CBS Expects “Star Trek: Discovery” To Get All Access To 4 Million Subscribers

Star Trek: Discovery on CBS All Access

Earlier today CBS CEO Les Moonves spoke to investors about the future of the company, including hopes for how Star Trek: Discovery will help meet their goals of growth for the CBS All Access platform.

Moonves talks expectations for Discovery on All Access and future of the platform
Speaking to investors this morning, the CEO of CBS Leslie Moonves went into more detail about his expectations for Star Trek: Discovery and specifically how he sees the show driving growth for the subscriber-based CBS All Access streaming service. Last year Moonves told investors that the company expected All Access to hit a goal of four million subscribers. Today he was asked about that goal and said:

On All Access, we were well over one million subs before we put on any original content. We just launched The Good Fight, which is The Good Wife spin-off. It has done very well and we are very pleased and it’s only three weeks in but the subscribers are going up there. Once Star Trek comes on – which will be late summer/early fall – we expect the subscribers to go up considerably. We think as we keep adding original content, that’s going to be easy to get to four million there…It’s not even optimistic – we are confident we are going to hit those numbers.

Star Trek is a key part of CBS' strategy to attract subscribers to the CBS All Access service

Star Trek is a key part of CBS’ strategy to attract subscribers to the CBS All Access service

Moonves also said that CBS was committed to doing four original shows each year for CBS All Access and he outlined the vision for what kind of content they were looking to do for the platform, saying:

We are primarily looking at scripted [content]. We are looking at things that would be different than is on the CBS Television Network. Probably more of a similar profile to what they are doing on Showtime. But obviously as it is All Access and we have got people to pay for it, there needs to be a great hook. Star Trek – obviously people have been clamoring for new Star Trek for years and years. So it is either through a star or through an idea that we will put shows on All Access that will attract people to pay money. People have got to feel they are getting something they are not getting elsewhere. And we think we will be able to achieve that.

According to Moonves, CBS is open to the idea of expanding CBS All Access outside the USA, but he again noted the importance of Netflix in funding Star Trek: Discovery, saying:

There may be a possibility. Obviously with Star Trek we had a tremendous deal with Netflix to sell the international rights to them, which obviously paid for a lot of what Star Trek cost. There would be a possibility of looking at both OTT [Over the top streaming service] platforms and coming up with an international service. It is certainly working for Netflix and Amazon and a lot of local SVOD [Subscription Video on Demand] players so we are exploring this right now in certain territories.

CBS is cognizant of Netflix's contribution to funding "Star Trek: Discovery"

CBS is cognizant of Netflix’s contribution to funding “Star Trek: Discovery”

Betting on Star Trek To Move Into New Markets
CBS is staking a lot of its growth on their All Access streaming service, and apparently Star Trek is a major part of meeting their goals, if not the key to those goals.

Even though Star Trek barely made it to a third season in the late 60s, by the 70s (due to the popularity of reruns in syndication) it was seen a vital property by Paramount and its parent at the time Gulf-Western. In 1977 Paramount announced they were going to launch a new television network with a Star Trek series as its flagship. The network project eventually died and the “Star Trek: Phase II” series morphed into the 1979 theatrical film Star Trek: The Motion Picture. In 1987 Paramount had a groundbreaking success in first-run syndication with the launch of Star Trek: The Next Generation. And when Paramount finally did launch a TV network (UPN) in 1995 it started with the premiere of Star Trek: Voyager.

Today, streaming has become a major force in the entertainment industry. Just yesterday it was reported that more US homes have the Netflix streaming service than a DVR. And last week the US Government reported that the number of televisions in US homes is actually declining as more and more people are getting content on other devices. CBS executives are betting that the future won’t just be televised; it will also be streamed. What better show than Star Trek, a vision for a hopeful future, to bring them into the new entertainment age.

Star Trek: The Next Generation and Voyager forged into new TV markets - now Star Trek: Discovery will forge into streaming

Star Trek: The Next Generation and Voyager forged into new TV markets – now Star Trek: Discovery will forge into streaming

Stay tuned to TrekMovie for all the news related to Star Trek: Discovery. And keep track of the show’s crew and details in one place on our Discovery page.

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Discovery is sounding more and more promising. And I’m thrilled that since Star Trek will be the key to growing their streaming service, CBS will be highly motivated to make the best Star Trek they can!

I’d be MORE hopeful if I thought that CBS had any idea of what made Star Trek great, but maybe the creative team can take care of that. :-)

And if it doesn’t (which is a possibility)? Then CBS will say no more to Star Trek, because they won’t consider it a financial investment for the company. This same thinking – abandoning Discovery before it’s even got a chance to air – is what doomed Star Trek: Enterprise in 2001. And if you decide to abandon Discovery, don’t drag the rest of the fan base with you. The toxicity already existing from people hating the reboot films (which by the way are the reason we’re even getting Discovery in the first place) doesn’t need to become toxic further. So, either put up or leave the fan base.

CBS won’t cancel Star Trek. Netflix’s license is paying for production and it’s sure to be a hit on Netflix outside the US and Canada. The reason we are getting Star Trek Discovery has nothing to do with people hating the movies. It’s because Les Moonves has a streaming service to salvage and boost up to 4 million subscribers, and Star Trek is just about the best brand he has for doing that. What would you suggest instead, CSI? Murder She Wrote? CBS doesn’t have many streaming-friendly properties.

I meant to say the Reboots’ success is the main reason why we’re getting Discovery… the hating is coming from those fans who have hatred for JJ Abrams and his crew.

NOBODY has streaming friendly ANYTHING. The streaming tech is still in its infancy and is unreliable and terrible.

@Ml31 are you kidding? There are no streaming friendly properties? So Netflix has no original content that is popular, right?

How about HBO? Their OTT service surpassed 2 million subscribers and growing and HBO is committed to it. Do you whine about paying to watch Game of Thrones on HBO? Or that you cant it on DVD the day the new season begins?

Really, your tired old argument is lame. We get it, you live in the middle of nowhere and wont pay for better internet service so you get poor streaming and you arent embracing new technologies so you want a cd to come in the mail that you can watch on your DVD player from 1998. You’re the minority.

Maybe Star Trek Discovery isnt for you.

There are no streaming friendly properties because the tech itself is not reliable. Duh… House of Cards and Daredevil are pretty good stuff. But streaming doesn’t help them. I wait for the disc that I KNOW are coming. I catch Game of Thrones on Netflix about 10 months after it airs. Sucks having to avoid spoilers but that is the price I pay for higher quality since I refuse to pay for HBO for one show.

I live in a top ten market in the US. Streaming tech is not nearly as good as popping in a disc. I get that you don’t care about avoiding commercials and that you don’t care if the rewind, pause, etc are very delayed action. You don’t care that the stream stops mid stream for buffering depending on when you do your streaming. I get that you don’t care about quality. But believe it or not, there are some out there who DO want a higher quality platform. It’s not about STD. It’s about the inconsistent tech CBS is forcing on us to get it.

@Ml31 , do you live in a cave on an island/ Netflix streaming is VERY reliable. Never had an issue. Crystal clear. So no, the service is not “unreliable”.

You might opt not to pay for good internet or OTT service but thats your choice. If your internet provider sucks, take it up with them. But you keep pushing this false narrative that OTT is unreliable. And its simply not true.

I’ve never, ever, ever had my Netflix signal stop mid-stream to buffer. Ever.

But again, is this YOUR Netflix or is your friend sharing it with 20 people? Maybe thats a problem, I dont know.

Again, you’re whining about Discovery not being available on Disc when EVERY film and episode of Star Trek has always been on Disc. So why dont you wait a year and if its not relased on Disc you can come here and whine about it.

I could complain right now that August 25th 2017 is not warm enough. But I have no idea if thats true. Thats what you’re doing. Knock it off.


Seems you did not heed my advise to actually read the posts you are commenting to. I mentioned that I live in a top 10 US market. I’ve had Netflix stop to buffer from time to time. It’s not every time but it’s enough to be annoying. That is the tech’s problem. Not mine. And even when I am streaming perfectly the controls are just a nightmare to handle. They are delayed action and when they do work you can’t get it to stop fast enough. The discs and the DVR just don’t have that problem.

A also complained that CBS has yet to say if the show will be available on disc at all. Let alone if it will be available for rental through other providers. Once again, you are crying about something that was not in the post. Please read them thoroughly before you comment on them.

Thank you.

@Ml31 never had that issue and Im in a city of under a million in Canada. And the controls are fine too. Are you sure you know how to use it? Perhaps you need a higher tier Internet plan? Or a higher quality cable connecting your TV to your friend’s Netflix account.

Living in a top 10 US market has no bearing on whether you have a lower tier Internet plan or bad wiring. Contact your internet provider and tell them you keep having issues when streaming Netflix which is NOT normal.

This isnt a Netflix or streaming issue. Its a you issue.

The fact you wait months for a disc because you think the quality of Netflix is poor is unfortunate. You’re denying yourself a great experience. In time, Netflix will probably cease renting discs (probably not for awhile but eventually). What will you do then?

“Living in a top 10 US market has no bearing on whether you have a lower tier Internet plan or bad wiring. ”

No but it is an appropriate correction to your claim that I “live in the middle of nowhere”.

“What will you do then?”

By then the streaming tech ought to be much better and more reliable.

@ML – its not an appropriate response to my inquiring because I was relating that you must live in the middle of nowhere and thus have limited internet connection. You stated that was not the case which reinforces my statements that if you have access to the best internet, it doesnt mean thats the package you currently have.

What you’re describing is an issue with your internet, not the technology of steaming. If it was, then EVERYONE would have the same issues.

People can experience Internet issues for a variety of reasons. Using it in a corner of the house that is too far from the Wi Fi modem. Being in a basement. Too many users on your WiFi. etc. These are not issues with the content provider.

Its your Internet, dude. You’re just too obtuse and stubborn to know it or do anything about it.

If Netflix sent me a disc and it was scratched and wouldnt play, thats an issue with the disc not with the technology of discs. What dont you understand about this?

I can sit on the beach and watch HD films on my friggen phone. I watched a hockey game on a patio in Jamaica live in HD. The technology is great. Its ALMOST idiot proof. But you’re proving that its not quite completely idiot proof.

“its not an appropriate response to my inquiring because I was relating that you must live in the middle of nowhere and thus have limited internet connection. You stated that was not the case”

Then there was no need for you to bring it up again.

“then EVERYONE would have the same issues.”

A lot of people do.

“Its your Internet, dude. You’re just too obtuse and stubborn to know it or do anything about it.”

And again… You are the one who accuses me of making petty insults…

“If Netflix sent me a disc and it was scratched and wouldnt play, thats an issue with the disc not with the technology of discs. What dont you understand about this?”

That’s true. But in the case of streaming it would be like 70% of the discs were bad but kinda sorta playable. It’s the price people are willing to put up with the the other positives streaming brings. What don’t YOU understand about that?

“I can sit on the beach and watch HD films on my friggen phone. ”

So could I. But I have no desire to. I’ve watched NHL games on my phone in the past but ONLY when there was no other option and it was a playoff game. Otherwise, I wouldn’t waste my time. Not sure what your point here is…

@ML – you’re flat out wrong. Please cite a source that indicates 70% of Netflix users have consistent, poor video quality? You’re completely wrong.

You’re so wrong you dont even realise that the issue is you.

Again, a reading comprehension failure on your part. Learn the concept of analogies. I never guessed at what % of Netfilx users have poor quality. And if I did, I would guess higher than 70%….

You have gotta be messing with me… Again, no one can be that oblivious to the world around them….

Netflix has about 83 million subscribers. To suggest more than 70% of them have consistent poor streaming defies logic to me. That amount of people having that level of poor service would be so vocal.

I decided to see if I could verify your position. While searching the Internet I found an article that actually discussed a test Internet Service Providers now use called Netflix ISP Speed Index1. They use this specific test to keep track of how well Netflix is streaming on their systems because of how important consistent good quality video is. In fact, the article is entitled “How many days will your customer suffer poor Netflix qualify before they switch ISP’s?” (feel free to google it).

An Article in the Sydney Morning Herald when Netflix launched there cited a study done by Conviva (which is a video analytics firm) that indicated 25% of people will turn off a program with 4 minutes of poor video.

That tells us that, when considered next to Netflix’ massive subscriber base, they do not experience consistent, widespread poor video or else they’d simply lose their subs.

The blame, when Netflix launched in Australia, was sqaurely on the local ISP’s for their slow internet. And it stands to reason. We know Netflix produces a high quality stream. We know this because many of us receive ie. You cant receive a better quality image then that of the source. So we know the source is tremendous.

What causes the loss in video quality and buffering is the ISP.

I’ve said this repeatedly. If its true that YOU have poor video quality with Netflix, it is NOT Netflix and its not inherient in the technology of streaming.

When I moved into my previous home, we had lousy cable service. It turned out our underground wiring was bad (we were the end house). I didnt watch the cable video crackle and pixelate and think “Man, I cant wait for this newfangled invention called Television to finally be good”, I called my provider and they identified the issue.

Please, ML, acknowledge that the source quality at Netflix is pristine and that any issues YOU experience are likely related to your ISP. And then do yourself a fsvour and call your ISP and have them investigate.

To suggest other does a diservice to others who might not know the difference and are on the fence about All Access. Ensure you’re ISP is providing you with sufficient service to stream the content.

“he streaming tech is still in its infancy and is unreliable and terrible.”

In the grand scheme yes, it’s in it’s infancy, but I don’t know what you’re talking about when you say it’s unreliable and terrible. You need to stop posting here, really.


Yes… Let people who bring the facts to the table vanish. You love the inferior picture, sound and controls in exchange for being able to bury your face in your phone. God forbid there are people out there who do not see that as a good trade off.

@ML31 – you sound like someone who buys a computer and then goes online and burries it as a lousy computer for going online and that it was incredibly slow and you couldnt even see anything. And it turned out you didnt have an internet connection.

You keep pushing this idea that streaming is so bad and terrible. But do you realise that Netflix streams in 4K? That many people watch this with no buffering or loss of quality? Like seriously, do you know that?

So if Netflix streams content and many many people have no issues but YOU have issues, do you think thats a reflection of the quality of the source, a reflection of the quality of the technology or perhaps its something specific to you?

I’ve been watching The Walking Dead on Netflix from the beginning the past couple of weeks. so im watching anywhere from 2-6 or more episodes a day when I have time. Not one single time was it slow, did it buffer or was there a single instance of loss of audio or picture quality.

The controls are intuitive and easy to use (and Im using an Xbox controller, not even a proper remote but when I used to stream Netflix through my blu ray player, I did use the Blu Ray remote and again, perfectly simple and easy to use controls).

So again…your experience with Netflix being poor quality and having stream issues is not the experience of others and is not the fault of either the provider (Netflix) or the technology (streaming).

If what you say is true, you should contact your internet provider and open a ticket. Either you have a lower tier internet plan which is throttling your connection or there is a wiring issue with your provider.

And I can tell you from personal experience, I had two issues with poor quality – when I moved into my previous home. I opened a ticket and it turned out to be a bad underground cable. Interestingly, this affected my cable more than my streaming. They eventually replaced the underground cable.

Second time, I was having slow downs and when I called they explained I had a lower tier internet plan that was good for me when I bought it but now we have many more devices running off our wi fi. I got switched to a better plan and have no issues.

Its not the tech, its you.

“you sound like someone who buys a computer and then goes online and…”

And I’m the one who insults people. Again… Tsk tsk.

“But do you realise that Netflix streams in 4K? ”

You don’t recall me telling you that personally know someone who gets the 4K service? This is why you are difficult to speak to. You ask questions, raise issues, get responses and ignore or forget them.

“So if Netflix streams content and many many people have no issues but YOU have issues, do you think thats a reflection of the quality of the source, a reflection of the quality of the technology or perhaps its something specific to you?”

You yourself admitted to not being able to tell the difference between DVD and blu ray. There are some in my family who claim they can’t tell the difference between SD and HD. I’m going to rely on my own experience more so than strangers on the internet who may or may not have any clue to what they are talking about in this field.

“The controls are intuitive and easy to use ”

That wasn’t the problem with them. But you not recalling that is not surprising.

“If what you say is true, you should contact your internet provider”

Why do you repeat this over and over and over? I don’t have any internet problems whatsoever. It works perfectly for EVERYTHING except streaming to my big TV. (why do I correct you? You NEVER take it)

@ML – you’re so ignorant its mind blowing. What a role model you must be to your children. You cant even answer the questions because the answers prove that you’re as stupid as you seem.

Its very simple: Netflix produces a high quality source content. MANY MANY people receuive that course with NO issues that you say are prevalent. That is not a matter of your experiences vs their experiences, its a matter demonstraing that the issue is not the source or the tech, its YOU!

And you dont understand how Internet works. I work for a Telecom by the way but I dont need to, to understand this.

Just because your internet service works fine for things like your phone or lap top doesnt mean its working fine to stream 4K video in real time.

I explained this to you when I related that I actually DID have minor issues and it turned out my internet service was an older, lower tier.

You’ve got the wrong Internet package, pal. That’s the problem. If you are willing to pay for the proper Internet package to stream HD video, you wont have any buffering.

“You cant even answer the questions because the answers prove that you’re as stupid as you seem. ”

And you claim I am the one who throws out the insults. Well, you know what they say about those who resort to the putdowns. They have nothing to contribute and refuse to admit it.

“And you dont understand how Internet works.”

I could explain it to you but I’m sure you would misinterpret it like you do nearly everything else. And no one cares who you work for. I figured you worked for yourself because with the attitude you present on line most bosses would fire you instantly.

“Just because your internet service works fine for things like your phone or lap top doesnt mean its working fine to stream 4K video in real time.”

Irrelevant. I never brought it up. I’ve told you before (old story)

Again, my internet works fine. Please move forward from that if you are capable. If not, just admit you aren’t, please.

@ML31 – actually you’ve repeatedly stated that your streaming buffers. So no, your Internet is not fine.

And its very relevant if Netflix produces a high quality image. Your argument is steaming tech cant do that and that it doesnt function very well. Those are lies. Again, the source is high quality, other uses experience high quality. We’re trying to help you – the issue is your Internet service. Check it out.

Can someone else school this fool please?

” So no, your Internet is not fine. ”

I’ve said it works fine for everything except from time to time on streaming to the big TV. Again, context is your friend. Use it.

My argument is that discs are better than streaming. And it is. Also that streaming has issues. And it does. The source doesn’t matter. There are other factors that limit the quality. But then, if you knew something about how the internet works you would know that. In another thread I went over those issues. I have no desire to list them all again.

“Can someone else school this fool please?”

I’m sure you will not recall you saying that those who succumb to insults do so because they can offer up nothing else. So….

Moonves should kill the streaming service and bundle it with an already existing serve. $6.99 for CBS only programs is insane. No one will pay that.

@Cody, I’m with you on that. CBS needs to put their content on Hulu, preferably for free, but at worst as a Hulu add-on for no more than $5 and conform to the Hulu no-commercial plan.

Jeff… They ought to make the show available through as many outlets as possible so as many viewers as possible are able to view it. Limiting it to streaming only is a huge mistake. Make it available on disc so people can watch it without having to worry about image and sound quality. Unless CBS plans on being chinsy on those production values….

@ ML31: I’m pretty sure that CBS will release Discovery on disc at some point. But that will be long after first broadcast. Basically, all they are doing with the show is moving the initial broadcast from TV to streaming.

I think they probably will release it to disc eventually. But the question is, when they do will it be available for rental through one of the other services?

@ML – If CBS feels there is a market for renting, then it will be available for renting. Actually Im not even sure its up to them. It would be up to the rental companies like Netflix, Redbox or whatever. If there is no market, or a limited market they wont.

So rest assured you and several other old ladies can still rent your moving pictures…as long as there is a market. If there is no market its not because Moonves hates you, its because they are delivering it in better, more popular and more efficient ways and if you want to watch it, you can make the effort.


I’m sure the one and only one reason it is a streaming only series is because it’s your favorite format. Les and his CBS cronies don’t care that it’s an inferior format with worse sound and image. They only care that TUP is happy getting it in his personal preferred format. They are not interested in making even their new streaming service available to as many subscribers as possible. As long as TUP is happy and can be full of himself making snarky comments on the internet then they have done their job.

Well done.

You complain about “his personal preferred format” while whining like a spoiled brattish child because it’s not on a format YOU prefer, a format that is now outdated (most laptops no longer come with built-in players for).

We get it, you’re angry because it’s not 1966. You’re a broken record. Another format that is outdated.


That is because you are not understanding what you have read. I’ve never claimed they should not use the streaming format. I’ve just been saying they should make it easier to get and/or make it available on better format sooner or later.

You don’t get anything here. Learn to read then come back and comment.

Thank you Torch.

My preferred service would be terrestrial cable on a channel I already pay for. But if that wasnt the case, I’d consider paying for whatever it is I need to watch it. If that wasnt cost effective or I wasnt that interested, I wouldnt. But I wouldnt try t make it CBS’s fault.

I wanted to watch the Stephen King series 11/22/63 but it didnt air up here. Yes, I could have streamed it. I didnt though, not for any reason other then I never got around to it. I was able to watch two episodes on a plane and decided to buy the series. I didnt think for one second that it was Hulu’s fault that I wasnt able to conveniently watch it. They produced it and it was up to me to seek it out.

Im lucky because Ill see it on Space in Canada. But if I had to sub to CBSAA, I probably would. Id certainly want to anyway. And if it sucked, then I’d cancel my sub.

CBS knows people are likely to subscribe for a show they love and not bother to cancel. Not everyone, but some. And in time the plan would be to provide enough original programming that people want to see that its worth keeping the Sub permanently.

How many people subscribed to HBO for the Sopranos and then canceled until the next season. In time, more and more people stopped doing that.

“No one will pay that.”

That’s just factually incorrect. Many people will. I will.

This is a very different situation though for a lot of reasons.

1. Nerdage said it, the Netflix deal helps A LOT and if the show is popular on Netflix then its going to be a BIG incentive to keep it going for CBS. That licensing deal alone is probably worth keeping DSC around awhile.

2. By the time Enterprise was done it was just franchise fatigue. People were just kind of sick of Star Trek at that point. The fans, the people making it, the network, etc. Yes Enterprise had its creative issues, but my guess is people still would’ve watched it if came out when Voyager did in 1995. By then it was just so much Trek has come and gone and the network knew the ratings wouldn’t get stronger and people seem to ignore the fact Enterprise was easily their most expensive show and yet was losing out to sitcoms. So it made sense. It sucked but people stopped watching. With Discovery its the opposite fans are CRAVING for a new show again. And while the KT films are fine for what they are, a film every 3-4 years (and just OK at that for most) isn’t the same of a weekly show. Even if its just 13 episodes. Most people will easily take those 13 episodes if they get them every year.

3. All Access sounds like its going to be the streaming version of UPN lol. And I don’t mean that in a mean way, I mean its going to have very little on for the first few years in terms of original content and DSC is going to be the big shiny object among everything JUST like how Voyager was when UPN came on. And for people who weren’t around then but believe it or not EVERY show that started with Voyager got cancelled within 2 seasons. Voyager made it to seven. Thats the thing, it was easily the biggest brand on that network because it was the ONLY brand on that network for a long time. AA is CBS so they obviously have tons of brands they can spin off like they did with The Good Wife sequel. But my guess is DSC is going to be the most unique thing on there for awhile that everyone will at least know.

So even if it doesn’t work out to where they want it, its going to be hard to get rid of the show right away. And thats the beauty of Star Trek, its never been easy to get rid of it early lol.

The toxicity in the fan base, which has only been more vocal since the reboots started, makes me concerned for Discovery. These same fans decided to abandon Enterprise in 2001, not because it was franchise fatigue, but because it was a prequel. Discovery is another prequel, and that hatred has come in full force.

As I explained you can’t compare Discovery to Enterprise because people were not craving for another Star Trek show. By the time Enterprise rolled around it was the FOURTH straight show and was literally started the 14th straight season of a Trek show at the time. Yes there WAS fatigue.

How do I know that? Simple because *I* was sick of Star Trek lol. I had watched loyally from TNG to Voyager every week for 14 years. But by the end of Voyager I personally thought a break would be a good idea. Now I did watch Enterprise but yeah I wasn’t very excited for it. I watched it through its entire first season. When second season came on I didn’t watch it. I just didn’t feel the need to. First time in 14 years. So yes there was definitely some fatigue out there.

NOW I will say I agree with you the other problem was it was a prequel. I didn’t personally love the idea of a prequel but I watched at the beginning anyway. So yes I think had a factor as well for sure. So it was a bunch of factors: Fans were getting a bit tired of Trek already; the prequel idea wasn’t a huge selling point; it simply wasn’t very good. So you add all these up I can see why the show had problems. And I feel if there wasn’t a sense of fatigue out there many would’ve kept watching anyway. We know the show got better in the 3rd and especially 4th season but people still didn’t care which tells they were just done at that point.

Of course Discovery may still get abandon, I know that, especially if its just bad. I do worry with the prequel idea as well not being a big pull just reading the comments from various Trek boards but it does seem like people are at least curious about it so hopefully it will go ok. I think the first trailer is going to tell us a lot and really decide who will give it a chance and who won’t.

Tiger… I do agree with the franchise fatigue concept. When Voyage finished its run I felt it would have been good for the property to take a short break from TV for a while. But Paramount was intent on bringing in a new show. I really think Enterprise would have been better received had they took that break. I did watch and enjoy Enterprise. I agree the first two seasons really felt tired. It picked up steam with the season long Xindi arc. And when Manny took over it felt like the show have new life. Sadly the damage had been done by then. Sadly, you can’t un-ring a bell.

I think if they listened to Rick Berman and kept the show off the air for 3 years, gave everyone a break (but still had a TNG film to look forward to in that time) then yes I think Enterprise would’ve had a stronger reception because people would have at least a few years to miss it. And its funny because according to Berman they actually wanted the show to run as soon as DS9 ended and have that show on during Voyager’s final season. He had to convince them to at least have Voyager go off the air before another show came on. Its no way they were going to have a year without Trek on at all.

But as I said I don’t think its fatigue that got the show cancelled alone but I do think its why people had no problem giving up on the show once it they had issues with it. As I said TNG and DS9 had growing pains too those early seasons but the fanbase stuck with them and they both stayed strong through the rest of their runs running 7 seasons. TNG was actually considered to be cancelled in season 2. But by its 4th season its one of the biggest hits on TV.

Enterprise on the other hand went through the exact same process: Bad the first two seasons but then got better from third season on. But people just stopped caring at that point. I mean they did everything possible in seasons 3 and 4 to get people to tune back in. Didn’t work. Its a shame too because I imagine if people came back by fourth season and got a fifth season Enterprise would probably be considered one of the top Trek shows if not THE top Trek show considering the ideas they had had going forward.

I don’t think fans abandoned ENTERPRISE because of franchise fatigue or because it was a prequel. My take is, they left the show because it wasn’t particularly interesting. By season 3 with the season long Xindi story arc, and the fourth season when the show started dealing with the mythology of TOS, the show woke up, but by then it was too late.

But I think people have to acknowledge that those other factors could be part of it just the same. It definitely was for me personally. Even Rick Berman, the guy who made the show told Paramount that they shouldn’t have a Star Trek show on for a few years after Voyager. He was even concerned there was simply fatigue setting in.

And to be fair it was setting in BEFORE Enterprise came on the air but people were already invested in Voyager. The mistake was to throw another show on so quickly.

But yes I agree fatigue was not the MAIN reason why it failed, just part of it. I think a lot of people simply didn’t like the show but as said because they had already seen so much of Trek by that point there was no loyalty to stick with it.

Remember TNG was considered AWFUL its first two seasons and people definitely gave up on it early on but yet when it got better the ratings got much better because people wanted a new star Trek show and responded in kind. DS9 ALSO was considered bad in its early seasons (although not as bad as TNG) and then when it got better in its third season people responded and while ratings didn’t raise a lot higher they stabilized and the show easily not only got 7 seasons but Paramount increased its budget from third season on because the ratings were strong enough.

Now look at Enterprise. It too had a bad first two seasons like those other shows but then got better in 3rd and 4th season as you said. And yet the ratings just KEPT falling. This is the first time a Trek show improved and the ratings still fell like a rock. So why didn’t it get that bounce by fans like those other shows did?

Because people just stopped CARING at that point. Even after they heard the show improved most still couldn’t be bothered to tune in again unlike TNG and DS9. Thats a fanbase that is no longer was as active anymore. Most were just ready to move on. The show didn’t excite them so if you remove the fact it simply got better but people still bailed on it what other reasons are there? Yeah it was fatigue. More so because it was the first Star Trek since TNG early run that didn’t need to compete with another Star Trek show at the same time like DS9 and Voyager did. It was literally the only Trek show on the air and fans still couldn’t be bothered.

I concur. I watched all of Star Trek up to the first half of Enterprise season 2, and I would have continued watching any Star Trek they put on TV, provided it was good. I bailed on Ent for 1.5 seasons and only caught up on it as season 4 showed they were going in the right direction for once with better material and a true prequel focus. Fatigue is just a partial excuse for the creators running out of steam, the network not allowing out-of-the-box ideas, and too much adherence to the Star Trek formula (see Voyager and Enterprise as clones of TNG, same act structure, mostly A and B and sometimes C plots, the same use of technology/technobable, simply more starship crews doing the same exploration as in TNG). Voyager and Enterprise each had their own unique problems that contributed to declining viewership as well (lack of continuity, direction, and consistency of character for Voyager; failure to live up to a true, innovative prequel premise and too much reliance on stale story points), but if the serieses had been as good as TNG or DS9, there wouldn’t have been as much falloff. If Ent had been renewed for season 5, I would have relished those episodes as Ent was getting good and making good Star Trek by season 4.

One can only hope that the naysayers put a phaser to their temple.

Tup? That’s you, isn’t it!

There’s no such thing as “franchise fatigue”. Trek productions are not living things that can experience such, as it is a mere artifice. “Franchise fatigue” is just an CYA excuse invented by the people in charge to explain away their own inability to keep the creativity flowing by either finding new wells to tap within themselves, or to be honest with themselves that their energetic enthusiasm for it had waned, and it was time to voluntarily turn it over to a new administration to oversee – a rather uniquely American thing that the captains of its entertainment and other industries often fail to grasp.

American History teaches, that King George was absolutely certain he would ultimately prevail because he was certain no President would voluntarily give up power, once he had it, and was absolutely flabbergasted when George Washington did precisely that.

Star Trek had a 18 YEAR run, in some of those years had 50 episodes produced a year and a film every 2-3 years. Of course people can get sick of it in time. How many other franchises ran for 18 years straight with multiple shows and films? Do people think MCU is going to be as popular now on year 18 as it is now in year 9? People now is saying there is comic book fatigue happening (although I personally don’t believe it) but yeah when you look around at all the shows and films out you can probably understand why people feel that way.

And the one excuse I kept hearing that in this period there was simply too MUCH Star Trek on to the point people simply got tired of following it all.

Again though I’m not saying thats why Enterprise was cancelled. I made that clear over and over. The point is that when the show didn’t live up to expectations people gave up on it early. But as I ALSO said, and reiterated here, when it got better the fanbase never returned fully which tells you there was fatigue because no matter how loud people kept saying season 4 was great it never got enough back who dropped out after first season.

The fact that Enterprise in season 4 actually DID what you said the show needed to do in the first place and that was turn it over to a new show runner who brought in a new creative life into it and told the kinds of stories fans wanted in the first place and yet still fell kind of said it all.

But if Enterprise came on around Voyagers time with the exact same seasons I’m more than sure more people would’ve stuck with it, especially it it improved which it actually did.

It is more the viewing public that suffered from franchise fatigue than the show producers. It seems the viewers got a little tired of Trek. Enterprise got better after the first two seasons but the viewing public just didn’t seem to care at that point.

BTW… It was when General Washington gave up power and left the Continental Army for private life that floored not only King George but the rest of the world. No commander has ever walked away from the ability to rule after deposing of the existing regime.

Oh thats what he meant, the creators were fatigued. Yeah I think people are just talking about the viewers themselves. And i don’t think the creators said they were running out of ideas or ‘tired’ of it. In fact I think they loved the idea of starting in a whole new century at the beginning of where Trek started and got a new creative spurt over going a different direction than before. But I think what kind of hindered them is a lot of ideas they wanted to do the studio was against at the beginning while being forced to do things like the TCW.

But as far as viewers I kept reading over and over again online from people who said “Star Trek needs to take a break”. This was repeated constantly. And of course when Enterprise was finally cancelled people were making assumptions we wouldn’t see it again for another decade and give it a lot of time to be missed when not a year later they announced the Abrams reboot film lol. Well it took that long to get another show at least.

ML31 & Tiger2

Viewers are not going to be fatigued if those creating Trek tales are truly being innovative and interesting. The only reason viewers experience fatigue is because those in charge are falling back on formulaic storytelling where those viewers have discerned the rules and are bored by the predictability of knowing exactly how the stories are going to unfold.

Whether they wanted to admit it to themselves or not, by ENTERPRISE, Berman and Braga were phoning it in as well — THAT’s what the fan’s were “fatigued” with, NOT “Star Trek”.

The BB Gun’s fatigue was exemplified by the thought processes that produced the travesty that was its epitome, ENTERPRISE’s final episode. That thinking, about what they were producing, is what the viewers were tired of seeing and NOT the idea of STAR TREK itself.

The longevity of other series, such as DOCTOR WHO, demonstrates that a “franchise” need not experience this type of fatigue, that you and others erroneously believe is a forgone conclusion in and of itself, across the decades.

Yeah… You are addressing things I already brought up in another post. See that one for my response….


Re:…already brought up in another post

I don’t believe so, because you keep missing my point that, despite the fact Berman and Braga introduced new blood with new ideas, that it was Berman and Braga, who were still ultimately calling the shots, and their micro managing beliefs and ffdicta that the viewers were fatigued with.

@Disinvited – I agree. I’ve said many times I thought Enterprise was their best idea in a long time and could have rejuvenated the franchise. But it was such tired and uninspired writing.

And the fact they thought story arcs was this new trend in TV at the time, years after DS9 had done it, just showed how much of a bubble they lived in.

Not neccisarily. Because if CBSAA doesnt move the needle based on Star Trek, CBS is still making a profit based on the Netflix deal. If Discovery flops for CBS, and Netflix still wants it, there’s your financing model for the next series.

But the fact Netflix is so in love with Trek, and obviously based on their own subscriber numbers, it tells CBS to be patient.

I’d have to assume the audience for The Good Wife skewed older and more female and they still financed the spinoff. They valued that audience. And again, the audience wasnt great enough to sell it on the CBS Network but good enough that a different model works.

People who want Trek on CBS dont want Trek because the viewership number would have to be huge AND consistent to last. Discovery being on All Access, especially with the Netflix deal is the best chance Star Trek has to last long term on television.

That has been a huge concern. That this series will not raise CBSAA to even close Netflix levels. And when if fails, CBS will blame Trek. Not the platform they chose to present it. It really is a lose lose proposition for fans.

So my solution before it begins to air is email or send letters to Les Moonves and tell him that Discovery isn’t worth the big investment from CBS.

Actually not. I would urge him to push the availability to disc. I would be far more ready to pay to rent a set of discs than I would pay for a streaming service. He can keep his lame streaming. Just make the series available for blu ray rental. That’s all I ask.

@ML31 Moonves said he expects Star Trek to increase CBSAA subs to 4 million. Where do you get the stupid idea they want it to be Netflix? They dont. Because they arent stupid.

Just because you’re one of the few remaining people that like to rent movies on Disc, dont whine and moan that you have to watch Star Trek on a streaming service. You dont get Orange is the New Black on Disc the day its released on Netflix do you? So why should you get Discovery on disc the same day?

If you want it on disc, wait for it to be on disc.

Unless you’re foolishly suggesting CBS should adopt a model where they ONLY make Discovery available via rental disc…which is a dying business and utterly ludicrous to suggest.

Maybe you should sent the Board of Directors your resume since you’re so smart.

TUP… You jumped to some pretty crazy conclusions or theories from my post. I never said they wanted to be Netflix. All I asked for was to release the show on disc so fan can enjoy it on a higher quality and more reliable format. Even if they release the disc AFTER the entire series airs, that would be fine. It would be nice to announce it is coming. BTW… Netflix used to release House of Cards on disc the same day it was out for streaming. Only the last season was delayed a couple of months.

Please pay closer attention the what is actually written next time you respond to a post.

Thank you.

And what makes you think it wont be released on Disc? I like Game of Thrones but I dont whine that the day Episode 1 of the new season airs on HBO that I dont get a copy sent to me via disk of the whole season. That’s ridiculous.

Wait til the season is over and they announce a DVD release date. Are you going to whine for a year about this?

Game of Thrones becomes available about 10 months after it airs. And I can rent it. I have no idea what CBS plans to do with STD. Maybe it will be on disc after three years? I don’t know. It probably will be EVENTUALLY. But I want to know if it will be available on a rental platform or not. CBS is not saying anything about that. Netflix has a rental arm and so I’m fairly sure eventually their products will find their way there. CBSAA has no such distribution. Hence the question.

Once again, this was explained in multiple posts yet you still see fit to complain….

CBS releases series to Disc all the time. Maybe if you post the same whine here every day for a year Moonves will personally call you and tell you. Just relax. I bet you the series ends up on Disc assuming it lasts at least one season.

So relax. And if it doesnt, its not because CBS is trying to screw with you, it will be because they dont see a market for it. Do you think there is a market for DVD sales of Discovery? If so, its likely going to be on Disc.

Sorry the question bothers you so much you have to make a snarky comment each time it comes up. Some people just demand a higher quality product than you do.
CBS puts new seasons of shows out all the time. But those are all shows on their parent network that could be watched at any time. Not a show they are holding onto in an attempt to drive up subscribers to an otherwise worthless streaming service. It may be available to buy 10 months after it “airs” on AA. But will it be available to rent on Netflix by then? Once again, you are not understanding the situation at all.

And for the record… I’m fairly sure there will be a ZERO market for the DVD’s. It’s like releasing albums only on cassettes when CD’s are the common listening platform. So I’m very much doubting they will release DVD’s at all. Is there anyone who still gets DVD’s?


Re: …doubting they will release DVD’s at all

Odd doubt to have, since not more than 15 minutes prior to posting that you were posting this:

on a thread confirming that they do, indeed, still release Trek DVDs.

That is true… And to be honest I am stunned they are even releasing a DVD set of Voyager and said as much in the comment thread. So yes, you made a good point. However, Voyager wasn’t shot in HD but in SD. To be released on blu would require an expensive upgrade. STD is being shot today. Might even be available in 4K. Pretty sure they won’t downgrade to DVD if they do release the discs for sale or rental.


Re: Voyager wasn’t shot in HD

It was shot on film which has plenty enough HD for 1080i broadcasts.

Yes, you wait 10 months to rent GoT. So why are you whining about Discovery? “Rent” it when it comes out on Disc. And also, rent? hahahahahahahahaha

I will do that if I have to. It is a drag waiting for GOT to come out but better than paying HBO’s outrageous monthly fee. But the plus is the discs have a ton of really good extras on them I wouldn’t get if I paid for HBO to begin with. The thing is, there is no guarantee CBS will even make the discs available services like Netflix after it airs. Therein lies the problem

Not sure what you find funny about the word “rent”. But whatever. Have some more laughs… I think you need it.

Rent rent rent rent rent.

Why do you have a problem paying HBO’s fee? You claim money isnt the issue, just the technology. So one would reason you’d gladly pay for HBO since its on a terrestrial channel. Or you are not being honest. Which is more likely?

You know what, I started writing out an explanation but I realized I would just be wasting my time. You haven’t understood the concept that different things have different worth to individuals. Why would you understand that concept now?

So CBSAA is not worth it to you. great. You could have said that. You could have come here and posted “Receiving CBSAA is not worth it to me” and then went away forever. And saved everyone the pain and suffering of reading your nonsense.

“So CBSAA is not worth it to you. great. ”

Wow… You MUST be playing. No one could make the mistakes you are making. That is not what I said. Again… it’s what you do.

When did Moonves say that success is only measured by matching Netflix?

It’s hard to tell in these threads… Was that meant for me? Normally I would think not as it does not address anything I ever touched on but it is you so….

@ML – it was. You commented that CBSAA will not rise to Netflix levels. IT was an odd remark and you followed it by saying it would fail and CBS would blame Trek. Since you didnt explain yourself well, one can assume the two sentences are connected. ie. CBSAA will not be as successful as Netflix, therefore it will be considered a failure.

Hence my question to you as to when CBS ever said they needed to be as successful as Netflix? Especially considering they gave specific sub numbers they hoped for that are not Netflix levels at all.

Moonves says “we want 4 million subs” and you say “if they dont reach Netflix levels it will be a failure”.

You’re flat wrong. And making things up.

You cant win a debate with me where logic is a tool. Im far too logical for you. You’re all over the place and cant keep your issues straight. I advise to give up and consider this to be a lesson in preparedness. ie. if you’re going to whine, at least know you’re whining about the right thing.

Wow… That is a stretch. The comments you speak of were not even in the above string. In fact the part about CBSAA not reaching Netflix like success was a VERY long time ago not even in this thread I think. I will cop to the comments but while they do loosely share a theme they are not in response to the same thing and it is pretty obvious they don’t. On occasion I have not made myself clear and am willing to rephrase to help. That accusation coming from you, however, holds no weight. It has become rather clear that there is little anyone can do to make themselves clear to you.

You really reached into the wayback machine for that comment. No wonder it was so confusing.

Unlike you I need better context to make a coherent response. So that’s as much as I can comment on it.

“You’re flat wrong. And making things up.”

No no, sir. That is your expertise. I’ve showed you time and time again where you have made things up.

“You cant win a debate with me where logic is a tool.”

This portion of the sentence I can agree with. Because I have been using logic and reason and you flat out ignore all of it.

Nice use of the tactic of accusing the other person of your own transgressions… You’re becoming a master at it.

No it was stated by you 4 posts above.


That has been a huge concern. That this series will not raise CBSAA to even close Netflix levels. And when if fails, CBS will blame Trek. Not the platform they chose to present it. It really is a lose lose proposition for fans.
March 8, 2017 8:22 am

***So again, what is your point? You’re suggesting CBSAA is a failure if it doesnt reach Netflix levels. Irrelevant and incorrect. Moonves said they want 4 million subs.

Thanks for actually pointing out a post. That is very unlike you. Of course, 4 posts above is you saying “When did Moonves say that success is only measured by matching Netflix?”. But I eventually found the post in question.

Again… Context is your point… So what is yours?

Oops… I mean context is your friend so what’s your point?

@ML – let’s try and keep new discussion civil and on point. I imagine the mods wont have an issue with that.

The point is, you implied that All Access would fail because it would not rise to the levels of Netflix so why bother. That’s what I gathered from your posts. If that is not what you meant, please clarify.

To that point, Moonves stated he wants 4 million subs and indicated they have experienced satisfactory growth based on the Good Fight. For comparison sake, HBO Now has 2 million subs.

HBO is a bit different in that it had a head start and leveraged users of HBO Go which was a streaming version of its terrestrial channel which required a regular HBO subscription whereas HBO Now is the same as HBO Go but separate from the TV – ie. no TV sub, its completely Over The Top. I dont believe HBO features any exclusive streaming services either.

So what CBS is doing is smart – it knows we are headed towards an Over The Top landscape in Television. At the very least, it knows people will want choice. The motive of HBO Now is really to catch those people who love HBO but want to cut cable and are at a point where they wont keep cable JUST for HBO so now they can cut cable and still watch HBO.

CBS could use All Access in a similar way but for reasons you and and others have stated, its very slow growth. They want to push All Access to the fore of streaming services. And they seem to be targeting genres, demos etc with specific niches that they feel would pay for the service to get that “one” show they cant miss.

In time, they stop being the service that gets subs for the “one” show they cant miss and begin attracting general users due to the overall content.

Much like HBO could measure its sub increases and decreases based on when The Sopranos would launch a new season and in time, they had enough new content spread out over a year that people stopped cancelling. Churn is the biggest problem and CBS is leveraging content with built in fan bases to try and cut down on it.

So to the original point, All Access wont be measured against Netflix in terms of success and failure.

The Good Wife still averaged over 10 million viewers per episode in its final season. If they can leverage that into subs for the Good Fight, they are laughing.

Voyager actually premiered with 21 million viewers which is unbelievable and limped to a conclusion with around 3 million per episode in its final season.

Enterprise debuted with 12 million viewers (averaged almost 6 million that first season) and ended with under 3 million.

The fact they are also premiering Discovery on the CBS Network should generate a great debut rating.

Moonves wanting 4 million subs shows a really patient and measured position in my opinion. Because if Good Fight gets 2 million and Discovery gets 2 million, he’s got his 4 million without any other shows drawing AND those numbers would be very lower viewership for both shows historically.

Ofcourse it takes time for people to adopt a new delivery method so all things being equal, “ratings” would be less for OTT than broadcast. But as fans we should be excited because it meant we dont have to nervously watch the Neilson ratings…they simply dont matter under this model.

I love how people talk about Enterprise like it was a disaster, saying things like it was “doomed”– it ran for 4 seasons, it’s not like it was a 1-2 season, short-lived show.

Can’t come quick enough!

You know, it’s great that Star Trek is always trailblazing for CBS/Paramount: TOS was a trailblazer which showed how a show, already done, dusted and paid for, could make cash hand over fist in syndication. It created the model other shows would follow for years. TNG took this to the next level in 1987: avoiding the “big three” networks and inventing the “hit first-run show in syndication” model which gave the writers more flexibility, and blazed the trail for genre shows for decades going forward. It also blazed the trail for UPN, which was the exclusive quasi-network experiment that ENT debuted on, and there were markets in the US that just never carried it. Similar to “Star Trek Phase II” as a proprietary new network anchor show in concept, ENT arguably failed not only because of its tiredy formula, but because of lack of distribution. I see “Discovery” on “All Access” as a risk as big as all of these, and when I read Les Moonves corporate schlock speech here, it makes me worry even more that they can’t see the forest for the trees, and could mess it up due to principle. Trekkers want the show, and may actually not give a crap about the channel, and will wait for the discs or find it on the web. Thank goodness Netflix is a known quantity almost everywhere, and will be carrying it in many markets. “All Access” competes with it in the US, and that puts the lucrative home market at high risk. It could fail, and take the show with it.

Sure thats a risk but my guess is they are betting most Trek fans will want to see it right away instead of waiting six months to watch on a disck (and who buys discs these days???? I watch all my Trek on Netflix and Amazon now….which is what gave them the idea in the first place). But yes if too many Trek fans say screw the channel and don’t pay it might be trouble long term. Short term though as I pointed out in other places its doubtful. And I think people have to probably consider that if CBS decides to drop then part of this Netflix deal is they have the option to pick it up. My guess is they are secretly hoping it fails on AA lol. And can run it themselves, assuming its a bigger hit there of course.

But I love Star Treks weird history of blazing new trails for platform and mediums. TOS was one of the first shows into the new syndication market and hit it big. Then TNG one upped it by actually running new content which was practically unheard of then and then a few years later multiple studios was going that direction thanks to TNG. Then Voyager being created as the flagship of a new network and now Discovery being the new flagship of a streaming site. Its actually funny how Trek has reflected our many viewing habits.

TOS started with the traditional ‘big 3’ networks which basically all there was in the 60s. Then it and TNG expanded the idea of watching shows in syndication through the 70s and 80s followed by Voyager at least trying to expand beyond the big three (or four with FOX). That never really took off although ironically CBS looks like it finally found a strong niche with the CW (who the President of that network said they wanted Star Trek before the AA deal) and now the next frontier: Streaming. Yeah been around a few years now but with CBS the first official network to make separate shows while having a network I suspect in the next five years a lot of them will be doing the same if this is successful enough.

Who knows, in another 20 years we will have a new Trek show breaking the barrier of some new media platform none of us see coming yet. But Star Trek will never truly die.

I buy disck.

I buy discs as well. Far more reliable than streaming. Where content comes and goes depending on licensing deals. This way, I know I will always be able to watch my content.
I subscribe to Netflix for discs too. In addition to the chaos of licensing material, Netflix’s disc library is still about 3 times the size of their streaming library. And it’s immune from the transitive nature of streaming rights issues as well.

So buy it on disc when it comes out. What’s the problem?

And by the way, ML31, Netflix Streaming service is VASTLY more popular than their rental business. So dont think for a second that disc is the key to Netflix’ business. It’s not. Their rental business loses tons of subs all the time as people transition away from renting movies.

First, I need to know if it will even be available on disc. CBS has never announced anything of the sort. Next, I don’t want to buy it unless it is worth watching more than once. So I need to see if first. That means, renting the discs.

And again, I made no comment regarding how popular one is over the other. Again, you need to pay attention to what you are responding to. All I have said is one is of vastly superior quality to the other and the format of superior quality is immune to the transitory nature of rights issues. It’s really not that difficult a concept. I will make the change to streaming when that format becomes more stable regarding content AND the format becomes at least as high a quality as the discs are.

Wrong ML31 – you said that Netflix’s DVD library is larger than their streaming library while whining about not being able to rent Discovery on Disc, implying that the market for rental is larger than the streaming one. Which it isnt. Not even close.

In fact, the rental market is shrinking fast. So prepare yourself for that. If you wont watch a program until you can rent it on DVD, then you’re going to miss out on a lot.

Also, Getting a DVD is not vastly superior to streaming a high quality OTT service. It simply isnt. You’re just making stuff up. If a Netflix DVD is vastly superior to the same program streaming on Netflix that’s your problem, not Netflix’s since they stream in as much as 4K right now.

Why dont you end your rental sub like most other people. Then you can afford CBSAA. And you can still watch movies and shows on Netflix. Problem solved.

But stop with the complaining that disc is vastly superior to streaming when its not true. its moot anyway since Discovery is being delivered OTT not via Disc on Day One.

Since every Star Trek series and film is sold on disc, one can assume Discovery will also be available on Disc. But not when it debuts. That would be highly unusual and rather absurd.

Stop arguing about nonsense. Get a better internet connection, better TV, accept what you have or dont watch it. No one is forcing you to and if you dont subscribe to CBSAA, it wont make a bit of difference.

Plus, if I recall you dont even pay Netflix. You steal your friend’s service. So you’re not really a customer anyway. Maybe someone you know will record Discovery on their phone or computer and send you the video so you can decide if its worth paying for. If its not, you can always steal it right?


No… Saying the disc library is larger and more solid than their streaming library is just that. I know they have more streaming subscribers than rentals. But the content totals are still factual. What you are implying is not what I was saying in the least. It is just your way of whining about something you are showing more and more that you do not understand.

I don’t get DVD’s. I get blu rays. The quality is way better. So please stop confusing DVD with blu ray. Nobody even makes DVD’s anymore. If I were waiting for stuff to come out on DVD I will indeed be waiting forever. Get with the times.

I keep the rental going because unlike you I want a good quality image, sound, controls that work right and disc extras. I know you don’t care about any of that but some still do.

My current TV is less than 2 years old. I know things become somewhat obsolete moments after you buy them but this was top of the line at that time. I am to this day very happy with my purchase. It has quite the list of bells and whistles. Again, you are speaking about things you have no idea about. The board will thank you to stop.

You also recall wrong. I do indeed pay for netflix. It’s where I get my blu rays from. If I really want to watch some low quality streaming I can use my friend’s account. I rarely do. These days I use it mainly to see if the quality has improved. I waited over a year to see Daredevil. Netflix finally put it on disc. I’m glad I waited. Would not have wanted to see it on low quality streaming.

And I’m sorry you don’t have as good of friends as I seem to. But that’s no reason to behave like the a cliche internet troll and accuse people of lying and ripping on people who do not like what you like.

@ML31 – you’re playing semantics over DVD/Blu Ray because you’re either a troll, being obtuse or too stupid to realise it.

You rent discs off your friends subs. And you tell me to get with the times? Ha! You’re a joke.

And no the quality is not way better. If it is, talk to your internet provider. I find it hard to believe you’re so upset about the minor differences between Blu Ray at 1080P and Netflix streaming at 1080P but completely baffled by how to watch Discovery.

Grow up. Read a book. Or use google.

You really think there is no difference between blu rays and DVD’s? That certainly explains your thinking that streaming is of higher quality, though. I know you will just blow this off but blu rays are high definition 1080p. DVD’s can reach 720 at best. It is indeed a noticeable difference. Apparently not by you. I’m guessing you can’t tell if a 4X3 image is being stretched into a 16X9 one. Many can’t.

I’ve told you over and over that I do not rent discs off a friends subscription. Yet you continue to be confused. It’s really not difficult.

The quality from disc is still way better than streaming. It is also more reliable. Basic functions like subtitles and rewind work in a snap with discs. Not so much with streaming. But then you aren’t one to let the facts get in the way of your myths. I am baffled only in that CBS has limited even their streaming availability. Thus far it seems the only way to get it is to watch exclusively on puny mobile devices and laptops or to purchase an otherwise worthless and overly expensive add on to your TV. One can only hope that CBS will fix this oversight.

I would suggest you take your own advise but based on your complete inability to comprehend the written word we both know it would be a complete waste of effort.

@ML31 – you might think providing a lesson on the difference between DVD and Blu Ray is a good way to show off your intelligence. But since my statement about semantics went over your head, it only served to expose your lack of same.

Again, talk to your internet provider if your Netflix steam (or your friends) is so bad. Because mine is perfect. So its not the stream, its not the technology. Its you.

Tup… No, I think providing a lesson on the difference between DVD and blu ray is very necessary as you have consistently referred to the as the same thig when they most certainly are not.

Your semantics comment was not unnoticed. It was indeed commented on because you needed to understand the semantics of DVD vs blue ray. It also seemed necessary as you have commented on how completely oblivious you have been to the superiority of blu ray vs streaming. You might think you are sounding superior by using a multi-syllable word but you wield it almost like a five year old who found his fathers revolver.

Your assessment that your video stream is good carries no weight. Your lack of ability to understand the difference in DVD vs blu ray shows you probably don’t realize how poor it really is.

@ML – for the sake of everyone else here, let’s review and nip this in the bud.

You’re issues:

“Streaming technology isnt good enough” – I’d suspect most people here can tell you you’re wrong. Netflix streams in 4K. Many people watch Netflix that way. Many people do not seem to experience your issue of repeated buffering and poor quality. Experience will tell us that if your signal has that issue consistently, its likely an issue with your wiring or internet connection. But its not the SOURCE because so many others do not experience this issue.

“All Access quality probably wont be good enough” – MattR helpfully explained to you that he watched it on his 65″ TV with no issues and stated the quality was “fine”. You didn’t ask him to expand on what his definition was “fine” was, which is odd since this seemed to be such an important aspect to you.

“I cant watch CBSAA on my TV” – several people told you exactly how you can watch it on your TV from using a SmartTV that supports CBSAA or by plugging your laptop into your TV. You said when you plug your laptop into your TV, you cant figure out how to make the picture big. That is not CBS’ problem, that is your problem.

“I could watch CBSAA on my TV but I dont want to pay for a device to allow it” – Again, many people have pointed out inexpensive options to make this a reality. If the $30-$40 is too much for you, that is understandable but unfortunately is the reality of the situation for many people who cannot afford large Smart TV’s, Blu Ray Players and expensive monthly cable bills.

“CBS is unscrupulous for false advertising the cost of their service because they dont include the cost of a device to stream the service” – Cable doesnt include the cost of buying a TV, Netflix doesnt include the cost of an internet connection. They are content providers, not peripheral sellers.

“I prefer to rent shows on disc and Discovery isnt going to be available” – You dont know that. Common sense tells us otherwise since every Trek series has been available on home media. You further complain that no one is telling you when and how you can rent it. It’s March. The series doesnt even launch until fall and discs would be sometime next year. Its far too early to say. But if CBS does not make their discs available to RENT, its not a personal slight against you, its because they dont feel it makes sense within the context of their business. Maybe some people wish shows and films were still released on Betamax but time marches on.

“I wont buy a disc of a show I havent seen and I wont watch it on All Access so if I cant rent the disc then I cant watch Discovery and that means CBS doesnt care about its fans” – If all those things end up being true, it means you made several choices along the way to not watch Discovery. CBS cant make you watch. They can only make the program available and you choose whether its worth your time, money or effort to view it.

Have we addressed all your concerns? If not, please post them and the smart folks here will try to help you. Barring that (and if your concerns relate to CBS’ business strategy or release dates/methods, you should contact CBS and ask them. You will likely receive a reply that reads something like “We dont have that information at this time but CBS is committed to delivering a great series to fans and will release more information as it becomes available” which is a wholly reasonable reply to you.

You’re welcome,


“I’d suspect most people here can tell you you’re wrong (streaming being inferior to disc). ”

Doesn’t matter. I’ve seen it personally. Discs are still much better and more reliable than streaming.

““All Access quality probably wont be good enough” ”

I never said that. You did.

““I cant watch CBSAA on my TV” – several people told you exactly how you can watch it on your TV from using a SmartTV that supports CBSAA or by plugging your laptop into your TV. You said when you plug your laptop into your TV, you cant figure out how to make the picture big. That is not CBS’ problem, that is your problem.”

Context is your friend. I can’t watch it on my TV without buying an otherwise worthless and expensive add on. Further, I never blamed CBS for the lack of being able to get my laptop image to work well on the big TV. I did blame them for creating a format that required potential customers to jump through so very many hoops.

” Again, many people have pointed out inexpensive options to make this a reality.”

And yet when I looked them up on line none of them were that cheap. Again, this was addressed already.

“Cable doesnt include the cost of buying a TV, Netflix doesnt include the cost of an internet connection. They are content providers, not peripheral sellers.”

No because that is common knowledge that you know you NEED it. CBS is making it sound like all you need is a modern TV and an internet connection when the fact is that’s not true. They don’t tell you this until you dig in to find out. That is being sneaky. Just like intro rates are sneaky and underhanded. But not illegal.

““I prefer to rent shows on disc and Discovery isnt going to be available”

I never claimed that so your response here is wasted time and space.

““I wont buy a disc of a show I havent seen and I wont watch it on All Access so if I cant rent the disc then I cant watch Discovery and that means CBS doesnt care about its fans””

The only part of that quite that can be attributed to me is I won’t buy a disc of a show I haven’t seen. The rest is your own made up fabrication. Making your comments wasted time and space again.

“Have we addressed all your concerns?”

No. You have not.

“If not, please post them and the smart folks here will try to help you.”

I have posted them and I’m still waiting.

Are you clear yet? If not please tell me what you fail to understand and I will attempt to rephrase the responses into a form you can better understand.

Again, the “add on” device is not expensive (within the context of purchasing add ons to view other content) and is not worthless if, in fact, it allows you to view CBSAA which is what you want to accomplish. That’s the opposite of worthless.

You’re a fool.

CBS is NOT “making it seem like all you need is a modern TV and Internet connection”. Show me where they say that? They MIGHT take for granted that most people are not raging friggen morons and know you need things like an internet connection, a device to access streaming services, a television etc. You also need power to run your electronic devices. Did you know that? Hopefully CBS begins adding a disclaimer “Must have POWER to OPERATE TV”

I realise you’re just being difficult and have dug in to try and “win”. And everyone else has given up correcting and educating you. And to them I say Im sorry for replying because it elicits a reply from you and everyone is so very tired of your garbage.

Please go away.

“Again, the “add on” device is not expensive”

Wash rinse repeat. I’ve answered that issue already.

“and is not worthless”

More trouble on your end. I said OTHERWISE worthless. Do you ever get tired of being wrong?

“You’re a fool.”

Personal attacks. The tool of the person who has no logic and reason on their side. And you claim I’m the one how makes insults. Shame on you.

” Show me where they say that? ”

Sure. As soon as you show me where I said I blamed Netflix for the shortcomings in streaming tech. Along with dozens of other falsely attributed comments.

” Hopefully CBS begins adding a disclaimer “Must have POWER to OPERATE TV””

Right. Because everyone knows that turning on the TV is the same as needing to add an extra part for an extra fee to make something work is the same thing.

” And to them I say Im sorry for replying because it elicits a reply from you and everyone is so very tired of your garbage.”

That is called “transference”. Look it up.

I know what you mean. I have Neflix via Roku, and mail service. I love Sarah Connor Chronicles, watched it on the Roku box. It disappeared one (of 800 shows I saved to my list over the years, about 600 have disappeared. Anyway, i bought the series on Disc so I indulge my annual Sarah Connor Marathon. Stupid decision to cancel the show BTW, but I’m glad we got what we got.

Sure but the reality is DVD sales have been falling the last decade. Its not the hot market it was 20 years ago and thats obviously thanks to streaming sites and even TV networks with their own set up to watch their shows anytime they want.

I’ll give you a perfect example. Last year I finally decided to give Game of Thrones a watch after hearing for years what an extremely good show it was. So I was all ready to go and buy the first season of the show and give it a chance. If I hated it well I lost money but was willing to risk it. And then I remembered I have freaking HBO which meant I have HBO GO. I had never been on HBO GO the entire time I had the service. I sign up and every freaking episode of GOT through 6 seasons is there for me for free….along with every HBO show ever made. I mean that no longer gave me a single incentive to go out and buy expensive DVDs I knew I would watch once. And if I liked the 1st season naturally I would buy the rest but in once instance I saved myself over $100. And then on top of that because it was free online I was able to watch the show anywhere I wanted. I got addicted quick lol so I was watching it on my phone at work, watching it at Disneyland in the line, wherever I could. DVDs you have to physically sit down at home to watch them. Or at least have a laptop handy. No such issues with streaming.

This is why the DVD/Blu Ray market is collapsing, especially for TV shows. I know people still buy them but they are becoming harder to justify it when you have so many options. And in some cases better options.

Tiger, I’m sure DVD sales have dropped to next to nothing. Don’t think anything new comes out on DVD anymore. Blu ray and 4K discs are the new thing.

Great that you got the online version of HBO with your subscription. For me, there just isn’t enough content on HBO to justify me spending the money on it. Any show they get has thus far found their way to Netflix. With a little patience I can see whatever HBO show I want. I have Westworld in my cue waiting for it’s disc release as we speak.
I don’t know why you would even consider buying a season you have never seen. Sounds like way too big a gamble for me. I would want to watch if before buying. I get the seasons about 9-10 months after and have loved every minute. The discs have TONS of extras that really really help with the story and with some fun behind the scenes stuff. The only drag is with the show gaining more and more in popularity it has become more and more difficult to avoid spoilers.

Glad you are enjoying watching that stuff on your puny phone and other mobile devices. I just can’t stand watching TV like that. Bad sound and tiny picture just makes it not enjoyable. If I were in line at Disneyland I would be enjoying the company of my companions and soaking in the environment around me. Not wasting my time staring at a tiny screen. I’d wait to watch on my nice big TV with the fantastic picture and amazing sound. But different strokes for different folks.

For the record, it is not hard to justify buying or renting the discs at all. Especially when one considers the transitory nature of rights and such. The story here on the Voyager series gets into that as well. What is available for streaming one week may be gone the next. The discs seem to be immune to such nonsense.

Well I meant ANY discs, including Blu Ray. DVD is just shorter to write lol.

I was only going to buy it because everyone kept saying how great it was. What I’m saying I was thinking about buying it as a collection. I do own SOME Blu Rays but very very few now because so much is just online and in all honesty I’m in front of a computer more than I am on a TV these days so its just convenience. As for GOT yeah if I didn’t have HBO I would probably considered getting the disc for the extras and stuff but I only watch that stuff once and never again. And now most of that stuff finds it way on Youtube.

And sure I still watch stuff on TV but the beauty of streaming is I can watch it ANYWHERE including TV. I have a Playstation which connects all the big apps to my TV. I watch Netflix, Amazon, Hulu, HBO, etc. Its all built in. But then the beauty is I can take it with me anywhere. I can’t with discs.

But as for your point about the temporary content of streaming I agree and why I UNDERSTAND why AA is being made in the first place. I have said over and over again sites like Netflix while great has the problem of having a library of mostly 3rd party properties and those can go at any time. And as more HBO Go, Hulu, etc comes around it will be harder for Netflix and others to retain these shows and films. Thats why people are thinking WAY too short term on AA. Yes it sucks NOW but in 10 years trust me it will probably be one of the biggest sites around because they have the catalog for it. The only issue is they don’t have any original content but as that changes people will just gravitate towards it. And you know it will always be there because its THEIRS! Thats why Netflix is now making 20 shows a year now because they know in the long term they will need their original content for people to rely on.

But don’t get me wrong, I’m not against DVDs but yeah it IS a dying fad as people just gravitate to more streaming. Technology gets better by the year. Media companies see how much cheaper it is to have a digital version you can buy online, etc instead of producing Blu Rays, getting shelf space, etc. I dont think DVDs are going anywhere soon but I would be shocked if they were around in the next 20 years. I think everything is shifting online. You’ll probably be able to buy them, but it will be like buying CDs is now….rare lol. Think about it, how many people today have physical music? Thats where movies and TV will be heading in time where 90% of the industry will mostly be online.

Lastly have you ever been in a long line at Disneyland? When you have two hours in it then you have NO idea how great it is you have entertainment at your fingertips. I’ve seen plenty of films while waiting for Space Mountain lol.

And I just LOVE the idea that I have the ENTIRE library of Star Trek in my feakin pocket lol. Think about that, 700 episodes we can out and watch anywhere at anytime. I’m old enough to remember when I had to wait for the rerun months later lol. Those days are thankfully gone!


Sure, with streaming you can watch the content anywhere. But again, why would I WANT to? I don’t even like watching some programs on the smaller 42″ set in my own HOUSE. I guess it’s convenient to stream to your phone if it is something you feel you absolutely MUST see. But there is no TV show I feel that way about. It’s just TV.
You mention the long term… As more and more streaming services are out there it’s going to cost consumers more and more to keep up with them. You need HBOGo for GOT. You need CBSAA for Trek. You need Netflix for House of Cards. You need Amazon for… Whatever they have you like. And the cold hard fact is the bulk of those providers probably will only have perhaps 2 MAYBE three shows you really want to see. The rest is just not quite as worthwhile. So here you are… End up forking out over $100 a month to stream your content and the amusing thing is many people cut the cord while they were paying less. How long before people start cutting the streaming cord? There is a limit to what folks will pay.
That is why I strongly suspect ultimately someone like Comcast will start bundling streaming services. And as the subscribers become more diluted the streamers will totally be on board with it.

I understand the realities. Things are going the streaming route. I’m not a fan because having the physical media in my hand is always better than relying on someone else to make sure you always have your content. When you pay for streaming, you aren’t paying for the content. You are only paying for the right to view the content through whatever provider made the deal. For this reason some sort of physical media will always be available. Side by side with the streaming option. The form that physical media takes may change. HVS to DVD to Blu Ray to 4K… But it will be available for quite some time.

I have been in long Disneyland lines. As well as long lines elsewhere. Never have I wished I would watch a TV show on my phone. And even if I had that ability I can promise you I wouldn’t. A fun place like Disneyland, like I said, I would be enjoying the company of my companions and soaking up the environment. Certainly would not be spending my time staring at my tiny phone screen watching something that would be a million times more enjoyable on my couch at home. Most places where I am in a line or cue I would be talking with whoever I was there with. If I was solo and the situation allowed for it, I would play games on my phone to help pass the time. But watching TV? Not a good option be it Trek or anything else.

@ML – but that is YOU. CBSAA is actually more condusive to wider choice. Because it can be watched anywhere. If it was on CBS Network and people complained that they needed to buy cable and sit in front of the TV, you’d be confused by their complaint.

I actually have HBO but didnt see Game of Thrones until I bought the season 1 Blu Ray. Worth taking the chance. And it was great.

You just dont understand how streaming works because you like renting discs. Im sure there were other old farts weeping in the parking lot of Blockbuster when it went out of business but it went out of business for a reason (read the book Netflixed).

I know I’m just spitting into the wind here by attempting to enlighten you but I’m doing it anyway… I and no one else is saying they shouldn’t make use of streaming tech. Lots of people use it. My kids and nieces and nephews mostly watch stuff on their mobile devices. We are saying that in addition to that platform it would be best if they made the content more available than just limiting it to one platform.

” If it was on CBS Network and people complained that they needed to buy cable and sit in front of the TV, you’d be confused by their complaint.”

This is another example of your blind arrogance. I would not be confused at all by the complaint. I would understand that they very well might have valid and excellent reasons for the complaint. Reasons that likely do not resonate with me. That does not make their issues any less valid.

“You just dont understand how streaming works because you like renting discs. ”

Again, wrong. I understand EXACTLY how streaming works. And having tried it and experienced it I PREFER movies on blu ray for reasons already made clear. I am also very well aware of why the corner video store and outlets like Blcokbuster are no longer around. No need for your arrogant and ignorant and infantile editorials. You do not realize it but it just makes you look worse and worse.

As others have pointed out to you there is nothing stopping you from watching All Access on your TV. The only thing stopping you is you.

And since most other streaming platforms rolled out various options for streaming including TV apps, one can reason CBS would do the same. Yet instead of waiting to see if they do or asking CBS if they are working on it, you just assume they arent and complain about it.


There is something stopping me. The fact that it turns out CBS is requiring their subscribers buy more than what they advertise their cost is. It’s unscrupulous behavior quite honestly.

And I have mentioned it is possible CBS will see the error of their ways and make it so they can be available on smart TV’s. This is you making bad assumptions and not understanding what you have read. This is a tired and old trend of yours.

@ML – How is it unscrupulous behavior by CBS??? Holy Cow you are dense.

Is it unscrupulous behavior when Netflix advertises their monthly price but doesnt include the cost of a TV or computer or phone etc to watch it?

Is it unscrupulous behavior when studios advertise the cost of Blu Ray discs but do not include the cost of a blu ray player to play the disc (not to mention the TV)?

Yes Tup. I guess it makes me dense to think it is immoral to say when something costs one thing but in reality really costs something much more.

So then you ARE saying its immoral for Netflix to advertise $9.99 but not include the cost of a TV or Internet connection?

Wow. I agree though. In my city today gas is 99 cents a liter and I was so excited but then I found out that didnt include the cost of car. THAT is immoral.

Wow… that has been explained to you many times and you still aren’t getting it. Go read the post that does and then get back to me. Please try and learn something….

Star Trek Discovery in Trouble


Well on other sites that video has been said to be created by sources who have been correct in the past.

The worrisome part is the idea of trans dimensional universes where “Sarek” actually was the Rumulan and Klingon played by the same actor and the lack of commitment to continuity.

I saw that link on Macross World and I was like…. oh &^%$. Oh course, it’s just rumors, yes? though I wonder… how hard would it be to prove that the merchandisers really are balking at some of the designs (which is something I’ve never heard about before in ST IP circles)?

~Pensive’s Wetness

There was a similar article in late 2015 “DEADPOOL MOVIE IS A MESS: FILM IN TROUBLE” and there’s already another spelling doom for the sequel. Sometimes they’re true, but they mostly just make me roll my eyes.

True it could mean nothing but the show HAS been delayed twice already, fired its FX crew and lost its show runner in the process. So while it may not all be true there is probably some truth the show is having growing pains of some kind. Especially for a show that has now been delayed 8 months now.

Even when Beyond got into its big trouble of losing both its director and script months before production was suppose to start the premiere date only got pushed back 2 months. So there could be a whole lot going on.

Daredevil also lost it’s showrunner, before it premiered, and after the first season. Disaster was predicted each time, and both seasons were excellent.

The first Iron Man film was beset by TONS of problems, conflict within the cast, a frustrated director, scenes written on the day of shooting, and a star who almost walked off the set.

DSC may turn out to be a clusterf*ck, but I pay no heed to these kinds of doomsayers.

Sometimes losing the Showrunner is good. I thought both Dead Like Me and The Walking Dead improved a lot after they changed Showrunner’s (not to mention Enterprise).

Yes but all that is being said is there ARE problems. No one is saying they can’t resolve it. Obviously they are because the show is still being filmed and they are still hiring actors. All thats been said is its probably chaotic but they are working through it.

And DD wasn’t delayed, twice, when it lost its show runner. Yes I get your point, stuff just happens. I think with Discovery some of this is just normal growing pains like any new show. But considering the pressure this show needs to succeed effectively launching a new streaming service and more than likely a very costly show I can see why there are issues over it.

Being 8 months delayed is NOT normal in the TV world. When it got pushed back from January to May I thought OK well they lost Fuller so I know they have to readjust. But once it was delayed again and they DIDN’T even give a date at that time it was clear a lot more was happening. But now it looks like things are smoothing out. How that translate on the screen have yet to be seen obviously.

I think thats pretty reasonable. If they are at 1.5 million now then they are only trying to get another 2.5 million and yeah that should be very possible. Obviously not right away but within the year. My guess its going to be over a million the first month easily and will take a few months to get to the rest. Now thats IF the show is good. And yes the other problem is a lot of people will simply cancel once they finish their run and I’m sure they are well aware of that. Netflix still has that problem.

But I like how its sounding and yes I have NO problem paying. I want new Star Trek and I will easily pay for it if the content is worthy. And I really hope a lot of others do too because downloading it illegally is not going to help it to another season. Now if you don’t have the money or you dont like the streaming service that is 100% valid. But if its out of some idea you feel you are being ‘cheated’ you have to pay for Star Trek, c’mon? Look around nearly every TV most people watch are ‘paying for it’ one way or the other minus the networks. And I have news for Americans, most American shows in many parts of the world that are run free here are usually on cable in a lot of places they have to pay for. Hell the irony is when I lived in Japan I had to pay cable to get Star Trek reruns which I seen all the time and I paid ANYWAY lol. But thats just me.

Anyway I’m not too worried about the show with the Netflix deal. My guess no matter what its going to be on a few seasons regardless, especially if CBS is only going to add four shows a year. THAT means unless the shows they have on there now truly suck they are going to run them for awhile until they build up more content. You’re not going to be cancelling a lot of shows when you don’t have anything to replace them with.

My problem is the streaming. Although I don’t like the idea of paying for cable, internet and other services I would begrudgingly pay for a new Trek show because I’m a fan. If they put the show on disc and then rent out the discs like Netflix or 3D blu ray I would do it in a heartbeat. I would even pay more to rent the discs than I would to stream. Why? Because disc quality is still light years better than streaming. My guess is CBS will not decide if they want to package the show on disc until after the series is run and they see what the true numbers are. I’m hoping they go to disc. Silly me for wanting to watch TV shows on my…. Wait for it… TV!

I’ve been watching The Good Fight through my Amazon Fire stick on my 65″ TV. The streaming quality looks totally fine to me.

I’m sure CBS will eventually release it on disc, like Netflix has done with their shows. It’s just usually not as quickly as with traditional broadcast/cable shows though.

Right and when ML31 buys (or rents -lol) the Star Trek discs is he going to watch it on his…wait for it…TV?

ML31 has been pushing this nonsense for ages. What do you want, it released on disc same day as it airs? That doesnt happen. Get over it. Wait til end of season and they probably will release it on Blu Ray. Or suck it up and watch it on your TV on CBSAA.

Great. I don’t have an Amazon account and have no desire to add yet another one account on top of the CBSAA account. So is there another way? BTW… Even when using the youtube streaming app on my TV even though the image is OK the controls are still annoying and don’t work nearly as well as those on the blu ray player or the DVR.

I think CBS MIGHT release the show on disc after. But the question will be will those discs be available through Netflix or another rental service? I do not want to buy what I have not already seen.

ML31 if CBS sent the actors to your house to act out the epsidoes you’d complain. People are answering your questions and you complain. Oh I dont want to buy a stick. Oh the controls suck.

Do you want CBS to buy you a TV also? Either watch it or dont. But dont pretend YOUR reluctance to watch CBSAA is somehow reflective of CBS being stupid. Sounds like The Good Fight has been successful for CBSAA. What say you about that?

@ML 31 – Remember when you posted that people claiming to have seen All Access were probably watching on their phones? MattR just told you he watches on a 65″ TV and the quality is fine.

So he answered you issue about streaming quality. You then go on to complain that you dont want Amazon. You then complain about Youtube’s controls which have nothing to do with Amazon.

You can get a Fire Stick for under $40. Others can point you to cheaper devices. You can use google if you’re able to comprehend how it works.

“Remember when you posted that people claiming to have seen All Access were probably watching on their phones?”

No. Because I didn’t say that. You still fail to understand context. He did not answer my issue about streaming quality because I never asked him to. I did say I don’t want any of the streaming TV add ons. So I guess in a weird sense saying I don’t want Amazon is kinda sorta true. But weirdly specific. The control problem I have said was a tech thing and not specific to any particular service.

You have got to be just playing with me… No one goes on and on and gets so very much wrong who isn’t….

There is absolutely no ‘control issue’ related to the general technology of streaming. That is absurd.

There is. I’m no longer going to repeat things for the sake of the board (if anyone else is still reading your rants). At this point I’ll just tell you to go read the post where it was already addressed by me.

Oh my God, ML31 back with the same old WRONG arguments. You know Netflix streams some shows in 4k right? So knock off this “disc is better then streaming”.

If you have a lousy internet connection, that is not CBS’ problem. That’s yours. Didnt you claim to be stealing Netflix from a friend anyway?

Watch it or dont. No one cares how YOU’RE inconvenienced by Star Trek being on CBSAA.

Tup.. So watching TV on a TV is nonsense. Whatever. It’s no impossible. Netflix has been releasing their shows the same day they become available for some time already. It has already happened. The only time they didn’t for a show I was interested in was the most recent season of House of Cards (which was delayed for about a month) and more annoyingly, Daredevil. Which season one was only recently released on disc and season 2 still has no release date.

The argument is 100% correct. The discs ARE better than streaming. WAY better. The image is better. The controls are better. And discs have extras! My internet connection is adequate. I do fine with it. That doesn’t change the low quality of streaming. Yes, Netflix does stream in 4K. But it only works over some gaming console and I believe you need to pay extra to get it. That’s a lot of hoops to jump thorough for something that still very well has the same control issues (I know as a colleague of mine has the 4K option and told me about it). No, I do not steal Netflix and you know it. I pay for it. Sorry you don’t have friends doesn’t mean you need to rip on mine.

I already have one friend interested in sharing an account and working on another. But the question still remains… How will I be able to watch it on my TV? Currently CBSAA has no TV app and the TV browser is terrible.

You seem to care a great deal about my concerns as you seem to feel obliged to comment on them so often. So are you a lair or just oblivious to what you write?

ML31, you are wrong. You are extrapolating your issues onto everyone else. Youre issues do not represent everyone else. This silly Disc vs Streaming argument is so silly. Its akin to the old man yelling at kids to get off his lawn.

I collect movies. I have a large Blu Ray collection. So I LOVE discs. I have Netflix is crystal clear streaming. I see no difference between my Netflix and the Blu Ray version. If you do, upgrade. If you dont want to upgrade dont whine that the platform is the problem.

The choice is there for you. You’re the one complaining about it. If you want Discovery on Disc, wait for it to come out on Disc. its not the norm for a series to be released on Disc the DAY it premiere’s. So stop complaining.

I dont know how you will watch it on TV but since its available on many devices that hook up to a TV including Xbox and Playstation, you can certainly do so if you want to.

You could not be more wrong. All I was wondering was if I do find others to go in with me, how would I be able to watch on my TV? Not sure why you have such a huge problem with that.

If you love streaming so very much, why waste your time with DVD’s (as you so often call them)? You are being very inconsistent. But that’s not surprising.

Why should I buy a very expensive Xbox or playstation JUST to stream CBSAA? That’s just idiocy. But then, I would come to expect that from you.

Ask CBS.

What? But you are the self proclaimed all knowing media god here!

@ML31 – No, myself and many others have tried to correct your nonsense. And we’ve certainly never spoken to subjects related to CBS business that we arent aware of (by using common sense, personal experience or a newfangled invention called google).

But really, only a moron would complain every single day about facts not in evidence. If it bothers you that much, ask CBS.

“No, myself and many others have tried to correct your nonsense.”

No one has corrected anything I have said. There was one guy who made a valid point about DVD sales that had escaped me. That was about it. Nothing you or your alter ego have said has been anything close to constructive here. You have indeed made a number of assumptions regarding CBS. All the time as if were verifiable fact.

You have presented yourself as the genius streaming and CBS and business guru, and have injected your ill conceived guesses multiple times yet NOW you are saying to ask CBS? What happened? Don’t tell me you had a small humility attack? Say it ain’t so….

“So knock off this “disc is better then streaming””

I will not stop speaking facts just because you don’t like said facts. The discs are more reliable in ways that have already been addressed. Go read the post to reacquaint yourself with them.

” Didnt you claim to be stealing Netflix from a friend anyway? ”

Again, I never made that claim. You did. You confused.

It should be only on Netflix, imho.

My boyfriend just finished watching The Good Wife on Netflix, and then last night wanted to watch the sequel – The Good Fight. When he saw it wasn’t there (it’s CBS All Acess) he just went to putlocker, found it and started watching on his laptop. It took 10 seconds to find.

Idiot comment. You could say the same thing about Netflix, why not just watch it from a bootleg service, and save yourself $11/m?

It’s not an idiot comment. Netflix has a lot of content – All Access doesn’t. It’s a lot easier to watch a bunch of shows on Netflix than it is to hunt them down on the internet. But one show? Netflix also offers a massive potential audience in NA (far more than All Access). I get why CBS is doing it – they’re trying to make all access viable.

And there’s subscription fatigue. I subscribe to Netflix, Amazon and HBO now plus pay $150 a month for cable and Internet. I’m not thrilled about having to subscribe monthly to another service to watch just one show that I can’t binge watch. I probably will. But will your average Joe?

Now it’s not just an idiot comment, it’s a worthless, insipid, garbage comment.

“Netflix has a lot of content – All Access doesn’t.”

And how do you think they’ll get more content, by NOT making new shows for CBSAA?

“I get why CBS is doing it – they’re trying to make all access viable.”

Than you’ve answered your own question.

“And there’s subscription fatigue. I subscribe to Netflix, Amazon and HBO now plus pay $150 a month for cable and Internet. I’m not thrilled about having to subscribe monthly to another service to watch just one show that I can’t binge watch.”

Then scrap cable, is my answer. The fact that you still have it says a lot. But really, you’re going to begrudge a new business because of other services in the market?

So Sony shouldn’t have entered the video game industry because “well, there’s system fatigue, I already have a Nintendo, a Genesis and an Atari, and those systems already have TONS of games! Playstation only has 3 so far!” Apple shouldn’t have entered the phone market because “there’s already so many good phones!” Google shouldn’t either, you know.

Now, as i’ve said before, I don’t think CBSAA will be a success story. But I wouldn’t be surprised if it is, either, and I certainly don’t think it dooms Star Trek to put it on CBSAA.

Good content these days wins out– it will survive even if CBSAA goes under, if it’s good. And I for one will happily pay $6 a month to watch a season of Star Trek.

If you used your head you’d wait till the season is over and pay $6 to binge watch it, if that’s what you want to do.

Exactly. If you cant afford or dont want CBSAA, dont get it. Problem solved. CBS is under no obligation to make sure you can watch their TV programs.

Of course they want people to watch. But this is their model. If they thought enough people were like Jack, they wouldnt choose this model. CBS doesnt own Netflix so why would they just put it there? They are a business.

If enough people reject CBSAA, then CBS will go in a different direction.

I bet most people whining about it will end up subscribing. Or they can buy the Blu Ray.

Because it’s going on Netflix everywhere else but the US and Canada.

And CBS cutrently puts most shows on Netflix.

Jack… That is pretty much the only hope for most of us. That when CBS puts the show on disc their agreement with Netflix will allow them to actually send out those discs since CBS is making subscribing to their service monumentally difficult.

They dont put shows on Netflix. Netflix pays to air the shows.

Obviously you are unclear on the concept.

Im unclear that Netflix pays CBS to air Star Trek? So you’re saying they air Star Trek for free? Are you over the age of 7?

“Im unclear”

That is all you needed to say. We all know how the system works. Yet you address issues that have never been brought up quite often.

You told me I was unclear on the concept of Netflix playing for Star Trek. So please explain… (or admit you’re wrong).

The comment wasn’t about CBS putting their own productions on Netflix (assuming the streaming arm, obviously). The comment was about hoping they will make the discs available to Netflix. Again, obviously not the same as Netflix has discs in their library that they have the right to ship out but that same content they do not have the right to stream out. So it’s a different animal altogether.

You dont understand how the rental model works. Google it or read Netflixed. it will explain it to you.

Then by all means… Enlighten your lowly and ignorant throng of what do not understand…
(This ought to be good for a laugh. If there is a response I’m pretty sure I know what it will be. Let’s find out…)

I doubt you could comprehend the relevant legal terms. But start with First Sale Doctrine and go from there.

Please… Explain this to the peons below you… Show us that those aren’t just three words you happened to see together somewhere….

First Sale Doctrine isnt three words I happened to see together. And if you need me to explain it then, further to my point, you dont understand how rental works. Which is not a criticism just an observation.

The only reason I know anything is that 1) I read Netflixed 2) I did some digging around the internet out of curiosity.

You can do the same (and again I highly recommend the book Netflixed) but the very general explanation is that in the infancy of Home Video, studios tried to assert that they owned the copywrite on a given work and you only had a license to view it, not re-sell, rent it etc.

First Sale Doctrine established that the rights holder only maintains that right on the first sale (not the actual copyright ofcourse). Thus, when you guy a Video or DVD or Blu Ray, you then gain the right to do whatever you want with it.

Thats why its perfectly legal for you to buy an original DVD of Star Trek and then sell it at a garage sale and keep the money or lend it to a friend or lend it out for a cost (ie. renting).

And the reason Netflix has a larger library of Discs then streaming is because that doesnt apply to streaming and thus they have to negotiate individual rights to everything they stream (and why they were so focused on creating their own original programming).

Any lawyers here can happily correct me on the finer points. But thats it in an nutshell (Im going off memory).

So yeah, First Sale Doctrine.

Yes I have said it over and over again as well people like this are ridiculous. As if a company should automatically make shows for another company because they already own it. These people don’t live in the real world.

Yes OF COURSE we would all like for this show to be on a platform we already own, no one here is saying differently. But there is this weird entitlement now that everything should just go to Netflix because they have it and because there is already a lot there. Yeah but CBS doesn’t own Netflix. They don’t get the benefits of it running it on their OWN service. What people don’t seem to get here is CBS is trying to be the next Netflix. How many times does this have to be said? And so they have the RIGHT to try. End of the day yes if enough consumers decide AA is not worth it it will fail. But clearly as the article states they have a strategy to try adding four shows a year and their subscription goals are pretty moderate.

I get sick of hearing people whine the show isn’t going to be on a service they already own. Boohoo, the world can be cruel. But they act like Netflix and Amazon are the only two companies that should have a streaming service or something. And in reality Netflix and Amazon KNOWS having third party IPs is not a sustainable business because the streaming market will only grow and more and more media companies will simply make their own and want their IPs on their site. In time you are only going to see more HBO Now, AA, Hulu, etc and a lot of those contracts Netflix has will not be renewed because of it. I mean it sucks how many movies and shows leave that site on a whim now. So why they are building their own content because they realize they need their own IPs a s a permanent fixture.

But also you’re right if AA goes under more than likely it will end up at Netflix full time (assuming its a success for them) so if the site doesn’t do as hoped DSC will get another home somewhere. Star Trek is too big now to abandon early.

I get the people who complain about it not being on a service they already get. That sure would be convenient but it’s not the real world. Some people already pay for one or two streaming services and the idea of paying for yet another just is not very attractive. I understand and it is a legitimate beef. Sadly for now, that is not how things are. In the future I can see someone like Comcast getting multiple streaming providers together and putting out package deals. But that is down the line and only if other services become popular enough to remain in business.
That said, many are not so much annoyed with the show being on CBSAA as they are that streaming is the ONLY way to see the show. And it’s not even about the cost. Some would pay more than the monthly service fee for the opportunity to just rent the blu rays and watch it with high quality image, sound and have controls that are not delayed action. And another beef is that CBSAA has yet to announce HOW to watch their service on a TV. They are being rather secretive on how to even get their service if you want it. Which is another reason why I’m thinking it really won’t last even if Discovery is the greatest spin off Trek ever.

I do think you are wrong about what would happen if AA goes under. What would most likely happen is CBS will blame Trek rather than the service for the failure and that would be the end of TV Trek for another decade at least. This show on CBSAA is really a lose lose for fans for Trek.

Some people didnt have HBO until The Sopranos came out. Some didnt have HBO until Game of Thrones. Some people didnt have Netflix until OINTB.

Do not understand the concept CBS has here? Enough already. Your whining has fallen on deaf ears. Go away.

None of that has any bearing on anything. You keep making post after post that reveal every time you do not understand the ideas presented in the posts you are responding to. I have no idea what you are like in person but on line you come across as a smarmy know it all who refuses to accept the fact that many people have different tastes. Take your own advice and do everyone a favor… Don’t come back until you can be more civil. The board will thank you.

@ML – I do not know it all. I just know a lot more than you do, apparently. Just like other posters here are more knowledgeable then me, apparent in their posts. Just like most are more knowledgeable then you including the ones that have answered your complaints and questions, given you advice and told you their FIRST HAND EXPERIENCES with All Access have been good. But you ignore them and just insult people that wont embrace your pitiful little axe to grind against CBS.

its simple. Do you want to watch Discovery? If yes, STFU and watch it. if you dont, STFU and dont watch it. Either way, you know what to do.

” I do not know it all. I just know a lot more than you do, ”

And there it is. The Tup arrogance on display yet again. You are the one who dishes out the insults sparky. Not me. That is your MO.

It actually is simple. Do you want to engage in a civil conversation about the merits and issues with CBSAA? If yes, then please take part. If not, (which seems to be the choice you made) then STFU and don’t take part.

@ML – its not arrogance. You keep repeating the same thing which has been corrected by MULTIPLE posters. So when you insult me, you’re insulting several people who have all said the same thing to you. You’re WRONG. Please be mature enough to admit it.

Dude… Enough. You keep repeating the same bogus garbage to me over and over even though you have been told the facts straight from the horses mouth and they are things you have absolutely no insight on. You constantly tell me I don’t pay for my Netflix. You constantly tell me my only concern is the price CBS is charging. Neither is true. Further, you constantly respond by bringing up things that were NEVER touched on. I never said anything about “The Good Fight”. Yet you bring it up as if I did. ONE poster pointed out a flaw in one comment of mine. One. And it wasn’t you nor your alter ego. I told the poster it was a good point and moved on. It is you who consistently cannot handle the facts and when you do you start throwing down the insults. It’s all over the board. If you haven’t already please… For the sake of the board… Grow up.

@ML – please dont resort to parroting what everyone is saying to you. its immature and clutters the board.

You’ve been properly educated on reality here. If you do not choose to accept it, that’s really your problem. Hopefully you dont teach your kids to be as anal and obtuse as you are being.

I will give you this… Your tactic is one I have yet to see. You behave in a certain way and later on you start to accuse the other person of doing exactly what you are doing.

The conversation could move forward if you could just do the following… First, before responding, make sure you read and fully understand what the poster wrote. That way you don’t attribute comments to people that they never wrote. And next, do not repeat the same comments over and over and over. Do you expect to get a different response each time?

That’s all you need to do to have a civil conversation that moves forward. Please take heed.

@ML – I hope the mods eventually come here and clean you up. I hate saying that because I believe in largly mod-free discussion. But thats relying on most people to be mature enough to moderate themselves. You arent capable. You’ve embarrased yourself and sadly tainted me with your stink.

I apoligize to the mods and the other posters here for engaging with you. I thought you’d eventually wise up. Sadly, you haven’t.

Please… This is your goal. To create chaos. You wouldn’t wash rinse repeat like you do if it wasn’t.

I did notice how you completely ignored the wonderful advice I gave you on how to have a civil conversation. Could that maybe suggest you have no intention to have one?

That’s not what I’m saying at all. And, they’re putting it on Netflix everywhere else. I understand why CBS is doing this in NA and don’t actually expect them to do it here for first airing.

They also put a lot of shows on Netflix.

Personally, I’m not subscribing to another service to watch one show.

And, in Canada its going on another service – Crave – CBS doesn’t own.

CBS isnt putting it on Netflix. Netflix is PAYING to have it.

Its apparently going to air on Space in Canada too, just to drive ML31 nuts. Maybe he can make a friend in Canada and run a really long cable to his home.

It is an idiot comment. So every TV show and movie should be on whatever delivery platform YOU prefer? Why doesnt CBS send the actors to your house and act out the episodes?

Think before you type, Jack.

You are indeed correct about what you call “subscription fatigue”. It’s adding yet another pay service to the docket. Eventually people are just going to go, “enough”. I can totally see cable providers package dealing all the pay streaming services together eventually into a single service. Cable for the internet. When that happens, and the tech improves, only then would multiple streaming services become a good option for consumers. Right now, it’s really not.
Nice that CBS wants to be in the “leading edge” of the tech, but it would be nice if they made their content available to people who want what is still more reliable and superior quality over what MIGHT become superior 5-10 years down the road.

How ill cable providers put streaming services together when they dont control the streaming services?

Still have no idea what you’re talking about in regards to streaming being unreliable. Upgrade your internet. I have Netflix in 4K if I want it. Far better than by cable provider thus far.

Are you suggesting streaming services all turn off their service until its peak? So, should Cable providers turn off Cable until they can deliver all content in 4K? What about 8K?

Again, your whining is about this being inconvenient for you. There are people who want to watch Game of Thrones and cant afford HBO. There are people who want to watch OITNB and cant afford Netflix or dont have internet.

either pay for CBSAA or dont. But stop trying to demonize CBS for it. It’s not their problem you cant watch it, just like it’s not HBO’s problem someone cant watch Game of Thrones.

They didn’t control the networks (initially) in the beginning either. Yet they were able to work with them to provide the service.

You don’t know about the unreliable service because you seem to be happy with low quality audio and bad picture and delayed controls. Just because you are good with such things doesn’t mean everyone else is.

“Are you suggesting streaming services all turn off their service until its peak?”

I have no idea what you are talking about. Yet another comment you pulled out of thin air that had nothing to do with what I wrote.

No one said or implied anything about “inconvenience”. That is your word. I never mentioned or implied that at all. Yet you keep going on and on about it as if it was something I mentioned. It wasn’t. Not going to bother to tell you what I actually wrote anymore. I’ve corrected you in multiple posts and it did no good.

Actually, I am happy with 4K video, surround around audio and on-demand service. And guess what, I pay for it. I dont mooch it off friends or steal it.

You make no sense and every one of your idiotic complaints has been answered by many people here but your head is so far up your own a$$ that you cant see that.

Netflix produces reliable content. If YOUR internet provider or TV is not able to display it, thats YOUR problem, not Netflix’s. Call your internet provider. Maybe you’re still on dial up… or should I say the friend you mooch from…

Good for you. However, given your lack of understanding I would guess you may even be watching standard definition stretched in to a widescreen format and you wouldn’t be able to tell the difference. Ignorance must be bliss.

Further examples… No “complaint” has been answered. The only reason you say such hogwash is because you have yet to able to respond with logic or reason or have a civilized discussion on the matter. It’s sad but is more common than it should be on the internet.

It’s not Netflix that is the problem, dude. Wake up. It’s the technology they are relying on to deliver the streaming content. The discs have been perfectly reliable.

And again, the bitterness you show from not having friends is showing again. You have my deepest sympathy. But perhaps if you changed your arrogant attitude you might actually find some friends?

You’re complaints have been answered many many times. You just refuse to accept them. Other people here have told you they have ZERO issue with the All Access stream while they watch The Good Fight. But you insist it must be terrible even though you’ve never seen it.

Since cost is not the issue as you claim (even though you keep complaining about cost), why dont you watch The Good Fight on All Access and let us know if your stream buffers or is of low quality. Then, if it is, we will advise you to call your internet provider and let them know. They will either dispatch a technician to check your line and let you know (most likely) that you subscribe to a lower tier package.

This actually happened to me. I noticed I was having issues with my WiFi (yes, including Netflix being slow). I called my provider and it turns out my package was from ten years ago when I probably had little to nothing using wi-fi. Now I have many devices using wifi. I upgraded to a higher tier and have had zero issues.

And yes it cost me more. I made the choice to pay for something I wanted. I know that’s a crazy abstract concept. But try it.

My concerns and questions have not been answered at all. People’s experience watching “The Good Fight” have nothing to do with what I’ve been talking about. This is an old story with you. Respond about something that was not brought up at all. Case in point… I never said one word about that show.

Why would I want to watch “The Good Fight?” I don’t even watch “The Good Wife”. Why waste my money? Oh that’s right.. Everything is free for you so you assume that is the same for everyone else. I forgot.

Why did you even respond? It contributed nothing and had zero to do with anything I wrote in the thread…. I guess that is you being you.

“You are indeed correct about what you call “subscription fatigue”

Just like “comic book movie fatigue?” No, it’s YOUR fatigue. Amazon, Hulu, Fox Now, HBO Go, Netflix, they all coexist OK. And people thought each one would fail.

And even if there is over-saturation, maybe CBSAA will hit the scene and push another service out with better content and better features over time.

Do I think it will happen? No. But you never KNOW. Like I said, did market competition prevent Sony from entering the video game market? Or Apple and Google entering the phone business?

“It’s adding yet another pay service to the docket.”

And that is a very GOOD thing. More competition creates better products. Markets have proven this OVER AND OVER.

“Eventually people are just going to go, “enough”

No, that’s not how it works. With various competitors vying for limited space (if we assume that’s the case), what will happen eventually is that the best services will rise to the top, or and this is a longshot but a possibility, there will be enough subscribers to keep them ALL afloat, redistributing the dollars so there is not ONE or TWO kings at the top, but a handful of well-performing services.

“I can totally see cable providers package dealing all the pay streaming services together eventually into a single service.”

Not a single service, but yes, I could eventually see some streaming platforms merging, to create a handful of conglomerates.

But that doesn’t mean new services will stop popping up, and doesn’t mean that more choice is a bad thing.

“Just like “comic book movie fatigue?” ”

Not exactly the same thing. Trek hit their mark after being on the air and in theaters for 25 years. How long have we had a glut of comic book movies? A decade? The trend will pass. Just as in the 60’s there was a huge glut of westerns. That genre faded out for a while too.

“And even if there is over-saturation, maybe CBSAA will hit the scene and push another service out with better content and better features over time.”

We aren’t talking about hardware stores. We are talking about entertainment media. Things work a little differently in that business. It’s not a matter of market competition. People opt for Android or iPhone or Galaxy. One. They don’t buy all the phones out there. But they CAN buy more than one streaming service to get different programing. However, that only goes so far. Eventually people will finally say “No” to adding just another $8 a month charge. There are already a number of streaming services out there. I think that level is closer to arriving than you think.

“No, that’s not how it works.”

No, that is EXACTLY how it works.

“Not a single service, but yes, I could eventually see some streaming platforms merging, to create a handful of conglomerates.”

That is another possibility. But I think it more likely someone will pay those streaming providers a fee to add their service to their streaming bundles. This will only come to pass if we get too many streaming providers, however. It is also possible the market will not reach that point.

No, that is EXACTLY how it works.

I disagreed with you and explained myself. You offer nothing. You’re still wrong.

“How long have we had a glut of comic book movies? A decade?”

The “comic book movie fatigue” predicition has been circulating since around 2004, with the genre itself kicking off in 1999 with Blade, but more seriously the following year with X-Men. After 2004 saw the release of 5 comic book films (Spider-Man 2, Blade 3, Catwoman, Punisher, and Hellboy), people starting talking about fatigue. So the prediction alone has been going around for 13 years, the genre itself for nearly 20.

While I do think they will eventually slow down, it will be a long time before it does (2018 has at least 8 major comic book releases), and the genre will NOT go away entirely.

“We aren’t talking about hardware stores. We are talking about entertainment media.”

The analogy is still apt. The fact that people CAN and DO purchase multiple media at the same time actually works AGAINST your argument. Idiot comment reaches 9000 because you just supported MY point!

“But I think it more likely someone will pay those streaming providers a fee to add their service to their streaming bundles.”

This makes zero sense. I’m not going to answer you any longer because you’ve conclusively proven yourself to be incapable of coherent thought, and actually argue against yourself.

Great job.

“I disagreed with you and explained myself. You offer nothing. You’re still wrong. ”

I offered what I said to begin with. Which was correct and still is. I saw no reason to repeat what was already said. You are the one who offered nothing.

“The “comic book movie fatigue” predicition has been circulating since around 2004,”

Hardly. That was when the trend was in it’s infancy. Give it more time. It will peter out. That’s just the nature of things.

“The analogy is still apt. The fact that people CAN and DO purchase multiple media at the same time actually works AGAINST your argument.”

No, it works FOR my argument. Your analogy doesn’t work. People don’t buy three or four phones. They get one. They can and do, however, subscribe to multiple streaming services. I felt the need to repeat what was already said because you seem to not remember these things. Also, as was said, the industries behave differently. So again, my point supports my argument and yours fails to support yours.

“This makes zero sense.”

It makes perfect sense. I explained the reasoning why. You couldn’t and didn’t. The only reason you have opted to pick up your ball and cry all the way home is because you know you cannot use logic and reason so you spew a few childish put downs out and run. It is the typical internet response when one is logiced into a corner.

‘obviously’ Moonves has an annoying word repetition tic, like in the old Kids in the Hall sketch wherein the employee is told by his boss that he is being let go for incessant repetition of the word ‘scenario.’ he should take a benzo or something before public speaking.

while i’m a mammoth Trek fan, i don’t like being made to pay money to see tv that was previously “just on” whether i watched it or not.. the original unspoken agreement whereby they provide programs i like in exchange for which i agree to watch the commercials has been reneged on. now i have to ACTIVELY give them money, for membership in their shabby little club, and i STILL have to watch the commercials? and this is supposed to be ‘value’? for whom? sorry, but i decline this new agreement.
a la carte programming should be on a per-program basis, not a per-network basis.

this is the edge of a slippery slope: the idea that in several years we would all be paying $5 per network for a dozen or more networks in order to watch just for ~one show per network ON TOP OF the monthly internet access bill is insane.

It is indeed an issue. When I opt for what level of cable service I get because they have pre-arranged tiers of service (that are designed to get the most subscribers. Yes, I understand the business) there are levels that have perhaps ONE channel I would like access to. But I ask myself, is it really worth it to tag on another 10$ a month for that ONE channel? 9 times out of 10 the answer is “no.”

I still have questions about CBSAA. First, will I be able to watch it on my TV? I have no desire to watch on my tablet or phone. YouTube has an app on the TV and it works OK. Will CBSAA have an app on my TV and if so, how can I add it? If not, I’m stuck using the browser that came with the TV. I’ve had VERY bad luck watching streaming content through the browser and I do not want that hassle if I opt to subscribe to CBSAA for Trek.
I also would like to know how many accounts one subscription will hold. I already have one friend willing to go in with me to share the cost and am working on a 3rd.

Are you accessing this site via a computer or smart phone? Can you use Google?

CBS All Access is available on all of your favorite streaming devices, including Roku, Apple TV, Chromecast, Amazon Fire TV, Android TV, PlayStation 4, and Xbox 360, Windows 10, as well as smart phones and tablets (iOS/Android). That means you can watch CBS on Roku and all of these other great devices.

I access this site on desktops, laptops and tablets. None of which are devices I want to watch TV shows on. EVER. I have a TV for that.

I have no favorite streaming device. I do not pay for Roku, AppleTV, Chromecast, AmazonFire, AndroidTV. I do not own a gaming system. Windows does not run my TV either.

So I ask again… How can I get CBSAA on my TV? CBS has yet to address how anyone will be able to even if they WANT to subscribe to their service.

They don’t need you to subscribe. There are plenty of other people who can figure it out. Seriously. You can just wait until it turns up on netflix or whatever other service CBS may license it to a season later. The world is moving forward, and you appear to have been left behind.

If you’re not smart enough to figure it out, just go back to your room in the home, take your pills in silence, at let the rest of us enjoy DSC.

Torch, obviously you aren’t smart enough to figure it out either. Don’t see you offering up how to do it. Hiding your own ignorance there?

The only one ignorant is you. Just because the solution you want isn’t available doesn’t mean they’ve dropped the ball. You simply have folded your arms and are holding your breath like a petulant child because you don’t want to take the necessary steps required. The solution has been presented to you several times. It’s easy, it’s cheap but you refuse. Impasse reached. Just shut up about it then.


The so called “solution” requires the subscriber to buy something they never wanted or needed to begin with. Which yes, it means CBS has indeed dropped the ball as they are asking people to jump though a series of expensive hoops. And yes, it may be easy but it is rather costly. So their service has suddenly become far more than the monthly fee they advertise. I guess it’s shocking for you to realize that not everyone buys the same equipment you do. Imagine that… People who think differently. That makes you so uncomfortable you have to toss out babyish put downs? How sad yet typical.

ML31 – you’re really not very bright. When CBS puts something on their Network they dont include a way for you to beam it into your brain. You’re still required to pay for access and buy a platform to view it (a TV).

Why is this different? There are many ways to watch it. If CBSAA sold a device like Firestick would that make you feel better that they have “come up with a way to watch it”?

You have no idea how ironic it is when you claim others aren’t very bright. When you say, ” When CBS puts something on their Network they dont include a way for you to beam it into your brain. You’re still required to pay for access and buy a platform to view it” you are saying what everyone already knows. The very idea that you feel that someone is unclear on such a simple concept is so amazing I cannot believe it to be true. It must be that you are deflecting away from something you cannot answer. Do you even realize that you aren’t fooling anyone?

@ML – If everyone knows that then why are you complaining? When they put a show on CBS Network, you need a cable subscription to watch it. When they release a show on disc, you need a disc player to watch it. When they release something on All Access, you need a device to stream it.

What’s the difference? You’ve long lost this argument. Can you be grown up enough to admit it?

” If everyone knows that then why are you complaining? ”

Tup, Because that is NOT what I nor anyone else was talking about!!!! No one actually takes the time to bring up the fact that you cannot watch the content without some sort of device because most folks consider that knowledge so basic and so universal that there is no need to ever EVER mention it. Yet you think people are just too stupid to realize something so amazingly common.

That is why. Can you PLEASE accept that fact and allow the discussion to move forward for a change?

YES YES Finally you GET IT!! It is so AMAZINGLY COMMON that you need a DEVICE to allow you to watch content on your TV. YES thank you finally. And yes, you would be very stupid to think otherwise.

You’re the only one who whined about it because everyone else knows this!

Whew. Finally. Thank you.

I thought you might have actually understood but it was too much to be true. Seems I needed to spoon feed you some more.. That device in question is called a TELEVISION. Or if streaming it could be a laptop or phone or tablet. Some sort of device that has a screen and is capable of connecting to the internet.

Do you understand now? Everyone else but you it seems does….

So can you watch Netflix on your television without any other device being involved? Ofcourse not. You still need the Internet!

Can you cable without a device? Not usually…most providers require a cable box.

Can you watch Blu Rays on your TV without a device? No.

You keep saying people arent stupid enough to think they dont need a device yet cant comprehend that you would need the same for CBSAA.

“So can you watch Netflix on your television without any other device being involved? Ofcourse not. ”

I sure can. The TV has a Netflix app all ready to go! No need to buy anything extra.

And again… People know you can’t watch TV without something with a screen to show it on. But you continue to think everyone except you is dumb as a bag of rocks….

At one time people had to buy VCR’s, then DVD players, then bluray players. These streaming android boxes are simply the newest thing that people everywhere have to buy. It’s the price of staying current and it’s nothing new.

Harry… No one needs to buy those to get video content. There was no need to. With VCR’s you had to buy one if you wanted to time shift or view your home videos. DVD players if you wanted to watch movies in the best format available at the time. Streaming boxes? What do they add? Mainly the ability to watch something on your mobile device. I can see how some might see a huge value in that. Others… Not so much. So no. They are definitely NOT the next step. At least not yet.

NO. They ARE NOT mainly to watch on your mobile device. There are so many dedicated streaming boxes designed to work WITH YOUR TV. This is the way TV watching is heading.

But… You don’t NEED them to watch video content on your television. Those services allow you to stream to your mobile devices. That seems to be their prime purpose as it is something a top of people want and use. More and more so than on their actual TV.

@ML – BECAUSE YOUR PHONE IS ALREADY THE DEVICE! And you paid for it! Holy FACK are you dense.

Many, if not most, popular streaming services have apps for smart TV’s. Already All Access can be viewed on the TV using MANY different devices. And most likely will have a dedicated TV app. It takes time. WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU??

“BECAUSE YOUR PHONE IS ALREADY THE DEVICE! And you paid for it! Holy FACK are you dense.”

I’m not sure how to respond here… It’s obvious you aren’t understanding the concept but each time I tried to explain I realized that you would not take it the way it was intended. To fully explain to you it seems would take an extra long post I really have no desire to type.

Suffice to say, this has all been addressed already and I will just futilely ask that you read it over again. Maybe you will get a 2nd time around….

I give up

@ML – WHAT? Ofcourse you needed to buy peripheral devices to play peripherals. When the home video market began you needed a VCR if you wanted to “rent” or buy videos. In many cases, outside of a theatre it was the only way to watch a movie.

Same goes with DVD Players, Blu Ray etc. When Netflix sends you a disc, they dont include the player do they? You really are the densest person ever to post here.

Do you complain when a film is released to theaters that its inconvenient for you and darn it, they FORCE you to buy a ticket? They dont let you rent a disc of the film at the same time.

If you dont want to watch Discovery, dont. BUT STOP WHINING.

I bet many people, myself included, wanted to watch 11/22/63 which was exclusive to Hulu. I dont have Hulu. But Hulu was under no obligation to beam the program into my brain anyway. And I wasnt stupid enough to whine about it. I waited for Disc and bought it.

You can do the same with Discovery. or not. If you dont, oh well. No one cares if you watch it or not.

TUP… No one was talking about peripherals. We were talking about TV content. You did not NEED a VCR to do that. The VCR gave you a little more flexibility but it was not a needed component. The same goes for disc players.

“Do you complain when a film is released to theaters that its inconvenient for you and darn it, they FORCE you to buy a ticket? ”

And here you go again. You do this ALL the time. You whine and moan about something that was not ever an issue. Why do you do that? We can only conclude it’s because you are unable to shoot down what was actually said so you make up some bogus thing to shoot down.

You further went on to cry and moan on a similar path that NO ONE but you is crying and moaning about. Why do you continue this? Everyone sees right through it because none of us are as stupid as you think we are.

No, ML, the point was clear. You just replied to a different narrative. If you wanted to watch a movie that was only available on VHS, you needed a VCR. It has nothing to do with what was available on broadcast TV at the time.

Would you complain that you needed to buy rabbit ears to watch over the air content as well? How dare they not give you free ones.

You’re all over the place.

The point was indeed clear, Tup. But it was you who responded to a different narrative in bringing up issues that were never brought to the table to begin with. Again… Your MO here.

Im sorry if you cant comprehend the discussion point. You should refrain from taking part if the discussion is above your comprehension.

You have taken the conversation so far off point you don’t even know what it was anymore. Not that it mattered to you to begin with….

STOP THE PRESSES – Harry and I are in agreement! Actually, thats happened a few times lately. What the heck is going on? ;-)

I’ve joined the dark side TUP :D

So CBS has not come up with a way for people to watch their streaming service on their TV’s? Doesn’t sound very progressive to me. If that is the case it seems like it is CBS’s streaming service that will crash and burn. Other streaming services provide a means to watch their streaming content on your TV. If CBS won’t even provide THAT they are doomed before they even start.


When I don’t want to watch streaming video on my laptop’s screen, I just plug an HDMI cable into its HDMI output port and plug that into one of my HD TV’s HDMI input ports.

The old laptop even has an old computer display RGB output that my set supports and makes just as pretty pictures with it too.

Yeah, I’ve done that. But that presents a problem. I have yet to find a way for the image to fill my TV screen. I’ve tried and I’ve had friends who are a ton more tech savvy than me try. It just isn’t working. Maybe it’s the laptop. Maybe it’s the TV. But we can’t get it to look good.
If that worked I’m such a big Trek guy I might go through the major hassle of watching it that way. But even with that said, CBS shouldn’t require their customers go through such hassles.


If your manufacturer truly supports you, the reason you are having that problem is you need what I believe MS calls a monitor “driver” for your set’s screen. It’s mostly just a text readable “.INF” file that tells Windows the exact paticulars that your set’s display supports and how to switch them.

The whole thing is goofy though since HDMI, itself, is supposed to eliminate the need for that, but there’s all sorts of version mismatches, partial implementations, and down right stupidity in cost cutting.

For example. my VIZIO uses a standard computer montor display screen to cut costs in their parts. But those screens’ displays are slightly taller than the aspect ratio for a 1080 TV. So they fudge it, by slightly overscanning to fill the display that they are using and then lie to other HDMI devices that plug into them by reporting that “I’m a standard 1080 screen”. But when you plug in a computer, an overscanned screen is going to mean you won’t see your entire desktop so it turns that off internally when it detects a computer, but still 1080 lies to my computer which is why I ran into something like your problem.

The correct INF file tells windows “When you see this model it’s going to lie so ignore that and use this actual size for your display”.

I recall my friend suggesting some sort of driver but we failed to find one for that particular brand pairing. I suppose I could look more into it. I guess I will just for Trek. But I still think it absurd that CBS requires potential customers to go through all this. Thanks. You might have given me a little push.

Of course Moonves is going to say those things. He HAS to. What’s he going to tell investors? That the prospects are gloomy?
I still think this has DIVX written all over it.

My question is even if I subscribe (I still might, I have one friend interesting in partnering up and am working on another) will I be able to watch on my TELEVISION? I absolutely will not do it if I am forced to watch on my puny laptop or tablet or worst yet, my phone.

Get an Apple TV, Roku or something like that. This is not rocket science, these streaming services and the devices to use them on televisions have been around for some time now. There is also Google you could use to ask these perplexing questions and it will keep you from getting snarky responses like this one.

Hopefully CBSAA tanks, and they decide it is worth the investment to stream through Netflix. Yes, it is not much monye in isolation, but CBSAA content is pitiful compared to the alternatives. $6 here, $10 there, $8 there–it all adds up. Can’t justify a streaming service for one show when the alternatives (Netflix, Hulu, Amazon) are so much more “content rich”. Maybe if I were a single, diehard Trekkie I’d spring for it, but some of us have non-Trekkie husbands and wives to convince. CBSAA content makes for a weak rejoinder to a skeptical and/or frugal spouse.


The problem with the show tanking is that undoubtedly CBS will blame the Star Trek property for the tanking and NOT the delivery method. So if it does tank (and sadly I think this likely no matter how good or bad the show is) that is pretty much the end of a Trek series for quite a while.

If Trek doesnt deliver subs to CBSAA but does for Netflix, odds are CBS would simply license it to Netflix. Which would be good for ML31 unless his friend cancels his subscription.

TUP… Why do you think CBS will just give up on Trek like that? They may blame Trek but it is likely they will still wish to hold onto the property. Sounds like you are the one wishing for things there….

ML31 – the story was that CBS got the idea to produce new Trek because Netflix was wanting to license Trek to produce their own TV show due to the popularity of the series and films on their platform.

This gave CBS the idea, based on Netflix’s own numbers, that there was a market for, not only a new series, but one that people would be willing to stream. Hence the idea to use Star Trek to leverage All Access.

Really, the same idea they have with the Good Fight, to leverage a built in fan base to subscribe to watch a new series.

If Discovery sucks as a series then it probably dies altogether. If its popular on Netflix but not popular enough on ALL Access to keep CBS interested, one could presume Netflix would discuss bringing it to their US platform. Either way, CBS still makes money. The difference now is, they make money and are using Discovery to build ALL Access, essentially on Netflix’ dime. Very smart.

But… CBS already had their fledgling streaming service. They wanted a hot property to get it off the ground. They had that in Star Trek. We all know the story there. We all know the story there and the potential issues with how they are handling it.

The concept that Netflix would pick up Discovery if CBSAA crashes and burns is possible, but unlikely CBS would give up on their Trek property even if they think Trek was the reason why AA failed to deliver. It just doesn’t make sense. My guess is they will dump Trek (while still holding on to the property) but make other attempts to keep AA going.

The entire enterprise seems like a gamble on CBS’s part. They want to be the next HULU or Amazon Prime. But they are entering the market a tad too late.

Previous incarnations of Star Trek were syndicated, not aired on CBS Network. So the idea that CBS would rather kill Trek then let someone else license it is not wholly factual or reasonable. In fact, since they lic3nsed it to Netflix for International and licensed it to Bell in Canada, one would presume they are very open to licensing Star Trek.

And ofcourse they want Trek to boost their fledgling streaming service. THAT’S THE WHOLE POINT! Only now, at the end, do you understand.

I don’t want to pay for both the device I need to stream the service and pay for said streaming service as well. That makes the thing way too pricey. CBS needs to make announcement regarding the availability of their service. I’ve already googled it. They have yet to comment on how people will get it. Thus far, all they have said is it is a streaming service you subscribe to. OK, fine. So how can I get it to stream to my TV? Seems like if hey want more subscribers they might want to get the word out somehow, right?

“CBS All Access is available on all of your favorite streaming devices, including Roku, Apple TV, Chromecast, Amazon Fire TV, Android TV, PlayStation 4, and Xbox 360, Windows 10, as well as smart phones and tablets (iOS/Android). That means you can watch CBS on Roku and all of these other great devices.”

Tup… That is not helpful. I don’t have any of those attached to my TV. Why would I? I’m not a gamer and the TV providing ones are worthless. There is a Netflix app on my TV already and it works (as well as can be expected). Will there be a CBSAA app I can add to my TV somehow? CBS has been very silent on how to get their service.

Wow. I can’t believe how old and out of touch people on this forum sound. I bet many are still using their AOL accounts from 1994.

Curious Cadet,

Re:…bet many are still using their AOL accounts from 1994.

I only ever used their free minutes which disipated long ago, but while I used dialup as recently as this past January, I would be perplexed if you considered me out of touch merely because I know how to efficiently utilize it, even to his day.

I have a feeling ML is a little kid. He’s mentioned mooching off his friend’s netflix before. I bet his TV and Blu Ray are the ones in his parent’s living room.

You are just full of vile and bitterness, aren’t you TUP? No friends so you take it out on an internet board. I pity you.

@Ml31 – Many friends. Dont be angry because I criticized you fro mooching Netflix. many people do. I have friends that do. I pay for my own Netflix. Just like I pay for cable, HBO, Movie channel, etc. And I pay for a good internet package that allows me to stream Netflix without buffering in glorious HD.

Im not bitter. Just amused. And slightly exasperated that you are so dense. Honestly, myself and many others have tried to help you by clarifying for you and giving you advice and options. But you keep COMPLAINING about things that are not factual.

“Many friends.”

Sorry. Not creditable. You SAY that but your behavior and comments suggest otherwise.

“Im not bitter.”

Again, you SAY this yet all your posts suggest the opposite. They are just rife with bile. You go on believing that your hatred is actually helpful. It fits with your character.

@ML – the size of my friend circle is moot anyway. I’d rather have no friends and be educated then have a lot of friends and be an idiot. So if you have a lot of friends, good for you. Who cares?

The point remains that you provided a laundry list of complaints and issues that several people have attempted to resolve and you continue to ignore everyone and continue to make posts with the same complaints and issues that others have already resolved for you.

” the size of my friend circle is moot anyway. ”

Normally yes. But you make such things fair game when you rip on others for having friends that share with them. We can only assume that yours aren’t close enough to do that or you don’t have any. Sorry. This was your own making.

” have a lot of friends and be an idiot. ”

And you claim I’M the one who is insulting. Tsk tsk.

” you continue to ignore everyone and continue to make posts with the same complaints and issues that others have already resolved for you.”

I haven’t ignored anyone. Even people who should be ignored. But that is on me. No one has resolved any of the issues I brought forth. You SAY they did but there is no evidence of it. Partly because the issues I have brought up do not actually have solutions at the moment. But you go right on believing otherwise.

You’re the type of guy who goes to an All You Can Eat buffet but doesnt pay, just eats off his friend’s plate. And calls it “sharing”.

We went through this last year. Many people share their netflix. But its not the ideal. Netflix wants you to have your own. In essence its stealing because its getting a service for free. You get Netflix and you dont pay for it. That’s not “sharing”. It’s stealing.

Oh my Gawd!! You really want to go there AGAIN?!?!

If the all you could eat place was totally fine and even actively advertised and encouraged customers sharing there would be no problem. Netflix has actively encouraged people to share. They knew people do it and are totally fine with it… To a point. That is why there are account limits. Why do you want to dredge this up again? What was the point? You were wrong then and you are still wrong.

Why would you? To watch the show you claim to want to watch. What does being a gamer have to do with it? Many of these devices are just streaming devices and have nothing to do with video games. It’s amazing that those who love a sci-fi show about the future can’t seem to stomach the idea of embracing real world future tech. If a device that costs $20 and plugs into your tv is too hard to figure out, I’m sure your rabbit ears can still pick up an old I Love Lucy re-run if you stand on one foot while holding some aluminum foil.


Those devices did not deliver anything to me I wasn’t already getting in higher quality and cheaper cost and with more convenient options.

“What does being a gamer have to do with it?”

Because some of the devices that enable CBSAA are gaming consoles.

” It’s amazing that those who love a sci-fi show about the future can’t seem to stomach the idea of embracing real world future tech. ”

That makes no sense whatsoever. Sounds like you are just an angry individual who loves to poke fun at people who do not think the same things as you do.

@ML – you’re either a troll or the dumbest poster here in a long long time. I really cant tell. Maybe both.

You whine about the cost of a gaming console yet people here have told you very inexpensive options to stream CBSAA on your TV. You still whine and rip on CBS for not releasing discs, not having a TV app when you have no clue if either will be true. Because YOU just want to complain.

Nothing is free pal. Why can you pay for cable, blu rays and Netflix? But not CBSAA? If you dont want to, thats cool, but CBS is charging for their product. There is nothing wrong with that.

WWE created a streaming platform and I was annoyed because it wasnt available in Canada as a streaming option. Its on a Terrestrial TV channel. That has pros and cons. But I wanted it so I bought it and I pay every month. If I didnt want it, I wouldnt pay. But that would be MY choice, not WWE’s.

Grow up and accept that this is YOUR choice.

If your cable provider offered CBSAA as a terrestrial channel for $10 would you be happy??


You are undoubtedly the most arrogant and vile person I’ve ever interacted with on internet threads. It is no wonder you have no friends willing to share with you. In fact, it is not beyond the realm of possibility that you have any friends at all given how you react to people on line.

There are no “inexpensive” options. I’ve checked. I haven’t ripped CBS for not having discs. I have been wondering if they are going to even make them available. I was also hoping they make their service available to smart TV’s before DSC comes out. But your anger anger and vile will not allow you to see that.

I’ve said over and over it’s not the cost of CBSAA. It’s the format. I’ve said I would pay twice as much for a better format. No one but you has been crying about things not being free.

Funny… I always heard that Canadians were polite and nice….

@Ml – several people here have provided you with inexpensive options to watch CBSAA on your TV. If you actually bought your large smartTV and blu ray player and pay for cable etc then the $20-$30 for a device is not “amazingly expensive” like you claimed.

If you cannot afford that, thats cool. Im not judging. But as a business, CBS isnt obligated to make their programming available for everyone, even people who cant afford it. Thats just not the way it works.

You say its not about the money yet you complain about the price. So which is it, the cost to watch it or the quality of their stream which you have never seen?

TUP… No one has provided inexpensive options. Not one.

It is not about the money… Up to a point. That is one of those things that should be amazingly obvious to most reasonable individuals. Not to you, however.

So $30 for a one time purchase of a device to watch it on your TV isn’t inexpensive? For some people that wopuld legitimately be a lot of money. But you’ve repeatedly said money isnt an issue (even though you keep complaining about the price of things) and claim to have bought a large Smart TV, blu ray etc and pay a large cable bill.

When you bought cable, you needed a device to play it on, did you complain that the cable company made you buy a TV?

When you get discs sent to you, did you complain that they didnt include a disc player so you could watch them on your TV?

Was your Blu Ray player cheaper than a streaming device?

It’s all subjective. What is expensive to one is cheap to another. Sometimes it’s a matter of merit. What you are not getting is that there are people who see things differently that you do.

” (even though you keep complaining about the price of things)”

You know nothing about context. Here is a short lesson for you. On the surface and by itself $10 a month is not that big a deal. But is someone is already paying $14 for this, $8 for that, $12 for that thing over there and so on it could easily get to the point where yet ANOTHER $10 charge is just getting to be too much. It’s called dollaring someone to death. And that means, one dollar is not a big deal. But many one dollars then yes, it becomes a big deal. I cannot spoon feed you any simpler than that. Somehow I suspect you will still find a way to ignore or mistake what is being said here. Like this… “pay a large cable bill.” I NEVER said I pay a LARGE cable bill. That is you editorializing.

“When you bought cable, you needed a device to play it on, did you complain that the cable company made you buy a TV?…” etc…

All that stuff is irrelevant and has nothing to do with the my post. As you are want to do.

@ML – its absolutely relevant because you are complaining that CBS is in the wrong for “unscrupulously” deceiving the “true cost” of watching All Access by not including the cost of a device to view it.

So its relevant when I ask if you feel the same about other content providers and them not including the cost of a TV or device to view the content.

And ofcourse you dont answer because you cant. You’ve been defeated. A simple “thats a good point” would be nice and probably show some respect on your part. We’d appreciate that. Its okay to admit you’re wrong.

And again, in regards to price you’re the one who said “its not the cost, its the technology”. Now you say it IS the cost. And yet you say you’re waiting got a SmartTV app for CBSAA. Which is it?? Can you even keep your BS straight?

“So its relevant when I ask if you feel the same about other content providers and them not including the cost of a TV or device to view the content.”

No, it’s not. And I’ve explained why more than once in other posts. Go read them again. Not going to do it again.

” A simple “thats a good point” ”

I do that all the time. Did it an earlier post this morning in fact. But I only do so when I’ve been made aware of something that is, you know, a good point. Something you have never provided. Would be nice if you could learn to do that yourself…

” you’re the one who said “its not the cost, its the technology”. Now you say it IS the cost. ”

Once again, I explained it more than once. The 2nd time it was made even simpler. Again, I’m not going to repeat it here. Go and read the response again and come back when you can actually respond with something new to move things forward instead of repeating yourself endlessly.

ML you’re explanation was that people arent stupid enough to think they can access Netflix without internet or cable without a TV etc. But you seem to think its okay to assume you’re stupid enough to think you can get All Access for $10/month without needing a way to view it.

So are you saying you’re stupid? I think most people have the common sense that just as they know they need a Blu Ray player to view Blu Rays or an internet connection to watch Netflix, they also need a device to allow access to CBSAA. Either through their phone or Xbox or Fire stick or whatever.

You’re the only who seems enraged and flabberghasted by that. Which by your definition would make you stupid (I wouldnt call you that, thats your definition).

“But you seem to think its okay to assume you’re stupid enough to think you can get All Access for $10/month without needing a way to view it.”

And that was a new way to toss out your childish insult. Throw it in a sentence that further shows you do not understand what was said.

Again, both you and I have already agreed that the person who dishes out the insults is the one who cannot support their position. Good for you.

I dont know ML, why dont you email or tweet CBS and ask them? But here’s a clue, they PROBABLY are designing an app for smart TV’s.

” But here’s a clue, they PROBABLY are designing an app for smart TV’s.”

Maybe they are, maybe they aren’t. You don’t know. But of course, you are the all knowing so whatever you say is so is. (SMDH)

@Ml – just like you seem to know the streaming quality of All Access is so abhorrent even when other people have told you that isnt true.

Maybe you’re right, maybe they wont release Discovery on disc. But that defies common sense since EVERY FRIGGEN TREK SERIES is on disc. So use some common sense.

” just like you seem to know the streaming quality of All Access ”

Never commented on the streaming quality of All Access. I questioned the streaming quality of the tech in general. Why should All Access’s streaming tech be better than any other? Again, you are not making any sense and attributing comments to me I never made.

What you are forgetting is that no other Trek series was designed as a streaming only show. So who knows how CBS will treat it? Maybe they will still release the discs. Maybe not. Maybe they will only release them for sales. I don’t know and given the nature of this new format there is no way to really tell. Except for you.

ML, one thing I would suggest is that you make sure your Smart TV stays up to date with any software updates which come out for it. It may update itself automatically, or you may have to do it manually. If a new app like CBSAA is going to be included to the selection on your TV, that’s how it would get there.

Yes, Danpaine. That is a good suggestion and I have thought about it. I checked it a few days ago, in fact. It is set to automatically update and I specifically used the search function to see if a CBSAA app was available to it. No luck. I checked of one on my blu ray player as well. Same story. As of this moment it seems the only hope lies in CBS providing the app or hoping the discs will be available for rent.
It is currently frustrating but if CBS gets on the ball and takes care of business before the series airs maybe it will be OK.

You can’t get around purchasing a device to attach to your tv to get streaming content. The cheapest is the Amazon Fire Stick, $40 at

I get your struggle with this, but personally we ‘cut the cable cord’ two years ago and now stream everything, and I save at least $130 a month from when I was paying for cable. It’s worked out great for me – happy with the content from various services and the quality.

I love how people pay $100+ for cable service and also rent a cable box, but the idea of purchasing a $10 Chromecast device is too much for them.

Exactly Torch. I guess ML gets his cable for free magically on his TV screen. Sounds like he paid for a smart TV and a smart blu ray but draws the line at CBSAA. Thats fine if thats his line. Some people have smaller cable packages because their line is paying for every channel. Some people draw the line at paying for the movie channels or HBO.

This clown has been whining for a year about this. Because he mooches netflix discs off a friend’s account. If the $10 or whatever it is is too much for his budget (which is fine) he should cut one cable package and then he could afford it.

Or save the $10/month and buy the blu ray season later for the price of watching it on CBSAA. *rolls eyes*

People complaining about nothing. “WE want Star Trek!!! We Want Star Trek!!” “But we want Star Trek for free!! We want Star Trek for free!!”

” Sounds like he paid for a smart TV and a smart blu ray but draws the line at CBSAA.”

More evidence you are incapable of understanding. It’s not the cost, dude. It’s NOT the cost of CBSAA. It’s a the cruddy streaming tech combined with the fact that it is more than just the monthly fee.

I do not mooch off anyone’s account. You are just sad because no one outside the internet will even put up with your arrogance.

You are the one who keeps bringing up the cost… But Tup has never been known to let the facts get in the way of his mythology.

@ML31 – you can insult me if you want to since you continue to fail to comprehend the logic of this. Insults are what people resort to when they have failed. Im educating you. You’re insulting me.

Did you get your own Netflix account? Last year you admitted to using someone else’s.

If you dont mind the cost why do you keep whining about how you pay for everything else and wont pay for it?

You have zero clue about the quality of the stream and when other people here have told you they watch The Good Fight with no issues you ignore them and go back to complaining about the quality of a stream you’ve never seen.

Stop complaining about something when you have never seen it and have no idea about it.

There was no insult. Sorry you are so very sensitive that I can’t tell you you have been ignoring the facts and like to make up stuff. You have been churning out the insults for some time. Just look at your hate ridden posts and the time stamps.

You know as well as I that I have had my own Netflix account for a long time. You just like tweaking to get a response. Here it is.

For all I know they are watching on their phones. I’ve not had a problem streaming on my phone either. Obviously you do not care about how you are perceived. If you did you would have stopped responding ages ago. Every time you post you bury yourself even more.

Please keep doing it, though. You are not only funny to me but I’d wager to others as well.

Actually I believe the reply indicated they stream CBSAA on a firestick, presumably on their TV but if the quality of the stream was so important to you, you could ask them. I would think if you were concerned and someone said ‘hey I have this service’ you would inquire to educate yourself.

But the issue is you dont want answers. You want to be able to keep complaining about CBS as if they have personally offended you.

And again, you incorrectly state the technology isnt good enough when millions of people watch Netflix in glorious 4K. So if you have issues with streaming at your home, you should investigate why but rest assured it isnt Netflix’s fault.

“Actually I believe the reply indicated they stream CBSAA on a firestick, presumably on their TV but if the quality of the stream was so important to you, you could ask them.”

But I never asked anyone to tell me about the quality of their stream. It’s not something I need to hear from strangers on the internet. I can just stream myself and see for myself.

“But the issue is you dont want answers. ”

Yes. I wanted answers to questions and concerns I raised. Not to issues I never did.

“And again, you incorrectly state the technology isnt good enough when millions of people watch Netflix in glorious 4K.”

First, you have no idea how many actually subscribe to the 4K service. And I already addressed the issues with their 4K service. And it wasn’t something I ever brought up or was concerned with. I don’t have a 4K TV or 4K disc player or the equipment required to stream the 4K content. It’s all moot anyway. Also, I never blamed Netflix or any other provider for the shortcomings of streaming tech. It’s not THEIR fault. Yet you keep claiming I did. It’s odd…

@ML31 – so you come here and spout nonsense about how the streaming technology isnt good enough for you to watch All Access with quality video. Someone else tells you they do exactly that and the quality is good and you now say you dont care because you can check yourself…except you’ve already told everyone how bad it is even though you havent seen it and dont want to see it.

Bury your head back in the sand.


Some drunk in the corner bar could claim all sorts of things. Maybe he’s right, maybe not. But when he speaks about something I have personal knowledge and experience with his opinion is not necessary. For example, sorry I’m repeating but you are repeating the same drivel and my response will remain the same… And it’s a short response… You yourself admitted you do not know the difference between DVD and blu ray. So you will forgive me if I don’t take your word on the quality of streaming tech. Especially when my personal experience is otherwise.

Then why bother coming here and posting on a discussion forum if you’re not at all interested in the discussion? You just dont want to hear anything that is contrary to your idiocy.

Also you’re a hypocrit because you keep spouting the “DVD/Blu Ray” nonsense when you know its a lie. Although I am surprised you can spell DVD. Too bad semantics and common sense arent things you suibscribe to (or at least “share” with a friend who has them hahahahah)

“Also you’re a hypocrit because you keep spouting the “DVD/Blu Ray” nonsense when you know its a lie. ”

I know that you have continually confused the two. That is no lie.

“Although I am surprised you can spell DVD. ”

Leaning even heavier on the insults, dude. You really have nothing going for you, do you?

Okay @ML31 and @TUP. Time to break it up. You two have dominated the comments here all day with terrible behavior towards each other. Consider this a warning.

@Matt – point taken. I’ve tried to refrain…its frustrating especially when so many others have corrected this person too.

Again, I apologize to my fellow users for the clutter.

There is no logic in that reasoning. Just because I don’t want to hear someone go off on a topic I have no interest in does not mean I do not want to take part in a discussion of something I AM interested in.

“You just dont want to hear anything that is contrary to your idiocy.”

More personal attacks from you. How sad.

I can get around paying for a device. Netflix, Hulu and others have apps already on my TV as well as my blu ray player. Yet CBS is demanding you buy one? Seems rather short sighted to me. If I’m going to spend nearly $100 just to watch Discovery I should just wait and buy the discs.

I contemplated cutting the cord. But it just didn’t make economic sense. I don’t spend anywhere near $130 a month for cable. I get very good image and sound quality. And I DVR what I want to watch and watch things at my own convenience. Plus, I could not see my favorite sports events without cable currently. Thus far, there is no reason to cut that cord. I know a couple of people who have, though and they are fine with it. Great but it just isn’t worth it for me.

If cutting the cord isn’t right for you, than shut the eff up about Discovery. Move on, and stick to watching a thousand terrible cable shows, reality TV, cooking programs, and a dozen sports channels nobody needs.


You are making the foolish mistake that not cutting the cable cord means not wanting to enjoy any Trek series. News flash… The services that people replace “the cord” with are filled with the same trash you see on dozens of cable channels. Including cooking programs and sports channels nobody needs. The difference is, I do not pay NEARLY as much in keeping the cord as I would if I were to cut it. And I get sports that I actually enjoy, my home teams, tons of convenience and higher quality image and sound. You don’t value those things. Good for you. Doesn’t mean it’s OK to rip others apart for it.

@ML – CBS isnt demanding anything of you. They are creating a program and making it available. If you dont want to watch it, dont watch it.

Yes you should wait and buy the discs. And stop complaining about the same stupid thing every day.

Why would I buy something I have not seen yet?

Oh yeah… This is TUP. It’s what he would do so naturally anyone who wouldn’t is just a mooching crybaby.

@Ml31 – no, you’re a moocher because you admitted to using your friend’s Netflix account and then complained about the quality of the image and sound.

If you dont want to buy the discs, dont. What do you want CBS to do, give you a free preview? Maybe they will. Many streaming services do that. Why dont you save everyone from your garbage and wait til mid August and then come back here and let us know if any of your concerns have been assuaged.

“no, you’re a moocher because you admitted to using your friend’s Netflix account and then complained about the quality of the image and sound.”

Nope. Wrong again. I never said I mooched off of anyone. You made that up and are hoping if you repeat it often enough it will be true.

You could save the board from garbage by stopping your responses…. That would be a big help. You don’t contribute anything. You just repeat made up garbage over and over again.

Don’t most people already have laptops with HDMI out? You can simply use a website like LuckTV and watch it the next day and usually in HD. That’s how I watch Walking Dead, Game of Thrones and Star Wars Rebels and it works great. I get to spend my coffee money on, you know, coffee and watch shows for free.

Thanks for that tip, Harry. Checking into that this evening….:)

Careful Harry, you’re going to give ML another thing to whine about. How dare he be expected to have a laptop with HDMI. Why should HDMI even be a thing. It didnt use to be a thing so why should it be a thing now?

Maybe Moonves will send him a laptop.

Very happy you were able to cut the cord and save some money. I know two people who have cut their cord. I actually don’t pay nearly that much for my cable. (Hard to believe people pay over $100. The only way I would get to that level is if I added all the premium channels and got the highest service tier possible. I don’t buy those. Not worth it to me. I’m at the tier that gets me what I want and it’s not a bad price at all.

I checked into cutting the cord and found that if I wanted similar service via the internet that I get through cable it would actually cost me more than twice what I currently pay. Combine that with the iffy tech and I decided it’s just not time for it yet. I will do it when the cost becomes less and the quality is at least the same. That day will undoubtedly come. It’s just still a ways off.

I know I won’t pay CBS for Discovery but when it becomes available

via Amazon I’ll pay for what’s good and ditch the rest

Your mother must be very proud.

Is this TUP using another screen name?

@Ml31 – I believe accusing people of sock puppeting is against the rules. Knock it off.

I’m sorry… I had no idea you were the lord of the trek movie site…. Normally I don’t go near such things. But occasionally if the shoe fits….

@Ml31 if you’re stupid enough to believe Torchwood and I are the same person, you’re wasting everyone’s time. Grow up.

Not saying it is. Just saying it is certainly possible given what the two of you write here…. Your lack of reading comprehension fails you yet again.

I will buy the BR sets of Discovery, but I am far less likely to sign up for more than a month of streaming at a time to binge the eps

If even half of what I’ve heard, which consists of Moonves meddling and changing many things so that they don’t fit Star Trek canon, then I seriously doubt it.

I can’t believe CBS All Access has less than 4 million subscribers. I didn’t realize it was so effectively shunned after two and a half years. On the other hand I’m happy to know I’m in the majority.

I think CBS is missunderstanding the reason why they have such low numbers. Diversity is not a benefit when it comes to individual streaming services. Expecting everyone to keep track of multiple service and remember which apps have a new show each week gets more challenging and more irritating with every new service.

CBS should put their content on Hulu (or maybe Netflix) just like they put their content on Comcast, Uverse, and other cable services. I would be perfectly fine with a CBS add-on for Hulu like they have for Showtime, but I don’t really care to have separate apps. Especially if I have to pay extra for them only to get a poorer experience.

Well put, Jeff. And agreed as to the poorer experience you mentioned. All I’ve heard so far about CBSAA is sub-par reviews as far as streaming quality, ie. pausing, having to reboot a show in the middle…why am I going to pay for that when the quality of the rest of my streaming channels are so good? And I’m supposed to pay extra for a no-commercial version, all for the one show I want to see? I don’t think so. Ironically, the worst streaming quality of the ones I subscribe to is Showtime, who is…..owned by CBS!

HBO Now has 2 million subs and is considered a success and thats with much more popular original programming. In fact, what does CBSAA offer as far as original programming? Three weeks of The Good Fight?

CBSAA is effectively brand new as far as offering original programming.

Do a little research into streaming platforms.

WWE Network has less than 2 million subs. HBO Now as 2 million. If CBSAA gets to 4 million, its a rousing success and a game changer for them at that price point.

I’ve done the research, TUP, through years of subscribing to them. HBO Now is an excellent platform, well worth the $14.99, with a literal ton of original acclaimed commercial-free programming, movies, documentaries and more. All with excellent viewing quality. What CBSAA is offering from the get-go is shoddy service (so I’ve read) and a very limited programming list (unless you find all-you-can-eat I Love Lucy compelling). And for commercial-free, $10 a month? New Trek or not, no thank you. Like I said earlier, there will be other ways to watch Discovery.

…and I find it hard to believe that people here actually think Netflix is free. I mean, maybe some really do, but what’s more likely is they’ve been paying that $10 a month for so long, they now consider it ‘free.’ So if Discovery were aired in the U.S. on Netflix, (as I believe it should be, or on CBS-owned Showtime) it would be deemed ‘free’ because it would be included in something they were already paying for.

Netflix and Hulu aren’t considered free, but any new show that is added to them is almost like a bonus to your pre-established viewing habits. It’s same with a cable subscription. Any new show or channel seems like a freebie because it’s included in what you were already paying for.

Another thing that kind of annoys me about CBS’s intentions here is almost everything on their network is not science fiction programming. So trying to use Star Trek to establish their online platform is almost like trying to launch a subscription platform using an everyday cop drama. It’s just not going to be that appealing. You subscribe for $10/mo because you like cop dramas then you have nothing else you really want to see on Likewise with CBSAA. Pay $10/mo for Star Trek then what else? It’s not like CBSAA is a daily or semi-weekly destination for me. Meanwhile they’ve already admitted they aren’t opposed to using alternative platforms like Netflix.

If they really wanted to draw the numbers to CBSAA they should move NCIS over to run exclusively there. I hear that show is super popular even after 13 seasons. Although that still wouldn’t be attractive to me, I imagine it would get their numbers up.

Or else it would just piss everyone off because they now had to subscribe to CBSAA for a single show while everything else is free OTA or with their other existing subscriptions.

@Jeff – All Access isnt genre specific though. Its not CBS Sci Fi Access. They have The Good Fight, they will have Star Trek. They are trying to draw from various demos.

Its smart. I havent heard Good Wife fans whine about this. One can suspect Good Wife got to the point where ratings softened but were still strong enough to indicate a loyal core audience. So CBS leveraged that to help boost CBSAA subs which, according to them, has been successful.

As someone who gets The Good Fight on terrestrial TV, I love the switch because the show is not subject to ratings of network TV. The creativity of the writers are not a slave to TV ratings boards.

@Danpaine – exactly. The root of the anger is that people are so used to paying for Netlfix that they consider new programming to be “free”. if HBO launched tomorrow and asked for $15 a month through your cable provider, some people would lose their minds that they cant get the “new channel for free”.

TUP – yup, agreed. And as other people have said, this technology is in its infancy, basically. Once more people cut the cord and cable goes the way of the dinosaur, the innovations which are going to be out there and viewing choices we are going get to make are going to render this whole thread useless. These companies are all brainstorming and scrambling, trying to figure out how to keep their products relevant and cheap enough for the consumer. Interesting times. The whole CBSAA thing has just really rubbed me the wrong way for some reason, though.

It seems rough now because there are people paying for both Cable and Streaming. But everything is going to be OTT eventually. Probably you’re going to not need cable at all and will simply watch TV like normal, but over the internet.

A pricing model will be made to combine multiple streaming services for one price. Or perhaps it will be $3-$4 for a channel. Or, for example, Viacom packages all their services together for one monthly price.

So eventually you end up with something similar to a cable package but for streaming and with likely greater choice and customization, with more on-demand and “anytime” viewing.

Careful Danpaine…

If you disagree with TUP he will just cry and moan and make childish put downs. Everyone has to think like he does and accept his “facts” as reality. But then, you know all this if you read his posts….

@ML31 – no kid, you’re projecting again. You’re the one whining and crying here about the SAME thing day after day. MANY people here have helped you understand, helped answer your questions and concerns and you keep whining about the same thing.

And MANY people have told you to get lost if you cant stop whining. Dont get mad at me because you cant comprehend the simplicity of this situation.

And thank you for reading my posts. Its really in your best interests to do so anyway.

“no kid, you’re projecting again. You’re the one whining and crying here about the SAME thing day after day. MANY people here have helped you understand, helped answer your questions and concerns and you keep whining about the same thing.”

LOLOLOL!!! Yes… You have returned to the “I know you are but what am I” argument. The irony of the above post of yours is wonderfully entertaining. And you also repeated the same old garbage you always have. It’s no more true or relevant the 8th time than it was the first.

I know you are turning on your blinders and will make up your own reasons but I read your posts for the entertainment value. It’s amusing to see you squirm and get angry and throw down your insults.

@Danpaine – I understand you’re perspective. But Netflix wasnt as good today when it debuted. HBO Now wasnt either.

In fact, HBO Now launched years after HBO had built a great library. So if CBS had decided they would air Trek on the CBS Network for a few years and then move it to All Access we wouldnt be discussing this because Discovery wouldnt exist because it wouldnt be successful on CBS.

So be thankful CBS found a model that allows them to invest heavily in a new Trek series.

Either pay for it or dont. If its worth paying for, great. if it’s not, thats cool. Thats YOUR decision though. And has nothing to do with CBS.

Sorry, but Trek belongs on network television. I refuse to pay for more streaming or cable services to watch it. It is heartbreaking though because I have been a fan since day one, 1966. Yes I am an old fart.


It is indeed sad that CBS is making their product available to as few people as possible. I, too would rather see the show on network television. That would be my first preference. But I would take a pay per view availability over the format CBS is currently using. Even if someone wanted to pay for the low quality stream unless they already have forked out the money to already amazingly pricy add ons like Apple TV, Chromecast and the like you cannot get it.

One can only hope that CBS in the coming months will at least make their product more available. After all, they originally did not offer a commercial free version and later did. Maybe they will soon make the show available on Smart TV’s before Discovery shows up.

No, ML you want to see the show for free. Do you pay other bills? If you want to watch Netflix, you pay for it (or steal it from a friend). If you want to watch cable, you pay for it. If you want to eat, you buy food. If you want to drive, you buy a car.

If you want to watch Discovery, you will pay for CBSAA or wait til its on Disc (and/or Netflix) or steal it.

Why is CBS the bad guy? Is HBO the bad guy for not releasing Game of Thrones on network TV? Is AMC the bad guy keeping The Walking Dead on cable? Is Netflix the bad guy for not giving away OITNB?

Im not sure if you have a mental block that precludes you from seeing that you’re whining about an issue that is about YOU not wanting to PAY for a product being CREATED by a BUSINESS.

Do you go to Walmart and complain when they expect you to pay for the underwear you really want?

All of the above are good points, TUP. I am a little pissed about AMC being so rigid about their content (which I buy per show through Apple TV). You can see it if you pay for Sling. Other than that though, when I heard that Netflix was distributing Discovery in every country other than the U.S., that sent me through the roof. So only we here in the U.S. are the suckers who are supposed to pay for an entire new platform to see the one show we’re interesting in on it? Sorry CBS, that smacks of greed, pure and simple. Sad to say, Discovery will be the first show I’ll be watching ‘off the beaten path,’ if you will.

@Danpine – no it smacks of smarts. Are you suggesting that CBS should not air Star Trek Discovery anywhere but the US? Because they made the deal with Netflix because they dont have All Access all over the world, but Netflix does.

This is similar to WWE who launched their own Network in the US that featured their monthly Pay Per View events. If you lived in a country that didnt get WWENetwork, they still made the PPV available to you. But as more countries became Network available, the cable companies droppped their PPV’s.

CBS is building a business. If you owned a lemonaide stand and had the best lemons in town, would you let the local 7/11 use your lemons too just so more people could taste them? Or would you want them to come to your stand and buy your lemonaide?

Its business. Too many people dont get it. It might inconvenience you but its business. And if you were Moonves you’d do the same thing.

…or, alternatively, the way I see it, it’s taking advantage. CBS is an established brand, who are already in league with Netflix. And, they own Showtime, which is premium. They could release it on Netflix or Showtime here in the U.S., (I think) to a much better reception, and still make money. But clearly, not Enough money for them.

No, in no way am I suggesting Discovery should be limited to the U.S. That would make no sense.

I just wish they would sell the show on Apple TV (ITunes), at least. I would buy the season and be done with it. That’s what AMC and FX do, and it works out just fine. And you can keep it forever. Commercial free.

Yeah.. There are a lot of different ways CBS could expand their audience. Yet they don’t.

One way they could expand their audience is to create a streaming service and put exclusive original content on it. They could also air that content’s premiere on their main Network.

Someone should suggest that to them…oh wait.

They could make that streaming service to be, oh I don’t know, easily accessible to potential customers?

They could make it easy to access thats true. Maybe they should beam it out into the Universe using invisible and magical technology that allows anyone with an internet connection to mysteriously and easily make it appear on their TV.

How much easier do you want it to be??? Should Moonves recite the script to you over Skype? Oh sorry, that technology isnt very good yet.

It literally cant get any easier. You need a cable sub and cable box and TV to watch cable. You need a TV, a disc player and a disc to watch DVD’s/Blu Rays. You need an internet connection, a device to play it and a TV to watch Netflix.

How much easier can CBS make it for you. You can watch the damn show ANYWHERE with an internet connection. It doesnt get any easier.

“How much easier do you want it to be??? ”

Oh… How about as easy as nearly every other streaming service? You should see the apps that are available on my TV. 3/4 of them are services I’ve never even heard of.

And yes… It literally COULD be easier. They could make it even easier still if they expand beyond the realm of streaming only. But their goal is to grow their streaming service and expanding it to reach more people in other ways isn’t going to do that.

So your problem is that I prefer to watch TV on my TV. Wow… Imagine that….

Streaming is easier then putting it on a cable channel not everyone yes. Streaming is accessible to anyone with an internet connection.

There is nothing stopping you from watching CBSAA on your TV like other people. You just dont want to.

You accuse CBS of being immoral and yet you admit to using Netflix’ service without paying for it.

“Streaming is easier then putting it on a cable channel not everyone yes. ”

That is wholeheartedly not true.

“Streaming is accessible to anyone with an internet connection.”

That, however, is. But streaming to your TV… Some services make that more difficult than others.

“yet you admit to using Netflix’ service without paying for it.”

How can I ever admit to something that is not true?

You’ve repeatedly said your friend has a sub that you use.

Streaming is easier for the source broadcastor. its really easier for the end user too for the most part and if all things are equal. For example, if you have an empty room. You need a TV, Power, Cable, Cable Box, to watch the network TV. For streaming you just need a device…you dont even need the room.

That’s true. They could leverage Showtime to create a streaming service, much like HBO and air Discovery on Showtime. Although, let’s be honest, if they aired Discovery on Showtime, there would still be a million complaints about it airing on a premium channel that costs X amount of money.

Many networks and studios are behind the times. Netflix is Netflix because they had a vision and beat everyone (I HIGHLY recommend the book Netflixed which tells the story of the rise of Netflix and the fall of Blockbuster, including the revelation that Netflix tried to sell to Blockbuster for a song and BB declined – ha!)

HBO is taking a slower approach because their channel is successful so their streaming service is more of a support option. its sort of a safety net to catch those HBO fans that are cutting cable.

I think CBS wants to juice their streaming game. Rather then sort of support it, sort of grow slowly, they are implementing a plan they think will boost All Access quickly and “catch up”. I dont know if it will work.

But realistically, if CBS wasnt committed to trying to juice All Access, we probably wouldn’t have Discovery or The Good Fight or whatever other shows CBS is willing to fund to be cornerstones of AA. The streaming subscriber model changes the business. Its not just about how many eyeballs watch a specific show, its about over-all content.

So even if Discovery isnt that popular, its not about the “ratings” for Discovery needing to be a certain threshold to ensure viability because even if no one watches, its content filling time that, as a package, makes the service more marketable.

Showtime does have a streaming service (unoriginally named simply “Showtime” for some reason), very similar to HBO Now in format. It’s $11.99 a month, but the streaming quality is not quite up to par compared to what HBO offers. I am going to look into that book you mentioned about Netflix and BB – thanks – heard Blockbuster really dropped the ball there.

@TUP. For me it’s not that they want to charge for Star Trek, it’s that they are essentially wanting to charge extra while segregating it away from everything else. Making it both inconvenient and clunky.

So it would be like Hanes or Fruit of the Loom underwear pulling their products from Walmart to open an exclusive outlet store. Instead of going to their store I would probably just find a replacement at Walmart.

I think what CBS really should do is offer a free access plan with embedded commercials, then have a paid no-commercial option. I currently watch the CW app (which is annoying that they pulled from Hulu), but it’s free and they also have 5 shows I watch regularly. CBSAA has 3 shows I already like (Scorpion, Bull, and maybe MacGyver) but I already get them for free OTA (or included with a cable subscription) but now they want me to pay extra just for Star Trek.

@Jeff – using your example, if Hanes wanted to be in the clothing store business and saw that there was a loyal customer base who would go to specific stores for their merchandise, they would pull their underwear to feature as exclusives at their own store.

This is exactly the same as HBO airing GoT on their channel. Or Netflix airing OINTB on theirs. They dont also let competitors air it at the same time.

I realise that the consternation is that most people dont have CBSAA. But thats exactly why CBS is doing this. And its not like it’s the cost of HBO. And its not like it’s difficult to get. Its a matter of choice and its easy.

If fans want to watch it (which CBS is banking on), they will subscribe to AA for it.

CBS is gambling, for sure, and being aggresive about it. Whereas HBO Now features content available on HBO, CBS isnt just loading AA with CBS programs. They are creating exclusives to generate interest.

Whereas HBO Now as 2 million subs and is considered a success, CBSAA wants 4 million subs. HBO Now is to give customers a choice, that if they want to cut the cable cord they can still get HBO. CBSAA is that but also featuring more attractive options – original content.

Think of this way, if there was no CBSAA, there might not be a new Star Trek series at all. The investment in All Access makes CBS want to invest in a new series and it will make them patient with sub numbers too.


If I could get it for free that would be fantastic. Who wouldn’t want it? But that is not the reality. Maybe it is for you because for all we know you are a 12 year old having his parents give him everything. But that is not the way the real world works.

This is just too funny. You realize that no one could possibly be taking you seriously anymore? Nearly every response you make you get everything so amazingly wrong it cannot be natural. You have got to be a troll just stirring up trouble. No one could be that dense. I’m actually giving you the benefit of the doubt here…

@ML31 – I think you’ve exposed yourself. You’re a kid living with his parents right? Take out the garbage, mow the lawn and maybe they will buy you CBSAA.


LOL!!!! And now you pulled the “I know you are but what am I card!”

You are too funny and predictable. Thank you for the laugh!

@ML31 said, “forked out the money to already amazingly pricy add ons like Apple TV, Chromecast and the like”

A Chromecast is not really that pricey at $35 each. Neither are an Amazon Fire TV Stick or Roku Express Stick.

I looked at their prices. All but one were amazingly expensive. One, and sorry I forgot with one, didn’t even list their price. When they do that it normally means it’s way too high.

And besides… CBS has been advertising their service only costs 7 or 10 bucks a month. They don’t tell you that you need to buy an expensive add on for their service to work.

Again, we can only hope they are working on getting their service on a smart TV to reach more subscribers. Just makes business sense….

@ML30, when your cable company advertises their cost do they include the fact you need a TV? They might mention you need to buy a cable box (in small print). Do you rant and rave about that?

You claim you own a large smart TV and Blu Ray Player and Netflix account (which you previously admitted you didnt, you mooched off your friend). But you are whining about paying $20 or $30 for a device to watch CBSAA? And you call it amazingly expensive?

Let me ask you, you live with your parents right? And they paid for the TV and cable, right? Because it makes no sense you’d be this enraged over a few dollars if you bought that big TV and pay that big cable bill every month.

But the end result is the same – stop whining. Pay for CBSAA (including a device to watch it on your TV just like you do with your cable) or STFU about it. Its YOUR problem, not CBS’s.

TUP… I know you think no one is as smart as you. But you have to realize that we know you need a TV to actually watch… TV. Or in your case, you just need a phone and mommy and daddy paying for your streaming.

I don’t know if I should encourage you to keep posting just for the laughs or encourage you to take your own advice and “STFU” about things you have no idea about. I think I’d rather you continue to state the amazingly obvious as if it is some revelation no one else has ever considered. And please…. Keep acting like you are understanding the posts you are responding to. I can’t be the only person who is enjoying your ineptness.

I continue to be amazed at all the pissing and moaning about the price of All Access Service.
A “Costa Lotta Latte” at Starbucks is $6.00 to basically “rent” for twenty minutes or so.
Do that 20 times a month and that’s $120.00 on coffee.
Give up one or two and subscribe to All Access.
Become a paying customer (shareholder) and then you can complain or pushback about the quality of the episodes.They’ll make them better, and (gasp!) maybe make more Star Trek. If you’re pirating the show from torrents or Kodi software, you’ve got no business complaining about the show.
I’ve subscribed to ALL Access in USA and Space Network in Canada.
Get a grip, folks.

@dennycranium, Agreed. People, just give up a couple of candy bars a month. You might even lose a few pounds – call it the Star Trek Discovery Diet.

I agree today as we continue to cut cords and stream we do have more options with pay as you go so to speak with how we want to watch our shows. First it was pay per view that next became on demand next we had apps on apart phones that let us stream and soon we have Netflix and Hulu and Roku boxes and the like. So why would a network not want to make more shows for online. However there are people who still like tradition and they too deserve choices. So I wonder if CBS and Netflix could just put Star Trek on the cw and Netflix it soon after if the all access doesn’t work as they want it to.

It’s not the cost. But the delivery method. But the cost is more than just the 10 bucks or so they advertise. You also currently MUST buy a gaming console of some streaming add on just to get it. So it is in reality far more than the subscription price.

@ML31 – I agree. And shame on those cable providers who make me HAVE to buy a TV to watch. Its ridiculous. They should include a FREE TV so I can watch.

Also, have you inquired to CBS about whether they will have an app for SmartTV’s? Perhaps they will. But then you’d have to have a smart TV. Oh well.

Everything in Canada must be free, right? Must be nice.

@ML31 are you dense? Im not the one whining. I pay for my cable, my movie channels, my Netflix, my TV, my Blu Ray Player, My Blu Rays.

I pay for a teir of cable that will allow me to watch Discovery. If my cable package didnt include Space Channel, I wouldnt come on here and post the same idiotic complaint every day for a year. I’d call my cable company and add the channel. If I didnt want to pay for it, I wouldnt.

Just like I wanted to buy an Escalade but didnt want to pay for it. So I bought a Jeep instead. But I didnt complain on the internet that Cadillac should be giving me an Escalade for the price of a Jeep.

Tup… Dude… You are indeed the one whining. You are doing it in nearly every post you make. “He’s mooching off his friend” “He is whining about the cost” “I know you are but what am I?” “I know more than all you fools so listen to me” “I bought a car”.

It’s either you whining, complaining, being arrogant to telling everyone else how much better you are than all of them. You are a true piece of work….

@Ml31 – again, you fail to grasp the obvious. Im pointing out why you’re wrong. And many others have as well. You ignore everyone who has corrected you and keep posting the same remarks and complaints. That’s whining.

Oh! My bad. Forgive me for thinking when you tell me I am stealing what you are really doing is helping me understand. And forgive me for thinking you are being arrogant when you tell me how smart you are and how everyone else is dumb that you are really correcting all the myriad of errors I have made.

How could I have ever possibly come to the conclusions I have?

You’re the one that admitted last year to using your friend’s Netflix.

You are the one who decided that when done legally sharing is the same as stealing.

So you admit that you dont actually pay Netflix for their content?

I admit to having my own netflix account and that I have a friend who shares her streaming with me.

Maybe thats why your streaming sucks.

Does this mean you no longer see sharing as the same as stealing?

Is your friend licensed by Netflix to provide you with their services? No. So its stealing. The fact Netflix doesn’t crack down doesn’t change it.

Is this what you have resorted to? Resurrecting your tired “sharing is stealing” argument?


Are you resurrecting your tired “stealing is sharing” argument? Stop bringing it up and stop complaining about a service you dont pay for.

@Denny – Im with you. The whining is unbelievable especially from the morons who dont know what they’re talking about.

You’ve got people complaining that they have to pay for CBSAA instead of getting it for free on Netflix. Ummm, Netflix isnt free.

Can you imagine if it aired on HBO? And people had to pay $15 or whatever it is for HBO? lol

I actually am hoping that Star Trek fans in the US draw the line and realize a rip off when they see it. I want to watch this show, but I am not adding another streaming service just for one show, even one I would like to see. What tops it off is that the show is available on Netflix everywhere else in the world.

To treat the American audience like that makes it clear they just feel that anything Star Trek will get sucker fans to buy in and they just want our money. No thanks.

This US fan is doing just that. There are other ways to see it.

You do realise Netflix isn’t free right?

The state of these comments…

Wow! You mean to say the bill that clearly comes on my credit card for Netflix means it’s not free?

Did anyone say that Netflix was not free? But Netflix is also gigantic and millions of people have it. Netflix isn’t asking us to buy a new streaming service for one show, and haven’t taken such a major franchise to milk an audience, while offering the same show to the rest of the world on the most used service.

The state of these comments…

You guys both fail to grasp simple logic. Netflix is a business. CBS is a business. Look, you might wish 7/11 sold your Walmart brand underwear but it doesnt. Two separate businesses.

If you want to watch Discovery when it airs, you have to pay the company providing it. Just like you pay Netflix for content they provide.

Do you understand now?

In other countries, CBS is using Netflix. They are discriminating against Americans, trying to find suckers to pay an extra $10 a month just for one show. It shows exactly what they think of Star Trek fans. Not all of us are that gullible, and many of us have the ability to find alternative means of watching the show that will not cost us a penny.

CBS is a business, and part of business is good will. They lose a lot of good will when they come off this greedy. And given that not all Star Trek fans are suckers who will waste their money on their service, they are losing audience that they would have if they had Netflix license the show from them, which again, they are doing all over the world.

Do you understand now?

You are completly wrong. Discriminating??? My God…the nuts have truly gone off the deep end.

Netflix is paying CBS to air Discovery internationally, presumably because All Access isnt available internationally. Its no different then if they negotiated separate licensing rights with individual channels all over the world. You wouldnt whine if they posted a list of 500 various channels it was airing on all over the world because airing on TV makes sense to you.

But they got a better deal to go exclusive with netflix. A deal that allows them to produce the series.

So its akin to airing on Channel 5 in the US, Channel 6 in Canada, Channel 10 in UK, Channel 9 in Germany. But it’s Netflix internationally, Space in Canada and All Access in the US.

You still have to make the choice to pay for it. Whether thats paying for cable which includes the channel, paying for netflix which includes the series or paying for All Access.

There is no difference here. Those people that already subscribed to All Access are thrilled, no doubt. Are they second class compared to those with Netflix?

Relax BringbackKirk.

TUP doesn’t like it when you question his authority. Let him rant. He feels better about himself when he does. He has a hard time grasping simple concepts.

And once again the intent of the post you are responding to goes a million miles over your head….

Why would they? I have streaming subscriptions to Netflix, Hulu, Amazon, HBO, CBS Acess and if rumors are accurate, soon I’ll have an Apple streaming video subscription. They all have specific unique programming I want to see, and it all costs me less than what I was paying for cable or satellite with hundreds of channels I wasn’t interested in.

If it’s too much trouble for you to pay for entertainment you want to see, then don’t do it. But for people who live in the 21st century and value an entertainment choice, paying for what we want is not a problem, including buying the equipment we need to access the services. I had DirecTV in 1995. I had to buy not only a subscription, with seperate optional services,, but a receiver and a satellite dish as well as install it. I also paid for an Internet connection, through which I paid subscriptions for various services, and I had a VHS deck and a DVD player. Now, I have an Apple TV, which allows me to stream virtually any service from any Apple device, with virtually no installation and costs me far less for the entertainment I want, on demand, when I want it. Add to that, sometimes I buy a TV series package from iTunes, because I don’t have access to some cable channels yet, so instead I pay to download a series I want to see, rather than wait a year for it to show up on Netflix. There has never been more choice or ability to watch whatever a person wants, thanks to IP owners and distributors offering their programming directly to the consumer.

Would I be happier if CBS just offered me on-demand streaming of a brand new expensive show I’m interested in via a cheap Netflix subscription I already have? Sure. But I also have no problem paying for it and signing up for another “channel”/app subscription. In many respects this is no different than having a DirecTV or Cable subscription, with a basic package and calling up and paying extra to add HBO because there’s a show being advertised I want to see. The only difference is its not just a channel added to the hundreds I already have, it’s a separate app that I switch between on a digital device, just as easily as flipping channels on a box. And a seperate charge on my credit card, instead of adding it to my bill. Of course anybody living in the 21st century is already used to this with digital purchases to iTunes, among others. PayPal, ApplePay, Android Pay, Starbucks cards, WalMart Pay, Uber, the list is endless. The world has changed, and CBS is well aware of what it’s planning and who their new audience will be. It’s a brave new world out there, and any old Trek fans boycotting a streaming app are living in the past, and will be left behind.

That’s a choice you are making, and it’s completely your right to do so. If you want to spend money for one show, that’s fine. I choose not to do so and recognize the money grab. It’s kind of like how they charge $80 for Star Trek DVDs when other shows of the same era charge $20. This is what they think of Star Trek fans.

Star Trek’s quality hasn’t exactly been that great in recent decades either, so no, I won’t be paying for the service. Doesn’t mean I won’t be able to watch the show, but I won’t be paying for CBS’ streaming.

It’s not a money grab unless you consider any company that creates a product and sells it to be a “money grab”. Expecting it for free is a “content grab”.

Curious Cadet explained it wonderfully. Its EASIER now to get this new content via this “new” method of delivery then it was in the past when you needed dishes, cable boxes, VCR’s, DVD Players, etc. What’s the difference?

All those people wishing it was on Netflix is because you already have Netflix so getting it is essentially free to you. If Netflix was a new thing and you didnt have it, you’d be outraged at having to get Netflix.

But yes, Cadet makes his choice. You make yours. But dont blame CBS. Its not their fault you dont want to pay for their programming (other then the idea they havent created programming worth paying for).

The production has been riddled with problems according to a lot of reports you can find on line. Whether or not those issues will get worked out before the premiere, it’s obvious that no one knows what they’re doing there and, at this point, that’s a bit sad considering how long this thing has been in the works. This missed the 50th anniversary date and now have been delayed two additional times.
Not sure how anyone can see this as promising.
And regarding CBS All Access, once again, U.S. audiences are getting the shaft compared to other countries. They’ll get a whole season dumped to netflix at once with no commercials on a platform they already pay for. We get one at a time, full of commercials and have to pay for yet another platform. Feel free to spin this as a positive if you can.

I dont believe you’re accurate. The series on Netflix will air weekly just as it does on CBSAA.

Also, your other arguments are idiotic. You’re complaining that you have to pay to watch on CBSAA whereas other places will “get” to watch it…on a platform they are paying for. So what’s the problem? Not everyone has Netflix. You’re free to pay for Netflix or CBSAA. No one is holding a gun to your head.

Also, I believe CBSAA has a non-commercial option.

You’ll be horrified to learn that us Canadians wont even have to pay for a streaming service at all. We’ll get it on a terrestrial channel. But darn it, there will be commercials. Whatever shall we do?

TUP, I thought “us Canadians” were going to get STD on Crave… No?

I heard both. Crave and Space. So I dont know which is true. Is it Space for the premiere and Crave after?

Wait, found it:
The first episode will premiere on Canada’s most watched broadcast network, CTV, on the same night as CBS. All remaining episodes will initially be televised on Bell Media’s cable networks, Space (in English) and Z (in French), and then later exclusively on CraveTV™, Bell Media’s streaming video-on-demand service.

Also, it airs day & date with the US version. Bell also claims exclusive rights to the library. Im curious if that means Netflix Canada will have to pull the Trek library in Canada? But I could be reading it wrong…it might mean exclusive rights to air Discovery and just further rights to the library.

Thanks, TUP.

…yet another reason I’d like to move to Canada these days…

CBS are you listening?
This whole streaming stuff is stupid!
You care nothing for the real fans!

if CBS really cared, they’d send every REAL fan the entire series on Blu Ray right now! FOR FREE!

Damn straight

I won’t pay to watch Star Trek.

Rumors in the Star Trek Fan world fear Les Moonves is screwing up Discovery with Sex, Drugs, and Rock and Roll. Not happy at all after hearing of great people behind the creativity are all leaving. I remember after John Kluge sold to Murdock some shows I liked were cancelled, I was still working for Kluge but we shared a building with the Murdock people. I asked why a certain show was cancelled because it had a great following. His answer was someone high up mucked with the show so much it got lost for a short period and before they realized how big the fan base was they had destroyed all of the sets and released actors from their contracts, OOPS. That is what is going to happen to Discovery if Moonves keeps mucking with it.

Murdock and Moonves aren’t the same, fox and CBS couldn’t be more different.

CBS AA just renewed “The Good Fight” for a second season.

That’s weird. Because no one watches All Access and the technology of streaming is awful. Lots of people must like staring at buffering static.

I haven’t had a problem with the streaming. And it already has 1.5-2 Million subscribers.

Dont tell that to ML – he thinks streaming technology hasnt been invented yet.

Jokes aside, I dont watch the streaming service as Im Canadian but everything I’ve heard is that the service is strong….and if you have an internet connection from this century you should be good to go.

If its closing in on 2 million subs, its already at HBO Now levels which is very good.

Lol. Yeah, 2 million is definitely decent. That would be at least $144 million a year at this point. Considering they don’t have to pay any license fees for content (since it’s pretty much all CBS owned), they would conceivably be profitable, if even just a little. Since the Netflix license fee is covering the production of Discovery, they probably aren’t paying significant amounts in production costs yet. Good Fight may cost a decent amount because of the talent involved, but Big Brother probably didn’t.

And I’d imagine they will syndicate The Good Fight as The Good Wife was pretty popular.