Saturday’s Star Trek Universe panel was broken into segments with rotating panelists coming on and off stage, with the exception of executive producers Alex Kurtzman and Heather Kadin, who are overseeing all of Star Trek television for CBS. The panel started with Star Trek: Discovery which recently started production on its third season. We previewed some of what was said along with a handful of new images that were released yesterday. But, there was much more said about what is in store for the Disco.
Huge changes in S3, but staying true to canon and Roddenberry
Alex Kurtzman kicked off the Star Trek Universe panel talking about what is coming ahead for Discovery along with the approach the team is taking with all the Trek shows in development:
We made a pretty radical jump into the future at the end of season two. We are going almost a thousand years into the future in season three, which is crazy. [It’s] further than any Trek series has gone before. People are asking what the world is going to be like in the future and are you going to go dark? I understand all of those questions. The thing I would want to lead with is to say every conversation we have about how to create Star Trek is filtered through [Gene] Roddenberry’s essential vision of optimism which can never really change. It is the spirit and soul of Trek for all of us…It is more important than ever.
Even though the second season of Star Trek: Discovery had the record of the USS Discovery’s mission in the 23rd century erased from Starfleet’s database and the ship jumping far into the future beyond any Trek show before, Kurtzman wanted to assure fans they are not going to ignore all those centuries of canon:
So, there will be lots and lots of huge changes in season three. There will be things you recognize; there will be things you don’t recognize. Part of the fun of it is that we get to honor canon but shake it up hugely. We are not erasing anything, so please don’t worry about that. It is all still what it was. But we do get to shake it up quite a bit. I think the fun of getting to that place of preserving that essential optimism is by testing it. Each of these shows do that in many ways. I just want to assure you all first and foremost that it is Star Trek and it will always be Star Trek, the way Roddenberry wanted it.
Kurtzman also addressed fan concerns about the story of the Discovery crew being erased from history:
While their actions have been erased from the historical record, the spirit of Trek lives on after them. And they are bringing that same thing into the future, a future that needs it very much. We are going to be leaning into that even more in season three. So, we are not erasing what we have done. It’s very important to us generally that all Trek carries a message.
The future isn’t what was expected
The finale of the second season had the crew of the Discovery jumping centuries into the future — to the year 3187, with the target of the planet Terralysium, which is where Burnham’s mother was based in the future. However, star Sonequa Martin-Green revealed that things didn’t exactly go as planned, at least in terms of which planet they landed on:
We are not in Terralysium…We do not land there like we planned. We were able to shoot in Iceland, which was fantastic. It was such a blessing. It was incredible and breathtaking. I feel like this venture into the future is so powerful because we – as a company and also as a crew on Discovery – we became a family at the end of season two. And now we are forging this path that has never been forged before, boldly.
Martin-Green also noted that the new setting for the show has them leaning into the what the series (and ship’s) name has always promised:
We go to the deepest level of discovery in season three because we are in this new place together and we have to figure out where we are who we are now. I really love that from a character perspective, that everyone and everything is unfolding in these really compelling ways.
Alex Kurtzman also discussed how things go for the crew of the USS Discovery at the start of season three:
When they get to the other side of the wormhole they have big problems. In fact, even getting to find each other may be difficult, because they may not have landed in the same place.
Kurtzman also discussed how they have approached developing the look of this far future:
There is going to be whole exploration of what the world looks like a thousand years from now. When you ask about the cinema of it, boy do we have our work cut out for us. The design teams have been busy at work because we are building a future that is complicated. The thing that I think defines Trek is it always pay attention to the small character moments in the middle of the big. It’s always about the little. It’s always about the humans, and the human interaction, and the inter-special interaction. So, that has to be the focus of the show. What we didn’t want is “now there is a lot of eye candy with big floating cities all over the place” and all the clichés you have seen a million times. Yes, you will have a lot of eye candy, but our focus is always on what does it mean and what does it do for the characters.
Burnham explores her burden, but who will command?
The first two seasons of Discovery have been anchored around the arc of the lead character of Michael Burnham. Alex Kurtzman talked briefly about where her arc may be headed into season three:
I think what Burnham carries with her is – which is fascinating – is this tremendous responsibility of taking care of everybody. She felt she need to lead her ship through time to save all sentient life. That is a really big burden to bear. That is a lot, to explore for her character what that means and what point is that too much to carry. She goes through a lot of changes as do all of the characters in many ways.
With Pike left behind, the USS Discovery went into the future without a permanent captain. Even though Commander Saru was acting captain, Kurtzman pointed to how this issue of command is still an open question:
Obviously, we left unresolved at the end of last season who the captain of the Discovery is going to be. And the captain will be [pauses] …somebody you will find out about when you watch season three.
Staying with lighter tone, and more exploring of crew family
One of the big – and generally welcome – changes for Discovery in season two was a lighter tone following some of the darker themes explored with the Klingon war and foray into the Mirror Universe in season one. Executive producer Heather Kadin assured fans they are sticking with the more traditional lighter Star Trek tone:
In the second season more than the first we were able to lean into the tone of what a lot of people expect out of Star Trek and having a lot more fun and adventure with the drama. Obviously [season three] is inherently dramatic because our whole crew left their entire family behind and chose the family they are now with. So, there is inherent drama in that, but there is also going to be fun and humor and you are still going to have the characters you love.
Co-showrunner Michelle Paradise also emphasized that even with all the issues related to the future, the crew remains the focus:
About going to the future and how it might be a little bit tricky. The thing the original Star Trek did so beautifully is focus on the family. I think the family of this crew, of Starfleet and the Federation, this season gives us the opportunity to hone in on that even more.
Kurtzman added that we will see some new character dynamics in season three:
The great thing about the third season of a television show is season one is about these people coming together and figuring out who they were as a family and season two is about really solidifying them. But then they choose each other for eternity and leave their birth families behind. Star Trek has always been a show about that bridge crew family and I love this season we get to start mixing and matching relationships between different characters. People you have met, but actually only got to know peripherally are going to take center stage in a different kind of way. There is going to be a ton of new characters.
One of the surprises for the panel was the introduction of actor David Ajala who will be playing Cleveland “Book” Booker. Ajala graciously introduced himself to the audience of Trek fans:
Greetings guys, lovely to meet you all. It is an absolute pleasure to be part of this wonderful franchise.
The actor also gave a bit of detail on his character:
Book is a character that is going to break the rules a little bit. It’s always fun to break the rules and we do that right from the start of the season.
Kurtzman also added a bit of a cryptic note on this new character:
He will be a character who isn’t exactly what you expect right away.
No word on release date for season 3 or Section 31
With the single Star Trek Universe panel running through all the various projects, time was limited for the Discovery portion. A number of open questions remain, notably when they expect the third season to premiere. There was also no discussion on how the third season will tie into the planned Section 31 series or what this means for the character of Mirror Phillipa Georgiou (Michelle Yeoh) who will be part of season three of Discovery and is the lead in the Section 31 show.
Season 3 photos
In case you missed them yesterday, CBS released a handful of images, likely from the season three opener, which includes location shooting in Iceland and the introduction of the character of Book.
UPDATE: Watch Martin-Green welcome Ajala to Trek
More SDCC 2019
Check out the rest of our San Diego Comic-Con 2019 coverage. And stay tuned to TrekMovie for more from the Star Trek Universe panel and beyond.
Thank you for posting this TM! :)
Man I have to say I am SO excited for Discovery next season. Going into the future was the best single idea for this show and it sounds like we are going to get a great story from it as well. While I don’t think going so far into the future was necessary this is probably the best outcome for the show and probably should’ve been this way from the start. I am happy though we are getting something that is so advanced and can redefine the entire franchise as well.
I have to say 6 months ago I was way more excited about Picard and after that trailer more than ever. It brought me back to the Star Trek I remembered and loved. But now I’m JUST as excited for Discovery too and its going to be fun to compare how things are between the 25th century with Picard and the 32nd century with Discovery. Its going to be so exciting to watch and compare both, especially their take on future tech and how certain species have developed from the Borg to the Romulans. And FINALLY no prequels! ;)
But will be giddy if and when the Pike show comes and we have his Short Treks coming. Man its a great time to be a fan!
Third time lucky, huh? I wish they would leave Michelle Yeoh’s character out of Disco. I love her as an actress but section 31 is annoying. Or bring back Prime Georgiou.
I’m with you there. The original show runners really screwed up when they killed her off- leaving no thread for her return. Then realizing their mistake, they make her mirror empress Georgio/Sato? Weird, just weird. Now they want to make her a section 31 agent and give her a show of her own. Even weirder.
I just don’t see the appeal in a show based on rogue, yet sanctioned Starfleet officers that are allowed to violate every directive, including the first. If done right, I could see it work, but not with Michelle Yeough. Not to mention the twisted background of her character: Mirror universe, evil empress pretending to be the ethical Captain Georgio, all the while acting as an agent for Section 31. It’s just too eff-ed up, already. And the series hasn’t even began production.
I like Discovery a lot, but I’m sick of the attempted appeasement. Gene’s Vision blah blah.
I couldn’t care less whether it complies with Gene’s Vision TM, a “vision” which changed in Gene’s own eyes often enough, and has been the subject of various interpretations ever since – with the bigger diversions from it representing some of Trek’s best work.
We’ve already had two season finales muddled by attempted appeasement of critics – Burnham’s mawkish speech about values in 1, and the ludicrous canon dodging in S2.
Just make a good show – which to my mind it has done better for the first two seasons than most of its Trek predecessors – and stop pandering to people who have already made up their minds against the series.
What the future look like in 1000 years. Well when I was a kid everything was suppose to look different. That was according to sci fi books and movies. I wondered what will it be like by 2000. I was a teen in the 60’s.Except for technology nothing really has changed Buildings look the same, wars still going on.People may have gotten worse with what’s going on at the moment. Greed still drives people and makes it worse on everyone else. Were nowhere near a Star trek type world and maybe never will One can only hope.
I’m done with hearing ‘you won’t see this coming’ as part of the game plan for Discovery. The biggest problems with the show so far have been plot twists we didn’t see coming… because they made no sense. Just write good stories. And please let other characters develop. Burnham does not have to be the center of every story. She can be a respected friend who listens sometimes from the sidelines.
Man, and I remember when people accused me of being the most negative about this show lol. I don’t actually disagree with your point though, the season 2 finale really made no sense if you thought about it too hard and I’m still having trouble trying to figure out how all the time travel worked. But I am more than happy with the destination than the journey to care that much at this point.
Th entire finale felt rushed. “OK, so, just forget any of this ever happened. The spore drive, Michael, Discovery. Just, you know, forget about it. All the pieces fit now! Woo hoo!”
Once Discovery made that jump they kind of made the entire series irrelevant and they’re still dealing with issues similar to Discovery’s first two seasons in that anything they introduce will still have to fit into what happened prior while also forcing other series to potentially conform with what the introduce with a gap that spans centuries. I’m not really sure how liberating this approach is.
Discovery never should have take place before TOS or tied in so closely to TOS by introducing Spock’s previously unknown sibling.
Yeah, the whole “classify everything and move on” was just too simple an effort for a problem that would be far more complex. Consider how the families and friends would react to being told they will NEVER see their loved ones again. And considering it’s all classified now, they will likely be given an evasive, run around excuse obfuscating the truth. We are to believe that the hundreds, if not thousands, of people impacted by that will just take Starfleet’s word on it and leave it at that? Trying to hush this all up would create a far bigger problem ensuring it became more known, not less.
Sending the ship to a different time (although 1000 years feels like a bit much but we shall see) was only the 2nd best option. The best option was for Burnham to use the time suit and prevent all that stuff from ever happening. Starting with her parents involvement in creating a time suit. Just set it up so not one does such a thing. But then, that would have been the end of the show.
“The entire finale felt rushed. “OK, so, just forget any of this ever happened. The spore drive, Michael, Discovery. Just, you know, forget about it. All the pieces fit now! Woo hoo!”
Once Discovery made that jump they kind of made the entire series irrelevant and they’re still dealing with issues similar to Discovery’s first two seasons in that anything they introduce will still have to fit into what happened prior while also forcing other series to potentially conform with what the introduce with a gap that spans centuries. I’m not really sure how liberating this approach is.
Discovery never should have take place before TOS or tied in so closely to TOS by introducing Spock’s previously unknown sibling.”
I agree with most of this obviously. Yes the finale was VERY rushed and the way they handled how Burnham is not ‘mentioned’ in TOS as being classified is just so bizarre and ham fisted. Did they really need to say its basically illegal to mention her again? But that’s why it makes no sense the ship is coming back to the 23rd century if everyone aboard Discovery made it clear they weren’t coming back and Starfleet literally lied and covered up the fact they went into the future. Why do all of that then if the plan is to bring the ship back a season later? And then they wouldn’t have ‘fixed’ canon either, the exact same problems they had would still be there. It would just be more bad and convoluted writing on this show if they actually did that now.
I will disagree that it made the show irrelevant though. Kurtzman made a good point at Comic Con that everything that happened the first two seasons still happened and my guess is if and when they create another show in the 23rd century again with either Section 31 and/or Pike then a lot of those events that happened in Discovery will become relevant again, especially since both Section 31 and Pike had such a heavy hand in that canon.
But yes it was a huge mistake to tie this show so closely to TOS and they obviously know that now. So I applaud them for going a different direction even if I’m not sure it will make a better show, but certainly a more interesting one for a lot of us.
“But yes it was a huge mistake to tie this show so closely to TOS”
Which was the first major mistake. Even setting it in the time frame they did could have worked out. The Sarek and Spock connection was certainty not needed. It felt like lazy writing to me. Something they put in to at best create an excuse to say “Spock” and at worst, a crutch they could use if the show was falling apart. Which is what they did in season 2.
I sincerely hope that Discovery’s writers room can settle down and produce a coherent and continuous season.
I really would like it to be successful, and less emotionally overwrought than it was in the second half of season 2, if only to keep my spouse watching with me. I’d like to get through at least one season without my spouse needing a hiatus from Discovery two thirds the way through.
Discovery could be both coherent and an action-filled bullet. It would be so great if it stopped being the Trek that doesn’t stand up to thinking too carefully…when it’s production folks are doing their best to polish every detail.
By the way, Michelle Paradise is quoted elsewhere saying that each episode will be like a mini-movie, which is exactly what Seth McFarlane said about The Orville’s stand-alone S2 episodes. My reaction was ‘What’s up with that?’
It would be great if Discovery’s writers room could have all the scripts in the can before production starts the way that The Orville does, so that they’d time to go back and polish.
5 scripts in the can before filming is progress, but with so many new shows in development, it sounds as though it will be a challenge to staff up and bring stability to the writers rooms for the various shows.
My enthusiasm level for season 3 lingers somewhere between “I’ll probably watch” and ‘meh’. Can’t quite explain it. Could be the return of Picard, the potential for a Pike series or that it’s jump to the far future almost makes it irrelevant after two seasons as a prequel.
I’m leaning more towards “meh”. The show struggled so much trying to figure out what it was about, only to have its concept changed completely. I’ll catch up on its new direction, that is supposedly far flung into the usual generic sci-fi dystopia theme, when I am paying for Picard or the rumored Pike series.
At this point I’ll be viewing the whole things as apocryphal. Excited to see where Pike and Picard are going, though.
My interest in Discovery is waned by the Picard series and even more so by the Lower Decks show. Both of which I am looking forward to more than STD S3. I’m not that interested in them in the future but to be fair, I’m just not interested in them as characters to begin with. If Discovery was the only Trek out there I would be more interested, however. But with more, seemingly better, options coming, interest in Discovery has dipped.
..so, is it going to be about star trek? Thank goodness for Picard
I think if they jump around the time line like the official series premise was written they could end up with an award winning series. For a show that’s been through the changes Discovery has, it’s amazing they finally got the recipe right. Most shows fail for this, but Star Trek got it right. I thought for sure that Gretchen Berg and her co-show-runner were going to kill the show with it’s social justice theme. I guess the writers were pretty tired of their work being edited, and/or rewritten they decided to go to Kurtzman with an ultimatum. Regardless of the hub bub, Alex managed to put together some great talent and overcome the issues that plagued the first two seasons.
I think Discovery will have it’s ‘breakout’ episode this season, skyrocketing the series popularity. I really think their on the launchpad and about to lift-off into cinematic history.
Peace And Long Life…
“kill the show with it’s social justice theme”
It’s Star Trek, it’s always been a social justice show, so frankly I have no idea what you are talking about.
Social justice is literally written into the fabric of Star Trek and has been there since day one. Take your bigotry elsewhere, please. Star Trek is about diversity and acceptance, not your bigotry.,
Except that Star Trek is – and always was – about asking questions, not about pushing the one arbitrary answer. Meanwhile, social justice movement is all about arbitrary answers (which is, by the way, one thing it has in common with fascism).
Also, it’s a matter of measure. Asafoetida spice is undoubtedly “woven into the fabric” of vindaloo dish, but that doesn’t mean you should use a metric pound of it.
“Meanwhile, social justice movement is all about arbitrary answers (which is, by the way, one thing it has in common with fascism).” That’s utter horsecrap, and either you know it is or you’re ignorant beyond belief.
Trek is for Social Justice, written by those who want Social Justice, loved by those who believe Trek has made a difference and still can
Roddenberry was the original social justice warrior. If the internet was around in 1966 when TOS debut it would’ve exploded lol. Its amazing how people pretend Star Trek wasn’t about pushing the envelope to these issues when the original show was pushing for the idea everyone will be equal to each other regardless of race, sex and nationality and live in a borderless society at the time both ideas seem almost offensive in most of the world.
I’m concerned that we haven’t seen anything about Rachael Ancheril as Commander Nhan.
She hasn’t been listed as joining the panels in San Diego or Las Vegas, although she definitely has other projects in Canada.
I would be disappointed if she turns out to have died a red shirt death in the rotisserie scene.
She was pretty useless in season 2, terrible character, not sure why anyone would want to see her back.
I initially thought that, but near the end of the season found myself inexplicably caring more about her character than I thought. I think her connection to Pike and the Enterprise is the main reason I’d like to see her continue. Having served under Pike on the Enterprise, she could be used as a connection to Pike and his leadership, perhaps sharing lessons and experiences from her time on the Enterprise.
why didn’t they end Discovery with the timejump? As in they go into the future and we the audience don’t follow them. The 33rd century is left to our imagination. Then a some point maybe wed see them again in some episode of another Trek series (like if they do a Pike series)
All any fan is bothered about now is PICARD and a return to the TNG era
I think the point is they want to carve out their own thing and define an era the way ENT, TOS and TNG was able to define theirs. We have to remember Discovery was Fuller’s idea basically. And I think after the Kelvin movies and now Discovery where both of those were set around previously created settings (but yes I know the Kelvin movies could rewrite it, to a limit) this will be the first time he can actually set the rules entirely on his own. Even Picard has some limits of what they can do. This show will have none.
Assuming you are invested in the characters at all and the possibility of finding out what happens next, it’s a pretty interesting cliffhanger. I think they are happy to take the pressure off. And as we all know — with the spore drive they could have done that anyway – but this way they wipe out the family relationship problems. Although I guess they are searching for her mom, so maybe not. Ah, who knows til next year.
How much do you want to bet this is a dystopian future with most of the federation infrastructure missing on in shambles?
Either that or the Federation is evil. Maybe we even get a combination of both.
Which would pretty much negate everything that happened before it. Once you take a jump like this you begin to wonder, “What, ultimately, was the entire point?”
Or the Federation has turned into something like the Vorlon Empire or the Q Continuum and it is staying away from galactic affairs. While the new minor races and some of the older races that didn’t join “project ascent” are left to squable as usual among the physical remains of the Old Federation.
This way you keep the dream of the federation utopia actually alive and working but clearing the field for a new cycle of strugles, exploration and everything inbetween that makes a good story.
Sounds like Andromeda. Which would be a great thing. Lets have both the Federation and the Systems Commonwealth be just footnotes in History.
If that is the case, I’m sure that the Federation will be approaching something close to its former glory by the time the series ends.
I’m calling it now…Book will be the bew captain.
Im guessing he is 31st century starfleet
That would be awesome.
Unfortunately, the upcoming Picard show has rather diminished my interest in further Discovery. The trailer for Picard oozes a confidence lacking in anything I’ve seen of Discovery.
I hope Picard sparks renewed interest in Star Trek and I also hope that interests spurs new viewership for Discovery. I also hope a Show with Capt. Pike can happen. I would love 3 treks in different eras on at the same time. but with NO CROSSOVERS or any further time travel.
Absolutely, same here. I’m planning on giving DSC season 3 a try at some point, but I’m certainly in no burning rush to do so.
To be fair we haven’t seen much of anything for Discovery next season yet. I imagine when that trailer drops and (hopefully) shows us something as interesting and exciting as Picard did people may change their mind. And to be more honest we don’t know if the Picard show will actually be good but it does look very very promising now. It seem to satisfy both camps who kind of want TNG again and the other who just want a continuation of 24th century stories.
But yes Picard is the most excited I been for Star Trek in decades. I like the Kelvin movies for what they were and Discovery is definitely growing on me, but Picard is what I been hoping to see Star Trek do for a very long time that the others simply couldn’t do.
I was more excited for Trek ’09 than I was for Discovery or Picard. But admittedly I tended to lean more in favor of TOS than TNG. Lower Decks is the most excited I have been for Trek since the KU. And if they announce a Pike show in LV, as I suspect they are going to, then THAT would be the most excited I have been for Trek since Lower Decks! Picard might be interesting but I’m not Jonesing for it.
PS.. While I do like the idea of going forward I still would prefer a show set after TUC. That is a blank slate we still know nothing about.
I was never TRULY excited when they announced the 09 film, but intrigued for sure. And while I wasn’t that excited about it, it was definitely a great idea to go in and for at least the first film, I think it did re-energize Star Trek a bit. I’m more excited about Lower Decks now. Before I really didn’t know what to make of it.
And I’ve always said it probably would’ve been a better idea if Discovery was a pre-TNG/post-TUC show since A. they have about 60 years between the movie and TNG to cover and B. they can go a bit farther with the technology and introduce other species like the Romulans and more TNG species like the Cardassians, Ferengis, etc.
I never been in love with the idea of a pre-TOS show and after first season of Discovery even less so. At least with Enterprise the idea was about the birth of the Federation even if they never got around to it lol. BUt yes Discovery did a much better job with it in second season and a lot of that was due to the inclusion of Pike himself. But if we’re being REALLY honest, nothing about the second season story line really had anything to do with the era itself. It was a lot of Section 31 stuff and Control which could’ve been done on any show or era. But yes the inclusion of Spock and Pike made a big difference and we did get the very specific TOS era episode If Memory Serves. That could’ve only been done pre-TOS.
So if a Pike show happens, I’m definitely on board but I still don’t know if its going to really satisfy a lot of people and they will still probably run into the exact same complaints like it feeling way too advanced for its period and other canon issues. But they did a much better job in second season of having the show feel like it actually take place in the TOS era, especially the look and feel of Enterprise and that may be enough for most people.
The only prequel (before I saw Mount’s Pike) I would have been on really board with would have been heading into the birth of the Federation (as Enterprise was heading to but never quite got to) or something having to do with the Romulan War. But, that would have been problematic, I think. But my favorite untapped era to explore would be post TUC. 60 years of nothing just sitting there waiting to be set free. I often wonder why that era has yet to have a serious look.
My guess with so much Star Trek in the pipeline these days, they will get to it eventually. I remember how excited so many people were when it was first rumored Discovery was actually going to be a post-TUC show. Even I got excited about it lol. My guess is though if Fuller’s anthology idea came into existence, then one of those seasons would’ve happened in that period.
But that is the beauty of Trek now, you can place the show literally anywhere. And now that Kurtzman upped the game throwing the franchise a thousand years into the future, they have literally centuries they can fill in between Picard and Discovery. Even for me I never thought we would get anything beyond maybe a 100 years post TNG for a long long time and even that idea seemed like a stretch at the time.
Interest levels for season 3: beyond zero.
Your comment tells us absolutely nothing about your level of interest. 100 is “beyond zero,” as is -100. So is 1, -1, 0.102921, -5,151,125…
So you weren’t actually trying to communicate anything after all? Glad to know I can ignore everything you ever post since you don’t actually mean to communicate. Seems pointless for you to comment, though, if you aren’t trying to communicate. Oh well. Your loss.
Great job ignoring.
I was seriously curious about what you were trying to say. For some reason you responded as a jerk, but the fact is that your initial comment is not clear. Since you took time to post it in the first place, I’d assume you’d clarify what you meant…instead of getting defensive and pathetic about it.
Why post something at all if you don’t care about being understood? Seems utterly pointless. Or, ya know, just clarify…like normal, rational people do.
My prediction is that Discovery will be canceled as soon as there’s enough new year-round content on CBS All Access. They’re keeping the show up and running now in order to save face and keep the Trek momentum going. Season three is really their last chance to get it right. Season four will be a long shot. I would love to get a love to get a look at their ratings numbers at this point.
That may be true BUT that said, thanks to the success and interest in Discovery the powers that be at CBS grabbed Kurtzman and signed him to a five-year contract to make even more Star Trek. And thanks to Kurtzman we now have a new show that will continue to tell the story of Picard, along with a whole new cast plus familiar faces from the past. If not for Disco, we would still be stuck with that abomination and disgraceful finale of Enterprise as the last Star Trek show ever made. Now we have at least five more years of shows. For that I say, thank you!
What DeanH said.
I’m also like to say that whatever my critiques, I have enjoyed watching Discovery, and it’s contributed to reigniting my own interest in the franchise. For that I also say thank you.
I just don’t understand why people are so convinced Discovery is doing so badly? No I don’t think its the huge hit CBS assumed it would be either but clearly its successful enough if they renewed it so quickly in both seasons.
But I have always said Discovery was going three seasons no matter WHAT because of the unusual situation the show was in launching AA. It was no way it was getting cancelled the first two seasons for a multiple of reasons. Now I’m not saying the show isn’t successful, we know AA has hit its subscription target and many will probably consider Discovery responsible for that because honestly what is on that site that is really bringing people? Even if the Twilight Zone is considered a hit, they hit their target numbers before that even aired.
I just think its a lot of wish fulfillment from people that Discovery is really a failure deep down and its getting cancelled any day now but there has been zero proof any of that is true. Every few months I see some youtuber suggesting the show is getting cancelled, Netflix is unhappy with it and wants to drop it, its costing too much blah blah blah but there is never a single source for ANY of this.
Now I don’t know if Discovery will go seven seasons like the other shows or anything and it could very well be cancelled in another season or two as people suggests, especially as they now have so many other Trek shows on. Its no longer the only child. But there is no proof its on its way to cancellation now either, especially as they just rebooted the entire show in a big way. To me that says the opposite.
The thing is that Netflix has a track record of killing its own original series after a season or two.
So, even if there were any truth to the rumours peddled by the usual YouTube desperate-for-clicks types, it would say absolutely nothing about the quality of Discovery.
From the business media, it looks like Netflix’s model is not sustainable now that the production industry and the holders of the rights to valuable older series are aggressively creating their own streamers.
I don’t know if it will be their last season but I do think TPTB have run out of excuses for the show’s substandard writing. From what I’ve read, the whole point of the past two seasons was to transition the show from what Bryan Fuller had in mind to what the current show runners wanted. They’ve said on numerous occasions that flinging the show into the 33rd century would free them from canon, that they would not have to worry about tripping over established history, and so on and they are now free to tell the stories they want. All that said it’s time for them to put their money where their mouth is. Let’s see if they can come up with something a little more coherent and that can adhere to its own story beats.
Yeah some of the episodes have been very good while others have not exactly been well written. Let’s hope S3 is better now that the writers have been freed up from some of the canon restrictions.
Which is exactly why others like me are more excited about the show, because now they can literally do whatever they want. They can set the universe any way they want and that must be both exciting and liberating as a writer. Why I don’t think they have any intention of going back to the 23rd century. They now have a chance to create whatever they want, include whoever they want and set their own parameters. Why would anyone do all of that just to return to an era they themselves admitted is already limiting for them and causes canon issues.
They want to be free from canon. That’s also why I don’t think they are as excited about making a Pike show as the fans are because end of the day they are the ones who have to make it and figure out how to make it exciting even when they already know the fate of their captain and others. And of course have to deal with the ire of fans the second the show doesn’t come out like it did in all their heads. At least with Picard they are free to do whatever they want even if they are using established characters and settings.
I think writing for a prequel is a more difficult task because you have so many things that must be adhered to. One could come up with a great idea only to be told that you can’t do that because some future episode said “x”. That is not to say it cannot be done. And I think with the right people running things a Pike show can indeed work.
Although I do have one reservation about a Pike show. It is possible that the reason the audience latched on to Mount’s Pike so strongly was because for some 14 episodes before that they really had no character to latch on to. So here comes Pike, and everyone’s eyes light up! I hope that is not the case, however.
PS… I feel like in fairness it’s not like shows set post Nemesis are free of canon issues. It very well may be that writers get told, you can’t do that because in 1994 an episode did “x”. But yes, they are more free technologically. So the production design issues that plagued Discovery are absolutely NOT an issue for the Picard show. They can change things up big time and it would still work.
Definitely agree! Prequels are REALLY hard to do because it limits so much. Movie prequels are not a big deal if you’re telling a stand alone two hour story. But when you’re doing a full on TV show and one that is so steeped in mythology and canon like Star Trek has become in the last 30 years it just makes it harder. Thats also why I think they want to do the Section 31 show because while its a ‘prequel’ (assuming it actually takes place where Discovery was and we still don’t know if it does) its premise allows it to basically ignore a lot of canon elements when they can just be secretly in the know that people like Kirk never was, ie, a cheat. It can still take place in a less primitive and smaller era but given the freedom to build basically any tech they want (as they proved in Discovery and the Kelvin movies) and meet any species they want, its all just ‘classified’.
And that was the problem for me with Discovery. Any time they did something that CLEARLY violated canon like discovering the MU before Kirk or having a spore drive, it was just marked as ‘classified’ which kind of defeats the purpose of a prequel to me if everything you do has to be marked as a secret. It tells you the writers can’t really write under the rules of a proper prequel if they are already contradicting things first season into the journey and have to make excuses for it. What’s the point? And ironically they have now classified their main star, Burnham, as a secret too which is utterly hilarious but really speaks to the problem they have.
As far as Picard, yes you’re right. I should’ve said ‘mostly’ free of canon but not completely of course. I mean if they kill off someone like Data then they are still dead regardless. The beauty of Star Trek though is they can undo a lot of things or simply retcon whatever they want, which they do in both prequels and sequels. But its easier (and more accepted) to do in a sequel obviously. Its easier to bring someone back from dead as opposed to bringing someone in who hasn’t even born yet outside of time travel.
That that is the problem with doing a prequel and then introducing an element that, while not addressed in the original, could not possibly exist because it would have future repercussions that were never mentioned in the original. So they introduce a spore drive that the audience KNOWS can never work. At least not to the point where 10 years later they could be installed in all of the Star Fleet. To me, just “classifying” everything questionable is laziness on a monumental scale. A Pike set era Section 31 show will have the exact same issues. Yes, they established that S31 has their own super advanced tech. But that concept is laughable and takes the viewer who is familiar with Star Trek completely out of the story. For example, if tap your chest communicators was workable to the point where S31 was using them there is no reason they could not be implemented as standard issue among Star Fleet crew members. None. So that concept was ludicrous. If a potential Section 31 show is doing stuff like that then it may as well be a non-canonical comedy. Because it would be impossible to take it seriously. It will already be difficult enough if evil-Georgeau is leading it.
I don’t disagree but that’s probably why people who want a Pike show and expect it to suddenly be like TOS will be just as disappointed as all the people who expected DIS to be that way too. I just don’t think the writers can or WANT to write a more primitive type show even if the show still takes place centuries ahead of us. I mean look at the finale, the Enterprise suddenly had hundreds of advanced automated fighter drones lol. It made no sense on its head and its NO WAY you’re suppose to believe they had anything like that in Kirk’s time.
But trust me, if its a Pike or Section 31 show, you’re going to get more of the same stuff like that on either one, its plainly obvious. The difference with Section 31 they can at least make excuses with it even if making a wormhole creating time travel suit still feels pretty ludicrous on its head. But even without Section 31 around, it would’ve still been there anyway just like the spore drive was.
Again, maybe all most people want with the Pike show is just those characters and being back on an updated but fairly accurate looking TOS Enterprise again. But its still going to feel as shiny and advanced as Discovery did, that I guarantee.
I think these guys probably feel at home writing for shows like Picard and having Discovery in the 32nd century and not an era where things are just suppose to feel more limited.
If the same people who wrote Discovery end up writing for Pike, then I would fully expect more of the same. So my hope would be to have a majority of the writer’s room be people who were not involved in Discovery. They can get outside people to say “yes” and “no” to ideas that are too far fetched for pre-Kirk era. I cannot speak for others but if for the most part they stick to the history and don’t stray too far to the ludicrous (*cough* Iron Man-ish Time suits *cough*) then the show could really take off. We shall have to wait and see what transpires.
I’m baffled by the show runners saying that they’re sticking with the “lighter tone” of season 2. The second half of the season is practically Star Trek meets The Terminator. The only thing that keeps the show from getting even darker is Pike and a few placed Tilly being Tilly or Tig Notaro moments. I will be perfectly happy if they don’t run into Sulu’s descendants or Data/B4 or that we don’t even see a ship called “Enterprise”. I really want this show to stop feeling like it has to be a slave to iconography. Tell good stories. Build the characters. Maybe give us moral dilemmas as opposed to disappointing mysteries.
I have to agree with Tiger2. The best thing they could have done with Discovery was to take her to a place where they have truly never gone before. Even beyond the time of Daniels in Enterprise. Kudos to Alex Kurtzman on creating a Star Trek universe where you have distinctly different shows, in different timelines each with broad appeal to fans like myself but also addressing those elements of the fanbase who didn’t necessarily like Discovery. You have to move forward to grow the franchise but do so without forgetting the past. I think CBS MAY have actually achieved this, but let see how things look in about 12 months from now.
And I know Kurtzman gets a lot of flack here, some of it justified, but what we are starting to see under his leadership is that he has a grand vision for Star Trek and he DOES want to push the franchise forward. I was really afraid after both the Kelvin movies and then Discovery we were going to be locked in this same limited period of Trek forever, just different variations of it. I mean one of the rumored shows was a possible Khan redux (ugh) but I’m happy to see they are serious about expanding the franchise while making the shows feel distinct from each other. Seeing that Picard trailer has lifted my spirits about Trek’s future. And yes its just nice that all the shows next year are finally moving forward again minus some of the Short Treks but still cool because we are getting more Pike and the Enterprise which people clearly want to see, even non-fans of prequels like me.
But so many shows in so many different eras is really cool. Hopefully we will get a Pike show to bring back the 23rd century full time again and be the true prequel to TOS where Discovery failed at.
Will Burnham be more likeable and will Tilly be less annoying?
That is actually a VERY good question. If I were a betting man I would say… Probably not.
Imagine a state of the art ship from 900 years ago suddenly appearing at Navel Base Norfolk. Today, the ship wouldn’t be of any interest except to historians, its arrival would be of intense interest. However, 900 years forward in Trek’s future, where time travel is normal, it’s not even likely their appearance would raise any eyebrows. Creatively, taking the show 900 years into the future maybe more of a challenge then anticipated. Time will tell…..
I fundamentally disagree that Star Trek always has to be about optimism and a brighter future. And I think the producers don’t believe that either and are just giving some nice lip service to attempt to shut some people up.
Of course not, if that was the case we wouldn’t be getting a Section 31 show starring the Hitler of the MU. ;)
This quote is nonsense, the entire crew wasn’t even in most of the original series episodes. That’s more a TNG era thing. “The thing the original Star Trek did so beautifully is focus on the family. I think the family of this crew, of Starfleet and the Federation, this season gives us the opportunity to hone in on that even more.”
Loved this quote from the new guy:
“What’s exciting about season 3 is how we see the advancement of technology!”
OMG, BRING IT!!!!! I’m all for any crazy, super advanced weird nutiness they can think of. The more magical the better in my opinion! And we all watched Discovery first two seasons so it won’t be too far off that I’m guessing ;D. (I’m ‘joking’ but remember when we thought the Red Angel suit came from the future because of all the zany things it did just to find out it was really decades old? Yeah…).
In all seriousness though, I think this is why we are going so far ahead in the future, they want to really play in this galaxy and do things the original setting of the show never dared allowed them to do. I can’t believe how I’m excited I am for Star Trek again!