PODCAST: All Access/Shuttle Pod Live From STLV 2023 – The State Of Star Trek Panel

This is a special live joint podcast from the 57-Year Mission convention, recorded on Thursday, August 3rd. At Star Trek Las Vegas the two TrekMovie podcasting teams got together for a “State of Star Trek” panel to discuss what’s going on with the franchise and where things are going, especially in light of the WGA and SAG-AFTRA strikes along with changes in content strategy at Paramount+. The panel was comprised of the All Access Star Trek duo of Anthony Pascale and Laurie Ulster joined by The Shuttle Pod‘s Kayla Iacovino, Brian Drew, and Matt Wright. The panelists offered their thoughts on Star Trek in 2023 and also took questions and comments from the crowd.

The TrekMovie podcasters panel were accompanied by slides, although we weren’t able to get all the way through it due to time, the complete set of slides is available below to follow along with the podcast. [Click any image below to zoom in and scroll through slideshow]

Let us know what you think of the episode in the comments, and should you be so inclined, please review us on Apple.

Subscribe to our podcasts

The All Access Star Trek podcast has joined the long-running Shuttle Pod as part of the TrekMovie.com Podcast Network. If you already subscribe to The Shuttle Pod, your subscription will now include both shows from the TrekMovie Network. If you prefer, you can sign up for only the Shuttle Pod or All Access Star Trek using the links below.

TrekMovie.com Podcast Network of Shows
TrekMovie.com Podcast Network All TrekMovie.com podcasts Apple PodcastsGoogle PodcastsSpotifyPocket CastsStitcher
The Shuttle Pod Podcast The original TrekMovie.com podcast Apple PodcastsSpotifyPocket CastsStitcher
All Access Star Trek Podcast All about the Star Trek Universe Apple PodcastsSpotifyPocket CastsStitcher

Keep up with everything to do with the Star Trek Universe at TrekMovie.com.

Inline Feedbacks
View all comments

For those who see production of Star Trek as a good thing,the state of Trek is good. For those who see production of *quality* Star Trek as a good thing, the state is unchanged since Enterprise went off air in 2005 – there is no quality Star Trek being made currently and there has not been now for almost 20 years. The Kelvin era movies are better than anything made for TV, but even they are a bit too dumb to be considered quality Trek. I have yet to see Strange New Worlds Season 2. At the end of a very mixed Season 1 I thought that is the only show that has the potential to be quality Trek but it could go either way.

I disagree with almost everything you’ve stated in your post- there has been plenty of quality Trek since 2017: with the exception of Strange New Worlds. It’s one of the most uneven series of Star Trek to date and I really don’t see what everyone else apparently sees in it. Season 2 especially has been wildly inconsistent. For every brilliant episode there has been two or three absolute clunkers. Coming off the back of Picard’s final season- which *finally* got the show right after occasional flashes of greatness in the preceding two seasons- probably didn’t help matters either. How do you follow something that fantastic? Anything would look inferior next to it.

Of course, this is all subjective. What I like, others don’t. And that is totally okay.

Picard,the absolute worst show in the history of Star Trek or at least second only to Discovery which is simply unwatchable. Picard season 1&2 was the most violent,crude and depressing “Star Trek” ever ” written “. So in season 3 they just recycled various previous Trek shows & movies (badly) and supposedly that overdose of fan service makes everything alright again? As I say,almost 20 years now without quality Star Trek. But production rates & budgets are doing well

I would agree with you on Season 1 of Picard.I am repulsed by the needlessly gory death scene Icheb got and there is an overblown grimdark feeling to the season that is so off putting. Picard doesn’t act like Picard, Seven May as well be a completely different character- and as much as I love Jurati, her constant crying and poorly explored mental health plotline gets to be too much by about episode 7. I only stuck around for Raffi and Rios’ holograms.

I’d go as far as to say that Season 1 is one of the worst seasons of Trek along with the first seasons of Discovery and TNG. Awful, awful guff. My opinion, of course.

Yeah I agree about season 1 of Picard as well. And I started out loving it. It was very different from TNG but intriguing. By the time we got to episode 5 and Icheb was tortured, it just lost all momentum for me personally although I did love Nepenthe.

Nepenthe was great, although I didn’t see why they had to lumber Riker and Troi with a dead kid backstory- but I guess Michael Chabon wanted every character to be thoroughly miserable?

I think the major issue with Season 1 is its nine episodes of scene setting and then a very, very rushed finale. I think people have gone on record as saying they didn’t know how to end the season when they went in to it and then they ran out of time. It shows. Nothing comes together, new elements are added all the time and the Synth colony basically amounts to a house that is clearly somewhere in the Hollywood house. And what’s worst, Soji saves the day by literally handing waving the evil machine aliens.

Yep fully agree. The show worked better in the beginning but the back half was just rushed and messy, especially the finale. Although thinking about it, I think all three finales were rushed lol, but season one is still the worst culprit IMO. There is just so many more head scratching things by the end of it. It was very obvious they were still trying to figure out how to end the story and subplots while they were shooting it.

I thought PIC S3, with the exception of episodes 3 and 4, was just hideously bad in terms of storytelling, not to mention the way it approached the Trek mythos in general. But I’m glad you enjoyed it.

My favourite kind of Trek are the TOS movies (TUC especially since it’s my favourite in the franchise) so getting a season that recalls those films was glorious to me. Maybe with a bit more distance I might change my view of Season 3- I really enjoyed Discovery Season 1 at the time before I realised it was awful, and this is coming from someone who *really* enjoys that show.

Cinematically I consider THE UNDISCOVERED COUNTRY to be possibly the best of the TOS films, but at the same time I don’t think it’s very good Star Trek. Which is as mixed a response as you could ask for. But as a film clearly meant to dramatize current events it had a lot to say about prejudice and what it takes to move beyond it; of the implacable weight of history and how, as Kirk notes in the finale, it never truly finishes with us. What was PIC S3 about, exactly, besides getting the band back together?

While there were missteps in s3, it was mostly about getting a chance to say goodbye to all the classic characters. But for all the (stupid) talk about it being “one big movie”, it isn’t and there isn’t one theme or even two or three. It is a tv show and episodes or groups of episodes have arcs and themes for individual characters. Wrapping up or addressing old storylines: Ro, The Borg vs Picard. Expanding storylines: Picard with a family, Geordi with a family, Seven finding a place in Starfleet.

Continuing the IDIC, I disagree with both you and DMDMDMDM.

There has been tons of good Trek since 2005: Lower Decks (my fav of the NuTrek), PIC S3 (about 50% of it; mostly the work on older characters and extending the “legacy” storylines; the newer stuff with Vadic, Jack, and Section 31 and “Moriarty” was not good), Prodigy, and practically everything of SNW.

For me, out of Strange New Worlds so far: I have only disliked 1 episode, and found 2 others to be meh. The biggest concern I had coming out of season 1 was that they were just going to continue doing “their take” on classic Trek episodes. But that has been alleviated. What they have instead done in S2 is not take “big swings” on storylines or concepts, which I probably would have preferred, instead on genre – i.e., going after a particular mood or approach for individual episodes. And it has worked. I can understand why some people might not like an episode like a rom-com, or a full comedy (the crossover), or a musical, because of the genre, but they have been excellent versions of those kinds of episodes (with the exception of “Lost in Translation”, which while it had some good parts was just too predictable and not enough of whatever it was trying to be (a psychological mystery/thriller maybe?)). I just don’t understand what people are thinking when I read them say something like that the show is poorly written.

Seasons 1 and 2 of PIC were pretty bad. 1 was a misguided but valiant attempt by people who didn’t know how to write or make a Trek series; season 2 was just a failure with the only good portion – the first episode and the emotional Q stuff – relegated to effectively an afterthought after supposedly being the reason for the whole season to exist.

It sounds like you haven’t been happy with any Star Trek since Enterprise ended, but I’m curious, if you HAD to pick one season of NuTrek that you liked the most, which would it be? NOT loved, just bearable lol.

As far as SNW season 2, this is my opinion only but if you didn’t love season 1, then yeah you’ll probably be disappointed with season 2 as well. I thought season 2 was fine, like your average season of TNG or VOY IMO, but I honestly loved season 1.

The best TV “NuTrek” I have seen so far would have to be SNW season 1, that did produce 1 or 2 cracking episodes which were satisfying in a way I had not seen in Star Trek since Enterprise S4. I thought Discovery was good for about half of its first season, I was enjoying it and then it just completely lost me and it never got me back , the show completely changed for the worse, and kept changing every season. I am glad they have pulled the plug on it, it was a FAILURE as was picard, complete 3 seasons FAILURE. Strange New Worlds has potential but they are a) just playing it safe by softly remaking TOS and / or 2) are just trying to cram in too many non conventional Trek stories / formats, which is all well & good but this is supposed to be Star Trek.

I would like to see a 4th Kelvin movie learn from the mistakes of the previous 3, I think Star Trek 2009 could have been the best Trek movie ever but it is just a bit too dumb for me and too many liberties taken with the characters (the Kobi-Ashi Maru for example) but it really is a well made film, some great scenes but just not too *clever* I do like it better than I did when it came out, Nero was a great character and I would love a backstory about him, his crew, his family on Romulous and the Nerada.

Mostly the JJ movies are cosplay

OK fair enough!

For the record, I loved Picard season 3, but reading here and other places about it for months now I certainly know that is clearly not an unanimous opinion lol.

But yeah I understand, I think people who hated season 3 or the show as a whole have valid complaints about it. It’s good you at least like the first season of SNW though, I do feel that’s probably the one where most people will agree overall was a good season. There is not the kind of division on it like Picard season 3 for example. I think the people really loved that season loved it, but the people who hated it really hated it so it is more divisive IMO.

But I don’t know man, I’m only speaking for myself of course, but if you already read my OP then you know I have been really happy with Trek in the last year. It’s probably the most I liked it since the 90s in fact. I just felt most of the shows were fun or at least feeling more Trek-y again. Even Discovery, which we fully agree on and I think is awful and not remotely sad it got cancelled, but yet still feel season 4 is probably the most Trek-y season out of ALL the new seasons to date. That’s the kind of thing I been wanting Trek to get back to, especially in the movies. It really did have a TMP vibe to it. It was just so poorly laid and written out with so many tedious and boring subplots. And sooo much melodrama man. But if they cut the season by half and got a better show runner while upping the tension and less hugging or crying, it could’ve been amazing IMO. Sigh

Anyway, I was on YouTube a week ago talking to someone like you who thinks Star Trek basically ‘died’ after 2005 (their words) and said with NuTrek I was just too easy to please lol. Maybe they’re right, I don’t know. But I can tell you I have been as critical about these shows and movies as I was with the old stuff and I do like the old shows better for sure. With the Kelvin movies, like you, I’m OK with them, but I also feel they never reached their full potential and basically squandered it. That’s why Trek is better on TV, it has way more time to get things more right, which I personally they done with most of these shows. But as, as I said I am fully aware that is not an unanimous opinion either. And some really love Discovery too! :)

trying to cram in too many non conventional Trek stories / formats, which is all well & good but this is supposed to be Star Trek.

Exactly. “Subspace Rhapsody” was fun *as a musical*, but not an episode of Star Trek.

What you don’t like Lower Decks either???? It’s awesome and Tendi is on that show! 😁

I kid. But I disagree JJ verse is better. Like you said, those movies feel like Star Trek for really dumb people. Not saying whoever likes them is dumb of course, but my friends like the first one at least and they are really dumb too so there is at least some evidence to that.

Anyway I’m always surprised more people don’t like SNW. I’m not saying it’s an amazing show but it at least feels like real Star Trek again like the good old days and for me it’s equal to Enterprise. And we haven’t had one episode where Pike has space jumped or rode a motorcycle yet!

But I know everyone just has different opinions. I don’t think The Final Frontier is as bad as people say it is so I am in no position to judge others! 😁

Hell, I don’t think INSURRECTION is as bad as many fans think it is. (For my money it’s an okay extended episode of TNG.) And I’ll go one better: while I’m not a fan of “Enterprise” (and maybe that’s the reason), I don’t think that “These Are the Voyages” is all that bad. Yeah, it’s a misfire for sure, but I can see why on paper the producers thought it would work.

Insurrection is my second favourite of the movies. It’s the only film the really capture the spirit of TNG and it is beautifully shot.

Insurrection is one of the few movies that gets better the more I watched it. Still not a favorite of mine or anything but I think its fine. Its always been similar to Beyond for me, a strong two part episode story, but not a very exciting movie in itself.

TATV definitely works better if you can look at it in the way people look at Trials and Tribble-ations or Those Old Scientists (although still nowhere close to the quality of those) and a fun one off crossover thing, people like it more. But yes as a finale to your show and wrapping up the characters and story arc after four seasons, it blows; especially when we’re not even watching the actual characters. That will always be its biggest sin.

This was a great panel. I listened to it while grocery shopping lol. I (as usual) have my thoughts and I agree with a lot points made, both good and bad. I know the state of Star Trek is in flux right, especially with DIS and PRO cancelled and people are crossing their fingers for Legacy but I been saying for the last year, I thought we’ve had some great Star Trek. Starting with SNW season one up until now I been satisfied with every season. And there was great Trek before that, what I mean is it was always very mixed between 2017 to 2021. But with I have enjoyed ALL of from mid 2022 with SNW S1, LDS S3, PRO S1.5, PIC S3 and now SNW S2. Doesn’t mean they were all perfect or amazing (and I don’t think LDS S3 or SNW S2 were as good as their previous seasons) but all solid IMO.

As far as the future, if I had it my way and we still had 5 shows on I would want:

-Lower Decks
-Strange New Worlds
-StarFleet Academy

To me that’s a perfect mix. It covers multiple time periods, age groups, tones, formats etc. SNW and LEG mostly covers the TOS and TNG eras. PRO is focused on VOY (although I read season 2 will cover most of the shows actually, old and new). SFA continues the 32nd century/DIS era and LDS is a celebration of all Trek even if its based in the 24th century.

Now unfortunately it’s not quite that easy lol. SNW probably won’t come back until 2025. PRO still doesn’t officially have a new home yet. LEG doesn’t exist at all…yet; but listening to Anthony on the panel gives me hope they are reassessing now that they know that Picard S3 was (surprise???) a hit. And SFA is probably not going to show up until 2026 if the strike goes into next year. But great news kids, sounds like season 5 of LDS could still happen next year though! Niiicce!

But I know fans are split on a lot of these shows, etc and we’ll have to see where it all falls, but I think it’s going to work out when the dust settles. In the mean time, it’s going to be a little rough. But I honestly believe Trek has improved in the last few years even if I don’t believe that with every show and hope it continues.

I really don’t care about the Academy show at all but it would be good for the Discovery fans to have and expand that era more. It could be good but I’m still doubtful.

As for the rest of the list, LDS and SNW are safe for now and it sounds like Prodigy is going to happen. It’s really the Legacy show that is the big question mark. I didn’t hear the part where Anthony said it’s still being reevaluated, I only listened to half of it, but that’s good news. But that shouldn’t be a surprise either. Picard season 3 is probably the most watched and we’ll reviewed out of any season in new Trek. It even turned some of the haters around who hated the other shows. It’s crazy this show isn’t being developed at all but I guess they have to limit the shows and budget now.

But I’m happy with LDS, SNW and Prodigy. That’s actually enough for me. And I like the variety. SNW is your daddy’s Star Trek and Lower Decks definitely isn’t your daddy’s Star Trek lol but both work for me. 👍

I can say I am looking forward to the Academy show. It’s not super high on my list or anything and if I had to choose that between it or the Legacy show, the Legacy show would win out every time. But yeah I do want to see the 32nd century expanded and it would be nice to see Discovery canon continued for big fans of that show. I was always worried once Discovery was cancelled the 32nd century would be cancelled too. As someone who is ALWAYS saying Star Trek needs to expand, I would feel like a hypocrite saying it should end just because I think Discovery sucks. And yeah who knows, it may be a stark improvement.

It’s pretty funny you say Lower Decks is not your daddy’s Star Trek because I do remember people saying when Star Trek got back on the air that they shouldn’t expect it to look like Berman Trek or old Star Trek again. And I don’t think they meant anything like this, but this proves they were certainly right lol. But that’s what is interesting about Lower Decks, on one hand it ISN’T like old Star Trek and then on the other hand it’s exactly like old Star Trek. And depend on WHO you ask, they will usually be in one or the other camp. But its a big reason why I love it, to me it’s Berman Trek through and through but same time it’s such an extreme version of it, it does feel like its own thing. But we agree Berman would’ve never approved it lol. Not on your life.

And its why I do like what Kurtzman is doing even if I don’t love it all. I love all the Berman shows completely, but I agree with others they probably felt a bit too comfortable and safe at times. I love comfort which is why I like SNW too, you can’t get anymore comfort food than that (although the musical certainly went outside of Trek’s comfort zone too). But if people complained old Trek needed to shake things up more, well here is Lower Decks for you! ;D

Is Starfleet Academy confirmed to take place in the 31st century?

Based on the press release announcing the show, it says the Academy will open for the first time in over 100 years which sounds like it’s been closed since the Burn.

Why would a legacy show be any different to Picard season 3, which was just wall-to-wall fan service, with dumb writing killing off good characters left, right & centre. Terry Matalas is a HACK there was NOTHING ORIGINAL in Season 3 of Picard and the show made zero sense

Why were the changelings working with the Borg?
Who was Vadic?
Jack Crusher got boring after 2 or 3 episodes
Why would the entire Star Fleet be on display at Earth during a celebratory event?

Awful awful awful show. Seven of nine is just not that interesting a character, I realise the actress needs to work but really a legacy show sounds like my worst nightmare.

The first paragraph is why I’m very unsure about the idea of Legacy getting anywhere near the aftermath of DS9. Vadic really had so much potential and then she was just kinda wasted. Also I don’t really want to see Nicole deBoer return and get killed off because ??? It makes you feel emotional I guess. The only emotion that would evoke in me is just rage.

I don’t need wall to wall of DS9 nostalgia in a way that does absolutely nothing. There’s a difference between being reminded of the “come to Quark’s, Quark’s is fun” jingle because lol wasn’t that funny and seeing Rom making actual lasting changes in Ferengi society which is what LD is giving us this upcoming season. Hopefully. What I want is actually moving the universe forward from it in ways that develop the species and cultures involved! Yes Legacy could be that but it just as easily could end up being a load of hot air just like PIC S3 was in that area in itself.

I would not watch Jeffrey Combs returning to live action as Brunt or Weyoun only for the main characters to kill them because they thought they were in the way instead of trying to work with them even if Paramount paid me

Oh yeah, I hear you for sure. I actually just wrote to you about this in another post but no I don’t think Picard season 3 was perfect, but I did really enjoy it just the same. But I actually agree with a lot of your issues, especially questions about how the Borg and Changlings were working together which I also brought up in the past. And yes Vadic wasn’t fleshed out enough. But she turned out much better than I originally thought at least, but that’s with VERY low expectations lol. But they REALLY should’ve made that connection between the two stronger and go into how the plan was set up. Vadic should’ve been able to kidnap Jack in the episode she boarded the Titan and then at the end of that episode it was the Borg instead waiting another episode. All that was poorly paced out and needed more development.

And I was never a huge fan of the son subplot with Jack. I just don’t understand with obsession with NuTrek how everyone is related to some legacy character. But now that they did it it at least made sense to the overall story, but yeah still could’ve done without it.

And yes, I also rolled my eyes hearing the ENTIRE fleet was there on Frontier day. C’mon Matalas. That’s just as bad as saying a super-nova is a threat to the entire galaxy. I get writers want to raise the stakes but don’t raise it to the point it defies all common sense. And the fleet only looked like a couple of hundred ships and not thousands.

Now all that said, I don’t see why that would stop a Legacy show from happening if Matalas is someone who can look at this mistake and make changes. Now if you just think he sucks as a writer, which you clearly do, then yeah he’s probably not going to win you over no matter what he does. But for me I thought there was still way more good than bad and it just felt like a proper Star Trek movie. And I loved the farewell he gave the characters. So I’m excited about the possibility of another show but yeah there certainly can be room for improvement for sure.

But we have to agree to disagree fully on Seven of Nine though. I love her to death and a big reason I want the Legacy show.

In my personal view. If legacy happens I’ll be happy for the people who want it. But for me personally it’ll just have to earn me watching it. Which means I won’t be watching it as it airs which is fine.

So it sounds like you would choose the Academy show instead. What are your thoughts on that show?

I do have faith (of the heart) the Legacy show will be good. But I can’t remotely blame people who are hesitant about it if they thought season 3 sucked major ass lol. And yeah it could suck. But if it happens, it’s probably years away regardless.

It’s another case of I’ll have to wait and see. Things don’t automatically get my viewership because it’s Trek. LD earned it and so did PRO. The three live action ones didn’t outside of the episodes of them that I did watch.

I am however more receptive to Academy, it’s gonna entirety depend on what the characters are. If there’s an Andorian main character, I will be very interested, for example. Also starfleet academy in itself is something that needs to be developed more. How many years is it, what all is there for extra curricular activities, is there a starfleet academy hockey team, etc

Adding something totally on brand for me about this. Since it’s the 32nd century we can see species that you wouldn’t think about being at the academy in there. Have more Romulans go into Starfleet. And one thing that would make me tune in for sure? If a cadet was a Vorta.

Exactly, it’s a big reason why it excites me. We can see Cardassian, Romulans or even a species from the Dominion as part of the Academy. We could even see a few species from the Delta Quadrant involved.

It just opens up a lot of interesting possibilities when you’re this far into the future.

Exactly! I hope they try for that. And actually give us information about the species at that century.

OK I gotcha! It’s still a wait and see for me as well but I’m remaining more optimistic about it.

I always listen to the Podcast while I’m driving, so it would probably be a bad idea to look at the slides while I’m listening. I guess I’ll just view the slides before I listen.

Id like it if Star Trek did some actual hard science fiction again. Everything is about emotions and feelings now.

I love episodes like Remember Me, Timescape or Cause and Effect. Gimme something with TMP vibes!

*points at the entirety of Discovery’s fourth season*

I don’t buy the notion that a specific show has to be made to appease a targeted demographic (ie a cadet show for YA). When I was a teenager, I watched TNG, so did everyone else, because it was good. I never said, “Man, I wish these people were all in their late teens.” I would love a quality Star Trek show that takes place in the 25th century, continuing to build on the rich world created by TOS, TNG, DS9, Voyager shows. Traveling hundreds of years into the future to start fresh is laaaaaaaaaaaazy. You can be fresh and still build off of what came before. You can attract young adults, adults, and seniors, to a new show all at once. It just takes the right people to do it.

Completely agree bro! We don’t need to go the 37th century or whatever, the 25th century is good enough. We have all those great characters back while producing new ones and building on ENT, TOS, TNG, DS9 and VOY or when Trek was at its peak.

The Legacy show will be the continuation of those and what excites fan since that is the backbone of Star Trek and all.

The Academy show may not be a total train wreck but I don’t think it’s going to get any new young people to watch unless they are already watching.

Agreed! I recently watched DS9 and I miss classic star trek storytelling. I miss that world Rick Berman, Michael Piller, and Braga created. I want a show that continues that continuity. I’m not interested in prequels and musicals. I miss interesting characters and science fiction.

Okay but I will pay to hear Weyoun sing so I want a DS9 musical. Let the man sing. The closest we have to that is Jeffrey Combs singing on the soundtrack for the DS9 documentary. Which is nice but I wanna plop down on a day when insomnia is kicking my ass and turn on something to enable myself to be heart eyes for an hour or so while Weyoun sings.

I would’ve been open to a DS9 musical actually and I didn’t hate the SNW one either. But not something I feel I ever have to watch again.

I’m not interested in prequels and musicals. I miss interesting characters and science fiction.

Batten down the hatches! Those idiots who were told to “find a new fandom” after “Those Old Scientists” are coming out of the woodwork!

Wow, did someone actually tell you that??? I don’t understand people. They are just TV shows and people are allowed to think they suck without questioning your fandom over. Some people really need to get a grip and not get triggered over every little criticism.

I absolutely loved Those Old Scientists but I would never attack anyone because they thought it sucked either. 🙄

There are sadly a lot of insecure people and can’t handle differences of opinions out there. I usually just put people like this on ignore and go about my day.

Some people take this stuff a little too seriously sadly.

DS9 is the kind of Trek I don’t think anybody working on it today could ever produce. They wanted Discovery to feel as dark and gritty as that but it was a joke and a cheap imitation at best. That show missed everything that made DS9 great in the first place.

I love Mike McMahon and I thought the DS9/LDS crossover was great but he’s still a comedy writer end of the day. SNW is a good show but it doesn’t have the same depth like TNG or DS9 had. And they made the crew too immature and Pike just too soft IMO.

But I agree I miss the stronger sci fi stories old Trek did and there was more of a weight to them. Those shows had a lot of fun and silly stuff too but I miss something as deep and bold as the Dominian War. Or even the Xindi conflict. It would be great if they tried something again on those levels. But after seeing what we got after four seasons of Discovery and Picard, I just don’t think they are really up to it. I loved Picard season 3 but it’s still nowhere close to the best of old Trek but was in the ball park at least.

I don’t buy the notion that a specific show has to be made to appease a targeted demographic (ie a cadet show for YA). When I was a teenager, I watched TNG, so did everyone else, because it was good.

*Precisely*. I would have found the notion of “you have to watch Teen Trek (TM)” to be an insult to my intelligence.

Also agree. And I think that strategy is going to backfire as much as much as trying to get kids to watch Prodigy.

I don’t buy the notion that a specific show has to be made to appease a targeted demographic (ie a cadet show for YA).

Exactly. When are they going to learn? You don’t need to specifically, blatantly, aggressively target your movie or TV series towards young people in order to get their attention.

Probably the greatest example of this is the original Star Wars trilogy. Three movies that appealed to different age groups, including many, many children, and they didn’t have a single child in them. Aside from that one shot of a baby Ewok, that’s it. Every character is 18 and above.

This is a fantastic point that I think bean counters and suits can’t understand. TNG is a great example of Trek that wasn’t “for” a particular demographic but brought in folks across pretty much damn near every demographic. And it’s become impeded into the zeitgeist. Good Trek is good science fiction with a positive outlook.

I see what you’re saying but I gotta say. When I was a kid watching TNG with my parents, I ended up traumatized by Chain of Command part II. And by Cardassians in general. Also the Borg.

As a ‘former’ NuTrrek hater I have to say the state of Star Trek is certainly better today. I loved how much the audience clapped when they mentioned Lower Decks! That show has really become popular in the fanbase. It’s great to see Trek can do something different 90s Trek would never do and people love it.

As for Trek in the future, Legacy show Paramount, seriously the Legacy show. Most fans want a continuation of TNG, DS9 and Voyager. Picard was kind of that but it didn’t really become that until third season. Now they have a real chance to pull it off. But yeah it won’t be cheap but it will certainly be watched. 😉

Don’t care about the CW Academy show, still think it’s going to be as bad as Discovery but maybe it will surprise me. And it’s certainly a better choice than Section 31 starring Adolf. I knew that was probably never going to happen because so many fans hated the idea. Willing to check out the movie though.

In conclusion, give us Legacy Paramount, especially after you screwed us over with Prodigy, one of the best Trek shows ever.

It’s great to at least see people who may have had doubts with the Kelvin movies and earlier shows are still open minded enough to appreciate and like other things. Believe me when I say that’s not very common, especially on YouTube lol.

Some people just want to hate just to hate and their minds can never be changed.

Trust me when I say I’m surprised about it too! 😂.

I didn’t really think I would like NuTrek at all, especially when it was more boring prequel stuff like JJ verse and Discovery. But of course I still just judged them on their own merit but still ended up bad for me.

But when Picard came, the one show I was 100% for and finally excited about Trek again since Voyager not only ended up being bad on it’s own but some ways worse than those other two I really lost faith in NuTrek in a way I just wanted to give up on future Star Trek. I just thought the new stuff would never be for me. It’s just too different, dumb down and doesn’t really like Trek anymore.

But I’m not out to hate anything and give everything a fair chance. If that wasn’t the case I shouldn’t like Beyond at all and I definitely shouldn’t like Lower Decks. 😆

The new stuff still isn’t on the level of 90’s/Berman Trek for me but it’s getting there. I think Prodigy and the Legacy show has the best potential, the show that’s already been cancelled and the one that doesn’t even exist yet lol. But for a 24th/25th century fanboy they excite me the most.

SNW is also great but being a prequel where you kind of know where everything is going doesn’t excite me as much but can’t deny it’s a very good show either and what they should’ve made instead of Discovery. So I am excited about the future, especially if the Legacy show happens. And even if doesn’t and the Academy show ends up being good then that’s still a win. It’s all still Star Trek at the end of day.

But if there is no more Trek at all after next year I still got my TNG/DS9/VOY episodes to rewatch until I die along with LDS and a bit of PRO and Picard D3, so it’s all good man. 😎

For me, I been up and down with the modern era as well but to be honest, no more than I was with the classic era (TOS-ENT). In the classic era and shows I liked two shows off the top with TOS and VOY and the others I needed more time to get use to. With the new shows I loved LDS, PRO and SNW from the top but needed more time with PIC and DIS. With the movies, always been mixed on those but liked more than I didn’t. With the Kelvin movies, same, pretty mixed on them but I thought the 09 and BEY was fine but yes I don’t look at the Kelvin movies on the same level I look at the TOS or TNG movies. Those are more fun distractions with a very Star Wars/Marvel type of vibe but fine. If they make more, I’ll watch them. If not, won’t lose any sleep and since it’s been 7 years already, that would’ve been a lot of lost sleep lol.

Now I will say I still think Roddenberry/Berman era of Star Trek is still way more stronger in many ways and yes I think I was much more disappointed in both DIS and PIC I have ever been in a show before although Enterprise comes close as well and to this day the only show I stopped watching completely. But Enterprise got better with every season. Not so with PIC and DIS. And those two are still least favorite shows in the franchise and DIS is dead last.

But I’ve always been pretty optimistic about future Trek even when I wasn’t happy with the prequel stuff but knew we would get post-Nemesis shows and movies at some point. And that’s because I do think Kurtzman listens to fans and always trying hard to make changes with things, like Discovery especially. They changed everything from the Klingons to throwing it in the far future to please fans and it’s still not quite working lol, but they at least try. And I also think every show has gotten better than the last which I can’t say about the Berman era since most people still consider TNG and DS9 as the superior shows and VOY and ENT a bit less…but nothing compared to the vitriol 20 years ago lol. Now they all seem well liked and loved from every place I read today. More people seem to want a Enterprise season 5 than another Kelvin movie (well I definitely do ;)). And the same thing may happen with these new shows too. Time seems to work in Trek’s favor a lot.

So while not happy with everything, generally happy! But yeah, I think I’m in the minority in this situation with the modern stuff, at least on this board.

I want Star Trek to be inspiring. This world needs Star Trek, but it needs to be inspiring, it needs to say something about our current world. I want a show that returns to not just episodic television, but they need to be morality plays. The need to bring back the original vision of Star Trek. But, maybe those things don’t sell anymore…maybe new audiences just want Star Trek: High School Edition.

Word for word, what KevinB just said!

That was good. I think Laurie and Anthony were much more candid in this live setting than they sometimes are in their reviews of individual episodes (which tend to be fawning, especially from AP). Seemingly no love for Season Two of Picard here, but I recall reading (and hearing) a different slant from both of you at the time. As for the crossover SNW episode, I cannot disagree with you (Laurie) more about that. It was 1000% fan service and cringey throughout. And I happen to like both of those series! Boimler’s adulation of TOS characters in the context of Lower Decks is ‘cute’ and ‘wink- wink’ but in live interactions with the actual characters it is nothing short of ridiculous. How would he even have knowledge of any TOS characters (other than Spock, perhaps) in his time let alone adore them?! Not realistic in the slightest degree. The writers need to do much better and take the material seriously.

So he shouldn’t know of Kirk either? Or Pike? Even if the rest of the crew is unimportant in the minds of fans, they still do pretty important stuff in universe. And they gave a pretty damn good reason for him to know who Una was.

As for Chapel, yeah I’d still say she was important in the lives of even the big well known crew of the Enterprise. Bones himself says a lot of good things about her, she’d be mentioned in the biography of Leonard McCoy. And he’s a nerd enough to have read it. On La’an at the very least he knows who she is because of her ancestor but we don’t know what she goes on to do yet.

Also people in Trek tend to live longer. For all we know he knows about them all because he took a course in engineering taught by none other than Montgomery effing Scott. For all we know Spock wrote the books about himself and talked about people he served with in length.

I was surprised this morning to see that Short Treks have been added to Paramount Plus – at least in the UK. Although it’s only the first four, it seems.

The Short Treks were made for Paramount+. Hopefully you will get all of them. Some of them suck, but there were several that served as mini-pilots for Strange New Worlds that are fun.

Hopefully! The thumbnail image for the show is Spock from those SNW ones, so based on that, I think it’s likely. Perhaps they will drop those specific ones next Thursday seeing the current SNW season has ended now.