Shatner Discusses Latest Rumors [UPDATED - More Video From Shatner] October 18, 2007
by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Shatner, Star Trek (2009 film) , trackbackThe following ShatnerVision video was shot Thursday afternoon
UPDATE: See Part 2 Below
So there you have it. Just as reported by TrekMovie.com yesterday Shatner is still not in the movie - and it appears he doesn’t expect to be in the movie. In the video Shatner was talking about the latest story on Hollywood.com which was from the WENN entertainment news wire service. After WENN put out the latest rumor TrekMovie.com confirmed again today that no definitive decision has been made regarding Shatner. WENN are probably just picking up on the AICN rumor. Remember WENN are the same outfit that made up the ‘Tom Cruise will be in Star Trek’ rumor (which TrekMovie.com also debunked). And no this is not some elaborate prank or hoax…he simply is not in the movie. However, there is still a chance that he might be. Hopefully by the end of this month there will be some kind of definitive statement one way or the other regarding this whole thing.
Comments»
first - i guess
i dont usually post but i really hope shatner is in this movie. I would love to see nimoy and shatner together one more time. i do not understand wha the plot of this movie will be but there should be a way. I do not want a rehash of generation though leave that horrible movie alone
Maybe spock could partner with Uhura to save kirk somehow off the walls uggestions but i would love to see thsoe two as well
BOOOOOO!!!!
:-(
Unfortunate. Only time and the creative minds behind this and future Trek projects will tell whether Shatner as Kirk is finished. All good things… In any event, I have confidence that Pine will be be a fine successor.
It would be great to get off the fence about this. As good as this film my turn out to be, without Mr. Shatner, there would be a big, and very hard hole to deal with. Either way, I’m so looking forward to Dec 2008
Still hoping.
Vinceman
I have loved Trek since childhood as well as in my grown up years and i say it is an outrage to have Leonard Nimoy in the film but not William Shatner. Kirk is arguably the most popular character in the franchise and to leave Shatner out in the cold on this is beyond ridiculous.
So, basically we have to go through this for another several weeks until it’s clear one way or the other.
What do you suppose Shatner’s point in continually making these announcements is if 1) the issue isn’t settled and 2) there’s not a conspiracy between him and the producers to hype up an already-done deal?
This little bit of video is a remarkably fast turn-around on rumor control regarding an unsourced bit of business like the WENN report, after all.
The blinking White House doesn’t do spin this quickly.
If they hire Shatner, there goes the money for the Iceland location shooting! It’ll be cycloramas and styrofoam rocks all around! Plus they’ll have to spring for hazel contacts for Pine.
Seriously…I’d love to see Shatner in the film, however they want to do it, storywise. It’s not a demand, just a fan’s fond wish. Once more unto the breach, dear friends…
Scott B. out.
UGH! JJ Abrams — WHY?
It just makes me sad to watch that clip :-( Poor William Shatner. It’s kind of disappointing and puts me off when I see this. His presence isn’t there at all apparently, and apparently no support of Chris Pine as Kirk either. It makes me wonder if they even asked him what he thought about it.
There are always possibilities…
I guess I’m a bit disappointed that Shatner seems to close the door on being in this movie in a cameo role. He seems to be saying either give me a big starring role like Nimoy, or I’m not interested.
That’s a shame because I myself would like to see him, and the other surviving TOS members, take one final curtain call in the next Trek film.
Swallow your pride Shat and take a cameo role if it’s offered to you!
Mike :o
#7 - Dennis -
I think Shatner’s ego is what is driving these announcements. I’d love to think this is all a media game, trying to convince fans Shatner is not in the film, then suddenly the BIG ANNOUNCEMENT that he IS in it.
I don’t think the latter is the case at all.
I’m speculating that Spock will appear in the beginning of the new film and will recount the early days of the Enterprise and her crew. He’ll probably will be giving some lecture to academy students - ripple dissolve to……
Knowing how upsetting this will be If he is NOT in the movie, do you think that Paramount would risk insulting, William Shatner, or the fans by excluding him? Remenber, if there is ever a chance at bringing him back it has to be now, not in part II, or III. If I was the Shat i’d offer them a fair price now, and if they decline, to hell with ‘em. Next movie charge them triple.
To whom this may concern,
William Shatner IS James T. Kirk. He made the character what it is, and he is the only person in the universe that can pass the torch to his counterpart. Anything less would be a disgrace.
Hailing frequencies ‘closed.
#8: I can live without Iceland…lol… But I can’t live without SHATNER!!!
SHATNER = $$$$$$$$
Regardless of what it costs to get him in, the movie will make tons more just for him being in it. You don’t go cheap on a dime when it brings you back in a buck, now do you?
Shatner means more to S.T. than J.J. Abrams vision of the project.
If the man wants into this film he should be given a role. Especially when you consider that Nimoy is being brought back.
There is no reason Shatner is not in this film + don’t give me the “we can’t find a role worthy of him” crap.
They simply don’t want him + they are shutting the door on many,many people who want to see him in this film.
This news is very upsetting.
There is still time to get Shatner in. There is no excuse if he is not included.
#15:”Knowing how upsetting this will be If he is NOT in the movie, do you think that Paramount would risk insulting, William Shatner, or the fans by excluding him?”
Paramount, as in the people running the studio?
Yes, of course they would.
Studios said “no” to much bigger actors than him, after all. Did you notice that Shatner explicitly described this as “a business decision?”
There’s no way for most of us to know, right now, whether or what limits there may be on the producers with regard to negotiating with Shatner. The assumption that Abrams and company have the wherewithal to simply decree that whatever Shatner Wants, Shatner Gets may correlate with the truth - or, it may not.
BTW, i don’t think Shatner expects to have as big a part as Nimoy in this film, since he knows his character ‘died’ in the last film he was in. I do think he expects to have a memorable role in the film though, and his resurrection at the end of the film will be just that.
Look at “Khan” in ST II…. He really wasn’t on screen all that much, but he was mentioned by name throughout the entire film. Same will probably go for Shatner’s Kirk in this film.
#7 Dennis Bailey
What do you think his motives are? You don’t seem to be taking him at face value.
Am I missing something?
Where are these rumors of his return coming from?
#9
Oh give me a break. I love Shatner too, but he’s being INCREDIBLY unfair here. Yes it’s “science fiction,” but these new writers shouldn’t feel obligated to completely rework their story just to undo the mistakes that were made in someone ELSE’S movie!
If they HAVE found a way to fit him in, fine. But I’m really getting sick of everybody here acting like Shatner is some poor, innocent victim being disrespected and spit upon by JJ Abrams.
He already made his bed by agreeing to be killed off in Generations. No one forced him to be in it, and he read the script beforehand. It’s not Abrams or the new writer’s fault that the movie sucked.
What’s gets me about this is the ongoing, seemingly never-ending uncertainty, particularly on the part of Shatner himself. I just find it really hard to believe that Shatner would be so far out of the loop about something like this as he professes to be. Even if he really isn’t in it, it’s almost inconceivable to me that J.J. Abrams–or Nimoy for that matter–wouldn’t have at least given him a definitive answer about it by now. And if they really are still trying to find a way to include him, it’s hard to believe he wouldn’t know something about THAT. This movie starts filming next month and it just seems like everyone involved is being too coy by half over the whole involvement–or lack thereof–of Shatner. If I were him and these guys were just using me to stretch out the the suspense and garner extra publicity, I’d be pissed.
Could the hold up be money? Shatner may want to invoke favored nations clause to match Nimoy’s paycheck…yet Nimoy as Spock presumably has a much larger role. Rumored plot involving Spock going back in time to stop the Romulans from killing young Kirk would leave open the possibility of seeing old Kirk at the end…and that may be the “cameo” that Shatner isn’t satisfied with. J.J. Abrams on record as wanting Shatner. Isn’t it about time we heard definitively from J.J. or Mr. Orci??
#18:”#7 Dennis Bailey
What do you think his motives are? You don’t seem to be taking him at face value.
Am I missing something?”
I don’t have answers; just questions and hypotheses . In terms of “missing something” - yeah, don’t you think there are big pieces of this puzzle that aren’t being communicated (for their own good reasons) by Shatner OR the producers OR the people running the studio?
Cost? Hell, I’m willing to watch a guy in a Gorn costume with a zipper up his back if the Shat can be factored into the movie!
Make the deal for more appeal!!
Shat is acting here. This clip seems like a cunning bit of improv to me. i think we’re being put on…for fun and to protect a surprise.
It seems very Spinal Tapish, doesnt it? anyone?
I think he knows he has a part (of some kind) in this film…but they are keeping it tight lipped. so much so as to have Bill deny any knowledge.
im not usually one for conspiracy theories…but something seems fishy here. the woman doing the interview seems a little TOO uninformed.
#20: “If I were him and these guys were just using me to stretch out the the suspense and garner extra publicity, I’d be pissed.”
Shatner is not a victim in “stretching out the suspense” or in whatever negotiations may be happening. He’s a participant.
The women is his daughter and clearly knows the answers to the questions before she asked them.
Why is he trying to get this news out to the public so soon after the rumors broke?
That, of course, is the other possibility: That Shatner was offered a role but not one that was big enough or high-paying enough to meet his demands. I have always liked Shatner but the man does have ego to spare and I wouldn’t entirely put it past him. If there really is some negotiating going on and it doesn’t pan out, I imagine we’ll find out why eventually.
Dennis:
What does your gut tell you about what is going on?
Do you think in the end Shatner will be in the film?
I’m confused + a little upset at this point.
24. That’s Shat’s daughter Elizabeth doing the interview.
If Nimoy and Shatner are such pals as both profess, Shatner’s gotta know more than he’s telling.
There are two sides to this….
and his side is the only one talking at the moment. I think he’s still negotiating, not liking what he’s being offered and in response is acting a little disappointed and making people feel bdd for him, trying to drag the movie down.
People will still flock to this film if done well.
The thing that militates against this whole thing being a false controversy cooked up between Shatner and the producers to generate publicity for the eventual announcement of his participation - which a few people at various sites have hinted at - is that if one presumes that the “right thing to do” is to sign him then the current “strategy” consists of casting the producers and the project in a negative light on Shatner’s behalf.
That’s not clever publicity; it would be self-destructive on the part of the producers.
So whatever’s going on, I tend not to think that it’s something that’s been gamed between the parties for our benefit.
#25: “Shatner is not a victim in “stretching out the suspense” or in whatever negotiations may be happening. He’s a participant.”
That was basically my point, that if things are as we’ve been led to believe then Abrams and the powers that be–and Nimoy!–are all showing Shatner some pretty serious disrespect, which just doesn’t make sense unless he did something to deserve it… or it’s all just a massive disinformation campaign.
I believe ‘the woman’ doing the interview is, in fact, Shatner’s daughter, is she not? Not exactly a hard hitting journalist, I’d imagine. Also, the main venue for these videos is Shatner’s official website. On which things are sold. So, as horribly capitalistic as it may sound, there are very good reasons for these videos to be made (traffic) other than as a massive disinformation campaign.
#19 David J..
BINGO!
you beat me to those basic points..thanks.
#28: “What does your gut tell you about what is going on?
Do you think in the end Shatner will be in the film?”
Gee, just out of the blue sky I think that when apparently simple things get this complicated to explain it’s almost always actually about The Money.
What the circumstances surrounding that are in this case, I have no idea of. We could sit here and fabricate three or four plausible scenarios and one might turn out to have some truth to it, but we’d be guessing nonetheless.
And in the end…I have no idea whether Shatner will be in it. I do suspect that if *he* knew for sure, one way or the other, that video wouldn’t be on ShatnerVision right now.
Eh, I could care less if Shatner is in this movie or not. I’ve never been a fan of his even though I love the TOS (Spock and McCoy were by far my favorite characters, much more so than Kirk). I find it arrogant of him to just brush his death in “Generations” aside and say since it’s Science Fiction, they should just come up with some contrived way to bring him back.
He got paid to be in Generations, and he agreed to the death scene. The script that’s written for this movie doesn’t involve him. If they can find a way to work Shatner into the movie that isn’t disruptive to the story and adds to it, that’s great, but if they can’t come up with a way to do it,, then let them make the movie as it is.
He’ll be in it, I’m telling you. It’s a major story point and they don’t want the resolution known until the end. Remember, “Nimoy as Spock” was NEVER announced when “The Search For Spock” was being produced.
So, hypothetically, the uncertainty of all this might be attributable to ongoing negotiations or a dispute over money or the size of the role or whatever, except THEY’RE A FREAKIN’ MONTH AWAY FROM FILMING! If so, I hope they wrote TWO scripts, one with Shatner and one without, because I’d hate to think they’d have to scramble for what I assume would be a pretty major rewrite either way at this late date.
I remember that very well - and the non-announcement was pretty much done with a wink at the fans. It was *not* a successfully-kept big secret that Spock would show up by the end of that movie.
Really, the idea that the producers plan to keep Shatner’s participation a secret for the next YEAR by going along with him occasionally whipping his fans up into resentful snits against the movie because of his being “shut out” is ridiculous.
Look, two things:
1) If Shatner is in the movie and knows that for sure, he has no reason to encourage disappointment or anger on the part of his fans a few weeks before production starts (and likely no more than a few days before the announcement of his participation).
2) If Shatner *isn’t* in the movie and knows that for sure…well, he doesn’t seem like the kind of person who sulks in public about his career and business affairs.
Either way, there’d be no reason for him to put this video out today if the the situation were completely settled. There’ve been rumors off and on for weeks about whether he’s in it or not, so the fact that there happened to be one reported on WENN and AICN in the last day or two isn’t really something he’d need to jump on.
For Dennis;
Bill isn’t on Ain’t it cool news posting comments that he is in the movie and then having a flurry of news reports online trumpet it based on that one little comment as if it was gospel.
As for WHY it was done today; I was scheduled to film Bill today and the timing of the Pine signing and these news stories were just timely. If you don’t believe me go to the WilliamShatner.com board and see my post asking fans what Burning issues they have as I was going to be filming the next segment of ShatnerVision.
The double edged sword in this is; i Bill doesn’t comment on the movie rumours - fans post he’s hiding something and think he’s definitely in the movie
We post a defacto, definitive video saying “No he’s not” and fans still post that he’s ego driven to be in the movie or that it’s some big charade and he really is not in the movie.
It’s ultimately a game that can’t be won. With ShatnerVision we give the audience what they want and leave it to you to interpret but I think it’s pretty clear that as of 1PM PT today - William Shatner did not consider himself to be in the movie.
Why isn’t Ain’t It Cool putting a huge story up? Didn’t they scoop everyone in this? Instead it’s a footnote commentary on the Pine announcement and there’s been NOTHING else since.
Maybe because Bill Shatner is NOT in the movie???
That would be a real revelation; wouldn’t it?
So, you’re saying definitively that this is settled and that no conversations are going on at all between Shatner and anyone at Paramount about this movie?
He’s not going to be in it? Period?
Or, “as far as *I* know, he doesn’t consider himself to be in it as of today and I’m not privy to whatever his business conversations are with *anyone*?”
I really doubt this is just an act by Shatner. We’ve all seen Shatner be coy and evasive in interviews before. He’ll say stuff like “Well, I can’t really say, but you never know…”, all the while having a little grin on his face and winking at the camera.
Something odd is going on here.
Why would Shatner care about some rumors hitting the media about his appearance in this film?
He clearly has some type of motive for putting this video (and others like it)
on his site.
That is his daughter throwing him those softball questions that he WANTS to answer for some reason.
There are several possibilities here:
a) Shatner was not offered a role (that would be ashame) and he is using his site to rally his fans to get the producers attention.
b) He was not offered a big part + feels slighted.
c) He was offered a part that is nothing more than a cameo that will not offer him a big check + he is playing hardball with the producers over money.
d) He is lying to protect the fact that he will be in the film. Perhaps in a cameo at the end that will reveal Kirk survived the nexus + provide the big emotional end to the film.
I highly doubt that Shatner + the producers are doing this to drum up publicity as some had mentioned. If they wanted to do that why not simply have a press conference that would be a media circus. So I would pretty much rule (d) out
To me the two most likely scenarios are.
1/ They haven’t asked him to be in the movie yet (Anthony said that a decision has yet to be made) + he is truly upset over this + is using his site to rally his fanbase. If this is true (not saying it is) shame on them.
2/ He is playing hardball about money as he did with the producers of Enterprise. If this is true (not saying it is) shame on him.
The truth may be somewhere in the middle. It is always tough to read Shatner + his motives, but why respond now within 24 hours of the rumors breaking?
I believe Anthony when he says that a decision has not been made about Shatner. I also believe Herc at AICN when he says Shatner is in the film.
I think this may mean that a cameo has been written for Shatner, but he wants a bigger role (he mentioned he doesn’t do cameo’s in the video) and more money.
Ultimately this is all guess work on my part.
I hope it can all be worked out and we get to see Shatner as Kirk one more time. If it is simply the writers not finding a part for him that is pretty weak.
If Shatner is holding out over money that is equally weak.
Guys (I’m talking to all of you Mr. Shatner, writers, producers) lets get this done. The Kirk character is bigger than all of you.
And another thing just occurred to me… If this whole Shatner thing really is just a massive disinformation campaign, if he really is sitting there and bald-faced lying to the camera, then all bets are off. Absolutely everything we think we know about this film, probably excluding the casting announcements, could be fake, which I have to admit wouldn’t totally surprise me.
Not so long ago, I teamed up with Anthony on releasing an April Fools Day design sketch of the Enterprise for Trek XI, which was specifically designed to tweak the fans in all the ways I knew woud get the best rise out of them, and it succeeded beyond my wildest expectations. I’ve been thinking for a while now that time traveling Romulans from the future, uber villains named Nero and other such things had a decidedly similar tweakish feel to them. Abrams strikes me as the kind of guy who, more than just being secretive, might just make it a primary endeavor of the film production to throw everyone COMPLETELY off the track of what he is really doing. The whole Shatner thing could be part and parcel of that.
Or not. Who the hell knows?
when did this site become a conspiracy theory hangout?
sometimes a cigar is just a cigar
The guy’s knows this business damn well… He knows how to play his cards right… And he’s upping the ante. He’s more of a tactician than Kirk ever was. He knows this mess about him being in the movie or not has a direct influence on the movie’s success. Just look at all the posts it generates here.
Either that or the rumors are true and he’s already signed to be in the movie.
Either way, he’s got one hell of a poker face…
He should have been in politics.
It would be a big loss for the movie not to have him in it. The day they officially announce he’s not in it, they’ll be loosing half their audience.
Google Ads revenues for this site will also drop dramatically.
A Star Trek movie IGNORING Shatner’s interest to be in it… is NOT a Star Trek movie.
It’s like Harrison Ford being ignored for a Indiana Jones movie or Sylvester Stallone for a Rocky movie. In fact… it’s even worse!
Come on Paramount, do you really want to invest that much money on this reasoning? If I was head of Paramount I’d halt production until the script has a decent place for Shatner.
Their best cash cow has plunged steadily since Kirk’s death. Now they have a chance to fix that and start fresh at the same time.
It just makes no sense to exclude him. Bad business decision… It looks more like someone pulling the ropes has a score to settle with Shatner and enjoys humiliating him for personal reasons.
Would you change director, change scriptwriters or exclude Shatner to make a Star Trek movie? The answer seems obvious to me… Get a new script if you have to, get a new director if you have to… But Shatner and Nimoy have to be in the movie, as do the other surviving actors.
Shareholders should smell the coffee… This is just more of the same nonsense management that has tainted Star Trek in the last 10 years.
It’s as simple as that… no respect for Shatner… no 10 bucks from me and many more. But hey… I guess some people like to bet risky.
And if it IS just a cigar, so be it, but how hard is it really for the people involved here to make up their minds and agree on whether it is or isn’t? Are we to believe that Shatner couldn’t just pick up the phone, call JJ and say, “Look, am I in it or not? I’m starting to look like an idiot out here and so are you, so what’s the deal?”And JJ wouldn’t tell him?
I honestly have no idea whether it’s a disinformation campaign, a conspiracy, a high-level ego feud or just a freakin’ cigar. All I DO know is that it’s weird.
#46:”It would be a big loss for the movie not to have him in it. The day they officially announce he’s not in it, they’ll be loosing half their audience.”
Not nearly that many.
“If I was head of Paramount I’d halt production until the script has a decent place for Shatner.”
It appears that the “head(s) of Paramount” have a different take on the situation based on their experiences.
Dennis, how much clearer of a comment do you need?
I’m the one who brought the hollywood.com story to the shoot (you can hear my voice in the video) don’t you think that if it was a contrived piece that Bill and his daughter would know where the story came from?
The way we shoot ShatnerVision is that I bring a set of topics I would like to see covered and Lisabeth sorts them out and asks them. The agreement is that if Bill doesn’t want to talk about it; we move on (that’s never happened, btw) and what you are seeing and hearing on the video is the answer from Bill after hearing the question for the first time. We don’t do retakes; it’s all very candid and raw.
When he says he’s not heard any offer and with fiming starting next month and presumably rehearsals starting in the next few weeks; it doesn’t look like they want him.
Again, you didn’t even address the Aint it cool comment - where is their BIG story??? It’s all out there now, isn’t it? So tell me why it was a footnote and not a lead story.
In tomorrow’s ShatnerVision video; Bill continues the conversation and talks about why he feels that it is a poor business move not putting him in the movie.
Somehow if Paramount were courting him; I don’t think he’d want to talk about that.
#43
On the contrary, when I watch these interviews I get the impression Shatner isn’t all that INTERESTED in talking about the movie. He always seems totally unenthused, and has this look on his face, like “oh lord, here we go again with a question about the new Star Trek movie.”
Yeah I’m sure on SOME level he’d probably like to be involved, but he’s already got a great role in a hit TV show, he’s winning emmy’s left and right, and in his mind he’s moved ON with his life. Star Trek was a great gig but I don’t think he’s nearly as obsessed with it as we fans like to think he is.
That’s what I see from him when I watch these interviews anyway.
I am going to take Mr Shatner at his word when he says he has not been asked to be in the movie. At least as of now.
If Mr. Shatner is not asked back when he clearly wants to be involved there is something wrong with the mind set of the writers + producers of this film.
I also believe Anthony when he says that his sources tell him a decision has yet to be made one way or the other.
My answer to that is why don’t they just pick up the phone + tell Mr Shatner this? If we know this why doesn’t he?
Mr. Shatner’s video was upsetting for many longtime ST fans.
If this really is as definitive an end to the question of Shatner’s involvement as Paul thinks it is, then great - let’s move on.
Everyone agrees that this is settled and that Shatner is definitely not going to be in the movie? Anthony? Mr. Orci?
Or…something else?
#45, Really? Then why are some flying saucers described as ‘cigar-shaped’? And then covered up?! It’s a conspiracy I tell you!!! :p
#51
My take on the writers and producers (and this is just a personal opinion) is that why wouldn’t they want to keep us guessing on whether Bill is in the film or not.
You have the Comic Con statement of them promising to try to put Bill in the film.
So they write the script and Leonard Nimoy (who has read the script) tells Bill on stage at a couple of conventions that he’s read the script and Bill isn’t in it.
So let’s play out this scenario: you don’t have plans for Bill Shatner to be in your movie but you have all these loyal fans of Shatner who you WANT to become interested in this new movie.
Wouldn’t you keep up the pretense that you are still trying to put Bill in the film? Roberto Orci restated the Comic Con promise recently in an interview here.
Don’t you think that one month before shooting that the script is pretty locked up at this point?
How do you keep the fans interested though?
Answer: You keep restating that you are trying to get Bill in the movie and hopefully garner enough interest to make fans want to see it anyway - even if Shatner isn’t it.
At that point, though - you’ve put a lot of spin and used the cache of Bill Shatner’s name to get fans interested in the movie.
Is that fair?
I understand that the video is upsetting but it’s the honest truth and fans do at least deserve that much.
That’s why I personally think that nobody has contacted Bill. It would seal the fate and you may as well get as much tread out of the spin doctoring as possible before you have to reveal your hand.
That’s just my own opinion of the situation. I don’t know JJ or Roberto or anyone associated with the movie. It’s just my vile speculation and a theory on what is happening.
-Paul
Shatner’s dreaming if he thinks any old Sci-Fi writers twist should resurrect Kirk JUST because “Hey, I’m William Shatner and you owe it to me and my fans. So, just do whatever it takes to bring me back.” SIGH!! The arrogance of some Hollywood elitists.
one logistical point about the script. in two weeks the WGA are likely to go on strike and Orci and Kurtzman are not allowed to write anything else. For over a month all of Hollywood has been operating based on the assumption a strike will happen.
btw Dennis did you vote to strike?
#54:”So let’s play out this scenario: you don’t have plans for Bill Shatner to be in your movie but you have all these loyal fans of Shatner who you WANT to become interested in this new movie.
Wouldn’t you keep up the pretense that you are still trying to put Bill in the film? Roberto Orci restated the Comic Con promise recently in an interview here…
…I understand that the video is upsetting but it’s the honest truth…
That’s just my own opinion of the situation. I don’t know JJ or Roberto or anyone associated with the movie. It’s just my vile speculation…”
Indeed it is.
Can anyone parse that as something other than “I think Shatner is telling the truth and the producers are liars?”
I mean, without throwing something out of joint from all the contortions.
Seriously, guys… get over it! I’d love to see Shatner back on the screen, even if not in the center chair… but if it doesn’t happen, it doesn’t happen!
I know its not exactly the same thing… but can you imagine if people clamored for Adam West to be involved in the original Batman movie like this? I mean, if we’re going to talk about wonderful, if campy, TV shows from the 60s, you can’t ignore Batman. It didn’t fit into that new idea of Tim Burton’s.
And I know, I know, Nimoy is involved - that’s wonderful! But he’s the only one, so far… and I still think he’s one of the best links to TOS they could have chosen. Sure, Kirk was the Captain, but I can guarantee a lot of people wanted to be Spock - he kicked ass, was a helluva smart guy, and could pretty much stand up to anybody - even Kirk.
So freakin’ get over it already! We’ll know if he’s really in the movie or not once it comes out in 2008!
#58:”And I know, I know, Nimoy is involved - that’s wonderful! But he’s the only one, so far… and I still think he’s one of the best links to TOS they could have chosen.”
As a friend on another board observed, in a way it’s fitting that Nimoy/Spock - the only TOS “regular” who appeared in the very first Trek episode - should be the last of the original cast to appear in a Trek production.
You know…I’m sick of Shatner. He’s just baggage for this movie. Nimoy works with this movie, because he is such an understated actor, but Shatner is a ham and has to be the center of attention. He had his chance to bow out gracefully, but instead he went for the ever so fantastic death scene. It’s his own fault that he chose to let Kirk die. Leave it alone already and let this new team make a GOOD movie…not just some contrivance to resurrect Shatner as Kirk.
i thought he was playing capt. kirk’s father, and make a cameo?
“The word has not yet,,,,come down”
Theres still a chance,,,
*crosses fingers*
*crosses toes*
*croesses eyeeeyss*
No. Walter Koenig plays Kirk’s father in a cameo.
Nichelle Nichols and Grace Lee Whitney play his aunts, and George Takei plays a cranky guy who keeps complaining to Daddy Kirk that the kid cuts across his yard every day and is killing the azaleas.
Face it, we’re ALL going to see the movie whether Shatner’s in it or not….HOWEVER….the only plausible way to have Kirk come back from the dead is to have the timeline altered so he didn’t die in the first place. That way you could have an elderly Spock (after returning from the past) meet up with him at the end of the film a la Michael J. Fox + Christopher Lloyd in Back To The Future. Everyone would get a sense of closure, a fond farewell to the originals, a sweet upbeat ending AND the symmetry of coming “full circle” in the first 40 year cycle of Star Trek!
If done right, the “word of mouth” on this film when it opens could be through the roof!!
Paul - could you get Bill to offer his comments on Chris Pine? And will Bill reach out to Chris Pine?
Perhaps Orci and Co’s imaginations aren’t as good as we have been led to believe? Seems like they just can’t do the business on Shatner.
Poor show guys.
And I thought Bill looked genuinely upset- but, of course, disapointment isn’t going to be a hard push for such a fine actor….. so I continue to hope.
“Hey, did you hear? Kirk comes back to life in the new Trek movie!”
“Does what? Was he dead?”
“Yeah, he died in that movie with the bald captain. God, what, fifeen years ago?”
“I saw him on that law show last week - the one with that guy from ‘Stargate’ on it. He’s not dead.”
This is disappointing and frustrating. There is no benefit to be gained by prolonging this. Shatner should be in the film.
The time is now, this may be the last chance. Logan and Spiner wiated too long — they wanted him in a Nemesis sequel. Berman could not get him fro Enterprise season 4, said maybe season 5 — and got cancelled.
I keep thinking about the end of Star Trek III. Kirk to Spock -”You would have done the same for me.” That is the untold story that needs to be told, and would be a perfect way for Nimoy and Shatner to cap their involvement in Trek.
66.
I would respond to you accusation of a poor imagination if I could think of something.
#64
Of all the wacky ideas I’ve heard, that actually sounds like the best. It’s simple and elegant and would be a great way to end the movie.
Unfortunately I just don’t think Shatner would be up for doing a cameo.
Orci–
If that really *was* you, that was classic. :-)
69.
You should write movies… that was a great line. ;)
lol, welcome to the DARK side of Trek fandom, Mr Orci. ;)
#40 and 41
Ok, he ain’t in it… next subject
The way some of this casting has gone, only an appearance of an older, still alive and well Kirk can salvage this for me, as when I see Leonard Nimoy on screen, it will only remind there’s a gaping William Shatner-sized hole in this Movie if not…
“William Shatner-sized hole in this movie”
Jeez, I hope they go for a wide-angle shot!!
69. Mr. Orci on Shat
You’re as tigh-lipped about this issue as an Aldebaran shell-mouth.
Business decision?
“How many yachts can you water ski behind?”- Bud Fox, Wall Street.
If this almost assured great moment from Star Trek is going to fall apart simply because a deal can’t be reached, I say to hell with William Shatner, and I would say this with a very heavy heart because I have been very vocal about how truly great I believe his participation in XI would be!
Money can’t be that much of an issue at this point in the game, and the Shat would be stacking quite a bit of Q points by doing it just because it would be really cool to see.
Even Sean Connery was lured back to Bond, and when he got the salary he felt he was entitled to, he gave it to charity, out of sheer principle.
I know that Mr. Orci has been kicking this one around, and it is quite evident that he is aware of all the ideas floating in exchange on this and other sites, so finding the story solution can’t be the factor.
I want more than anything to see one more iconic exchange between LN and WS, but if it’s a hard thing to remember that all he has springs from all of this, well, there’s a new Kirk in town, and his name is Chris Pine!
Good luck, Chris!
Kirk is dead. There is no place for Shatner. Spock can get older, but Kirk not. Shatner never will look as he looked at ST7. There is no place for him in the movie.
Except of playing a small cameo as grandfather of kirk maybe.
But that would be irrelevant for the story. Nimoy also wasn’t there in ST7, so now ST11 will become a only-Nimoy movie for exchange. What’s the problem?
Everybody with me!!! We want te Shat, We want the Shat!!!
Although I would loveto have the Shat in this film, I came to terms with the fact that we would “never” see him as Kirk again a long time ago.
His involvement will not effect me either way.
I agree with #79. Kirk died, and to bring him back would mean a gimmick that would require too much of the focus. I’m looking forward to plenty of Nimoy time anyways - he’s a fine fine actor and his Spock character is easily the best of the original cast.
I’m sorry, but just because something is science fiction doesn’t mean that you can just do whatever you want with the storyline. Sure, in-universe laws make it possible to do that — but what if it interferes with/distracts from/takes away from the main storyline? IMHO, it doesn’t matter whether that story is scifi, fantasy, biographical, or anything else — the elements have to fit.
I feel like just based off of how worked up people are getting on this board about the topic, if they off-the-cuff resurrected Shatner and then went on to the story, everyone would be focusing on Shatner and not the story. (If he’s actually an integral part of the story, playing a role no one else could — well, that’s different.)
It doesn’t take much imagination to figure out how to throw the Shat in, but it might take nothing short of a miracle to make it work with what the story that Orci, Abrams et al have already chosen.
I have to say that if I were making a decision as to whether or not to include His Shatneriffickness in the film I’d consider a couple of things:
Can you put him in, in an optional cameo and not make it look like a cheap gimmick (Starsky and Hutch anyone?) We would all go NUTS if it looked like a marketing sop!!! And don’t say we wouldn’t because we would.
So he’d need a bigger part and is the film about ‘OLD’ Kirk? Could you have him in without having 30 minutes devoted to Nexus stuff that wouldn’t be a complete cop-out? Star Trek 2.0 is going to have to be more than a soothing balm on the still open fanboy wound of ‘Generations’. (I suppose , *sniffs*).
And if you did that, would the New Shiney Star Trek Franchise be all about William Shatner, or all about the new guys? It HAS to be about the new guys.
We’ve had one poorly recieved handover already - if it can work, then great. I’m sure Mr Orci is far more aware of the commerical difficulties of balancing what would be a large salary demand with giving it the meaning which such a salary demand would entail with not totally unbalancing what is essentailly an ‘Origins’ movie.
So, back to the first point, I think it just HAS to be a cameo. If Nimoy/Spock is talking to someone off camera and Shatner/Kirk hoves in to view I would accept WITH NO EXPLANATION NEEDED:
Spock: “Aren’t you dead?”
Kirk: “There are always possibilities”.
[Credits]
Otherwise the whole movie is about bringing him back (well, for fans anyway who don’t have the attention span of… hey look shiney warp cores…)
And could you write a story based on that without knowing that Shatner would sign up? I agree with Dennis on an earlier post, it SOUNDS like it’s about money, but I think it’s also about keeping the film in balance. I think Bill Shatner will have strong views about his part and not fancy a cameo (since Spock has a larger role in comparison) and TPTB will want to stay focused on Eomer and Co.
Hell, make Star Trek Babies II about how they go into the future to save future Kirk who is needed to save the future future of Picard if you like, but I’m the ‘Origins’ story needs to be about the new crew so it rules out it being about the post Nexus rescue of Kirk.
If you are still reading Mr Orci, if you REALLY want to bake our noodles, make it a cliffhanger and DON’T explain why old Kirk is still around…
Just chuck him in the last scene, pay him for Iceland and promise him the sequel is Star Trek 2.1 The Search for Kirk.
Then just sit and lurk on this site for awhile afterwards… it could be very funny.
It is disappointing if he is not in the movie. Imagine all the great scene he could have with Leonard Nimoy, the chemistry between them. It would be incredible. I think there would be something amiss without Shatner. I hope the people in charge know that they are missing out on a great one-time opportunity if they don’t include him…
If the movie is a time travel thing and alternate reality or whatever, I see no reason why they couldnt have written a role for shatner if they really wanted to.
And why wont they just come out and say he’s not in the movie?
We keep hearing things like “We’re trying” or whatever, and the fact of the matter is that the movie starts shooting next month. Of course he’s NOT gonna be in it, so why keep up hanging? Just come right out and tell us. I dont believe all this “conspiracy theory” stuff or anything either.
I think its a missed opportunity not to have Shatner and Nimoy together again. With the two of them onscreen one last time, it could have been an “EVENT” The publicity would have been enormous.
I still think the movie will (hopefully) be good, and I’m glad Nimoy is in it, but I’m disappointed by no Shatner.
Lets all just face the facts. The film script is a Nimoy/Spock driven story that would have to be horribly tweaked to include a Shatner/Kirk. If Mr. Nimoy says it’s a great script , then by god don’t screw with it. Art is not made by a consensus of the many… but by the few…or the one!!!!
I’ve changed my mind.
New Kirk chockes on a pretzel in the acadamy and dies. Timelines in ruin, fanboys howl!!
So:
The whole story has to be about Old Spock telling New Spock to travel forward in time to steal the 2nd Genesis Device (the one they kept under sink in the galley for emercencies, watch scene 48 again and you can just see it - it’s in the extended cut) just before the Reliant explodes, take it forward in time and nuke Veridian III with it but instead of protomatter, use the chicken soup that Kirk gave to the 1960’s Earth Fighter Pilot.
Old Shatner appears, but the chicken soup matrix makes him get younger. they take him off the planet just before he reaches 28, mind melds occur and the balance is restored.
It’s a win/win, lets face it. It’s a cameo, but a MEANINGful cameo. and the film is all about the Trek Babies.
More or less.
Did I miss anything?
I want Wiliam Shatner in the movie. I think that he, of all people on the screen who have ever represented Star Trek, he is the most important. To have him still around, willing and able to be in this movie (just like Nimoy) and NOT have him in the movie, to me, shines a negative light on the producers… whether or not it’s their fault.
83.– I’m assuming you didn’t have a problem with Harve Bennett bringing back Leonard Nimoy in Star Trek III or did you think it interfered with/distracted from/took away from the main storyline?
After all, the elements have to fit.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m really looking forward to seeing Star Trek 11… on cable some day.
It’s possible that Mr. Shatner and Mr. Abrams have some secret deal and the older Kirk will appear as a surprise — but I doubt it. Given what little what we know about the plot of the film, and the writers’ apparent adherence to continuity, it doesn’t make sense for Kirk to appear the way it allows Mr. Spock to. Kirk’s death, the actors’ ages and physical dissimilarites (the DirectTV ads notwithstanding) from the last time we saw them together in VI . makes them appearing together, outside of a dream or “unreal” sequence, problematic at best. We must trust the producers, who have a fine record creatively, to make the right narrative choices.
As an aside, I must stress that Mr Shatner is, to me, and to so many of us, something unique. And a genuinely terrific actor.
I can’t wait for John Laroquette’s character, Carl Sack, on “Boston Legal” to say to Shatner’s Denny Crane “I thought you’re going to kill me.” To which he can, in character respond…
I must admit, it would be nice to have Shatner involved.
At the very least, he could advise Pine on how to play his character.
And, the idea of redeeming Kirk’s meaningless death in Generations, as was done with Tasha Yar’s death in “Skin of Evil,” is very compelling.
I can’t think of anything that would rock more than that.
But, I can also imagine a hundred reasons why it wouldn’t be done.
Funnily enough, it wouldn’t be so disappointing to have Shatner missing from the film if Nimoy wasn’t in it. But, to have one without the other does make me long for the one left out. Heh.
It doesn’t look like it’s gonna happen this time around, but the show must go on!!!
36. Hear hear.
# 68 “I keep thinking about the end of Star Trek III. Kirk to Spock -”You would have done the same for me.” That is the untold story that needs to be told, and would be a perfect way for Nimoy and Shatner to cap their involvement in Trek.”
If memory serves since I saw Generations only once, Kirk never ever did even mention Spock or asked Picard what had become of him in the meantime. Yes, Spock would have moved heaven and hell to find and rescue Kirk. Generations botched that story. They not even had the decency to have Kirk at least talk about his best friend Spock even after Nimoy declined to be in that film. On YouTube is a clip from a convention where Shatner talks about Kirk’s death in Generations and Nimoy’s answer is that if he had been there, he’d never let him die (to a lot of ahhhhs from the crowd present and Shatner kissing him). So when Nimoy says there was no Spock role in that movie, he is right, since Spock would have to have an active part beyond the cameo appearance at the start of the film. A dynamic that the producers of TNG didn’t get.
Many years have gone by since. Spock might have gotten old as Nimoy got old. Older even. Vulcans have what - twice the lifespan of a human? Everyone from the Enterprise is dead then. No Shatner as Kirk nor other actors from the original series would have a natural place in that movie then. In Shatner’s own movie ST V he has Kirk say that he knows he would die alone and that is what has happened. In a way it was fitting. Let him rest in piece.
I’ve been against bringing Shatner back in for ad hoc, nostalgic reasons from the beginning.
I think Shatner put his finger on it when he said it’s a business decision, but I would add that it is a matter of a good story. And having a movie about bringing someone back from the dead is CORNY, plain and simple. Moreover, it’s been done, it’s called Star Trek III: The Search for Spock, which was indeed CORNY and over the top.
When Shatner says, it’s Science Fiction, I get what he means… you can do anything in Science Fiction. But that’s part of the problem with the genre… it is so often dismissed by folks as not serious, and why? Because there is too much BAD writing, too much CORNY, sappy, not believable writing.
I am confident JJ Abrams will do right by this film.
I’ll say this for Shatner: kudos for not accepting a cameo, or even conceiving what good such a thing would do. Shatner does not need to be in the film just to show his face.
Shatner is their ace in the hole i tells yah! We have thirteen months until “Star Trek”… give it time.
PS i could be wrong :P
I’m sorry to see His Shatness being so shut out of this production, he clearly has heard nothing from anyone - especially after Leonard has (so rightly) been embraced so warmly by the team. From his body language here, I would say he has a certain feeling of being “left out” to say the least! And I really don’t think there’s any wierdness or conspiracies going on here.
#83 — Etha Williams said it nicely and succintly — “If he’s actually an integral part of the story, playing a role no one else could — well, that’s different.” Yes, that’s the word: integral.
Bringing Kirk back just to bring Kirk back would be the nail in the coffin of the Star Trek franchise. Either JJ and Orci breathe new life into it by means of a good story, or it is over and done with.
But, didn’t he only say that he doesn’t have a cameo in the movie? This does not rule out that he will have a big part in it ;)
As for there not being a natural way to fit him into the story. here is what I would do:
I would do it similar to the TNG episode “Yesterdays Enterprise”. A rift in time is opened (maybe by the enemy) and Kirk is suddenly there. Just like Tasha Yar was there in “Yesterdays Enterprise”. Spock is the only one who sees the changes in the timeline and he and Kirk travel to this rift and then back in time together. Old Kirk begins to realize that he is helping Spock to restore a future in which he is dead which could bring up some conflict between them. They defeat the enemy (which had some kind of crystal on him that was used to create the rift - young Spock then takes this crystal and keeps it. And this crystal is responsible for Spock being the only one able to see the changes in the timeline). At the end someone is putting a letter into young Kirks jacket reading “Do not open until the maiden voyage of the Enterprise-B.” Spock asks Kirk if he wants to go back to the future or travel with him through time forever, righting things that went wrong. They vanish.
Why is Kirk alive in the future, when the enemies try to assassinate him in the past, you ask? ;)
The changed future, Old Spock saw, was the one he created by going back in time not the one the enemies made. Logical, huh? :)
That’s a shame. Poor old bloke. All joking aside, he seems pretty downcast about it. It really is a shame to have a movie called Star Trek without Mr Star Trek in it.
okay how about this: spock and kirk are (insert scenery) reflecting and sharing a laugh. thus inspires the flashback. enter chris pine and crew. in the end spock gets up and leaves only to reveal that he spends a great deal of time in a holodeck with an image of kirk, whom he still misses many, many years later. problem solved. jj, i accept paypal.
I hope Shatner’s big enough to accept what realistically is a cameo. The script is the thing, wherein we’ll catch the conscience of the… this is a Spock-driven plot. The new cast needs the chance to prove itself. I’m the biggest Shat fan around, but he’s not carrying this movie based on the script. A final scene with Shatner as Kirk is worth all the bigger screen time Nimoy wlll have. Let’s not count lines.
As for Boston Legal, wouldn’t it be great if Denny Crane dressed up as Captain Kirk for Halloween?
Like most Star Trek fans I would love to have William Shatner in the movie. Having said that there is only one character that he should play in the movie and that is James T Kirk. I don’t wnat him playing Kirks father or have a bit part as a nothing character. Better he not be in the film at all if that is the case.
As it would seem the script has been well and truly written by now and it is obvious that it does not include an older James T Kirk.
I have a feeling I am gonna love this movie and the writers, producers, directors etc are going to do Star Trek proud.
It’s just a shame, as it would seem, that William Shatner doesn’t get to play Captain James T Kirk one last time!
You can see a fan-artists imagination of the new Kirk at
http://karracaz.deviantart.com/art/The-New-Captain-Kirk-66268538
You’re right: “The show must go on”. Because this film will be nothing but a meaningless “show” without Shatner als old Kirk. And its biggest exhibit will be Abram’s and Orci’s arrogance. Shatner was absolutely right in the video saying that his identity was in the film. The production team of ST XI must no longer withhold from Shatner what is his, and not from us what is ours.
Mr. Abrams, Mr. Orci, stop this unreasonable “show” now!
I think it’s a shame Bill feels disappointed he’s not in it, although it’s equally a shame he’s not able to accept that his character was killed off, and would be quite happy for his character to be brought back in some hockey sci-fi way.
I am still hopeful. If it does not happen, It would be an ABSOLUTE SHAME!
You’re right “The show must go on”. Because without Shatner als old Kirk, this film will be a meaningless “show”. And its biggest exhibit will be the production team’s arrogance. Shatner was absolutely right when saying that his identity was in this film. Abrams & Co. must no longer withhold from Shatner what is his and from us what is ours.
sorry for the double post - my computer had problems
#106. It doesn’t have to be a “hockey sci-fi way”. But why not end the movie with old Spock coming to rescue old Kirk?
Spock somehow manages to change time so that Kirk never dies (which happily coincides with the script leak), and then the two meet up in the last scene…and have one of those witty, poignant conversations…
Roll credits.
I quote from that same convention video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ljHAJvIZyhs) I cited earlier:
Nimoy to Shatner: “Being loud at me doesn’t make you right.”
Iowagirl, repeating your statements doesn’t either.
The problem is that if I truly make a post detailing my disappointment and opinion, I will be accused of having an agenda, a conspiracy, being obsessed, or my personal favorite, spamming.
However, I know Mr. Orci reads these comments, so I have some questions for him.
1. Why do you say you’re trying to get Shatner in the film, yet did not write him in the script?
2. I may not be a Hollywood expert, but when you are trying to get someone involved with you, how can you do that without talking to him?
Shatner hasn’t even SEEN the script.
Look, if you have no intention of using Shatner, please just say so. At this point, I’m so tired of the back and forth and the lack of the producers actually being straight forward that there is no way I will pay to see this movie unless the producers do the right thing and put Shatner in it.
You can get Nimoy, you can get every actor in the book and recast the movie all you want, but the constant false hopes about getting Shatner has really grown old. It would be nice to have JJ Abrams address this once and for all.
Upps, sorry, got to see post #109 only after I send my comment and the site renewed. My apologies.
110. Rescue him for what though? Old Kirk is an old man now. The franchise was already stretched to it’s limits when Spock was brought back. I think it undermines the premise and credibility of Trek if we start to play God whenever we feel like it and bring back dead characters. Maybe show him in a flashback and make him look a bit younger like they did in that direct TV commercial, that would work.
I had a lot of goodwill towards this project and it has really started to fade since I watched that video.
I am not a Trekker just someone who was a big fan of the adventures of Kirk and Spock when I was growing up in the eighties.
I have not seen a Trek movie in the cinema since First Contact. I
I’m there opening night for this if Shat is in with Nimoy and think JJ is a very talented guy, but that video kind of made me fell like: Auto-destruct sequence on-line.
Please guys. Do it. Just make it happen.
#111
read 109 - saying sorry ONCE should do
#113
ok, my apologies - now it was me being late…
Hi. I have had two posts vanish. Are there probs or should I take it personally. I didn’t say anything nasty? : (
Boy, these sure are nervous times aboard the good ship Trekmovie.com…
Here’s the ‘Scotty’ I ended up with for this Movie…stop laughing there at the back…
http://www.tipos.com.br/media/12/20051118-jardineiro_willy_blog.jpg
But will I end up with something like this for this Movie’s ‘Enterprise’?…as it sure doesn’t sound like I’m getting the original series design…
http://jedi.org/blog/archives/N.S.E.A.Protector-The.Visual.Effects.of.Star.Trek.II.png
And am I also getting a Bridge to match?…
http://www.dreamworksfansite.com/galaxyquest/gallery/Crew_Aboard.jpg
Only one thing can give me hope now…somebody please own up soon if William Shatner is REALLY in this, however briefly…and if so, is that appearance as an ‘older’ Kirk, rather than a ridiculous ‘cameo’ where he plays his own dad or such like…
Me thinks Shatner is playing us like a fiddle…and JJ wrote the music.
Not that I mind one bit, I love surprises.
There’s always one isn’t there?…
That Bridge link should have been this…
http://www.dreamworksfansite/galaxyquest/gallery/Crew_Aboard.jpg
@64 - I totally agree with your post.
And Shanter balking at doing a cameo - sorry dude, if you didn’t agree to die in Generations then your character would be in a better position for continued use.
Last time!
http:/hollywoodjesus.com/media/galaxy05.jpg
aaargh
If he is in the movie, it won’t be as his dad or something ridiculous like that. Any actor can play another character. If they’re going to get Shatner, the only role for him is as older Kirk. There is no way an intelligent producer would waste Shatner in another role, and for the most part, no way the audience would accept that.
But the constant false hopes are going to hurt the grosses more than some people believe. Bottom line with a $150 million budget, they need butts in the seats, and Shatner as Kirk will put butts in the seats.
The endless stringing along has got to stop.
they put the original(1950’s) Lois Lane in a cameo in Richard Donner’s 1977 “Superman” as The new Lois Lanes mom on the train when Clark ran by.So Shatner could do a cameo of Kirk’s dad or such.
He’s lying… I love the man to pieces but he’s lying. “I wouldnt do a cameo… a cameo” bull… he wants to be in this movie, he would do a cameo.
he looks like a man under pressure to lie… notice the stutters and the un ease at answering simple questions, he looks like a man that is choosing his words very carefully as to not give away the truth.
“The word… is no, so were doing it anyway” (ST:III)
There is no reason to believe he’s lying.
#126–And Noel Neill’s cameo ended up on the cutting room floor. Plus, in no incarnation of Superman did the characters actually age. Completely different situation. Plus, it’s not like they had other actors from the 1950s show playing the same role, like they do here. If Shatner is in the movie, it would have to be as Kirk.
But it doesn’t matter, since the producers desperate efforts don’t actually involve talking to Shatner or even sending him the script. Yeah, they’re trying hard.
*128…. there is every reason
#129–no there really isn’t.
The reaction to Shatner’s lack of involvement is mostly negative and filled with disappointment. If Shatner actually had a deal in place, the producers are not foolish enough to tell him to lie about it and drag their movie down. It wouldn’t make sense.
This isn’t the type of thing that could be kept in the dark. It’s not something that would be a surprise. The only way that happens is if the producers haven’t told HIM yet, and that’s highly unlikely.
There are no benefits to lying about it.
So many people want Shatner in this film. It’s terrible what’s going on. I know I won’t pay to see it at this point.
Shatner is Kirk. Simple.
Do not have him cameoed as somebody else…
It simply will stick out as a sore thumb, and would really be awkward, considering that Nimoy is Spock in the film.
Would you cast Somebody else as Indiana Jones, and then have Harrison Ford playing the bad guy? Or worse, Jones Sr?? Doesn’t work.
Shatner should be in the film… and to be honest, I’ll be astounded if he is not.
I think the worst part of all this is the silence from the producers. Abrams hasn’t said a word since July, and Orci merely parrotted that statement last week. If they truly intend to put Shatner in the film, it’s time to pick up the phone and call the man. At least fax him the script and an idea. Trying to get someone in the film requires communication.
#131 -
Don’t be so narrow minded people. Shatner was an actor employed to play the character of Kirk. Shatner is an actor, Kirk is a Character. Big difference. I’m going to be highly disappointed if the writers buckle under all of this resurrect Kirk non-sense. It was bad enough that they back tracked and spent 2 movies bringing Spock back up to speed, but now people are begging the writers to short change this new cast of characters, just so Shatner can undo something he shouldn’t have done in the first place? He’s successful, he’s on a hit show….I think he can afford to let the new crew take the spot light.
He accepted the decision to kill Kirk. Nimoy wisely stayed out of that movie. The undiscovered country was the original crews farewell. Remember that movie? They went out on a high note. Now people just want to keep belaboring the exit. It’s like a band that keeps having reunions after the farewell tour.
Enough is enough.
I wonder if Shatner saying this Scifi was a hint that Shatner will be in the movie and they are going to do something to bring Kirk back after Generations so it wont effect Kirk helping Picard and his crew on Veridian III?
Why is it so hard for Shatner and his fans to accept the fact that this movie is an attempt to move the franchise forward to a NEW generation of actors? All iconic characters in movies and TV get replaced eventually. From Superman to James Bond. Sorry, thoses are the facts. Eventually the umbilical cord, must be severed from the old and the new. It wasn’t required for Sean Connery to appear in ‘Live and Let Die”, when Roger Moore replaced him as Bond. Nor was it necessary for this to happen in any film or TV series I know of. Get over it. TREK is no different, though some fans are deluded enough to think there is. The filmmakers open themselves up to this when they wrote Nimoy in the movie. I don’t think he should be in it either. It’s time to move on, folks. I hope the fan base is mature enough to accept it.
#133–it’s science fiction. Anything can happen. It’s NOT a problem to bring the character back. We all know it. So the whole Kirk died argument doesn’t hold water. If it did, the producers wouldn’t even give the lip service and Shatner wouldn’t even be talking about it.
The original series did NOT go out on a high note because Generations spoiled it. And yes, Shatner shouldn’t have taken the role, but he did, so yes, they should spend time in the movie making sure that the central character–the captain–isn’t dead.
#135–Shatner is ready, willing and able to play older Kirk. You don’t see people arguing against the idea of a new cast. But we want Shatner in the movie to deal with that ridiculous death and put the franchise back in a positive direction. Kirk’s death lingers over this movie. They are already including Nimoy which shows an intent to reach out to the fanbase, but it’s not enough when Shatner wants in so badly. There was no “bring back Spock” campaign. Not that it isn’t great to see Nimoy. It is. But the demand has always been about Shatner.
It’s not about an unwillingness to replace Shatner. But this is the last, best chance to finally give Shatner’s Kirk a sendoff worthy of it. Bring the character back, and pass the torch right. It’s all that’s being asked.
Then film all these sequels with the new cast for as long as you can.
The problem is the character. Hell, I could even accept putting Chris Pine in older makeup and bringing the character back that way. Not my first choice, but it’s better than nothing.
This is the most absurd scenario I’ve ever encountered in my whole Trek life. Nothing ever has come near this.
If they don’t involve Shatner as Kirk, they will still make their money, but they will destroy the transcendental factor of ST that made ST much more than just another SciFi series. They will destroy the magic.
I am beginning to realize now that Abrams & Co. really just want to make another popcorn movie for the young masses. This is fine, let them do it - they will find enough ticket buyers and bill payers for that. But as for all you people out there who got into ST and especially TOS for the REAL surprises at the right time, the unique mix of drama, action, continuity of characters, legendary friendship and emotions - there certainly will be other films to watch in 2008.
104 - Pine is Kirk, not Vogel.
Probably JJ want let old kirk presence in this movie, like one of the big surprises…for us…. i would like to discover just in the theatre during the movie that Shatner is there! i love spoilers…but i will love this kind of surprise remain secret until the movie go to the theatre…. what do you think?
#135 Then why include Nimoy? Why not simply create a movie that plays entirely in the past, detailing the first adventure of the TOS-crew that leads into more movies?
If this movie belongs to the new actors and the new adventures then Nimoy will diminish that as well. So it wouldn’t matter if Shatner would be in it, too. In fact, it would be even better. Having Young Kirk and Young Spock as well as Old Kirk and Old Spock. The old versions would help their young selfs and send them off on their adventures.
Face it, this movie is not about the new crew because Nimoy is in it.
I still hope that this is all a big secret, that Shatner has to lie because they want to have the surprise of him being in the movie until either the trailer hits the cinemas or the movie itself.
It simply cannot be a story issue. As Shatner said himself, this is sci-fi. Everything is possible.
This how shatner should appear the film:
McCoy is telling Savik a story about Jim Kirk back on the genisis cave waiting to get rescued. Then the correct version is told by Spock to Savik after they are rescued from the Genisis cave. *LOL*
Or it could be one of the falsh backs that was used by spock’s brother to forment the pain. *LOL*
However, sine this is allgedlly a time travel story there are a slew of possiblities, that can be done. becuase ther eould be various alternate time lines. ( How about as an old aging bad Kirk from the Mirror Mirror Universe, wher he has become Emepror??)
‘
I have to say that I wouldn’t be disappointed if Shatner weren’t in this movie at all. In the early going he was a pretty cool character, but eventually he just became a parody of himself (can anyone watch ST VI and not feel like he is wink wink nudge nudge at the audience the whole time??? Compare that performance to the character in TMP and ST II which are much more fleshed out and honest).
Spock has remained an interesting character through the whole series. Even in ST V and the poorly worked T.V. comeback on TNG, Nimoy’s performance preserved some sense of the real Spock. The result: who cried when Spock died in TWOK? Who cried when Kirk died in Generations?
Since the late 80s, much of Star Trek was overproduced, taking on a Disneyland like gloss. Lots of bright colors, lots of over the top, operatic performances, but very little to ground it in reality. If the team’s work on MI:iii and Lost are any indication, this movie could feel like its in a real future. This could be the first time since 1983 that we believe that Kirk is a real starship captain (and not just Shatner in an ever increasing belt-size).
JJ and crew have to be left to tell the story that they want to tell. If that story can credibly work in Shatner, then thats a good nod to the old school fans. If not, then quit being jerks about it. Get over it and watch the billion hours of t.v. and film that already have Shatner’s Kirk in it.
Now, I’m not a Shatner hater. I was a kid when TMP and TWOK came out, and I loved those movies. Kirk in those films was visceral, cocky, loyal and clever - everything a real ship captain would have to be. And I’ve definitely enjoyed much of his work in the original series. But you can have Star Trek without him, and you don’t need to waste a great opportunity running around trying to raise Shatner’s Kirk from the dead.
Make a great movie with Chris Pine and crew. Everything else will work out from there.
Thus endeth the rant.
If JJ is trying to keep a secret that Shatner is in this movie or not. And not wanting to spoil the ending knowing that Shatner is, there is no way people talk if it’s true or not. We all are trying to guess what the movie is all about and someone will get it right. We got about a year so what’s your guess?
Roberto Orci:
If you are out there would you be kind enough to make a definitive statement as to whether or not Mr. Shatner will be in this film.
I hate to put your feet to the fire like this, but you do seem to genuinely care what the fans are thinking and since J.J. Abrams was the first to bring up the subject at comic-con I don’t think the question is out of bounds.
If you can’t answer the question for whatever reason (non-disclosure, want to keep it a secret, plot points..etc) I will completely understand + will not press the issue.
On the other hand if Mr. Shatner is not going to be invited back why not just say it?
Thanks.
I have said it before and I say it again. If you don’t have Shatner as older Kirk in this movie many people will regret it for a long time to come.
Even, at some point in the future, Paramount.
Oh, fercryinoutloud, people, it’s a MOVIE. Let’s all get a grip here. Unless and until George W. Bush comes out and says the casting for J.J. Abrams’ Star Trek reboot will determine the future of Iraq, I think we should all calm down.
I don’t think Shatner is up to anything sneaky — I think he wishes he were in the film, and he isn’t. He posted the video to correct an erroneous piece of reporting, to express his disappointment and — I suspect — to needle Abrams & Company into giving him a part.
I mean, why shouldn’t he? It’s his right. He’s been playing that part for 40 + years. Of course he wants to be in the film. What’s the mystery, here?
If he’s in it, that’s cool. If he’s not, everyone should be able to live with it.
That said, I think Abrams ought to cast him as Kirk’s Grampa or beloved Great Uncle Bo, or something. Then Pine & Shat can have one significant scene, maybe a goodbye, in which the older fellow sends the younger fellow on his way — blessing him on his voyage, or whatnot. It would require no narrative gymnastics to wedge it into the movie (whatever the plot), and it would provide psychological closure for everyone — Shatner and the fans. It would just be nice to see the two actors onscreen together before Shatner fades to the background.
Just a thought. As I said, I don’t think the fate of the world rests on Star Trek XI.
Another thing–if this is some sort of super duper surprise, why have Shatner do a video at all? Just be silent. This news only upsets people. Why upset the audience? Clearly all this news has accomplished is making people angry and frustrated.
There’s no gain in that.
Captain Kirk needs a happier ending.
#69 I bet that sounded funny in your head? I hope the ‘humour’ you have put in the script is somewhat better?
I just want Bill in the movie. Period. This might be the last chance. Is there no way to put him in it without messing up the story line: Mr Orci?
To have Bill shatner as some other character in star trek is out of the question, IMO. I’d be completely distracted.
if he is in it i doubt they will tip their hand this early
So, judging from these posts, Shatner HAS to be in it, he HAS to play Kirk, it HAS to be canon and it HAS to correct the ignominious end of “Generations”? That’s a whole lotta imperatives. We’re a whole lotta whiners.
Once again: IT’S! A! MOVIE!
Sorry — I don’t have time to read the whole thread right now — but I think I have a theory about why it is so difficult for them to find a way to incorporate Shatner.
I will try to articulate what I think is going to be the main device of this film, and it hinges on the statement that they are “honoring canon.” Well, if this were simply going back to the beginning and starting earlier, then the only way they could honor canon is to have exactly the same things happen to the crew as time goes on. So where would they be with regard to sequels to this film — even though this movie is set before the five year mission, they will very very quickly be into the same time period as TOS. Are they going to rehash old episodes? No. Something happens in this first film that “resets” the timeline, allowing them to honor canon and still have the freedom to do whatever they want.
Prediction: In this film, Spock will go back in time and save “young kirk” with the help of “young spock” — and will end with the presumption that as we go forward in time, “young spock” will have a secret mission — to try to steer the timeline in generally the right direction despite that fact that he now knows something about the future. And that is that Kirk is absolutely essential to something that happens in the future and has to be protected at all costs. So, if Shatner is in this film, we will know that Spock succeeded, when maybe they want it to be a cliffhanger… Maybe Shatner already KNOWS that he will be in a future film — but he can’t say because not only would it be a spoiler for XI — but for XII as well.
Just a theory.
Here a guess that will upset you. Old Kirk shows up at the end giving Spock a big hug but it’s a back shoot of Kirk with a Shatner look- alike from the back and thats it.
Shatner will be in the movie! JJ said back at Comic Con that they we’re trying to find a way to put him in. Sounds like Shat has no desire to do a cameo. So this is really about screen time. Shatner just wants a bigger part. So give it to him! Not having him in the film will have nothing but negative affects & shave millions of dollars off the box office.
Some people simply won’t go to the movie.
Tell Paramount they might get some of the Trek old customers back.
Ya know they ones they lost after Generations.
JJ & team, please do not be fools, give Shatner what he wants.
People like my parents will go. It will be a big event of 2008.
Having Nimoy is a good start, but not anuff.
You got to have both NIMOY & SHATNER.
#154 No, its in Nimoys contract going way back- NO BODY CONTACT WITH ANYBODY BUT SHATNER. NOT EVEN A LOOKALIKE. Shatner has a similar stipulation- NO BODY CONTACT WITH ANYBODY BUT SHATNER- BUT A SHATNER LOOKALIKE IS OK. AS LONG AS WE KISS.
I’d love to see him in the movie. However, the story has to serve it’s characters, if they include him just to appease the fans, without a substitive reason, it would just weaken the whole deal.
Personally, I find his physical appearance precludes just working him into the story anywhere they might otherwise, because he doesn’t look like he’d fit in to any time frame except perhaps, being trapped in the nexus and aging normally.
Perhaps we’ll hear his voice, but also we might find that the story will set-up a change in the ‘future history’ of trek and we might find at the end of the story that Captain Kirk is alive once again..
As an aspiring writer, there is one thing I haven’t read yet, which I feel is important to point out:
Namely, if they don’t change the timeline now, then they’ll have to do it in future movies because there will never be a point where Kirk is in “danger”. We know he’ll survive at least until the Nexis.
If the timeline changes…and Kirk is brought back: anything goes once again - for any memeber of the crew.
BTW…I DO want kirk back
Someone needs to tell Shatner that if he set fire to the pile of cash he’s made from Trek over the years (including all the margerine commercials he got because of Trek) he would still be basking in its warm glow until his demise, many years hence.
I really hope this isn’t about money, but I suppose it is. This is why movie tickets cost ten bucks now, and most of the movies are not wonderful events.
I’d love to see BS back in uniform again. But, there’s obviously a lot of BS going on behind the scenes.
#158 But they’ll not make the mistake of killing Kirk again anyway! Look at the mess of trouble doing it before threw up! lol
How long is the stalemate of “maybe” going to last? It’s frustrating to those who do want him in; its frustrating for those who DONT want him in. Everyone’s frustrated now.
#54 Paul, thanks for your continued video updates. I have no reason to doubt the Shat, he’s the only one saying definite “no im not in it”. It’s clear no one is talking to him. It must be just as frustrating for him as it is everyone else.
I’ll be mighty upset if this “maybe” has been a publicity stunt all along to hide the fact they never had any intention of putting him in the movie.
Mr Orci, please give us a hint other than “we are looking” because the script as far as we are aware is written and you shoot next month. He’s either in it or he isn’t, which is it, i beg you to end the speculation or give us at least some hope other than the comic con thing. Please :)
it is very pleasing to know that Roberto is lurking around in general and particularly pleasing to know he’s lurking (and posting when suitably encouraged ;) ) around this story. Seems he’s as interested in Bill as we are. Understandable.
I am telliong you folks, this is all part of the effort to keep some important plot points a secret. Same exact reason Nimoy was NOT named in the role of Spock before ST3:TSFS was released. Keep people in the dark as tothe outcome… and the outcome will be, KIRK IS ALIVE.
Bank on it. The Shat will be in this film, even if we NEVER hear about it till the movie is out.
#163–that’s what so many people WANT. But there is no reason to believe that is what IS. None. And the animosity and bad will they are building doesn’t seem worth it.
As of now, I have no reason to doubt Shatner.
So, Bill doesn’t like the idea of playing James Kirk’s father? Too small a role? Sounds good to me. Sounds perfect to me.
153# You got it!!! That’s best theory I have heard. Why would you want to do the old episodes again we know the ending already so all the Star Trek movies now and sequels to come would be new because the time line will be changed and the five year mission will be different and new. Sounds like Spock as a job to do.
#166 That assumes we are bothered about Pines Kirk biting the big one? Time will tell on that one- we may all end up cheering on the bad guys yet!
159.
I’d be in Star Trek for free.
Just saying.
Why would the makers of this movie ignore the wishes of the majority of the fans? isn’t that suicidal?? Especially if they want huge ratings and the chance to make the sequel, even non-fans think that having Nimoy without Shat is STOOOPID
Mr Orci: You are either very smart or very silly… i will have to reserve judgment until after Christmas 2008 where i will be dazzled by a masterpiece or asking for my money back.
This is a big deal.
Shatner called Kirk his “identity”.He seems to have the same problem separating himself from the role as some trekkies.I think He should play a cameo ,most likely as Kirk’s father.Physically,He’s unrecognizable as Kirk,so another character wouldn’t be too distracting.
*153 just read your post…. interesting but wouldnt that be a huge gamble as they need this film to please everyone so they actually get the nod for the sequel?
just a thought
This is all about creating “buzz.” Nothing more. Don’t fall for it.
Remember, it’s show BUSINESS we’re talking about.
BTW, anyone going to Vulkon, Cleveland- my neck of the woods?
…and ,by the way.The original (1950’s)Lois Lane actress WAS used in Richard Donner’s Superman movie (for a few seconds) as Lois Lanes mom.Lois Lane was the little girl in the train who did a double take as Clark Kent ran by.Why not use Shatner THIS WAY?In another role.It would be a nice homage.Especially if He plays an elder admiral giving charge of the Enterprise to the Chris Pine (new Kirk),my suggestion.That would be a classy transition.
#170 “Physically, He’s unrecognizable as Kirk, so another character wouldn’t be too distracting.”
Except for the fact that the entire world knows he IS Kirk. For the last time, in a film where Nimoy is Spock, having Shatner play anyone but Kirk would be stupid and confusing. I’d rather not have him in it at all, than to see him play a cheap stunt cameo as some nobody.
Off topic, I know, but…startrek.com seems to officially confirm that Captain Pike is in this film
http://www.startrek.com/startrek/view/news/editorials/article/2310513.html
There’s a poll, too. So now that this whole Who will be Kirk thing is done:
Tom Hanks for Captain Pike!
174 Not the whole world.You have to look at it from the perspective of the average cinema goer.To them Shatner is ancient history.I think having him play a clever cameo would be a good homage.And remember.This is Nimoy’s legacy film (where Nimoy says “Good bye”.Shatner’s was “Generations” where he concluded his legacy.
Jay — it really isn’t much of a gamble… the movies made money even when they appealed mostly to fans — now they are going after a new audience, while they’ll likely retain the existing audience (except for the 9 or 10 people who won’t see it if Shatner isn’t in it (insert smilie emoticon)) — so it can ONLY be bigger than what has come before, unless it’s a complete disaster… and come on… no one REALLY believes that will happen… including the writers, the studio and half the doomsayers here.
My opinion and guess.
Having Shatner play a role other than Kirk would be like a hypothetical present-day concert featuring Lennon & McCartney, in which Lennon was in the spotlight the entire time while McCartney was in disguise as a member of the backing band! In other words, lame.
Plus, you heard Shatner here. He’s having a hard time envisioning a cameo as KIRK. It is therefore extemely unlikely he’d want to do a cameo as Kirk’s football coach…
He is NOT unrecognizable as Kirk. He IS Kirk. And Generations did not conclude his legacy. It created unfinished business and a black mark on this franchise that still exists. And anyone who thinks Shatner’s absence will affect just 9 or 10 people is fooling themselves.
If the movies were such moneymakers, Berman would still be in charge and Trek XI would be TNG.
#176 but most agree that Shatners ‘goodbye’ sucked and blew. THIS is a great opportunity to correct that.
I don’t want it to distract from the new team- and if Bill will accept a smaller, indeed cameo, role then I think he should- As a gift to the fans for his part in the mistake that was allowing Kirk to be killed.
This is beginning to sound like the Enterprise series debacle over his being in it. I’m glad he wouldn’t be chef. Don’t understand why people say he can’t be in it but it’s OK to reinvent the whole show with different interpretations of the same characters. And have Romulans we shouldn’t be able to see. And change the timeline. Was the Zephrem Cochrane of First Contact the same as Metamorphosis? This movie needs all the positive press it can get, they should find some way. If they can’t, they can’t. I don’t think the producers are prolonging this, it’s just that people keep asking about Shatner. I’m a big Kirk fan, but I’m not sure I efen want him in this.
This is Nimoy’s legacy piece where He will be ending His involvement with old Trek. Shatner shouldn’t use the fans to muscle in.A cameo as a different character would be tasteful as this is Nimoy’s legacy piece.
Dear Mr. Orci and Mr. Abrams,
Honestly, how hard would it be to bring Kirk back? This hard:
Spock– (Lifting one eyebrow) “I thought you were dead.”
Kirk– (With a little smile) “I got better.”
Please, for all of us hardcore TOS fans, bring this iconic figure back from the dead. He should have never been killed in the first place.
I’m not arguing that they were successful — only that they were successful enough for sequels.
And — speaking for myself, and only myself, with no disrespect intended to those who REQUIRE Shatner to be in this film — I would really rather they base the decision as to whether or not he is in it on the needs of the story… not as some kind of homage or quid pro quo. I also think Shatner, as he looks now — including his physical shape — is not true to what Kirk would look like in old age… he’s too old and out of shape… it would say something about the charactor of Kirk to see him looking like the Shat. It would say something about the state of healthcare and medical science.
Finally, another reason why I beleive that there is something planned for the future is that by making a big deal about not being in it for a cameo, Shatner is making himself look small and self-centered at a time when he is enjoying a popularity boost. I don’t think he would do that so vocally if there was not an agreed-upon punchline in the future somewhere.
#182 Shatner isn’t using the fans- certainly he hasn’t emailed me! I WISH! No, its genuine fondness and desire to see him afforded an opportunity, if only a small chance, to give something back to his many fans.
If he doesn’t want a cameo- as older Kirk (I couldn’t accept him in another role as I think that would demean him) then we can’t make him.
Equally we can’t force the writers to put his Kirk in if it doesn’t work for them. It will be sad- but it wi