/3poh8z.jpg
Heck, she even often shows in in American film and TV often “mm-hmming” in service position, giving unnecessary attitude and holding the hero. Which her derisive seen-it-all cynicism.
I’m sure you’ve heard of the Bechel Test and Fridging.
Well, to me, both of those are for white women.
Black women’s purpose isn’t to be a man’s lover, no she’s too sassy and strong for that. She’s there to frown and flex and be strong and sassy and support white people (TV’s Michonne is a good example).
…And fridging??? Don’t make me laugh, most of the time, black female characters in media are so hated their deaths are called for, and then quickly forgotten or done not for herself but for more important white characters (see: Simone in Heroes and Bonnie in The Vampire Diaries, who has died TWICE! for her white friends).
As for Uhura, bringing up race doesn’t make you racist. If that’s the case, then Gene Roddenberry is clearly a racist, because the entirety of Star Trek was about THIS DIVERSE GROUP COMING TOGETHER IN THE FUTURE TO EXPLORE SPACE.
There was even a A FREAKIN SIKH OFFICER ON BRIDGE AT ONE POINT!!!
Something you never see today.
Remember this was during the Civil Rights Movement.
So, it upsets me to see people mindsets going backwards in some ways.
That with the string of white female strangers having all kinds of storylines in the TOS movies, all up on the posters and everything, without complaint, that so many are concern-trolling Uhura,..
…Who is not only an original castmember, but one who was crapped on because of her race so much, she almost left.
MLK convinced her to stay and endure, to put aside her own desire to get away from the freakin’ racist security guard who would let her through the frontgate, for the good of her people.
So, don’t you dare act like Nichelle Nichols was put on some pedastal that Zoe Saldana has defiled.
She gets consenual romance.
She actually knows Klingon.
She gets to show all of the training she’s had in Starfleet, including combat training.
And, she’s loved by an Iconic character, one the first mainstream iterations of the “other” that was successful.
It’s no coincidence that outsiders often wrote Leonard Nimoy thanking him for allowing them to not feel like so much garbage.
So, yeah I see you’re disingenius concern-trolling. I see your use of the race card to deflect any real conversation about the reality of race in this country (something Gene Roddenberry didn’t flinch away from) and I am sad to see some many new Trekkies…don’t actually get what Star Trek is supposed to be about.
*psst!* It is about and has always been about diversity.
#41 It’s a double standard, plain and simple. She’s not defined or reduced by her relationship. Besides, you don’t even know she’s in a relationship with Spock until the half way point of ST ’09. Up until they kissed in the transporter, she was the lead actress who’s character had 1) handled herself coolly while being annoyingly hit on in a bar, 2) intercepted and translated the Klingon transmission, 3) defended her academic record, skill sets, hard work, and dedication to a superior officer who erroneously assigned her to a lesser ship, and 4) received a field promotion to the bridge because she could differentiate between Romulan and Vulcan, could speak all three Romulan dialects, and because she was instrumental in providing Pike proof that Vulcan was under attack. She was established from the beginning as this amazing female character.
Of course, certain fans perceptions changed when she went to comfort Spock.
Once they’re shown kissing, that’s when the dismantling and reduction of Lt. Uhura occurs by certain fans who call her portrayal anti-feminist and a “step back”, without bothering to realize how repressive the “don’t need a man” trope is to a certain group of women. It’s those fans that reduce her and place more import on her relationship with Spock (as her defining characterization) and continue to ignore all she did in ST ’09 and STiD.
I absolutely love that her ability to translate (ST ’09) and speak (STiD) Klingon, after the horrible dictionary thing in ST: TUD, is shown. I love the fact that she’s shown as the best xenolinguist in Star Fleet. I love that she presented a cool head and stood as the voice of logic and reason when others wanted to go out shooting. I love everything about her characterization because she’s the Lt. Nyota Uhura we should have gotten in TOS.
35. barney – May 17, 2013
“well it still doesnt change the fact that black women seceretly crave for a white’s man love. Most black women are diehard S/U lovers.”
ugh man way to prove that Rebecca is exaggerating.
I think that you should think before writing some things unless you want to be offensive on purpose
(I’m so white that I could be a vampire, btw)
“I hope the S/U relationship stays solely in the JJ Universe.”
hope? unless these writers have the power to completely recton the old series I think it will definitely be unique to the reboot and you have nothing to worry about
or you mean a continuation of the old series? (aren’t they all dead saved for Spock Prime?)
“I hope we get to see Kirk/Carol as a couple”
I smell Carol/Bones tbh.
41. Desraye the vulcan girl – May 17, 2013
“Its only plus to the people that are fans of their relationship.”
in the same way it’s an issue and not a plus only to the people that aren’t fans of the relationship and thus are biased AGAINST it regardless what the writers do with that.
” No I am not saying that. I am saying that if the wanted Uhuru to be a main character in the move they did not have to put her in a romantic relationship.”
the thing is, even when it comes to Spock himself he was, originally, made a more prominent and main character by making him the best friend of the star that was Shatner-Kirk.
Hell, If you read some old letters by Roddenberry you will read that the reason they made them best friends, in the first place, was precisely because they knew that the alien (Spock) was more popular thank the captain and this was unacceptable for them as the star had to be Kirk-Shatner. So to resolve the problem they made Spock his best friend so that people would love Kirk because of Spock instead of hating him because they preferred Spock over the protagonist.
McCoy Bones also was a more prominent character compared to Sulu, Chekov and Scotty BECAUSE he was the friend of the protagonist.
Making Uhura important to Spock in order to make her more prominent as a character and see a bit more of her is not necessarily something new to this franchise and any fictional story that have one or two main protagonists with many background characters.
#Gingerly… I am black and I’m very much aware of how stereotypes affect me as a black women.
I do, also, know more than enough about people assuming I’m white because my name is Rebecca. I could tell you so many stories about going on interviews and the shocked faces (actually mouth open, wide eyes) I get when it’s me, and not who they expected.
I’m not speaking from some desire to “speak for” Black women. I’m speaking for myself, as a black woman.
#47 Rebecca74:
It’s a double standard because that is your perception since you are a fan of the romance. From my perception it is a double standard to make exceptions for something based on its inclusion. An inclusion that is sexist because women are seldom shown outside of the male gaze, regardless of their ethnicity.
Case in point, if I were to go to one of my black female friends (one of whom is my niece) who aren’t Trekkies and could give two figs about Spock and Uhura, but who do care quite a bit about racial and gender stereotyping, they’re not going to feel that the Spock/Uhura relationship makes any sort of statement. Because it’s a romance. A romance is not the begin all and end all of an individual. But how Nyota Uhura is portrayed as a person, based on individual merit, THAT does matter, because romances come and romances go, but they do NOT encompass a person’s personality nor do they dictate someone’s worth.
I, too, love Nyota Uhura. Her relationship with Spock bares no impact on my fondness for her. Nor should it.