John de Lancie Assures Fans Q Will “Annoy The S@#t Out Of Picard” In ‘Star Trek: Picard’ Season 2

Once again John de Lancie is dropping clues about season two of Star Trek: Picard, including a re-confirmation about another returning character.

De Lancie hard at work annoying Picard

The big news out of the Paramount+ First Contact Day virtual event was the teaser trailer and panel featuring John de Lancie returning to the role of Q for season two of Star Trek: Picard. However, it wasn’t entirely a surprise that Q was coming back, because late last year he sort of let it slip he was coming back in a Cameo video for a fan.

And since First Contact Day, de Lancie has been back at it, mentioning his Picard return on many of his Cameo videos posted in April. In between wishing various fans happy birthday or congratulations for other events, the actor has repeatedly and effusively talked about how he is “back!” on Star Trek. He has also been dropping some hints about his return.

The videos posted over the last few weeks were recorded both before and after he started shooting. He revealed that he started filming on April 13th for Picard, but has been at work on the show for a month (presumably preparing and rehearsing). You can also see that his hair is a bit shorter, but he still has his beard.

de Lancie in his latest Cameo video

He has also been giving some details on what we can expect to see in Picard season two. In one video (for “Stacy”), de Lancie gave a taste of his return:

By the way, you are going to be seeing more of me. I am on Picard. I guess they really needed someone to come in and really annoy the shit out of Picard and that is exactly what I have been doing for the last month. I’ve been making his life very unpleasant. I’m really proud of that. [laughs]

He offered similar sentiments in a video for “Kyle”:

You might not know this but Q is back and I have been spending the last month really annoying Picard in the new show Picard.

it was Q who inspired the iconic Picard facepalm in “Deja Q”

Multiple episodes, under the direction of Jonathan Frakes

In a video for “Seth” he indicated he was in at least two episodes of season two:

The word’s out. I’m coming back to annoy Picard. As a matter of fact, yesterday I really annoyed him. That was episodes one and two.

In two other videos, de Lancie talks about appearing in the season two premiere—which is a bit curious as the show began production in February, so they should have finished a handful of episodes by the time of his April start. It’s possible he was conflating his first episodes with the season’s first, or possibly they are shooting out of order.

In one of the videos posted before he began production (for “Jan” ), he revealed that Jonathan Frakes will be directing the episodes he appears in :

I’m ecstatic… We’ll see what the writers bring. It’s going to be fun, that I know. And the whole notion that Frakes is going to be directing as well is going to be making for some good times.

And in a video recorded last Friday, he talked more about his Picard schedule:

The word is out. I’m back. I spent Tuesday and Wednesday really annoying Mr. Patrick Stewart. Really annoying Picard, as only Q can do. That was great fun. [I’ll be] back on Monday, and Tuesday again or Wednesday. It will be a while before we shoot all of this stuff.

de Lancie as Q with Frakes as Riker in “Q Who”

Q will be dealing with Guinan and other Picard characters

Even though Whoopi Goldberg’s return as Guinan for season two of Picard seemed to be confirmed last year, she was not mentioned official press release sent out on First Contact Day earlier this month. On Wednesday a Variety interview with Goldberg confirmed she is currently “preparing to return as Guinan on Star Trek: Picard.”

Whoopi Goldberg as Guinan and John de Lancie as Q in “Deja Q”

And in a Cameo video from Tim Roy (see below), de Lancie confirmed Q will also be “harassing” Guinan in Picard. In the same video (which appears to have been shot over the last weekend), de Lancie reveals that his first scenes didn’t involve the new Picard cast, but he will get to them too…

I haven’t met them yet. But I watched their entire first season and thought they were awful good… I will be meeting them soon, in the next three or four days.

Cabrerra celebrates returning to space

One last Picard update for the week is from Santiago Cabrera, who posted an image of himself in front of his trailer, with the message “Sights back up in space. It’s all happening #picard #season2 #rios.”

 

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A post shared by Santiago Cabrera (@santiagoc)

ICYMI – Season two teaser

Star Trek: Picard season 2 will arrive in 2022. Here again, is the teaser released on First Contact Day.


Find more news and analysis on Star Trek: Picard.

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I love this so much.

So nothing has changed between Q and Picard then. Thought the idea behind coming back was to not re-do what they already did.

Eh, Q can do something different and still be annoying… I rather doubt that it will be entirely more of the same. With Guinan in the mix too, maybe we can actually get some nuggets of their history/backstory which would be fun.

The only time Q did something that had wider reaching consequences was in Q Who. All that’s been teased so far is that he’s going to be annoying. When we left robo-Picard at the end of season one, he’s still retired, of limited influence in the affairs of the Federation, and seems to have called in whatever favors he had with Starfleet to get the fleet out to turn back renegade Romulans. So, Q being annoying now may likely contain all the drama of a farmer poking a dead dog with a stick. I’m not feeling “must see” TV out of all of this….

I’d greatly prefer a quiet, reflective, thoughtful story to the bombastic, unrelenting and thus deadening dramatic noise that has typified certain other Trek properties, for instance. When everything is “IMPORTANT,” nothing is.

I do too actually. It’s why so many loved AGT. It felt big, end of the world stakes, but it was really a personal story with Picard and ended with trying to solve a paradox and not about trying to defeat another uber-villain.

The irony is Q originally started out as a villain but became more of an antagonist to now something more reflective and contemplative. I don’t really care what they do with him, as long as it’s interesting, but I’m hope we get more introspective Q next season.

For those who found Guinan or Q interesting that very well could be fun. And honestly I hope it works out for you as well as those who didn’t.

I am not sure how you infer that “nothing has changed” just because he will annoy Picard. You make it sound as if the entire episode is Q simply following JLP around giving him noogies.

I suspect that there will be new dimensions explored here (my gut tells me that, like in Tapestry, Q will help Picard examine the nature of his new existence). But what it sounds like to me is that Q’s presence as an antagonist that drops in to annoy our main character (as he did to Janeway in Voyager) is alive and well.

And why shouldn’t it be? Q has been around millennia. Will he change a fundamental aspect of his personality over the past 20 years? Might as well be a minute or two to him.

Being the jester is just one small facet to the character, but it seems to you that is all he is.

Being a clown was pretty much the only time the Q character worked. So yeah. While that is not all he is it’s pretty much the bulk of what he is. A clown who seems to care a great deal about Picard while Picard wants absolutely nothing to do with him.

The problem is, as the TNG era progressed, Q was basically reduced to being a caricature. Why would a supreme bring now be interested in Picard, when his “new existence” basically comes with all the built in frailties of his old one? If Q is reduced to being annoying to an old man with nothing ‘official’ to do, how is this compelling drama?

Fundamentally disagree. While he had some clownish moments in the episodes, his two best episodes for me were “Tapestry” and “All Good Things,” where he acts almost as a spiritual advisor to Picard. I suspect his PIC appearances will continue that thread.

I am curious though, what Trek to you like most? From the posts i’ve seen from, it sounds like you don’t really enjoy TNG. That’s fair, there’s some Trek i’m not fond of, too.

Tapestry was easily the best Q episode. Followed a distant 2nd by the Robin Hood one. (And that was mainly great because Worf got two of the best lines in all of TNG.) Was that Q-pid? I get those titles mixed up. Anyway in that one he was still a clownish figure but he endeavored to teach Picard a lesson. Why? Obviously Q cares about Picard. All Good Things was actually one of the worst Q episodes. By that time it had been well established that Picard was essentially Q’s pet. So there was no way in hell Q was going to let anything happen to him. And then as if that point needed to get hammered home Q just told Picard EVERYTHING. There was no lesson. No persona realization or growth. Just Q telling Picard what to do a little bit at a time. No so Picard could learn something like in Tapestry. But because he just enjoys playing with him. So unless that relationship has changed since AGT, I just don’t see how Q brings very much to the table for a 10 episode story arc.

For me, the best Trek series’ so far have been 1: TOS. And 2: DS9. I never thought TNG was all that good even back when it was airing. It was watched mainly because it was Trek that wasn’t a rerun. I felt the characters were all pretty dull save for Worf and that that Patrick Stewart had the acting chops to make bad/mediocre episodes watchable. Yes, there were a handful of really good TNG episodes. And I really do appreciate TNG for what it did for the Star Trek brand.

I agree on Tapestry, and the strong points of QPid, but I never did really like that episode. It’s a fun romp, more of a “guilty pleasure” episode than a strong Trek story.

Personally I rather enjoyed Q in AGT. It was a logical extension of his role in tapestry. The lesson he was trying to teach him was to open his mind– that, as he says in his speech at the end– the exploratin humanity needs to make is not in mapping stars or charting nebulae, but expanding their understanding of existence…

….something that I think could very well be examined in PIC S2, where Picard is now no longer human. What is the nature of his existence? Is he the same man? Is he an android copy? Is he something in between? The esoteric themes we could explore are exciting to think about, and Q is the perfect conduit through which to filter them through… that is, if they can avoid the temptation to devolve into battles with the borg and actually explore those themes.

My ranking of Trek is 1.DS9 2.TNG (very close), 3.VOY (just a fun show, even if not very good) 4.ENT (not a very good show but totally watchable and has some good stuff in it) 5.TOS. What made TNG so high on the list is the characters. I’ll agree they are not the most exciting, but they were so well written and well performed, they became like family, a cozy blanket to sink into on a quiet Thursday night.

And as someone who saw the classic movies and TNG first, TOS always just felt like a bad Saturday morning cartoon version of better Trek, and not much better than the atrocious TAS. Nimoy is literally the only thing that makes the original series watchable for me, and most episodes I struggle to get through. After ‘Magic to make the sanest man go mad” I went back and watched the first Mudd episode, and couldn’t even finish it.

I find that younger people tend to have a tougher time with TOS. And old TV and movies in general. So I’m not surprised. I don’t think it a coincidence that the two Trek shows I consider the best had the best Captains. Not in acting. Stewart beat them all by miles. I just found them interesting and of the Captains in the shows we’ve had those are the two I would prefer to serve under.

Regarding AGT… Those things you spoke about were things that Picard already knew. Yet that knowledge didn’t help him figure out the “mystery” Honestly Picard in AGT was uncharacteristically not very sharp. Not the “crazy old man” version. I get that. But the other versions never felt like the guy we saw the previous 7 seasons. I just found no depth to anything in that episode and there were no stakes whatsoever. And quite frankly I think that was purely due to the presence of Q. There might have been something there had there been no Q and Picard worked things out for himself. And had the mystery not been made so obvious to the audience.

If S2 of STP does dive into the things you are suggesting I really hope that it doesn’t tell the audience what to think about it. I like Trek best when presenting dilemmas where there really is no good answer and different characters have different takes on the matter. Thus giving the Captain an impossible decision. The Captain makes the choice and it’s not necessarily the right one. Like Kirk in A Private Little War. Obviously he regrets what he felt like he had to do. “Serpents for the Garden of Eden” he says.

I think you are also being too hard TAS. Yes the entire production is monumentally cheap. That’s Filmation for you. But many of the stories would have made for really good TOS episodes. You just have to get past the crappy production. Besides, having a slick production doesn’t make a show good. Just look at Star Trek Discovery. Everything about their production is very high end. Except the quality of scripts and the stories.

Anyhow, after DS9 for me comes 3: Enterprise. (Biggest weakness was Bakula badly miscast but I really felt the era was a fascinating time to set a show in) 4: Voyager. 5:TNG. I feel the exact opposite you do about the TNG characters. In addition to being dull I felt, apart from Worf, they were badly fleshed out and the actors, apart from Stewart obviously, were not very good. But I’ll close on a positive note saying that Picard did have charisma and Worf was interesting.

I’m curious what you think of as young, as I am 42. Grew up on a steady diet of 60s reruns (Batman, Twilight Zone, Bewitched, etc) but TOS was tough to watch.

As for Captains, Sisko tops the list, by a country mile, as far as who i’d want to serve under.

I was just playing the odds. Since most younger people find older shows and movies hard to watch I concluded that you likely were below 40. I was wrong but I still contend it was not a bad assumption to make.

I agree as well, Tapestry and AGT were my favorite Q episodes as well, although Q Who was probably the most exciting since he introduced us to the Borg. But I’ve liked most of the Q episodes minus his second appearance in TNG in Hide and Q and his final appearance in Q2. That was just horrid because it just became a joke with his spoiled son. There was nothing else to it. But the rest, I’ve really liked if not loved.

And I also agree, by the time we got to Q-pid, his relationship with Picard had changed after Deja-Q. He no longer viewed Picard or humans as a threat once they were willing to save him and clearly started to care for Picard (even if Picard never had the same view of Q lol).

Tapestry was one of TNG’s best episodes, but it was a Picard story. Q was basically just Rod Serling, popping in to provide some exposition. Had John de Lancie not been available it would have worked just as well if JLP has having a near death experience, the side effects of a cortical stimulator malfunceion, or some other telepathic alien interference.

You are thinking too linear, not like a Q. 20 years have no meaning for him. Who knows from which time Q will appear? It could be the same Q which appeared in Q who or Tapestry. Just a moment later. “Jean Luc, I see you have cheated death again, but without my help.” Or it could be Q 1000 years later (whatever that means for him) deciding visit his old “closest thing to a friend”. There are no limits.

Except that’s not how Q has ever worked, and I don’t expect that to suddenly change. While he is ageless, the Q have never, to my recollection, been described as existing outside of time like the Prophets.

Yes, they can time travel for sure, but my point above is, simply, that is appearances have always been linear. I don’t expect Q to time travel to the “present” Picard from a previous era, even if it is possible.

Did you hurt your knees jumping to that concusion?

Knees are fine. No jumping required, thank you.

Why are you always so melodramatic and negative?

Why are you always never understanding the comments correctly?

Is Q going to be annoying Picard?

Do bears s**t in the woods?

They’ve got to be filming some of this out of order, right? Michelle Hurd posted back in mid-Feb that she was back on set, but recently it seems Cabrera is just starting? I would imagine shooting during COVID makes things really challenging

LOL same old annoying Q.

Please let’s hope this means Picard will be lighter in tone than last season where everyone seemed to be shouting and swearing at JL or being broken characters. All very cliche. I’m hoping Q will sweep all that rubbish away.

After getting shouted by everyone around him and in case Guinan will behave that way too, he might consider Q also as “closest thing to a friend” and enjoy his visit.

Okay, soooooo…..so what? Q is annoying. All old robo-Picard will be able to do in response is offer up some stern lectures on the viability of humanity. Q isn’t going to kill anyone. No galaxy altering mayhem, that’s something the 32nd century Discovery crew couldn’t ignore. Robo-Picard makes a “Tapestry” type episode pretty pointless. A “Qpid” series long story arc would just be insipid. The problem with this slow drip of information is that season two seems to be shaping up to be a story about nothing.

I see your points and I do get it. Q is pretty limiting. If Q is involved in whatever is going down then that pretty much erases any real stakes because we all know there is no way Q is ever going to let his own shenanigans harm his good buddy Picard in any way shape or form. He likes him too much. And that is the problem with Q. The only time he worked when he wasn’t a clown was when he was teaching Picard a his “Tapestry” lesson. And even then he was still a clown. But a 10 episode Q lesson would just be too much. Of course, maybe some really clever writers could come up with something that would not be too much for Q. I just don’t see it happening.

Wow, you and ML31 seem to be in heaven crafting your own PIC S2. You guys combined already know that nothing has changed about Q, nothing has changed about Picard and Q’s relationship, that Q has had and will have no wider impact on the universe than he did in ‘Q Who”, that there will be no stakes, that an all-powerful entity is limited as a character, that the writers have no thoughts other than rehashes of old storylines, that their only options are those insipid rehashes, that Picard can’t have any current or future influence on the universe because he is retired and Starfleet wasn’t interested in him in episode 1 of season 1, and that all of season 2 will be about nothing. A serialized Seinfeld episode, it would seem. Call me when you have something new to say about what is actually known about the show.

Last edited 3 months ago by Ometiklan

TOS at least had enough sense that when they introduced a supreme being, the determination those beings came to was that humanity was insignificant enough to warrant any ongoing interaction with. That went out the window when TNG introduced Q. Q is a supreme being, and humanity is insignificant to the Q. The Q could snap humanity out of existence and not give it a thought. Nor could humanity do anything about it. If this Q is now petty, cruel, or maybe has matured a bit that he doesn’t actually interfere with anything, just how does Picard influence that? He can’t. As far as a relationship goes, Q to Picard is akin to that of a person to their dog. They aren’t equals by any stretch of the imagination. Picard will die one day, and Q is apparently immortal. This isn’t conjecture, it’s canon, and also a reason why a lot of fans don’t like the supreme being trope anymore they they like the cheap and easy time travel trope. “The trial never ends” is a really cheap, and meaningless throw away line. If it doesn’t end, all there is is existence, for better or worse. If it does end, then there’s a verdict. I’ll leave it to others to decide the consequences of guilty or innocent to a Q.

Last edited 3 months ago by Phil

That’s pretty funny because that’s literally how Data describes Q and Picard relationship in AGT:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6MvBl7WYLKA

But we also have to remember as far as the Q Continuum is concerned, they do look at humans or the Federation as a whole as insignificant and has said so. Q himself is interested in humanity but I also think because he sees humans becoming a much bigger influence in the galaxy in centuries and even millenniums to come, for good and bad. Humans will always be inferior compared to something like the Q, but they can still have a lot of influence in the galaxy itself, which includes even destroying it. Dogs can’t really do much harm to Earth, so there is still a difference.

But look, if people just don’t like Q, I get it. There are just going to be some characters some fans will never like. I never loved Harry Mudd and yet he seemed to be a fan favorite and I just couldn’t figure out why? But Q is a much bigger character and a lot more complex and more divisive because of it.

I personally always loved Q so this is really exciting to see him again. But I’ve said I would like to go beyond just that character and see more Qs in general. There is SO MUCH they can really add to the species and that we got a small glimpse of in Voyager. And I wasn’t really fond of all the God like aliens in TOS (I forgot just how many they did lol), but they are all part of Star Trek now.

Last edited 3 months ago by Tiger2

I swear even though I did my first rewatch of AGT a couple of months ago I swear when I wrote that he sees Picard like a pet I did not recall that conversation. Promise!

I never cared for Harry Mudd, either. But, a little like Q, when they brought him back they decided that he would work better as a clown. It worked and I, Mudd was WAAAY better than Mudd’s Women. For that reason.

I remember that line so well because I laughed so hard when I first heard it. So it always stuck with me.

Mudd just always came off more creepy than funny. But oddly I like Rainn Wilson’s version of Mudd a lot, so you never know I guess.

Q had the funny lines but I guess what I meant with Mudd being a clown is that his 2nd appearance was a far more light hearted episode. And the character worked better in that context even though he himself may not have provided the bulk of the amusing moments. But I would argue he did provide some. :)

 Q is a supreme being, and humanity is insignificant to the Q. The Q could snap humanity out of existence and not give it a thought.

Not if the Q are humans in the far, far future.

Spoken with the same voice and tone like in “not from a Jedi”…😂😂

I do laugh when fans have predetermined an episode/series/movie’s story and quality. In all likelihood no matter what the season is about, or how good or bad it turns out to be, fans like that are never happy.

That old Guinan quote comes to mind, “When a man is convinced he’s going to die tomorrow, he’ll probably find a way to make it happen” That is to say in this case, if you tell yourself something is going to be a certain way, you’ll probably believe it even if it turns out not to be.

If it’s an Emmy quality season, I’ll be thrilled. Promise.

If it’s Emmy-worthy, people with those pre-determined opinions usually refuse to acknowledge it. It could win awards, and those people would simply use it as evidence of awards bias, or that the studio paid them off for the win. It’s one thing to be skeptical based on past history, or to have low expectations, but some folks make predetermined assessments with such certainty that if they are wrong they dig in their heels rather than admit they were wrong.

Well, I did leave it open by saying that there could be some clever writers who might come up with something that could work for Q and Picard. It’s just that given the history of Secret Hideout that doesn’t seem likely at all. Sorry if my and Phil’s conjecture (and yes, we know it’s conjecture so it would be appreciated if you don’t act as if we are saying we know exactly what is coming in S2 for 100% certain.) bothers you. Not much we can do about that. We are fans and fans like to guess about upcoming plots based on what information is made available.

And… What Phil said.

Perhaps…
Perhaps…..he makes Picard human again…

That is actually my hope. I honestly don’t really care why or how. Just have Q ultimately snap the robot out of Picard and make him himself again, minus that silly disease that he had in AGT that was really only there for plot purposes and for all we know Q gave it to him just to screw with him.

That would completely ruin the ending of season 1. The entire point is that it doesn’t matter if he’s an android or a human. He is still him. It isn’t necessary for Q to change Picard back, because there is no difference.

Except there sorta IS a difference. He can’t be affected by disease because he’s not organic. If he needs something all one needs to do is write a few lines of code and he’s all better. It’s a HUGE difference.

I think his new body is organic. But, his body isn’t the important thing. Whether or not he can be affected by disease doesn’t change who he is.

If it is it’s something that wasn’t made clear. And if it is, then we are really getting into even more philosophical arguments about creating life and such. Which is a very Trek thing but less so to come to a judgement on it. Regarding Picard in a new organic casing I would argue that he is still not really himself. Everything about him is different. Such a transition cannot be possible without changing someone.

The examination of whether he is still Picard or not is exactly what I want to see in this season. Philosophical debates on the nature of humanity, of identity, of self, are very Star Trek, and very socially relevant in 2021.

I don’t care what the ultimate verdict is, whether they agree he’s the same man, whether he is just a copy, or whether (as I suspect will be the case) “it doesn’t matter because you are who you believe yourself to be”– I just want the discussion and debate to form the basis of the season.

Well, Culber got a new organic body, and he is still himself. So did Spock, sort of. Obviously this will change Picard, but any major life experience will change him. That’s just part of life. It is never made clear what exactly the Golem is, but Dahj was described as organic in the first episode. I assume that the Golem is similar technology.

Last edited 3 months ago by Legate Damar

I still don’t believe it’s “really” Culber. I thought that from the first time they brought him “back”. As far as I’m concerned, Culber is dead and this is some sort of mycelial network facsimile. Spock was still Spock. Still his mind. Still his body. Picard is now artificial. No more real than if they made a holodeck program out of him. I mean, he can be turned off and back on again. How is he still even human?

I find your stance on Spock pretty interesting. After all, he copied his mind into McCoy, and then the Vulcan priestess copied it out of McCoy. He’s not just a copy, he’s a copy of a copy.

And he did act rather different afterwards. Albeit, some people say his change in behaviour and personality was seeded in his revelation about V’Ger in TMP. But if that’s the case, TWoK mostly ignored that, which just further makes it seem a post-TSFS development.

I mean, I am also of the opinion that Spock is still Spock — but then, I also think the same about Culber. After all, his soul was whisked away into the mycelium, and existed disembodied in there. (Unless we are to regard Stamets an unreliable narrator.) To my mind, that’s equivalent to a Katric Transfer, and therefore just as valid at preserving identity.

Of course, maybe your issue lies more in continuity? As I noticed you mentioned Spock’s body being rejuvenated instead of outright replaced as being an important factor for you. (Even though of course there was still a discontinuity of mind, as he was not conscious while inside McCoy.)

If that’s the case, I could see why you have a bigger issue with Picard than Spock, since there was indeed a discontinuity of both body and mind in Picard’s case. Conceivably, they could have woken up the Golem Picard before regular Picard had died, if he hadn’t already lost consciousness for the final time prior to their performing the deep brain structure scan.

But ultimately, it’s all a variant of the Ship of Theseus thought experiment. Many philosophers would vehemently argue for or against continuity being an important (or even relevant) factor, and, as a result, argue extensively over the Ship of Theseus. In a sense, that’s also exactly what we’re all doing, with these various characters substituting for the ship.

(While we’re on the topic, I had expected to see far more debate about whether the people returned from the Snap/Blip were in fact the same people who had died; but I’ve seen basically no such discussion at all. That was the first thought I had as soon as Banner did it. It’s not like they existed in some timeless pocket dimension to get retrieved later. But then, the text of the film completely ignored that question, while Picard drew attention to it and had a scene discussing its aspects.)

The actual end of season 1 ruined the end of season 1.

Bingo, exactly.

Agreed but I would add there were a number of other things that contributed as well.

Very true. Apart from the Riker/Troi episode and maybe the first two episodes, the entire season was a thundering failure for me.

I think their main mistake was they tried to do WAY too much. Almost as if their main story just couldn’t fill up 10 episodes so they threw in a bunch of other stuff to pad it out. Stuff that ultimately went unfulfilled because they had to get back to their main idea. Also, and I guess this is more me than anyone else, I really wanted to see Picard a broken man. Maybe because he was on the wrong side of a call or made some tremendous mistake. But there was none of that here. They tried to present him as broken but he wasn’t broken because of anything he did or believed. He was still right. I think it would have been much better if Star Fleet followed his lead and it turned out to be devastatingly wrong. I wanted him to make a mistake. Be human. But we didn’t get that.

Again, I have to fundamentally disagree. While narratively it was odd and in some ways deflates certain elements, I think it sets the stage for some very interesting stories, and in that sense, it works very well.

The problem I had with it is is that it ended too abruptly. Some time to let the effects of that ending be felt were sorely needed.

No disrespect intended to anyone who liked it, but my feeling is that if it works only in the way it sets up something else — and not as its own thing — then it doesn’t work. For my money, it is a failure to live up to TNG’s legacy, it is a failure in its own right, AND it is already proving to be something they are seemingly going to just ignore going forward. It’s all fail, every bit of it. Not just as regards Picard, either; they had an opportunity to correct Data’s poor handling in “Nemesis,” and crapped their pants while fumbling the ball instead.

In my opinion, of course.

It’s weird though that he still has his beard. I wonder what’s the story with that.

Sounds like they are getting the band back together! :)

Pretty exciting. Even more so now that Guinan will be back too. Maybe they will explore her own backstory and exactly why her and Q are enemies. I just rewatched Encounter at Farpoint yesterday. Haven’t seen it over a decade and I forgot how much he annoyed Picard right out of the gate. But back then, pretty much anything annoyed Picard lol.

Just PLEASE be better than season 1. That’s all I’m asking at this point.

I hope that if they DO explore that backstory, it’s subtle and only hinted a bit more than what we already know. Not interested in seeing a “stop the episode in its tracks for an unnecessary exposition dump” kind of thing. Some things work best when they are left a mystery. Cough *augment virus* cough.

You’d think with the extra 8 (?) months writing time, it would have to be better, right? I hope so.

I wouldn’t make that assumption.

Yeah I hope so too. At the very least come up with your ending BEFORE you start shooting which Goldsman said in an interview last week is what they didn’t do in season one….and we have to wonder why it sucked so badly. ;)

I still wonder if the shooting before finishing writing is has been a choice by Secret Hideout or a problem with CBS’ funding model…

Clearly, with COVID there was no option but to wait. But I find it hard to believe that writers and showrunners would choose to have shows start shooting before the scripts were baked for the season.

CBS has in general struggled with serialization. Perhaps Covid + new senior execs for streaming post ViacomCBS merger are making it possible to do the logical thing.

I also wonder whether CBS “forced” them to start shooting before the whole season had been written. Trek seems to be a major driver of subscriptions to CBS All Access (now Paramount+), so there was probably some pressure to have each new season come out as early as possible.
As Trek is moving into several shows being produced in parallel there may be slightly more time allowed between finishing one season and starting the next, simply because they have other Trek shows to fill the break.

Hollywood Hack Akiva Goldsman ruins almost everything he touches.

Sometimes more time is just more time to overthink and overanalyze everything. As an artist, the worst habit I have when working on something is messing with it TOO MUCH and completely ruining a piece of art in the process. I learned in art school years ago to mark a piece complete and then not touch it again.

I understand completely. A part of my job is to create maps. It is VERY easy to overdo it. Often I have to force myself to stop or I will keep making small and subtle changes to the point where I don’t have a good map anymore.

Fantastic news!!

From pretty much the moment I first heard that Patrick Stewart would be returning to Star Trek for PIC, I started thinking about whether Q would show up at some point. Was so pleased to have this confirmed recently.

And now that he is returning, I want him to be absolutely and unapologetically……Q.

From de Lancie’s comments, it sounds like this will indeed be the case…and I couldn’t be happier :)

S1 of PIC was hit & miss for me. The injection of some Q-branded humour might be just what the show needs. With Q’s return, I can honestly say I’m now just as excited for this new season as I was for the first.

Oh, and Guinan returning too. Can’t wait! Like others have posted above, I’m hoping we’ll finally get to learn something more about her history with Q. Should make for an interesting story.

My guess is the second they got Patrick Stewart back in Star Trek again, Q was probably the second idea they had to bring back right after the Borg. I never doubted for a second Q would be back because of how popular and influential the character is. I’m very happy he’s back, but same time I do worry they will mess it up just like I thought how they did the Borg in season 1 sadly. So yes it can always be a careful what you wish for moment, but I want to stay positive.

And when you can spread something like Q across an entire season, you can do some crazy things with him. I’ve always wanted to see him in a movie because they have the budget to do whatever they want with him, but this is probably a much better idea….assuming its good of course.

I hear what you’re saying. There is always a risk in bringing back a popular character, especially in a new setting, and you can’t please everyone.

The sheer vibrancy of John de Lancie’s performances in the role though, just makes it so difficult for me to imagine Q’s return as anything less than spectacular.

I say this as someone who absolutely loved Q (in case that wasn’t obvious from my first post) and consider his appearances among my favourite things about Star Trek as a whole.

Getting to see de Lancie acting opposite Patrick Stewart once again, and for Picard to be reunited with his old nemesis after all these years, is definitely a wish-list item for me.

Even setting aside my rose-tinted Q-shaped spectacles for a (very brief) moment, the nature of the character could lead to some good storytelling options. I’m intrigued by some of the time travel theories that have been mentioned on this site lately.

If they WERE to mess this up somehow, I would be would be SO VERY disappointed. It’s probably as close as I’d get to understanding how those who REALLY dislike the new shows feel.

But hey, I’m an optomist, so can’t help but think only about the good things right now. Fingers crossed, this faith will be rewarded…

(I would have loved a Q movie too)

And I love your optimism! :)

Trust me, I feel just as much as you do about Q. Just by CRAZY coincidence, I watched Encounter at Farpoint yesterday. I don’t think I’ve watched it in over a decade easily, maybe even longer. I literally forgot what happened in some of the scenes. The episode is still ‘meh’ overall for me, but Q is still so much fun to watch. He is definitely more serious and deadly in his introduction, but there is still his humorous and even charming side that comes out, which clearly came from De Lancie. He just played that role so well, it’s no wonder he kept coming back….for 14 years lol. And now 20 years after THAT, he’s back again. Crazy.

That’s what I love about Star Trek, nothing ever truly dies in it anymore. And my guess by the time Kurtzman is done they’ll find a way to bring back the Kazon and set them up in multiple episodes. Wait come to think of it, they could be back in Prodigy lol. I just realized that. Oh my!

But to think Q himself only exists because they wanted the pilot to be two hours and Roddenberry just came up with that to sort of fill time and he ended creating one of his most iconic characters ever. Until I came to this board, I always thought Q was beloved overall. Obviously some people will not like him, but I never thought he was ‘divisive’ as a character. But I get why he is as well though.

But for people who ARE excited to see him back, yeah I’m really rooting for this one. They have a chance to go BIG in ways we haven’t seen in a long time. That’s why Q is so fun, you can imagine anything with him, so hopefully it will be something good and twisty!

All I can say is several weeks ago I was not really all that excited about Picard season 2 (and the show is my WORST show in the entire franchise currently…but we’re talking 10 episodes.). So I hope this really brings me back to the show and I love it like I assumed I would when it first started. Sadly Q can’t just snap his fingers and make me like everything in Star Trek as much as we want to.

Last edited 3 months ago by Tiger2

Yes, I’ve noticed from a few of your other posts that you’re doing a full re-watch. Quite an undertaking! I’d like to do the same myself at some point.

For now, I tend to pick a series at random. TNG was my introduction to Star Trek though, and is the one I have revisited the most over the years. Most recently was early last year.

Yes, I think they definitely tweaked the Q character over the years to best suit de Lancie’s skillset. But you’re right, all the elements were there (in some capacity) from that very first appearance.

Yep, 30+ years and still going strong. You can’t keep a good omnipotent being down :)

Completely agree. I would have watched S2 regardless, but wasn’t exactly over enthusiastic after S1. But now with the Q (and Guinan) news, I’m probably as excited for this as I am for SNW.

Yeah, it’s a lot of fun! I never would’ve thought to do it before, but since I’m home basically all day now (but that is slowly changing again) and work from home I have the time. But I didn’t really know if I would really stay focused on it because I seen this stuff so much already but surprisingly I’m still watching, at least one episode or movie a day. And I’m watching stuff I haven’t seen in so long. I talk about Trek so much that I feel I know most of the episodes really well. But I have realized just how many episodes I have been skipping for a very long time now, especially TOS. Some of them I didn’t even remember at all, which is crazy for someone whose been watching it since the early 80s. And I watched TAS for the first time ever.

The only show I have rewatched from beginning to end in the last decade is DS9, which is my favorite (but TNG is my second). I rewatched DIS last year but that doesn’t really count. Like you, I just watched most episodes randomly from any of the classic shows. That is the other issue though, rewatching the newer stuff like DIS and PIC is not as fun because it is so serialized. And in my opinion only, they haven’t been very good either. DIS is improving though and season 3 is easily my favorite one so far.

So I’m really hoping Picard knocks it out of the park next season. If you have Q for an entire season just to be a big let down, I don’t know if I can recover. So this has to be good or at least better. I do think it will be and I love the new showrunner. I watched his old show 12 Monkeys and it was amazing from beginning to end! So here’s hoping!

Last edited 3 months ago by Tiger2

Sorry for the late reply (busy few days).

Sounds like you’re doing well so far. And your two favourite shows up next, should make it easier to stick with it.

Yes, it’s always a good feeling when you discover a new/forgotten episode of something you enjoy isn’t it? Even if that episode turns out not to be the best.

What did you think of TAS then?

Yes, I completely agree. I always feel as though I have to commit to the entire thing when considering a rewatch of a serialised show. It feels odd to just randomly watch part 9 of 15 or 11 of 13 etc. A bit like reading a single chapter in a book.

There are a few exceptions. I think you were part of a conversation earlier in this thread which mentioned a couple of the more ‘stand-alone’ episodes of DIS. I too have watched (and enjoyed) them more than the others.

One thing is certain, if they pull it off like I’m hoping they will, I’ll have no problem setting aside time for a rewatch of an entire Q-focused S2 of PIC :)

Hey there, no worries!

And I apologize for THIS being so late as well because I haven’t looked at this thread probably since I posted this. Just decided to see if there were any new comments and here I am.

I’m now currently at the end of season 2 of TNG and have to say I’m even enjoying that season a lot more now. It’s amazing how easy it is to watch episodes again I thought I was going to dread rewatching but it’s been the opposite. I’ve just forgotten so many of them, but they are pretty decent overall. I’m rethinking my feelings of the first two seasons of TNG now.

And from season 3 on is going to be SO much fun to watch (although I’ve seen a lot of those episodes in the last few years, but still many I have not in a long time). But that is the thing about the rewatch, you get caught up in it and you just want to keep watching more and more. And I notice even when I stumble upon a truly bad episode, the next episode after that is usually decent to great a lot of the times. That’s why the episodic format worked so well in Trek, it’s just easier to watch because the next episode will be totally different than the stinker you probably just finished and starting over to something else.

As for TAS, again, another surprise! I’ll be VERY honest, when I watched the first few episodes I didn’t think I could get through first season lol. The animation is just SO bad!!! And the dialogue, ugh, very very dated. But again, something happened, around episode 6 or 7, I REALLY started to enjoy it. Once you get over the bad production and focus on the stories themselves it does become a lot of fun. I just love the types of stories they told. Very creative in many ways and while the animation is dreadful, it could show what TOS could’ve been in terms of presenting more alien characters and locations if it had a bigger budget. Now there are definitely stinkers for sure and some truly out there stories (like meeting Satan in the middle of the galaxy lol). I doubt I’ll ever watch them again, but I’m glad I finally gave it a chance at least and FINALLY understand all the TAS references I been missing all this time. ;)

Doing this rewatch has made me really appreciate Star Trek in a way I haven’t in a long time. It’s just amazing how so many of the shows holds up for me. And stuff I thought was once really bad is a lot better after a lot of time has gone and yes probably appreciating the types of stories we use to get as opposed to the newer stuff, which I do like, but just not at the level of classic Trek.

But still looking forward to all the new shows of course and yes Picard season 2 is now on the top of the list beyond all of them. SNW comes after that!

Last edited 2 months ago by Tiger2

But It’s NOT Picard – it’s a simulation, the golem, of the memories and life experiences of Picard – Picard is DEAD, He died, he’s gone to the afterlife – and all that is left is a copy of his brain patterns who thinks he’s Picard. Will the show explore what LIFE means, Where is Picard’s Soul? “I think therefor I am” – this brings up more issues than Data’s longing for Humanity and it’s understanding ever did.

Q isn’t stupid – he’s going to know a COPY from the real thing (and we know he would have the ability to bring Picard back from the dead…think about that one..or make THIS Picard “Alive and Real Flesh and Blood”)

…or Q doesn’t care and is glad to still have “a” Picard to annoy the heck out of!

THIS is the big issue – the true Human Adventure to explore – a Picard who is no longer Human (or the REAL Picard – but a copy) continuing to go toe-to-toe with Q defending Humanity he’s not longer a part of.

Oh, Gene Roddenberry would have REALLY Loved this!

Is that your interpretation of Julian Tainer, too? Because “Inheritance” pretty much directly states that she is the exact same person before and after her death/transition to the android body. The ONLY difference between Tainer and Picard is Picard’s awareness of what happened to him. I fail to see how he is not the same person because his physical matter is different.

Ironically, you quote Descartes, who argues that the essence of a thing is not physical at all. :)

Sadly this is the reason why it was a mistake to do this with Picard, because there are going to be endless arguments if it’s really him or not for probably years to come. People are still arguing if the Kelvin movies ‘overwritten’ the Prime universe even though the writers made it clear long ago that was never the case and we have direct proof due to all the new shows like DIS and PIC…and yet it still persists.

Just imagine how long this will keep up! Sigh

Yeah, that is me who still is arguing that the Kelvin timeline has overwritten the old timeline from the point when Nero disappeared. Same as in Back to the future or yesterdays Enterprise.

Vulcan still exists in the 24th and 32nd century. I mean, yeah.

That’s a philosophical question but then we can go waaay back to the beginning of the series and question if someone is the same person after being transported!? To get beamed, the transporter has to destroy the body and put it again at another place. After being materialized the person has the same memories, but IS IT the same person? Is it the same consciousness? One could argue that being transported into a Golem is no different in that point of view than being beamed.

The transporter argument is invalid as they have established quantum entanglement – mater turned into Energy and the Energy is sent to the location and turned back into matter – THE SAME MATTER – nothing is lost, destroyed, copied – just turned from one state to another back to the first state. Both TNG and ENTERPRISE has episodes that confirm this factor.

Picard is still Picard. New body, same old mind and soul. That’s why Soji told Picard that he was real as soon as he woke up.

Doesn’t everyone who uses a transporter die and get artificially reassembled at their destination? It kind of happens a lot in Star Trek. I don’t see much difference.

Picard has been a copy ever since he first used a transporter. If you believe in concepts like a “soul” that was destroyed the first time he was disintegrated into energy, sent to a different place, and put back together from energy. And he has been copied over and over again.
Now, it’s just a different kind of copy.

It is more like: You take apart a jigsaw puzzle, put it in an envelope and send it to a friend. If the friend puts it together again, is it the same puzzle or just a copy?

Except it isn’t. In enganglement, there isn’t any means of transport of the origonal matter. Location A blinks out of existance the instant Location B blinks into existance. I understand that this quantum experiment was successfully completed in Europe a couple years back. One of the problems being, it pretty much took the combined power output of the continent to entangle an atom from one lab to another.

Something I haven’t thought of before, if you are being phycically dissembled to be beamed somewhere, I’d think the pain that the process of being ripped apart (and reassembled) at the atomic level would be fatal.

Last edited 3 months ago by Phil

I kinda feel like in spite of that probable reality we just have to accept the transporter as a means of travel that does NOT make new people every time. Just for the sake of being able to watch the show. Best not to get too deep into such things. Like relativity. Starship time and such. Just don’t deal with it and treat it as if relativity isn’t a thing.

Well, if people want to argue that Picard isn’t Picard anymore because his “soul” couldn’t be transferred into his new body, which makes him nothing but a cheap copy of his former self, then they have to also acknowledge that Picard has actually been a cheap copy of his former self ever since he first used a transporter.

Not if one accepts that the transporter is not a copy machine and just a means of transferring. Someone traveling via transporter (at least in the context of the show) is no more different than someone walking off an airplane after a 5 hour flight.

I believe Trek has thrown in with transporter being a ‘means of transfer’ device. I don’t recall the name of the episode, but Barkley was having to deal with seeing others trapped in transporter transference. Memory of the transport does imply a process of being disassembled….which should still be incredibly painful, particularly so if consciousness remained intact.

Yeah, I know. Just accept that it works..

That was one of the joys of TOS. Nobody spent time explaining things. Warp drive just worked. Impulse drive just worked. Artificial gravity just worked. Transporters just worked. I get there’s a production design aesthetic, but actively introducing the technobabble bulls**t episodes didn’t enhance the final product. I do hope that SNW’s resists the urge to explain things with fake science and engineering.

Precisely. It was enough to know that the transporters and warp drive worked within the rules established in the show. Explaining the science behind those things rarely made episodes better.

I hate to break it to you, but with real life quantum teleportation, the matter is not actually transferred — only the quantum state of the matter in question. The electrons, protons, and neutrons stay exactly where they were, but the quantum states of A and B are switched. (However, there is an upside to this, as it means we would never have to deal with “the disassembly failed, go kill the other you” type sci-fi story, due to the No Cloning Theorem.)

That being said, Trek thankfully doesn’t specify entanglement or quantum teleportation being involved.

Rather, the matter is pulled apart and structured into a one-atom-wide beam called the “matter stream”, which is aimed and controlled to deposit those atoms in another location. Like an atomic fidelity 3D printer, where the matter stream is the nozzle. It is textually the exact same matter being moved with the transporter, rather than synthesised anew.

I’m hoping Guinan prevails in any Guinan/Q contest.

Even in an arm wrestling? Hot dog eating contest?

So Q is going to be played like having a mid eternity crisis?

I feel like he’s always been played as having a mid eternity crisis.

Hahahahaha 😂😂😂😂 MID-ETERNITY!!!!! That suggests that even eternity has an end…

“Alles hat ein Ende nur die Wurst hat zwei”
-Albert Einstein-

All of this absolutely delicious!

Picard should of died at the end of season 1…and as he enters the afterlife….he sees Q….that would of been a better ending to last year leading into this new season lol

That does make it a bit hard to deliver several seasons of Picard that the CBS folks promised….

That ending would have just come out of nowhere and had nothing to do with the first season. The season was about androids and how they really aren’t all that different from organic beings. Putting Picard in an android body makes sense as an ending for that story. Having Q pop up to take him to the afterlife (again) wouldn’t have connected at all to the story.

There were so many blind alleys in S1 that I find it difficult to nail down what the main theme of S1 really was.

And if what you suggested is indeed what the season was trying to say then they were very wrong. Androids are indeed VERY different from organic beings.

Obviously there are differences, but in all the ways that are important they are the same.

Well… I could not disagree more with that assessment. In the important ways they are not the same at all.

i love the way hes dropping spoilers on this Cameo thing..its like hes trolling Picard (the character, the actor, and the show) in a very Q like manner

They would never do it, because it would be a cheap trick, and Shatner is far too old, but once you bring Q into the equation, he could simply snap his fingers and bring James T. Kirk back to life. Have TPTB use the same de-aging technology used in The Irishman and make Kirk look how he did in Generations. Give Trekkies the happy ending they’ve all been waiting for. Now there would be a Season 2 of Picard for the books!
Nah, too shmaltzy by half!

Have you caught any episodes of Shatners’ unXplained? He was wheezing his way through his narration last season, now they have him on a stool in season two, and he’s still huffing and puffing his way through his dialogue.

Before the indignant sputter “what about Senior Moment?”, that was shot four years ago.

Phil, I agree with you. That ship has sailed.

If you’re on a budget and in dire need of a Star Trek Cameo, your best bet is a Daniel Davis (Moriarty) at a very tempting 30 bucks.

So does Q use his powers to make himself look old to mock Picard’s aging? Or will they write in he lost his powers after the events of Voyager for some reason and he has aged 20 years without his powers…….. It will be one or the other.

There are only two characters in Star Trek that are so annoying, I just skip the episode…. The “Grand Nagus” and “Q”… I thought the whole idea was to go in different directions…

I love Zek and Q. They can both make even a bad episode watchable.

Have to agree. In addition to Q, Zek was another character whose appearances I always looked forward to. Always good fun.

Not liking Zek? Inconceivable!

(This is just a joke/reference, for those of you at home who can’t perceive my tongue in my cheek.)

Seeing De Lancie saying that Q has a stint coming made my heart leap with excitement! I feel like writers have had, and still have a huge treasure trove of potential there, still ready to dig up! It will be so hard to wait until season 2’s premiere, to see where they will go, with the story line!! I can’t wait!!

I haven’t really been watching Picard, yet, as I find it difficult to see him being so old. But now of late hearing of all the old crew returning… and especially Q!! I didn’t like him at the time, but when re-watching TNG and Voyager I grew to love him! Brilliant actor and so much fun!
And Guinan. She HAS to come back!