The entire Shuttle Pod crew is on deck to discuss the exciting return of Star Trek: Discovery from the Fall hiatus. So grab your best goatee, straighten your hair, and prepare to jump into a new side of Discovery.
Subscribe to Shuttle Pod: The TrekMovie.com Podcast on iTunes, Google Play Music and Pocket Casts! Like what you hear? Please feel free to leave us a glowing review on iTunes.
Star Trek: Discovery Season 1, Episode 10 – Debuted Sunday January 7th
Written by Sean Cochrane
Directed by Jonathan Frakes
At The Disco 9: “Despite Yourself”
“Despite Yourself” plunges the crew into the Mirror Universe where the evil Terran Empire rules the galaxy, with excellent direction by Trek’s own Jonathan Frakes. The universe swap allowed the cast to relish in the trappings of the Mirror Universe. Kudos to Mary Wiseman as Captain “Killy” and Shazad Latif and Mary Chieffo continue to do excellent work with their characters’ intense draw to one another.
The Emperor commands you to listen to the latest podcast.
Mirror, Mirror
The Shuttle Pod crew also discuss the new version of the mirror universe and how it has changed since we last saw it in Enterprise. Of note was the mention of the USS Defiant, integral to the plots of both “Despite Yourself” and ENT’s “In A Mirror, Darkly”. Along with the uniforms and Terran Empire logo, the Discovery team seems to have tweaked the Defiant as well. Check out this comparison of a wire frame of the Constitution class ship alongside the Defiant as we saw it in ENT.
Constitution Class USS Defiant as seen in “Despite Yourself”
The USS Defiant as seen in drydock in “In A Mirror, Darkly”
Before anyone says anything about Discovery changing the design of the Constitution class, keep in mind the ship is now over 100 years old and chances are they’ve made modifications. Really is as simple as that. Look at the difference between the 2 designs between 2269 and 2271 refit. Major difference in 2 years.
Or it’s simply a new take on an established design, like much of DSC to date. Personally, I prefer that explanation in light of the fact that 21st century audiences are just not going to buy into plywood sets and resin buttons in a modern SF series. Not even the majority of the TOS fanbase (myself included), which really needs to do some growing-up.
When I originally read that reason about 21st audiences accepting plywood bright sets I accepted it and then seen a hoard of fans not understanding that statement – it just will not work. Need to grow with the times, which luckily many are now doing.
I can understand the aesthetic might need updating, and more detail would be needed, but why would the shape of the ship need to change? The schematic shown is less streamlined and doesn’t seem ‘updated’ unless you mean ‘change for the sake of change’. I’m still hoping that there will be a reason for the change, such as what Stu proposes, or perhaps that schematic is inaccurate on purpose…
Possible guess… Since the Defiant came into the mirror universe ENT era, the Terran Empire obviously studied the new tech and made modifications to the ship.
I don’t know, I never had an issue with the ’60s looking Defiant alongside the NX-01 in In a Mirror, Darkly. Weird but fun.
Actually, I don’t disagree. “In a Mirror Darkly,” was, in my view, pure fan service and nothing more, but I’ll have to admit that the TOS era visually came off better than it had any right to, due partly to the way the sets were lit but mostly because I think the NX was designed from the beginning to look more “primitive” to the degree that was believable in a modern show. Discovery didn’t bother with that, so we’re now forced to accept it (or not) as a visual re-interpretation of the pre-TOS era. I was the dork who had his own set of TOS blueprints back in the day, so I get the objections of people who can’t buy into canon discrepancy, but at this late stage of my life I just can’t get worked up about it.
I hear ya, I can’t get worked up about it either. But if they want to go full ’60s again, for no reason other than fan service, I won’t be complaining. :-)
Then again, I think a happy middle ground could be found, drawing from the clean lines of the ’60s while incorporating modern tech.
When I think of how the TOS bridge would look to an outsider, just consider how the Black Mirror episode’s bridge looked to us: hokey and old school, an affectionate parody on 60s retro futurism. But it looked ridiculous, as does TOS to modern audiences. So yes, the only believable option would be to update the sets. Sorry, visual canon. After 50 years, it’s not that important.
Kayla is back! Thank pitchforks and pointed ears!!
Really enjoyed that, thanks everyone.
They should have really called this show “Star Trek: Been There-Done That””
After Jared’s review of U.S.S. Callister and his gross BS about society picking on the poor, poor, male, “misandry”, yadda yadda, Infind the appeal of a podcast featuring him has dropped to less than zero. How disappointing to see this crap given a platform. TrekMovie used to be better. Unsubscribed.
“I find the appeal”…
Bye!
I’m sorry, Karidian, but that’s just silly. You disagree with Jared’s opinion on the interpretation of one episode of one show, and suddenly everything he takes part in is soured for you? “This crap” in your sentence is a reference to Jared? A person, a human being? Perhaps you’ll benefit from taking a little break and examining why you can’t tolerate people who hold opinions different from your own.
I personally thought there was something missing from Discovery until episode 5, when Tyler appeared and joined the crew. The puzzle pieces fit and the show suddenly clicked.
So, I have two theories.
1. Tyler Self Sacrifices himself in front of the Klingons for Burnham or Burnham has to kill Tyler at the end of the season to complete her ark. Either way Tyler dies and becomes a tragic love.
2. The real Tyler is still on the Klingon ship. Voq as Tyler dies and the REAL ash Tyler becomes a part of the crew without any memory of his love for Burnham.
Either way I cant see how the showrunners or CBS would be dumb enough to let Shazad Latif go.
Or Voq decides to remain as Tyler…
That’s the direction I’m leaning, but just barely. We shall see.
You just gotta give up the ‘They did this in TOS, so…’ I wish continuity could hold up for 50+ years, but it doesn’t. Go yell at the screen during the next Batman/Bond/Who. Somehow, those franchises hold onto what they need on a movie-to-movie basis.
Anyhoo…
Nice work on Volcano Expeditions, Kayla. Hot stuff!
With Vulcans having goatee and beards only one didn’t and that was Tuvok when he cameoed in the DS9 season 3 episode Through the Looking Glass. I think Georgiou will be the emperor when they reveal it. It would make more sense in that universe if she’s a descendant of Hoshis
Ironic, all this talk about “dated” TOS, and yet Discovery will be the most dated looking Trek show of them all in a few decades. Mark my words. Everything in it is so “contemporary”, they are not making an effort to project a credible future that is different from today’s tastes, like TNG did when it invented tablets and computer surfaces embedded into walls (minus the beige carpets, I know!) All these over-designed structures in Discovery, apparently meant to cater to spreading HD and 4K sets (same as overcolored TOS just meant to placate color TV owners!), then John Eaves’ horribly busy starships (out of all the Berman era creative talent they had to re-hire that hack? Really?), the hair styles, colors and let’s not talk about the rap song in the second Mudd episode…
The truth is the history of technology shows a trend from busy to smooth simplified “disappearing” tech. I get it – TOS plywood doesn’t fly, but we are talking about design language here. As someone else said, they can achieve this style even on a much higher budget with premium materials (somewhat like “2001”) Just look at the history of the smartphone starting with busy overdesigned key phones, clamshells, thick slabs with buttons and ports to almost button- and port-less singular sheets of full screen glass now. So let’s not talk about realistic projection of today’s future instead of 1960s. If that was the case, Discovery wouldn’t show touch screens at all but some sort of virtual 3D surfaces or tech that interfaces directly to the minds of the crew on an otherwise empty smooth ship – maybe with pot plants and (not beige ;-) carpets.
The problem is, you’re equating consumer industrial design trends to something that’s meant to be functional in a variety of critical situations. This is why engineers should design ships, not artists. Just because tech CAN go in a certain direction, doesn’t mean it should in all potential applications of it. TOS actually does a good job of balancing these aspects. Sure the aesthetic needs updating, like maybe round things out a bit, make things a bit less clunky. And the primary color scheme is probably the biggest offender to our sense of futurism, though that’s our own cultural bias talking. But they didn’t and still don’t need touch-screens and unnecessary holographics. The biggest problem is that we’re talking about a television series, not real life. So these things ARE designed by artists, and things like actor visibility, framing, lighting, etc. are all taken into account, along with the “wow factor”. They’re not designing sets and props exclusively for realism and function. They just have to look good on camera, and make the actors look good interacting with them. So the argument about consumer industrial design practices does apply here for sure, but only because Star Trek is a consumer product, and not a real thing. If it were real, it’d probably follow NASA and military design trends more than smartphone designs.
Aesthetic preferences vary, but there’s no evidence whatsoever that John Eaves is anything but a lifelong fan and talented illustrator who’s wholly committed to his work, the very antithesis of a hack. Stay classy if you can at all manage it, Mr. Soul.
Writers often give characters names that have meaning. I think Ash Tyler’s name perhaps is a reference to a phoenix rising from the ashes. But does that mean his former Klingon self will rise, or that his new Ash persona is the one that has risen?
Gave up on this podcast about halfway through. First they say they don’t like fan service and then they complain about “The Manchurian Test” and suggest it should have been the “Tristan Adams Test.”
Also yes, in Enterprise the Vulcan T’Pol was mistreated and spoken down to.
We don’t mind fan service if it is done well, which we’ve said in previous Discovery episode podcasts.
I’d argue that naming the test after an in-universe well known psychiatrist who was said to have revolutionized various treatments during the era of DSC is not so much fan service, rather it is good world building.
I may be wrong but I don’t think anyone has yet mentioned how well Harberts and Berg are doing as show runners on Discovery. I know they are associated with Bryan Fuller who is a Star Trek aficionado but when he left the show it became a huge weight on their shoulders. I personally think they are doing an amazing job. Thoughts?
Love the podcast and enjoyed this weeks analysis.one piece of criticism- I have been going through the catalog of old shuttlepod eps. On a few occasions someone has not done their Homework (by watching the film or episode(s) being reviewed). If you will be conducting a retrospective on a movie you should be revisiting the film to jog your memory so an in depth analysis can be given. Seems you guys/gal are relying too much on your recollection of having watched it a few years prior. I get that a lot of the points you want to make will maintain but you’ll maybe a a bit more to flesh out and allow the listeners to digest. I know- who likes criticism but aside from this i have spent hours listening on the DISCO episodes and really enjoy it
I just noticed: The DISC-version of the Defiant has those strange bumps just before the nacelle struts. Seems to me that’s where the nacelles were in the original configuration (as seen in TOS and ENT) – thus, we are indeed looking at a refit the ship has had in the Mirror Universe, rather than an outright retcon of the Constitution class’ appearance!
This new configuration seems to move more “laterally” anyway, rather than radically “modernizing” the Constitution class, unlike famously the Kelvin-verse Enterprise. The era around the deflector dish makes me think of the Bonaventure from TAS…
Major kudos for the Bonaventure reference. And yes it kind of does look like the dish area from the “Bonnie”.
Re: The Discovery located near Organia.
The Discovery did not do a spore jump from the Pavo (sp?) planet. The Discovery was ordered back to Starbase. To buy time, Lorca pulled the “mechanical issue” a la Scotty in Star Trek VI. So the ship was going mid warp to buy time in order to come up with a solution. As soon as they found a solution, *then* they did the spore jump that led them to the Mirror Universe. So, it was entirely possible that the Discovery ended up near Organia by the time they spore jumped.
I was yelling at you guys whilst driving my car. Lol
And if I recall correctly, Lorca’s Organia comment was in the context of where they expected to end up – namely, Starbase 46 – not where they jumped from. So, that means we learned that Starbase 46 is near Organia.
That was my recollection and conclusion as well, thanks.
Not sure if an one else mentioned this but the first slow clap in Star Trek was in Star Trek 6
Really?