TrekMovie had the chance to chat with some of the cast of Star Trek: Discovery
Just call him “Voqler,” but don’t ask him to return to the makeup chair
The big thing for Shazad Latif during the first season was maintaining the secret that his character of Tyler was actually the Klingon Voq. The actor talked about what’s next for him (or them) in season two.
Now that the secret, it’s more about the repercussions. It is more of a balancing act. He is stuck between Starfleet and the Klingons, and how you would handle that. And the fallout, who he has hurt, how he is going to repair stuff, the intimate relationships with L’Rell and Burnham. That’s enough for anyone.
Latif also talked about how the second season has a lighter tone, like more traditional Trek:
The first one was set in wartime and it was very dark, it had to be. My character was dealing with very deep issues and going through a lot of pain and struggle, which is very great for drama. I think this [season] is very much like the old Trek. It has got more lighter moments, which balance it out even more, which I think everyone is going to love.
As for what to call his character that started as Voq, but became Tyler and now has this balancing act, Latif joked it could be “Tosh,” but agreed “Voqler” works. As for the Star Trek: Short Treks the actor didn’t have much to say except to reveal he will not be part of any of the four short episodes, which will be released monthly in the fall.
Latif also said that so far he has not done any more scenes in full Klingon makeup as Voq, and sent out a plea that he hopes it stays that way, joking that if they do need a flashback, he wants a high tech solution:
I hope not [having to do Voq makeup]. I am asking though. No more. …CGI flashbacks — I’d put on the [motion capture] suit. Nothing on the face!
Latif’s last time in Klingon makeup, playing Firewolf (Mirror Voq) in episode 11 of season 1
First episode back was emotional for L’Rell and Tyler, wants more scenes with Tilly
When asked if anything has been particularly challenging this season, Latif talked about filming the first episode back featuring Tyler and L’Rell (Mary Chieffo):
It is always a challenge. When it is a particular episode – we left with me and L’Rell going back to the Klingons – there is a whole episode about that kind of stuff. I can’t say much, but it is a very emotional episode to get back into it when you meet them again. It is always tough to film that kind of stuff, big emotion stuff. It is such high stakes. It is in space. L’Rell is [Chancellor]. These are big ideals. So, you have to really focus and go there 100 percent, because if you go there ninety percent, nobody is going to believe you.
When talking about who else he has worked with in the second season so far, the actor also revealed that he has yet to do any scenes with Anson Mount (Captain Pike) or the recently announced Ethan Peck playing Spock, but he said he was “sure” to do so before the season ended. He also revealed he very much wants to get some lighter scenes with Mary Wiseman’s Tilly, like they had earlier in the first season:
I am trying to get me and Tilly — get more scenes of us together, because in real life we are so close. There is an essence of it in episodes six and seven [in season one] when we meet in the mess hall. There are elements of us all sort of laughing together and then it sort of — I want more of that! More! …She get’s [Tyler]. There is a good friendship there.
Shazad wants Tilly and Tyler to hang again
Watch the full interview with Shazad Latif
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I think Latif’s performance in S1 was really underrated. I think he did an excellent job with some complex scenes. And the actor is extremely likable.
See him in The Commuter.
Oh, he’s f***ing GREAT in season one! And I say that as someone who doesn’t like the show very much at all. He impressed me more than anyone else by far.
You might say he’s your tether.
Its a bummer that Jason Isaacs didn’t stick around though for S2!
Good riddance to that pathetic one dimensional mustache-twirling villain.
So adorable. Love this guy.
I’m happy so many keep repeating next season will be lighter. DIS tried to be too much like DS9 IMO, only without the charm and personality of those characters. Keep it lighter but you can still have dark moments like TNG, VOY and etc did, but not all the time. It just felt too weighty for me and why I have a hard time rewatching most of first season. Star Trek is suppose to be fun, not depressing all the time.
“DIS tried to be too much like DS9 IMO”
I don’t think it felt anything like DS9. S1 was like a weird mix of VOY and The Walking Dead. Yeah, they tried to make it darker by adding some guts and gore here and there, TWD references included (Walker class, USS Glenn, SMG starring).
But overall, the war arc didn’t pay off… just like VOY never fully realized its potential either.
DS9 did a much much better job displaying a long-term war while still preserving its Trek feeling. Even ENT’s Xindi arc felt a lot more convincing and cohesive.
They did a great job on the Mirror Universe stuff though. There, the darkness fully paid off.
But I think DSC will do fine as a true Pre-TOS prequel as of S2.
I mean the tone just felt much darker than the others. DS9 is the only other show that did a season long war arc. I don’t count Enterprise and Xindi because that wasn’t really a war like DS9 and DIS was. Enterprise was just one ship trying to stop another attack from happening.
And it tried to hit the same grey area themes DS9 did like how far can you go in a war before it’s morally wrong? The fact they were willing to look the other way like how Sisko over looked what Garak did to get the Romulans on their side. Lorca felt a lot like Sisko in excusing his actions in war time. Of course we later found out why, but he came off like a guy who knew they were losing the war and would do anything like Sisko started to do in seasons 5 and 6.
And I’m not the only one that noticed the parallels either:
https://comicbook.com/startrek/2018/01/06/star-trek-discovery-deep-space-nine-connection/
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying they were good at it lol, but I do feel that was the attempt on some level.
LIke you, I just didn’t feel the war angle in DIS paid off but it was also two-thirds of the season so it’s hard to get into it when the main story line just wasn’t very appealing IMO although I liked the series as a whole.
Regarding your second paragraph, Sisko was a good man wrestling with moral conundrums over how to end the war quickly and with fewest casualties. Lorca was not that sort of man. He was an undercover one dimensional villain whose reveal as such totally undermined any sense that he was struggling with moral conundrums. He was a moustache twirler who had no morality.
No Sisko is the man lol! AGREED! I’m not putting him down, but he has definitely done things I don’t think Picard or Kirk would’ve done, but yes his intentions were on the good side. .
I notice people really seem to hate Lorca after the big reveal. I still liked him but I can understand why so many hated the twist and made the character look worse.
I think the dislike comes from the “real” Lorca being one dimensional. Had he been revealed as a troubled and conflicted villain I think people would’ve been more forgiving.
I can’t speak for others but for me the reason was before I knew who he really was he was such a fascinating character. Unlike any Captain we had ever seen. I was fascinated with his decisions and actions and how he treated people. I wanted to see more of what made him tick. I wanted to explore his entire story. But then… Sorry… All of that was subterfuge. He’s none of that. He’s not fascinating. He’s not complicated. Who cares what makes him tick because the reality is he’s just a MU bad guy with no nuances of any kind at all. It’s not like showing a great character and then killing him off so we never learn anything else. It’s that he was presented as interesting and it turns out he never was. It was such an idiotic concept that when people predicted it I blew it off as too stupid for even Discoery’s show runners.
So yes, this was a long winded way of saying what you just did, El Chup.
Previous comment was getting moderated. So here is an edited version…
I can’t speak for others but for me the reason was before I knew who he really was he was such a fascinating character. Unlike any Captain we had ever seen. I was fascinated with his decisions and actions and how he treated people. I wanted to see more of what made him tick. I wanted to explore his entire story. But then… Sorry… All of that was subterfuge. He’s none of that. He’s not fascinating. He’s not complicated. Who cares what makes him tick because the reality is he’s just a MU bad guy with no nuances of any kind at all. It’s not like showing a great character and then killing him off so we never learn anything else. It’s that he was presented as interesting and it turns out he never was. It was such a creatively bankrupt concept that when people predicted it I blew it off as too ridiculous for even Discoery’s show runners.
So yes, this was a long winded way of saying what you just did, El Chup.
Yeah sometimes TM do moderate things. It’s usually maybe a word somewhere that get it put in purgatory. Most of the time though it’s approved as yours did but it does get annoying waiting to see if it shows up or not.
As for Lorca, obviously I understand. They could’ve done more with him if he was a PU character with issues. I actually liked the idea when others thought he was secretly a Section 31 agent, that may had been fun to explore too. Not a bad guy but someone who did things he may have regretted in the past and trying to redeem himself.
While I think him being Section 31 is better than being from the MU, I still think that is a cop out. I’d really like to see a Captain who is somewhat of an enigma. Can be a harsh a-hole one moment and then do something selfless for a crewmember the next. We’ve all had bosses who have been jerks. Why can’t that be a Starfleet Captain? Where the people below him wonder how he ever reached that level? Not sure how long the show can go on with that concept but it is new and innovative for Trek and one that I thought STD was using. Sadly I was wrong.
I agree. I don’t have any issues with Lorca being from the MU, but I also said I would’ve been fine if he was really from the PU and just had troubled issues or a past he couldn’t resolve. I think the show runners just wanted a big twist and looking at their resume that’s kind of the stuff they were always doing in their other shows.
Ironically these showrunners turned out exactly like Lorca, one-dimensional bad people who were preaching water while drinking wine all along, quickly flushed into oblivion after being caught in the act… What they did with Lorca, the lies, the deception, is just unforgivable and i doubt any shownrunner who “gets Trek” wouldve gone down that route of undermining and destroying a main protagonist in such a blatant, audience-insulting way. Let’s just all treat season 1 as a bad nightmare and see where they take us in S2.
I think I read somewhere that Lorca being from the MU was the concept from the very beginning. Back when Fuller and the others were involved. This surprised me that Fuller was on board with it. I’ve always felt him much better than that. Shows we all make mistakes.
That is incorrect. Fuller wanted Lorca to be a tough captain (from our universe) that operates in the grey area of wartime. The idea that he’s from the MU came from Harberts and Berg after Fuller left.
See the section titled “Lorca wasn’t originally going to be Mirror” in this article:
https://trekmovie.com/2018/01/29/jason-isaacs-and-star-trek-discovery-producers-talk-prime-lorca-emperors-future-and-more/
Yeah Matt Wright is correct. It came after Fuller left. And from I read they rewrote the third script completely which was already written when Fuller was still there and my guess is part of it was to include the hints of Lorca being from the MU.
That is a real shame. Fuller’s idea was so much more compelling. Harberts and Berg totally blew it, took arguably the most interesting character in the series, and deep-sixed him. Nice move.
Absolutely a shame. They had an amazingly complex character in their hands and completely flushed him down the toilet, ruining their own show in the process. Although if it’s true and if Issacs was indeed only on board for one season then it seems like he was doomed either way. Just would have been better if he were prime.
Agreed. It’s a shame. Isaacs really like the MU idea too, so they went with it full force.
It totally sounds like the idea came from Berg and Harberts. But the thing that throws a wrench in that was Issacs claiming the job was only for the one season and he was told about the MU thing BEFORE taking the gig. Was that even true then?
Remember Fuller was developing a series from scratch for the first ~6 months of 2016. During that time he was spitballing all kinds of ideas and then tossing out ones that CBS outright rejected or were found to be too costly, etc. They didn’t actually hire many of the actors until late-2016 — during or just after the transition from Fuller to Goldsman and Berg and Harberts. The final version of Discovery season 1 was a big scramble with lots of changes and re-writes to the first half of the season, many times done at the last minute. Both Jason Isaacs and Rainn Wilson touched on the last minute scramble to refine their characters at STLV this year. So there’s no “wrench” in what Isaacs says. By the time the producers hired him they had already made the decision that Lorca would be from the MU (but not much else).
…makes one wonder if Issacs would have been up for staying more than one season if things had gone how Fuller envisioned. Bummer.
OK. So it seems I got my timing of things off a bit. Shame things went they way they did with S1. Sounds very much like Berg & Harberts could very well be responsible for much of the S1 plotting issues. Their ouster could very well bode well for S2. We shall see…
I know like what happened with Orci and the third Kelvin film, I don’t think we will ever get the full story of why Fuller left Discovery so abruptly. I don’t doubt a big part of it was him just getting behind making the show with all his other commitments and CBS was getting sick of the delays.
But I also think there was a lot more conflict between what Fuller wanted in the show vs CBS. Now I have always said the show that Fuller laid out from the beginning we basically got. But I’m also guessing a lot of that was compromised between what he originally wanted to do. It looks like he did get his overall vision and look of the show on the screen but I do have a feeling individual stories, characters and tone of the show was changed a lot.
@Garth Lorca
Agree with your reasoning. It was nothing like DS9. Not even close.
Very much agree with your first two paragraphs.
Disagree on the mirror universe stuff. Personally I found the novelty to have worn off mid wat through the second MU episode, by which point it was already descending into little more than one dimensional villains and ray gun shooting – generic sci-fi action in other words. Those episodes, especially the second two MU episodes, were for me a microcosm of everything bad about the Season One writing.
Just want to agree that DS9 did season long war arcs that worked very well overall. And yes, even the Xindi arc worked WAY better than anything STD did. Forced to disagree on the MU stuff. None of it worked and felt like a tremendous waste of episodes in a season that felt like it was cut too short to begin with.
SMG starring isn’t in itself a reference toTWD and the USS Glenn probably refers to astronaut John Glenn.
“Yeah, they tried to make it darker by adding some guts and gore here and there, TWD references included (Walker class, USS Glenn….”
Seriously? You have heard of the famous astronaut, John Glenn, right?
I’ll give you a pass though on not knowing about X-15 test pilot Joseph Walker — technically the 7th man to go into space.
I personally don’t think it was anything like DS9. DS9 had mostly more intelligent scripts and was littered with brighter moments and moments of levity in between the darker episodes. Plus, like you say, the characters were more interesting.
Discovery spent half a season setting up a Trek-like pay off that never came. Instead we got obvious twists and banal nonsense with moustache twirling villains and the ridiculous plot idea of an evil villain entrusted with the fate of the Federation. DS9 wouldn’t have dared offer up that sort of nonsense. Hell, I doubt even Voyager would have offered up writing that bad.
Having said all that “more like past Trek” is a reason for hope and so maybe it will indeed go in the right direction now that the writers room has changed, TOS mining aside.
As I said, I felt they were going for the darker aspects of DS9, not so much the show as a whole. I’m not saying DIS is anything close to the greatness of DS9 lol. Not even close. But yeah I definitely see it. Especially now that we know Section 31 was suppose to have a bigger role in the first season. I get what others are saying, its a poor imitation, I AGREE, which is why I was happy to hear it’s going to be lighter if they were trying to go that direction.
I just felt Discovery was meant to be a more morally grey show, we were suppose to question character motives and that everyone wasn’t meant to get along which is what DS9 did differently than the others. At least DIS first season. But if others just don’t agree or think I’m reaching, fair enough.
What people are saying is that DIS didnt turn out as a “morally grey” show after all. They promised to explore nativist Klingons and delivered fascist cannibals. They promised a truly new, “edgy” captain with Lorca and delivered a fascist genocidal maniac. The unrealistic black-ness of all this is deafening.
I get your point, but I do think they WERE going for that angle, they just failed at it IMO. I mean the season finale made that pretty clear. Starfleet was going to blow up an entire planet to win a war. They didn’t want to do it, but they felt it was necessary. You can argue it’s an analogy of America dropping the atomic bomb on Japan in WW 2. Many hated the idea but in their minds it was the only way to end the war completely. Others obviously disagreed but that’s where the ‘morally grey’ part comes in. Of course in DIS case they didn’t do it, but it’s something I felt they set up to show this series isn’t your typical Star Trek show and be edgy.
For me that’s why I felt they wanted the show to be a bit more DS9 in that regard because it was darker and the characters were doing things you may question other Starfleet officers doing. That said I can’t disagree with you and others much, they did a poor job of making it about two sides and the show just made everyone look worse instead of making a moral argument during war time and trying to find a balance between right and wrong DS9 always did a great job with.
My guess next season it will be more like classic Trek like TOS, VOY and TNG and fewer lesser of the two evil story lines.
The problem with the final so-called “morally grey” solution of blowing up Qo’nos is that whatever Star Trek-y “right or wrong” element they tried to set up was undermined by the idiocy of the plot in general. People were too busy with hollow planets and dual pee streams and evil dictators taking charge of Starships to see the issues with the concept of mass destruction of an enemy in a time of war. Which felt amazingly hollow to begin with, anyway. All the admiralty seemed to be behind the plan while the entire crew of the ship they needed to carry it out was not. Sorry. That concept doesn’t fly with me, either.
Yeah sadly they set up a really interesting morality play but put it in a pretty bad finale. I was really excited to see where they were going with it and it ended up being pretty flat.
Here, here! El Chup, I could not agree with you more.
Interesting. See, for me, Disco was more akin to Star Trek Into Darkness meets Battlestar Galactica season 4 meets Starcrash meets Hardware Wars meets a TED talk.
LOL!
The first season felt like a prologue to me. We meet the characters and get the lay of the land through this long wartime storyline, and then at the very end, there they all are — together on the bridge, ready to explore.
” I think this [season] is very much like the old Trek. ”
What TPTB want you to know about next season in one sentence. The entire CBS marketing drive in a nutshell.
After they are trying so hard to win back disgruntled fans like me, let’s see what they deliver!
Exactly. Such a far cry from the “Not your daddy’s Star Trek” strategy! After all the horrible changes to what old trek used to represent, they’ve lost me as a fan for now as well.
It’s not that they changed things. I actually encourage them to change things up. But do something GOOD. You want a twist, do one that doesn’t undermine the only good character in your cast. You want to change the style, fine. Do so in a way that includes deeper characters and sharp writing and great plotting. Change the look of the era but not to the point where it bears zero resemblance to the era it’s supposed to be in.
Yeah, I don’t think they went too dark. But, yeah, the twists were mostly silly (Lorca) and or not really explored (Tyler/Voq).
And the war was rushed and wrapped up way too quickly/neatly.
I like to think of S1 as “twist-driven”. The integrity of several characters was sacrificed for this addiction, most of all Lorca. What we ended up with was a show that neither had deep characterization nor coherent plots, let alone morality plays or exploration… no wonder a major course correction was due.
And I think it worth noting that I think word of mouth about STD is hurting future subscribers for CBSAA. The show has come and gone and it is generating little to no positive buzz. Since they didn’t really promote the show or their service much they had to rely on those who DID see it to tell others about it. The overall message has been “don’t waste your time on CBSAA”. CBS is in salvage mode at this point. It’s why we have the Picard show coming and other Trek projects.
Its nothing wrong to change the formula up for a new generation and audience but they clearly went waaaaaaaay too far with it and it’s obvious they know that.
I don’t know how Season Two will play out, but one issue I think worked against DSC was the type of serialisation. Trek’s best episodes have always been largely stand-alone and when DS9 and ENT attempted serialisation it wasn’t full serialisation. It was more hybrid between serialisation and stand-alone. You had the overreaching plot strand, but many episodes dealt with individual stories within that. It’s something the modern Doctor Who has also done for a decade or so. DSC in contrast was more like a one big story soap opera. Multiple episodes with a few plot threads that basically merge into one 15 hour episode. Not only is that risky, because the writing has to be top notch to pull off a great Trek like story (which it failed to do), but it reduces the scope to tell individual character stories, to explore space and to tell stories within stories – something already hampered by shorter seasons. I think it speaks volumes that one of the episodes people say they liked the most was the Harry Mudd time reset one. I think the reason for that is because it was the one episode that was more that hybrid sort of episode I am talking about rather than full on serialisation, so it stood out.
Now, I realise serialisation is the order of the day for modern TV, but given that it is Trek and must be recognisable as Trek to tell Trek like stories, I think the DS9/ENT style hybridisation would work better and I would like to see a shift more towards that as the show goes on so that we can have a wider variety of adventures and greater opportunities for morality plays.
I will admit, before DIS started I was always one of those people who defended it for being serialized. This is just how TV is today and ESPECIALLY streaming TV because those shows are designed to be binged in short sittings so they purposely serialize them to keep them hook from beginning to end.
But after seeing how they did it, sadly I have to say I was wrong (see I can admit when I’m wrong….once ;)). It just didn’t work the way I thought it would. You’re right one of the problems was it was hard to just break away and do interesting stories on its own because they only had 15 episodes and they had two big arcs for the season, the Klingon War and the Mirror Universe. It’s also why I don’t think we got ONE single episode of exploration. Not one, which is a BIG no-no for Star Trek and for me. But there was literally no time to just go and visit something for the sake of it.
Oddly about Enterprise, I loved it’s third season because even though it was heavily serialized, that season actually had some of the best standalone episodes of the series: Twilight, North Star, E2, Similitude, etc. So many of those episodes feel like something out TOS or TNG. But also because you said, they just had a lot more episodes, so they could do that. Most of these would be considered ‘filler’ since they didn’t focus on the Xindi but it some of the best stuff.
And yes, Sanest Man is ALSO my favorite episode of DIS as well. It’s one of the few I have at least watched more than once because it does feel more standalone and it’s in crazy Star Trek mode which is what I mostly love. And it used the time loop idea TNG did in Cause and Effect. Good episode, they definitely need to do more of that and less boring Klingon stuff next season.
The short season for Trek is both a blessing and a curse. The normal season length is long enough to give you some standalones while still dropping in a thing or two to move the season arc along. The short season means no time for something like that. The story arc MUST move forward. For STD the one I liked best, Lethe, really didn’t move the story arc forward but mainly focused on what our main character went through. Not much time for stuff like that when you have a main story arc.
BTW, the first time I saw the concept of standalone episodes that dropped in elements of an underlying season long thing was on Buffy the Vampire Slayer.
I actually rewatched Lethe for the first time this week and I have to say I really liked it much better than the first time around. I really enjoyed just seeing more development on both Sarek and the racist Vulcans angle in general, which I thought was a nice continuation of what Enterprise did with them. And of course it felt a lot more obvious who Lorca was and it was fun to know that after the fact.
But as El Chup was saying the lesser serial stories of the season seem to be more popular for a reason because you can just watch them without knowing the back story to everything. And sadly the Klingon stuff just felt the least interesting. That’s the other problem of a serial, if you love the story its fine. But the second you don’t then it’s hard to enjoy the season as a whole even if you still like the characters and so forth. We know next season it will be a (roughly) one story arc but now with only 13 episodes. But I’m hoping the story is at least open enough where they can divert to more standalone stuff but not holding my breath.
But maybe the story they are telling will be exciting enough that you don’t care. Sadly I can’t say the same about first season at all.
Um, didn’t you see? Now they have THE SEXIEST SPOCK EVER. Is your heart made of stone?
The thing is being “like the old Trek” should be about the type of stories told and the quality of the characters. I fear they think being like old Trek means more jokes and recycling TOS characters. In reality the improvement should be about exploring the human condition with good, intelligent scripts and well developed characters. But all means they should have more levity, not least to make it all more of a fun watch and to make their characters more likeable. But that’s not all it takes IMO.
Voqler might’ve had PTSD, but I have PSSD – that’s Post-Shazad Stress Disorder, the anxiety caused by the lack of Shazad on my video streams. WE DEMAND A VOQLER SPIN-OFF wherein Voqler and his family adjust to a new life of luxury after the success of his dry-cleaner chain.
Ugh, they ruined and killed off a great character like Lorca but we have to suffer through this weird Klingon garbage.
I like Discovery but some of these plot/character choices are ridiculous.
I have a feeling they will take a back seat to the main story next season at least. They didn’t even show them in the trailer.
Yep. Lorca, yes! Klingons, no!
Season 1 (at least the portions that I saw) looked like DS9 filmed in a Greenwich Village bar. There’s reason to be hopeful for season 2… fingers crossed.
I’m so glad the clunky, mechanical (and questionable) explanation of Tyler/Voq is behind him now because this man is a fantastic actor who elevates any material he comes near and hopefully season two will give him some better scripts to chew on. Even if the writing is unimproved, though, I can’t wait to see more of him on screen.
I love that TrekMovie has access to this semi-public insidery information, but I’m worried we’re starting to learn a little TOO much about season 2. (I also remember all the misdirection from the premiere season!)
I’m going to have to start skipping some of these articles until after the second season has aired… I’m just not a read-the-last-page-first kinda guy. 8-)
Yeah just skip the articles! I personally have no problems hearing as much as we can and so far we haven’t learned what the actual story of second season is yet outside of Spock is missing and they are going to find him. The other stuff so far has been more character insights.
What I’m more worried about is a repetition of those lofty pre-season 1 promises that turned into a total farce in execution (exploration of nativism or Lorca as a conflicted captain). Will any of this “return to old Trek” talk pay off? Clearly these guys don’t have problems with ideas but severe issues with delivery!
Very good actor & nice guy. Look forward to seeing more of him. Great interview, thank you.
Whilst Shazad’s performance was one of the better ones in the disastrous first season, the Klingons are such a mess, that their return would undermine any emotion in Tyler coming back.
I am deeply disappointed that L’Rell and Tyler are coming back. Nothing against either actor, but the Klingon arc needs putting in a memory hole. The writers and make up artists destroyed them in my humble opinion.
I really loved the Klingons in DISC — almost everything about them. For the first time since TOS, I’m actually interested in the Klingons. Thank god they no longer look like rejects from a 70’s hair metal band. I can’t even watch some episodes of TNG anymore because of the trope-filled Berman era stories about them. In my humble opinion.
I’m with you Curious Cadet, when the Klingons were given something new in TSFS they were interesting, but with TNG they just became kinda boring and just another Star Trek Monoculture™ that just became boring as hell. Part of that is seeing it through Worf’s eyes, he’s always trying to be more Klingon than Klingons that it just bogs stuff down and everything just becomes an honor culture thing where anything can be honorable.
DSC they finally felt new again, they finally felt like there was more than a monoculture made up of bad hair metal blackface bands.
But the DIS Klingons didn’t feel anything more than a monoculture either. They made some of them look different physically but not anything culturally that felt different. In fact they came off very one dimensional because they all came off like intolerant brutal killers. There was no depth there at all, especially compared to past Klingons where you did see different sides to them.
To make this clear though I NEVER been a big fan of Klingons and their story lines usually bored me in TNG and the others. They barely count in TOS to me because they felt like another species entirely and were barely around. DS9 was really the only time I fell in love with them when they went to war with the Federation. That and TUC were the only times I was really interested in them. I had no interest in them in DIS either but I was kind of hoping I would like them like I did in DS9 and they sadly came off so disappointing it’s even hard to watch the episodes they were mostly end now.
I give the DIS producer credit for trying to change them up but it clearly didn’t work for a lot of people and they only depth they gave them was in ltheir looks and speech but not personality and culture.
“DSC they finally felt new again, they finally felt like there was more than a monoculture made up of bad hair metal blackface bands.”
The thing is, that is what the producers promised we would get. (the part about Klingons being more than a monoculture) But we ended up with nothing more than we got before in feature films that just presented them as “the bad guys”. STD Klingons, behaviorally, had more in common with TOS Klingons than with spin-off series Klingons.
” Nothing against either actor, but the Klingon arc needs putting in a memory hole.”
Forced to agree. Klingons in STD need to be shelved for a while so we can get the bad taste of that meaningless Klingon war out of our mouths.
I wasn’t a fan of season one at all but I accept that it appeals to some. Having seen the trailer for season 2 I’m far more optimistic. I think the casting of Pike and Spock were spot on.
what’s up with this page? Why is not it updated?
No new news probably. Most of what they been posting the last few weeks are interview and news from the LV con. Outside of the news with the new Spock its been just articles about what was reported there.