Bryan Fuller’s Original Pitch For ‘Star Trek: Discovery’ Included Going Beyond TNG Era

Today, Entertainment Weekly released their new issue with a feature cover story on Star Trek: Discovery. We previewed the photoshoot for the issue yesterday. Much of the information has already been reported from both before and during San Diego Comic-Con, but there were some new good nuggets of information, with a focus on co-creator Bryan Fuller’s time on the show before his departure last year last year.

Fuller’s rejected ideas included multiple time periods

According to Entertainment Weekly, Bryan Fuller’s original pitch to CBS had the show starting in Discovery‘s time, but then moving through the eras of Kirk and Picard and then going beyond that, reaching a time period that hasn’t been seen in Star Trek before. He wanted to do something like American Horror Story, which resets its storyline each season, and described it as a “platform for a universe of Star Trek shows.” However CBS decided to create a single serialized show and  see how it performed before agreeing to anything that elaborate.

The TNG cast’s final appearance on screen in Star Trek: Nemesis – Bryan Fuller’s original pitch was to take Discovery beyond TNG

The article also noted some other elements of Fuller’s vision for Discovery that have been set aside, including: “a more heavily allegorical and complex story line,” and his original idea for Starfleet uniforms, which were “a subdued spin on the original series’ trio of primary colors.”

Bryan Fuller wanted uniforms that were more reflective of the original Star Trek

Fuller’s fights with CBS

The article details that there were significant clashes between CBS and Fuller during 2016. These included issues with going over the budget of $6 million/episode. Fuller also disagreed with CBS hiring David Semel to direct the pilot. Semel is a two-time Emmy nominee and veteran of television, notably many procedurals like Madam Secretary and Code Black, and is particularly known for directing pilots. Apparently Fuller wanted a more visionary director and had even reached out to longtime Simon Pegg collaborator Edgar Wright (Shaun of the Dead, Baby Driver). Fuller and Semel are said to have “clashed in pre-production” on the pilot for Discovery.

But the “biggest clash” was the schedule. The original plan for CBS was to launch the show in January of 2017, which was the soonest CBS could do a new Star Trek TV series based on an agreement after Viacom and CBS split in 2005. Heavily invested in their new streaming service, CBS felt that Discovery “could be the franchise that really puts All Access on the map.” Development time and pre-production continued to push the date back and CBS grew concerned about Fuller’s split commitments, notably with American Gods.

All of this led to CBS letting Fuller go in October 2016. But CBS Studios president David Stapf noted that even with Fuller gone, his vision for the show remained, saying:

The good news is Bryan created a really nice template that was unbelievably specifically detailed

For his part, Fuller seems to bounced back from being fired, telling EW:

I got to dream big. I was sad for a week and then I salute the ship and compartmentalize my experience.

Official CBS photo of Bryan Fuller released last summer

 

Sex, death and disco

An extended version of a portion of the article has been posted online regarding how CBS All Access streaming platform allows the show more flexibility when it comes to more mature content. However, co-showrunner Aaron Harberts dispels the notion that Discovery is the next Game of Thrones in the nudity and profanity department, telling EW:

Every writer’s impulse when you get to work on the streaming shows is to go crazy. But how does nudity play on Trek? Eh, it feels weird. How does a lot of [profanity] on Trek? Not so great. Are there moments where it merits it that we’re trying to push here and there? I would say we’re trying to push more by having the type of complicated messed-up characters who aren’t necessarily embraced on broadcast TV.

Another notable tidbit in the magazine was about the large number of characters on the show, with a line from EW about how maybe you shouldn’t grow too attached to any one of them:

If all this seems like a lot of characters to follow, there might not be quite as many around by the end of the season. Discovery has grave consequences baked into the story line.

One final fun fact is that the USS Discovery is nicknamed “the Disco” behind the scenes. This revelation connects nicely with a dancing-themed animated GIF TrekMovie tweeted yesterday, based on the video that EW released.

Three covers

The new issue of EW is on stands now and features three collectible Star Trek: Discovery covers. You can buy all three here, or purchase the individual covers here, here, and here.

Star Trek: Discovery premieres on September 24th on CBS with all subsequent episodes on CBS All Access in the US.  In Canada Star Trek: Discovery will premiere  on Bell Media’s CTV and the Space Channel on the same night. Netflix will launch Star Trek: Discovery on Monday, September 25 to countries outside of the U.S. and Canada.

Keep up with all the Star Trek: Discovery news at TrekMovie.

 

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Three main revelations from the EW article:

1) Fuller was indeed planning on making an anthology show but CBS rejected it:

> Fuller sat with CBS executives to deliver his pitch. It wasn’t just for a ‘Trek’ series but for multiple serialized anthology shows that would begin with the ‘Discovery’ prequel, journey through the eras of Captain James T. Kirk and Captain Jean-Luc Picard, and then go beyond to a time in ‘Trek’ that’s never been seen before.

For morons saying there is no story Post-NEM, Fuller clearly has an idea for such an era.

2) Fuller didn’t leave the show voluntarily, he was fired by CBS:

> In October, after months of backstage tension, CBS Television Studios asked Fuller to step down as showrunner

3) It looks like they’ve dumbed down ‘Discovery’ story as well.

> Some of Fuller’s ideas were tossed, however — from the more heavily allegorical and complex story line to his choice of uniforms (a subdued spin on the original series’ trio of primary colors).

It doesn’t sound like the idea for ultimately setting part of the story in Trek’s “future” has been rejected entirely, just tabled for now. (I’ve always found these time-leaps fascinating when done properly (e.g. BSG), and would love seeing it happen on DSC if it’s story-appropriate.)

It’s old news that Fuller was, indeed, let go. It’s very unfortunate, but given his scheduling conflicts and with so much riding for CBS, it was also inevitable. The producers have insisted that his series template remains in effect, including projected character arcs for the second season, and Fuller has indicated his willingness to return if asked. Given the circumstances, that’s about the best that fans can hope for.

Rejecting some of Fuller’s ideas (as some of Roddenberry’s were rejected) doesn’t necessarily mean the show has been “dumbed-down,” which is strictly your uninformed opinion (since you don’t know any more about what those ideas entailed than the rest of us). I do agree that the uniform design is unfortunate, though.

@Michael Hall,

Well, the article specifically said that CBS rejected Fuller’s “heavily allegorical and complex story line”. Add that to what we have seen in the trailers, the focus on Klingon war, the Spock family drama & you have what looks like a dumbed-down show.

Fuller came up with a new & fresh idea for a Trek show, multiple serialized anthology shows, something we have not seen before. But CBS took the easy way, to do another typical show.

Ahmed, “…But CBS took the easy way, to do another typical show.” If you’re right, then it simply will not last. With the excellent quality of writing across vast amounts of television these days, there’s no room for a ‘typical’ show anymore. Especially on a new channel everyone (in the U.S.) has to pay for above and beyond what they’re already paying for.

I hope you’re wrong, but time will tell.

” If you’re right, then it simply will not last. ”

That’s not entirely true. There can indeed by “typical” shows that are good. It just won’t be innovative or different. Those things are not mutually exclusive.

Thankfully we won’t have to sift through Ahmed’s weekly biased negativity since he clearly doesn’t want to watch the show.

Yeah right.

Rejected a “heavily allegorical and complex story line” In other words “We rejected anything complex because the show is going to be about grit and explosions to hook all the young kiddies onto it”

This is CBS’ money. Lot of it. Let the show hook an audience and maybe they will hve more freedom in story telling.

Dead Like Me was way better after fuller was fired.

It’s Netflixe’s money & they, like the rest of us wanted Prime universe.

Yep, First Orci kicked off Beyond for making it too “Star-Trekkie” & then Fuller is sacked for trying to Explore the Prime Universe/ Maintaining cannon & being an intelligent show.

You hVe zero clue about this.

One could say thankfully cbs stepped in and cut fuller’s convoluted and silly ideas. Works both ways.

So knock it off. You’re ridiculous.

I’m not overly familiar with fuller. But I loved Dead Like Me…after fuller was fired for what sounds like similar reasons.

@TUP,

While it’s really a waste of time to reply to an obvious troll/shill, I’ll say this just once.

Fuller came up with a unique idea, a TV show that spans generations. We have no idea if he meant a single season will cover an era or maybe more than a season per era. What we do know that it was a fresh idea that no one have tried it before.

When someone reads that TV executives rejected “complex story line” it usually means they are trying to dumb down the story. From all the trailers, the SDCC interviews it seems the focus is on action (the Klingon war) and family drama (Spock’s family).

And it’s funny that people who hailed Fuller as visionary when he was first hired are now attacking him & questioning his abilities.

Wow… Ahmed… you have no idea what you are talking about.

Ahmed, I’ve been posting here a long time. Exposing your distasteful ignorance by calling me a troll for simply disagreeing with your perspective and explaining why is laughable. You come across a lot smarter than that, so please grow up.

You are CLEARLY reading into what was said to advance your negative narrative. Thats fine. Its not correct, but its fine.

The problem with a multigenerational anthology series is that it would be ridiculously expensive. As fresh of an idea as it is, I don’t think it’s something that would work within the boundaries of tv.
Which is sort of Fuller’s problem, he’s a brilliantly creative writer, but he falls in love a little too much with his own ideas. I doubt his Star Trek would have resembled his other shows much, but based on the way American Gods and Hannibal played out, I think his story for Discovery would have probably been called ponderous and pretentious by certain viewers.
I do think CBS should have hired someone a little more distinct to direct the pilot, and visually the show just looks too slick, but I don’t think that this is quite the case of a bland studio machine dooming a project by firing a brilliant artist, some perveive it to be.

The irony of Ahmed calling other people out for being trolls. Purlease!

It’s equally funny that the very people who attacked Fuller as a PC SJW now laud him as a visionary.

“Fuller came up with a unique idea, a TV show that spans generations. We have no idea if he meant a single season will cover an era or maybe more than a season per era. What we do know that it was a fresh idea that no one have tried it before.”

ENT tried something very much like it with the Temporal Cold War, and TOS/TNG with GENERATIONS. Neither attempt worked out very well.

Can anyone name an anthology series that really worked well and sustained viewer interest? THE TWILIGHT ZONE, perhaps. But that was really a congeries of short stories told very early in the history of television. THE INCREDIBLE HULK? It had a handful of poignant episodes, but it also had its share of divorcees, and the bulk of its plots were simple. It’s not something that works in the era of THE SOPRANOS/BREAKING BAD.

I think CBS made the right call to focus on a single timeframe. And before we say that the series has been “dumbed down,” we should see what they come up with. Everything before this suggests multi-season plots.

@Ahmed – your usual MO of insulting people in your responses. You should grow up and act more mature. Its really sad to see what you’ve become.

You should also be aware that you twist everything to fit your own narrative. You dont know anything about Fuller’s ideas. Its possible they were awful and the studio saved the series by dumping him.

Try to reply without insulting.

Actually, the quote was “a more heavily allegorical and complex storyline.” That’s a big difference, since you have no idea what the series’ storyline has been “dumbed-down” from. And I’d be willing to bet some serious quatloos that the focus on the Klingon war and the “Spock family drama” were all part of Fuller’s initial pitch, since they’re central elements of the show and the producers (and the network) are saying that they’re sticking to Fuller’s concept. That only stands to reason, since Discovery was very far into pre-production before Fuller was let go.

We have no idea at this point if the approach to the subject matter will be typical, or innovative. As Danpaine says, time will tell.

@Michael Hall,

“the producers (and the network) are saying that they’re sticking to Fuller’s concept. ”

You mean the same producers who said in the press release about Fuller’s departure that he “will continue to map out the story arc for the entire season.” Only for Fuller to deny that in interview a month later saying “I’m not involved in production, or postproduction” and that CBS “has my number”!

“As Danpaine says, time will tell.”

Indeed.

I don’t recall the producers saying that, but if they continued to map out the season using his ideas anyway — and you’ve got exactly nothing that says they didn’t — it’s really a moot point in any case.

As it stands right now, there’s not much point in calling people liars, or insisting that things have been “dumbed-down,” unless you’re bound and determined not to enjoy this show.

Ahmed is the first one to complain about everything. He’s made it quite clear that he doesn’t like anything and will not watch the show. Yet he continues to read each article that is posted. Look, Ahmed, we know your opinion about the show. We get it. But it seems like you WANT it to fail and are trying to convince others to follow suit by nitpicking it ad nauseum. Every comment you make is negative. I’m not sure what exactly you are looking for in a Star Trek show, but I don’t see this as dumbing down anything. Yes, we are seeing action. Yes, we are seeing explosions. Yes, it will be with the backdrop of the Klingon war. But from what I have been reading, that is all secondary to the story they want to tell. I don’t think the idea of changing the eras each season is a good idea. I want to be invested in the characters and see how they grow throughout the series. Changing eras and characters every season will just muddy the waters and people will not get attached to characters. Perhaps this is what Meyers is going to be doing… another Trek show in another era… separate from Discovery. That would be a good plan. Frankly, I don’t really care that the uniforms don’t look like THE CAGE or TOS. Heck, even TOS had 3 different styles of uniforms. The Uniforms changed from TMP to TWOK. The uniforms changed how many times… Read more »

@Joe Canada — there’s enough spin and alternate facts on this thread from the usual suspects to land them a job as White House Communications Director under Trump. I think that’s all that needs to be said here. There’s no arguing with people who have no objectivity, and a clear agenda with a very dull axe to grind.

Ahmed hates everything but his specific ideas. Maybe he should make a TV show.

I agree

@Joe Canada,

Well, as I’ve said before I’ll watch the pilot and then make up my mind about continuing with the show or not.

This idea that fans should not be critical of an upcoming show is beyond ridiculous.

“Yes, we are seeing action. Yes, we are seeing explosions. Yes, it will be with the backdrop of the Klingon war. But from what I have been reading, that is all secondary to the story they want to tell.”

Not sure what you’ve been reading but from all the interviews with the cast & producers the Klingon war is the story they want to tell.

Ahmed must have stock in CBS or Fuller Co. He cares a lot about this, but only as long as he can twist things to fit his negative narrative. So sad. If you’re not interested, don’t watch and thus, don’t post. Win Win lol

Ahmed, you say easy way, others may say cautious way. Its safe to assume most of the fans are unhappy about things getting nixed like the anthology idea, more traditional tri colour uniforms, etc, I sure am…but its been 12 years since a new Star Trek series has been on TV. Its not the Burman era were shows were coming out one after another or even over lapping, TNG, DS9, VGR, ENT. The fact that a new Star Trek has not been on TV for so long, you can’t logically blame a studio (with financial investment in it) for testing the waters before entering into something as great as an anthology series. Would you blindly invest your money without doing thorough research, observation and sound advisement, the answer is NO! They also want to bring in new fans and there is NOTHING wrong with that. Do you not want new Star Trek fans!? which will bolster Star Trek’s popularity? Or are you going to argue “not at the expense of dumbing it down”? Listen bud, two sides of the coin to everything. You have to look at our (fans) point of view as well as the studio’s point of view, they own the franchise. It does belong to the fans to some degree but I no way am I furious over CBS wanting to test the waters. If Discovery succeeds we’ll get another show soon after dealing with the post Voyager universe. “But CBS took the easy way, to do… Read more »

What “morons” said there was no story post Nem? That is a made up and idiotic remark

At best some people said they preferred not to to post Nem. No one said there is no story. In fact the opposite is true. If there are morons it is the ones saying the ONLY story is post Nem.

So how bout you knock off the name calling and silly posts? You seem smarter than that.

You’re also making assumptions to support your negative bias. CBS wanted to make discovery before considering any anthology idea. Fuller was already over budget and he expected cbs to green light a massive expense in new sets etc every season?

Also, no evidence the story has been dumped down. That’s like saying beyond was dumbed down from STID. Beyond is less complicated. STID is more convoluted.

Fullers ideas might have been better. Or worse. We don’t know.

So really. Stop.

What morons were saying there is no story Post-Nem? You’re making up false facts to lend credence to your narrative. Give an opinion, don’t create fake nonsense to try and make it work. No one said that at all.

Those people that simply preferred a series that was NOT post Nem said so. If there are any morons, as you stated, its the ones that are so determined you cant tell a story in Discovery’s era which is silly of course.

Also, the fact Fuller wanted to do several seasons leading up to post Nem would certainly add to the idea that even he felt he needed several seasons to set up a story in the Post Nem world that would make sense. Hmmmm

Nothing indicates Discovery has been dumbed down at all. Perhaps Fuller’s story was convoluted. Perhaps it was unclear. Maybe his idea was way better. Who knows. But for you to make a definitive point is really a negative bias you’re trying to pass off as a fact. It isn’t.

Nobody said there “were no stories post TNG”. People such as myself simply said that there was nothing inherently better about it, and that storytelling possibilities in the pre-TOS era were far more interesting and simpler for creating conflict and stories.

Dang, I wish they would have went with Fuller’s wishes on the uniforms. These new uniforms are just a small step above The Motion Picture blandness. Why did they avoid the three color scheme from TOS? It was evident on The Cage, so why the change to something worse? Even JJ Abrams kept that basic uniform look. SMH

Sybock\'s Other Brother

I’ll take TMP uniforms any day compared to these.

Why would you take them? Other than don’t like them.

Me too.

These new uniforms are some of the worst in trek history. I was expecting a TOS throwback look for the show since it is a prequel. They could have at least given us that.

That’s ridiculous melodrama. Relax, kid.

Opinion alert! Besides, its just uniforms – its not like they need to win a fashion show….

“Would have went” has no meaning in English.

that’s funny because I’m fluent in English and I understood its meaning just fine. get off your grammar high horse.

I admit I don’t love the uniforms but I like them. But yes they are a little too ‘busy’ for me. I still think out of all the uniforms the Enterprise ones probably felt and looked the most functional. People are saying these are an upgraded version of those but I don’t really see it outside of being blue.

Agreed. To me they’re just blue as well. Probably comfortable for the cast to wear, though. Looks it.

Everything is blue. I don’t get it.

They’re a trifle too gaudy for my taste, but they’re not outrageously bad. They’re not the worst uniforms (see ST09 and STID for those, not to mention TMP), but not the best (TWoK, TNG series and movies). They do, however, suggest evolution from ENT to later eras and resemble the Kelvin uniforms. Ultimately we’re going to judge the show much more on stories, characterization, etc., not uniforms.

Honestly…the more I see about STD everyday…the more I realize they’re rewriting Trek for the kids…they didn’t want a complex story so all the young one with short attention spans will stick around…so in lieu of story we get explosions and endless scenes of grit.

@Sprotia — well as long as they don’t write 10 minutes of pointless technobabble into every episode … I’ll take a little straight forward drama that doesn’t jump the story around a dozen timelines every season, with a little more excitement than self psychoanalytic exploration for the remaining 30 minutes …

Lord no, there was enough techno-jibber jabber in TNG’s first hundred hours to spread out over 15 different series. If they start solving problems with last minute bullshit re-engineering of the sensor array I’m out! I already made the mistake of sticking with all of TNG in hopes for improvement. I won’t go down that rocky road again, it’s a dead end street.

@VZX — Abrams was trying to capitalize on nostalgia and familiarity. It didn’t really work past the initial movie. Keep in mind Abrams moved to other single color uniforms when off ship. Just as TOS did on the big screen. Even TNG moved into rather drab solid black uniforms with colored accents as a result of its ascent to feature films. I’m sorry you feel these uniforms are worse than the garish birth of color-TV era uniforms introduced in the 1960s, but they’re actually pretty cool, and lend themselves to an equally compelling and modern cinematic look. It’s not 1960 anymore, and this series looks to the next generation of fans, not pandering to the nostalgia of the aging baby boomers and their kids.

Even so. Asymmetrical collars, just too weird. I can live with it, but sure wish they’d kept it simple.

Hoo Boy, this one is going to attract some rather heated commentary. My opinion is still that post-TUC, pre-TNG would have been appropriate. There’s 70 unspoken-for years in there. And they still could have done the Sarek/Burnham thing.

As to post-TNG era, I would have been interested in that, too.

I REALLY hope they have a compelling reason for setting it pre-TOS. Otherwise, I’m pretty thrilled with everything else we’ve seen so far.

Yes I agree, I think the post TUC era probably would’ve been the best and satisfy both people who wanted a prequel but also people who wanted to go farther in the future. This idea was good because it at least tapped an era we oddly still know little about. And it would’ve been great we get a melding of both TOS and TNG era meaning we could get stuff like Cardassians along with more Klingons. And based on this article it was really only set in the pre-TOS era because that was the era Fuller wanted to start with. After his analogy idea was rejected he stayed in this one because more than likely thats what he developed first and they were rushing for the show to start getting made already.

But I agree I’m excited for most things based on what I seen.

” My opinion is still that post-TUC, pre-TNG would have been appropriate. ”

I kinda agree. That is an era that one would think could have a lot of interesting things going on. But they didn’t so what are you gonna do?

ML31 – ha, I’m going to watch it anyway, like everyone else here, of course!

Enterprise B was my pick. Unlike the vocal minority here I don’t whine about my choice not being selected incessantly.

This era is still pretty wide open to be explored creatively.

@ML31 — it’s so odd to see someone embrace a different unexplored era as having a lot of interesting things going on, as if the DISC era is any less interesting.

@Cadet – exactly. “How dare it be a prequel, that is done to death and sucks and is boring. Should have been between TOS and TNG” hahahahaha

Again not everyone hates the idea of a prequel, they simply don’t love this time period, thats all. Most are just not excited about yet another pre-TOS show after we already got that with Enterprise. People just want to at the very least move beyond TOS, thats all.

Tiger – let’s be honest, the bast majority of the whining from the minority is to say Prequels suck and it should have been post Nemesis. They arent saying its this specific era per se.

I preferred Enterprise B as an era to explore. But Im not getting my panties in a bunch over it. Also I dont wear panties.

Yes…because they want to rewrite trek for the kids…pissing all over canon and trying to make Trek Star Wars 2.0

What the heck are you even trying to say?

This is upsetting. I would have much preferred going through different eras. I would have even enjoyed a scenario where They started out from the future and were thrown back in time.

Well, they could still go through different eras. CBS just wanted to start with one and see how it goes.

They wont…as much as i’d love to see it, it would be too costly to completely rebuild the Trek Universe for each season/era.

There’s still a chance the story could leap forward at some point, if not on a seasonal basis. I’d love to see it happen.

There’s no evidence it was ever intended to be a time travel story, or even any connection between the different stories. Only that we’d have followed different crews in different time periods.

Could have been good, could have been terribly anti-climactic.

I’ve been a big proponent of an anthology Trek series, but do you REALLY think the show’s current bunch of critics would suddenly be loving it if just because it were an anthology? No, these guys are dead set on hating it, and would have found the negatives:

“Ugh, this is dumb, it takes away any chance of audiences getting hooked if you are constantly changing the cast!”

“Stupid idea, i want to follow one ship and one crew!”

“This is a stupid gimmick and typical CBS who is clearly just trying to throw sh%t at a wall and hoping something sticks!”

“Dumb to jump around in the timeline, just makes it more confusing. I want post Nemesis only!”

“They’re clearly trying to placate TOS fans by having some episodes in that time period, an obvious attempt to once again squeeze life out of that old tired show!”

“They’re clearly trying to appeal to the stupid TNG boring-era fanboys by setting some episodes in that time period. I want to see TOS era!”

…and on and on and on…

Again, we had a taste of “jumping around timelines” in GENERATIONS. Neither crew’s story was well-developed. Granted, some of this was poor execution, but at least there we had two well-respected actors with a long history, rather than tabula rasa. (And really, in the Trekverse, humans shouldn’t be time travelling at will for many centuries.)

Too bad it played out as it did. Sounds like his plans might have made a lot of fans happy, myself included. But it sounds like the studio decided Fuller would be too hard to rein in and went with something they felt they had more control over. (And for the record, Semel has directed some exceptionally good television, so hard to see the issue there.)

Money was clearly an issue too, as having to retool sets, ships and costumes on a seasonal basis would have been prohibitively expensive.

But there’s still much to be hopeful for, based on what we’ve seen thus far.

Genevieve Bujold is a very good actress, but she just didn’t work as Janeway. I don’t know anything about Mr. Semel or directing, but perhaps Fuller didn’t think he was a good fit for Trek despite him being a good director?

The studio clearly has bottled it and chickened out for a more generic sci fi show. So frustrating. Bring back Berman!

Bring back Berman? No thanks. He was getting stale.

@80sDude — thank you. Berman would likely have no idea how to make a compelling TV show of any kind today, much less Star Trek for the next generation. There’s a reason why THE ORVILLE looks like TNG 2, because Branon Braga is just as severely stuck in the 90s and the stagnation of an easy paycheck earned over almost two decades doing exactly the same formulaic crap.

The reason Orville looks like TNG2 is probably because they are purposefully going for a TNG spoof (or homage if you prefer). We haven’t seen enough of the writing to know if it’s typical Brannon Braga. Of course you can accuse him of only taking the job because it would allow him to recycle his old ideas in a new comedy package but there’s no way of knowing, yet.

I would have no problem if Berman came back. But I’m sure he would stay far away at this point and sadly can’t blame him.

Berman was toxic 20 years ago…he would be a death sentence. This series is coming off the heels of the wildly successful JJ Trek, not following Trek’s ultimate collapse when Berman was helming Nemesis and Enterprise.

Your definition of ‘wildly successful’ may be different than mine. I say this both as a Trek fan and as an accountant. .-)

Financially, the first and second JJ films were wildly successful. Only the third wasn’t, and even then it still turned a profit for the studio.

Not true. STID was probably really the only one that was a big success but still only marginal compared to most film budgets that size. The first film was a success but it basically flopped overseas. To make just $130 million from a $150 million film is pretty bad when overseas is where these big tent pole films make most of their money.

In reality the KT films were never big. Decent sure, but not a big runaway success Paramount could brag about like the Transformer films and the last few MI films and thats really the issue.

You don’t want generic sci-fi show but you want Berman running Trek? Those are two things that ARE mutually exclusive!

I for one am really glad they ditched the anthology show idea. Part of what makes TV shows so good is the years-long storylines and attachments that we the audience have with the characters. I feel like the drama and impact would be lessened with only 1 season per era to work with, especially in the modern age of TV with only 10-13 episodes per season. I’d rather see another full-fledged spin-off than an anthology.

I wish they kept the tri-color uniforms too, but the uniforms we’re getting are beautiful.

A lot of movies achieve decent character development in just 2 hours, so a 16 hour season should be able to do it just fine.

After seeing Crisis on NBC a few summers back I have been thinking that single season story line would be an interesting idea for Star Trek. Crisis was excellent, and had they tried to extend it multiple seasons it would have either been boring or too far fetched.

I think with Star Trek there are plenty of short 8 to 16 episode story lines that could be explored, where you need more time than a 2 hour movie, but not enough story to fill years.

– Maybe have a season take place at Star Fleet Academy
– or in some small village city on Earth.
– or on a star base
– or on new planet colony

Any of these could be set in the same time period or vastly different time periods.

I mean, most of what we have seen up until now are problems occurring on planets or space stations when the Enterprise swoops in to save the day, but there could be plenty of science fiction stories where the normal crew stationed there is able to save the day. Basically a one-off event that is significant to the history of the federation and Earth but doesn’t justify years of adventures from the same group of people.

Just a side note but TOS was 79 ep over 3 seasons – I’d LOVE to get back to that production level

And most of them were shite. It’s difficult to produce quality level drama, very difficult. I’d rather have ten or thirteen top level episodes than 27 with mostly filler and fluff.

The quality is not directly related to season length.

The main difficulty is when they get into writing a single story that spans 10+ episodes. I mean it’s not like these 10 episode short seasons are taking twice as long to create, and it’s also not like every 10 episode series doesn’t have crappy episodes.

I think the key difference is whether it’s episodic or fully serlized. There are plenty of examples over the years of long season show with 15-20 good episodes, even if they have a few crappy ones.

Season length has a direct impact on quality. When you have to pump out 26 episodes a season, focus moves away from making the best possible show, to moving episode from page to stage to screen quickly and efficiently.

Think about those numbers: with 26 episodes a year they have TWO WEEKS to film a one-hour episode. Movies routinely spend 8-12 MONTHS producing just TWO HOURS of film.

On an elaborate FX-laden sci-fi show, producing an episode in 2 weeks is especially difficult, and producers on all Trek series’ have lamented how even good episodes could have been much better had they had just another week to tweak the script, reshoot a scene or two, or spend a few more days in editing.

Exactly. That innovation alone is what produced the second golden age of TV we’re privileged to be living in. THE SOPRANOS, HOUSE OF CARDS, THE AMERICANS, BREAKING BAD, and OCCUPIED, to cite some of my favorites, all have 10-15 episodes per season, and there’s almost never a bad one in the bunch.

Imagine how much better TNG would have been had we been treated to “the essential TNG” from all those lists, and ditched the annual Lwaxana Troi episodes, wacky Ferengi episodes, Wild West episodes, etc.

This leaves a sour taste of meddling from CBS. I dont know if I wouldve liked the new, reset storyline each season, but if they couldve found a way to explore a continuing storyline that would weave through each era, season to season, that could be cool. Wouldve opened a virtually endless door to other stories, characters, and events that have been touched upon in trek history. I also wouldve preferred the standard red/blue/gold uniforms for this timeline.

The most disapponting aspect of this for me was that someone finally wanted to go forward…and again we get a prequel. I want DSC to succeed, but if it doesnt, this article could point to the show being in the wrong hands at CBS.

Yes but now we at least understand WHY its a prequel…it was only suppose to be the first of many eras. It all makes sense now. My guess is Fuller wanted to do the anthology idea and that Discovery was going to start that off and he developed the story line for this season but only intended for it to just be a one season show and why he decided to do just one story line for it. So that would feel ‘complete’ and he could go on to another time period and do the same thing.

Yeah it sounds so ambitious but probably too ambitious for CBS. Again I like the idea as well but you have to see it from a corporation perspective, it would have costed additional millions every season redoing everything from all the sets, replacing the actors, new uniforms, etc. I think it wouldve been cool though to see a bit of Star Trek ‘history’ every season and FINALLY go beyond the 24th century and see stories there as well. It will probably happen some day obviously.

It sounds like CBS was open to the idea but wanted to see how Discovery performed first. There has been nothing leaked about story ideas for further seasons. SO its entirely possible that they do jump years in Season 2. Maybe the “new way to fly” leads to Discovery as a time travel ship. Maybe it already is.

You’re right and IF so I would love that. To jump different time periods would be great. We keep hearing these vague rumors Discovery isn’t just some ordinary Starfleet ship and looking at it, it seems to suggest that. I guess we’ll see.

What’s clear is the meddling was to make it less “Star Trekky”. That makes me sad.

Oh please. You have no idea what you are saying. It was clearly a budgetary decision. A series where the sets, the cast, the unifoms, the cgi changed every season would cost a stupid amount of money.

Besides, how would you get invested in the characters or have growth if the cast changed every season?

I would be invested in the big picture: the storyline. Not crazy about the anthology idea but if it were done right, it could work. It would certainly go with their rumored plan of killing off characters. I just like the idea that someone was actually looking and planning past the 2370’s…but unfortunately thats been taken away for now.

Its sad he was let go with his fountain of ideas, but my concern is the reportedly complex storyline pitch that had to be watered down. It sounds like The Cage and Star Trek Beyond all over again.

@TS1701 — every studio meddles in the productions they finance — many times they improve the product, sometimes not. So far there’s no evidence this production is headed in the wrong direction. All I’m reading here is that some fans don’t like the choices being made. Just like many fans at the time hated the choices TNG made. Indeed, it was only after the studio got more involved and Roddenberry dropped out that TNG began to really take off. And look how that turned out.

Hasn’t it been widely speculated that CBS “meddling” led to a far better SFX team coming in?

So he faced a battle of egos intent on re-inventing the wheel in their own image. Very sad, because he would have respected established Trek history to a far greater degree.

That’s a very declarative statement.
How do you know this?

I work in this business and Dr. Image’s assessment is very likely spot-on. The ego’s belong to the execs, the showrunner is at their mercy. He had a vision, they had very specific expectations of what Star Trek should be and what a new series should include. This show was developed solely to allow CBS All Access to gain traction.

I think this is probably the reason Gene Roddenberry used the syndication model for Star Trek: TNG. No studios telling him safe and reliable is the only way forward.

No, my question was: what evidence do you have that Fuller would have ‘respected canon’ to a greater extent than is happening already?

Yup. He was a true fan. I’m not so sure you can say that so much about the folks on it now.

I couldn’t say, but from what I’ve read I’ll bet a Kirsten Beyer could smoke you in a Trek trivia contest.

Irritating that they fired him because of the delays. And then the show still ended up delayed.

I suspect it was more because of creative differences and going over budget.

To be fair though the article did state it was the schedule itself that was the biggest issue. But I don’t doubt those others were pretty big on their own but it sounds like Fuller conceded on budget and story ideas. I think he compromised those but what actually got him fired was not delivering the show he ultimately did make on time. But those other issues probably made it easier for both to walk away.

I think whats interesting about all of this is the same reason why they wanted Fuller is probably the same reason they clashed because he has become known as having a very strong vision and he micro manage everything but that always leads to a lot of delays on his shows trying to get everything just right. He’s basically the James Cameron of TV lol. AFAIK all his shows have gone over budget and been delayed, oddly including American Gods itself. But that show only had 8 episodes and wasn’t trying to launch an entire streaming platform.

It might have been much more delayed otherwise.

@Michael Hall,

You don’t know that.

What part of ‘might’ did you not understand?

Playing semantics? The implication in your comment is very clear.

About the anthology idea, I think it really could have worked fantastically, and would have given us views so many interesting eras of our universe. But I agree with those saying it would be prohibitive budget-wise. However, shows like American Horror Story and Fargo are both very well done, very popular and follow that formula – though most likely less expensive.

@Danpaine — and confusing. Trek needs to get back on its feet, not jump around timelines. A good solid, relatable series can be spun off into a myriad of concepts once the basics are established.

Even if we don’t get an anthology show, I am sure that the producers are aware that seasons run in themes, like Mad Men and The Wire. So, even if we don’t get totally different eras, the characters that don’t die, will live to change…

That’s why I’m so enthused about the serialized format, whatever my other reservations about the show. We don’t need another TOS, TNG, or even DS9. Trek needs to change with the times in order to survive, and I for one much prefer the change of serialized storytelling to dumbing it down a la JJ Abrams.

Absolutely agree with that. Any show I watch religiously these days is serialized, whether it be for multi or just one season.

I think a half and half blend between serialized and episodic is my preferred style. For example going back to J.J Abrams, I liked Alias a lot, but LOST was too serialized. On Syfy today, Dark Matter has the right blend of stand alone episodes with a larger story arc. NBC’s Timeless is another good example.

The strictly serialized stories that literally cut off the episode in the middle of the story line are too tiring to watch in the long run. I specifically avoid those that are aired in a weekly fashion and wait for them to reach a streaming platform.

So here’s me hoping Star Trek Disovery is a blend, and not just a 15 hour movie that was chopped up.

Won’t story dictate what happens in the next season. Season one, accidentally war.
Season two, exploration of a particular complex solar system. plus friendly competition with Klingons
It doesn’t have to be that expensive: Stranger Things used only a few sets to create 9 amazing episodes and they were used repeatedly; the Expanse has a realistic clarity that also has fun and optimism. So they could build and focus one solid Avatar-quality world.

Never watched As The World Turns, or All My Children…don’t care for soap operas. That’s all Trek and all these other shows have done, is adopt the soap opera model Makes an engaging first run, then the thrill is gone. Like an old fashioned mini-series. You invest deeply for 15 episodes. Then the love affair is over until next year. It can’t sustain itself without watching it in 15 hour blocks. Fans will watch it as long as it’s on the air, but I predict massive non-interest once it stops production. There’s nothing to revisit…unless they cleverly drop the long arcs into specific one-shots…but it doesn’t sound like that at all Sounds like Klingon war. That’s it. And the soap opera of their lives as they fight it. And of course die…so the new bunch of similar personalities can be brought in to continue the dynamics established. Just rearranging the chairs on the deck. That’s the Walking Dead model. Wash, rinse and repeat. Damn shame they kicked Fuller to the curb.

Since there’s no indication that Fuller didn’t intend to produce a serialized show, your last sentence is a bit of a non-sequitir

You’re right, I think the idea of independent seasons somehow got into my thinking and I was applying it to the individual episodes. In fact, I’m pretty sure Fuller would have had an arc of some sort, to flesh out the characters throughout each individual season. I still hate that they kicked him to the curb, Trek needs a strong creative singular vision not dictated by the bean counters…but I really have no reason to believe he would’ve produced stand alone stories. Stand alone seasons…yes. Episodes? Probably not.

“I still hate that they kicked him to the curb, Trek needs a strong creative singular vision not dictated by the bean counters”

Except that Fuller was dividing his attention among multiple projects, not just Trek. That’s hardly a “strong creative vision.”

“That’s all Trek and all these other shows have done, is adopt the soap opera model…You invest deeply for 15 episodes. Then the love affair is over until next year.”

Huh? That’s the polar opposite of the soap opera model. Soap operas play *daily.*

And as for the love affair being over…HOUSE OF CARDS? BREAKING BAD? The latter is over and the tourists are *still* flooding Albuquerque for tours.

If Discovery is a (financial) hit they will undoubtedly proceed with a spinoff. Whether this will be in a different time period, as Fuller envisioned, is impossible to tell.

And let’s remember Nick Meyer is already working on SOMETHING, maybe for CBS, maybe not, but definitely Star Trek. :-P

I know. But that SOMETHING being a new new Star Trek show is too good to be true.. right? :)

Cumberbatch is a wonderful actor. Lousy for Khan though. Part of that was terrible story and direction. But still…

I think CBS has learned its lesson from when DS9 and VOY ran concurrently: there was Trek overload. I doubt we’ll ever see two concurrent series again. If Meyer is really working on a serious project, it’s more likely to be either a movie or miniseries.

…Personally I think it will be a stand alone Khan movie…Perhaps “Star Trek: Khan – The Eugenics War” or something like that. Cumberbatch would star in it.

But he is working for CBS, not Paramount. So Cumberbath/Khan is impossible.

Apparently he is working on a Star Trek TV show for the CW.

Cumberbatch is a great actor. But a terrible Khan.

Like characters evolving, I think also the uniforms will evolve into TOS uniforms as the series progresses over the years. Wouldn’t that be nice?

I think it would be great if the uniforms eventually gravitated towards that, yes. Surely not the same as TOS, not 60’s ‘retro,’ but similar enough to throw us ‘old people’ a bone and showing respect to continuity as well.

Please let Michelle Yeoh survive the carnage.

Wow so the anthology idea WAS actually real this whole time. It wasn’t just some bizarre rumor, he really did want to explore multiple time periods. And for all the people hollering they can never go post Nemises, get a clue already. Obviously that was the plan and in fact it now makes total sense WHY Discovery is at the period its in because it sounds like this was suppose to be the start of a long various time line through centuries. But when CBS said no, they just stayed here instead of advancing. Oddly we are only in this era because this was simply suppose to be the first one. Wow, very interesting. For the record though I have to agree with CBS. Sure the idea of an anthology show with different crews, ships and eras sounds like great fun for us but I think they fear its harder to keep fans if you switch out their favorite characters every year. And yes probably more expensive as well completely redoing all the sets and uniforms every season. But its also why I liked Bryan Fuller he clearly had a really deep vision of where he wanted to see Star Trek going. Even with Discovery its clear he’s trying to do something vastly different and why even though I hate its a prequel I’m excited to see it because its only one in name only. Again I think thats a big risk but I’m excited about it. And now knowing… Read more »

Thank you, Ahmed for the nice synopsis…

looks like the intelligent tasteful people here were correct, in that Fuller was our guy, but he got blocked by the suits =(

Fuller’s vision would have been awesome, i have no doubt… would have saved us from these crappy #startrekdisco TRACKSUITS at least! =(

so, this will probably be the usual: crap for dumbasses… thanks kurtzman! =(

Sorry to get off topic here but I think its wrong to call Madam Secretary a ‘procedural’. I just started watching it a few months ago (on All Access ;)) and I have to say I am really impressed with that show. Yeah it kind of started off that way but it blossomed into a really complex and smart show with tons of threads. I just finished the season 2 finale yesterday so its on my mind lol.

Sorry about the rant.

Glad did not go past TNG.. thought do wish they had some Excelsior motion picture series in there. The TMP movie era had awesome ships, uniforms with an exciting universe (see classic Trek DC Comics in the 80s/90s for how Trek should have went). Post TNG you have three choices: 1) TNG in Andromeda which is basically the same as TNG and Voyager (perfect humans, with unlimited energy going warp 9.99999999999999 with unbeatable shields, replicators that can create anything needed exploring a universe where everyone wants to be like us progressive humans when we aren’t playing in the holodeck.. how could the audience ever decline with an exciting proposition??) 2) The Federation collapses that there is conflict like the proposed cartoon series, a battle to restore the Federation. I thought TNG was boring as hell but I do like the optimism in Trek; how sad that all our Trek adventures ended up with a destroyed Federation? 3) Counter-revolution.. the Federation realizes it lost it’s way post-TOS and everything is falling apart as it is becoming a dictatorship/authoritarian regime on par with the Borg and the frontier with a collection of truly alien species being wronged must save it. Yeah, that might work but if pre-TOS upsets TNG fans this would give them a heart attack. There is a reason why all roads lead to the TOS era, I just wish the studio realized why they keep coming back to the same conclusion and then embrace the Wagon Train to the… Read more »

@Cmd.Bremmon,

I guess that I need to correct my earlier reply to you and make it “all of your comments”

————————

But it’s not surprising giving that half of your comments here and on other threads are just bashing of TNG for no reason, I guess you’re one of those zealous TOS fans who are stuck in the 60s.

I feel that I presented a convincing argument on reasons why post TNG will not work. I look forward to counter arguments to the above on why it would.

@Cmd.Bremmon,

You didn’t. You’re only limited by your imaginations and in this case by your own TNG biases.

They could go anywhere from an expanded Federation that explores other galaxies, to a Federation confronting a powerful new adversary, a Type III civilization for example.

I’m glad that Gene Roddenberry back in the 80s didn’t stand back in horror thinking there is no way to move forward after TOS. I mean, how do you replace iconic figures like Kirk and Spock, how could anyone come up with something interesting when they have already seen a faster-than-light spaceship, Gods among the stars, alien enemies, space war, killer robots, time travel?

A post TOS show will never ever work for sure. /s

That’s just not true – pre-TOS Roddenbery specifically puts a limit on the timeframe to ensure the stories are exciting. “The time is…. close enough to our own time for our characters to be fully identifiable as people like us”. He specifically talks Wagon Train to the Stars and Horatio Hornblower to put the TOS crew in a time where space exploration is new and full of limitations and conflict. The farther into the future you go, the more perfect (and boring) the people become. Class III civilization – how is that going to differ from fighting the Borg sphere (only now it’s the size of the solar system, and the Enterprise is the size of a planet)????

Ah.. I see the problem. You think I like TOS because of the phasers, communicators and ships were cooler than TNG. The only part of that which is true is that they were cooler. The real reason why I think TNG ended up forgettable is because the universe and technology were no longer ” close enough to our own time for our characters to be fully identifiable as people like us”. Fair enough some people out there might relate to characters with free energy, no conflict where all get along, no personal flaws, no cash needed, space exploration is so common place that you go play in the holodeck . I think Roddenbery made a HUGE mistake in not moving Trek forward after ST:VI to Sulu and the the Excelsior and/or Saavik or even David Marcus because that universe had no free energy and was full of conflict. The good news is that we both win. You get holodecks and free energy on Orville, the rest of us that want to see space exploration as new, dangerous, conflict filled filled with Gods among the stars, alien enemies, space war, killer robots, time travel, etc have Star Trek Discovery… hopefully.

Personally, I’d like to see ORVILLE actually have to deal with losing the free energy and the rest, just the way I wish TNG had to. Finding out replication is bad for the universe is something I wished so hard they would have to do on TNG, but all they did was genuflect in that direction with the warpdrive is ripping the uni a new one, and then they just pretended it didn’t happen for the most part afterward.

You and I are in agreement about the post TUC universe (not that GR was in any position to direct things at that point, having been removed from authority over a decade earlier, and, incidentally, being dead), it is THE one rife with potential, since you have the political paranoia evident in SFS and TUC but you don’t have the free energy/something for nothing tech in place yet.

Why would Orville deal with that? It’s a comedy.

Ahmed doesn’t like Discovery but wants his preferences explored because you;re only limited by your imagination. Uh huh.

Well thank god you don’t write for Star Trek.

I’m still excited for the show but I’d be a liar if Fuller’s version didn’t sound leagues better. Exactly what I feared has happened. They are trying to mainstream it and give us *yawn* Hollywood’s ideas of “dark and gritty”. More dumbed down, for the masses JJ Trek style stuff. This concerns me greatly. It is criminal to dump someone who understands Trek in favour of perpetual failures like the atrocious Akiva Goldsman.

Oh well. I’ll still give it a go.

It would have been cool if the protagonist was a Vulcan or some species (that looked human of course so the audience could relate) that lived for centuries. That way there would be someone who we could follow throughout all of the time periods. While this an ambitious project, it may have been a little to ‘heady’ for the majority of viewers. I don’t know. I’m torn.

I get a sense that was the idea. Perhaps Burnham was a Vulcan, maybe altered to look human as some sort of social experiment. Maybe just a Vulcan. Didn’t Fuller describe her as not quite human?

To save money, they could have had the ship remain constant over a century as well. You would have to eventually make changes but it would be less than doing complete re designs every season.

That’s true. Make the ship the same and do some subtle redresses a la ‘Yesterday’s Enterprise’ or ‘Future Imperfect’ as the show moves forward. While I’m intrigued by the idea, I just think it’s a little too inside baseball for mainstream audiences. While American Horror Story has the ability to tell new and interesting stories year after year, there’s a loss felt after each season because audiences lose the connection to the characters they just started to feel ties toward. You also run the risk of having a wonderful first year, but abysmal second year if the premise doesn’t work, see True Detective as an example.

What I wouldn’t mind seeing is the show advancing several years each season. Make every year a theme. Perhaps year 1 is the Klingon War while Year 2 deals more with exploration of a particular phenomena. There are so many directions this could go.

We’ll never know how they would have translated to the screen but on paper Fuller’s vision was interesting and something I would have liked to see. Maybe it’s a “grass always greener on the other side of the fence” kind of thing but while I’m curious to see how Discovery turns out, Fuller’s pitch sounded more interesting even thought-provoking.

@TonyD — it sounded like a big, poorly thought out mess to me. And not one that would help attract new fans. There’s a big difference between dumbing down something and making it understandable to a new audience. ENT lost its audience with the incredibly confusing XINDI season with all time travel all the time. I’m a lifelong fan, and I had no idea what was going on half the time, or why. Stories like Fuller was proposing might work for a secure fan base, but Trek has been off the air for well over a decade with some very different movies, with varying degrees of success, spread out over almost as much time. The first thing anyone needs to do with the franchise is establish a new stable platform for growth. I feel for these old fans around here, but CBS cannot blindly continue churning out Trek for 50+ year old fans, especially the ones who grew up during the Berman era. It’s mind boggling that fans from that era don’t recognize how much Trek mutated from TOS, and how a similar transformation is necessary now. Each era of Trek speaks to a new generation, with new sensibilities. And just as TNG left many TOS fans behind, so will DiSC leave many TNG fans behind. But just like TNG it will attract a whole new fan base to help keep the franchise alive and thriving for the next generation.

I agree. This has happened to Fuller before where he and his supporters take the side of the creative freedom of the creator. But that doesn’t mean its good.

Fullers ideas could have been better. He might even have pulled it off. Or his ideas were great but he wasn’t organized or available enough to pull it off. Or, CBS is correct and its better for their decision to fire Fuller. Either way, its CBS’ property and Fuller couldn’t play nicely so he’s gone.

cbs LISTEN to Bryan Fuller

cbs DO WHAT YOU FEEL is best for the franchise.

Off topic…with the staff seems pretty occupied with Discovery at the moment, Karl Urban’s interview on Screen Rant slid under the radar. He’d love to do Trek 4…..if it’s greenlit.

I think it’s going to be a while before Trek is back on the big screen.

Bet the Star Wars movies doing well plus nay success with Star Trek Discovery will move up that movie date. Hopefully we get to see the Beyond Enterprise-A in action soon!!!

@Cmd — nope. Paramount is losing its third party investors. The Chinese investor that made beyond possible is about to go away. Chances are Paramount is going to focus on its biggest franchises, and that’s not Trek after STID and STB. MIssion Impossible and Transformers will likely get whatever bankroll they are able to secure, the rest will go to keep the studio afloat … Paramount is going to need to stabilize before they try to make Trek work again … And that’s not going to be any time soon.

It does depend on whether they see Trek as a third tentpole. So far, with only Transformers and M:I are simply not enough. Look at the franchise lineup of other studios. If they don’t have a surprise hit coming up (and I really don’t see that), they would probably be more inclined to follow an agressive strategy and push a fourth Trek. Especially considering that Discovery on CBS is basically some free advertising for Paramount. Transformers has rund its course, Wahlberg and Bay are exiting, and the spin-offs are a gamble. Same for M:I. Cruise wont go on forever, and handing it over to another IMF operative is tricky (There’s Jeremy Renner, but he’s already out of this one because of Avengers, he’s no leading man and he almost killed the Borne franchise when they hired him to replace Damon). Money issues aside, Paramount’s future isn’t looking good.

I think if we get a Trek 4, its the studio going with someone other than Bad Robot and providing a smaller, strict budget.

A better idea is, wait to see if Discovery is popular and let CBS produce a film.

@Alex — by your own explanation, BEYOND has also kind of signaled this cast has run its course. With dwindling financial resources, investing in Trek again now with this same cast and producers after failing returns of STID and BEYOND would be a much bigger gamble with what little capital they have than investing in another tried and true brand like Transformers and MI, which most recently are still making big money, even if the next film may be the one that tanks. I have no doubt they view Trek as a tentpole franchise, but if they can only afford one or two tentpoles a year for the next couple of years until they get back on their feet, Trek seems like a huge gamble for that money. By the time they get back on their financial feet again, Paramount might be a whole different kind of studio.

Paramount moved pretty quick to slap the ‘franchise’ label on Top Gun when the sequel was announced. I’d agree they are looking for a viable franchise, but it doesn’t seem to be Trek. Until the financial situation stabilizes at Paramount, there’s nothing in their current slate of films to suggest they will be producing Trek anytime soon.

Trek CAN be a viable franchise– even today– as long as they are realistic about their expectations. It won’t be a series of billion dollar blockbusters. It can’t sustain a film every year.

But with a modest budget, a Trek film every 2-3 years could earn a solid $300-$350M at the box office.

CinemaBlend isn’t pulling punches, but they don’t list their sources, either. No big screen outing has been greenlit, nor in development, according to these guys.

It may be a long time before Trek is back on the big screen.

http://www.cinemablend.com/news/1686080/another-star-trek-actor-is-hoping-for-a-fourth-movie

Not that Discovery looks bad, but I am tired of Star Trek living in its past. They went back with Enterprise, rebooted in the Kelvin universe and now Discovery. Can someone please start to move it forward. Not that these arent valid shows/movies but I think that’s way it suffers. No forward momentum and continually fighting it’s own continuity.

Wow. Sad Mr. Fuller didn’t get to fully realize his vision. Subdued uniform style, advancing through different eras. Bold moves. Something I would have enjoyed seeing. Sounds fresh and exciting, like the kind of show a streaming company like Netflix would have done. CBS is still thinking like an over the air broadcaster.

CBS is probably thinking like a business that isn’t going to spend an open-ended unlimited budget on a tv show.

The fact that Discovery was supposed to be an anthology series was published nearly a year ago. Google it.

..ok, it was the ‘anthology’ idea that I recall actually intrigued the fan base and ‘non-fans’ alike, which since the berman days and the nex gen movies..’we just have to make a trek movie that will appeal to more than just trek fans’ which most fans thought was a direct insult since there are millions across the this blue marble we call a home and proof more he couldn’t actually stand trek and we fans..to an ends is what cbs is doing..they don’t give a damn if its real trek. I’m gay, I don’t care if trek has its first gay crewman, or that there will be a muslim character. I’ve said it on other blogs, GR is shouting from the heavens that this isn’t his trek..his characters were of different backgrounds yes, but it wasn’t thrown in our faces to garner publicity and (possible) ratings

@snoopytrek — thanks for telling us what Roddenberry is doing in “heaven” … And completely discrediting yourself. Good job.

..notice I said ‘heavens’ which could apply as anywhere in the cosmos. obviously didn’t read what I wrote yet became offended thinking I was making somesort of religious reference. ive never seen so much anger one blog

There’s a quote from Gene from the 80s where he said something about hoping Trek would live on well past him, and he hoped younger filmmakers with different styles and sensibilities would bring their own unique spin to Trek, and he looked forward to seeing it.

So you don’t know sh&&it about what Gene would think, is what I’m saying.

..yes he did but he was hoping it would be HIS Star Trek, his ideals and vision not a way to bring to the public some sort of political agenda and slap the name of Star Trek on it. other fans ive talked, quite a few, agree

sorry you are angry

I know most of the fans on this site have high hopes for this show overall and I really want to agree, but aside from cool props and uniforms I feel like everything I read is a let down. Between CBS’s direction to decisions made about where this story will take place have been a misstep. Maybe my low expectations will pay off (though I already pay for Netflix, Amazon and Showtime in the US and have zero plans for expanding my streaming budget), but in all, these articles give me zero hope the show will last longer than a season or two max. This feels like another Enterprise.

Not paying to watch this SJW crap.

Good. Then you don’t have to post either.

People are ignorant of the fact that Star Trek has always been socially progressive awesomeness

1960’s middle aged white dude’s opinion on TOS: “I’m not watching this SJW crap”

I really wish that when the mods show up to warn people, that it was the ones with the clear bigoted attitudes. Censorship is almost never a good thing. When its anonymous racists on a Star Trek forum, I dont think anyone would mind.

“A bas la bourgeoisie Vulcain!” The latest Soros directive, straight from SJW HQ.

Look, I know you want to turn Trek into “Birth of a Nation,” but that’s not what the franchise is about.

SJW is nothing new to Trek. You forget that TNG had men in skirts.

Well thaaanks CBS… really, that sort of contempt towards a potential audience makes me rather mad.

When you’re the one risking the hundred million dollars, maybe you’ll feel differently

I went everywhere to try to find this magazine. The only one I could find was the one with Black Panther on the cover.

Wow, so the rumor was actually true? It would have been great if this idea had been realized! But now we are stuck in this time that no one really cares about. No real possibilities of cameos :(.

I doubt we are stuck anywhere, this is Star TREK. One advantage of no one really caring about this era (yet) is that it makes it just that much harder to fuck it up.

Personally what I always wanted was probably much like many non-E TOS era fan productions: another TOS era starship that wasn’t Kirk. IDK why that’s never been done.maybe this can become that.

Trek the universe or franchise is not essentially about any particular characters, or even an Instiution. Star Trek can actually “be” anything. It could even be a whole season only 50 or 60 years into our future! Who knows?

“nobody” sure is a loose term considering a lot of fans are excited for the show, even if you and others are not.

Wow. Apparently CBS didn’t want someone with real vision, just more of the status-quo…just make it serialized so it appears to be ground-breaking. Could have really had something unique, an anthology, through the ages. Damn shame they insisted on playing it safe. And with Star Trek no less…the one property that really could be setting trends instead of following them. Sad.

Im glad that EW did this digging and that CBS isn’t hiding any of the fact by not letting EW publish this, kudos to CBS for that. I am a little pissed to hear some of Bryan’s brilliant ideas were rejected, like the anthology, deeper allegory and the event tri colour uniforms. Bryan Fuller, Bryan Singer, and Ron Moore are the three more brilliant and capable people to lead a Star Trek series BAR NONE! We all know Star Trek is about moving forward yet CBS and Paramount want to retread over eras that have been explored. There are plenty of years after Archer and before Kirk to explore. After Kirk and before Picard to explore. And everything post Voyager. Yet CBS and Paramount are hell bent on remaining in this era. Why? Because Kirk and Spock are synonymous with Star Trek and even non Trekkies know who they are. Great marketing idea to bring in more people more money, but thats not always what is best for Star Trek. At the very least I hope it does bring in new fans and that they go back and explore older Star Trek. Regardless, I am beyond excited for Discovery as well as another Kelvin movie. We can only hope Discovery does well enough, they bring back Bryan and allow him to realize his dream of an anthology series which will eventually end up post Voyager. That it does well enough to bring in new fans who will explore past Star… Read more »

I have been pushing for an anthology Trek series since the mid 90s. But I also realize it’s very cost prohibitive, and I can understand CBS not looking to (essentially) develop 5 different Trek shows at the same time, with 5 different sets of sets, 5 different casts, 5 different ships, sets of designs… that would be an insane production.

Now, I mentioned this a few weeks ago as a guess as to what Meyer could be working on, but what if their compromise was that the anthology be by-the-season, meaning Discovery is designed as a single season story, and the second season will have a different name– “Star Trek: Endeavor” for example– set on another ship, at another time?

The same way Fargo and True Detective have separate casts and stories each year.

I wish trek movie would allow us to edit our posts. What I actually wanted to say in close is…..Its not the time to quibble over minutiae about how the Klingons look or the transporter room. Now is the time for Trekkies to band together and support the franchise we love. Star Trek needs our enthusiasm and support now more than ever.

I would disagree somewhat. While I agree Trekkies should stop focusing on the minutiae, I would never blindly support Trek if it were terrible. If Discovery is not to my liking, I will not support it. And I would not expect anyone, whether justified or not in their hatred of Discovery, to “band together” to get behind it.

If it’s not a good show, it should not survive.

We have no idea if Fuller’s ideas were brilliant.

I do think his idea for an anthology is brilliant. Mostly because I thought of it 20 years ago!

I believe at last year’s panel he was talking about working with the actors from all the series including William Shatner. At least for fans of all the series that would have been interesting.

Well then I’m glad Fuller was axed. We were spared the joke that is William Shatner!

@Tom – that doesnt make it brilliant. We’ve seen some awful ideas for Wiliam Shatner including the one that got filmed and called Generations.

That would’ve been great!!!

“But how does nudity play on Trek? Eh, it feels weird. How does a lot of [profanity] on Trek? Not so great. Are there moments where it merits it that we’re trying to push here and there?”

Wow…that’s a major relief! Nudity on Trek would absolutely feel weird and out of place…eh…universe. I’m glad they arent going that far for the moment. Even TWD doesn’t have it, and that is one helluva messed up show…

As far as “profanity” is concerned… it’s not even an issue outside the US and probably the UK. Swearing and cussing is a non-issue in most countries and would even require a high age certificate. But then again, why force it upon anyone for no reason?
The problem with many R-Rated movies is that they feel they MUST use it to justify the high rating and it feels forced and unnatural to include 100 f-bombs just for the sake of it.

“and would NOT even require a high age certificate.”

I dont think a film gets an R rating before its written. Sometimes, they will admit they are fine with an R rating beforehand in the case of reboots of franchises where fans are concerned about dumbing it down.

I’d hate for any series or film to feel the constraint of being told it HAS to be R or it HAS to be G.

If they write a story for Discovery and it organically makes sense for nudity and profanity, then bring it on.

Love how the critics have– in 24 hours– gone from hating Bryan Fuller to hating the studio for not letting Fuller make the show he wanted. Classic!

Sounds like Fuller wanted to be like Stargate or Dr Who.

What a mess. Beam me outta here.

I was never a fan of Fuller to begin with, but the anthology idea would probably be much better than what Discovery is now. Not to mention Fuller did say that it was possible to see returning characters, like bringing Captain Kirk back from the dead. Hopefully some of the ideas can still come to fruition, but Fuller was a real idiot and shot himself in the foot taking too long to develop the show.

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