Star Trek Sequel Writers Give Script Update + Promise No Remake + Talk Vulcan, Arcs, & More | TrekMovie.com
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Star Trek Sequel Writers Give Script Update + Promise No Remake + Talk Vulcan, Arcs, & More June 11, 2011

by Anthony Pascale , Filed under: Orci/Kurtzman,Star Trek (2009 film),Star Trek Into Darkness , trackback

Following Nick Meyer chat at the LA Times Hero Complex Film Fest it was the turn of Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, and Damon Lindelof who talked for forty minutes about their 2009 Star Trek movie, and about the 2012 Star Trek sequel. Highlights, quotes and a video clip (with TrekMovie.com shoutout) below.

 

Orci, Kurtzman & Lindelof on Star Trek sequel

The Star Trek night at the LA Times Hero Complex was a double feature with Star Trek: II The Wrath of Khan and the 2009 Star Trek movie. For Star Trek there was an all-star panel with co-writers Roberto Orci and Alex Kurtzman along with producer Damon Lindelof, all three of which are knee-deep in writing the Star Trek sequel. The group spoke about their admiration for Star Trek II and Nick Meyer, their 2009 Star Trek movie, and the sequel. It was a very entertaining night and three out of five members of Star Trek’s new "Supreme Court" said all the kinds of things that should be encouraging about the next Star Trek.


LA Times Geoff Boucher with Alex Kurtzman, Damon Lindelof and Roberto Orci at Hero Complex Film Fest – Friday June 10

On sequel status – 80 page script-thing & "JJ’s attention"

The panel started off with a question about the status of the Star Trek sequel script. Lindelof and Orci gave a quick update on what was recently described as a "70-page outline," which appears to have grown in the last few weeks:

Lindelof: As of right now there is kind of a 75 or 80 page half script/half…I don’t know what it is…

Orci: It is in a state of quantum flux

The core creative team behind the 2009 Star Trek movie are Roberto Orci, Alex Kurtzman, Damon Lindelof, JJ Abrams and Bryan Burke. Now that Super 8 has come out, it’s time to get the band back together for the sequel:

Lindelof: our attitude for the sequel in order for it to be successful is that we sort of have to form that [group of all of us together] again. So we were kind of waiting and now the moment is upon us where JJ has done Super 8.

Orci: JJ and Bryan’s little side-project is over and now we can have their attention.

On sequel time setting – "some adventures" have happened

They also talked about the direction they want to go with the character arcs, talking about how there is some time between the films:

Orci: The first one was about, "Spock is pretty emotional." Well, he is younger And "Kirk, he is not a bookworm with legs who really understands the chain of command." Well he is not quite there yet. So you can get closer to what you know. It is all about earning what you know and learning that when we see them now they have been through a couple of adventures, but they don’t know each other either. There is still discovery, but there is also more familiarity. So, like the first one, it will feel like Trek, but it will also chart new ground.

On fallout "ripple effect" of the destruction of Vulcan

While talking about the parallels between modern terrorism and Nero in Star Trek 2009, Damon Lindelof appeared to imply that the impact of the destruction of Vulcan will carry into the sequel :

Lindelof: We often referred to the destruction of Vulcan as the 9/11 moment of [Star Trek 2009]. There had to be an event that was so significant that it allows you to change the Trek universe, not just for the purposes of the first movie, but moving forward. The idea of saying, if you did something that huge, what would be the effect of that rippling outwards?

On original vs. classic storylines – "No remake"

Lindelof also talked about how their approach is not to just do a remake:

Lindelof: We love Trek too, but we want to also blaze our own trail here. The idea of just kind of playing cover songs and classics again – we feel like there has to be a little of that, but there has to be a lot of original music in the set list to be worthy of your time and attention. You don’t want to see a remake, you want to see a new movie.

More sequel highlights:


LA Times Geoff Boucher with Alex Kurtzman, Damon Lindelof and Roberto Orci at Hero Complex Film Fest – Friday June 10

On Star Trek (2009) time travel, canon and more:

Lindelof talked about their early decision to use time-travel to allow them to make Star Trek both an origin story and a sequel to all that came before. Explaining:

Lindelof: That was the only way we could make it work, because we said, we can’t be bound by the incredible canon of Trek, because the Chekov knowing Khan thing [continuity error from Star Trek II] would have just been the tip of the iceberg. It would also hamstring us in a way because if you watch the movie you would know that no one could die and nothing bad could happen to anybody, because they have to grow up and go on the adventures we saw them have. And we also didn’t want to replay those adventures, because everybody knows the outcomes.

Orci: We also didn’t want to erase what came before, so that is why we decided to sort of update time-travel. It is not the rules of Back to the Future. It is the rules of more modern theories, of creating an alternate universe. It explains why some of the characters do what they do. Spock doesn’t try to fix the timeline because there is no such thing as fixing the timeline, they are just in a new universe that is going on its own. That had been done is some of the previous Star Trek series, but not in the movies. 

Lindelof:  In the case of the physics and the science and the science fiction, we had a rule that we kept coming back to, which was "our wives need to understand this movie."

More Star Trek 2009 highlights

VIDEO: Damon on Bob on fan feedback w/ TrekMovie.com shoutout

During the Q&A the group were asked about the pressure to make their Star Trek movie "cool again." Orci replied by saying for them it was about making a movie where you love the characters. He also gave a shoutout to feedback on TrekMovie.com, launching into a discussion with Damon about fan feedback online. Damon noted that if you are going to critique, it is better to offer suggestions, you never know if he might just borrow the idea. Watch the exchange below.

More to come from Hero Complex Film Fest Star Trek Night

Early in the week the LA Times will be posting (better) video for both of Geoff Boucher’s panel discussions with Nick Meyer and with the Star Trek team of Damon Lindelof, Alex Kurtzman and Bob Orci. Look for an update on that here.

Bob, Alex and Damon also gave TrekMovie.com an exclusive video interview all about the Star Trek sequel. Look for that update early in the week too. 

Photos and video by Anthony Pascale, TrekMovie.com

Comments

1. dmduncan - June 11, 2011

Well I have offered plenty of “this is what you should do instead,” Damon.

“So let it be written, so let it be done.”

2. somethoughts - June 11, 2011

cool

3. Norbert - June 11, 2011

Sounds ok for me. I hope they will start with the production soon. The delay to X-mas 2012 is hard enough for me.

But what I really want to see is a new series set in the JJA timeline. Maybe even an CG-animated one, as long as it is as well designed as Clone Wars with a little more adult approach.

4. somethoughts - June 11, 2011

If they do delay it, would be nice if they announced if we are to expect the Klingons, Talosians or Anomalies in space. I think that would give us something to look forward to and garner some patience.

Knowing who the villain(s) are and who are cast to play them would help us with the agonizing wait for the sequel :)

5. Red Dead Ryan - June 11, 2011

Good to hear about them not remaking anything. Also explains why they still haven’t finished the first draft of the script. I agree with destroying Vulcan, but wished that Amanda hadn’t died. George Kirk’s sacrifice worked brilliantly, but I felt Amanda’s death just didn’t pack the emotional punch that James Kirk’s dad’s did.

6. moauvian waoul- aka: seymour hiney - June 11, 2011

This is what you should do instead? I’ve read a couple of suggestions here. How about this one… show us the start of the five year mission and perhaps some insight concerning Kirk’s peers and how they view his rapid promotion.

7. Commodore Mike of the Terran Empire - June 11, 2011

What!!! Not going to use the Mirrior universe and the Terran Empire. BOYCOTT!!!!!!. Oh ok. I was just kidding. great that they will not use and or do a retread. No Khan and such. That is a good thing. new Adventure and new Stories. That is the Ticket!.,

8. Browncoat1984 - June 11, 2011

I’d love to see a nod to Carol Marcus in there somewhere. Maybe you won’t do Khan, I hope you don’t but it would be cool to see Carol…and Nurse Chapel. Star Trek needs more female characters in the next movie, but there’s already a plethora of characters available who would make great additions. Chapel, Marcus, Yeomen Rand to name a few. Also, Uhura singing! And Bones has to say “he’s dead Jim.” I’d love to see Karl Urban doing that line in the same exact tone as DeForest Kelley did in the original, and I know he can pull it off!

9. Commodore Mike of the Terran Empire - June 11, 2011

I think it is great that our own Bob Orci comes on and chats with us and looks at some of our ideas. I do hope Bob Orci can use Del Trames name in the Movie. British Naval Dude. That would be a great Honor for our friend who passed away last year.

10. Commodore Mike of the Terran Empire - June 11, 2011

What the court should do is Build a new Engine Room and have Phasers that fire a beam and not a pistal shot.

11. Thorny - June 11, 2011

1… There were lots of storyline suggestions here in the weeks and months after ST2009. I do like the Five Year Mission concept, with Pike giving the 12 starship captains their marching orders. I also like the concept of the next movie ending with the Enterprise finding the Botany Bay just before the credits roll. I suggested an “energy crisis” storyline, perhaps with a protomatter experiment run by a young Carol Marcus.

3… No Trek TV anytime soon, please. Don’t saturate the market again. Let the JJ-verse go three movies at least before Trek has to start competing with itself again.

5. Totally disagree with destroying Vulcan. So they can say “its a whole new universe to tell stories in”. Yes, it is: a worse one.

12. Commodore Mike of the Terran Empire - June 11, 2011

I would love to see Lt. Riley and Lt Bailey and Styles and of course Lt Gary Mitchell and Lee Kelso.

13. MJ - June 11, 2011

Great panel, but I wish they would spend less time doing this outreach stuff and more time working on the 1-year later and counting script.

14. Lousy_Canadian - June 11, 2011

After their first film came out in 09, I’ve been dreaming up fan scripts for the sequel (like I did for the first movie before it). Although I am not a huge fan of Klingons (sacrelige, I know), they would definitely be an interesting part of the sequel. They’ll show their leader Kor and the Klingon Empire rise to prominence, while they’ll show Spock and Kirk’s friendship develop strong and stronger, as well with the rest of the crew. Which leads them to meeting up on a peaceful planet in danger because of the Klingons. Similar to the episode “Errand of Mercy”, but with different side characters and planet setting as well as circumstances.

Just some fan-fic here. :P

15. Buzz Cagney - June 11, 2011

An interesting read.
The thing that most leaped out to me was, and I know this is old news, the way Quinto lobbied for the job where as Pine wasn’t so bothered. Ironic then, for me anyway, that while Quinto was ok as Spock it was Pine that really shone through as Kirk.
Not sure if or how they can redress that in the next movie- or if they even saw it.
Clearly Kirk is the more enimagtic personality but somehow Nimoy’s Spock was able to compete with ShatKirk in a way that Quinto’s couldn’t with Pine’s.
Imo of course.

16. somethoughts - June 11, 2011

Some title suggestions for you Bob :)

Star Date 2260

Star Trek(s)

ST2.0

Final Frontiers

Rise of the Federation

Rise of the Klingons

Settlement Talos IV

Live Long and Prosper

Star Trek Warp 2

Star Trek Dark Matters

Star Trek (A)

Star Trek Year 2.0

If you haven’t watched IP Man yet, please do, you can make a sci fi space movie of IP MAN in space with Star Trek skins.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1AJxXQ7xojE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsLxq1EnBK8&feature=related

17. La Reyne d'Epee - June 11, 2011

In the case of the physics and the science and the science fiction, we had a rule that we kept coming back to, which was “our wives need to understand this movie.”

WTF.

I’m not sure I like what’s implied by this comment. Plenty of women nowadays (apart from your wives of course, chaps) are perfectly capable of appreciating and understanding physics. Shit, honey, some of us even WORK in that field. One thing I didn’t appreciate about the reboot, was the dumbing down of Uhura from being a technician to a linguistic interpreter and mere love interest. Sort that one out next time around, boys.

18. matthias - June 11, 2011

@the team: just make it a real story again. not only action, but some thougtful and critical ideas about our life and society, too.

19. somethoughts - June 11, 2011

#17

I think they meant for our non trekkie wives to enjoy ie emotional involving story that not only appeals to Trek fans but movie fans.

20. Odkin - June 11, 2011

Good scripts do not come from frat boy writing committees.

They come from one person with vision and passion sitting down at a GD desk and pouring his heart out to earn his fat paycheck. The producer might pass it through polishing hands later, but the act of real creation is not a team effort.

Since writers are on PR tours now, does that mean PR flacks are busy writing scripts? From the IQ level of some recent movies, I’d guess probably so.

21. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 11, 2011

A love story between Kirk and Spock? Never noticed it myself. Dealing with emotions like resentment, grief and anger, coming to an understanding and greater respect for each other. I guess that is the start of a “spiritual” kind of love (for want of a better word) that Kirk and Spock ultimately had in the prime universe. I suppose when I think of a love story, I immediately think of a romantic kind of story. I do not believe that Kirk and Spock’s relationship was in any way romantic.

Please, please, please – no Carol Marcus or anyone like her. This Kirk deserves better…

I believe that Chris Pine’s sister, Katie, talked him into doing the audition for Star Trek. I will be forever grateful to that lady.

22. Bill Peters - June 11, 2011

I like to See Klingons or Gorn as main Villains, and I like everything they said in the interview.

23. La Reyne d'Epee - June 11, 2011

Somethoughts – did they dumb it down for the non-trekkie males too?

24. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#23

The movie sold a lot of tickets no?

25. La Reyne d'Epee - June 12, 2011

Somethoughts: Also, I’ve never seen a more wanton misappropriation of the laws of physics in my life! I sincerely doubt that any of them have any sort of handle on THAT subject…

26. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#23

I believe so, they made the movie for fans of movies. ST2009 was more accessible than say nemesis, in print its easy to misinterpret comments made.

27. La Reyne d'Epee - June 12, 2011

Somethoughts: Believe it or not, women do buy tickets for movies that don’t patronise them. I liked the original Trek because of a lot of the messages it put out. eg A black woman can have senior responsibility, can execute a technical role. If they carry on in that vein, I won’t be buying tickets in future.

28. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#25

Its a sci fi movie, I watch it with that kind of expectations. Reading up on einstien, newton, hawkings is done outside of movie fun time. I enjoy T2 cuz its cool, I dont nitpick at how it violates laws of universe

29. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#27

I thought spocks mom, uhura were strong characters and if you watch closely, spock respects his mom very much.

I really dont understand how you feel st09 mistreats woman

30. La Reyne d'Epee - June 12, 2011

Somethoughts: I’ll leave you to enjoy the dumb then. Lowest common denominator and all that. But it won’t be Star Trek.

31. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#30

Everyone is entitled to their opinions, likes and dislikes.

Did you like inception and tng?

32. Tom - June 12, 2011

Star Trek Ascension, best title I can come up with and would work for multiple plots.

33. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#30

You are allowed to like any movie you enjoy, myself as long as I was entertained and the movie made me feel inspired or challenged my senses, I am a happy camper. I do know I am picky with the type of films I like.

For the record, male and females are equals and star trek works because it shows diversity, family solving problems.

34. MJ - June 12, 2011

“our wives need to understand this movie”

Memo to Orci and Company — we are now in the 21st century.

35. Cap'n Kirk - June 12, 2011

Bob -

Interesting point about you reading some of the books. Without giving away what you may be borrowing from (unless of course you want to hint at it), what are your favorite Trek books? I always very much enjoyed “Federation” & “Enterprise: The First Adventure” (about George Kirk, not Archer), or of course anything by Judith & Garfield Reeves Stevens myself.

36. La Reyne d'Epee - June 12, 2011

MJ – my point above exactly.

37. Cygnus-X1 - June 12, 2011

Damon should have a look at this site from time to time.

There’s no shortage of unqualified praise and support for his work here.

In response to his request of the boards, I would re-iterate my constructive criticism and alternative ideas, much of which has been expressed by others here:

- Have a more substantial, more powerfully developed theme throughout the story arc. A motley bunch coming together to save the world wasn’t a bad theme, but the only real tension amongst them was between Kirk and Spock and their struggle for leadership. And that didn’t involve much in the way of differing ideologies or shifts in the balance of power. Spock lacked the daring-do to deviate from a text-book course of action, either because he was emotionally compromised or because his thinking is normally constrained to field-tested courses, or both. Kirk couldn’t contain his dissent with Spock’s leadership decision, so the latter kicked the former off the ship. Kirk finds a way back onto the ship and gets Spock to come unglued so that McCoy can officially relieve the emotionally compromised Vulcan of duty. Kirk then takes command, with the full support of the now-acquiescent Spock, and saves the day. A harder-fought, less neat resolution to the main theme would be nice. It would also be nice for the theme to last through, and not be resolved prior to, the climax of the story. Once the struggle between Kirk and Spock was resolved, the rest of the story, including the climax, really wasn’t dependent upon the story’s main theme. It didn’t really matter how the Enterprise came up against Nero at that point. Apart from our supposed appreciation of seeing the former rivals working together and the meaningfulness of Kirk being honored by Star Fleet, the movie after the Kirk/Spock resolution could have been tacked onto the end of many different stories.

- Have a science-fiction theme for what has historically been a science-fiction franchise. As has been said by several people on these boards, Star Trek ’09 was more a space adventure movie than a sci-fi movie. Of course, Star Trek has always been rich in stories that were not dependent upon science-fiction, but being that you’re re-booting the franchise, it would be nice to have a science-fiction story before you start going in other directions. Look to TWOK for a good example of a movie that did an excellent job of both — the science fiction premise of “Project Genesis” combined with a variation on the literary theme from Moby Dick.

- Make sure that, in some way, the scenes, events and main characters of the film are serving the film’s main theme and story arc. The monster-chase scene on Delta Vega was an extraneous action scene in an already-action packed movie whose breakneck pace seemed to pander to the audience’s weakness for constant stimulation and instant gratification. This scene was a waste of a lot of screen time that could have been better spent on making the story’s main theme deeper and more powerful, and on making the villain’s motive stronger, more meaningful and better expressed.

Maybe my criticism here is ignorant and bone-headed and Damon, Bob and Alex are wise to ignore it, but they can’t rightly say that it’s not trying to be constructive or offer alternative ideas.

38. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#34 and #36

I see your point, I am sure they are sorry for saying it, they prolly meant for fans of movies to understand/like.

Very easy to offend/misunderstand in quotes and interviews.

39. USS Enterprise B - June 12, 2011

Rise of the Federation, Final Frontier, and Where No Man Has Gone Before, are three titles I can dig for the sequel, if we’re going Dark Knight style by avoiding a redundant “Star Trek” in the title.

It’s hard to know if any of these titles are even fitting though since we don’t know the story yet.. for all we know Bob could blow up the Federation. Lets wait and see…

Other potential titles I can dig for the sequel are Enterprise, New World(s), and Journey (trek = journey).

40. MJ - June 12, 2011

@36. Yea, my wife loves Trek and I’ve got my 10-year old daughter loving Trek, and so I could do without this “Trek Rat Pack” outdated boys club nonsense.

41. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#39

Nice

#40

LoL

42. naseweis - June 12, 2011

“You don’t want to see a remake, you want to see a new movie.” Thank you. :-)

43. Spectre-7 - June 12, 2011

Though it was really apparent to me in ST 2009, I really don’t feel the Kirk/Spock love story, as they put it…

Maybe that’s cuz I’m a guy. And I don’t think their mainstream dumbed-down “target” audience would either…

“Dude! Kirk and the pointy-ear guy are soo gay!”

44. Capt. of the U.S.S. Anduril - June 12, 2011

Bob Orci- I have a quick idea for a Trek CG animated series that could be done without impacting the movies. Let us see the voyages of the U.S.S. Kelvin as they would have been without Nero’s incursion through time!

45. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

I dare them to make it 2hrs and 30mins of orgasmic epicness winning

46. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#43

I always saw it as a bromance, a mutual respect and genuine love for each other. Not brokeback mountain love but more like bart and milhouse love or homer and flanders love or forrest gump n lt dang love

47. MJ - June 12, 2011

@43 “And I don’t think their mainstream dumbed-down “target” audience would either…”

Ah, you must mean Orci’s, Lindelof’s and Kurtzman’s wives, right? :-))

48. Trekprincess - June 12, 2011

I’m forever grateful for them making New Trek and for everything they have done so brilliantly in the last film :):) so the script is nearly finished that’s great news.

49. Chasco - June 12, 2011

#29 “I thought spocks mom, uhura were strong characters”

In what way? We barely saw Amanda, and Uhura had been changed from an independent, clever, technically-savvy officer who had made it to the bridge of the Enterprise on merit – into a dumb bimbo who left her post to go cuddle her boyfriend, and was only on board in the first place because she’d slept with him.
Then again, the writers also changed Scotty from an authoritative, brilliant, tough, professional guy who commanded respect – into a clowning idiot who’s there for laughs.

Still, so long as their poor little airhead wives were able to follow the plot (once they’d popped the dinner in the oven, bathed the children, cleaned the house, put on a nice frock and had their hair done). Sheesh!

50. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 12, 2011

#49 – “Still, so long as their poor little airhead wives were able to follow the plot (once they’d popped the dinner in the oven, bathed the children, cleaned the house, put on a nice frock and had their hair done). Sheesh!”

Up yours!

51. Geekette - June 12, 2011

#49 in buckets.

52. AJ - June 12, 2011

The Kirk/Spock “love story” is legendary in Trek lore. But, please throw in McCoy as well. That is something I hope the new film does.

While no-one can truly recreate that chemistry from TOS, Pine, Quinto and Urban are fine actors, and can do their best.

53. LukasKetner - June 12, 2011

Enough with the ‘wives’ comment already. You are all looking for offense where none was intended because you have nothing better to talk about.

54. Buzz Cagney - June 12, 2011

#50 perhaps their wive’s are just not Trek fans? Just a thought.
In your rush to take offence perhaps you should have stopped to consider that possibilty, because thats how I read it.

55. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 12, 2011

“Lindelof: In the case of the physics and the science and the science fiction, we had a rule that we kept coming back to, which was “our wives need to understand this movie.”

I think Damon Lindelof could have phrased it better, however, I have actually read male posters claim that Star Trek was made for guys. I believe they were being quite serious. In reality, Star Trek has always attracted a much greater male than female audience, even though some of the best TOS episodes turned out to be written by a woman, Dorothy C Fontana. Go figure.

To me, it is about acknowledging certain basic differences between men and women, apart from the obvious biological ones. The reality is that the brains/minds of men and women are wired up a bit differently. Although there are always exceptions, there does appear to be a definite pattern and it affects the way each sex learns, perceives and relates to the world.

In many ways, I tend to fall into the stereotypical female type (and in other ways not such much perhaps) as I am more interested in the dynamics of the relationships between crew members on the Enterprise and wanting to see my favourite character have a healthy emotional/sexual life, just as much as seeing him perform well as the captain, dealing with whatever may come…

Frankly, I really could not give two cents what the engineering section looks life, (who the hell knows what a warp capable engineering would look like anyway? – sheesh) as long as it makes the ship go where the captain wants it to go. Nacelles – fat, thin, who gives a…? As long as it is a nice looking ship, that has good senses that show the unexpected, the beauty, the frightening awesomeness of space, that keeps the crew protected or not – I don’t need or want to know that this Trek 09 Enterprise has a different whatever from the Enterprise in TWOK, and on and on it has gone/goes on… A concise explanation of some astrophysics, MWI etc whatever necessary to the understanding of the overall plot, is all I need or want.

“(once they’d popped the dinner in the oven, bathed the children, cleaned the house, put on a nice frock and had their hair done). Sheesh!”
What is so airheaded about that? Anyway, what time zone are you living in? I mean, who uses the word “frock” anymore? Sheesh!

God, why are some people so mean-spirited? I mean, honestly -
“into a dumb bimbo who left her post to go cuddle her boyfriend, and was only on board in the first place because she’d slept with him.”

Lt Uhura was NOT a dumb bimbo. She went to comfort a close friend who had just LOST EVERYTHING – get it, people, EVERYTHING!!!

Lt Uhura got to be on the Enterprise because she was qualified to be there, not because she slept with Spock. So you actually saw them sleep together, did you? I must have missed that part in the movie, however I did see a young cadet called Kirk attempting a docking with a green woman, but got interrupted…

I don’t think it is the writers who have a low opinion of women. It is many of the film goers.

56. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 12, 2011

Buzz Cagney – I was taking exception to the comment about women/wives who do domestic duties and actually take care of their own children rather than have nannies and/or daycare workers do it for them, being labeled “airheads”.

Lots of people aren’t Star Trek fans. It is about making the films attractive and comprehensible to a wide audience and that does not mean dumbing it down. Star Trek 09 was not dumbed down. In fact, it is amazing how many supposedly intelligent Trek fans did not appear to understand certain basic concepts of the movie and so decided to call it “dumbed down for the masses” and other such twaddle. It certainly happened on other sites.

57. DJT - June 12, 2011

You know what? I thought Trek was really cool and awesome …so I went and I posted it.

:)

58. Pierre - June 12, 2011

Unsure as to what Lindelof means by “a 70-page outline”. An outline is usually a summary of a (completed) document. It sounds more like they got the gist of the story but need to fill in some blanks. If they need/want suggestions, it would help to be more specific. Here’s one: Trek is the triad of Kirk, Spock and McCoy, each character being crucial to the development of the other.

59. Mel - June 12, 2011

“The first one was about, “Spock is pretty emotional.””

Yes, he is emotional. But he still shouldn’t act like a human in the sequel. That would be boring and out of character. So please no more kissing scenes with him in front of other people! I think Vulcans are much more private people in such things.

“Damon Lindelof appeared to imply that the impact of the destruction of Vulcan will carry into the sequel.”

That is great to hear! :-)
I just hope you won’t let Klingons be the main enemy of the Federation in the next movie. They lost a lot of ships against Nero and should be to weak for an attack. Klingons were also done to death in the previous Star Trek series/movies and I really prefer other races. For example the Gorn. They could try to profit from the Federation weakness.

“Lindelof said they believed key to Trek is “huge emotion” and friendship and Star Trek 2009 was really a love story between Kirk and Spock.”

I agree! Just please add McCoy to this friendship in the sequel. There was for example barely any interaction between McCoy and Spock. McCoy should get overall more scenes in the sequel.

Otherwise I like to see Keenser again. He is one of the few really strange looking aliens. But please don’t use him only as a comedic relief. He should do something useful like helping Scotty to repair the ship.

And I am all for at least cameos of Andorians, Tellarites, Hortas and other TOS races. Just add members of those races to the Enterprise crew. Let them go through a corridor or let them sit in the mess or something similar. I just like to see them as part of the crew so that the Enterprise crew would be less “human only”. There are just too few aliens on the Enterprise.

And there are also too few female characters. Uhura is the only one. So why not a female as a security chief? That position is empty so far. So just give Giotto a sex change.

http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Giotto

He is a very minor characters so I don’t think many people will mind it. It is not like what BSG did with Starbuck.

60. TrekkerChick - June 12, 2011

#59

Already done! Natasha Yar!

61. Devon - June 12, 2011

Some people here are a little too P.C.

Sounds like in the next few weeks the ball is really going to get going on the sequel with everyone all ready to go.

62. Iva - June 12, 2011

“Wouldn’t say what classic Star Trek elements they will take from for the sequel, but did confirm they would not be using “Spock’s Brain””

Mhm, this one has already been made clear in the first movie. This version of Spock is not a predominantly Vulcan hybrid like Gene Spock, but a halfling with 50/50 biology who just needs to “loosen up”.
As such – all of the knowledge of specific Vulcan brain physiology, chemistry and the way it makes their behavior necessary for survival and mental stability will no longer apply to him too. Forget not just “Spock’s Brain” but every episode there is.
He is still called Spock though, for some reason.

63. trekker 5 - June 12, 2011

Bob,(and everybody else) you have me really looking forward to Trek12 again!! :) Thanks for the pick me up,I really needed it!

64. Hugh Hoyland - June 12, 2011

These guys were not “dumbing down” anything when they wrote Star Trek 09.

They wrote it so that it could COMMUNICATE to a larger audience (Not just trekkers). And they succeded like no other Trek movie could.

And it doesnt mean that their wife is dumb because they werent into Trek (TOS). It just didnt reach em man (Communicate)

This movie DID. Now if only I can learn to write like that! :]

65. Rick - June 12, 2011

I hope they have learned from “Generations” not to kill off one of their main characters! (Kirk). Also it will be good to see Kirk fathering a son in the next films. That will present more story line as well. But please….no remakes! Just use TOS as a guideline.

66. Iva - June 12, 2011

“And they succeded like no other Trek movie could.”

Really? Even after raping it for the sake of popularity, it was still not popular in the end.
The hype was big, I’ll give you that. Lots of money spent on promotion and showing it in your face.

But in the end, it was neither better story-vise, nor did it make most compared to other ST movies.

67. Alientraveller - June 12, 2011

The social ineptitude being displayed here by accusations that Lindelof’s comment was sexist is astounding. Who do you want to represent the audience when the writers check to make sure the script is making sense?

Anyway, interesting nuggets, it would have been odd not to mention Vulcan’s destruction, and I look forward to seeing the bonds between the crew develop.

68. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 12, 2011

#67 Iva – Have you ever been raped?

You are not the only one to use the word “rape” way too liberally and very inappropriately. Others have also done it on other sites. No such event took place, not in the actual movie nor was committed by any of those involved in the writing, directing or production of this movie.

Rape is a very serious crime – one of sexual violence. It is a prosecutable offense, as it should be.

#66 I could not agree more.

69. SirBroiler - June 12, 2011

Less than 80 pages!

Kirk is in love with a young scientist Carol Marcus. She tries to resist his advances and insists her work, about which she is quite secretive, leaves her no time for love. He finally charms his way in – but she leaves abruptly after one night without saying goodbye.

He then discovers the focus of her tireless work: The Guardian of Forever. Discovered by the Federation and now a top secret research facility under supervision of Section 31 and it’s leader, surprise…it’s Admiral Pike.

Meanwhile, Spock has become despondent over time. While his service has been exemplary, his personal relationships, especially with Uhura, have become severely strained. He is nearly consumed with suppressing his feelings about loss of Vulcan. His exposure to Prime Spock begins an obsession with finding a way to go back. To save Vulcan. To save his mother.

Kirk, risking his career, decides to help Spock and tells him about the Guardian project. Together, they secretly execute some ruse get the Enterprise to the planet in the hope of convincing Carol to help use the Guardian to Save Vulcan. In the heated debate, Carol reveals to Kirk that she is pregnant.

The Kirk/Spock/McCoy ruse somehow draws the attention of the helmet-wearing Klingons, who execute a sneak attack on the Enterprise, damaging the ship, loss of crew, etc. Very dramatic death scenes, Scotty’s nephew, etc. Klingons board, retrieve information about the Guardian from Kirk’s computer. A team of Klingons goes to the planet to take over the facility and control of the Guardian.

Kirk and Spock and the remaining crew must now stop the Klingons from using the Guardian as a weapon and take back the Enterprise and destroy the Klingon ship. In a classic hand-to-hand battle, Kirk defeats who we’ve all believed was the Klingon commander. But he was a decoy. The real commanding officer has Carol at phaser-point near the mouth of the portal. He removes his helmet – he is not Klingon at all, but Human. He is Khan.

In tribute to Montalban – the new Khan monologues the entire story of how he and the crew of the Botany Bay were discovered by Klingons. How his crew overpowered the Klingon crew and captured their ship. How they intercepted information about the Guardian Now, with the power of the Guardian, he could rule more than a planet or the federation, but time and space itself. Just before leaping through the portal, Carol puts up a fight and is killed.

Kirk – who now hates Klingons and really hates Khan convinces Spock, McCoy to follow him through the portal. So they do …To Be Continued

70. steve-o - June 12, 2011

“if you watch the movie you would know that no one could die and nothing bad could happen to anybody, because they have to grow up and go on the adventures we saw them have. ”

tell that to the people of Vulcan.. :p

71. VZX - June 12, 2011

When it comes to the science, I hope that they don’t eff it up so much next time. I mean, the whole “wives test” should not be a good measure, my wife is not a physicist and she is quite capable of understanding a good story. It is true that too much techno-babble can clutter up the movie, but you should still not use lazy, sloppy writing.

Ex: Supernova threatening entire galaxy?
Magnetic distortion from Saturn’s rings?

C’mon, these are easy things to fix. Saturn has a very weak magnetic field, and the rings have none!

Like Lindelof stated, fan criticism is great, but better with suggestions. So, I suggest to research the science better before you have Chekov, a supposed “boy-genius”, spout such ridiculous-ness like “The magnetic distortion from the planet’s rings will make us invisible to Nero’s sensors.” Umm..Checkov, wait, what? Magnetic distortion? From the rings? Rings made of ice and rock? Since when can rock and ice create magnetic distortions? And since when can the magnetic distortion from any planetary body be strong enough to mess up 24th century sensors, when 21st century sensors work fine?

Ok, sorry, too much, I know. Guys, just please do better with the science next time, cool?

72. denny cranium - June 12, 2011

BobOrci- please channel the themes from ST TWOK.
It tetsted Kirk beyond his capabilities and he paid a price for it.
Push your Kirk beyond his limits. Have MCoy challenge him on some of his command decisions.
Have Mc Coy in Spocks face as well.
Friendhip and loyalty. If time has passed let the characters feel more at ease with each other.
Have Sulu and Kirk develop a better relationship as well.
As they saved each others life on the Romulan drilling platform that has to form a bond.
Stop the Uhura/Spock romance. It’s not necessary and its distracting

73. Number 3 - June 12, 2011

just a lil title suggestion for the sequel

TREK 2.0

simple,clear,no need for the “STAR”.people will know what it is

74. Startrekker - June 12, 2011

The Romulans would make for a good villain. With the destruction of Vulcan and the Federation weakened, and one maybe could argue weaker Klingon Empire with the loss of their ships, this would make for an ideal time for the Romulans to take advantage of the situation. Plus we’be never had a strong Romulans presence in any Star Trek movie (Nemesis doesn’t count since that was more the Remans).

75. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 12, 2011

I wonder whose ideas Damon would be happy to *steal*.

There is a beagle which needs to appear in the next movie, so that the beagle can walk all over/massage a planking Kirk; a Menosian planetary system; a wonderful steamy sensuous love expressed between Kirk and Jasmia; a little Beatles music – Help – Kirk will need it due to his youth and inexperience, and of course,

the triumvirate’s uniforms all ripped to shreds and the three men hanging onto vines (have no idea where this scene should go, but should look very good…) I guess it will be an unashamedly contrived and gratuitous scene containing male gorgeousness – works for me. JJ – you can go round and round these guys with your camera as many times as… slowly though, slowly… all angles, all perspectives. Surely, no better way to (re)acquaint everyone with Kirk, Spock and McCoy. I say, in those words made so memorable by a young James Kirk – “Do it. Do it. Do it!”

Message to Pine, Quinto, Urban – some gym workouts may (I do say, may) help with that scene – got to have those pecs et al… looking at their best. We will appreciate your noble efforts!

Have I missed anything? Oh dear, no phaser fire, explosions, scenes of torture, mad villains, imploding planets… oh well, who gives a crap about all that stuff anyway?

Hang on, just remembered – Scotty sits on a prickle, gets vocally explosive…with Kirk standing nearby desperately trying to hide his smirk. (There – got an explosion). No ass-kicking scene for Uhura though. I guess that’s what you guys, the Trek writers, will have to sort out.

Bob, Damon, Alex – I hope you are all studiously taking notes here. This is important. You know, I am actually quite serious about (most of) this.

76. fizzben - June 12, 2011

I really like these guys. They really do their homework while writing for trek. As a fan I really appreciate that.
You guys (fans) need to stop being so anal. Every science fiction story has to stretch physics a little to make the story work. Do you think we have the laws of physics nailed down in this century? Maybe a few laws are readjusted in the 23rd century , ahem, warp drive.
Who dosen’t bounce their ideas off their wives, or significant others? Come on, sometimes you need a little outside reassurance or someone you really trust to tell you your idea stinks.
My wish list for Star Trek ’12 is plenty of Enterprise action, some gritty jaw dropping character action, dump the Spock/Uhura romance, Chekov needs to be a little less nerdy, Scotty needs to get his hands dirty in the engine room especially after he removes the beer tanks and McCoy and Spock definitely have to have a major argument in this movie. One of Bones best movie lines : That green blooded son of a bitch, it’s his revenge for all those arguments he lost.
I’m very much looking forward to the next movie, please don’t delay it!

77. Christopher Roberts - June 12, 2011

I’m glad they came out and said directly that Vulcan’s destruction has to be an ongoing plot line. It would be completely wrong to follow Star Trek 2009 with an adventure that could take place during TOS – just minus Vulcan. That would have made me very uncomfortable with this whole Alternate Universe. Nero’s actions have to have consequences. What would happen if you removed Vulcan from any other period in Star Trek’s history? Think about it.

Which races would benefit? Which would suffer?

Who would extend a hand of friendship to survivors looking to resettle?

Would that create animosity between say Humans and an old enemy taking advantage of the situation?

How weakened would the Federation become, without one of their keystone members?

78. More Shat Please - June 12, 2011

Unfortunately, given that they did not put anything about the prime universe still existing in the actual movie, and given that Trek does essentially have a sort of Back to the Future style where you CAN change history, the prime timeline is gone. If they want to establish the prime universe still exists, they have to actually put it on screen.

79. TrekMadeMeWonder - June 12, 2011

Star Trek 2.0? I,d like to see a ST 1.1!
Seriously, it seems like the writers are making a REAL effort to fix some of the problems with ST09′s errors and satisfy us with an original story. GOOD.
Now if we could just get us back to the prime universe.

For me, knowing there is parralell universe, I would have an irresitable desire to see it. Especially if I were a Vulcan.

80. Christopher Roberts - June 12, 2011

76. (cont) Then again, Star Trek is about a ship exploring space. How do you tap into that AND also move forward what Nero (unwittingly) set in motion?

The science/exploration theme in Wrath of Khan is still there, despite all the action and human drama. It comes in the form of the Genesis Device, Ceti Alpha V shifting orbit, and a new star system/planet coalescing from a Nebula.

Transfer that now and there’s a new home to be found for the Vulcans. Where that is. How unusual it might be. Who’s for it and who’s against. How that matters to Spock. His father’s involved or Uhura? Why it’s a problem for Kirk. An enemy claiming for their Empire. Somebody from his past on the planet like a lover from his Academy days. Or finding himself at odds with Pike over the right course of action.

81. Enda - June 12, 2011

“As of right now there is kind of a 75 or 80 page half script/half…I don’t know what it is…”
Is that before they start doing the drafts to perfect it?
If so…. that is Ridiculous. I think we’ll be waiting another while yet for this movie.
Which frustrates me because, as they say, they’ve created this situation whereby anything goes now basically. A feast for the imagination with no limitations practically. Yet…. they only have a “kind of a 75 or 80 page half script/half…I don’t know what it is…” after all of this time.

But off course if, when the film does come out whenever that will be, and it’s fantastic, it will have been worth the wait obviously and I’d prefer them to take their time rather then rush into it. But I REALLY can’t understand what is taking them so long to punch this thing out.

82. Christopher Roberts - June 12, 2011

78. Reads that last sentence back. Oh dear. I’ve just basically come up with Insurrection again, haven’t I? Similar moral dilemma for sure.

83. Mel - June 12, 2011

@ 60 TrekkerChick

That is quite a stupid comment. Sure we already had a female security chief in a previous Star Trek series, but that isn’t an argument against a female security chief in the new movie.

We also had a male captain, first officer and chief engineer in TOS. So according to you there shouldn’t have been a male Picard, Riker and La Forge in TNG or what??? I mean it was “already done” before! eyeroll

I guess you don’t think there is a difference between Kirk, Picard and Archer. I mean they are all male and captain of a starship named Enterprise. So they are of course the same character.

A female security chief in the next movie could be of course only a Tasha Yar copy. I mean all women with the same job are of of course exactly the same people.

I hope my sarcasm is obvious.

84. Mel - June 12, 2011

Maybe they should give the role of chief security officer to a female Andorian and don’t even base the character on Giotto. This would improve the gender and alien balance at the same time. The Andorians are one of the four founding races of the Federation, but they were unfortunately quite ignored in TOS, TNG, DS9 and VOY. They were great in ENT through.

85. The Optimist - June 12, 2011

In my opinion, I never really bought the alternate reality excuse anyway because I can’t really get into a 2nd version of the caracters that I like. When I see Shatner as Kirk he’s Kirk. When I see Pine as Kirk he’s Kirk. Let’s face it, this is a reboot( the 2009 movie). The last movie was a reboot of the original star trek, and I’m fine with that because at the end of the day with my imagination I can choose what I believe is Trek or not. They couldn’t put the old 60s Enterprise bridge on the big screen or the BIG screen(IMAX) and make it look believable. And yes I know Berman and his crew did it on TNG, DS9 and ENT but they where working with a much smaller canvas! So JJ and his writers reboot Trek and use Alternate Reality as an excuse to make us Trekies ( and by the way Orci, I was a Trekie long before Trekers was ever used) feel better. Sorry for the rant.

86. trekker 5 - June 12, 2011

#83,The Optimist,wow. And I can get mad some times,but wow. Oh,and I don’t want to get you mad at me or anything,but ‘Trekers’ is spelled ‘Trekkers’. And I would know,well,because….thats my name.

87. Dee - lvs moon' surface - June 12, 2011

Great, I’ll take care of my life for a little… and a bit of Star Trek sequel appears… But looks great!

“in a state of quantum flux “… it must mean “top secret “… right, boborci? LOL…

“You don’t want to see a remake, you want to see a new movie.”….said Lindelof … definitely YES! … for me at least….

“our wives need to understand this movie.” …said Lindelof … funny … OK, blame their wives … LOL

:-) :-)

88. Adolescent Nightmare - June 12, 2011

77.
Yeah, good luck with that strategy.

89. The Optimist - June 12, 2011

My bad trekker 5, you are correct. Typed too fast :). And don’t get me wrong, if you want to be called trekker then that’s ok too. I was just responding to something Bryan Burke said, Orci told him that the use of Trekkies was incorrect and that all fans want to be called Trekkers, which some do obviously but not all :)

90. Trekprincess - June 12, 2011

The Optimist I wasn’t at all a Star Trek fan before I seen the Star Trek reboot to me I love old and new Trek :):)

91. BAMA - June 12, 2011

RE: “our wives need to understand this movie”

They did not say “women need to understand this movie.” They are talking about THEIR spouses. Have you considered that they got together and noted that none of THEIR wives were Trek fans, and that they would provide a good test group for whether concepts could be understood by non Trek fans?

92. The Optimist - June 12, 2011

Oh I love the new movie! I thought it was great! It felt like star trek to me. I guess that’s the point I’m trying to make, even though it doesn’t look like older treks it was still star trek to me. I don’t have to rely on “it is an alternate reality” to accept it.

93. El Chup - June 12, 2011

I have a problem with the notion that Star Trek is about the relationship between Kirk and Spock. This is totally wrong.

Star Trek is, when it’s doing it right, about moral choices and the human spirit. That’s what boldly going where no man has gone before was all about…and, as entertaining as the movie was, Trek 09 sorely missed that, Still, I allowed for that since it was an origin story. But, to this fans mind, Trek ’12 will be a failure if it’s just about moving the characters forward. It needs to have those characters out there facing difficult moral choices or questions of what it means to be human. All of the TOS movies did that, and most of the series, even the supposedly bad ones. If this is not done and it’s just more villan of the week action, then Roddenberry’s spirit will have been laid to rest.

94. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#55

Well said keachick

95. Christopher Roberts - June 12, 2011

I’m sure I’ve mentioned this before BUT I’d resist the urge to do Klingons.

Sure they’re synonymous with Star Trek and everybody knows about them. CSI investigate murders at Comic Con and the suspect will be one of those fans, in full make-up – turtle glued to his forehead, spitting that he didn’t do it! Media outlets zoom in on the guy taking it too seriously, queuing outside cinemas.

Klingons simply don’t need any more exposure in the films. No BIG BAD Klingon villains please. Leave it until the third Abramsverse outing. You could have them as background aliens and they would be appreciated just fine.

Romulans are still poorly defined. They’re still Mark Lenard’s unnamed Commander or Andreas Katsulas’ Tomalak. Perhaps Vreenak from DS9 – amazing since Stephen McHattie didn’t have THAT MUCH screentime. Nero was a little limited and frankly any race could have been brought in to be the brute force that smashed up the Kelvin, Vulcan and almost Earth. ROMULANS are more calculating and manipulative than him.

Why would you want to do a second film featuring Romulans?

Tom Hanks seems to dig them! I wouldn’t cast him as a peaceful one however, as he recently joked about on BBC’s Graham Norton chat show.

Watch their episodes from across the series… Enterprise had a BIG historical event looming on the horizon – Earth/Romulan War, just when the axe fell. The writers have some scope based on “Babel One” and “United”, “Balance of Terror” to shed light on what happened between us and them.

When Nero crashed in and created an alternate universe, by killing Kirk’s father and destroying the U.S.S. Kelvin – - it exposed what Romulans looked like. A fact we either never knew before or some part of Archer’s Starfleet went to great pains to cover up. Maybe they feared for the future of the Federation, if it got out that an ally humans were in bed with, were closely related to a bitter enemy.

The Romulans had made the first strike and it wouldn’t be for another two decades, that it came out Nero wasn’t acting on their behalf.

96. Christopher Roberts - June 12, 2011

93. (cont) Maybe Nero initiated a long conflict between the Federation and the Romulans of this universe. Flared up a war while this Enterprise crew were in their infancy and Pike was a younger serving officer. Klingons became a lesser threat and we didn’t provoke them as much – unlike the ongoing enemy they became in the 23rd Century of the Prime Universe.

Also Kirk’s rise to the Captaincy is faster due to Starfleet’s loses in such a war or continuing threat, that all stems back to the event he was born into.

Nero attacks the U.S.S. Kelvin. The Federation sees that as… the Romulans attacked and destroyed the Kelvin. Somehow they didn’t deny it and peace in the Alpha Quadrant crumbled.

97. Allenburch - June 12, 2011

Definitely agree with Damon regarding how often a poster will do the “I HATE WHAT YOU DID….” game.

Frankly, if we all care about Trek so much, and if we all claim to have LEARNED from Trek so much, why flame so much?

I definitely agree that more posters should…have fun…but also work together more in the manner of a great starship crew working together, offering suggestions without having a temper tantrum if the commanding officer doesn’t go with every single suggestion offered.

Does that make sense?

98. miguelito1701 - June 12, 2011

They said about 2009 it will not be a reboot and just a lot of fancy words, but it was a reboot, so I cannot believe what they are saying now.
But I´ll still watch it, just to see Leonard Nimoy or Karl Urban again.

99. Christopher Roberts - June 12, 2011

94. correction – Starfleet’s losses NOT loses. Casualties in a war. Lack of recruits making it to be Captain.

100. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#93

Another possibility is that the borg detected the signal from the borgified Narada and has sent a borg cube to investigate, sensing mass destruction of 47 warbirds and dragging the borg into the alpha quadrant 80+ yrs earlier.

So we have the tos crew battling it out with tngs and star treks most feared and cool villains, the borg.

Kirkcutis or spockcutis or pikecutis anyone?

101. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

Just call the new movie;

Resistance is Futile

102. James - June 12, 2011

All I know is Harry Mudd needs to be a recurring character somehow.

103. Joseph - June 12, 2011

@17:

They didn’t say “all wives” they said “our wives.” Given that it’s a group that contains three specific women, I wouldn’t say that’s all that sexist.

Frankly it would be rather interesting to me if, perchance, the Nero thing actually caused the Romulans to become substantialy less powerful in this new universe. I always kind of got the sense during that era that the Romulans were really rather bit players who the Klingons thought they could use as pawns because no one really knew anything about them, aside from the fact that their cloaking device gave them a tactical advantage. Their ships were very small, apparently not that fast, and relatively fragile until they got Klingon designs. Then the Klingons started supplying them with advanced weapons and technology and the Romulans used that to become a superpower capable of giving their former benefactors a strong metaphorical kick in their metaphorical crotch and go their own way.
After seeing what Nero’s ship did to their fleet though, it wouldn’t surprise me at all if the Klingons were no longer willing to risk arming the Romulans with anything more dangerous than a strong spork. Which actually means quite a lot: no Klingon cruisers to augment their BOP fleet, no Romulan cloaking device for the Klingons, and quite possibly a Romulan empire which is too militarily weak to force the Federation to sign a treaty stating that they are forbidden to develop cloaking technology of their own. The possibilities are quite far-reaching…

104. James - June 12, 2011

@Somethoughts Interesting idea! I wonder how primitive of those Borg might seem in comparison to the Borg of TNG. Given that every time they assimilate a new species, they incorporate that culture and technology into their own.. the possibilities for a truly unique take on the Borg are endless!

105. James - June 12, 2011

@101 I really hope JJ’s team sees your comments. Going in a slightly different direction, maybe the Klingons go so far as to start a war with the Romulans, crippling them even further.. perhaps sparking a Federance-Klingon alliance.. or even a Romulan-Federation alliance? But aside from that, a war between Romulus and Klingon at this time would change the relationships between the three “super powers”

106. Odkin - June 12, 2011

Why do people bother publishing their personal fan fiction here as some sort of “proposal”?

First, they are all amateur, nerdy, undramatic fan-wank nonsense.

Second, on the teeny tiny possibility that one of these “proposals” is actually good, publishing it here *absolutely guarantees* that it will never ever be used. Ever. In any medium.

As far as the team’s comments, I find their statement “our wives need to understand it” to actually be LAUDABLE. Unfortunately, I also find it completely at odds with anyting they have ever written.

107. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#104

Everyone and anyone is allowed to speak their mind.

If you dont like it skip to the next comment, nobody needs to hear your hate.

108. Odkin - June 12, 2011

I didn’t ask why people were *allowed* to post their fanfic here. I asked why they bothered. Even though most of the ideas are useless, plagarism laws assure that they are throwing their ideas away.

I’ll further add that I wouldn;t be surprised if one day Orci’s agent and or lawyer suggested he REALLY stop visiting here. If he is reads an idea he likes, or even one he simply shares, he is exposing himself to credible accusation of theft if he uses it.

Maybe Anthony needs to post something that says “any idea you post here you are giving away to whoever wants to make a profit of it, with no credit or compensation to you”

If you think any of this is “hate”, then you lead a very sheltered and immature life.

109. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#106

Anyone with a brain knows posting here is in all good fun, something you have missed. Anyone afraid of their idea of being stolen simply should not post on the internet, common sense imo and the legal/privacy info is pretty clear.

If bob uses ideas here great if not, its all in good fun.

110. Dee - lvs moon' surface - June 12, 2011

Orci: “So, like the first one, it will feel like Trek, but it will also chart new ground.”

OMG… I ‘m so curious about this… Please guys, make it happen in 2012…

:-) :-)

111. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

Spock versus 10 re imagined Klingon warriors with Klingon General(s) looking on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUSPoXWYpjw&feature=related

112. Desstruxion - June 12, 2011

Glad there’s not going to be any rehashing. I want something new, not what I’ve already watched again and again. I didn’t like the destruction of Vulcan to begin with but it seems to have opened up a whole new avenue of story telling. I remind myself it’s “only a movie.”

113. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 12, 2011

Thank you, Odkin, for your appraisal of the various ideas for the next Star Trek movie that have been presented on this and other threads. Fortunately, it is up to Bob Orci, not you, to see if any of these ideas may be incorporated into whatever story they already have. He did consider us to be consultants – perhaps he was just being kind/polite to us folks with all our “amateur, nerdy, undramatic, fan-wank nonsense”.

Actually, I am sure there is a way for Anthony Pascale to be able to contact any one of us personally if the writers were interested in running with an idea or two presented here. Acknowledgement of some kind, as in “Thanks to…” part near the end of the movie credits, would be very nice, but not really expected.

114. Jason S. - June 12, 2011

# 24 – And your point is?

I think I would have rather they made it totally detached from the REAL Star Trek then do what they did. This fan sees what they did as more disrespectful to Trek then just having a true “re-boot” that has nothing to do with the previous five shows and 10 films. But at this point, it doesn’t really matter now. I just have to come to terms that for me there is no new “Star Trek.”

If they want to bridge the gap between fans of their new universe and Trekkers like me who hate them for making this garbage, I have one serious suggestion for them. They need to bring the morality play aspect that was the heart and soul of the original stories into this one. Kirk, Spock and McCoy need to banter back and forth about humanity and what direction it’s going.

They need to lessen the explosions and eye candy moments and pump some intelligence back into it. Of all the major reasons why I hated the first one of these new films, that may have been the biggest, becuase the reasons I became a fan of this franchise in the first place, was missing in the 2009 film in favor of eye candy. I realize the fan base Abrams and crew are going after care more about eye candy, but I think if they are half the writers they claim to be, they still can find heavy doses of old fashioned “Star Trek” psychology to be the base still even with the eye candy. That and loose the similarities to “Star Wars.” This is “Star Trek” damn it!

115. Damian - June 12, 2011

I’d rather not see Klingons as the villain. I think they had enough coverage in the movies and we’ve pretty much explored every aspect of Klingon culture there is to explore. I just don’t think there’s any new ground there. The Romulans always make an interesting villain, but they’ve been done in the last 2 movies and it might be time to move on. I’d really like to see a well thought out exploration story, maybe involving a new villain or an old villain rarely featured (i.e. Tholians).

I’m also hoping the movie time reflects real time. The main reason for this is that we probably have the current team intact for a total of 3 films, tops. I don’t want to spend all that time on an origin stories. I’d like to see how Bob Orci and co. handle a story with a more experienced crew. Not another “let’s get to know each other” movie. (If they were planning on doing more, I might be ok with more developing relationships, but I think they made it clear they are only doing maybe 3 films).

Re; the alternate universe theories they used, Bennett’s Department of Temporal Investigations book was a great read. He pretty much covered every time travel angle and how some result in changed history (a la First Contact, Assignment:Earth,) some resulting in alternate universes (a la Star Trek[2009]). He also brought a conclusion (more or less) to the Temproral Cold War from Enterprise in an interesting way, putting to rest some unanswered questions. I’d highly recommend it to anyone interested in how Orci and co. handled the alternate universe story.

116. Trek Lady - June 12, 2011

In the case of the physics and the science and the science fiction, we had a rule that we kept coming back to, which was “our wives need to understand this movie.”

FAIL. Sheesh. Patronizing much guys?

This “chick” understood enough to realize when you all were totally butchering the laws of physics and science. Please don’t use women as your excuse not to do a little research or for sloppy writing.

117. Dee - lvs moon' surface - June 12, 2011

Regarding the feedback from the fans… I can only speak for myself… I should only speak for myself… their approach on the “alternate universe”… it was never questioned it in my mind… was easy for me to accept it… I never felt like a guardian of the canon… I did not realize that as a disrespectful attitude, from them… so I really enjoyed Star Trek 09… it was awesome!

What about the sequel… though I adore spoilers… I do not want to see the movie that ‘s in my head… then I will not offer suggestions, Lindelof can stay quiet about it… LOL… But in return they have to deliver a great film if possible in 2012, … and I promise I will praise highly!!

And Trekkies in general have strong personalities… “very strong opinions” and are faithful to Star Trek … they know that, right? … boborci is always here … so I guess he thinks interesting to know what fans are thinking!

:-) :-)

118. trekker 5 - June 12, 2011

#87,The Optimist,I do that too,and sorry about the spell check,I get a bit upset on how my name is spelled. No,just joking!! :) I’m just looking for some fun! :)

119. BaronByng - June 12, 2011

Star Trek has always been about the HUMAN adventure. Or maybe in a multiracial Federation, the SENTIENT adventure. It’s never been about the technology or even the ships, as iconic as they are, it’s about moral dilemmas and emotions, with of course some adventure and action thrown in to keep the story rolling along.

The rest is all tinsel and stardust, to help you suspend your disbelief. If it wasn’t spaceships, it’d be three-masted sailing vessels or submarines. When you make it all about the tech, you end up with the worst episodes of Voyager. When you make it about being slavish to canon, you end up with Enterprise.

As much as I liked those shows, you can’t deny they were hamstrung by their formats and premises. On a recurring show with cast under contract, you can’t kill off a lead in Season 1 or do anything really dramatic, so there’s always some sort of reset button at the end of the episode.

ST:2009 was basically a Crisis on Infinite Earths for the TOS canon, which had painted itself into a storytelling corner with years of accumulated lore and fanon. Now it’s opened up again, a clean slate, and we also have (as the videos showed) an avenue for non-Trekkers to care about the characters (or remind you why you cared in the first place), re-earning that place in your heart without relying on easy familiarity with the characters and backstory.

We “knew” the fates of Kirk, McCoy and (kinda) Spock from TOS/TNG, so a standard origin story would have been more Enterprise-style “fill in the gaps” writing, of interest only to obsessive-compulsive personality types who need everything in its right place, and if you change it HOO BOY their amygdalas can’t cope and go into fear-threat-mode. I mean we saw them come out in force two years ago, we all read their posts, right?

Now Star Trek is healthier and more vital than it’s been since the series first aired. And that’s saying something. Roll on 2012!

120. Trek Lady - June 12, 2011

And before someone jumps all over me and points out that they may have just been referring to “non-Trek fans” not understanding, then that means they were being patronizing towards the audience in general. You do not need to dumb Trek down to appeal to the masses. How about writing a film with solid science, and assuming the “masses” will rise to the occasion?

121. Anthony Pascale - June 12, 2011

Iva,

That kind of language and personal attack is not welcome here. Final warning

122. Dee - lvs moon' surface - June 12, 2011

Love and friendship… not necessarily imply sexual love… I do not think this is the case of Kirk and Spock… it was more, “very young people” with emotions under the skin … the romance of Uhura and Spock is a good example about it! … and if it is in this context what Lindelof was talking … I agree … that’s what I realized in the film …

But I think the “huge emotion and friendship” should be or is more a triangle … Spock/Kirk/McCoy … always!!!

:-) :-)

123. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 12, 2011

Gosh, I did not interpret Damon Lindelof’s statement as inferring that their wives could not comprehend basic sci-fi notions etc. It was more a case of why would they want to? What’s the point of knowing exactly how some fictional red matter might work, for instance? It is not about being able to understand an explanation or not. Men and women tend to see, learn and experience the world in slightly different ways. No individual is hardwired exactly the same way as another and that also applies to the sexes. It is more about providing the right sort of hook that makes more women want to see a Star Trek movie than in the past. If being able to present a story from a more feminine perspective is considered somehow “dumbing down” Star Trek, then clearly a generally male perspective is one that is seen as superior and it would seem that even some women are buying into that bs.

Given that so many people still do not appear to fully understand the MWI concept of alternate universes presented in Trek 09, it seems that Bob, Alex and Damon had not dumbed down the movie at all. In fact, it appears to be the opposite situation. Curiously, among the few females who do post to this and other Star Trek sites, none of them appear to have had any problems understanding the basic concepts presented. It’s been largely a guy problem, as far as I can tell. Go figure.

Trek Lady – A film with solid science? Would guys understand it any better than women? From what I have observed, I seriously doubt it.

(Perhaps my perception is wrong here. BTW, there is a difference between liking the notion of an alternate universe and understanding the concept).

124. Joseph - June 12, 2011

Odkin:

I’m a professional writer. I know full well what I’m doing when I publish a comment here, and I suspect many others do too. I also know what the laws are regarding copyright and intellectual property. It is not nearly as easy to prosecute someone for theft as you seem to think it is. Legally, you can’t “steal” an undeveloped concept from a 300 word post on an internet message board.
Believe it or not, it’s pretty standard for writers to bounce ideas off each other and other people. These days it’s becoming increasingly common for writers to turn to the internet to do so. It’s a normal part of the creative process.

125. Trek Lady - June 12, 2011

Keachick, “A film with solid science? Would guys understand it any better than women? From what I have observed, I seriously doubt it.”

Sadly you may be right, but then perhaps said film could be an opportunity to educate some people. I am not talking about having characters engage in a bunch of techobabble. However there should be an effort to stick to actually following the basic rules of science, rather than tossing them out in order to make things “understandable.” I am not talking “alternate universes” which leave room for the imagination. I am talking about the idea of a supernova destroying a galaxy. Or a platform, attached to a ship in space by a chain, being able to maintain a stable enough position in the atmosphere for people to “free jump” onto it from space, or black holes that swallow matter up and spit it back out whole in some other time and location – that kind of thing. I am willing to suspend my disbelief to some extend in the name of entertainment, but I really don’t like having my intelligence insulted.

126. Trek Lady - June 12, 2011

Keachick: “Gosh, I did not interpret Damon Lindelof’s statement as inferring that their wives could not comprehend basic sci-fi notions etc. It was more a case of why would they want to? ”

Oh, and BTW, that could be seen as somewhat insulting to women as well. Just so you know. Some of us “want to”…okay? Some of us actually LIKE science and WANT TO understand it.

And I am pretty sure the writers have already stated they added the whole “romance” thing to attract more women -which means they too are stuck focusing on the stereotypical assumption of what women like. In my experience (and I likely have a lot more experience with what FEMALE Trek fans like – being one and having interacted with them for years) women (in general) do enjoy “character interaction” a great deal, and are more likely to tune into that over the design of the ship – but “character interaction” does NOT equate with romance. Nor does it mean, “spare us the science stuff”.

127. La Reyne d'Epee - June 12, 2011

“Ye cannae change the laws ‘o physics, Cap’n!”

128. MJ - June 12, 2011

@123. “Gosh, I did not interpret Damon Lindelof’s statement as inferring that their wives could not comprehend basic sci-fi notions etc”

Well you are not paying attention to what they are saying that, because that is pretty much what they said: “”our wives need to understand this movie.”

There is no dancing around this I am afraid. This comes across as condescending, both to their wives and to women in general. It is a bit of a Rat Pack mentality, given these writers are all male and seem to infer that they have airheads for wives.

I expect that their wives are much smarter and astute then they give them credit for. If fact, while their wives might not be able to produce a great ST script, I bet their wives, who probably are much better then them at organizing and meeting deadlines, would get some sort of half-decent Trek script submitted in on time, without a year of delays and continual unfulfilled promises, planking episodes, and self-aggrandizing public appearances. :-))

129. Paul - June 12, 2011

No pressure guys just knock it out the park again & take as long as you need to do so!

130. Starbase Britain - June 12, 2011

I hope we dont get the Klingons as adversaries. We need something new or updated. I would like to see the Talosians.
Greg
UK

131. Charla - June 12, 2011

First, I like Damon’s shirt~~ The combo Star Trek and Star Wars shirt that was being sold for people who love both franchises! LOL

Secondly, I don’t think the comment about their wives wasn’t meant as a slam to women neccessarily. I do think many women aren’t attracted to movies such as Trek because some have different interests. Thankfully this is changing, but I still feel like an anomaly in groups of women because I don’t like the same things they do. (Twilght, plastic surgery, shopping, etc etc etc) LOL j/k not all are that shallow….

I respect other women’s right to like what ever it is that makes them happy, and I like shopping and gardening, fine wine and dinners, but I get all kinds of grief from some of my friends that are women (in jest most of the time, ) when I talk of my love for space and science. Most of the time the conversation just fizzles…. :S so onto the other topics we go…. haha

I have always been interested in the sciences since a young girl – my hobby is astronomy/meterology. A perfect night is the darkest of skies, my husband and some nice music while scanning the skies with our telescope. It is capable of allowing us some very nice views of DSO’s and of course most of the planets too.

But back to the comment, I think the comment Damon made was really more of a poke at women like their wives- those who are more into the Lifetime channel movies or “chick flicks”. LOL

I hope between the three of them, Bob, Damon and Alex they can make a nice balance for all viewers. But you can’t please everyone all the time- but this woman will be at the first showing available like most everyone else on this board. :D

132. Anthony Pascale - June 12, 2011

Ppl are making too much of wives thing. All three wives were there in front row. JJ has also talked about how his wife loved script and helped convince him to do movie. They were talking about ensuring ST09 appealed beyond it’s core base. Their wives were good proxies for them, how is that a bad thing? I’ve met some of these women and they are not wilting flowers. Bob’s wife Melissa is also a writer.

133. dmduncan - June 12, 2011

I think all the “wives” comment means is that they were aiming to make the movie accessible to outsiders, to non-fans, to general audiences, which is something that Star Trek has had a problem doing in the past.

134. Tom - June 12, 2011

Sounds like they are happy to have JJ and Bryan back in the mix. Must be something missing that they bring to the table.

135. Iva - June 12, 2011

People need to remember that science fiction genre exists and is called science fiction for a reason.
If you don’t like the “science stuff” there are plenty of other genres out there that contain none,
like Jennifer Aniston movies for example.
Star Trek is/used to be a sf franchise, not even hard sf mind you – is that, even in this dumbed down action movie fashion, already “too much science”?
How in the world?

136. Bill Peters - June 12, 2011

#114 for Trek to keep going they have to make it Relevant to both fans and non fans so they can keep on making them and that takes money, We had a Fan aimed Film in Nemesis and it did very Poorly at the Box Office and in the end all Paramount cares about with Trek in the End for everything it is to those of us who are fans is that it make Money,

it is there cause it makes money, Fan are a Bonus but Studios are in it for the Money anything else is side bars that are interesting but still Sidebars.

137. Bill Peters - June 12, 2011

and the wives of the Writers made it so that they saw this film would Reach non fans and give them a Second movie where they can do a little more to make fans happy and do more Easter Eggs and such.

138. MJ - June 12, 2011

@132. Anthony, the additional context you provided here have caused me to change my mind on this — thanks!

139. Tom - June 12, 2011

Initial reaction was that they are way behind. They were first supposed to be done by the holidays. Next deadline was end of March. Now we are in June and it is still an outline??? I think Bob is being honest about being in flux.

Step back and realize it is more important that they get it right. Which they will. Perhaps all the other projects have held them up. There is nothing for them to be ashamed of for being in demand. They are maximixing their careers while they are hot. That is what they should be doing. However now it appears everyone is focused on Trek and it will come together. Hopefully without too much delay and worth the wait

140. Toothless Grishnar Cat - June 12, 2011

BobOrci, if you’re out there I recommend reading 72… it’s a good post which I would echo…

141. NCM - June 12, 2011

So women don’t get science or science fiction? Why does this team suppose so many women watch and read Trek – for romance!? As I recall, the original show was aimed at young men; that women took to it was likely a surprise – perhaps it still is, to some. I always thought Kirk’s womanizing was a distraction; a nod to male bravado rather than to a feminine idea of or affinity for romance (surely there were more romantic options for the Harlequin crowd).

Maybe the guys know something I don’t know, but it seems a significant number of Star Trek writers have been women and I haven’t noted them shying away from the science; in fact, I think many of them offered much better ‘science’ than what we encountered in the last movie. It also seems to me that a significant number of fans are women – who happen to appreciate the science in science fiction.

I’m grateful to this team of guys for breathing life back into the franchise, but I wonder if they use their wives as scapegoats for their own limited interest or understanding of science.

142. Chad - June 12, 2011

#12
I agree…I would definitely love to see Gary Mitchell. Not sure how they could incorporate him since there was no mention of him at the academy, but anything is possible.

143. Dee - lvs moon' surface - June 12, 2011

In my comment # 87, about the wives thing, I look at it as a joke they did… in the end of the day I think they will have to justify themself to them… LOL… because of course there are many in the audience of the film, including the guys… who are not interested or prepared to receive highly sophisticated scientific details…

So thanks for the additional clarification, AP, #132 …

:-) :-)

144. MJ - June 12, 2011

@135. “Star Trek is/used to be a sf franchise, not even hard sf mind you – is that, even in this dumbed down action movie fashion, already “too much science”?”

There you go again, Iva! FYI — the Star Trek 2009 movie has done more to educate the public on the “many-worlds interpretation” of astrophysics than all the Discovery Channel and other tv space science shows combined over the past five years.

Nice try Iva — back to your old drawing board. LOL

145. p'trick - June 12, 2011

really enjoy these guys and all they have to contribute to TREK.

but i guess i am a bit confused.

if they’d have followed the old-TREK canon, they’d have been “hamstrung”. yet now with the new timeline they’ve created it’s taking THREE years to create a “worthy” TREKmovie?

146. Hateya - June 12, 2011

Whew. J.J. is now focusing on Trek, general audiences and specifically, wives. BRING IT!!! I’m a wife and theoretical and quantum physics are my hobbies. Even so, I really don’t need the scientific details. I’ve got Shirley Jackson, Michio Kaku and my main man, Neil deGrasse Tyson to educate me. When they falter, I look to George E. Alorn, Brian Greene, Frank Underdown Jr. and the list goes on and on.

Bring me some action, adventure, and romance. Bring me some crew angst and big bad ORIGINAL villains! Oh and let’s do PON FARR!!!! Someone needs to lose their damn minds and make sure the nuUniverse isn’t sterile. Oh and do BLOW UP SOMETHING BIG!!!

And gents… STRINGS, M, SUPERSTRINGS

147. Battle-scarred Sciatica - June 12, 2011

I am not sure about anyone else but I have got quite used to her ample nacelles now.
I like ‘em.

148. boborci - June 12, 2011

I knew damon’s statement would get him in hot water. I called him out right then and there, right Anthony? And he didnt write the tech, i did, and i never used the strategy he stated. Quite the contrary, i did the opposite of dumb it down. So. Controversy over?

149. VZX - June 12, 2011

Ok, cool. So, we should always direct the tech/science concerns to Orci. Like we have all along.

Bitchin about movies is neat fun!

150. Anthony Pascale - June 12, 2011

Yes Bob did call out Damon on that. full video will be up in a day or so

151. p'trick - June 12, 2011

Definitely want to confirm my anticipation of an awesome TREKpic from these guys. Whenever it finally gets here, and even if it’s old-news by the time it reaches the big-screen, i’ve little doubt that they are likely to deliver one of the finest of the film-series.

152. Praetor Tal - June 12, 2011

Boborci, you’ve created a monster!

153. Odkin - June 12, 2011

Bad news for everyone whining about “science”. TOS had nothing to do with science. TOS had to do with one star, two featured players, and an ensemble of background characters traveling in a vehicle encountering problems to solve and people to help. It was Route 66, Wagon Train, the A-Team and countless other shows of the same formula. Nobody cared or remembered the make and technical details of the Wagon in Wagon Train, unless the plot involved it breaking down or something.

I wish the writers would knock out a basic plot about people and problems, and worry about tacking on the magic science doo-dads later as the set dressing and occasional deus-ex-machina they are..

154. Jonboc - June 12, 2011

My god, how do some of you people get through the day taking things so literally?? I understand MJ, who jumps at any chance to get a dig in on the new guys, no doubt understanding full well what they meant… but some of the others here take the cake. If you’ve followed any of the new Trek’s development over the past few years you would know all about how the new team was trying hard to make the new movie appeal to everyone, not just Trekkies. That includes the large demographic of women who loved Eat Pray Love but wouldn’t give Trek the time of day. Their wives…like MANY MANY women including my wife, are probably the types that dig chick flicks and have been exposed to nothing but the technobabble laden trek of the past 20 years and have had no desire to enter that alien universe…until now. The new team is plugging in the elements to make Trek fresh and appeal to fans and non-fans alike. That’s ALL they were saying. Good grief.

Asde from all that, the evening looked like great fun…2 great movies and 2 great panel discussions. Well worth the price of admission. Looking forward to Anthony’s upcoming interview with the writers…but not so much the kneejerk reactions from some on this site.

155. Red Dead Ryan - June 12, 2011

What we have to remember is, the science in “Star Trek” has always been complete bullsh*t. Warp speed, phasers, holodecks, tachyon beams, etc. were all completely made up just like hyperdrives, light sabres and blasters were for “Star Wars”.

Which brings me to my other point. The new Trek films, to succeed in bringing in the mainstream audiences and women, have to be more like “Star Wars”. “Star Wars” never bothered to explain how it’s techology worked. It didn’t matter because WE SAW HOW IT ALL WORKED. There was no science in “Star Wars”, because George Lucas wasn’t the least bit interested in lecturing his audience with nonsensical nonsense that “Voyager” was built around.

I didn’t care about how the Hobus supernova worked. I didn’t care about the instantaneous transwarp beaming. I don’t care about how Red Matter works. Those are mere storytelling devices. Hell, the Genesis Device was scientific b.s but was used wisely as a device that was part of a great storyline featuring great character moments during “The Wrath Of Khan” and “The Search For Spock”. The Genesis Device was just a means for the characters to interact with each other and their surroundings. It wasn’t meant to be a lesson in science or exobiology.

I also don’t care about moral lessons, metaphors, or other self-righteous propaganda pieces. I just want something that ENTERTAINS me and makes me think on my own.

156. Devon - June 12, 2011

#116 – “This “chick” understood enough to realize when you all were totally butchering the laws of physics and science.”

Which they weren’t, so we’re back to square one. Whoop!

Seeing some uptightness here still, chill out people, the sun will come out tomorrow in your world.

157. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

So a 2hr movie where kirk gets served beers and steaks by hot alien woman while watching a preserved hawkings go thru the workings of warp technolgy anf alternate realities with the morals of respecting your planet and parents while arm wrestling and playing chess vs KHAN is out of the question eh?

I KID.

158. dmduncan - June 12, 2011

Well…I agree and disagree with Ryan. I mean if you write the science and it’s not accurate I’m going to enjoy the movie anyway. It’s not going to ruin the experience for me if the plot device is bad science or no science. I’m going to accept it in the universe of the movie and I’m going to let myself be entertained.

But at the same time it IS fun AND challenging getting your plot devices in a SF story to be good science as well. You may find that good science actually creates wonderful scenarios that bad science or make believe science does not. So it can pay off with regard to the story to actually work on the science a little harder and to mold events around it more tightly. Possibilities may appear that otherwise would not have, so it’s not just a fetish for getting the scientific details right. Those accurate details could also open up dramatic possibility you didn’t see before, so I think we should lose this general notion that good science is necessarily antithetical to good movie drama.

159. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 12, 2011

Actually a lot of people find maths and science difficult subjects to understand and it seems it is not just women. I agree that the writers should try to correctly use what is actually already known about the cosmos, laws of physics etc.

The thing is that quite often there seems to be not much given in known areas of astronomy. What is shown so often in a lot of science fiction movies are simply (futuristic) space battles and big explosions. It is not about experiencing going through a nebula, surviving a cosmic storm, exploring what that mysterious “dark matter” might be etc. If only it could be more about actual space and planetary exploration. I am more than interested in this kind of thing, however I am not an astronomer or astrophysicist, so a clear concise layman explanation (not a lot of high tech “technobabble”) may be needed sometimes. I am not the only one here and it is not just because I am female. If a main character like Kirk does encounter a beautiful alien woman in the process and a relationship does develop, then it is a natural unfolding of one of many positive, creative possibilities that is open to those of a similar mind…

People are instead obsessed with the size and shape of weaponry like photon torpedoes or phasers. They want to see space battles, kick-ass fight scenes between a human and an alien, dirty politics and subterfuge and all the other politico/military drudgery. They just see and use space as a bigger platform for crazy warring and then ultimately space itself becomes yet another trash site for the carnage and wastage that wars inevitably bring.
That just gets so ugly and boring and makes me want to “nod off”.

160. Red Dead Ryan - June 12, 2011

158.
……

You make some good points. I guess believable science does make sense, but we’ve seen countless times that it can lead to an obsession that ruins scenes in movies and episodes. What I’m saying is, the writers should just present the science as IDEAS, not FACTS.

So I suppose science is important, but it’s more about how it’s used. My post at 155 was black and white in what I was trying to get across. I shouldn’t have said science doesn’t matter.

But then again, what someone considers to be “believable science” might be complete crap to someone else, so what do I know?

I suppose the Borg might be a good example. On TNG, there were hints about how the Borg functioned and how they assimilated people and technology. TNG, the series that created what is known as technobabble, actually showed some restraint in explaining the Borg. In “First Contact”, we SAW how assimilation happens without lengthy exposition. “Voyager”, on the other hand, ruined the Borg with it’s endless explanations of Borg technology and behaviour. The TNG and FC Borg had a mystique and mystery to them, which was wiped away by “Voyager” episodes such as “One”, “The Collective”, “Unimatrix Zero”, and “Endgame”.

161. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

I just want to see cops in space kick some alien ass lol

If I wanted real science, I would watch the discovery channel or space shuttles go up to space station and come down with everyone clapping.

162. Dee - lvs moon' surface - June 12, 2011

#148 – boborci, #150 – AP … LOL … I really want to see the full video …

:-) :-)

163. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

Bob, give us Hawaii Five O and Lost that takes place in space lol with some alias and mission impossible thrown in.

164. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

some Fringe also :)

165. MJ - June 12, 2011

@153/Odkin: “TOS had nothing to do with science.”

Not true at all. You really need to go back and read The Making of Star Trek and The World of Star Trek. A lot of good people involved with Trek took pains to include science in the series. That is why Trek is called science fiction, not fantasy.

Now, is is hard sf? No, of course not! But I categorically reject your blanket and uncompromising statement that Trek “had nothing to do with science.” It is a fact, not an opinion, that this statement is incorrect.

166. MJ - June 12, 2011

@154. “I understand MJ.”

Cool! Kumbayah my friend!

167. Red Dead Ryan - June 12, 2011

161.
……

Hmmm……..cops in space…….”StarTrek:COPS”…The new series from John Langley and FOX dealing with Starfleet officers busting alien drug dealers selling illegal batches of Ketracel White. Follow cameramen from the Federation News Service as they follow Starfleet cops in the Federation neighborhood as they crack down on drug addicted Jem’Hadar junkies and their Son’a and Ba’Ku dealers. You’ll witness witness characters such as Neelix being arrested on suspicion of drug use (eventually cleared, though his “normal” behaviour understandably arouses suspicion) and Ferengi who launder gold-pressed latinum through the ghettos of the Demilitarized Zone.

168. MJ - June 12, 2011

@158 “But at the same time it IS fun AND challenging getting your plot devices in a SF story to be good science as well. You may find that good science actually creates wonderful scenarios that bad science or make believe science does not. So it can pay off with regard to the story to actually work on the science a little harder and to mold events around it more tightly. Possibilities may appear that otherwise would not have, so it’s not just a fetish for getting the scientific details right. Those accurate details could also open up dramatic possibility you didn’t see before, so I think we should lose this general notion that good science is necessarily antithetical to good movie drama.”

Well said DM. That s part of why Blade Runner, 2001 and Alien were so great…because they were done in a a hard enough science fiction manner that you would believe that they could really happen. And that is also why TMP is well thought of in Trek — even though the movie sucks in a lot of way, the hard sf treatment and seriousness of the material took Trek to a harder sf-level than it had ever been before, and one that I expect will never be realized again.

169. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#167

LOL why all the aliens always wear those wife beater t shirts :(

170. Harry Ballz - June 12, 2011

In a final showdown of rock, paper, scissors, Spock……the writers have prevailed in winning the right to name the title of the next movie………

Star Trek 2: Revenge of the Vulcan

D’OH!!

171. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#170

That’s a lot of neck pinching and being talked to death.

172. Red Dead Ryan - June 12, 2011

Q: What do you call condoms made on Vulcan?

A: Vulcanized rubber!

173. ncm - June 12, 2011

Star Trek’s long been credited with broadening viewer perspectives; it’s ability to do so isn’t limited to social conventions and moral issues.

As a kid, I overlooked the “science” b/c I couldn’t follow it; as an adult, being a trekkie has fueled an interest in science (btw, a scientist on NPR, or some such, recently noted that much of the science in ST was based in real science – alternate universes are spoken of seriously, now, within scientific circles. Some say that if we ever achieve ‘real’ space travel, it will be through warp tech., etc…).

Sci fi done well can be as fun to contemplate as the moral questions. Those uninterested can over-look it and still enjoy a good story – maybe years later, watching the movie that hooked them on ST will spark an interest in the science…

I’m not PC. I found the wives thing irksome, but no great offense. I commented b/c I hope to remind the writers that ST appeals to many women who like sci. fi., or in the case of ST, sci. fi. light.

Peace and long life to all good ST fans, and to the writers who keep the ship sailing!

174. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#172

Vulcan imploded :( and using condoms right now wouldn’t be a good choice for their species ;)

Spock and co gonna do a lot of tapping

175. Red Dead Ryan - June 12, 2011

174.
…….

Vulcan still exists in the prime universe…..

176. dmduncan - June 12, 2011

@168: Two of my favorite movies, Alien and Bladerunner.

And the scene in ST.09 where the woman gets sucked out into the silence of space was awesome. But then we got sounds in space afterward, and I think it’s because of what we’re used to. We have been conditioned by generations of televised and movie SF to hear sound in space so it is expected as unimaginable to go without sound for any length of time during, say, a phaser battle. But I disagree with that. I think it’s our expectations that hold us back and that a phaser battle where the only sounds are heard within the ship by the devastation they cause would work. With the music helping it along I think it would work, but we are told things that are not true, that it’s not dramatic enough, which to me sounds like Robert Wise saying that the colors of the original uniforms wouldn’t work on the big screen and what do you know? ST.09 proved without a doubt that the bold colors worked just fine, but that was Bob Wise’s excuse, that was the limit of his imagination and why he gravitated toward muted battleship gray colors. So it’s our thinking that keeps us doing things the same old ways and not exploring or experimenting.

But great movies do that. They explore. They experiment. They don’t play it safe with the rules.

177. Anthony Thompson - June 12, 2011

I like what Lindelof said. No ‘Golden Oldies’. That’s a good anology because some fans here just want a retread (maybe the same folks who tune in the classic rock channel and never give new music a chance). That’s just chasing your tail.

178. Red Dead Ryan - June 12, 2011

176.
……

Hmmmm……..space battles without sound. I’d like to see that made an option on the Blu Ray for the sequel after its run in the theatres is over.

On a similar note, after seeing “Casino Royale”, I’ve thought it would be a neat idea to make a James Bond film in both color and black and white.
I thought the teaser scene from CR gave off a cool, film-noir feel.

As for the uniforms from the last movie, I appreciated the fact that they went back to the TOS style, but thought they put too much detail into them and now they look dated to me. More so than the TOS versions, which came out fourty-five years ago.

179. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#175

The Prime universe is so 90′s ;)

It is dead like vinyl records, vhs, dvds and the space program.

Joking aside, I’m betting they will explain why the star went super nova, who’s the mysterious ancient aliens trying to mess with our cops in space.

180. Jack - June 12, 2011

116, 120. Word.

They can get the physics and science right, or at least, righter, without having to over explain it, or explain it at all.

I’d like a little background, or foreground, political intrigue — not Phantom menace yawny, talky, not intriguing stuff, but some of the Cold War stuff that leaked into TOS. And the sense of Kirk bucking rules, or finding solutions to problems that aren’t exactly what was ordered, out of necessity, and at great risk to his career… and not simply because he’s a maverick. i think the idea of consequences was a powerful one in TOS and the movies – the political fallout after Genesis in Trek Iii, episodes like Court Martial, The Menagerie, Balance of Terror — as opposed to the few times where, Kirk was kind of a one-man wrecking ball, effectively deciding fates of entire civilizations on his own.

181. dmduncan - June 12, 2011

You know, at the end of Bladerunner when Deckard is hanging on for dear life and Roy Batty jumps over him and watches him hanging on with broken fingers, I could NOT imagine what was going to happen next. Batty was supposed to be a psycho, but it was Deckard who makes what he thinks is his last act to spit at Batty, and it’s Batty, nail in hand, who catches and saves Deckard. Nothing plays out according to history. It’s all astonishing. And then in a split second Roy Batty goes from psychopath to just one of us, a man trying to live a little longer, who doesn’t want all that he knew to be lost, but who in resignation to his fate decides to teach something to Deckard though he had nothing left to gain from it. It blew my mind. It changed me, that movie.

182. Fubamushu - June 12, 2011

“It would also hamstring us in a way because if you watch the movie you would know that no one could die and nothing bad could happen to anybody, because they have to grow up and go on the adventures we saw them have.”

This is the bullshit reasoning of a short-sighted, creatively bankrupt writer. It is the lamest of excuses.

What makes a story entertaining and exciting is not the perceived doubt about the character’s chances of survival. What makes the story entertaining and exciting is how the character’s face their challenges, how they resolve the challenge, and how they grow as the result of facing their challenge.

183. dmduncan - June 12, 2011

178. Red Dead Ryan – June 12, 2011

I didn’t mind the detail of the uniforms so much as that the pattern was all delta shields, which I felt was a bit much. I thought a very fine honeycomb pattern would have looked better.

184. MJ - June 12, 2011

@178. Hmmmm……..space battles without sound. I’d like to see that made an option on the Blu Ray for the sequel after its run in the theatres is over.

Reminds me that some of the Battlestar Galactica (Ron Moore version) fight scenes were done without sound, and I thought it looked pretty cool and cutting edge.

185. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#182

Yup, half the fun is getting there. The problem is the canvas was too cluttered, there was no room for exciting adventures without contradicting what came before. It would have been as boring as the new star wars, filling in the blanks and dotting the i’s and crossing the t’s.

Star Trek needed a fresh start, and we are lucky to have a reboot.

186. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

I see Spock sitting down and mind melding the entire crew at once with this alien entity and they go through this crazy inception type dream sequence, kung fu in space, slow motion floating, some weird acid type film sequence not as bad as TMP one with the asteroids though

187. Red Dead Ryan - June 12, 2011

183.
……

Yeah, it was the delta shield pattern that I feel dated the uniforms from the last movie. Maybe a subtle grid pattern would be better. And maybe a belt with the delta shield on it?

188. Red Dead Ryan - June 12, 2011

185.
……

The battle scenes from “Battlestar Galactica” were great. I think they did a lot of them without sound effects, but still had music. I can’t remember, so I’ll have to rewatch the dvds one day.

189. Sam - June 12, 2011

Destroying Vulcan was a big big mistake. The greatest episode ever was written by Harlan Ellison, City on the Edge of Forever. What they should do is have Spock go through the portal and restore the old timeline except that you know the writers won’t do it.

The choice (young or old) Spock could be making is Uhura vs. Vulcan.

Lets be real, Star Trek (TOS) discussed the issues of the day. The movies try for bigger and bigger effects and spectacle. No destroying Vulcan doesn’t parallel 9/11 and it never will in this type of movie.

If they want to talk about parallel universes then they should watch the cartoon series where Spock is replaced by the Andorian. Another possible direction would be to look at Sulu who never got his due in the sequels.

The whole point of warp drive was destroyed by Scottie inventing his trans warp teleporter. There is no need for starships with that invention.

Another idea is to take the Gary Seven episode bring back Terri Garr and have this crew meet the aliens on the Gary Seven episode to restore the timeline.

Personally I am a TOS fan, Enterprise is second in my book, then TNG, VOY and DS9 (my opinion) and I really don’t care for the last two at all actually.

190. Hugh Hoyland - June 12, 2011

Okay I know they want to keep the basic story under wraps, but can’t we at least know who the Villain is going to be. :)

191. sean - June 12, 2011

I’m far more offended by people saying they were ‘raped’ by a movie than anything Damon may or may not have worded poorly. Honestly, if I see one more person demean rape by using it to mean any experience they dislike, I’m going to go out of my Vulcan mind.

192. Will_H - June 12, 2011

I wish I had their kind of deadlines in my screen writing classes. If I did, I probably could just turn in stuff a year after its due.

193. Bill Peters - June 12, 2011

189 they needed to show it wasn’t just Old Trek Rehashed, they needed to get out from under the weight of all Trek Canon that would get in the way of doing a good take on Trek. it was Necessaity go read what the guy from DS9 who played Odo said that Trek was getting stale and needed this to re invgorate it.

194. Charla - June 12, 2011

dmduncan and red dead ryan, you both sound like you might enjoy the fashion model shows!! Nit picking the pattern on the fabric of the uniform!

You may just fit in with the wives! LOL I am kidding!!! Really!! Just thought it was funny that a male would notice such minor details. Now that was sexist of me to say, I know…. :P

I totally agree about not remaking the old series episodes. The writing talent is here in the present, the past is the past. These writers have the proven ability to bring originality to the franchise. I think they can provide new and original stories to carry on Trek’s legacy.

195. Sam - June 12, 2011

193, I have to disagree and I found the destruction of Vulcan in poor taste in an attempt to get some kind of impact from 9/11.

Lets get serious, every single film doesn’t have to put Earth, Vulcan or some other planet in peril of complete destruction.

If they needed to do a complete reboot then why not tell the story of a completely different crew from that period or take Kirk and Spock on a different adventure.

On the same note, why not rewrite Superman so his parents don’t die or Batman and kill Alfred or Robin or destroy Gotham City. The reason is you don’t tug on Superman’s cape…

Sam 189

196. boborci - June 12, 2011

192 as long as youd turned in your homework on the other five movies and six shows.

197. Charla - June 12, 2011

Oh and yes, Bob- the controversy is over at least for me and some other folks here. Good for you for calling him out about it even if it was an innocent remark. It should be fun to watch his reaction! LOL

198. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#195

They had to destroy vulcan, it allowed spock prime to show his pain and allow kirk to remove quinto spock for being emotionally compromised and made the stakes that much higher.

There is no reset button because it proves there is danger and all bets are off, this makes the reboot new and fresh with a clean canvas to tell new stories.

199. Harry Ballz - June 12, 2011

196.

Wow, Bob, nothing like rubbing his nose in it and then asking how it smells!

200. Sam - June 12, 2011

Spock sub 0 = Nimoy
Spock sub 1 = Quinto

I actually thought the best part of the movie was showing Starfleet Academy and playing off of Kirk’s playboy image and the Kobyashi Maru. What was the age of Spock when he was with Pike? Kirk must have been younger than Spock and Spock would never have been at the Academy at the same time as Kirk.

All bets are off for the same reason that they continue to make sequels which is that they have a ready made market instead of thinking up new stories and characters. At some point the bets will be off because no body will care.

201. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#196

I dont know how you do it :) you must take a lot of vitamins and red bulls

202. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

#200

40+yrs later and st still kicking, have a feeling st will be around longer

203. boborci - June 12, 2011

199. Thought twice about it, except he said he is a student.

204. Charla - June 12, 2011

Darn! I forgot to mention I had the pleasure of watching Super 8 tonight! It was a good movie – (Trek is still # 1 with me, but it was still good) The special effects were good, the kids did a great job with their characters as well.

I enjoyed some of the references to the locations in Ohio since I grew up in the area where the characters gave reference too. (The main location doesn’t exist of course) and some of the locations were off, which I won’t say which ones until the movie is seen by all so I don’t spoil it! And it is fictious after all! :-)

Also my husband was a Montgomery County deputy in Ohio for several years which made it interesting, noting the patch used in the film.

But anyway, go see it, it is well worth your money and time.

205. TBonz - June 12, 2011

Now that Vulcan is destroyed, I’d really like to see what impact that has on the Trekverse. How (will?) the Romulans react? How will this affect Earth and humans? How will the remaining Vulcans carry on and what must they do to ensure the survival of their species? Could there be a reunification with Romulus because of this?

Dump the romance between Spock and Uhura. It just doesn’t work for me as it makes Spock weaker; he acted wimpy. Perhaps he has to go forth and multiply with a Vulcan in the interests of helping to rebuild the Vulcan race and must reluctantly let Uhura go.

206. somethoughts - June 12, 2011

Question I have is, will this super nova happen in this new alternate reality also and destroy romulas? Or will pine and quinto get to the bottom of this snd stop it, preventing the nero loop for this new reality.

207. Charla - June 12, 2011

192- when you graduate, I really hope you might be so lucky to do as much as Bob and the others are doing. Until then, you should not be so quick to pass judgement on matters where your not privy to know every detail or demands in someone else’s life.

208. boborci - June 13, 2011

The M String Hypernova (wink) should probably still be on Track to occur, but they have a century to plan.

209. Jack - June 13, 2011

208. lol.

210. Astrophysicophile - June 13, 2011

One thing from “Spock’s Brain” that Orci, Kurtzman, and Lindelof could use is a technological element: that each Starfleet uniform has an internal heating system. In this episode, Kirk orders his men to set their “Suit temperatures at 72″, although they still have to supplement their suit heating systems with the heating of rocks with their phasers.

However, whenever Kirk’s uniform gets gratuitously ripped, we never see tiny wires dangling out. So, this limited suit heating system probably employs nanotechnology (but not as sophicated as the nanites of TNG.)

This suit heating system could certainly explain how Starfleet officers are able to survive for limited periods of time in subfreezing environments as shown in other TOS episodes “The Enemy Within” and “All Our Yesterdays”, and in the TOS movie “The Undiscovered Country.”

Given Moore’s Law, I would expect that clothing would eventually incorporate microtechnology, and then nanotechnology.

211. VulcanFilmCritic - June 13, 2011

“Star Trek” was certainly enjoyable in the theater. I saw it eight times! But I was sorely disappointed watching the DVD at home. There is a lot of sensation in the theater but the film just does not have the emotional impact of TOS or the movies. I never tire of watching TOS and the movies can always be relied upon for a pleasant afternoon.

Certainly the situations in ‘Star Trek” are designed to evoke emotion, but there is something lacking in the execution. And that element is time. So if I would offer any suggestion it’s: SLOW DOWN! Slow down for Crissake!!!

TOS was only a 50 minute show and yet was able to take the time to allow us to feel. This is especially important for a character like Spock. America did not know what he was about at first, so it was important for the directors and for Nimoy to tell us what he feels. The slow 180 degree pan around Nimoy in “Amok Time” as he breaks down alone in a conference room was done without incidental music. The emotional rawness of this scene derives from this Method actor doing his thing. It almost seemed to go on too long, long enough for us to feel some embarrassment at seeing what we should not see, but we can’t take our eyes off the screen.

Also the scene in “The Immunity Syndrome” where Spock walks (slowly but deliberately) off to what must be certain death after McCoy refuses (out of ire) to wish him luck was poignant because we get a sense of how alone he is. Compare that to the scene where Spock walks away from Uhura after a consoling embrace in the elevator. We catch only a brief glimpse of his retreating form. This scene should show how this character CANNOT be consoled and we should almost be in tears with him. But there is not enough time to feel anything for him because it’s time for the next thing.

Another comparison: In “Arena” we have William Shatner’s battle with the Gorn. You are on the edge of your seat watching what is basically a silent movie (along with the impotent crew of the Enterprise, also forced to watch this) It’s brilliant because of Shatner’s performance, not because the Gorn is particularly scary. It’s some guy in a leftover Creature From The Black Lagoon suit. Big deal. Shatner is wounded, he’s out of breath, he’s limping, etc. And he carries us along for the emotional ride.

In “Star Trek” Chris Pine is pursued by a creature on an ice planet but except for a few panicked looks over his shoulder, we don’t really see how terrified young Kirk is (or should be.) More attention is payed to the CGI creature than to human emotion. The creature could just be a shadow if the acting is spot on!

So if had one wish for the next movie it’s to allow the actors to shine. Not the flashlight.

212. VulcanFilmCritic - June 13, 2011

I meant “The Naked Time” sorry.

213. mr. NUspock - June 13, 2011

189 : the old universe, IS STILL AROUND :-)

214. Chris Pike - June 13, 2011

would love to have heard a throwaway line that the Narada was “Borgified”….maybe something for the next film, referencing the Borg much earlier in the new universe.

Somehow I have a feeling the E has undergone some extreme damage between films addressing the design criticisms – maybe a much earlier 1701A in the new universe…

215. Harry Ballz - June 13, 2011

203. “Thought twice about it, except he said he is a student”

Bob, why do you suddenly remind me of one of my old teachers?

LOL!

216. Christopher Roberts - June 13, 2011

Bob, have you guys had any title ideas yet? Star Trek in there or not?

Obviously you’re not just going to name it right now. Spoilers if a key word is the name of a Big Bad.

217. Harry Ballz - June 13, 2011

216.

You mean like Big Bad Wolf 359?

ouch!

218. Steve - June 13, 2011

boborci – if you pursue the animated STAR TREK project – I hope you look at adapting some of the wonderful books that have been published as a source.

In regards to this subject on the sequel – the idea about the resettlement of the Vulcans might be like the formation of Israel in the late 1940s, with regional tensions and internal strife as coalitions juxtaposition for power in the creation of a new society. Some of the neighboring star systems of the new Vulcan colony might not like the idea. One can see the drama in that.

219. KHAN 2.0 - June 13, 2011

random stuff id like to see in the star trek sequel:

Klingon BOPs..mushroom spacedock being built..ripped shirts/drop kicks/Kirk-Fu..TOS & movie music nods..lengthy phaser beams(not star wars ‘blasts’)..more uniforms/field jackets..vicious Trek III style Klingons..Twilight Zone/Outer Limits/early TOS style uncanniness/eeriness..unexplained wonder/unknown stuff left to the imagination (with just the odd hint) which is far more powerful than any explanation the film maker can give..transporter malfunctions..federation starship vs. federation starship carnage..Khan..big name cameos/supporting roles ..more redshirt deaths – im talking ‘Obsession’ levels

220. KHAN 2.0 - June 13, 2011

plus a whole chunk of Trek stuff cameoing/referenced/easter egging (but not centre stage) – e.g. Doomsday machine, gorns, cloud killers, corbomite, tholians, wild west, rand, No 1, C Marcus, Matt Decker, Reliant/Excelsior, the borg, PStewart as Picards ancestor, Admiral Archer, G Michell&Talosians, Shat as grandpa Kirk

221. Damian - June 13, 2011

165–Agree completely. Star Trek always tried to have some basis in science. All of the spinoffs, movies and even books tried to use some science. It’s funny because some people have complained that in the past their was too much science in Star Trek (technobabble) and not enough fiction. I think the new team struck a good balance. I never took issues with technobabble in the TV series because you are dealing with hardcore fans who come back week after week and can follow it. But for movies, I think they had to keep it less complicated (which does not mean less intelligent) or the general population would have been lost.

Re; the wives’ controversy, when I read the article, I took it to mean that their wives were not hardcore Trekkies and they wanted the film to appeal to a mass audience. I never took it to mean that they thought their wives were dumb. I made my wife see the film. They had her for a few minutes at the beginning when George Kirk sacrificed himself for his wife and son. She was actually tearing up. But unfortunately that was it (in the Abrams’ team defense, my wife has never been into science fiction and it is very much an uphill climb to get her into Star Trek). But maybe I’m wearing her down because I was watching Star Trek: Enterprise (The Xindi) last night and she actually did not leave the room or roll her eyes. Maybe there’s hope for her yet.

222. Victor Hugo - June 13, 2011

Well, the Doomsday Machine, the V´Ger Probe, that giant amoeba are still out there, and those pretty new faces can´t just pretend they don´t exist, even with the hyper bright snowblinding bridge.

223. thomas p vinelli - June 13, 2011

As a Startrek fan for years, i like the idea of something different from what we seen over the years. The rehashing of old stories and people got to stop. All we have seen from the past was new then. And anything like the Borg , there was a pupose for them being in 2 series. Other then that we need something Startrek , but something new and diffrent. Fans need to stop living in the past. A new Good story is what’s going to keep Startrek going, not rehashing the past.

224. Christopher Roberts - June 13, 2011

221. Daiman – “But maybe I’m wearing her down because I was watching Star Trek: Enterprise (The Xindi) last night and she actually did not leave the room or roll her eyes. Maybe there’s hope for her yet.”

HIGH FIVE! That’s some super Jedi mind control going on there…. How on Earth did she make it past the “Faith of the Heart” remix? :p

Now if only we could convince Simon Pegg to watch one too…

We could get Darren Brown to hypnotise him I guess. Or insert a two-frame hypnotic suggestion to step out and get something to drink, right before the song starts.

225. Randy H. - June 13, 2011

Please put science and respect for the scientific method into the next movie. SF is great, but some constants – interstellar distance, star types, biology – help ground it in reality and keep it from becoming too much like fantasy.

226. Christopher Roberts - June 13, 2011

223. *sorry* Damian NOT Daiman

Well… not unless you’ve recently been promoted to Ferengi Captain!

227. Jai - June 13, 2011

I tried posting the following thoughts here earlier today but the filter keeps grabbing it. Apologies in advance if Anthony Pascale eventually rescues it and the comment below just repeats what I’ve already said:

I think the most important thing is for Bob Orci and his colleagues to have learned the right lessons (both positive and negative) resulting from their experiences making ST09. If they take all that on board and build on it, then the sequel will be fine.

I also think they can learn a lot from Ron D Moore’s Battlestar Galactica, although the vibes in the two rebooted franchise are quite different in some ways, of course, (okay, “semi-rebooted” in the case of ST). The positive stuff mainly involves the brilliant first three seasons and should be self-evident to people who have seen BSG; the negative stuff involves how the ball ended up being dropped towards the end. Main suggestions for Bob Orci, JJ, Damon etc are:

- Plot out the entire storyline thoroughly from start to finish. Don’t make any of it up as you go along, especially the ending.
- Meticulously analyse and “devil’s advocate” the story for plot-holes, inconsistencies and contradictions, whether it involves the storyline as a whole or the behaviour of the characters.
- Remember that the logic, credibility and intellectual rigour of the storyline itself is very important. It’s not just “about the characters”. (People who are familiar with RDM’s remarks regarding the latter after the viewer outrage resulting from BSG’s finale will understand what I’m referring to here).
- Beware of falling into the trap of self-indulgence.
- Stay away from any “gimmicks” which seem fun at the time but should not really be in the movie. Examples in ST09 include the brewery engine room, Nokia ringtones, expanding hands, a glass windshield on the bridge (instead of a viewscreen) which dangerously cracks in the vacuum of space, Scotty’s transwarp beaming, phasers that mechanically “flip” between stun and kill settings, and so on. Examples from BSG include the “All Along the Watchtower” song, along with the crowbarring of “mitochondrial Eve” at the very end of the finale (which suddenly threw the show’s extensive references to classical European and Indian civilisation out of the window, and caused the writers to have to claim that the story was set 150,000 years ago rather than the far more credible 15,000 years ago timeframe).

I also think that a “must read” book for Bob Orci is “The Eerie Silence” by Paul Davies, the head of the SETI Post-Detection Taskgroup, especially if the ST writers want to make the “space” and “extraterrestrial” elements of the story realistic. The last few chapters of the book in particular are completely mind-blowing, particularly the discussions about what an alien civilisation millions of years more advanced than us would actually be like. I thought TMP hit the nail on the head in its depiction of that subject, but there’s plenty of material in Dr Davies’ book which would also be perfect for the impending sequel if it was going to include that issue.

The trailers for Terrence Malick’s “The Tree of Life” include some extraordinary (and extremely vivid) depictions of deep space. That sort of thing would be perfect for Star Trek too, especially as it would look incredible on the big screen.

Oh, and as VulcanFilmCritic said in #211, slow the movie down a bit.

228. Damian - June 13, 2011

223–I usually just hit next on the DVD to skip the theme altogether. We’ll see if I can get her to watch “Anomaly” next. Actually, that was a pretty good episode and the first where Archer starts to cross the line toward torture when he throws the pirate in the airlock. Lots of action. We’ll see.

Re: the theme. The song itself was ok. It never bothered me so much. It’s just it never seem to fit with Star Trek. I liked the visual montage during the opening credits and it seemed to fit. The lyrics fit the theme they were trying to establish. A better theme would have made a world of difference though.

229. Janice - June 13, 2011

Now that Super 8 is in theatres, maybe the ST sequel will move along faster now with everyone on-board.

I saw Super 8 yesterday and it’s a good thing I had a heads-up about Bruce Greenwood’s part in the movie. If I didn’t know, this Bruce fan would have been batty trying to figure out where hs was!! It was great and good for him to do something different! I was suitably impressed!

Now—bring on PIKE.

230. Damian - June 13, 2011

222–Depending on what year the next movie takes place, those events are still likely years in the future.

224–They have to be careful that it does not get bogged down too much with technobabble. I agree that grounding it in reality is a good thing as long as they don’t make it too complicated. I would like to see a little less of the Star Wars and more Star Trek.

231. falcon - June 13, 2011

In a comment above, Red Dead Ryan made the comment that Amanda’s death didn’t have the emotional “punch” that George Kirk’s did. However, I’d argue that it’s those two events that actually bring Spock and Kirk closer together – they now have something in common, the death of a parent. Even though Kirk didn’t know his dad, it’s still something with which he can identify with Spock. (This was brought out in the novelization of the movie, which – while it didn’t hit on all cylinders – did fill in some gaps that the movie left open. Oh, and it also allowed Admiral Archer’s beagle to reappear.)

So maybe there’s some play on that, the “infinite diversity” think coupled with the shared hardship. Could even make an interesting subplot, where Kirk considers a Spock-like action (which Spock then objects to in a somewhat less emotional Kirk-like manner). Character interaction is just as important as plot, IMNSHO.

232. bradpitti - June 13, 2011

ITS VERY SAD THAT THE BOYS AT THE CREATIVE HELM – LET US WAIT FOR SO MANY YEARS – AND THERE IS STILL NO LIGHT AT THE END OF THE TUNNEL.

I REALLY DOUBT THEIR “REAL LOVE FOR STAR TREK” AND THEY CAN KEEP READING EACH AND EVERY ONE OF THOSE ZILLION NOVELS FOR INSPIRATION AS LONG THEY GET THEIR ACT TOGETHER AND REALIZE THAT THEY ARE THE ONES NOW WHO IN CHARGE OF THE STAR TREK FRANCHISE – A POP CULTURAL PHENOMENON FOR OVER 40 YEARS.

SURE I LIKE THE GANG -ALWAYS FUNNY AND INTERESTING TO LISTEN TO – BUT THEY ALL HAVE TOO MUCH ON THEIR PLATES TO FOCUS ON STAR TREK. I DO UNDERSTAND THAT WHILE THEY ARE STILL HOT IN HOLLYWOOD TO GET AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE OUT OF IT!!! AND WHILE I UNDERSTAND ALSO THE CREATIVE ASPECT OF THE DIVERSITY OF THE JOBS THEY ARE DOING – YOU JUST CANNOT JUST WAIT UNTILL JJ HAS DONE HIS SUPER 8, DAVID HAS DONE THAT AND WHATEVER – IT DOENST REALLY SHOW A LOT OF HEART AND RESPECT TO THE FRANCHISE AND THE FANS.

RICK BERMAN WAS 1000 % STAR TREK FOR A LOOOOOONG HIS SERVICES FOR THAT WILL NEVER BEEN FORGOTEN – AND ALTOUGH HE OVERDONE STAR TREK AT THE END – YOU COULD TELL STAR TREK WAS HIS EVERYTHING.

NOW THE HIGHER COUNCIL SURLEY SHOWS SOME FANDOME – BUT IM MISSING THE DEVOTION – THE NEXT MOVIE COULD HAVE COME EASLY BY NOW!!!

4 YEARS IS NOT THE BEST TIMEFRAME INBETWEEN SEQUELS – BY PART 3 THEY CAN REBOOT AGAIN CAUSE THE ACTORS ARE OLD!!! THE FRANCHISE IS COLD AGAIN..YOUR CHECK MARK IN YOUR GEEK CURICULUM FOR THE STAR TREK 09 MOVIE SHOULD MAKE YOU HAPPY ENOUGH . IF YOU HAVE NO INTRESTS AND RATHER MAKE TV OR ALIEN-WANNA BE PREQUELS MOVE ON… AND IF YOU CANNOT DO THE JOB IN TIME.. THAN PLEASE LET SOMEBODY ELSE TAKE OVER – THANK YOU

233. sean - June 13, 2011

#230

First, please turn off your caps lock. It’s the written equivalent of someone yelling in my face. Thanks!

Second, Rick Berman was ’1000% Star Trek’ because he wasn’t in demand for anything else. When you don’t have any other obligation, it’s easy to be 1000% for the only job you have. Keep in mind, this is also part of why he couldn’t see the forest for the trees as time went on.

Third, plenty of big franchises wait 3 or 4 years between movies. Those that don’t often have stories that suffer for it.

Fourth, the fact that people like Ridley Scott, Jon Favreau, and Stephen Spielberg want to work with these folks should be seen as a positive, not a negative.

234. Bruce Banner - June 13, 2011

Agree with #230 @bradpitti: Lets turn this site into a boycott of the next film. That’ll show em. Sorry for not posting in all caps since we all know how everyone loves that.

SERIOUSLY BRADPITTI: GET OUT OF THE BASEMENT, THE SUN IS SHINING AND I THINK THEY HAVE THESE BEINGS CALLED GIRLS. MAYBE LOSE SOME OF THE TENSION.

235. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

Would have been cool to see kirk and spocks hand to hand combat starfleet wing chun training come into play with a 2v2 vs nero and his henchman with kirk and spock delivering the touch of death to nero, whom killed kirks father, destroyed spocks home, race and his mother, would have been epic scene, while the narada gets sucked into the vortex n scotty n crew try to beam them out and scotty try to get the enterprise n crew out to safety. I would have loved this payoff.

236. oldtrekgeezer - June 13, 2011

Please don’t clutter the field with too many guest stars, when we’ve only been given glimpses of most of the regular crew…more McCoy, of course, because except for 3 or so episodes of TOS there’s never been enough of him–more Sulu, Scotty, etc. I’m not getting any younger here, and neither is the cast…

That being said, if Chapel ever appears, suggest Rosamund Pike for the role. Not my idea, read it on another forum, but she’d be great. Nice chemistry with Karl in Doom, and she showed she can play cool and collected, yet compassionate, under pressure…

237. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

Bob get donnie yen, sammo, wing yu ping to train quinto and pine in martial arts you wont regret it. I know they need bout 6mths+ to look legit, reeves did it for the matrix kung fu scenes

238. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sammo_Hung

239. trekker 5 - June 13, 2011

All I can say is Bob,I hope you give Trek12 a better name than some of the ones I’ve seen on here!!

240. Anthony Pascale - June 13, 2011

Bradpetti

No more ALL CAPS. What you have to say is no more important than others

241. VZX - June 13, 2011

I never read posts that are in all caps. It’s too frustrating. I say the same to my students when they post to our class sites.

Is Spieldberg available to direct the next Trek? That would be neat!

242. Mike S - June 13, 2011

#78
#85

“Lindelof: That was the only way we could make it work, because we said, we can’t be bound by the incredible canon of Trek”

I’m good with this.

“Orci: We also didn’t want to erase what came before, so that is why we decided to sort of update time-travel. It is not the rules of Back to the Future. It is the rules of more modern theories, of creating an alternate universe.”

But they have erased what came before! You can’t say, we’re a continuation of the original body of work and then say, “Oh, by the way, we’re going to ignore one of the fundamental rules in the original body of work.” In TOS, and all the other series, when you go back in time and change something, you’ve erased the original time line. However, there was already a concept of an alternate universe in the ST canon, that of Mirror universes. I wish that these guys had merely said, “Look, this is a mirror universe, so we’re going to get to do our own thing.” I would have been good with that.

243. MJ - June 13, 2011

@231 “RICK BERMAN WAS 1000 % STAR TREK FOR A LOOOOOONG HIS SERVICES FOR THAT WILL NEVER BEEN FORGOTEN”

Yea, I will never forget how bad he botched things up, especially Voyager, Enterprise, Kirk’s death, and the atrocious last two movies that nearly shut down Trek for good.

I’ll take 10% of JJ before 100% of Berman on any day.

244. Mindmelder - June 13, 2011

First off, loved the 2009 film, It was a breath of fresh air and probably the most fun Trek film yet.

If Abrams’ Star Trek II really wants to continue break new ground:

1) Get a totally new alien threat. The Predator, Terminator, and Alien franchises kept rehashing the same beasties… and they’re just not scary the nth time around. The Borg, Klingons and Romulans are played out, IMHO. Give us a “black hat” with some mystery and new twists.

2) Kill a major crew member (say Scotty) in an emotionally impactful way.
Gotta shake the sense that “everything will turn out all right in the end”. Vulcan’s destruction was a great idea but Amanda’s death was “meh”..

3) Kirk the “rebel” should appear to “screw up” to the point where the Enterprise is being (unfairly) hunted by Pike and Starfleet and he’s been made a real pariah.

4) Continue to avoid the heavy-handed moralizing that has bogged Trek down in the past. Just give us another story where the character arcs are paramount.

5) Pay more attention to real science. This is Star Trek, not Star Wars! We like a little science meat on the bones.

6) Keep up the little in-jokes for us Trekkies… we love that stuff! Word.

7) Fire the guys who used the beer factory for Engineering…. we couldn’t believe that they tried to pull that one on us.

245. MJ - June 13, 2011

@211 “But I was sorely disappointed watching the DVD at home.”

If you had been watching the Blu-Ray at my place with the 100 inch HD 1080P project then you wouldn’t have had these issues. :-)

246. boborci - June 13, 2011

241. Not entirely true. Several episodes focus on the rules of quantum mechanics. I’m sure many here can name a few. But even had that not been the case, we still would’ve been motivated to update the rules of time travel.

247. dmduncan - June 13, 2011

194. Charla – June 12, 2011

dmduncan and red dead ryan, you both sound like you might enjoy the fashion model shows!! Nit picking the pattern on the fabric of the uniform!

***

Haha! I knew somebody would pick on that as I was writing it. True fans sweat the minor details. It’s ALL important. ;-)

248. Dee - lvs moon' surface - June 13, 2011

regarding the interview of Mr. Shatner with Captain Fine … for the Captains…

here:

http://www.thesudburystar.com/ArticleDisplay.aspx?e=3167710

:-) :-)

249. Dee - lvs moon' surface - June 13, 2011

Simon Pegg talks again … a bit …

here:

http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/movies/news/a324584/simon-pegg-confirms-star-trek-2011-shoot.html

250. Desstruxion - June 13, 2011

Spock “prime” sure did find a suitable planet for the leftover Vulcans to colonize quickly. Wonder if we’ll see it in the new flick.

251. captain_neill - June 13, 2011

Thank God they wont be doing any remakes of the classics.

252. Shatner_Fan_Prime - June 13, 2011

@ #247

Thanks for the link. Shat arm wrestling Pine? That I’ll pay to see! :-)

253. captain_neill - June 13, 2011

although I don’t think I will ever agree with their reasoning with destroying Vulcan.

Yes it works dramatically but the hard core fan in me was not happy with that one.

254. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

#236 correction *Yuen Wo-ping

http://www.gluckman.com/Matrix.htm

255. Dom - June 13, 2011

245. boborci

‘Parallels’ being the obvious TNG-era episode!

256. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

http://www.crownedanarchist.com/paralleluniverses.htm

257. Sam - June 13, 2011

The Time loop really negates the whole franchise now. Spock sub 0 knows the future like the posters above said about the amoeba, spock’s brain etc. Spock can prevent the contamination from a Piece of the Action and the Roman themed one, etc. He can go back find Khan’s derelict ship and destroy it thus erasing some of the poorer sequels.

The other posters 69 and 115 also brought up some good points and I agree that the Gorn episode was like a silent film carried by Shatner alone. Spock should set up Kirk and Marcus, mind meld with Quinto who should be made a captain himself. Let’s face it how many screwups was Kirk responsible for and how many times did Spock pull him out of the hot water. Spock really should have been the captain if we are being objective and putting aside our human prejudice that needs to have a human as the captain for the movies.

With his knowledge of the future, Spock 0 sets up Dept. 31 and can send Kirk on James Bond type adventures leaving Quinto to be the prototypical captain.

258. nuKirk - June 13, 2011

oh great…I sense The Best of Both Worlds v2 coming to nuTrek… only the Borg assimilate Khan into Lokhanate of Borg and then rampage the galaxy :S

259. Flake - June 13, 2011

256: I think Spock Prime will never reveal his secrets, I think he will walk into some remote mountains and never be seen again. If someone trys to find him and get him to reveal the future he’d rather kill himself. He probably felt responsible for what Nero being in the past and helped Kirk to fix it but he won’t do anything else because ultimately these people have to find their own way like he once did.

260. Sam - June 13, 2011

How many times did they narrowly save the entire universe in the past. Well, it just can’t happen twice, if Spock doesn’t get to Khan first it’s over. Khan’s genetic engineering together with the Borg implants forget about it.

261. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

#258

I think spock prime figures out a way to get back to his prime reality, he is spock after all and prolly locates the guardian in this reality to do so, this way there is no further cheating in this alternate reality.

262. Flake - June 13, 2011

I bet Paramount asks them to make 12 & 13 back to back with one release in 2013 and the next in 2014 to make up for todays delays. When they are finished with that they can be free of TOS and reboot TNG. Make it so!

263. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

#259

Thats pretty sick, a borg enhanced super human lol a superman borg villain. Khancutis, bow down to me mortals, resistance is not only futile but stupid

264. Sam - June 13, 2011

Ok, is Spock prime smart enough to take me and the TOS viewers with him into the old universe and dump these screenwriters?

Lets have Spock try and contact the creators of the Guardian and see what brought them down. That would be the epic battle combining elements of the Lost Middle Earth, Battlestar Gallactica (with the Borg/Cylon implants and cycle theory of time) and B5 going beyond the Rim combining everything but Star Wars, Dune and Foundation. Only Spock could act as the messiah in Stranger in a Strange Land fashion bringing them all together to destroy the entire Sci Fi Genre at one final mega battle for our souls.

265. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

#263

I think we all had enough of retirement home berman trek, embrace yout new supreme court overloards and party it up

266. Star Trek Sequel Fan Already - June 13, 2011

I absolutely love how these guys realize the importance of characters and their emotional development. That is really what pulls the audience into a good movie I think the most. The audience is human, the characters (or most of them anyways and all of them in at least one way or another) are human. Thanks guys for having such a great focus!

267. Sam - June 13, 2011

Somethoughts you are right and I left out Dr. Who which Spock is starting to resemble. Khan is smart enough to corrupt the Borg and only Spock can save them like Dr. Who who was given a chance to destroy the Daleks but didn’t. Oh, the philosophical dilemma!

268. Sam - June 13, 2011

I must resist.

269. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

Hey bob since we are your consultants, lets have a gander at the 70 page outline ;D

270. VZX - June 13, 2011

I like the updated rules of time travel. This means that you can go back in time and do whatever the hell you want and not worry about screwing up the time-stream! No more need for the Department of Temporal Investigations, since it doesn’t matter anymore! Looks like Lucsly and Dulmur are out of a job…

Go ahead, go back in time and kill your mother before you were born, it no longer creates a paradox, it just creates an alternate reality!

Screw you, Kip Thorn! Time travel can work! The laws of nature do not forbid it! Time paradoxes are never created!

Let’s see, I’m going to go back in time and warn the Titanic crew about icebergs in 1912, stop the assassinations of Lincoln and JFK, and bring back a sports almanac from the future for financial gain!

271. Daniel Shock - June 13, 2011

I hope they borrow from the Indiana Jones films and start the movie with the end of a classic ep. adventure. I think that would be a fun nod to fans. But definitely want to see the main body of the movie be something different.

272. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

#269

That sports almanac are results for that reality and would only work for that reality. That act of going to a different reality would change the outcomes of so many unforseen things, small changes in atmospheric pressure, you coughing or sneezing on someone thereby affecting athelete etc, each sports almamac would be like a snowflake unique to its reality/universe

273. Jesustrek - June 13, 2011

245.- “Deadlock” VOY season 2. (bien por no hacer “Remakes” eso espero).

Saludos.

274. Ron - June 13, 2011

@270 – that’s right Daniel Shock – they should start the next movie with the ENTERPRISE leaving Ceti Alpha V and completing the resettlement of Khan and his group, with Spock wondering what Khan will create there in 100 years.

275. Christopher Roberts - June 13, 2011

273. Given what we know, they should leave him on Ceti Alpha VI instead…

276. Chadwick - June 13, 2011

I completely agree with the aspect of cannon, any hard core fan would know of how many canon errors have occurred throughout Star Trek’s history, and for the most part we ignore them and move on. I have enjoyed the creative licence that bob, alex, damon, and JJ have used on Star Trek, and eagerly await what they do with the next movie.

277. Christopher Roberts - June 13, 2011

274. Geeze. Did I just recommend dropping Khan off on a planet due to explode in 2268? That’s not the Roddenberry philosophy at all. Section 31 would be proud of me.

278. Forrest_Leeson - June 13, 2011

^ “Well, the Doomsday Machine, the V´Ger Probe, that giant amoeba are still out there.”

No they’re not. One of the shots Nero fired at the Kelvin missed and deflected the Doomsday machine five years later, causing it to cross paths with V’ger. They fought, annihilated each other, and the cloud of debris expanding outward at .99C killed the giant amoeba. It also destroyed the Botany Bay, dissipated the vampire cloud from “Obsession”, and diverted the interstellar flying pancakes from “Operation: Annihilate!” into a convenient Einstein-Rosen-K’t’lk Bridge, causing them to travel through time and space to the other side of the galaxy a million years ago where they wiped out the original form of the Borg.

279. Iva - June 13, 2011

Hah, nice one. :))

280. Daoud - June 13, 2011

“Lindelof: In the case of the physics and the science and the science fiction, we had a rule that we kept coming back to, which was “our wives need to understand this movie.”

Take it this way: Their wives know physics and they don’t. Now it makes perfect sense. ;)

281. Daoud - June 13, 2011

@boborci on 208. No! Not M-theory! That takes branes! However, this does mean you could subtitle the film:

“Spock’s Brane”.

Physics joke. Sheldon gets it.

282. Kyle - June 13, 2011

Okay, so I did really enjoy the new Star Trek movie. I’m a long time Star Trek fan and I think the movie succeeded at gaining new fans and gaining trust from existing ones, which cannot be overstated. What I’m really hoping for though in the sequel though, is a deeper science fiction story. Star Trek didn’t always tackle big political social issues, it’s known for that, yes, and rightly so, but I think at it’s best held a mirror up to us and created a dialogue about what it means to be human, through this removed science fiction universe. It’s so much more than an action movie with aliens in it. It’s about civilizations and cultures, how they interact and how we treat each other. It’s about asking the question, how should we treat each other? DS9 added awesome new layers to that question, it didn’t change the question, nor the answer, merely added new layers of relatability and conflict that we encounter in our daily lives. TWOK is about how age, friendship, and enemies affect us and our decisions. ST VI could be said to carry a lot of those themes as well. ST IV asks how do our actions influence the future? That’s heavy stuff and certainly worth to continue in storytelling, especially with a universe so deep as Star Trek.

I’m surely repeating things that the creators of the new movie series realize, but as the new one gets underway, I really hope that Star Trek does not only remain “cool” to people, but exceeds that and becomes relatable to people again. That’s about so much more than grease on the bolts in engineering, which is why the stories always worked before, even with low budgets. On a much happier note though, I am glad you guys have the reigns and care about it so much, and created the first sequel/prequel/reboot that I know of :) Looking forward to the new one and excited to hear news!

283. Sam - June 13, 2011

I really should have taken another tack with my posts and critique.

It should be how the producers and writers took an interesting concept, with a following around the world and destroyed it.

284. NuFan - June 13, 2011

282.

You have a very unique definition of destroyed.

285. Desstruxion - June 13, 2011

Johnny Depp as Khancutis.

286. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

Fade into bird of prey beside delerect botany bay, at command is not a klingon but a built and tall human.

A oddly familair cube shaped craft approaches the familair yet different bird of prey as if it has been upgraded somehow….

A strangely mechanical voice comes rushing through all channels and all frequencies.

We will add your biological and technoligical dis……borg cube melts

Khan flexes and laughs, releasing the big red button.

5 borg beam over to the bird of prey and surround Khan.

Khan uses his martial arts on the borg and take out 4 before being assimilated.

Another cube fades in.

Fade to starfleet 57th chess and martial arts championship, we see kirk dressed in traditional red and gold and his opponent is none other than spock dressed in white and blue. We hear the referre announce, en garde, appon. Kirk rushes spock and goes for a flying drop kick, spock remains calm and im a defensive posture and catches kirks flying kick with his hands and deflects kirks kick. Kirk attacks with his hands and move close, we see spock and kirk engaged in close hand to hand wing chun combat, attack, drfend, attack, defend going on for 2+mins.

287. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

Spocks calm and clear mind can see Kirks moves before they are made.
Both Kirk and Spock appear to be at a stalemate.
Kirk is focused on taking down the defending champion.

Kirk realizing the only way to win is to take risk and use illogical moves, Spock anticipates Kirks aggression.

Kirk goes in for the wing chun punch and strikes Spock dead on in the chest 10+ times Spock appears to be dazed and falling down, and as he does he grabs Kirk by the shirt and puts him into the Vulcan death lock grapple.

Kirk falling in and out of consciousness sees his dad, George Kirk, oddly strange as he never met his father, only saw holographic images of him provided by his mother.

Refusing to tap out, Kirk somehow gets out of the Vulcan death lock grapple and both Spock and Kirk are now engaged in a mental test of will and survival. Kirk pushing Spocks arm away, causing pain and earning points. The bell sounds and both contestants rush up to the 3D chess station, both physically drained from their duel, Kirk trades in his pond for a…..Red Alert Klaxxon sounds, ATTENTION ALL OFFICERS AND STAFF, a hush goes over the crowd. Kirk and Spock look at each other with concern.

Before the announcement can finish a huge section of the building gets ripped open like a tin can and there is a massive explosion, the sound of death, majority of the crowds get vaporized and gets sucked out into space. Debris is everywhere, if you were too look out the panaramic view of the solar system you can see fields of debris. The Enterprise having gone a refit is on earth. Dr. McCoy, Scotty, Uhura comes rushing over to Kirk and Spock with deep dive suits, all strap on and head for a emergency deep dive towards earth and the refit Enterprise. A much more sophisticated and deep space jump compared to their very first mission, having to dodge fields of debris and floating bodies.

288. chrisfawkes.com - June 13, 2011

Hope they know how it ends. I would love to come out of the cinema thinking that was the best payoff i have ever seen in a movie.

They have already provided the best opening sequence ever in Star Trek, lets see the best close too.

289. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 13, 2011

#282 – “It should be how the producers and writers took an interesting concept, with a following around the world and destroyed it.”

Only in your mind, Sam. By the way, there is NO time loop. The reality is that what happened in the prime universe may not actually happen in this one. Why automatically assume that it would or should? Some people, who existed in the other universe, may not have been born in this one. Some things will be much the same, others things simply not at all.

290. Odkin - June 13, 2011

Oh brother.

291. somethoughts - June 13, 2011

Nobody has done martial arts in space, floating hand to hand kung fu combat would be cinematic. Kirk and spock beaming over to narada and drop kicking/kung fu’ing the romulans would have been awesome. Bob you should have convinced jj that you cant fire phasers inside a space ship just like you cant fire a gun on a airplane. After spock and kirk take out the henchman, nero getting beat to a bloody pulp would have been fiting for murdering george kirk, spocks mom, planet, race. Have the final kung fu fight while the narada is imoloding into the vortex and scotty figuring out to beam them out and get the ship far from vortex would be climatic heaven.

Of course the kung fu fight sequence would have to be better than the matrix subway fight scene and all the ip man fight scenes combined.

You can always bring back nero as borg nero and he can get his ass kicked by kirk and spock

292. bradpitti - June 14, 2011

OK SO NO MORE CAPS LOCK!

sure berman did lot of b***sh*** voyager, enterprise, nemesis i totally agree – but at least he did it with passion. i just dont have the feeling the boys demonstrate that to much with having too many collaboration with too many people. 4 years its way to much inbetween the movies sorry – as mentioned – it makes the franchise not more apealing to a mass audience – when “oh another trek is here again” rather than ” ah the sequel is here” the fanboys show up anyway – but outside the us market – there is still work to do – and it aint helping letting years go by – and im from austria – nobody really cares bout trek – if you dont generate some hype..

yeah i think the lost boys are good for the franchise in the 21st century – but a ferrari staying in the garage is not good for the car either or its not what its made for…

hand the keys to ronald d. moore he at least knows how to handle sci-fi in exciting way (now start whining bout the finale of bsg) and he surley does respect deadlines…

you guys are frustated by caps lock letters – im soooo SORRY for disturbing your feng shui on the pc. im frustated by a perfect reboot movie – with an ending that let the adventure just begin… but the council is still breaking the story outlining and princess jj still has to decide – if the screeenplay is good enough for directing (or makes some money-studio-mumbo-chumbo)..

that is frustrating!!!

293. Bill Peters - June 14, 2011

I think Bob and JJ and Team can come up with stuff without having to Rehash old Episodes but they can take elements and re-Introduce them into new situations or refresh the Ideas to be used in the Sequel!

294. Jack - June 14, 2011

280. Brane and brane, what is b…

Thank God for String Theory for Dummies.

295. Jack - June 14, 2011

Oops, M-Theory. Good thing I’m not writing a screenplay.

296. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 14, 2011

#208 What? Clearly Bob Orci style technobabble? Something to look forward to, maybe?

297. VulcanFilmCritic - June 14, 2011

244 @ MJ. It’s not the technology that’s lacking. “Star Trek” doesn’t play well at home because there is no large audience there. The experience in the theater is very different from that in front of a TV no matter how big the screen is or how great your sound system is.

TV is an intimate medium which makes you listen to what the characters have to say. That is why TOS is so effective. It’s drama. Some on this board brought up on a steady diet of action movies have referred to it as “talky.” Well, that’s what good drama is: talk.

Alfred Hitchcock said movies can either be dramatic (talky or like filmed plays) or cinematic (like silent movies) and he preferred that movies that were cinematic. In fact, he decried the advent of sound. The Star Trek movies have tended to be more dramatic, especially those directed by Nicholas Meyer. “Star WARS” on the other hand was more cinematic. You don’t need the sound on to know that Darth Vader is a menacing guy. But the first Star Wars movie never sacrificed drama for cinematic effect.

The new “Star Trek” is like “Star Wars,” more cinematic, but its rapid cutting and sketchy plot line tends to leave one wanting some kind of real drama.
That is why it doesn’t play well on the “small screen” regardless of how large that screen actually is.

298. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 14, 2011

#296 I agree that the pace could be slowed down a little, so that the characters get more time to just be and do. I hope that is what we will see more of in the next film.

I enjoy watching the DVD on my analog TV screens – one being a 14″ screen and playing on a JVC DVD/Video recorder or the larger 28″ screen and playing through an X-Box 360 player.

The only thing I don’t like is that what you get is a wide narrow picture (16:9). It is not just Star Trek. It is like that for a whole heap of other movies made by different companies. I prefer the picture to fill up (pretty much) the entire screen. It does look better on a bigger screen, but it seems a waste of a lot of screen space. You still have the black border at the top and bottom of the screen. A programme made for television fills up the screen and perhaps that is part of what gives the feeling of intimacy.

They need to change the format for widescreen movies going onto DVD. Is it any different with Blu-ray? I don’t know. Don’t have blu-ray. Touchwood, our current (backwards) technology still works and if it ain’t broke, don’t fix or replace…

299. Radioactive Spock - June 14, 2011

If they do decide to use Khan at some point, they should give him 2 movies, maybe not even sequential, and have Botany Bay found during a firefight with the Klingons, during which he is narrowly saved by Enterprise crew, and through the movie he somehow saves Kirk and crew, only to be captured by the Klingons later, who are interested in making Klingon supersoldiers. This can set up Khan as a bad guy in the subsequent movie, as he can blame Kirk for not saving him from the Klingons.

I don’t know, I do like Khan a lot, but if he is reused at this point they should make him a good guy for a while. Give him a common enemy with Kirk and crew so he can use his “superior” intelligence and strength to benefit the good guys. Guess Spock prime would know better though.

300. La Reyne d'Epee - June 14, 2011

http://media.collider.com/collider_audio/Hero_Complex_2011/Alex_Kurtzman_Roberto_Orci_Damon_Lindelof_Star_Trek.mp3

Heard the whole interview now – great fun! Real people talking! And Bob you heard it the same way I read it…(OK, OK, won’t rub it in)

301. Charla - June 14, 2011

Hey Anthony!! Ready for that “exclusive video interview” eluding to more information from Bob, Damon and Alex. Checking my calander, it is early this week now. Wednesday is mid week technically. :)

Shall we all start complaining about how long it is taking for that to come out ???? LOL j/k Don’t make us wait until July!! I’ll be another month older! Oh and don’t put it in 3-D either ok?

302. Robert Rostad - June 14, 2011

@#8
Odds are Uhura won’t be back. Zoe Saldona is supposed to be a pretty big deal, and I wouldn’t count on her for sequels.

I think that holding Rand, Chapel, and even Ilia in case Uhura bails and the Enterprise needs a last minute A List replacement makes good business sense.

303. VulcanFilmCritic - June 14, 2011

301. Bite your tongue, Robert Rostad! Uhura not coming back?!? After setting us up with the biggest bombshell ever dropped on Star Trek fans? Are you kidding?

Look, we’ve gotta wrap this Spock/Uhura thing up in the next movie. Somebody has to break somebody’s heart so that we can feel sorry for them. And we have to give Mr. Spock a really good reason to crawl into his emotional lock box…and stay there.

I can see it so clearly: Love vs. duty. And Spock mistakenly chooses love and all hell breaks loose and the Enterprise is almost lost. So at the end we get this really tearful scene where Spock explains to Uhura why he cannot love her like other men. And she cries her eyes out and he tenderly kisses those tear-stained cheeks! And maybe even sheds a tear, a real tear, himself.

And all the fangirls in the audience will get goosebumps and write bad poetry about lost love in the fanzines for years to come.

304. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 14, 2011

#301 Why should Zoe Saldana bail? As far as I know, all the main cast are contracted to do three Star Trek movies. I don’t think it would look at all good on their resumes if they tried to get out of their contracts. There is no doubt get-out clause, but it will cost them, in reputation and quite possibly, monetarily as well. What have the characters Rand, Chapel, or Ilia got to do with Uhura being there or not? Uhura was always there, irrespective of what other women may or may not have been in the original Star Trek.

305. HARRISON!!! - June 14, 2011

There is *no* quantum flux, there’s no auxiliary, there’s no God-damned SHIP! Ya got that?

Sorry… Galaxy Quest moment :-P

306. FarStrider - June 14, 2011

@302 Or the writers can do something completely original and have Spock and Uhura get married and stay happily married. . .and all the fangirls will get goosebumps and write bad poetry about true love for years to come…

~FS

307. somethoughts - June 14, 2011

#305

Uhura could get killed and sends Spock over the edge, Kirk and company are sent to stop Spock from destroying the Galaxy.

Evil Spock can shoot lightning bolts, have red eyes and bolts of electricity shoot between his ears, first order of business for evil Spock is to wipe out all the Romulan miners and Klingons whom brutally murdered Uhura.

You can’t stop Sylar I mean Spock, he’s bad ass.

308. FarStrider - June 14, 2011

@306 Muhahahaha. . . nonononono. . .C’mon get with the program. . . we are being ORIGINAL here! SPOCK has to die, and Uhura becomes the ultra badass terrorist who plans to take down the Romulans and Klingons who killed her man!!! That’s a story we haven’t seen yet. . .I mean, “killing the female to motivate the guy” stories are a dime a dozen. . .

~FS

309. FarStrider - June 14, 2011

@306 Oh, and since Uhura and Spock were married, she gets his katra, which gives her all of those freaky super-Vulcan powers you were talking about. . . yeah, that works for me. . .

~FS

310. Red Dead Ryan - June 14, 2011

297.
…..

The days of putting a widescreen theatrical film into the standard definition 4:3 format are over, since widescreen hi-def televisions are the new thing. The evolution of home entertainment has made 4:3 format versions of 16×9 films irrelevant and archaic. Plus, when a movie is cropped to fill a standard def tv, parts of the movie are cut out.

If you could afford it, I would suggest you upgrade to a widescreen hi-def set. “Avatar” on blu ray is absolutely spectacular and beautiful. Also, I hope you’d check out the BBC blu ray series “Planet Earth” and “Life”. Both will blow you away!

311. somethoughts - June 14, 2011

#307 #308

LOL

312. somethoughts - June 14, 2011

#308

Imagine Uhura crushing starships and planets with her bare hands, the rage she is in, sorta like magneto on juice, a fight sequence where she takes out 1000 klingons, romulans and chuck norris

313. FarStrider - June 14, 2011

@311 Well, Saldana DID want a action/fight scene. . .

~FS

314. Charla - June 14, 2011

# 301– For the record, having seen Zoe in a few interviews, she has expressed great anticipation to return to Trek. I think they all are looking forward to it from what I have seen on the web.

315. somethoughts - June 14, 2011

#312

I hope they get martial arts training like the matrix, last thing I want to see is amateur fight scenes from tv series. Sammo Hung and Yuen Woo Ping choreographer is a must. The actors should be training now if they want to shoot in Nov/Dec! Investment in time and skilled folks if they want quality on screen, not old folks fighting it out on a mountain.

316. somethoughts - June 14, 2011

Imagine if Spock had the chance to SpockFu Nero at the end of ST2009, this would have been the result! Tie in some flashbacks of his mom, planet and his people as he kicks Nero’s ass.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0zIJCpUqeb4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSMTf0wUCzs

317. FarStrider - June 14, 2011

@314 I’m not really sure that everyone needs to be a wire-fu expert. . .one of the points of Star Trek is that the characters are human, not supermen, so personally, I wouldn’t want anything beyond what is possible for real people . . .one of the the things that impressed me about the bridge fight scene is that Spock’s fighting style was “alien” . . .you could tell that he is not human from the way he moved and his strikes. . .as long as any fight scene in the movies achieves that sort of realism, I’ll be happy with it. . .

~FS

318. somethoughts - June 14, 2011

#316

I agree about the wires and dangling but ask yourself this, do naval, military folks get martial arts training?

319. Somethoughts continued :D - June 15, 2011

To answer your questions-especially the one about the naval, military folks getting martial arts training. They do actually get some basic techniques on how to defend, disarm, and neutraliz people. But i dont think that you will have to worry about them looking like old people fighting or any of the action scenes looking crappy. Come on this is a movie that is going to be spending millions of dollars on production there not going to want to piece together some worthless scene and throw it in. I loved all of the matrix movies but i honestly dont want to see a jet li scene in a trek movie im sorry but i garantee everyone here will agree with me. tho i can say that that sword fight on the drilling machine was an awesome fight but it also showed how everyones fighting techniques are different! Which is a trek thing these people are coming from all over the galaxy and we dont want to see kirk and spock throw down the exact same way. Kirk is a bar fighter lol. And spock well he has the choke thing going on lol :D

320. FarStrider - June 15, 2011

@317 Unless they are in the Special Forces, not as much as you seem to think. Modern warfare is fought from a distance, hand-to-hand martial arts would be a waste for most (sailors are on ships miles away — hell, all of their basic training is performed indoors. . . Air Force are in planes. . .) Marines and Army Infantry do fight on the ground, but again, modern weapons make it more unlikely to have to use hand-to-hand combat. . .they are taught the basics, but unless they study it after basics or are in the Special Forces (Rangers, Seals, Green Beret), then what they are learning is things like field first aid, biological attack defense, bomb detecting, swimming, marching and taking orders. . . they are not necessarily expert martial artists. . .

~FS

321. Artchick - June 15, 2011

To lead off my comment- I’m not a racist, and I’m not a swastika-sporting, ethnic cleansing, despicable person. :o)

That noted, Young Spock said in ST2009 that he was now a member of an endangered species. Would the Vulcan elders (AND SPOCK’S DAD), with all of their logic, support a loving relationship between Spock (who, yes, is half human) and a fully human woman (Uhura)? Or would they order Spock to choose a Vulcan mate as a contribution in perpetuation of the species? Crisis of heart for Spock- make a logical choice and choose a wife to make children that are more Vulcan than human, or turn his back on his culture, stay with Uhura, and make some mostly human with slightly pointy-eared babies?

322. just some guy - June 15, 2011

It’s too bad there won’t be any remakes of old episodes. I had been hoping for a retelling of Gary Mitchell’s godhood story in the reboot universe with characters like Dr. Carol Marcus and Dr. Elizabeth Dehner. It was another very compelling story like Star Trek 2: The Wrath of Khan that stretches Kirk to his limit and beyond.

I don’t know if Bob Orci is still reading this, but if he is doing such a story, I would invite him to read Spinoza’s Ethics, especially IV.xxxvii: “The good which every man, who follows after virtue, desires for himself he will also desire for other men, and so much the more, in proportion as he has a greater knowledge of God.” Or as Kirk says to Mitchell: “Above all else a god needs compassion.” Ironically, Kirk shows Mitchell compassion at great risk to his ship as Spock is telling him to kill Mitchell while he still can, while Mitchell as a god is incapable of compassion for Kirk.

Early in the story, Mitchell rejects Spinoza saying that he’s “simple, really” and that he doesn’t agree with him at all. Spinoza’s Ethics of reason over emotion is also very similar to the Vulcan philosophy of Surak developed later in the series. Our Kirk, of course, probably would not have read “that long haired” stuff like the original Kirk had.

Also, the eyes look cool. :) Best of luck on the movie.

323. somethoughts - June 15, 2011

#321

I think spock will donate his magic sauce to other vulcan woman while he and uhura develop their relationship further.

Knowing the vulcans im sure they can clone replicate all the ones killed in the 911 vulcan event, memories included. They can hire some talosians to cast a illusion on new vulcan to make them think its real vulcan and nothing has changed.

324. FarStrider - June 16, 2011

@321 given that Spock is HALF-HUMAN, and all of his Vulcan genes are the same as Sarek’s, his contribution would add to the diversity of the Vulcan people, so there would be no over-riding objections if he didn’t contribute (if the Vulcans want him, considering their attitudes toward him). . .but even if they did want him, Spock-Prime could contribute those same genes. . .so your rational to break up Spock and Uhura doesn’t work on that level. . .

~FS

325. FarStrider - June 16, 2011

CORRECTION: Would not contribute to the diversity of the Vulcan people. . . since Sarek has the same vulcan genes. . .there is no need for Spock’s. . .

~FS

326. Keachick (rose pinenut) - June 18, 2011

Except that Sarek has old “magic sauce” and prime Spock’s is even older. The best juice still comes from a fit, YOUNG man! It is not just women who age in that respect and are more likely to have sick or handicapped children, but it is also more likely among older men as well, just not so much.

Vulcans need healthy, youthful “magic sauce” to get the best outcome.

Why do you think older men (40+) tend to go for younger women and older women tend to go for younger men? Fundamentally, our instincts are about perpetuating our genes and if you are older, then the chances of a better outcome goes up if you go with a (much) younger member of the opposite sex. It is sort of hardwired into us. Not that strange if you think about it. Most people would not think of their attraction in those terms, because we tend to be divorced from our procreative selves because of contraception and various socio-economic factors, but our brains/bodies aren’t. It knows what it is looking for, even if we don’t.

327. Aurore - June 18, 2011

Star Trek II (2012) : The Search For Sauce.

Mr. Orci , should you ignore that title suggestion, I wouldn’t feel offended.

328. Aurore - June 18, 2011

@ The “team” .

Star Trek II (2012) : The Search For (Hot Vulcan) Sauce.

Ignoring THIS suggestion, however, would be unfortunate.

Think of all the marketing possibilities, people!!!

:)

329. La Reyne d'Epee - June 18, 2011

Star Trek II (2012): The Sauce of Spock.

330. ImFineNU - June 29, 2011

I was thinking about the “Wormhole/Blackhole” that Old Spock created. It still is connected at one end to near Romulas in the future timeline and at the other end somewhere in the Alpha Quadrant in the 2009 timeline. This might be the source of an epic potential threat that needs to be dealt with. A future warship arrives in the 2009 timeline and starts trying to take over. It would need to be dealt with and the wormhole would need to be closed to prevent any further advanced future warships from entering the 2009 timeline.

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