Report: Quentin Tarantino And J.J. Abrams Close To Picking Star Trek Screenwriter – Movie Would Be R-Rated

Earlier this week it was reported that Quentin Tarantino and J.J. Abrams were assembling a writing room to hear Tarantino’s pitch for an idea for a Star Trek movie. Today Deadline reports that the “whole thing is moving at warp speed” and Tarantino has already met for hours with three potential writers.

The screenwriting candidates are Mark L. Smith (The Revenant), Lindsey Beer (an up and coming writer with number of summer action movies for 2018), and Drew Pearce (Iron Man 3). Smith is reportedly the front-runner for the job of penning the first draft of what would be the next Star Trek movie.

Revenant screenwriter Mark L. Smith

Tarantino wants it R-rated

Also according to the report, Tarantino has asked for an R-rating for this potential project, which is not surprising given his filmography is almost entirely R-rated films. Deadline says that even though all the recent Trek feature films have been PG-13, Abrams and Paramount have agreed to the stipulation. An R-rating would be a franchise first and a rarity for tentpoles, but with the recent success of Deadpoool and Logan, this seems like something Paramount execs are open to trying with the Trek franchise.

The report also indicates that Tarantino is interested in directing the project. He is currently working on a film about the Manson family due in theaters in August of 2019.

Logan was first film in X-Men franchise with R-rating

TrekMovie will be monitoring this story and providing updates as they occur. Keep checking back to TrekMovie.com for all your Star Trek movie news.

 

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HELL YEAH!

HELL NO!

HELL YEAH!

HELL MAYBE!

Fuk No!

Hella Yeah!

David Alexander Harrison

Purgatory perhaps?

If this is some spin-off movie that is it’s own thing, then I guess that is fine. But an R-rated sequel to Beyond? No thank you.

(FYI: Picture in the article is from Days of Future Past, not Logan)

But of course it’s from Logan! It’s during the sequence in the Las Vegas hotel when Professor X is having a seizure.

I’m with you on this. Definitely Logan.

Yes the image now is definitely Logan. It was a different image from when I posted my comment, they’ve since changed it.

Please let it be the Kelvin cast. I don’t want *another* new cast now. QT has mentioned City On The Edge of Forever and Yesterday’s Enterprise as 2 of his favourite episodes. They could do a movie where the current cast go back in time and reset the timeline. But they have to fight Nero and the Narada and Kirk gets to meet George Kirk. Or it could be the TNG cast set 20 years after Nemesis ;) ;)

This news seems to be leaning toward a clean start. At this point it’s not a bad idea to just forget any speculation you may have heard up to this point….

I agree. All Star Trek movies have been based on previous crews or reboots of previous crews. Would be cool for a new Star Trek movie, to have a fresh start with a new ship, new crew, one that has not been on screen before.

Guys give up the whole ‘reset the timeline’ thing. Its not happening. No one seem interested in that happening. My guess is they would just reboot the whole thing with a new cast of actors then going that direction.

I would love a TNG film but I don’t think they would go that direction either. My guess is they would want to go like Discovery and just come up with a completely different crew.

Set phasers on decapitate motherf***er!

1) That photo of Jackman isn’t from LOGAN.

2) Those complaining about this potential sequel are ridiculous.

1) Yes it is.

2) Agreed.

Well, it is NOW. They replaced the previous one, which was from one of the other movies.

So…why comment on it in the first place knowing full well the site will probably notice the error and replace the image? Doesn’t matter if the first image is from Logan or not, its the content of the article that is relevant.

The Chadwick,

How would that happen? When FOX calls to tell them they owe them money because they didn’t give permission to use a picture from DAYS OF FUTURE PAST?

and yet I doubt this for 3 reasons, 1. the Studio is not the MPAA, 2. JJ has not been known to do R rated movies, 3. Paramount generally like Trek making money, R rated movies don’t get played in some nations where Trek Did well with Beyond. this to me smells of Clickbait, how would Deadline know what is being talked about at Paramount on the next Star Trek, Paramount has not named a Director yet…

But QT can make movies for very cheap that look great. Spend $100m on it and if it makes $350m it’s a big hit.

The most expensive QT movie is Django I think for $100m

I don’t doubt QT might be the Director of the Project, I doubt JJ and Paramount will want a Rated R Trek, China doesn’t let in that many rated R films, and that is an emerging market that kind of limits those things.

but a few weeks ago we all thought that the Beyond team was still on Board, Really on this one, I wait to tell Paramount or Bad Robot says something.

QT may be able to make a Star Trek movie to me this is likely but to insist that it is Rated R is kind of Strech in my mind, Directors don’t make that call…I think he will end up with a PG-13 movie that skirts that line…

As far as China’s concerned, they’ll just butcher the movie for a release there. I recall reading that their censors just snipped out some of the more extremely gory moments of ALIEN COVENANT for instance, as well as ‘David’ kissing ‘Walter’

If this next TREK movie ends up littered with ultra-violence and ‘F-bombs’, then Paramount and Tarantino would do well just to do their own approved sanitized cut for the likes of that market, to ensure the bucks there.

I don’t mind some F-bombs, I was in the service after all, but the super gory blood-‘n’-brains-flyin’-everywhere stuff, yecchh, not in Trek. There’s been gore, but not the kind Tarantino has glorified in his grindhouse-influenced movies.

Make a tense movie. A character movie. A movie with great dialogue. One that addresses morals and science.

In other words, a good Star Trek movie.

Sounds like the “R” discussion is, yeah, clickbait.

They will probably take the chance of it being R rated just as long as the budget is not that big and probably another reason they want QT because he might make it much cheaper. Both Logan and Deadpool were R rated, but they both had much lower budgets to get it approved. Logan actually had one of the lowest X Men movies since X Men 2. Of course Deadpool is also an X Men movie but its a different timeline (although its hard to figure out between Stewart and McAvoy ;)).

But yes those were much cheaper than the others and yet some of the most profitable. My guess is the movie will still be around $100 million but it won’t be as bloated as Beyond, especially with that rating. But I don’t think no Star Trek film will cost as much as Beyond again. I think they learned their lesson on that.

Yea..and it looked great!

@Bill Peters — THIS IS BY NO MEANS A GREEN LIT MOVIE. Studios and Producers develop scripts all the time, that GO NOWHERE. This looks like one of them.

Could be, could ne not. But it is troublesome nonetheless. Those Parademons seem to hellbent on emulating the success of Deadpool and Logan and that is unfortunate on its own. It’s sell-out time.

The mere idea of an R-Rated Star Trek movie is delicate, let alone one involving QT. Now, if Ridley Scott was to answer that call, I’d be trying to keep an open mind. At least, the guy knows his limits and knows the difference between boundary crossing and boundary pushing.

Emulating Deadpool? What? Tarantino is one of the best directors of this generation, a life long Star Trek Fan (TOS and TNG) and JJA is producing. This is the stuff that makes dreams come true.

“Tarantino is one of the best directors of this generation”

I’ve always hated Tarantino, even decades before I had even bothered about main mainstream franchises turning R-Rated.
Those issues of mine started in 2017 and I definintely agree that there are very good R-Rated movies and TV-MA shows out there which I’d like to appreciate, only outside Star Trek!

But QT? He has always been a no-go for me. I cannot stand a single one of his movies, could not at 17, not at 27 and not now at 37.
He’s a red cloth for me. I cannot even look at pictures of him…never could… and that had started long before 2017. I just don’t like him. Even Rob Zombie doesn’t arouse the same level of negative emotions within me.

What I think is Deadline has picked up that Paramount is making moves on the 4th Kelvin verse movie and gone with the Biggest Rouomored name to Direct and let thier need for Headline get out ahead of the facts.

@Bill Peters — they’ve picked up on the fact that Abrams wants to make a 4th Kelvin film before he gets shut out of the franchise. He’s been self promoting since Orci was to direct and shopping for locations in Korea. And have we already forgotten his hype over Chris Hemsworth returning for an epic 4th film?

@Cadet – yeah I get the excitement but people are getting way ahead of themselves. Several things have to happen that would surprise me, not least of which is Paramount spending money on their underwhelming Trek series again so soon, JJ and QT making a movie together etc.

Its a great development though. Could it be related to QT needing a new studio and Paramount placating him to lure him in?

“This looks like on of them” uh, no that is not true at all. In fact it seems this movie is moving forward at a rapid pace. You may not care for QT, but there is ZERO evidence that his ST project is anywhere near falling apart

R-rated ‘Star Trek’ movie directed by Tarantino sounds too insane to be true but it looks like Paramount is willing to take a big risk!

I’d prefer if someone like Alex Garland or Denis Villeneuve were involved in a new Trek movie, nevertheless it will be very interesting to see if Paramount will greenlit R-rated Trek.

more like, if any of this is true, they sound desperate. That’s a suicide.

RESERVOIR BORGS

LOL

:-)

:D Genre: Pulp fiction with some science

Pulp Science Fiction, you say?

Inglourious petaQ

This sounds interesting…sadly at time it seems that R rated films are better these days anyway since we really just get an overabundance of action with little character moments, as it seems like there’s no time for that with the fast pacing of movies these days.

I hope we get some awesome stuff…more Klingon tits might be nice. I could so picture an R rated movie with the Borg, especially if we see a detailed assimulation.

If QT is involved, there will be plenty of character moments.

And if Paramount is really going to consider an R rating, they will be insisting on a lower budget. QT delivers some great films on the cheap.

It’s my opinion that the original “Star Trek” was to capture not only the spirit of the great sci fi writers but to also appeal to the open minded person who probably enjoyed reading “Playboy” in part to read those cool sci fi articles that were contained within.
Roddenberry’s “Star Trek” definitely conveyed at least part of the Sexual Revolution going on in the late 1960’s. Even in the earliest episode, “The Cage”, we see Captain Pike tormented as he sees what is supposed to be the most sexually appealing Green alien dancing erotically for him.
Imagine if they took that scene further, or one of Kirk’s many romantic interludes. What about the Holodeck from TNG that was likely used for one big sex fantasy enough times that they probably got bored with it after awhile.
This is the R rated direction I hope they go for …not Bones telling Spock to “Fuck off” …that would make the series jump the shark for sure. We also don’t need more violence or bloody scenes. Take the romantic elements of “Classic Trek” and make it the sex romp that would make Roddenberry proud.

Somebody needs a cold shower…

I really don’t think more sex is the answer. I think real stakes, more human drama, and a better story with intelligent ideas is the way to go. Trek has never done sex well, but it certainly isn’t the missing element from the latest batch of Trek

From a late 60s / 70s POV, this Sexual Revolution made a lot of sense. But now? If anything, internet smutt has proven that sexual liberation is a dead end. If Roddenberry had had the guts to show some boobs back then, I would have applauded that. But now, it is nothing but jumping the bandwagon of excessive indecency for no further reason but staying in business for a while longer. It’s a pathetic sell-out! Not succumbing to those least desirable lower traits is what “mature” and darig would mean today.

I’ll believe it when I see it. Unless Paramount are so dissatisfied with the box office of the underperforming Beyond that they’ve given up on Trek and are just having a last roll of the dice?

To me this is either a.) a response to Discovery’s TV-MA production or (more likely) b.) just something to get fans talking and will lead to exactly nowhere

I’m inclined to agree. It seems like the execs at Paramount are clueless on how to manage one of their most prized properties. It’s a case of them going:
‘F–k it. Why not.’

How is this a bad thing? R-rated movies are generally better than PG13 movies and getting one of the best directors of our time is a luck the Kelvin franchise does not deserve.

Well, I’m willing to stand corrected. Maybe this will happen after all. . . But still, a lot can happen between now and when QT finishes his Manson film. I’d still bet against him directing it, though the odds his story idea might make it to the screen seem more likely.

I don’t know how I feel about the R rating though. I love dark, violent and gritty films as much as the next, but I don’t see how you square that with Trek (DISC seems like a good model for balancing the two). I’m also just not sure how QT’s brand of ironic, violent pastiche fits in the Trek universe. I was originally hoping that he was challenging himself to create something more in the mold of classic Trek, but now I fear he’s going off on a total tangent.

But that said I do hope this film at least works with the existing NuTrek crew. Please don’t go with another reboot and recast that’ll make this project seem even more erratic.

Let me add that I don’t have a problem with an R-rated Trek. It could be a fun way to mix things up with the right story and cast . . . I’m just leery about QT’s unique brand of “R-rated” in this particular context.

Agreed, Holden, especially about the NuTrek crew, who were all beautifully cast.

I think the best way to fit QT and his ironic violent pastiche is to do “Yesterday’s Enterprise” in the Mirror Mirror universe or Kirk vs. the Borg.

True. The parallel universe angle makes more sense now.

I really want a Kirk vs Borg story! They would bring out a LOT of people!

If Im in the room, as much as it would aggravate many fans, my suggestion from a business perspective is 1) Prime 2) Kirk 3) time travel 4) Borg.

But checking off the boxes only works if you have a capable screen writer. One could look at STID and say they checked off the boxes too but they hired guys who simply werent capable of writing a great movie.

I think all those are fine since they are all popular. But I never understand why some people don’t want time travel since oddly enough those happen to be some of the best stories in Trek, especially the films (and some of the most popular). The probably have over done it in the past but its a popular device for a reason and I loved how it was done in Discovery.

I think a fan favorite like the Borg would be fun, especially if we see them face off against Kirk. Of course it may be harder to do that in the prime universe for a number of reasons but if they had Archer facing them down 200 years before they popped up on TNG anything is possible these days.

No, that would be a fan movie. Everything about this is screaming its probably a ‘one off’ character driven story, and that the canon notebook, if not tossed out the window, will probably have most of the pages ripped out. QT doesn’t strike me as a franchise director/producer, it’s best to look at this news without any preconceived notions that another Trek movie is going to look like the last few….

Well yeah. Thats why you do it lol. I don’t think it will happen either but if you want butts in the seats, bring in the Borg!

It the movie production putters out, it’s because of studio interference. QT was very explicit about the conditions for his involvement in all this, one of them being that the film has an “R” rating.

“I was originally hoping that he was challenging himself to create something more in the mold of classic Trek, but now I fear he’s going off on a total tangent.”

exactly. He’s not challenging himself with something different. He is just trying to alter trek and make it just another of his movies.
Not today, Satan, not today.

Ok, don’t like the R rating. Would I watch it? Yes. But not keen on the rating. Hopefully then they wouldn’t use the KT. I like those actors and don’t want to see them in an R rated ST movie. IF the rating is due to violence and mild language then I guess that’s workable for me.

Um, nope.

If it’s R, this’ll be the first Trek movie I don’t see.

And if they follow it up wit an R rated trilogy?
Are you going to skip 4 Trek films.
That is potentially skipping 8 years of Trek.

This attitude is like the clearest example of closed-minded thinking. Bet you’ll go see it if it’s good no matter what the rating. These fans that have such high-minded “eww R-rated Trek noooo” mentalities sound like kids afraid of cooties to me. Get off y’all’s high horse and quit judging. It’s an idea. It probably isn’t even on paper yet. Relax.

@albatrosity I’d say it’s the people like yourself that sound like kids. Not people that think that having an r rated movie is good idea per se but those that have to resort to calling people prudes just because they have reservations about Star Trek being r rated or those who think that saying the f word multiple times or showing some tits in a movie automatically makes it mature – they’re the ones acting like children. There’s lots of people who are more than happy watching r rated material but just happen to think that it’s not necessarily suited to Star Trek. For the record, I will watch the movie regardless as I’m a fan and I hope it’s good but I do have concerns that Paramount is jumping on a bandwagon that is at odds with the franchise.

I just think Trek fans in general have such a high opinion of themselves because we’re fans of something that has been described as “intelligent,” “cerebral,” “moral,” etc. when adjectives like “dumb,” “boring,” and “violent” can also be applied to it as well. Trek isn’t one thing. The people trying to make it that are the ones holding the franchise back. I of course see why people oppose the idea of an R rating, but saying no to watching it at this stage of the game is sheer absurdity.

You won’t be missed. I will go see it twice for you.

That’s cool, you can stay home and watch The Orville.

Yep. If Paramount goes through with this, Star Trek will be dead to me. After 35 years, I had to stop watching Star Trek with “Discovery” due to its TV-MA rating. Now this… Ugh. Thank God for “The Orville.”

You stopped watching Discovery because it has a TV-MA rating even though the show doesn’t really need it? Yeah okay.

Yep. I don’t watch TV-MA rated television shows, and I’ve seen about a half dozen R rated movies in my 40 years of life. A couple of those weren’t by choice. I intentionally try to avoid anything with gore and/or graphic violence, which sadly now includes Star Trek.

“You stopped watching Discovery because it has a TV-MA rating even though the show doesn’t really need it?”

Oh, it is well deserved. Of course the QUANTITY of gore and nudity is not on par with … well, QT for example, or GoT, but they include tiny bits of it in almost every episode. These “five seconds of shame” are even worse than full-on stuff, because they are included to undermine our old viewing habits step by step, making us ready for worse…

Don’t assume that an “R” rated ‘Trek film is all about swearing and nudity. Wait until the trailer before making a decision.

I think QT may be one of many Directors Bad Robot and Paramount are looking at they want to make the 4th Kelvin movie, but Kelvin timeline has done well at PG-13, Also I have never heard of a Director saying what he wants a film to be Rated that seems a bit over the top to me.

Also who knows QT may like taking on the challenge of writing his first PG-13 Movie and doing a Franchise bit..

@Bill Peters,

“Also I have never heard of a Director saying what he wants a film to be Rated that seems a bit over the top to me.”

Actually top directors like Tarantino get to make that call. If you’ve read the Deadline report, you will find another example of a director who wanted his movie to be R-rated but in his case, the studio rejected the request.

=================================
Per Deadline:

“Most mega budget tent poles restrict the film to a PG-13 rating in an effort to maximize the audience. That was the reason that Guillermo Del Toro’s $150 million At The Mountains of Madness didn’t go forward at Universal, even though Tom Cruise was ready to star.”

Logan was like that, R-rated before production began.

If R rated is true then clearly Paramount are not keen to use the existing crew they will probably go for a new crew or offer the existing actors lower salaries. This sounds like a low on action high on drama type of movie the budget will clearly be much lower than before probably some kind of low tech setting the crew get stranded in an alternate reality on earth via the Guardian of Forever. Then at the end of the movie they return to the Enterprise after saving the universe as we know it again!

Which I would be totally down for. Also I don’t understand, why do they have to cut the actors’ salaries? If they’re making it a character drama then the focus is on the people, not the special effects.

albatrosity, Exactly, and the new cast has a bunch of damn good actors in it.

Not really, Pine’s star has fallen, and Quinto, Urban, and Cho are not top dollar draws. Saldana probably would demand the most in salary, if she is even possible to get, given that there are 231 Avatar sequels being made and she has at least 2 more Marvel movies to make. She is probably out of this movie, and that would be fine I think – It would be much better being Kirk/Spock/McCoy.

If it is character driven, with action more on the Kirk-Fu and Spock pinches and chokes side, you could drive the cost WAY DOWN. And given they want to make it R-Rated, they won’t budget much more than $100m, if that, to make this movie – they are limiting how much it will make. Tarantino movies have never made that much money.

“She is probably out of this movie, and that would be fine I think – It would be much better being Kirk/Spock/McCoy.”

*yawn*

You guys are so predictable and repetitive.

Agreed, Jemini.
It’s like they want her not to be there. Because, you know, a gerrrrrl in the boyz clubhouse

Marja,
it’s amusing they see the one female character as this terrible ‘threat’ to the bros. Clearly, the only way to make the guys more relevant is by sidelining the woman.

also amusing the pure delusion of thinking that a movie that is only about those 3 white dudes would be more successful for nowadays audience. So interesting. Groundbreaking.

No clubhouses involved, Marja–just the simple fact that the overwhelming majority of TOS episodes featured Kirk, Spock, and McCoy, and therefore to some of us a Trek that favors Uhura over McCoy necessarily feels like something else. Does that make me sexist? Well, maybe, but if that’s the case, why do I have no problem with Michal Burnham being the lead of Discovery?

M.Hall,
The point is, this is a REBOOT of TOS. Why not feature some of the players who were sidelined in the original because of 1960s racism/sexism?

And I repeat, as I have many times, Uhura is not being PLACED OVER McCOY. She is ALONGSIDE McCOY WITH KIRK AND SPOCK.

The trio becomes a quartet. How hard is that?

By all means, tell yourself that you aren’t.

“She is probably out of this movie, and that would be fine I think – It would be much better being Kirk/Spock/McCoy.”

*yawn*

You guys are so predictable, and repetitive.

My choice would be Mark L. Smith!

too me the risk of losing overseas markets to R rating would not be worth it to Paramount, Trek is not Logan or X-Men or Deadpool, sure you could even make an R Rated Batman Movie but Star Trek and Star Wars really kind of is Family Fare for the most part.

so to me, QT may be their man, but I doubt he’ll get an R Rating, or has the ability to command that from the Studio who may not want to lose money overseas.

Give me a cool sci-fi concept, Mr. Tarantino, and you’ll have my interest. Otherwise this is just meaningless Hollywood buzz. The rating, and the writer for that matter, can change a dozen times by the time the movie is released, if it’s even produced at all.

Well, if the folks who screamed until they were purple that BR Trek was an abomination to the memory of the original, this’ll likely make their collective heads explode.

QT has never struck me as a franchise director (overrated, yes, but that’s a different conversation). That said, asides from this being in the Trek universe, I’d not be surprised if they left established canon in the dust. Just tell a story in the Trek universe, no (or very loose) ties to previous movies or characters.

Stay tuned. Young minds, fresh ideas….

A SCRIPT DOES NOT A MOVIE MAKE

Studios and production companies develop scripts all the time that go nowhere, and this is likely one of them. Abrams is desperately trying to remain in the Star Trek business. This is a Hail Mary if I ever heard one.

Bad Robot is a mess right now — CASTLE ROCK is coming apart at the seams as Abrams focuses on other interests, namely Star Wars. Paramount is likely ready to cut ties with a producer who can’t stay within a reasonable budget if he had to.

I agree. JJ taking the Star Wars gig didn’t go over well at Paramount.

JJ taking Star Wars didn’t go over well with most fans, either, I think. And I don’t just mean Trek fans. I think the day is coming soon [depending on how Last Jedi turns out] that people look back on TFA as an uninspired money-grubbing rehash, kinda like how opinion of Phantom Menace at the time was significantly inflated at the onset. I’m prepared to eat my words next week though.

JJ is a genius, TFA reignited interest in Star Wars and made 2 billion dollars. He saved Star Trek in 09,with a film that appealed to a wide audience.

“TFA reignited interest in Star Wars.” Sorry, but that’s a serious LOL. He reignited interest in the most popular film franchise ever? He reignited interest in a franchise that Disney had just paid 4 *billion* for?

And if he “saved” Trek in 2009, why is he scrambling now to create new buzz less than nine years later . . . All while DISC continues to be humming along without him?

Sorry. JJ’s very smart about positioning himself in the right places at the right time. But both franchises are just fine without him.

Holden, And if he “saved” Trek in 2009, why is he scrambling now to create new buzz less than nine years later …?

Because JJ screwed himself between Trek movie 1 and STiD. He took three flippin’ years off to make “Super8” … which he could have made after Trek movie 2. Not to mention a massive major effup with the Khan debacle. [and again I cry “Ugh, why Khan? Why?”]

And in the middle of promoting STiD, he took a little time to mention his flitting off to Star Wars for a little revival.

Look, I like a lot of what JJ did in bringing Trek back. I love his casting choices [except for, ahem, Khan]. But I DON’T like that he took three years off between the first two Trek movies and almost killed the franchise.

Which is why so many of us prefer a TV show. Those FOUR years between Trek 09 and STID, we would’ve gotten 100 episodes of a show instead of waiting four LONG years for something like STID just to feel meh about it.

And I agree with you. Although STID did do better than the 09 film it was clear they didn’t strike while the iron was hot or the movie could’ve done over $500 million but it fell quite a bit in America. Of course by the time Beyond came out the buzz was completely dead by then. This isn’t the 80s and 90s anymore. Franchises can’t go 3-4 years without a film these days. You have to keep the hype train going. Thats why we have a Star Wars film literally every year now. Marvel is making 2-3 films a YEAR. Its just a different world today, there is just too much going on for people to move on to the next new shiny toy.

Star Trek will always survive but it needs to be constantly pumping out new content to keep it on people’s radar which is why having Discovery is a great idea so they can keep things going between movies just like Trek did in the 80s and 90s if they can’t pump out a film every 2 years.

The three years was toxic in and of itself, he didn’t help his cause that his guys, Orci and Kurtzman, were busy telling everyone who would listen they were busting butt on the sequel, when it became obvious to just about everyone that WOK 2.0 was pretty much a contractual afterthought. So when Pegg was teasing they were working hard on a STB follow up, there was a collective ‘yeah, right’ response to that.

TFA would’ve made 2 billion dollars if it had Jar Jar in it. That’s what happens when Disney is at the helm. They throw money at it and saturate the world with marketing. I literally bought Star Wars branded salad yesterday. The Star Wars fever will never die, and there was no “reignition” of interest; it was always there. The fans were given a blockbuster and they went to see it. It was a guaranteed smash, with or without JJ.

Your so wrong and so against the majority of opinion it’s not even funny.

I loved TFA on first watch and still enjoy it to this day. It could’ve been way, way better. Should’ve been. And this is the article that finally convinced me: https://www.cbr.com/the-force-awakens-15-reasons-its-the-worst-star-wars-film/

alba, TFA certainly struck me as an uninspired rehash and I’m not even a devotee of SWars. I enjoy it, but it’s not like Trek to me.

I was more impressed with “Rogue One,” the one-shot SWars movie last year.

Agreed! Rogue One was by no means a masterpiece, but I thought it was a visually stunning fun little romp that at least felt different. TFA was like one yawn after another. And this is coming from someone who actually likes it for what it is. It could’ve been way better, is all I’m saying.

I agree with others that feel like TFA was too much of a rehash (although I did generally like it) and while I thought Rogue One was a really good film it just felt like a reason to relive A New Hope basically, which oddly enough how TFA felt as well. Its also why I’m happy Star Wars is FINALLY going the Star Trek direction (at least the shows) and building on characters outside the originals. It sounds great Rian Johnson is developing a new trilogy that won’t have any ties to the Skywalker family and in effect won’t be about the original trilogy they keep going back to over and over again. I was really afraid thats how Disney was going to keep SW prepped up for another 50 years rehashing the same characters and situations over and over again with all these prequels. I’m still waiting to hear about the Jabba the Hut movie. But it sounds like after Obi Wan they are going a different direction altogether. And why if the Tarantino film actually does go through and its not about the KT characters that they too should focus on a new crew and ship. The shows do it all the time obviously but the films seem afraid to go that route. I get it from a marketing POV, but what should sell them is the name Star Trek and not just the specific characters so I hope they do go away from the KT characters. Nor… Read more »

Agreed, and the fact that QT’s not even interested in writing his own script–a first–is a huge red flag for me at the moment.

I remember when everyone got excited about John Logan. But then he wrote the dog turd that became Nemesis.

Complete speculation on your part. 1/ Abrams is on top of the world right now. He can pretty much do any project he wants to do. The idea that he is “desperately trying to remain in the Star Trek business” and that this is a “Hail Mary” is laughable. 2/ Abrams is one of, if not the hottest young directors is Hollywood. There is no way that Paramount wants to cut ties with him. Again, this statement is laughable. 3/ Yes, scripts get developed all the time that don’t get made, but this is Quentin Tarantino one of the greatest living directors. The studio is going to bend over backwards to get his name on a Star Trek film. It seems they have already given him a lot of control over this project. 4/ How exactly is Bad Robot a mess? Aren’t they the guys behind the biggest domestic hit of all time with The Force Awakens? I think they are working on a little film called Star Wars: Episode IX. That film is going to really struggle to make any $. I think they are also working on a Star Trek project with a director (some Italian fella) that nobody has ever heard of. I think they are also involved with that little known actor Tom Cruise on Mission Impossible 6 and I think they may have done ok reviving Star Trek and Mission Impossible franchises. Honestly, if you don’t like Abrams or Tarantino just say it, but to… Read more »

…voodoo speaks the truth! Some folks hate how JJ took trek back to popularity by removing it from the 24th century sensibilities set forth by Berman and company, and they hate it so much they want JJ to be failing. And clearly, as voodoo stated, it just ain’t happening. Wishful thinking on their part, but it just ain’t happening.

No, I hated Trek 2009 because it was stupid, not because it wasn’t TNG. But I knew that I could set my watch by your beating that particular drum, so thanks for that.

You’re welcome…and you know it’s true…that’s why a segment of “Trek” fans are lapping up Orville as fast as Seth can feed it to them. it’s their nostalgic, comfortable sweater that they can FINALLY wear again…after enduring Jar Jar Abrams aka Lord of the lens flares raping of their childhood. I think you dog him for the very same reason…you’re just too strongly opinionated about it…and the very fact that he is so successful and has taken Trek away from the direction you enjoyed for almost 20 years drives you fruitier than a nutcake. :)

@Voodoo — false equivalenies and specious reasoning. I can’t say how I know BR is a mess, but it will all come out. Remember when BR was backing Orci directing and scouting locations in South Korea a third Trek film? And how about announcing Chris Hemsworth returning as Kirks father in a fourth film, just before BEYOND was launched and proceeded to make less money than either previous film, in part by going $30 million over budget? What happened to those movies? QT co-produced Trek is just one more effort by a guy who’s trying to keep his hands in as many things as possible. Abrams has a sweet deal with Paramount, a studio facing numerous financial struggles. Is keeping an exclusive deal with a producer who has become notorious for going over budget and spreading his interests across numerous franchises going to be the most effective for a studio struggling to keep from going under? Or does it drive away more affordable talent, and force Paramount’s best products into BR’s hands which has of late produced questionably profitable productions for various studios, notoriously going over budget, and stretching Abrams attentions razor thin?

I Seen his movies I know he is a huge Trekkie Hell He even wants to Do a Prime timeline Star Trek Movie with a Character from Ever Show including Enterprise and The Original Series and if its R Rated it may pull things off that No Other Director Can Cannot Wait

G1 Convoy: Here’s the thing. Nobody except a very small/niche group of people care about any other ST series, but TOS + TNG with TOS being the more iconic of the two…Do You really think Paramount is going to bring in a director of QT’s status to have him make a film that involves characters from Voy, ENT, Discovery? No he will use the franchise’s most iconic characters (and his personal favorites) Kirk + Spock….P.S. He never said that he wanted to make a film “with a character from every series”

An R rated Star Trek movie would be a bit of a risk for Paramount, particularly with a pricey film franchise that underperformed in its last outing (which is very likely why they would be willing to take the risk). The question becomes who is the movie ultimately intended for and can the movie make a significant sum of cash without the families who would normally attend a Star Trek movie.

There’s the potential for a Star Trek movie that is as well received as “Blade Runner 2049” but then performs about as well. Positive reviews are great but a significant return at the box office is ultimately what matters.

It will be interesting to see just how committed Paramount is to that R rating.

It’s happening!?

No, just some script development. May happen, may not. Time will tell.

Sybock\'s Other Brother

RIP Trek

You’re fartoo late— “RIP Trek” has already been declared when TNG started. Then DS9. Then Voyager. Then Enterprise. Then Star Trek (2009), and most recently Discovery.

VoR,

I wouldn’t say Sybok’s is too late, then, but that s/he/they are repetitive

How are Trekkies not bored of saying this shit?

The path of the righteous Trek is beset on all sides by the inequities of it’s fandom and the tyranny of rabid trolls.

You win the internets for the day. (And sorry for being a day late.)

First off – I have no problem with any of this.
Secondly, calm down everyone. Nothing is greenlit. There is no deal with QT. He is just assembling his writers in order to create the draft to pitch to JJ. That is all. I am sure JJ is also meeting with other people (Including Pegg) for ideas about the next Trek movie.

They rebooted Star Trek for a frest start. So far, that got us one movie that was so laden with self-references and style updates that it forgot to tell a story, one abysmal kind-of-remake of Star Trek II and one movie that felt like your regular two-part episode (which is exactly the criticism TNG movies always got).
Tarantino might finally do what this rebooting was supposed to do all along: bring something new to the table. Also, he’s a hardcore Trekkie and an excellent writer/director. Just give the man all the creative freedom he wants.
Also, R-rating might lead to smaller budget and more focus on character and story, and no more blockbuster tent-pole nonsense.

^bump, agreed on all points. I just want a good STORY dammit!

I don’t see the point of deliberately setting out to create a franchise movie that a good percentage of the most likely potential audience can’t or won’t see, unless you want to have a ready excuse for lower-than-expected box-office. And I’d hate to see this be the reason for another reboot and/or jettisoning the current cast.

I see plenty of R-rated movies, and when the story and the production drive the rating, that’s fine – but I don’t see the logic of seeking an R rating as a precondition. Nothing about Star Trek has ever made me say, “Ooohhh… this would be SO GOOD if they would have just make it R rated.” Help me out – please explain what the benefits to THIS franchise would be.

I’d love to help you out Chuck but I don’t have the answers. I’m sure that those of us expressing concern about his will get the standard response about being prudes but I too watch and enjoy plenty of r rated movies and shows. I just happen to think that not all properties are suited to this approach,

yeah, it seems some Tarantino’s fans just want it to happen because it’s him and they love him. I love many directors, but I don’t necessarily think they’d be a good fit for trek. People are entitled to have concerns about this, it’s not gratuitous hating (and not the kind JJ got). People’s concerns are reasonable, especially that of the ones who already love this cast and this trek and can’t find a sense in altering it to turn it all into another thing, let alone alienate a good chunck of the audience that loves these movies.

They are trying to expand Trek’s base by getting Tarantino fans who wouldn’t normally watch a Trek film along with us usual fans. The same way Abrams was trying to bring in the younger fans and people who were more into Star Wars. Now will it work, of course who knows. But the angle here seems to be get people on board who see Trek as too soft and tame. Its exactly why Discovery is also rated mature. They want to broaden their audience with people who like harder edge stuff. I don’t think its just about making it R rated as it is just making it more mature. Thats just my guess anyway.

they might try to bring him Tarantino’s fans, but I honestly don’t think fans of his movies would be that interested about trek, even if he’s the one making it.

and in turn, by trying to get those fans they will just alienate: reboot fans who want a continuation that makes sense with the other movies, kids who like to impersonate the characters and watch the movies with their parents, people who don’t like QT’s movies but like trek and THIS trek.

It doesn’t make sense and is just not worth it. If true, it’s another hint that this studio doesn’t know how to handle their business.

Well its a risk sure, but I guess they feel they have nothing to lose since the KT films have lost any real buzz and they want to try and shake it up a bit. If they do it it will be interesting what they come up with at least. My guess is they will go with a whole new cast but who knows. My guess is they want to start from scratch if they are going to go a very different way.

Besides, maybe Tarantino will ensure there’s a flippin’ good trailer in theatres a couple of months before opening week.

The only way Paramount lets this be R rated is wirh a much lower budget.

I think if Tarantino agrees to direct they would be pretty accommodating.

At this point they are hashing out a script. Nothings been greenlit.

No comfort in that. The very fact they’re actively pursuiting such an endeavour speaks for itself. If the projects falls apart, they would most likely give something like that a try later on with a lesser known director. Anyway, the R-Rated Star Trek movies will be happening sooner or later.

Pine was naked in Wonder Woman. They could save money by foregoing crew uniforms.

Well you got more women turning up at least. ;)

Might happen, Paramount just auctioned them off.

When was the last time you saw a movie with an obscenely huge budget that was also great in terms of story and character?

Titanic. Beauty and the Beast. Wonder Woman. Inside Out……

Of course, I’m thinking a (obscenely) huge budget is anything in the 150MM range.

Hell, never mind about the possible ‘F-bombs’ in this, it’s the SOUNDTRACK I’m nervous about! I love Q.T.’s use of music in a lot of his movies, but I don’t want a repeat of the likes of J.J.’s ‘Beastie Boys’ fiasco!

Hoping for a great lush orchestral score to accompany the ultra-violence. :)

While we’re letting people who shouldn’t make Star Trek movies why don’t we let Woody Allen make one… or even better, Michael Bay. How about we get Paul Verhoeven to make one?

Next up, Tommy Wiseau presents The Star Trek.

If the R is for “risqué”, I’m okay with it. If the R is for “rampant violence”, not so much.

I would say expect both.

So this necessarily implies the storyline with Kirk’s dad is DOA? Too bad. Sounded like an interesting premise….and we’re ready to turn the franchise on its heels and make it something it has NEVER been – R rated for R’s sake – in the process? Meh. No freaking out here, but not very excited about the idea of some arbitrary gore-fest.

Given Tarantino’s previous comments regarding adapting Yesterday’s Enterprise I would say Chris Hemsworth would definitely still be on the table and given that this would inply the majority of the movie would be set in a parallel universe in which the Federation are losing a war against (presumably) the Romulans it might work as an R Rated movie. I have mixed feelings about this, I was initially intrigued by the Tarantino reports but I don’t agree with making Star Trek R rated. I have nothing against r rated content and I’m happy to see cinema movie away from the exclusively PG13 model. I just do not think that Star Trek is the best fit for an R rated version. Star Trek should be more adult focused in terms of intelligence and maturity and adding excessive violence, nudity and profanity doesn’t make something smart or mature. Nevertheless I will also do my best to keep an open mind until we know more about it..

Anthony the other one

My bet is that they do a hard reset of the timeline. There’s already mention of Chris Hemsworth. Somehow they use the Gaurdian from City of edge of forever and go back to before the Kelvin attack. Stop Nero (somehow) and this prevent the destruction of the Kelvin. The Original Prime timeline is this reset and proceeds as we all k ow and loved. Kahn is still out there and Vulcan is in one peice and the Big E is normal sized and not bigger than a Galaxy Class ship, survives another 20 years and is eventually replaced by the -A. That would make the “new” cast, the uniforms, the changes in appearance of ships and everything else we had. A hard time accepting as “canon” acceptable and ok. Then we can worry about how STD will “become canon”.

The Guardian is off the table. Harlan Ellison will raise holy hell if they attempt to use the Guardian.

I love it when people like you think you know what the writers are doing lol

Trekboi, I think Denny C is just remembering Ellison’s litigious bent.

I’m not excited about excessive violence or profanity or sex. But if Samuel L. Jackson is cast and drops a “mothafucka” I would certainly find that pretty satisfying.

G… D… right!

I can’t believe this is happening. I’m excited about the possibilities, but prepared for a a disaster.

I trust that this is going to happen. Tarantino is a huge Star Trek fan, unlike JJ who is a Star Wars fan and pretty much used Trek ’09 as his sizzle reel for Star Wars. Nothing wrong with that, JJ is a good director.

This is what I hope happens (but probably won’t)

-Klingon Movie. Could be “modern” day, could be prequel. I wouldn’t mind a Klingon Prequel. If Tarantino brings the story of Khaless v. Molor to the screen and we FINALLY see it, that would be awesome!

-DS9 Movie. It was the realest of the Roddenberry/Berman-era Trek series, I think. It tackled everything and anything and could easily be rated R.

-Anything New. Tarantino takes a dump and it’s an instant cult classic. Trek will be in good hands with him.

What I hope we DON’T see but probably will…

-JJ Trek 4. Kirk is a pimp. Uhura/Spock sex scene. A total mind trip and lots of violence.

-Admiral Sam Jackson. “Look Kirk, I don’t give a [censored] about what you think. I told you to go to the mother[censored]ing planet, get the mother[censored]ing ambassador, and bring her back to this mother[censored]ing starbase, or I’ll shove my foot so far up your [censored] [censored] you’ll be [censored]ing my shoe laces for the next few YEARS, mother[censored]er!”

Yea… we’re now more than 90% likely for that last one…

What’s great is that Tarantino is an unapologetic nostalgist, but also a unique voice. Like I can picture him having Chris Pine do a Shatner impression for the whole movie, but tell a story unlike anything that’s been seen previously, riffing on the familiar in a similar way to 09.

Honestly this sounds like fan-pandering BS to me. JJ lost credibility in my eyes after a.) he made STID about Khan, b.) he directed the completely underwhelming Force Awakens and took credit for it as if he wasn’t just rehashing Lucas’s ideas, and c.) he made some statements last year that were just designed to get fans talking despite them both being false, i.e. that the Axanar lawsuit was going away [bs] and that Trek 4 is already greenlit [for what, 2025?]. So sure, let the fans salivate over the possibilities. My guess is that this idea will fall apart and with it the rebooted films. But I pray to the seven I’m wrong. I do like being wrong.

‘More of the same’ is not an option at this point. Movie-goers are (putting it mildly) ‘disenchanted’ with the current state of the movie franchise. Something new is better than another nothing-burger.

OMG how do you people see the total opposit of reality- The problem is they keep trying to change Star Trek into something it isn’t- everyone just wants a good Star Trek (Science Fiction) Story which doesn’t preclude fun, action, romance etc etc the possibilities are endless, there is room for so much “new & different” within the Star Trek universe but they keep trying to make star trek in other alt Universes that don’t resembele Satr Trek or its values & thats what people are sick of, tuning in to see satr Trek & getting Star Wars or Game of Thrones & now Pulp Fiction? Jeez.
Just Give us Star Trek.

Well said.

KLINGON MOTHERF***ER!!! DO YOU SPEAK IT!??

Star Trek fans have turned so negative over the past few years with risky installments like “Into Darkness” and “Beyond.” I’ve kept it positive against an onslaught of whining: “the uniforms don’t look right,” and “the Klingons just don’t look like Klingons.” If Star Trek is about anything, I told myself, it’s about change and expansion and hopefulness. As long as it’s about a hopeful future with starships and aliens, hey, I’m open to pretty much any direction that paramount or CBS want to take this thing. They own it, right?
And then this week happened. I really don’t understand how they can take one of the most cynical directors in Hollywood -famous for profanity, violence, and discord to make a Star Trek movie. Making it R-rated won’t make it okay; it will make it a Tarantino movie. Don’t get me wrong. He’s good at what he does but this is . . . .not what he does.
I don’t think the fans will like this film. We’ll go see it (some of us will go several times), but at a certain point we have to admit that we’ve gotten so far afield from the original vision that it isn’t ST anymore.

This is Great news. It may anger some fans…but its time Trek went outside the box.

As long as it is a shaved box…

LALALA

Everything unfolds as I have foreseen it.

First people are okay with DISCO’s TV-MA rating, defending it before it was even released, telling me that their wouldn’t be any serious gore or nudity, let alone violent sex… 9 episodes and two Klingon boobs later, the show has joined the ranks of GoT or Westworld, with those mirror episodes still upon us…

Then, people say that a Quention Tarantino movies doesn’t necessarily have to be ultraviolent and that this director can adapt for this franchise… Now he insists on it being R-Rated! Of course, he does! That’s his thing… He is the one person that turned R-Rated movies into blockbusters in the first place! He is one of the main reasons this sort of movie made it beyond the grindhouse and drive-in theatres… He popularizes cinematic indecency! And now he’s taking over the most decent franchise ever!

It feels as if Madonna had been elected as the new Pope after having a public abortion on Sait Peter’s Square…

Quick nurse, get the smelling salts!

Decent franchise? What about every holodeck episode ever made? Those were at least equivalent to several Madonna abortions.

Smike, get therapy. At the first session, just have the therapist read all of your posts on Trekmovie about sex, violence, etc. Your obsessions and, to be honest, twisted viewpoints need attention before they ruin your life or someone else’s.

You sound unbalanced when you write these things. It is frightening to read. Please, seek help. You are not well.

Stop this! I know I’m not well but this is DUE TO these developments in Star Trek and genre entertainment as a whole. Anyone in his sane mind could see that if you hadn’t been brain-washed by decades of decaying standards.

I dare you… take some DVDs of R-Rated or TV-MA rated movies and shows like GoT, Logan, Deadpool, TWD etc., build a proper time machine and show it to someone living in the late 1950s or early 1960s, let’s say Walt Disney himself, who banned Hitchcock himself for having made “Psycho”! Show it to Tolkien, show it to Roddenberry! Those people would be blown to bits and pieces mentally if ever exposed to such material before their time.

Only because I am still aware of those changes despite having experienced these developments myself doesn’t mean I’m psycho! Hollywood has lost most of its decency, I can see it, you can’t. I don’t care! But don’t call me insane for speaking my mind repetitively.

You are absolutely, positively correct. Hollywood has become disgusting. It’s just sad that it took Star Trek down with it.

I didn’t call you insane. I said you need therapy. Your rant at me proves it. You are unhinged about this stuff, and what you write is NOT mentally healthy. You have an unhealthy obsession with sex and violence in tv, as your MONTHS of freaking out over Discovery prove.

You really need to seek counseling. Just tell the doctor, “I have an unhealthy and life-affecting obsession with sex and violence and TV-MA ratings…” Then show them your comments here since the premiere of Discovery. They’ll help you.

The way you express yourself is not mentally healthy. You are OBSESSED and REPRESSED and you sound emotionally unhinged more every time you post.

Please, stop taking this as an attack. It’s not. I don’t think you are insane. I think you need mental-health help. Counseling. For your own sake.

Or at the very least, STFU about your obsessions. Either get help or get over it.

Let’s not debate the tiny little thin red line between mental problems and insanity. This isn’t a psychology lecture. I’m neither. I’ve got issues with recent developments, not mental health…

What you fail to see is that almost everybody I know has the same feelings about these developments in Star Trek. We are talking about 10+ people here I’ve been talking to in depth…plus another bunch of people adressed in small talk. NO ONE agrees that QT doing Star Trek is a good idea…

I agree that I’m sorta obsessed with these issues, but they don’t become any less pressing by that insight. I may be emotionally attached to Star Trek at an above average level but point being? My points are valid… and the very fact you are questioning my mental health shows that you are, to some extend, “impressed” by these developments as well…

To cut a long story short: I believe that most of you “disagreeing” with me, even considering my posts “frightening”, are at the verge of agreeing with me! You just can’t stand that I’m talking to your collective conscience because after all, there is nothing either of us can do about it! You know I’m right but you’re spooked about agreeing because it would destroy your appreciation for Star Trek or movies at a whole.

smike, add that reply to the ones you show your therapist. Wow. What a whopper of a post–so much ongoing mental instability in everything you write, and getting worse with every post.

Your defensiveness and aggressiveness are evidence that you know I am right about your mental health. (Also, it’s not a “tiny red line” between mental health and insanity. Learn what words mean before you post such idiotic comments as that, okay?)

Your comments are a warning sign. Ignore the warning at your own risk. Your obsessions are hurting your enjoyment of life, but hey, it’s your life, so you decide.

But here’s a request: can you PLEASE shut the hell up about your obsessions since you ADMIT they are obsessions? We all know EXACTLY how you feel about this stuff, and nobody involved in making Star Trek will care how you feel, so you have no reason to keep posting your obsessive freakouts.

Spare us. Get help or not, your choice, but PLEASE stop filling this place with your nonsense. (Seriously, take it to a therapist. You’ll feel better in a few weeks.)

Well, I can’t shut up and won’t shut up.

“Your obsessions are hurting your enjoyment of life, but hey, it’s your life, so you decide.”

There is no decision available for me. I decided to become a geek when there was still clear separation between family and adult content. I signed up for this for life. This decision was made almost 25 years ago and it’s final…

Now that there is no clear-cut separation possible anymore, my life is falling apart and there is nothing I can do. 2017 has taught me that. No “therapist” could change any of those issues unless he exposes me to brainwashing methods.

smike, I take it back. You are insane. Certifiable. You are unhinged from reality, and you clearly have some twisted ideas about mental health and therapy. (Your repeated comments about “brainwashing” show that you are paranoid as well. Brainwashing? That is INSANE.)

I’ve been a fan/geek/whatever for over 40 years, and I have no trouble with the separation between “family and adult content.” My life isn’t falling apart over such nonsense. Only someone with an UNHEALTHY obsession would feel that way.

But you aren’t mentally unhealthy. Nope. You are stark, raving mad. Barking at the moon crazy.

And yes, you CAN shut up–just stop typing, stop pressing send–but you CHOOSE not to. It’s very easy to do. It’s what I’ll do regarding you from now on.

I must have previously overlooked that post of yours! Incredible. What a gross reaction just because you don’t share my opinion on this! You call me insane and mad because I care about Trek’s age suitability? You call me mad because I want Star Trek to remain family-friendly? Or just because I’m too emotional about this?

“My life isn’t falling apart over such nonsense.”

Lucky you. My gosh, you know, I’ve spoken against censorship MANY times in my country which still bans certain movies as “crimes against human dignity” to this very day. I’ve even advocated to lower the age restrictions over here. On German boards, I’m considered rather too liberal. I’ve defend Americans many many times against backward idealists who still try to impose 1970s style youth protection laws.

When you grow up in a place that has COURTS judging movies for individual scenes in horror movies, when you are raised to believe that some movies are criminal and evil, you would understand why I look at “such nonsense” with far more passion.

I am all for hard-on horror and action, just not on Star Trek! My “life” is falling apart because Star Trek has been my life for almost three decades. Seeing this turned into an adult romps hurts profoundly, as much as I enjoy standalone adult flicks or R-Rated franchises!

PaulB,

I’m not leaping to anyone’s defense here, but as someone who struggles with mental health issues myself, I take exception to your tone … and the tone of a couple of other people.

If smike’s posts bug the flip out of ya, skip on down. I have seen battles royale on various threads in the bad ol’ days here at TrekMovie, and there’s no need for anyone to start one here.

I used to skip on down when the two or three people were battling each other; sometimes it took up about 40% of the thread.

smike has his obsessions, others have theirs. Let’s try to play nice, okay, like the good Starfleet people we so admire.

Marja,
I struggle with mental health issues. I begged smike to seek help, but smike continues to spout ever-more-insane nonsense, so I gave up. smike doesn’t seek help despite it clearly being needed.

If you care about mental health, you should focus on getting smike to seek help for his life-damaging obsessions, not on my attempts (and then failure) to get him to seek help.

If you think smike sounds healthy, then you don’t know much about mental health at all. If you think smike sounds unhealthy, you should be focusing on that. Either way, peace!

“but smike continues to spout ever-more-insane nonsense”

Insane nonsense? All I’m asking for is a clear borderline between PG family franchises and hard-R adult entertainment as well as between distinctive genres! What is nonsensical about that opinion?

I dislike QT for having made movies that continuously blur the lines between genres and because he uses splatter and gore for the sake of it.

And yeah, when people tell me to “get laid”, I frankly tell them that I’m not interested in that activity.

What’s insane about any of that? I want to enjoy space opera and hard horror / action separately. I don’t want to have apple pie with salami and cheese stuffed down my throat. And no therapist is going to change that…

…it’s not nonsense. Now, I’m not going to avoid it, just because QT is involved and it’s rated R…and it won’t bug me that much…but I do take exception to them tossing such things into Trek to become ‘relevant’ and hip. Why? Simply for the fact that it is not the uninverse we’ve been led to believe is the Star Trek universe. All evidence from all series and movies point to a fictional universe where these characters don’t get real vulgar I their swearing. And what they do behind closed doors, was kept behind closed doors. We know Kirk doesn’t say “f— you” because we’ve been shown Kirk for 50 years..and he doesn’t talk trashy. Just like they had a WW3 and we didn’t. They had a Khan rule much of the world in 1997, we didn’t. We like to cuss like it’s classy, but they don’t. It’s the fictional universe they’re in, doesn’t need any explanation other than that.

smike,
I get your feelings about how Hollywood used to produce more family-friendly movies and such. But those movies were laden with sexism, racism and so on. Movies started devolving from “decent” back in the “Dirty Harry” / “Godfather” era followed by the early days of Scorcese. The violence was getting brutal, and nowadays it has to be over the top, a la Tarantino.

Yet there are good movies that are out there too. Movies like “Ladybird,” “3 Billboards Outside Ebbings Missouri” and other character-driven dramas. For science fiction, “Arrival” and “Interstellar” were really good. Yeh, some “language” in these movies, but all is not lost, smike. All is not lost.

Here’s hoping Tarantino doesn’t make Trek in the mold of his other movies. He hasn’t always worked in “blood ‘n’ guts” — he did some episodes of “ER” for TV, after all. But his name alone will draw moviegoers.

I’ve NEVER had any issues with violence in gangster epics such as Gofather or Scorcese movies. There it fits. And I’ve even grown to like most horror movies after some quibbles during my coming of age twenty years ago. All is fine with that… That stuff is supposed to exist and it is perfectly alright to enjoy it. Because these used to be separate genres!

But now, splatter, gore and nudity are expanding into formerly family-friendly properties and there is the line that must be drawn. Star Trek and the X-Verse are prime instances for this development.

I don’t like apple pie and pizza mixed and mingled. Even DSC has tiny little “salami nuggets” inserted into the apple pie of a standard Star Trek show. But with QT, it’s going to be a complete mish-mash of apple pie and pizza…and that is literally vomit-inducing…

Stop rushin’ me, you’re makin’ me nervous

Smike, no one cares about the Klingon boobs for a split second but you man. My god, get laid already.

Or just stop watching the show? I mean this is presented ALL the time and yet you keep watching despite your ‘values’. Its called will power, use it already or shut up.

“Smike, no one cares about the Klingon boobs for a split second but you man. My god, get laid already.”

Well, I care about those “boobs”- fake or not – because it has been the first time such images have been shown on Star Trek and it’s most definitely not the last instance! And I simply don’t want to see that!
As for the “get laid” part, simply stop offending me! The very thought of having “recreational” sex with anyone makes me want to vomit. Even for “procreational” purposes, this crude ritual should be replaced by invitro fertilization on the long run. But that’s only my humble opinion.
If you enjoy that activity, indulge yourself. I am far beyond those primitive urges and I hate to be reminded of those needs… It’s disgustig, and not because I was reigious at all. I’m not… I hate traditional beliefs. But sex is off limits for me anyway! Call me a repressed prude, I don’t care. I just don’t want to deal with that… especially not on Star Trek!

If you don’t want to ‘see that’ then you can reconcile that by not watching the show genius.

And you don’t like sex? Yeah you’re a repressed prude. Or someone who never had good sex maybe. And if you don’t want to ‘deal’ with it on Star Trek, stop watching Discovery and just rewatch all the other films and shows in their library. Last time I checked that was a pretty big library.

“Yeah you’re a repressed prude. Or someone who never had good sex maybe.”

I’ve never had ANY! Most of my friends never had! That’s why we all became Star Trek fans, I guess.
Beautiful women to look at, yeah, but actual copulation is well beyond our reach…I know more people that have never been intimate than other ones, and the ones “with experience” are either married or in steady relationships. But that’s not the point here. My non-existent love life is my business. Fact, I don’t want to see naked actresses on Star Trek, Star Wars or any other family-friendly franchise! Full stop!

Dude you’re almost 40 and you never had sex? Man this is sad. No offense but there is more to life than TV shows. You’re focusing on the wrong things in life if you are that old and never been in an adult relationship.

Call it sad, but that’s just how it is. I used to be interested in “getting laid” from 16 to let’s say 25, but since it never happened, the ONLY way of surviving this was to completely giving up any interest in that primitive activity. Had I not abandoned my pointless quest at 25, I would have probably killed myself by now.

TV shows and movies have been a perfect substitute for that for most of my life now and that’s true for most of my friends, too. Only now, that have I developed this ongoing issues with mixed franchises and that represents a major challenge indeed…it takes away a lot of joy in the stuff I used to love without second thought up to watching Logan earlier this year. Logan was a major cesura for me… and it started that loophole I’m caught in…

Smike, I’m not going to try and psychoanalyze someone over the internet or who I don’t know, but you really seem to be prioritizing the wrong things in life. And if you don’t want to have sex, obviously that’s your right. Not everyone cares about sex. But I think forming real relationships with someone or at least a life outside of movies and shows would be a positive for you. Don’t get me wrong we are all too obsessed with this stuff, clearly, even if you are married with kids. But man you are coming off unhinged. Seriously. And I’m going to say this again, and to be be civil about it. Star Trek isn’t breaking any laws. It can show whatever it wants however it wants by whatever government standards it abides by. I get you and others don’t like what it may show but it has the RIGHT to show it. So you have two options: You can accept that some of it will be more mature than you can stomach or you can simply not watch it. Again it doesn’t mean if you watch it you have to just be happy about it. I’m not trying to shut down your opinion so much as I’m saying your opinion is simply out of date for today’s audience and you have to recognize that. You can continue to not like it but if you are this bothered by it, then the most logical step is to simply remove yourself… Read more »

“And you still have multiple shows and films that are more to your liking.”

I’ve said this time and again… R-Rated stuff IS to my liking! I like it, yeah, just not on Star Trek! Because that “upgrade” makes me feel guilty about being both a Trekkie and a horror fan. It should remain separate.

It seems to be almost impossible to convey that message. I’m not fully capable of wrapping my head around my feelings about that either.

I like “IT”…and have supported it and I like traditional Star Trek and I have supported it with my money. But when Star Trek becomes R-Rated because of the success of movies like “IT”, I feel ashamed of both. Because I have contributed to that very change!

So basically, this takes away the joy in both… Guilt, shame, crumbling youth protection, you name it…
None of this would matter if both realms were still clearly separate! Or if our rating system would adapt to changing viewing habits…I dunno…

I was talking about the past Star Trek shows and movies dude.

You simply don’t have to watch Discovery or if QT makes the next film rated R and just focus on the vast Trek library that doesn’t focus on this stuff. Problem solved.

Anyway I think all this goes farther than just curse words and seeing naked people. You might have some mental issues. I’m not trying to joke or insult you but your obsession over this and other issues you seem to have might suggest this. Anyway thats something only you can admit but yeah these posts are sounding more like it.

“You simply don’t have to watch Discovery or if QT makes the next film rated R and just focus on the vast Trek library that doesn’t focus on this stuff. Problem solved.”

I dunno. Maybe you don’t want to understand. I cannot and will not abandone my HOLISTIC approach concerning franchises. That’s the point of being a franchise fan in the first place! If one Trek movies is R-Rated, the whole package is. Nuff said.

That’s why LOGAN got me started on that rant in the first place because it changed the entire X-verse for me. 1000+ horror movies hadn’t caused any concern within me. But LOGAN was that very game-changer!

And don’t get me started on that mass abuse of “bodily fluids” that can be observed online, borderlining on cannibalism. I had my fair share of those impressions to know that all of this is primitive bogus! You know, when The Orville made that “gloryhole” joke, they lost me for good…

Talking about “will power”, I am going to use that fending of the very notion of lettig you shut me up! I’ve never been in a clearer state of mind. Those “five seconds of shame” in each and every DSC episodes was one thing, but accepting “cutie” to take over this franchise is a whole different level of abomination!

While I agree that those tiny little TV-MA instances on DSC COULD be ignored away with proper self-control, the total sell-out of Trek to this cynical low-life is not going to be accepted. I’m at the zenith of my will to resist now and you most certainly won’t change a thing about that…

I’ve been freaking right from the beginning and the only conceivable reason for you to react so emotional towards my posts is because deep within, there may be a voice telling you the very same thing… and you just don’t want to listen!

You got some real issues. Thats all my voice is telling me. You want to rant and rave but yet you don’t want to follow your own values by simply not watch it anymore. How does this not make you a hypocrite?

“but yet you don’t want to follow your own values by simply not watch it anymore.”

Because I have built MY ENTIRE LIFE on being a movies and TV geek! All I want is keeping thse franchises separate. The R-Rated / 16+ ones to the left, the PG-rated / 12+ to the right, like it used to be back in the day!
Then I can enjoy both of them. But now, I cannot enjoy either. This is what 2017 has taught me… And that’s so sad!

Plenty of geeky stuff out there to enjoy without the sexxins, smike. As stated above, there is a HUUUUGE library of Trek episodes from TOS on that are pretty safe to enjoy. IDEK how many episodes are available, dude, but they’ll give you a good Trek “fix.”

Sorry, but modern movies have to make a boatload of money, and so far, Trek hasn’t done that well [certainly not in comparison with even the worst Marvel movies]. So the aim of the studio is to get people into the multiplexes. That means sensationalism, sexual innuendoes and sometimes a lot of violence.

Stick with the older stuff, but watch out for that Mae West character. She was sexual innuendo walking on two legs!

My gosh, you simply don’t get it! I LIKE most R-Rated stuff (minus those QT movies and some others).
I like horror, hard action etc. but OUTSIDE mainstream franchises!!! I want those contents separated! That’s all I’m asking for. Because mixing and mingling ruins BOTH realms for me.

I collect each and every sci-fi, fantasy and horror movie or series on Blu-Ray! I don’t select as you suggest. But I want them to change mainstream family franchises into adult entertainment. It’s my only real concern.

It’s not about what I watch but how I perceive and arrange these genres and franchises systematically.
Apple pie is apple pie, pizza is pizza, both are great on their own, but mix them and you freakin’ ruin both of them! And that’s what’s happening to genre entertainment right now…

“But I want them to change mainstream family franchises into adult entertainment.”

I DON’T want them to change…

But what you’re ‘asking for’ is not close to the realm of reality Smike. This is the problem.

And whats funny is nothing in Discovery has been all that big of a deal for families. Discovery is definitely not a kids program, but not because of the violence or sex, but because the story line itself feels too adult and dare I say it, boring, for the average 10 year old out there. Its not like a TOS episode where you are just waiting for Kirk to get into a fight with an alien, its clearly a more complex show.

But you seem bothered that ANY hint of sex is a problem when for most kids it isn’t. I grew up in Compton, which is the hood in America. I was listening to gangster rap at 13 years old. I seen my fair share of sexual situations and REAL violence around the same age. I had my first actual sexual encounter a few years later. I’m still just a normal guy today. In other words, most kids will hear and see their fair share of adult content, especially today, and will be just fine. And so far nothing, NOTHING on Discovery is anything that hasn’t been seen or heard 100 times everywhere else or that the average 10 year hasn’t been exposed to.

You just have to get over it. I don’t know what to tell you at this point. Frankly no one does.

“You just have to get over it. I don’t know what to tell you at this point. Frankly no one does.”

Honestly, you DON’T have to tell me anything. Don’t tell me I’ve got mental issues, DON’T tell me I’d better get laid…

I’m only here to share my opinion about new Trek and movie-making in general. There have been quite some people agreeing with me this time round. All my Trekkie friends agree with me as well. None of the people I meet once a month are exactly looking forward to this QT movie.

“But you seem bothered that ANY hint of sex is a problem when for most kids it isn’t.”

Hints at sex don’t matter at all, nudity does – although there is plenty of it on regular TV in my country. I don’t dislike nudity in general, I only dislike it on formerly PG-Rated franchises. And yes, you are right about today’s kids. But THAT’S exactly why it bothers me so much. They have access to far worse materials online 24/7. But that doesn’t make it any better…

Smike I wasn’t trying to tell you you have mental issues, I was only suggesting it you may have it. Your obsession with this has gone pretty beyond what would be considered normal. Its not that you argue about it, we all do, its the fact that you seem to let it control your life to the point of unhealthiness. Look I’m not trying to say you DO but yes I have a friend who does have a mental condition and it is scary you both act pretty similar. I know her in real life though, I don’t know you beyond what you write here. But what you do does seem suggest it. And no one said you can’t have that opinion, all people are saying is its not going to change regardless but you are way too obsessed about it to the point of concern. And sure plenty of people are not happy about this Tarantino idea and as I said I can understand why. But if it happens we just have to hope he has more restraint than people are giving him credit for. I guess I’m one of those people who tries not to judge something until I actually see it for myself. There were a LOT of things that worried about me dealing with Discovery. And there were things I didn’t like the ship itself and being a prequel. But since it has come on some of my fears about it has gone away while others… Read more »

“Discovery is definitely not a kids program, but not because of the violence or sex, but because the story line itself feels too adult”

But neither the German FSK nor the British BBFC will rate the story line being too adult for kids. They only look at instances of bloody imagery, sexualized nudity etc… And while the FSK doesn’t rate Netflix material, the BBFC has rated the show 15+.

BTW: The storyline being too complex doesn’t prevent 12-13-year-olds from watching GoT either ALTHOUGH the rating authorities deem it 16+ in Germany and 18+ in the UK. And as long as these ratings are in place, I am losing sleep over it! Lower the ratings like France or Sweden have done, and I’d probably be fine with it over night…Because then, all things Star Trek might get the same lower rating again…

What difference does it make what they rate it? My point being this is not something your average 10 year old will gravitate to one way or the other.

Again, this obsession seems to be a symptom of other things. The fact you are ‘losing sleep over it’ does speak to something more man. Seriously I’m not trying to insult you but yeah.

“My point being this is not something your average 10 year old will gravitate to one way or the other.”

Maybe not ten-year-olds, but 12-15-year olds are watching GoT regularly, constantly violating age regulations. If the rating WAS 12+, like in France, them watching would be fine, but here, it’s freakin’ 16+, so it’s not. Simply put. Not hard to understand.

“The fact you are ‘losing sleep over it’ does speak to something more man.”

Funny. It’s hard to sleep while posting here…

“Again, this obsession seems to be a symptom of other things.”

If you think so… okay, if it makes you happy, I’ll admit I’m suffering from borderline selective autism, severe schizophrenia, obesity, alcoholims and yes, I’m gay, so Klingon boobies give me the CREEPS.
Nope, none of that is true, maybe a tad of the obesity bit. What is it you want to accomplish by this? I’m NOT CRAZY! I only care about these issues to a much larger extend than most of you… be it for cultural reasons, paternal upbringing, vocational occupation or simply because this genre is my life’s main focus, just like other people risk their lives sky-dyving, mountain climbing or wild-water-rafting. Are they obsessed, too? Maybe. I don’t care… Good night!

No one said you were crazy man. But yes this very unhealthy obsession and bizarre rants show there could be something more. Again, I have seen this in my own friend. Maybe you are perfectly fine but your posts do not indicate that. Sorry but they don’t.

It’s constant violation of THE LAW that bothers me when it comes to minors watching stuff like GoT or that potential QT movie.

Frankly, if the VERY SAME MOVIE that is now rated 16+ in my place was rated 12+ (like in France), I’d be happily observing 13-year-olds talk about it. But as long as that’s not the case these “changing viewing habits” gives me the creeps. Not because the movie is “too harmful” for teens, but because of they collectively go against these regulations.

If they’d legalize weed in my country, I wouldn’t have any issues with it either. But as long as it is prohibited, I consider it a crime. Call me a legalist.

I’d be more than happy if Germany significantly lowered the age certificates for movies and TV shows. I guess it’s hard to understand for you, but you don’t have those age certificates punched in your face in cover art like we have (or the Australians). Looking at a 16+ Star Trek release (or 18+ if things go bad), makes my head spin. If THE SAME releasse was rathed 12+, I’d be fine with all of this…

If THE SAME release was rated 12+, I’d be fine with al of this…

Dude no offense but yeah this seems to be something more. Have you at least gone to talk to someone? I’m being 100% serious here. You written a multiple posts about this citing the same thing over and over. This is not normal.

As far as the response I can only say what has been said: You can simply ignore the show and move on. The fact you don’t may also speak to something more than just being an overly obsessed fanboy.

“You written a multiple posts about this citing the same thing over and over. This is not normal.”

Okay, agreed that I’m sort of a wordy person. That may come of repetitive at some point, but only because I absolutely want to make you’re getting what I want to say. It IS a VERY complex issue after all and I could write a 100+ page reflection on it any time. But you’re right. Maybe this is not the right place to go into that much detail…

smike,

I would probably be more concerned if QT’s R films weren’t airing severely edited on my commercial primetime over the air broadcast channels.

Knowing that he acquiesces to such severe editing for the OTA money and that both Bad Robot AND Paramount do edit newly released Trek tailoring for its world-wide markets, I think that you are needlessly fretting away your precious hours thinking that all parties involved are going to release in your country an unedited English language R rated film for general release.

According to Imdb QT’s THE HATEFUL EIGHT earned a DE-16 certificate in Germany along with these popular filmed entertainments:

http://www.imdb.com/search/title?certificates=DE:16

which includes 34. Doctor Who (2005– ) [TV series]

I’m not afraid of censorship with Trek 14.

The cinematic release will be uncut these days. Tarantino never had any problems with that, not even in the much more uptight 90s. I don’t know why, but six of his movies are 16, two of them 18+

The TV broadcast will be cut if it airs prior to 10 PM, but will air uncut in overnight reruns.

The Blu-Ray will be uncut as well.

A couple of Doctor Who episodes have been rated 16+, and are basically all genre shows, only excluding Supergirl, The Flash and MOST of Doctor Who. The rest ist 16+ already but they are watched by younger viewers nonetheless. And that the whole trouble!

Not because they are harmful but because they aren’t supposed to watch. Sticking to the rules is all that matters. If they don’t, the rules have to changed. But tell that to youth protection enthusiasts!

smike,

Re: I’m not afraid of censorship with Trek 14.

I’m not sure why that is because it is a fact that all STAR TREK, from TV on, have been submitted to the censors and ratings boards, and had its content modified in response to feedback from same, i.e. censored.

“I would probably be more concerned if QT’s R films weren’t airing severely edited on my commercial primetime over the air broadcast channels.”

Horrible. I am all against censorship. There should be one and only one version of a film. Older kids don’t need that sort of protection but they have to be legally allowed to watch, like in France! As long as they aren’t, there is this deviation between law and reality. And that I cannot condone.

I’m all for SELF-censorship with all-age franchises though. There needs to be some worlds you can escape to that don’t bother you with bloody images and nudity.

smike,

Then you should be aware that in QT’s KILL BILL in every market except Japan, the CRAZY 88’s fight scene was changed to black and white from the color that he originally filmed it in, because it was the only way he could keep the R rating that he covets.

“But what you’re ‘asking for’ is not close to the realm of reality Smike. This is the problem.”

Alright… so the movie industry won’t change its policy “for me”… Right, I get that. So they are churning out R-Rated productions which receive a 16+ or 18+ rating in my country, but are watched by 12-year-olds anyway. Gross!

I’d be fine with them watching it, if it was rated 12+…but things won’t change that much in my place, so I’ll probably have to live with MILLIONS of kids and teens, violating the law on a daily basis, now involving Star Trek!

Again, I don’t bother them watching it. No one can stop them anyway. But as long as the state says NO to that, this “reality” is forcing me to observe illegal behavior by millions of minors.

As long as this only involved other genres and shows, I happily ignored it. But now, it’s Star Trek that will be illegally watched by minors. You get the gist?

I get this is really starting to sound pretty unhealthy man. Seriously. You are worried minors are breaking the law watching a mostly tame TV show? You have to ‘live’ with these kids doing this? Ok.

I would really think about other issues you may have going on here. Its crazy I never suspected it before. I can be completely wrong but reading these posts now I see something a lot deeper going on. But its up to you to at least admit it. And again I could be wrong but this post and others you wrote kind of suggest other wise.

There aren’t any “deeper issues” at work here. I think you simply aren’t aware of the legal implications an age certificate involves in my country. An R-Rating may not be a big issue in the US, but 16+ or 18+ ratings over here, involve a lot.
There are time windows for broadcasting these movies, only from 10/11 PM to 6 AM.
There’s an ugly super-gross age certificate on every DVD or BD you buy and if it’s red (18+) you have to personally be at home when you order online to receive the package (which isn’t possible if you have to work!)
Selling a 16+ or 18+ media release to a person below that age is considered a crime.
Yes, parents have the right to decide for their own kids AT HOME, but that’s the only liberty there is. IN THEATRES, the 16+ or 18+ age ratings cannot be overruled by parental choice (unlike your R-Rating).

So yes, it DOES make a huge difference whether a movie is rated R (which translates either to 16+ or 18+, or even total ban in uncut form over here). It’s not as gross as it used to be, but imagining future Star Trek outings exposed to these burdens is indeed worrisome…

You you are telling me I’ve got issues?

“You are worried minors are breaking the law watching a mostly tame TV show? You have to ‘live’ with these kids doing this?”

What’s so difficult to understand about this? Minors have to learn laws are important. If they constantly violate these particular rules, they are more likely to break other, truly important regulations as well.

Maybe you cannot fully empathize with on this issue, because, as far as I know, R-Ratings and TV-MA aren’t exactly strict laws in the US but rather parental suggestions that can be ignored by parents in cinemas and aren’t even relevant for retailers.

Well, over here, they are! But yes, they are broken every day via smartphones and internet access. And THAT has me worried, not the fact they are watching that stuff…

And I have to “live” with that every single day of my work life, as I do work with kids aged 11-17, who are constantly reminding me, that they don’t care about those regulations, while it is my VERY JOB to teach them respect for law and order.

Most of my colleagues just blame it on “the parents” but it isn’t that easy. This era of transition with the realms of media is far too complex. And I deal with it every day. Because it’s both my hobby and my job! Gosh…I’m NOT CRAZY!

It’s an ongoing cultural “battle” fought between my country’s authorities and new media reality…

And that’s exactly what I hate about QT movies. He always serves apple pie with salami and bacon! Two thirds of his movies are great character pieces and then, out of thin air, a turns stuff into bloody nightmares! I like thoughtful character movies and I like bloody horror, but NOT WITHIN THE SAME MOVIE OR FRANCHISE!

I’m open minded but am troubled by an R rating for Star Trek, cuts against the grain for sure.

I Khan Believe It\'s Not Butter

I can understand taking the next step and making an R rated Star Trek adventure.
After all Disney will be pumping out Star Wars films every year or so, all of which will be PG rated with mild character development, cool visuals and light clean bloodless deaths (OK, probably just a stain on a shirt or corner of the mouth drip of blood)
Star Trek can’t be doing the same thing.
Even ST Discovery is merely a mixed up concoction blended into a quasi realm of Star Trek lore and has more in common with Star Wars then your all willing to admit, plus that extra added non sense science that one hardly can believe actually made it into the show.
Spore Drive, what a joke.
I’m waiting for some one to yell “FULL PLAID SPEED NOW!!!”

An interesting and serious yet brutally realistic story is whats needed.
No more trips down memory lane paying homage and dropping turds of nostalgia here and there like crumbs laid out to find a meaning to it all.
Been there, done it, so please stop.
Star Trek can’t survive re-wrapping the same ole story with new characters that are merely cookie cutter copies of the basic originals.

So take the originals and bring them some where they have never gone before.
Some where the spin offs didn’t have the balls to do because they were too busy being the same old thing as usual and in name only in the title to booth.

“The same old thing” is what Star Trek is supposed to be. Of course it needs fresh writing, new ideas and proper handling along the way but it primarily needs to remain Star Trek! If the price is selling out the soul of Star Trek, I’d rather have it to end here and now.

Yes, Star Trek could handle some R-Rated aspects in order to explore the dark side of the human condition. If done by a decent filmmaker, it could be pulled off.

But honestly? QT? A guy who enjoys blowing his cameo character up on screen? He just lacks the subtlty and self-control to get this right. He doesn’t show excessive violence because he wants to teach a lesson, he does it because it’s entertaining fun! He sucked up Grindhouse and Drive-In flicks in his youth and repacks them with style for a broader audience. He’s the master of exploitation, the master of “pulp fiction” (pun intended).

“After all Disney will be pumping out Star Wars films every year or so, all of which will be PG rated with mild character development, cool visuals and light clean bloodless deaths.”

It’s so sad. Actually, I’d be more than willing to kiss Star Trek goodbye at this point and devote myself entirely to Star Wars. The one and only reason I simply cannot do this is that I just can’t be too sure that Star Wars isn’t going to fall for this sooner or later as well.

Disney isn’t what they used to be. Most of their movies may be PG-13, but they didn’t prevent Netflix / Marvel from creating an ultra-violent adaptation of The Punisher and other street-level TV-MA shows.

No one can be sure that there won’t be a bloody TV-MA rated, “street-level” Star Wars show focusing on gangsters like Boba Fett once thex start their online platform. So no, taking refuge in the Star Wars universe isn’t an option either in this day and age!

I Khan Believe It\'s Not Butter

To answer both your comments yours is not the deciding view point.
As small as your narrow view of your prescribed weights and measures regarding what Star Trek is and is not.
If you lack the capacity to think and explore beyond what you know, then prehaps Star Trek isn’t for you at all.
You like what you like and you have 5 series and this new web abomination (I only call it that because of the load of crap Spore Drive). Your free to watch reruns and reruns and you wont be missed.
Embracing infinite diversity in infinite combinations isn’t an idea your seem to be able to understand let alone look beyond what you know.
No saying you can’t evolve, but more likely you refuse to evolve.
IDK what QT could bring to he table.
Right off the bat people assume it’s going to be blood, gore and crazed sex scenes sprinkled with mysto magic what’s going on.
But in general most newer fans need to be hand held and walked thru a story any way because all hell will fall if they don’t. So we end up with repackage series with fill in the blank character names, but basically all the same only even more woode and diluted.And lets NOT forget that all the newer series after TOS & TNG all relied on the US vs Them bring on the Star Wars story arch.
Now that’s what’s truly boring.
Almost as boring as every answer you’ve replied on here and probably countless other treads.

But, smike, you can pick and choose what you want to watch. You vote with your money in the movie business. If they’re not getting money from you, maybe they’ll try a different formula.

No, I cannot. Because it has been my life’s objective to collect the entire genres of scifi, fantasy, horror, CBMs etc…
I don’t have ANY issues watching Species or all eight Saw movies, because those have always been clearly labled as horror or sci-fi horror. They’ve been rated R from the very beginning, so these franchises are pure in being for adults only…
But I do have issues with two seconds of Klingon boobies on DSC, because this is not what is supposed to be shown ON STAR TREK! Give me thirty minutes of gratuitous nudity on any 70s Italian giallo and I’d enjoy it to the fullest, but two seconds on Trek… nope!
I want clear distintiveness, clean-cut borderlines and rating structures.
BTW: I’m also against PG-13 outings in originally R-Rated franchises such as Alien, Robocop or Terminator! Those franchise must be R-Rated and it’s a good thing they’re abanoning those PG-13 experiments. AvP, Terminator 4+5 and the Robocop remake should have never happened!
R-Rated movies and franchises can be GREAT! But they need to remain isolated from family franchises. Otherwise, but realms suffer…

BOTH realms suffer, and so do I along with them!

LOL uh yes you can Smike. Just because YOU chose to collect all that stuff doesn’t mean anyone is forcing you to do it.

Look man, I’m starting to think this is more than just about seeing boobies on a TV show and maybe as someone suggested earlier this is a mental health issue. When I say ‘you got issues’ I was talking about social ones. But now I’m starting to think maybe you really do have mental health issues. I mean you been going on about this boob thing for literally weeks now. You go on and on about your point as if we haven’t heard it for the 100th time now. And you are going on about ‘realms’ as if this is some law that was instituted. Star Trek has always had some form of sex, violence and language. It simply delving deeper with it. My point being its never been a Disney animated film, this stuff has been there from the beginning, its only the level of how far its gone we’re talking about.

But we all get your point, we simply don’t agree with it. And more importantly neither do the makers of Star Trek. And yes you have a choice, you just choose to keep watching regardless. But again I’m starting to get the feeling because this is a lot deeper than a guy who is offended by some language and naked Klingons. Have you sought mental health in the past? This is a real question.

“When I say ‘you got issues’ I was talking about social ones. But now I’m starting to think maybe you really do have mental health issues…Have you sought mental help in the past?” No, I haven’t and I don’t see any reason for that. Because all I do is talking about a subject matter that means a great deal to me. “Just because YOU chose to collect all that stuff doesn’t mean anyone is forcing you to do it.” Right, but giving it up is out of the question because it would take away a very iportant part of my life. Why would I want to change my policy in the first place? I love the worlds of sci-fi, fantasy AND horror, the only thing I ask for is those franchises remaining true to their original ratings. “I mean you been going on about this boob thing for literally weeks now.” Because the boob thing ON TREK symbolizes serious boundary pushing FOR TREK! Trek is now clearly an adult franchise and going to be deemed unsuitable for kids and younger teens by my country, by other countries like the UK, Australia etc. But at the same time, kids ARE watching, like they can watch anything above their age certificate, be it online, be it for liberal parentage. The walls are breaking down, and yet, my country expects me to implement those rules and regulations anway. Mostly because of that divergence between age certificates and actual underage viewing habits, I’ve constantly… Read more »

Then I suggest you at least CONSIDER seeing a doctor man. I mean seriously. Yes we all are obsessed with Star Trek, I’m not getting on your case for that. But you seem to be in a whole other realm considering what you wrote here just today. The boob thing being the number one example. You are really worried about kids seeing it in Australia? Seriously?

Smike, your concerns ARE valid, OK? Overblown for sure, but valid. But I feel this has gone beyond just what you consider appropriate for a 12 year old to watch and more of an unhealthy obsession that you can’t drop even if you want to. My guess is you have had many of these kinds of obsessions over other things as well. Again maybe I’m wrong man but seeing what you write here and how much it keeps you up at night (your words) kind of says it all.

“The boob thing being the number one example. You are really worried about kids seeing it in Australia? Seriously?”

Quite obviously you didn’t get the point here. I only mentioned Australia, because it’s the only other democratic country I know that still invests that much into youth protection as Germany. They have the same sort of “punch in your face” age certificates on DVD covers and they occassionally ban movies completely.

I’m not worried about a kid “seeing boobs” anywhere. I’m worried about them watching stuff they are legally not supposed to. Because the mere fact that they have unlimited access to stuff that’s still deemed illegal for them by the country they live in, they learn that respecting the law is unimportant.

That’s why I’m fine with older kids and teens watching some R-Rated movies in France or Quebec! Because there, it’s legal! R-Rated movies are rated 12+ in France and 13+ in Quebec!
And if it’s legally okay, I have to be fine with it, no matter what…But in Germany, the UK or Australia this is considered a legal offense I take it…

I’m not worried about the “harm” these movies will do to kids but about the negative amplification ignoring those age certificates causes.

“My guess is you have had many of these kinds of obsessions over other things as well.”

Nope, this obsession with age certificates and changing viewing habits is the ONLY thing I’ve consistantly thought about for 10 months now, since I first saw Logan! I don’t have time for anything else. :-)

Seriously, I may be obsessed over this, especially when it comes to former all-age franchises, but other people on German boards are even far more backward and radical, people who consider any tolerance for on-screen violence for underage viewers, even aged 16-17, as major crime they “have to fight”.
There I am one of the liberal, reasonable voices. I guess, this is just a matter of cultural differences.

Due to the insane censorship laws of my country, these changes ARE a major issue here and are debated up-and-down. Sure, lots of people don’t care either, but those who care, believe me, they can be really obnoxious…

One could say, these obsessions are a national vice. German angst, if you will. We’ve got at least SEVEN different rating authorities PLUS penal court action to rate movies or ban them.
Lots of 18+ releases are CUT, with the uncut version put on index or banned entirely. They used to do this to “normal” movies like Terminator, Predator, Phantasm, Nightmare on Elm Street, Friday 13th, Starship Troopers or Total Recall, plus 700+ further movies, back in the day!

Most of the mainstream movies have been rehabilitated lately – after decades of being either banned or limited to a cut 18+ release – and are now 16+, but there are people agressively fighting those changes, even on anti-censorship boards, asking for a 21+ rating among other things!

I’m against all this nonsense, but it is still bothering me that kids learn to ignore the law these days. That’s why I’m asking for lower ratings that cannot be THAT easily undermined.

“And you are going on about ‘realms’ as if this is some law that was instituted.”

Oh my… because it IS THE LAW instituted by my country and others. In Germany, the UK, Australia and many other places, age certificates are hard regulations, not parental suggestions.

Of course, the law doesn’t tell Star Trek to remain 12+ in Germany, but with Star Trek now being “upgraded” to the higher age certificate, it becomes part of an absurd cycle of changing viewing habits and unlawful behaviour on minors’ parts. Keeping Star Trek out of that would have been so important for me.

Yeah, even my country cannot prevent those kids from watching GoT these days, but I’m not nearly as emotional about GoT than I am about Star Trek. Trek now being in that very same vein puts me in a delicate position. On the one hand I want to continue supporting that franchise, on the other hand, it now contributes to those ongoing developments of decaying youth protection… Not an easy subject!

“And yes you have a choice, you just choose to keep watching regardless.”

This is absurd. I LOVE watching horror movies. I own hundreds of 16+ or 18+ releases and I even go for UK releases of movies that are still banned in Germany.

How on Earth would I be willing to skip a 16+ or 18+ Star Trek movie? But that doesn’t mean I’m happy with Star Trek being upgraded to that rating after all. I’d rather have individual franchises remain what they are rating-wise. That’s all I’m saying.

Because, end of day, it is hard enough to know that 13-year-olds are watching horror movies or Spartacus these says.

But now having to accept the same kind of “transgression” on minors’ parts with Star Trek, is a completely different beast of burden!

“But again I’m starting to get the feeling because this is a lot deeper than a guy who is offended by some language and naked Klingons.”

I have never been offended by language. It isn’t an issue for our rating authorities anyway, so why would I have any issues with f-bombs?

Nudity is sort of a shizo thing for me. It isn’t a big deal with the German rating system either, but personaly I feel uneasy about it, especially in pre-established franchises. So yeah, culturally I should be fine and relaxed with it, but personally I cannot subscribe to that notion yet, especially because there’s much worse stuff online…

Will we see some T and A on Trek. Probably see the alien with 3 boobs, Uhura and Spock do it.

Scotty and Sulu…

@ Arathorn – which reminds me…if Q.T. ends up doing his own vision with this, I hope ‘Keenser’ gets blasted out an airlock!

What? Keesner is adorable!

Uhura/Spock, yeah! W00t

Spock/Uhura doing the deed wouldn’t be half bad. If anything, Beyond especially seemed to deliberately keep all the interactions platonic and not even allowing them a peck on the mouth, which seems a tad too over the top safe.. even for a team that didn’t want to piss off the most conservative fanboys who have an aneurysm over the mere idea of the characters not being asexuate. You don’t need a full explicit sex scene and nudity to suggest intimacy and sexuality, though. Don’t need to turn trek into games of thrones.

I suspect, though, that the R rating would be more about gritty, violence and language.

Yeah, Jemini, I was disappointed as hail when Spock and Uhura didn’t even sneak a Vulcan-style “kiss” at the end. Or duck into a corner for a lip-to-lip. I really did like S: “What are you doing here?” U: “Rescuing you!” and all the great Uhura-as-an-officer stuff, when the Enterprise was getting shot to pieces. Uhura was bada** in this movie. Didn’t she deserve a kiss from her boyfriend at the end? Dayum!

if you watched some of the behind the scenes videos, it looks like they kissed in another shot of the party scene (when she brings him a drink). It’s hard to tell from the angle, but that was the case too bad they changed it. That scene is a rare moment where we can see these characters off duty, and I like these guys being like a family now and just like in real life, seeing your friends being affectionate is normal and no big deal.

And now this could finally be the reboot we’ve been waiting for! An R-rated ST movie. I can barely imagine. Orion Slave Girls, anyone?

Star Trek should be kept accessible to young people, to inspire them with its though-provoking storytelling, fascinating alien worlds, impressive technological ideas and a bright vision of humanity’s future… ohhh, this is about the Kelvin timeline, never mind then ;)

I liked the idea of Mr. Tarantino doing a film, if he’s such a big fan, but why the R rating? Has violence and the f-bomb so improved Discovery? I doubt it. There was talk of Star Trek 3D in the eighties, and it was dropped as a gimmick. I think Paramount is close to just not knowing what to do with Star Trek anymore. They tried all-out action and now they’re going R. It’s all sizzle and no steak. They will eventually dry up their merchandising stream with all these niche Treks, since they don’t appeal to kids. I’m all up for a good story from T, if he gets one.

The eff-bomb on DISCO was effing awesome
;^)

It was effing cool!

I think it’s safe to say that we can blame this on the success of Logan and Deadpool, as well as the ongoing craze for GoT, TWD etc… Millions of people have applauded a formerly family-friendly franchise such as the Xverse being turned into a bloody nightmare, honoring it with higher attendance than any of the regular PG-13 X-Men movies. Gazillion of people are watching GoT, thunderously applauding the transformation of the high fantasy genre into a mix of blood and boobs… a genre once “created” by decent authors such as JRR Tolkien and CS Lewis, now leading to an Amazon series set in Middle-Earth trying to be just like GoT… And finally Trek’s very own fandom has widely accepted the TV-MA rated DISCO, which has been the tesing ground for even more changes to our beloved franchise. An R-Rated Star Trek movie created by Quentin Tarantino is by far the most vomit-inducing prospect… and everyone who stood by and applauded those changes on DISCO is to blame! I remember watching that “cult movies” Pulp Fiction and From Dusk Till Dawn back in the late 90s with some friends, feeling very uneasy about those BECAUSE I had been primarly a Trekkie who couldn’t really cope with all that graphic violence, even at the age of 17-18. I hated the meaningless violence in those movies because of the values once taught by Star Trek. These movies felt like the complete antithesis to the franchise I loved back then. Now this franchise… Read more »

Oh Smike. Just give in to the debauchery.

Fantastic comment. Pretty much wholeheartedly agree.

I’m with you about the graphic violence. I don’t feel that DISCO is horribly violent, though; maybe my perceptions have got warped over the years. The violence that is there is shocking to the characters, within the context, and seems dramatically appropriate.

As opposed to the free-flyin’ boobies in the Littlefinger scenes in early GoT days. And most of the violence on GoT, which is deliberately set in a cruel, cruel world, so that gore can be shown, and shown, and ….

“I don’t feel that DISCO is horribly violent, though; maybe my perceptions have got warped over the years.”

No, DISCO isn’t horribly violent at all, but I fear that the occasional inclusion of those “five seconds of shame” are but a harbinger of things to come.
Marja, maybe you are not a regular reader, but yes, people here are right about one thing: I’ve been obsessed with these issues for the better part of a year but only because I care so much about Star Trek.
Thanks for showing respect for my points. I cannot tell you how much any of this means to me…

Again, I completely and wholeheartedly agree with you. I’ve largely given up on anything Hollywood has made past 2005 or so. We’re better off sticking with the classic films and television shows made before 2005.

Man, I freakin’ love Turner Classic Movies, when I can tune in. These days I stream lots of Netflix [they have All the Star Trek except DISCO], Amazon films and series. I don’t worry too much about “language” and normal-type sex, but I do dislike excessive violence.

@Smike – ugh you…just…nevermind.

I like that you admit how popular this is but try to make it a negative. Get off the ship if you dont like where its headed.

@TUP: I know you hate my opinions to the fullest and…nevermind…it’s okay. Hate me or my point, but no, I won’t get off our little starship unless you push me out of an airlock at warp speed! It’s my prerogative to speak my mind and I feel obliged to do so.

For what it’s worth… while your lot had your day during the premiere weeks of DISCO, the simple prospect of an R-Rated QT Trek movie has finally made SOME folks agreeing with me after all. Finally the fandom is waking up. Not all of us are mindless apologists craving for R-Rated content within ozr beloved franchise!

It’s been along road until I got people thinking, but my time is finally here… you, TUP, and all the others will soon be outnumbered by true Starfleet officers who will not stand by while Star Trek is hijacked by a dark lord of smutt…

Smike, so very well said. It seems the values that make the original Star Trek so loved the world over are now ground into the dirt under the heel of cheap thrills, arse-shots and needless violence and destruction. What I hated about the last two movies was the near- and total destruction of the Enterprise, our beautiful ship thrown away for a few minutes of shock and awe. Compared with the way she went down in Search for Spock, Beyond was a disgrace.

I have no interest in a QT version of Trek. I’m sick of seeing beloved characters and ships abused by people who have no right to play in the Trek sandbox. I can only wonder what heights the next movie could have reached if they had gone with someone who has vision, empathy and originality… say Patty Jenkins for example. RIP Star Trek, I’ll stick to fanfic from now on.