Shazad Latif On Section 31 Star Trek Show: “We’ll Know More In A Year”

One of the Star Trek shows in development we haven’t been hearing much about is the previously announced spin-off of Star Trek: Discovery focusing on the clandestine group Section 31. Michelle Yeoh has been tapped to lead the series, playing the Mirror Georgiou was recruited into Section 31 and acted as an agent throughout season two of Discovery. Presumably, the cast would also include Shazad Latif’s Ash Tyler who was last seen in the Discovery season two finale being put in charge of Section 31 back in the 23rd century.

The Section 31 show was not part of the big CBS push at the San Diego Comic-Con Star Trek Universe panel. Now, Shazad Latif provides more clarity as to why.

Section 31 in 2021?

Shazad Latif (Ash Tyler/Voq) spoke with our friends the Trekkie Girls at London Film and Comic Con last weekend. While he did not reveal a whole lot, he gave us some idea on a timeline for the would-be Section 31 show:

The head of the CBS said it was about 2 years down the line, so we’re maybe a year and a half away but it all depends on the people. Michelle [Yeoh] is very busy, it depends on her being free, me being free. It depends if I fit into the timeline. There’s loads of things that we don’t know and they have to write it. We’ll know more in a year.

This generally fits with the information CBS executives and producers have shared about the potential production timeline for the Section 31 show, which has yet to have an official series order announced. Earlier this month we reported executive producer Heather Kadin confirming how Michelle Yeoh will be part of the third season of Star Trek: Discovery (currently in production), adding “The [Section 31] spin-off wouldn’t happen until after that.”

At San Diego Comic-Con, the Star Trek Universe panel focused on the shows currently in production: Star Trek: Picard, Star Trek: Discovery (Season 3), Star Trek: Short Treks (season 2), and Star Trek: Lower Decks. It looks like Section 31 – if it moves forward – would follow those projects.

Shazad Latif’s Ash Tyler being given control of Section 31 in the Discovery season two finale

Don’t expect Ash Tyler in Short Treks

At SDCC it was revealed that there would be three Star Trek: Short Treks set in the 23rd century focused on Captain Pike’s USS Enterprise. When asked by The Trekkie Girls if we can look forward to seeing him in Short Treks, Latif demured, but generally indicated he would not be:

I don’t know, I haven’t heard anything. I think I did so much it would be a bit cheeky to get more, I’ve been on screen so much that it would be a bit rude of me!

Listen to the audio of the Trekkie Girls interview below:

Follow along with all the Discovery news at TrekMovie.

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Arathorn

Does anyone actually want to watch this show? No offense to the actors and production crew involved – but I can’t imagine the premise is interesting to anyone. I could be wrong. But this seems like a concept totally unmotivated by fan-base interest levels.

PEB

Yes, they do. I mean, I totally get it if you don’t have interest in it. But I’m all for a Section 31 show if the stories are interesting. It opens up a lot of doors you could go through and gives you another perspective of the Star Trek universe. For so long we’ve really only seen it through the eyes of someone serving in Starfleet who still has the gleam of Federation ideals in their eyes, but let’s be honest, there’s so much more out there than that. I’m totally for this expansion.

TG47

I’ve heard some very enthusiastic fans talk at cons about how much they are looking forward to this show.

Certainly, it will appeal to a different market niche, but I’m much less concerned about it being poorly aligned with the franchise’s brand since I’ve heard early musings from the creators.

There’s room for the show in the calendar and it’s certainly not either/or in terms of a Pike’s Enterprise series.

It’s very tiresome that some posters here on TrekMovie just insist on trying to make this a sibling rivalry.

Arathorn

I don’t know if your last line is in reference to me, but I was in no way taking a partisan approach between different Trek iterations. I just find the Section 31 premise to be void of any large support/interest in the fan base. My question was simply an attempt to gauge the validity of my suspicions. I’m totally open to other opinions.

TG47

Not specifically you Arathorn, but scroll down a bit and you’ll see what I’m getting at.

I agree that I was dubious, but there does seem to be a definite market niche, even if it’s not strongly represented on this board.

Boze

Star Trek as such is already niche, so technically, it’s a market niche in a niche.
I’m just not sure that it is wise to make a show that caters to a small subgroup of trekkies, instead of catering to trekkies as a whole. If it’s called “Star Trek”, it is supposed to be for *all* Trek fans. In a fandom as small as ours, what sense does it make to have separate shows for separate niches (which may or may not exist)?

Arathorn

Fair enough

Wehmut

“… let’s be honest, there’s so much more out there than that.”

No. There is not. The other stuff is just Not-Star-Trek. There are enough sci-fi shows expecting the worst from everything.

Neill Stringer

If the show can get Section 31 correct then I would be interested, however, given my feelings on DSC I am not even sure I can stomach it’s third season, unless next year has better writing.

VZX

Not me! I highly doubt I will watch this show. I do think it is good to do different takes on Star Trek, but not like this. DS9 was a great example of how to change the Trek formula a bit but still make the show optimistic and examine the best qualities of humanity.

I would rather a show about Surak or Kahless or a Starfleet repair base than this.

snoopy

I would rather see a Capt.Pike and Mr.Spock and number 1 show on the USS Enterprise.

VZX

You and I and millions more. I don’t have proof, I just don’t want this pointless Sec 31 show! I would rather the Pike show!

Afterburn

I do. Sounds cool. I have been telling people they should do a section 31 show for almost 2 decades. Great idea. I like the idea of 4-5 different Trek shows, with 2 running each year, each with a different tone, concept, and audience:

-Picard (90s audience, post Nemesis setting, more drama than action)
-Discovery (far future setting– anything goes– all new cast for new fans, space action)
-Section 31 (dark drama, spy action, I assume a prequel setting?)
-1701 Enterprise Series (prequel setting, appeals to TOS fans, mass appeal with Spock and Enterprise, focus on space exploration and more episodic than long-season arcs)
-Animated Adventure on Nickelodeon (for Kids!)
-1701-F Enterprise Show (spinoff from Picard, post nemesis, all-new crew, ongoing episodic thought provoking sci-fi stories ala TNG).

Something for everyone, whether you want action, drama, sci-fi, classic characters, future or prequel setting.

Trek in a Cafe

I love Pike, but there is literally no reason why “explore strange new worlds” cannot be any time period. It’s just expensive perhaps not even creative if they don’t stay there very long. A TOS era constitution ship in a single planet/solar system would be great. Imagine a TOS ship meeting the world of The Expanse.

Afterburn

I’m not disagreeing, but that’s the show I think they’ll use it for, and I think it’s entirely appropriate.

Locutus

I agree with you. If they had a new trek product every week with varying tones, I would subscribe to CBSAA year round. If they have Discovery, Picard, Lower Decks, and Section 31 run consecutively during the year at 13 episodes each, that’s 52 weeks worth of Star Trek year round!

Jonathan

I would like to see DS9 20years pater show incl. Section 31 (with Dr. Bashir) and I would like to see U.S.S. Relativity time period series incl. stories like VOY Year of Help timetravel shop.

Amit Agarwal

No. Please scrap this show and give us a a Captain Pike show.

Afterburn

It’s not a competition. They’re very likely going to do both. This kind of “Them or Us” mentality is exactly what’s poisoning the fandom right now.

Boze

The “Them or Us” mentality wouldn’t even exist if we had a proper, full-season episodic Star Trek show that’s made for everybody. If the fandom is divided, it’s because CBS is deliberately dividing it by making shows that don’t appeal to ALL Trek fans.

If I wanted to be paranoid, I’d even say they’re doing it on purpose. But really, I don’t care enough for Kurtztrek to be paranoid about it.

FrostUK

I’d watch the show if it was like Wasp by Eric Frank Russell or if it was learning more towards the Section 31 we knew from DS9.

Ryan Spinney

As understand it, it’s supposed to explain how the version of section 31 seen in Discovery and Enterprise became the Section 31 of DS9.

Soren

They’re going for the Killing Eve audience. You’re right, existing Trekkies haven’t been given a second’s thought.

Afterburn

Really, you don’t think the upcoming Picard series and the “nearly all but announced” Pike series aren’t specifically designed to appeal to existing Trekkies?

I want to. Count me as one.

DeanH

Just a small sample size but it surprisingly appears that there is just as much interest in a Section 31 show as non-interest. I think that reflects the scope of the Trek Universe fandom – something that Kurtzman seems to have grasped onto. Yes you can take Star Trek far into the future or look at Section 31 and other elements of the Federation and Starfleet with new serialized stories BUT don’t forget to appeal to other elements of the fandom as well – those who still want to see the Star Trek that they remember. The current lineup seems to be addressing this entire audience and that is great to see. Personally I hope they find a way to bring Shazad’s character back but until then, at least we get to see Michelle Yeoh back in Disco S3. It will be great to see how this all plays out over the next few years.

TechNoir

I would be interested in a series about Star Trek spies and intelligence officers, but not those under Section 31. A little too mustache-twirling for my liking.

Unless S31 was something the normal spies were occasionally fighting against. That might be good.

ML31

The mustache twirling is something specific to Discovery. Not just section 31 but the MU as well. I don’t think a Section 31 show about Federation Spies and such is a bad idea… It just depends on presentation. If it is done they way they showed Section 31 in season 2 Discovery… Then that would be awful. If it were done in tone and style of, “The Americans” let’s say… Then it has the potential to be great. I think a Trek spy show needs to be more grounded to work. Giving that organization hyper futuristic tech and their own fleet of advanced star ships just doesn’t work.

TechNoir

Agreed.

A34

We want this show. I can’t wait to see it.

Gary 8.5

Sure, why not?

Steve

The cast of Discovery is unlikeable enough as it is, now they want to give a show to one of the worst culprits?

Georgiou’s Sass

I think the cast of Discovery is infinitely likeable. Sonequa is a wonderful ambassador for the series, so generous with her time and so devoted to her cast mates. You can really tell they’ve bonded as a family.

Unless of course you mean the characters within Discovery? Who- in my humble opinion- are also infinitely likeable, just deeply flawed. As we all are.

Well said! I agree 100%.

Locutus

Agreed.

Afterburn

Agreed!

Boze

Sonequa may be awesome person, but Michael Burnham is the worst kind of pampered, nepotised know-it-all brat I’ve ever seen since the times of Wesley Crusher.

As for other characters… well, we barely know them. After two whole seasons, we still don’t know their motivations, we don’t know what makes them tick. They are so hollow that one might confuse them with the Pod People from The Invasion of The Body Snatchers. The show could’ve been just as well named “Michael Burnham And Her Nameless Redshirts”.

Binyamin

especially Saru, Tilly and Stamets, right? We don’t know nuthin about them. smh.

ML31

There are other characters that have been fleshed out a bit. I think Boze was mostly referring to the bridge crew. Whose names I honestly don’t even recall. But Boze is right about Burnham. That character is certainly lacking in interest. Like nearly every Character on Discovery.

mysticaldigital

Lt. Nilson (don’t think we’ve heard he first name yet, could be wrong), Ronald Altman Bryce, Gen Rhys, Kayla Detmer, Joann Owosekun. Just from memory, it;s not hard, we know about this bridge crew after 20 episodes than any other regular extras in other series after 20 episodes (Well, save for Bryce and Nilson, Bryce is criminally under used, Nilson is too new).

ML31

Those names do ring bells but none were featured to any extent. At least not to the point where their names are easily remembered. Especially for someone who did not think anyone was all that interesting. How many boring people’s names to you recall? Most people don’t bother even trying to remember the name over someone they meet on rare occasions. Even more so if they didn’t think anything of those people to begin with.

Afterburn

So… just like Sulu, Chekov, and Uhura?

I like them….

Visitor1982

No Section31 please. I would be more happy with Star Trek – Pike and StarFleet Academy.

Locutus

I cannot imagine a Starfleet Academy series going that well, although I’d give it a shot. It might appeal to a teenage audience, I suppose.

ML31

Again, like everything, I think it would depend on the presentation. If they can make the audience care about the people involved, it can certainly work. If it is something like Star Fleet meets Riverdale… (facepalm)

Old Trekker

Well, since the supposed main cast of this alleged Section 31 series is now off 1000 years into the future, is there even any need for a Section 31? Or do some of the crew plan on taking the next wormhole back to the 23rd Century at the end of the 3rd season of Disco?

Personally, with the lack of buzz on this show i’m thinking its DOA. I’m thinking that Pike Trek may push it to the side.

Locutus

I have to agree that putting Georgoui in the 33rd century paints them into a corner for Section 31. I suppose Section 31 could still be around, but I doubt they would have much interest in Georgoui.

Afterburn

It’s science fiction. It no more paints them into a corner than setting DSC as a prequel did. When whiney fanboys caused a stinky, they threw the ship a thousand years into the future. If they want Georgiou back they can have her find the Guardian of Forever, or even find a way to resurrect the Prime version in the prequel time period.

TG47

I have a lot of faith in the two writers that have been chosen to develop the pilot and break story for the first season.

Yeon and Lippoldt wrote some solid episodes in the midst of the writers room problems of Discovery’s season 2.

It sounds like they were obliged to stay with Discovery until the story arcs for S3 were broken.

They probably need time and space to give full attention to the new project, and then Kurtzman, CBS and the talent can make their decisions.

ML31

I realize this show is a ways out. But it is sounding like there is a puncher’s chance the show will never see the light of day. Which wouldn’t bother me in the slightest. If they were to have a Section 31 show it feels it would be best to place it in the TNG era. And have all new and original characters. And certainly no genocidal maniacs from an alternate universe ought to be involved.

Picard’s Patty

Absolutely no interest in the concept of this show! We want a Pike show!

mysticaldigital

You started off strong with a personal opinion, then you ascribed your view onto me. I would not mind a Section 31 show and if we get a Pike show I want it to be serialized (which most people do not it seems).

Jay

Would love this show to give us the opportunity to have a plot that could combine all Star Trek shows. If Section 31 is linked to DTI (Federation Department of Temporal Investigations) would be a great opportunity to make a time travel show, would be interesting to see all different time periods.

This show could give an opportunity to all the Star Trek Characters and Producers, to revisit previous events, from a different perspective. Like the DS9 Tribble episode. Scott Bakula with Quantum Leap was a great concept. With fifty years of Star Trek history, possibilities are endless.

Great opportunity to write stories for other actors such as Obrien and Bashir, Odo and Quark, Geordi and Guinan, Wesley and the Time Traveler, Hoshi and Phlox, T’Pol and Reed (Since Tucker is gone), Chekov and Sulu…just to name a few. These actors would love to reprise their characters, if a good script is in place.

ML31

Star Trek: Legends of Tomorrow!

Captain Danno

Jay, I’ve been thinking along these same lines! I would really like this concept. In addition to the story ideas you mention above, I think there was enough tinkering with the timeline between Enterprise (Temporal Cold War and USS Defiant going back to the Mirror Universe) and Discovery (Burnham’s Mom tinkering with the past as the Red Angel) that a show like this might help explain some of the canon and visual continuity inconsistencies between Discovery and previous Trek shows. And, if CBS and Paramount re-merge, then it could also be a vehicle to bring the Kelvin and Prime universes back together…

alphantrion

This actually sounds a bit like that Star Trek anthology idea that Bryan Fuller had before developing the current concept of Discovery.

Jay

Indeed. There were almost a whole season in the Mirror Universe. Maybe the idea was to send Discovery to a different time period in each season. Which is actually happening.

I think will be a difficult task for budget reasons. They will have to rebuild previous ships, uniforms, bridge, etc. Recreate each time period.

For the Tribbles DS9 episode they put a lot of effort and details to make that episode look exactly as TOS.

Like I said, something like Quantum Leap or Back to the Future, with previous characters and relationships, revisiting certain events and creating new plots, will be a smash hit!

Jai

“If Section 31 is linked to DTI (Federation Department of Temporal Investigations) would be a great opportunity to make a time travel show, would be interesting to see all different time periods. “

Good point. I’ve suggested this before: Depicting Section 31 as having time-travel capabilities would be a straightforward way to explain why there were actually no Eugenics Wars in the 90s. Just mention that Section 31 tampered with history, Khan and the other genetically-augmented tyrants were born decades later as a result, and the Eugenics Wars were merged with World War Three. The rest of canonical world history as described in Star Trek then played out as before. Easy.

If the show was going to be particularly brave, it could even hint (or depict on-screen) that Section 31 covertly played a part in deliberately escalating geopolitical conflict during the past 20 years, including certain events today. As far as Section 31 would be concerned, a peaceful united Earth and the future Federation can’t exist unless World War Three happens first. So S31 has a self-serving (but, in their own minds, ultimately morally justified) reason to fan the flames.

Vulcan Soul

“If the show was going to be particularly brave, it could even hint (or depict on-screen) that Section 31 covertly played a part in deliberately escalating geopolitical conflict during the past 20 years, including certain events today.”

The Martians, sorry, the Russians aren’t enough anymore to explain 45? ;)

Gary

What you’ve described is essentially the phone game Star Trek Timelines.

alphantrion

I wonder if they are keeping this show and want to have it as a continuation after Discovery is finished. I can’t see Discovery going past 5 seasons and if this show is indeed two years out, then it makes me wonder if they will put this show out instead of Discovery after the 5th season.

ML31

That is a definite possibility. I actually don’t see Discovery lasting beyond 4 “seasons”, myself. And there is a change season 3 may be it, too. That said I think they may be fast tracking a Pike show and it might have priority over the Section 31 show at the moment. Just spitballing here, but I think there is a chance a Pike show will be officially announced this weekend.

alphantrion

I am still thinking that the producers will be vary of announcing the Pike show anytime soon because of the fact that thematically it will be a return to a format already done relatively successful before and they wouldn’t want to get backlash for going back to a more traditional “male captain” led show like TOS and TNG were. It would be good to have a Captain Pike show, but I am not as certain about this as others around the fandom or Star Trek community.

ML31

If THAT is the reason behind a reluctance to do a Pike show then Kurtzman & Co should be fired on the spot. Productions shouldn’t let that kind of idiocy rule how they make their shows.

Tiger2

Well I disagree I don’t think they would have an issue with the ‘male captain’ part, especially since Discovery first two captains were both males, including Pike himself obviously. And the Picard show the new crew he’s with also has a male captain (and ex-Starfleet) leading the ship.

But yes I do agree Kurtzman made it clear he didn’t want all the shows just be traditional ship based shows and why I was ORIGINALLY skeptical we would get a Pike show since Discovery was already doing that and they would be taking place at the same time.

BUT now that that’s no longer the case and Discovery is at least in a different time period, then that gives a Pike show to have the 23rd century mostly on its own along with the Section 31 show. So there are probably enough differences to have two ship based shows on now. And assuming Discovery will even be on by this time which it could very well be cancelled by then as a Pike show could still be 2-3 years away if all the shows including Section 31 happens.

ML31

Not exactly sure what you are disagreeing with. I was saying that if alphantrion’s reason (fearing backlash from a show with a white male lead) was the actual reason for not doing a Pike show… As opposed to actors not being available, not being prepared, ect… Then Kurtzman should be fired. Is that what you were disagreeing with?

Tiger2

LOL it should’ve been I disagree ‘too’, ie, I actually agree with you. Should’ve read closer.

Vulcan Soul

“thematically it will be a return to a format already “done relatively successful before and they wouldn’t want to get backlash for going back to a more traditional “male captain” led show like TOS and TNG were”

The fact is that among the FIVE or so shows announced or in production, there presumably is not a SINGLE one representing the “traditional” format of TOS and TNG, that is, EPISODIC Trek! And from the persistent popularity of Voyager episodic shows in all time best Trek surveys we can gauge there is a huge segment of Trek fans, certainly not much present at boards like this (including the more casual fans, maybe a “silent majority” even!) who would like to see a more episodic show again, possibly with a serialized backbone, but more in the Enterprise season 3/4 way. The huge interest and success of The Orville is also proof of that!

So this is where the Pike show fits in, and it is by no means replicating the format of any of the other shows. The great irony is that (even in Picard) none of the traditional Trek story telling has any current shows in the lineup.

ML31

It would be nice to see episodic Trek again. I think Enterprise season 3 walked the line between stand alones and season long story pretty well. But they had more episodes in a season to do it. With a mere 10-14 episodes, it is very hard to maintain both. Perhaps end the season with a three episode arc is as best they can do.

It seems to me that a Pike show could fill this void. Especially if the goal is to have different genres of Trek out there. Pike can be the traditional ‘strange new worlds’ kind of Trek.

alphantrion

The only thing that makes me hopeful for a Pike show is the fact that they have built a Enterprise bridge set. I mean I don’t think they would have gone to that much trouble if they weren’t gonna use that set in some way.

Jay

I Pike show is coming later. But also Section 31. They have also built the Section 31 ship…I think the 31 is because it was created in the 31st century. Georgiou will spend some time with Discovery, then will return to the past….and pick up Tyler. I think that was the original intention since he was onboard from the very beginning.

Not sure how. According to Craft, Short Trek Calypso, there is no Federation in the 31st century. Temporal Agent Daniel (ST Enterprise) is also from the 31st century. Hope he also join this team.

Legate Damar

Craft was from a thousand years after Discovery was abandoned. Now that Discovery is in the future, that would put him in at least the 43rd century.

Locutus

Agreed. Hopefully, the writers don’t forget that.

TG47

Unless the Discovery gets taken back 1000 years by Georgiou and the parked in the nebula? Badlands?

Or, it there a possibility that the Discovery is somehow pulled into mitigating the bad effects of the Temporal War of the 28th century.

Mama Burnham hasn’t been shy about trying to fix and rewrite history.

Could it be that the Discovery will try to put a fallen Federation to rights, not in the Andromeda way of heroically leading a return to values (which seems to be Picard’s arc), but rather by traveling back and forth through timelines to put things right.

And in that context, I could see Georgiou supporting Burnham by returning to an earlier time and working with S31 to protect the Federation’s future.

Michael K

I think they might be pursuing the Pike series instead of Section 31. If they can lock that down, I suspect they won’t pursue the Section 31 series. I’m definitely interested in exploring more of that Section 31 universe and timeline, but I have no doubt Pike would be a more compelling show for most people. I think a sinister Section 31 series would be a hard sell to Star Trek fans, but I would be into it since the format breakers (like DS9) have always been my favorite. I don’t really understand why Star Trek fans just want the same formula over and over again.

Locutus

Yeah, shake it up a little.

Vulcan Soul

“I don’t really understand why Star Trek fans just want the same formula over and over again.”

Because the so-called “format break” of Dystopian, grimdark Trek is being done by every single scifi show (save for TNG-copycat “The Orville”) and has in some way been flirted with by all recent Trek shows going back to DS9 season 4 in 1995? It’s the so-called “formula” Trek that represents the exception to the rule and minority of scifi, not the other way round.

Andy Millman

Nah- I would much rather watch a Pike Show than a S31 show. They’re a fun foil but I don’t need to see Borg the series or Klingons the series either.

Afterburn

I think we’ll get both so worry not. You may not need or want it, but we’ll get it, and more. It won’t stop them from green-lighting other shows you DO want so why not? Something for everyone.

Tiger2

I was one of the few people who was actually on board with having a Section 31 show. Not completely enthused about it but didn’t have a problem with it being a show, it just wouldn’t have been my first choice either.

But ironically after seeing how Section 31 was portrayed in season 2 of Discovery has made me LESS interested in having a show now, not more. Obviously we know Section 31 had such a big footprint on Discovery was to get people use to the idea and up to speed of how the organization functioned for when their own show came around. But I think that backfired immensely. Pike and Spock seem to be the runaway hit in the season while Section 31 mostly put a bad taste in a lot of people’s mouths. I’m NOT saying everybody of course so you don’t have to type, but clearly people were very divided on their portrayal and they took it too far with a lot of it IMO, especially when it came to Control which I was originally excited to see when I first heard what it was and want more A.I. concepts in Star Trek. But sadly it just went the way of the tired Terminator plot line.

And having MU Georgiou as part of them didn’t make me anymore infatuated with her either and she is suppose to be the star of the show and by all accounts the only reason why we’re even getting a Section 31 show. I much rather had Leland back instead of her. He was much more interesting IMO.

Maybe my mind will change once we get a more in-depth look of what the show is about but with all the shows coming out from Picard to Lower Decks, this is the ONLY one that seems to breath more negativity than anything any time its talked about. That’s not a great sign.

Hopefully it will be mentioned at the convention this week but not expecting a lot.

ML31

I really think they dreamed this concept up as season 1 of Discovery was closing. They decided they wanted to keep the biggest name in the cast around but they already killed her off. They were stuck with this cartoony evil dictator. What to do? The best idea they came up with was shove her into Section 31 because they are a sneaky organization too! And thus a show concept was born where they get to keep a somewhat notable actor around. Now I’m no fan of Section 31 but I know there are people who are intrigued by it. And I’m forced to admit it does have potential if done right. But not only is this cartoon mass murder not a good fit for the show but, as you said, what they did with Section 31 on Discovery S2 really doesn’t bode well for what their concept could possibly be. And yeah, had Leland not been turned into a T-2000 he had potential to be a decent lead for the show.

As it stands, the way I see it, a Section 31 show is still viable but they need to move the setting to the TNG days. And they need an entirely new cast of new characters. And try to resist crossovers for as long as they possibly can.

Tiger2

I agree with most of this. I do think they probably were thinking of a Section 31 angle earlier since it was rumored before the show even started it was going to have a Section 31 subplot and we know the black badges we saw in episode 3 in first season were in fact for Section 31; so they were in the show much earlier, but idea to add Georgiou probably did come much later. And yes I don’t think anyone was thinking of a full blown spin off until they wanted to keep using Yeoh and then gave them a huge role in season 2, but it was too big. I mean when you think about it, there is NO season 2 without Section 31 involved at all since both the hero and villain ended up being their creations.

And thats the thing I LOVE Section 31, but how they were done on DS9 and later Enterprise. How they did it on Discovery just felt over the top in everything, from their operations to the technology. I mean I’m trying to wrap my head around how big are they going to go on the show when in season 2 of Discovery they had one of their A.I. killer bot already wipe out all life centuries into the future. I liked it better when they did the scheming but still a bit more grounded.

I would like to see the show return to the 24th century too so it could be more underground again. But my guess is they want to have a way to bring in Starfleet to work side by side with and so it can feel more ‘Star Trek’ so I still see them being more known on the show unfortunately.

ML31

I forgot about the black badge in the beginning. So yeah… Them thinking of S31 from the start seems reasonable. And good lord… Don’t get me started on their super future tech and that they seem to have their own FLEET of starships! That’s just crazy. And part of the reason I have bad feelings towards the potential show.

Vulcan Soul

ML31, with Space Hitler having all the 31st century super-duper-tech she has gleaned in Discovery season 3 to add to 23rd century Section 31, this problem will ONLY get worse ;)

Jay

They will have to explain the technology behind the squid sent to destroy the shluttle carrying Pike and Tyler.

Jai

”they seem to have their own FLEET of starships! That’s just crazy.”

In fairness, the CIA does have its own fleet of aircraft too. This has been the case for more than 50 years. So that part, at least, was not necessarily unrealistic. What *was* unrealistic was the depiction of Section 31 being so open about it all.

ML31

OK. There is the Air Branch of the CIA’s Special Activities Division. What Section 31 had felt like it went above and beyond that but point taken. Isn’t there already a Federation Intelligence division, though? An agency that would actually be, you know, accountable and have to beg for a budget and such? Section 31 seems to be accountable to no one and have an unlimited budget.

Jai

”Maybe my mind will change once we get a more in-depth look of what the show is about”

Tiger2, something that is worrying is that Michelle Yeoh has repeatedly described the show as “fun”, along with (I think) the showrunners/writers’ public statements about the show being inspired by the Mission Impossible films.

Given the subject matter, a Section 31 show should really be much more serious and far darker. Basically a combination of the Bourne movies and DS9’s “In the Pale Moonlight”, but obviously on a much bigger scale.

Or, to put it another way: Remember the brief music during the opening titles of the most recent Bourne film? A Section 31 show should have that kind of vibe. Epic. Ominous. Foreboding. Hints of Very Dark Deeds. “That sort of thing”, as Garak would say ;)

Unfortunately it looks like they’re planning to take the show in an entirely different direction. But like you said, we’ll only know for sure after a lot more details are released.

ML31

Comparing the show to the MI movies does not sound positive to me. I agree Jai. A Section 31 show would work best as dark and teetering on the moral line, crossing it just enough to make the audience question but not so much that the audience is outright against what they are doing. My gut is telling me that the Discovery people are incapable of such a task. But as with all of this, we shall see for sure when the final product shows up. My guess is it will be very much like the over-the-top garbage we saw from Section 31 in S2 of Discovery.

Chancellor Gowron

I just hope that L’Rell is in this show. She was an awesome character, and it seems unlikely that she’ll be in Discovery again.

TG47

I’m hoping we’ll see more of her from time to time in Pike’s Enterprise.

After all, that show would inherit the backdrop of the period Discovery has left.

It also provides the opportunity to cross paths with Tyler, not to mention Harry Mudd and some other TOS characters.

ML31

I wouldn’t put it past these guys to have Pike work with a Lt. Kirk on a Pike show. Even though Kirk did say he only met Pike once. When he got promoted.

Legate Damar

I’m sure they wouldn’t directly contradict canon in that way. If Kirk does show up, he won’t interact with Pike. It could be cool to see Kirk and Spock’s first meeting though.

ML31

I’m sure that would be how it would be handled. Pike can HEAR about Kirk. Kirk can interact with anyone else. But they will have to find ways for the two to NOT be in the same room. It would be quite the task but I doubt if that show does get off the ground they can resist bringing in Kirk. I mean even I think it could be great if Pike hears of something Kirk did and say something about him making a great Captain someday. But that is the fanboy in me talking. It would probably be best to leave him out of it. But other TOS cast… They are all on table if they want them! In fact, my head canon had Scotty on the Enterprise already when Kirk assumed command. (McCoy I suspected Kirk brought with him as part of his staff) So I think he could even be on the Engineering staff of a Pike’s Enterprise show!

Afterburn

I would be perfectly fine with them contradicting a single line of dialogue for the sake of a better show. Ron Moore did it in Generations and though the final product wasn’t all that great, I think his reasoning was sound. He believed it was in the best interests of the story to have Kirk aboard the B, where Scotty ended up being (yes we know it was originally supposed to be Spock and Bones, but it wound up being Scotty and Chekov)– but despite the contradiction created with Relics, they did it anyway.

Legate Damar

Scotty’s line was much less definitive though. You can interpret it to mean that he was being figurative or something. He didn’t come out and say that he believed that Kirk was alive, even though he kind of implied it. Kirk directly said that he had only met Pike once. There’s a lot less wiggle room there.

Tiger2

It is amazing how one line of dialogue from decades ago can have such an impact on story telling. Its the same reason why Pike couldn’t stay on the Discovery that long since they had the line Spock served with him on the Enterprise for 11 years. If you remove the 11 years line then in theory Pike couldv’e stayed on the ship and Number One could’ve been captain of Enterprise or something.

Its the same thing with Spock and Sarek. We didn’t see them together but once when Spock was going through his mental phase because of course it was stated he and Sarek hadn’t spoken in 20 years and to be fair they really stuck to that. I thought at least when they thought Spock was going to the future with Burnham, they would ignore that and give them a moment. But that didn’t happen either.

As far as Kirk and all of that, as usual we are getting waaay ahead of ourselves lol. We don’t even know is happening yet and we are already adding cast members. ;)

But I will say if a Pike show does happen they will probably adhere to canon as much as possible like they did last season, but it doesn’t mean we won’t see Kirk, it just means we won’t see him with Pike ;). They will probably find a way to bring him on the show, just not he and Pike together. But all the other TOS characters, all bets are off! And yes they could all show up on the Section 31 show as well.

Afterburn

Definitive or not, they knew it would contradict, and they went ahead with it. I say if it makes the show better, pretend that line never happened. It was silly 60s show nobody thought would outlive the decade, they weren’t exactly planning for this.

Heck, they changed the Klingons appearance not 10 years later and just pretended they were always that way.

That is, until DS9.

ML31

I guess we each have a level of importance we place on things that are said in shows and features regarding Trek canon. To me, Kirk saying he only met Pike that one time is something that they ought to stick to. It feels too important to change it up. And as you said, it was quite clear and doesn’t provide much wiggle room. Whereas Amanda saying “… speaking as father and son…” leaves a lot of room to play with. Without the “as father and son” part Discovery S2 would have been different. (maybe for the better?) For me, Soctty’s line for some reason didn’t hold as much weight even though it was severely implied. So it’s in the eye of the beholder, I suppose.

Afterburn

Yes, we clearly have different levels of importance of single lines of dialogue that was a throwaway line in an episode only written because they were running way over-budget.

I’m perfectly fine with that sort of thing. Easy enough to release the episode and delete the line or even alter it.

Sully

The most anti-Star Trek concept, headlined by the worst actor, from the worst series to carry the name. Section 31 worked on DS9 because less is more, but mostly because William Sadler is an exceptional, and criminally underrated actor who played the part of Sloan with subtlety and depth.

Afterburn

Sounds perfect.

madtrekfanuk

Sounds to me (readind between the lines) that the Section 31 show has been binned, which if it is the case then good, wasn’t intereseted in the slightest (please no ranty replies, just my personal opinion) if CBS have any sense they need to get Anson Mount onboard for a Pike/Enterprise series (along with Ethan Peck and Rebecca Romijn)

Locutus

I will admit that Mount/Peck/Romijn is already the beginning of a stellar cast. Get a good Dr. Boyce and another compelling female support character and you’ve got a crew and a ship
I’d most certainly watch. Hopefully, they would make the series more episodic and classic Trek. Wouldn’t hurt to have one series that relies on the tried and true formula of old.

Sully

100% agree!

Afterburn

Still struggling to see where this quote means it’s been binned. Seems to me a lot of people are seeing what they WANT to see in this quote.

Jako

“It depends if I fit into the timeline.” — LOL!

Tiger2

Yes that was actually a weird comment lol. But it also may prove what I been suggesting and that maybe the show doesn’t take place in the 23rd century again like everyone is assuming. Maybe Gerogiou will be part of a Section 31 in the 32nd century OR another century altogether. With so much going on now and so many eras showing up, it could be set practically anywhere.

Jay

Why Section 31 or a Pike show? Why one or the other? We can have both. Kurtzman mentioned moving fwd with Section 31 after Discovery Season 3. But now, not sure….Shazad is actually letting us know there is uncertainty. No green light, yet.

I have zero interest in a Section 31 show. Actually, it’s worse than that — I actively want it NOT to happen. I wish it had never happened on DS9. Sounds based on these comments like there’s no real heat behind the show; and it seems to me as if the primary interest was in the viewership Yeoh would bring to the table. Fair enough, but if this whole series falls apart and never materializes, you’ll hear nothing but a clapping noise from me.

That said, it’d be a real shame if the producers continue to squander Shazad Latif. He’s great; not too big a fan of Tyler/Voq himself(s?), but Latif is blameless in that. Same goes for Mary Chieffo, who’s been even more ill-used.

Afterburn

Section 31 was my absolute favorite storyline on the series. I was actually disappointed it was only featured in 3 episodes. Still, it had a huge impact on the franchise, and I couldn’t be happier about it. It creates an opportunity to tell stories that mirror whatever world we’re in– whether it was 1996, 2004, 2014, or 2020.

In fact, given a choice between a Pike show or S31, I’d go with S31.

Trek has never — until very recently — had any problem mirroring the world we’re in. It does so best at a remove, by showing a humanity of the future that can serve as an inspiration to humanity of the present.

Black-ops organizations don’t fit into that terribly well. When I want that sort of thing, I can — and do — get it from “The Expanse.” And at a higher level of artistic merit than these new Trek shows have even gotten close to yet.

Afterburn

“Trek has never — until very recently — had any problem mirroring the world we’re in.”

Not sure how that’s relevant. In fact, i’d say it supports my argument– because S31 isn’t a solution to a problem, it’s an extension of what they’ve always been doing. ie: it fits perfectly well within the framework of classic Trek stories.

Jai

”Section 31 was my absolute favorite storyline on the series.”

I think the concept has huge potential, but how the showrunners and writers handle it is absolutely critical. Like I said to Tiger2 upthread, ideally the show should be a mixture of the Bourne films and “In the Pale Moonlight”, but on a far larger scale. There’s all kinds of dark, conspiratorial and very timely stuff the show could realistically portray. Not sure if “fun” and “like the Mission Impossible movies” is the correct way to go, despite Michelle Yeoh and the showrunners/writers’ descriptions of the show as such, but a lot can happen between now and the finished product. It may well end up being a much more sophisticated and dark show than recent statements indicate.

Kayley

He has been my favourite part of discovery in general. It will be terrible if they don’t do something more with that character. The psychology of that character alone is intriguing and they are wasting it. I hope we get some show with him in the future, definitely my favourite character

Johnson&Jansen

It was obviously not happening from day one. Yeoh was great as an actual Starfleet captain but she’s garbage as a genocidal dictator that somehow we’re meant to love after watching her commit atrocities? I guess they thought the race/gender card would be enough to get them through it. Section 31 show isn’t going to happen, very glad to see someone high up actually bothered to watch the show and finally torpedoed this dumb idea.

Afterburn

I see nothing in here that says it won’t happen, or that anyone “torpedoed” it. Is it perhaps questionable? Maybe. But I think the nastiness in your post says more about you than the quote in this article says about the status of this series.

TG47

Agreed Afterburn.

Frankly, if there is a project among those announced as in development that seems to not be going ahead, it’s the Starfleet Academy show.

We’ve heard nothing about progress on that in about a year.

Afterburn

I completely forgot about that until someone mentioned the academy idea up above. No update on that in a long while. The difference here is that there’s a cast in place (Yeoh, Latif, potentially Sprang) and a fully built ship set. All we have of the Academy show was a rough concept. I don’t even think they’d mentioned a time period, did they?

Mel

The Starfleet Academy show was never officially greenlit. Until it is it is just a concept of a future series which might become reality or not. The same is true for the limited series about Khan there was talk about. Just an idea TPTB seemingly had which reached the press. I am sure they considered many more ideas, but in the end only a few become reality.

I think the Starfleet Academy concept is a good idea though. They could also reach a different demographic with it than your usual Trek fans. So personally I think the series was only deferred to further in the future. They are already working on so many other series right now. It might be greenlit in a few years when the current shows have ended.

alphantrion

I think for some strange reason the new Trek powers to be completely decided to cut all ties with Nicholas Meyer and that Khan idea was a casualty of this. I am really curious now about what led to this, I should say hardly amicable split. I mean Nick Meyer was one of most respected names in Star Trek and to cut all ties with him without any mention seems like a curiosity.

ML31

He was the director of two of the better films in Trek history… But that capital only went so far.

Afterburn

It’s possible they just weren’t excited about the ideas he put forth for these shows.

alphantrion

Yeah, but to completely cut him out of everything without even a hint of a reason, seems just weird to me.

ML31

I strongly suspect we will see an Academy series eventually. It just looks like other things have squirmed their way ahead of it. Wanting to keep Yeoh around for one thing. But remember, the Section 31 show hasn’t officially been green lit either. But there is talk like it is for sure happening. And I think Pike breaking out as popular as he was has also pushed an Academy show back. My guess is they have been working out ways to make a Pike show work for months and the other things have been pushed back. Just a hunch.

Legate Damar

I still don’t get why everyone wants a Pike show. Mount and Peck were good as Pike and Spock, but a Pike show wouldn’t really be anything new. We’ve already got four shows about the Enterprise exploring strange new worlds. Its time for the franchise to move on and do other things. It will be cool to see Pike again in the Short Treks, and a miniseries could be cool, but I don’t want to just see the Enterprise visiting a new planet every week.

Markinva

I don’t thing it’s fair to criticize a Pike show as not being new. We haven’t seen any of the history from that time period. Their would be adventures we haven’t seen.

I a a big fan of the Apollo missions. But I am constantly finding out new things about what happened then. It amazes me what they did with so little.

This is Star Trek. You can tell any story. The backdrop is the universe. I am sure there is something new to be found out somewhere in the universe during that time period.

Afterburn

Because if there’s anything the fandom agrees on, it’s that Trekkies don’t want anything new. A Pike show is a safe bet: it has Spock, the Enterprise, and an actor/character that was pretty universally well-received.

I’m all for it, as long as they also move forward with things like Picard, Section 31, Discovery, etc.

TG47

It totally fits at a strategic level.

Pike’s Enterprise would fill the niche for the significant portion of the established fan-base that is looking for a show anchored on the Enterprise.

While the brand needs to be extended to new niches with innovative offerings, the core needs to be served too.

Why would they develop offerings targeted at everyone but the historic core?

Legate Damar

There are already offerings targeted at that core. There’s Enterprise, TOS, TAS, and TNG. That niche has already been very much filled.

Afterburn

You know what he means: new shows. The fandom has said loud and clear they want MORE not just what’s on DVD.

Tiger2

People love nostalgia and fan service at the end of the day. I’m not super enthused about it but I certainly wouldn’t mind it. I think its the closest people will get to a TOS show again, at least for a long time and the adventures of a young Spock on the Enterprise probably sounds perfect to everyone.

But I also think because people just really liked the performances of Mount and Peck. If they were really not hot on those two I doubt we would be hearing a call for a show.

If we don’t get a show I really think a mini-series would work as you said or maybe just a TV movie every year. They have so many options now so I’m fine with whatever they do, even if its just a few Short Treks every year.

Afterburn

“I’m not super enthused about fan service”

Your previous comments earlier this week:

**Robert Picardo In Early Discussions To Appear in Star Trek Picard Season 2
“OMG, yes yes yes!!! Love the Doctor, this would be amazing news. And maybe even a Doctor/Seven reunion in season 2! That would be great.”

**William Shatner Would Like to Be In Quentin Tarantino’s Star Trek Movie
“I would like a “Captains” movie Mulgrew talked about a year ago where Janeway, Picard and Kirk all appeared together.”

**Jonathan Frakes Talks Return in Star Trek Picard
“Sounds great!!!! I’m happy we get them back in the first season even if it sounds like it will be in just a few episodes if that. I really hope we see them on the Titan or Enterprise.”

This is the kind of weird contradiction that drives me up the walls with a lot of fans. Here we have a wonderful set of actors in roles and adventures we know little about, on a classic starship from the franchise’s past in a time period largely unexplored, and you’re “not enthused”. Yet at the mere mention of Jonathan Frakes, Marina Sirtis, and Robert Picardo– actors and characters we saw episodically for 7 years each (Sirtis in an ongoing storyline on Voyager and 4 movies to boot), actors who were not nearly as engaging or charismatic or as exciting as Mount’s Pike, and you’re over the moon!

I get that you “wouldn’t mind it”– hey a tv movie! But you want a full series on the Titan starring the 66 year old Frakes and his wife, neither of which are very talented actors? You want a theatrical movie starring a bunch of elderly ex-captains doddering around doing what exactly?

Perplexing.

Tiger2

Afterburn, I am going to be VERY delicate here and just ask you straight out but do you have a reading condition of some sort? Are you dyslexic? I’m really asking here man because I don’t understand how you can constantly misread my posts over and over and over and over again? This is really common with you and ONLY with you for some reason? Yes we all misread things obviously from time to time but you do it very frequently.

For example, I never said that quote you have up above! Seriously read it AGAIN! I said, and I will make this VERY clear:

“I’m not super enthused about it.”

THAT’S what I said, exactly. Honestly look at it again please. And the ‘it’ in that sentence was REFERRING to having a Pike show, NOT fan service chief. I was saying I’m not overly ecstatic if they made a Pike show but sure it will definitely be a huge plus IMO, but I still prefer to go forward whenever possible. That’s it.

THAT said, now that there is a ‘vacancy’ of 23rd century Star Trek since Discovery jumped 1,000 years into the future this would be more than appropriate even if Section 31 shows up too since that won’t be a traditional Trek show. So I HOPE they do it now! But if they don’t do it, I will be fine either way.

And yes I LOVE fan service like any fan out there, I just ask they find a real reason to do it, thats all! As all the quotes you found, clearly I don’t mind it lol. It’s great when its done right!! :)

AND to give them credit, most of the fan service has been done right on Discovery IMO, EVEN when I was against it like bringing Mudd back (I hated the idea SO much in fact I told myself I may not even bother watching those episodes), bringing in Spock and throwing Pike in every episode. I wasn’t even that big of a fan about going back to Talos IV when that was announced. I was against ALL of it originally but changed my mind after I saw it, because they did a great job with it overall IMO.

That’s WHY I don’t have a problem with everyone being added to Picard. BUT, if all those originally turned out bad then NO, I wouldn’t be as excited about the others coming, OK? Get it now? I just hope they do as good of a job as they did with Discovery’s fan bait! It’s not as black and white as you are painting it lol.

But anyway, getting back to my REAL point, I’m just asking, do you have some kind of reading condition because this happens a lot!

Afterburn

It seems like you’re the one with the learning disorder, or an inability to comprehend basic human speech, or at least a lack of strong critical thinking skills:

***I said “I get that you ‘wouldn’t mind it’” ***

I fully acknowledge your stance on the issue. You aren’t against it, but aren’t excited about it. If “it” referred to the Pike show, then you also lack an ability to accurately articulate your thoughts.

Reread your comment:

“People love NOSTALGIA and FAN SERVICE at the end of the day. I’m not super enthused about it”

So you call out fan service, then say you’re not super enthused by it. Thus connecting the non-specific pronoun to the just-mentioned specific nouns. You should have said:

“People love NOSTALGIA and FAN SERVICE at the end of the day. I’m not super enthused about a Pike series…” So maybe my confusion interpreting your comments is that I have good reading comprehension skills and you have poor writing skills.

That said, it still doesn’t account for your previous opinions where you keep getting incredibly excited about what is OBVIOUS fan service, but are not nearly as excited for a Pike series which is both similar fan service, and much more appealing because (by your own admission) what we saw of the Enterprise and it’s crew, and the performances of its prospective stars, is very high quality and in a lot of ways something NEW, rather than just dragging up elderly actors to reprise roles that weren’t ever that celebrated to begin with.

Seriously, you’re excited about The Doctor, but not a Pike series? Good lord what has this fandom come to…

Tiger2

Man you misquoted me, seriously. Its right there! You do this kind of stuff over and over and again. So its a real question. I wasn’t talking about fan service, I was simply saying I wasn’t as excited about a Pike show because its still a prequel. The reason why I DON’T mind it because like everyone I wouldn’t mind seeing a show with Pike and Spock on the Enterprise. So I don’t know what your issue is?

Afterburn I’m going to be very honest again and that you have become REALLY annoying and bitter here. Dude, why do you CARE what I am interested in lol. My god, move on!

Dude I DON’T care about anything you like or dislike here. Nothing. You know how you know that? Because not once have I EVER questioned about any particular show, character you are a fan of, in literally years. Because I DON’T CARE ENOUGH! Honestly. I have disagreed with you and say what I like or don’t but I never got riled up about it or think you are ‘wrong’ for feeling that way. But yet I can’t go a week here without getting some post from you because I like this actor too much or because I want to see this person show up and so on. Stop whining about it, jesus.

Whats funny is you use to get on my case because I complained about Dicovery’s horrific first season and now you are STILL getting on my case because I’m too excited about Star Trek these days? That’s your problem now, I’m too happy and excited about things lol. Which INCLUDES Discovery next season chief and as far as I know, Riker won’t be on that season (but the way things are going, you can’t count the guy out either). Afterburn, you don’t seem to GET how annoying and bitter you come across in your posts these days, not to mention rude and nasty to others who simply disagree with you. You’re becoming as bad as that BorgKlingon guy use to be. Not AS bad but you’re getting there.

Seriously just like what YOU like man, stop getting on other people’s case because of what they like to see and enjoy, my god. Again, not once in years have I EVER cared what you liked about anything. Stop taking this stuff so seriously, its a fan board, we’re fans. At least most people here are excited about Star Trek these days even if they still don’t love it all.

Tiger2

TLDR?

Get OVER yourself and move on already! I have never cared what you enjoy or don’t or got on your case about what you like or don’t. Ever! But your REALLY odd obsession with me (example: see above ;)) shows you take this stuff a little too seriously. It’s a fanboard man, we’re allowed to like stuff and express it. There is no need to get so angry or offensive about it. Good lord indeed.

Tiger2

Oh and since you have turned into the quote finder, maybe you can find the one chief where I said IF I had to choose between Discovery going into the 32nd century and having the Picard show I would CHOOSE having Discovery believe it or not! WHY, because as exciting as it was to have Picard and the 24th century back, I do mean what I said and really prefer when Trek is doing new things and pushing forward. And Discovery is pushing forward like nobodies business lol. And its why I am SO excited about Discovery and really meant it at that time.*

*That’s before the Picard trailer came out and showed we are getting Seven, Data and the Borg back, so I changed my mind lol. Who is turning all that down??? NOT me! ;)

ML31

For me at least, it was seeing Mount and Peck and even Romijn together more than anything else. Before seeing that I would have been dead set against a Pike show. “Been there, done that”. But seeing the chemistry created and the wonderful job Mount did… My mind has been changed. That is the show I currently would love to see. And I doubt I am alone in that thinking.

Tiger2

Yes, that’s what I’m saying too. I think its the actors themselves that has MADE people more interested in a Pike show than they were before. Reddit is the perfect example.

Over a year ago before we knew ANYTHING about Pike coming on Discovery (or that Spock was coming at all) I actually made a thread there asking would people be interested in seeing another TOS or even a Pike show because IMO, it was only inevitable SOMEONE do one of these shows.

But even the SUGGESTION at the time they may do a Pike show some day had people offended over the idea. I felt like I was being attacked over it lol. Anyway you can read it here:

https://www.reddit.com/r/startrek/comments/8djf0e/do_you_ever_think_they_will_ever_just_make/

Look how much people were against the idea at the time? Literally ONE person who bothered to respond thought a Pike spin off was even possible lol. Many on that board really hates prequels. And now many of these SAME people are pushing for a Pike show today lol. I think people went through the same feelings you did, had no interest of one before but after seeing Pike on Discovery has changed their minds. I include myself in that as well but I was never that against a Pike show to begin with and always said that’s probably the show they should’ve made instead of Discovery, I just would’ve preferred they went forward.

alphantrion

This is exactly what I was trying to say up earlier in my post. While I would love to see a Pike show, it definitely would seem like treading old ground for the producers and I highly doubt they’d want to do that. Having said this, they did build an Enterprise set so perhaps they also do have a desire to do something more substantial with the ship. I mean why would you spend that much money building a physical set if you are only going to use it for 3-4 episodes at most?

Afterburn

I think treading old ground absolutely has its place, and is absolutely something they will do, because there is a segment of the fandom that ONLY wants the old and familiar. We’re getting new and different stories around fan favorite characters– that’s one way to tread old ground– and a 1701 series with a new sensibility and cast, with characters we barely have ever seen– but with a familiar stlye and a classic setting– is another.

Vulcan Soul

Let’s not forget that an episodic Trek series is something they haven’t done at all in 15 years and that’s what most old fans – especially the majority of casual fans – are familiar with. Not everyone wants to binge “10 hour movies’ back-to-back for the same reason not everyone enjoys solely reading 1000 pages novels but also short stories and poems. IDIC!

alphantrion

I think they might actually consider making the Pike show to replace Discovery after it finishes. As it stands now, I don’t think Discovery would continue for more than 5 seasons and if they start developing the Pike show now, they can get it up and running the moment Discovery finishes its run.

Afterburn

What makes you think DSC is planned to be “finishing”? If it runs for even 5 seasons it probably won’t close out until 2024.

alphantrion

I am not saying it is planned to finishing, I am just saying that considering the fact that most streaming showsn go on for about the average of 5 seasons, that seems to be the logical number to end the show on. Of course they can continue and I’ll be happy if they do, but as it currently stands, this is my guess. I think there would be too many Star Trek shows if most of them continued at the same time or a year apart.

Tiger2

I think that’s possible too. If a Pike show isn’t going to happen now, then they may wait to do it after Discovery finishes so they won’t have so many live action shows on (assuming its the first to go but most likely being the oldest), but yes the question is when will that be? But I always said no matter what its probably YEARS away anyway, especially if the Section 31 show happens first and that’s still years away as Latif just confirmed.

And people keep saying you can have both Section 31 and the Pike show at the same time. Yes, this is possible of course but this is a fan answer. The reality is we have NO idea how much money CBS has set to do these shows. Clearly its up there but it doesn’t mean they are going to just throw in another $50 million to develop another show either. Especially when they have SO many other shows in the pipeline.

So no I don’t think its as simple ‘hey, let’s just throw that show on too’. I think they are being a lot more strategic than that and yes, even CBS has to think about money lol. There is also probably a concern of simply doing too much too fast. NONE of these shows have even aired yet. So my honest guess is they don’t want to do more than three live action shows at once. MAYBE I’m wrong and that might be proven wrong this weekend, but I do suspect if they stick to their guns and keep the Section 31 show, a Pike show may not happen for awhile. Again, it COULD happen, I’m just guessing its a few years away.

And also why a good compromise may be a movie or a mini-series if they can’t do a show right away. Hell I’m happy with the Short Treks lol.

It certainly would be weird if Star Trek fans wanted a show that was actually Star Trek. Yep, that’d be baffling.

ML31

But it would be more than just visiting a planet every week. It will be the people and how they grow. It would be the Spock Pike relationship and how it grows to the point where Spock would be willing to risk everything for Pike down the road. We will still be getting new stories with the other shows. This one would be the episodic traditional Star Trek type show that a lot of fans would like to have. And it’s not like they have run out of episodic stories to tell.

Tiger2

But this is part of the problem too. I don’t think CBS WANTS an episodic Star Trek show because streaming is simply a different animal from traditional TV. I think if we get a Pike show, its still going to go the serialized route and it may disappoint a lot of people like you. Could I be wrong, sure, but SO FAR every show on AA with the exception of the Twilight Zone for obvious reasons is serialized.

Every science fiction show today is in fact. I can’t think of one I’ve seen in the last decade that’s been episodic. I’m not saying none are out there, but everyone *I* watch is and I watch a lot of them.

Gary

The Orville is the only modern episodic sci fi series I can think of.

ML31

Yes. The Orville does it. But they do have an underlying bit of serialization there. I think being episodic is difficult mainly because of the limited number of episodes. But there is the thinking that episodic doesn’t promote “binging”. Which I personally don’t have the time to do anyway. But it would be nice if, and who would have thought THIS would be said 30 years ago, there was one version that leaned towards being episodic rather than a single story are. And BTW, I was never a fan of the A story and B story concept. It felt a little lazy to me.

Tiger2

Exactly Gary! And as pointed out its still a bit serialized, but not as much as others and do tell a lot of standalone stories.

But my guess is now that its going to HULU next season, expect that to change as well. Pretty much everything on that site is serialized too.

Markinva

I would have watched the section 31 show. However it seems like (from indications) the show runners seem to be feeling this out.

I think with the Pike show being mentioned by the show runners as a possibility, that they are hedging their bets. I would welcome a section 31 show along with anything else. But it seems like the winds are changing on this.

The CBS brand is in this to make money. I am sure they are sharpening their pencils and trying to figure out if a Section 31 show would bring in more money long term over a Pike 23rd century show.

Star Trek still makes most of its money from the US and to a lesser degree the U.K. and Europe. They have to balance that (with their emerging and future markets).

I think this is most likely what is going through their minds.

Mel

The UK is in Europe. It just sounds so stupid when you make it sound like they are not part of it.

TG47

Markinva it’s not either/or.

It’s not Pike or S31. They aren’t competing against each other.

CBS has room in its schedule for both.

As long as S31 is forecast to make a positive return on investment, it will go forward — especially if the market research shows that it could attract a new niche of viewers.

It’s interviews like this one that lead me to believe that this one is just going to fade away into ‘in development’ purgatory. When Simon Pegg pops up somewhere that it’s a go, then we’ll know it’s dead.

Markinva

Gotta agree that it sounds like that is what is happening. The Pegg reference is funny. I gotta give Pegg some kudos though, he wrote a Star Trek movie with some actual Star Trek history in it. I can’t think of a ST movie that referenced its history more than Beyond. The Wrath of Kahn maybe, but allot of people consider it a sequel to Space Seed.

Tiger2

LOL!

Vulcan Soul

I really hope this one goes the way of the dodo. Also (and there hasn’t been much talk about this yet) because with Space Hitler being part of Discovery season 3 and staying in the 31st century for a whole year, then somehow going back to the 23rd century, she will have all that knowledge about future technology and political developments and certainly no qualms to use it to pollute the prime timeline and TOS canon even further!

Afterburn

Hey I feel the same way about a lot of the fans here, but I have just accepted they’re not going anywhere.

Vulcan Soul

Peaceful coexistence, mate :)

Danpaine

I have to agree, VS, this concept hasn’t found any traction with me whatsoever since it was first mentioned, but to each their own. If it comes out I’ll give it my customary three-episode try then either go with it, or drop it. Simple. My guess is the latter.

Afterburn

I wish more people would have this attitude. It’s foolish to believe that every show has to be for every person.

ML31

Selfishly, I, too, hope this show never sees the light of day. Everything I have heard about it screams ‘garbage’ to me. From the comments of what the tone will be to what we have seen of Section 31 in Discovery… It doesn’t bode well. Now I know there are people who would still like to see such a show regardless. To them it would suck if the show goes away. But the good news is that there still might be a Section 31 show pop up down the road if this 5 year experiment works for CBSAA. Perhaps that version could be a better concept than the one that spoken about now?

Afterburn

Well at least you admit your selfish!

ML31

In the context of wishing for no Section 31 show, then yes. It is selfish as I know there are some who would like to see such a thing. I can admit to times when my feelings are negative. Unlike some other posters….

Soren

If this is all about the producers not wanting to lose Yeoh then why not just bring back prime Georgiou as the captain for Discovery? There’s a vacancy in season 3 and with them going into that time travel vortex I’m sure they could easily enough dream up some way for the empress to transform in that same moment.

Mel

Just scrap the show. The premise already sounds bad. The Federation just looks stupid and morally corrupt with letting someone like Mirror Georgiou walk around free and working for them.

Ash Tyler is also the worst DIS character and shouldn’t be in any show. His backstory is a convoluted mess, his love story with Burnham was horrible written and acted, and the rest of the time he was just a boring, moping, charisma free guy. It seems like DIS might have gotten rid of him for its 3rd season. Good decision! They shouldn’t make the mistake to bring him back for another show.

ML31

To be fair, most of the characters on Discovery were just as poorly conceived. Tyler wasn’t really any worse than the others. But I do agree. There was nothing interesting about Tyler.

Afterburn

Except everything about his character.

TG47

Tyler can and should be a classic Trek character who is trying to sort out what it means to be human or Klingon and find a place where he can add value.

Making him Burnham’s love interest wasn’t successful in exploring that, but did give the tether and anchor to make the human personality dominant.

Shazad Latif is strong actor with excellent range.

With a new concept in the S31 show, and his acting skill, I believe there is a great deal that could be explored.

Not only that, he would be a very useful compare and contrast character against Georgiou’s MU-raised character who is reluctantly discovering what it means to be a healthy human in the Prime Universe.

ML31

I will admit that a lot of the problem with Tyler springs from his origins as being a part of a lame plot device. I find it tough to get beyond that.

Tiger2

I agree with both you and ML31. That is what is so odd about Discovery, they actually present characters with some really interesting conflicting backgrounds but then do nothing with it. Burnham is obviously the best example of that since she was raised on Vulcan but none of that is EVER explored other than the melodrama with Spock and her parents. I expected to see internal conflict of some kind but that never really happened either. Today you only know she was raised on Vulcan when Sarek shows up. But other than that she could’ve been on Earth the whole time.

Same with MU Lorca. There was some real potential to see a character questioning who he was after being in the PU for so long and maybe rethinking how things work in the MU was not right. Or even imploring the Discovery crew that with their help they could make the MU more like the PU if he became Emperor instead creating a lot of interesting Prime Directive issues. But NOPE, he basically stayed the same person he always was and didn’t try to expand on the character internally one bit.

Then of course you can’t ignore MU Georgiou which has the exact same flaw and even worst feels like a cartoon character at times. Yes, we see some conflict with her when it comes to Michael but outside of that she still the exact same person she was with zero introspection. Zero. And its odd how NO ONE seems to take her to task about her past. They make sly jokes about it but not one person has confronted her dead on about who she is. Maybe that will come next season but it was a missed one for sure this season.

And then yes there is Tyler. Now admittedly they at least given him some lip service that he was at least Klingon and have to deal with being treated like an outsider now, but it was still really thin stuff. But again that is part of the problem with serialized story lines. If they could just do an episode with these characters face these issues like you saw so much on the other shows, especially TNG, DS9 and VOY, then they probably would do more. But when you have to remind people of the other five ongoing story lines in an episode then all the character stuff just gets pushed back in the background it seems.

ML31

That was a HUGE issue I had with Burnham. When I heard her backstory, while I didn’t like the Spock connection I felt it interesting to see the results of a human raised on Vulcan. And they did NOTHING with that. To the point of why even have it in her back story? It doesn’t seem to shape who she is when we saw her. That was another irritating thing with her character.

Tiger2

Its so weird. They made SUCH a big deal about her being the first human raised on Vulcan and then….nothing. And SMG proves she could do the Vulcan thing very well as evidenced in Binary Stars. I don’t expect her to ACT like a Vulcan but its funny how the only things that reminds you she is from Vulcan when she talks like a computer at times. I really wish we saw real struggle or at least flashbacks to it, but nothing.

Jonathan

DS9 and VOY HD remaster please!!!!

Tiger2

YES YES YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Kat Slander

Yes, I can hear you Clem Fandango.

ACpilot

Nope – not for me. Add my voice to the thousands wanting a Pike/Spock/Number One Enterprise series instead!