Over the last week, we have brought you news from Brent Spiner and the Picard panel at STLV, but there are a few more bits of news related to Star Trek: Picard to catch you up on.
Season one writing complete
A week ago, Picard showrunner Michael Chabon took to Instagram to share his struggle completing the script for the season one finale. The photo he chose was Kirk fighting the Gorn in “Arena.” Chabon was quick to point out the image was not a clue as to the Gorn’s inclusion in the show, with a fun note of warning to us here at TrekMovie. Chabon and TrekMovie have been having a bit of fun with each other on Instagram.
On Monday, Chabon posted another update showing off a gift from his wife of a set of books from author Jack Vance. He says the gifts may have been in honor of finishing the scripts for the first season of Picard.
The first season of Star Trek: Picard is still in production in Southern California. The show is expected to wrap the first season in mid-September and debut on CBS All Access in the first quarter of 2020.
Del Arco hints at emotional story for Hugh
Based on his comments at SDCC and especially at STLV, it appears that Jonathan Del Arco’s role as Hugh in Picard will be substantial. On Twitter yesterday the actor indicated that he and Patrick Stewart will again be tugging on the heartstrings, as they did when they had scenes together in Star Trek: The Next Generation.
Berman implores you to watch Picard
Rick Berman, the man who oversaw the Star Trek franchise throughout the 90s and into the early 00s, has mostly remained quiet over the last decade in regards to Trek movies and TV. However, in regard to the upcoming Star Trek: Picard show, Berman has been expressing optimism and excitement. The latest example is a tweet over the weekend celebrating the new cast and crew lined up for the new show, including some old friends and actors he brought into the franchise.
Stewart, Spiner, Frakes, Ryan, Chabon, Goldsman….what else could we ask for? Im holding my breath. Watch!!
— Rick Berman (@berman_rick) August 5, 2019
Cast talk first contact with Star Trek
CBS has released another video (on startrek.com) with the returning Star Trek cast filmed at San Diego Comic-Con last month. This time it has Brent Spiner, Jonathan Del Arco, Jeri Ryan and Sir Patrick Stewart talking about their first contacts with the Star Trek franchise.
Keep up with all the news on the Picard show here at TrekMovie.com.
“It’s not a person damnit. It’s a Borg!”
I guess it’s a good thing I plan to start rewatching TNG for the first time soon. Hopefully I will be able to start within the next few weeks. I just don’t remember anything significant about Hugh.
hugh really stood out for me… i’ve been rewatching ds9… i suggest that after tng… amazing how ahead of it’s time it was… and it’s super addictive with it’s serialized story telling… tng ive seen a lot over the years… i have a soft spot for the early season… they are rougher but i like the early we dont know what were really doing yet vibe… season 3-6 are the best… 7 is super weird
Unhappening, I rewatched DS9 a number of years ago and it just cemented my memory of how great it was when compared to TNG. I don’t want to sound like I’m ripping on TNG. Stewart was great on the show and it did bring Trek back into popular culture. And after GR lessened his involvement (and this was a repeat from TOS but to a lesser extent) the show did improve. But Gene’s TNG characters were plain, boring and weak. Something the other shows learned from. I just finished my rewatch of Voyager and my opinion of it has improved from my memory of watching it that one time it aired. I am actually hoping the rewatch of TNG will help improve my memory of that show. There are only perhaps 4 or 5 episodes of TNG I have seen more than once.
I have watched tons of TNG since the show was announced but now I think I’m considering doing my first Borg marathon now that we know its about them and will include people like Hugh and Seven. I won’t watch them all, but it will be fun to do and of course the big ones like BOBW, First Contact, Scorpion and Dark Frontier. And I haven’t seen episodes of I Borg and Descent in ages.
I actually thought highly enough of TBOBW that I bought the disc where they spliced the two together. The one thing I REALLY miss was the scoring cue when they cut to black after “Mr. Worf… Fire.” A better editing choice would have been to include that fade to black and then start right up with the energy weapon firing. It’s the one episode, obviously, I have seen more than 3 times.
True story… 3 of my Trek biddies and I would plan to watch TNG on saturday evenings. (It aired at 7pm on our local affiliate) We were all in college then. There would often be comments made during the episodes. Usually cracks at various plot holes and what characters did wrong or what have you. But when we watched TBOBW there was NONE of that. We sat there quietly every one of us wrapped up in the story to the point where we lost track of time (so no one knew 8pm was approaching) and when they came to that final moment and fade to black there was a collective “Ahhh! holy crap!!!” among all of us. That is how effective that episode was. It was so amazingly well put together.
Hugh was significant in kind of the way Worf was significant. It’s the first time the audience gets to know the Big Bad in a meaningful way other than as an antagonist.
Some have said “I, Borg” is when the Borg started to become weakened as a villain, and that’s true to some extent. But I don’t think Star Trek, broadly speaking, is really about villains. It’s about the process of making former villains. (Khan and Dukat notwithstanding.)
In that way, I wouldn’t be surprised to see a more peaceful Founder or Jem Hadar turn up at some point, either.
Since he got mentioned I did kinda recall some of the “I am Hugh” stuff. But I do not recall being moved by any of it. It was just sort of… There. Like most of the non-memorable TNG episodes.
I was never moved by the Hugh episodes either. But they were at least moderately interesting to me, just as with all the Worf stuff.
To me, the most interesting character was Worf. Mainly because he wasn’t a perfect human and we dived for the first time into the Klingon culture. Worf was the best part of TNG and when he moved to DS9 it even breathed a little life into that already interesting show.
I’ll go along with that. He did get a lot of good stories over the two series.
A favorite that comes to mind is when he refuses to give his blood to the dying Romulan. I’m not saying I agree with his decision, but it did make the character a lot more interesting than the rest.
As for Hugh, of the returning characters he may have the most potential to explore. We barely got to know him as a non-Borg. I mean, is he human? Alien? Was he born as a Borg? Assimilated?
I hope you’ll feel rewarded by looking back at the Hugh episodes. As I recall, and I feel like I remember his episodes well, the first episode is some truly great sci-fi storytelling. To me it’s one of the great classic episodes. Very trekky.
Hugh (as you probably know) was found after a crash of his scout ship. After that episode ended, he played a huge part in a 2 part episode where Data’s brother Lore had somehow become the de facto leader of a group of renegade Borg, and had taken the Enterprise crew hostage and Hugh helped them because of his friendship with Geordi.
What I remember was watching that episode and thinking that it’s amazing that the Federation hasn’t been conquered yet. There they are trying to devise a plan to attack the borg, and we get Beverly and Geordi ‘getting to know you’ with the Borg, and naming it. It was ridiculous. The worst, most lethal, terrifying enemy they’ve ever fought and… they name him Hugh and send him home with warm thoughts. Evolved sensibilities indeed.
Poor Midnight’s Edge! What are those losers going to make up now?
They did one a few weeks ago called “Picard show stolen from Bryan Fuller?” Yet another one of those lies made up by them and repeated by the ghastly Alt-Righters like Nerdrotic and others.
Robert Meyer Burnett commented on that and said it was true, that he had spoken with Bryan Fuller and that a Picard Show had been included in a couple of pitches for additional shows he had made. May be true, may not be. Who knows.
Shrug. Of course a show focused on Picard would come up during initial discussions of a new series. It doesn’t mean the idea was “stolen.” It’s just common sense. It’s not like Fuller owns the concept of Star Trek. He’ playing in someone else’s sandbox.
No, but apparently the ideas he pitched for a Picard show are being used here. It happens.
And you find this assertion credible why?
It took a 45+ page concept penned by Beyer (who has written many post-Nemesis novels) to get Patrick Stewart on board.
And Stewart was very clear that several other people had approached him previously and he had rebuffed them.
Fuller may have written up the usual 2-page concept for a Picard centred show among other possibilities – but clearly the actor wasn’t interested in what he offered if he was even convinced to read it.
Sounds like a lot more IP was developed by Beyer and Kurtzman to get Stewart to say yes.
For all we know all it took to get Stewart on board was another zero. Especially so if one buys the stories of him being approached multiple times over the years to return to the role.
The point is, we don’t know what the real reason is. Maybe he’s being honest. Maybe not. But I’ve grown to the point of leaning towards contract figures when it comes to well known people and what jobs or deals they end up taking.
LOL! Nerdrotic is NOT alt-right.
I disagree. Next you’ll be saying that Jeremy from Geeks & Gamers isn’t Alt-Right ( they are buddies ). These and others are always so triggered at the notion of “diversity”.
What exactly makes someone alt-Right, in your view?
I’m not so sure. I watched one video and as soon as he uttered the phrase SJW in context of Star Trek, I was done. Star Trek has always been socially conscious and using that as a critique of newer shows is garbage. Likewise, anyone who uses “Mary Sue” is garbage because nobody minded when Luke Skywalker came from out nowhere to exhibit amazing abilities. It’s only a problem to people who use those phrases if the prodigy is female or a person of color. It’s very Alt-Righty.
You are so right.
I don’t get why that kind of person would even watch Star Trek. All the best episodes of every series are what a certain type of person would call “SJW garbage.”
That’s not true. The best episodes of Star Trek got people thinking. Not specifically one way or the other. But getting folks to consider other things or ways. It was the worst episodes of Trek that tended to preach one way of thinking about things. Even if that one way was the obviously moral way. Those episodes were often among the weakest.
I think one of the best episodes of Trek that looks at the issues from both sides was definitely “Duet” from DS9. Now that is a very important episode that I believe more people currently need to watch before judging everyone just because of the things they can see. This is also one of my favorite episodes of entire Trek, just because of this reason. There is no right or wrong in that story and it makes you decide and think for yourself which might be the moral ground instead of blindly following one point of view or the other.
Alphantrion, that is exactly the way it should be.
Exactly, ML31. Star Trek is about being open-minded and critical thought. SJWism is about seeing things one way and that’s it. I’m not criticizing the concept of “social justice”, mind you. I’m criticizing the mind of the Social Justice Warrior.
Luke got his ass kicked by a Tusken Raider. He was a good pilot, but that’s about it. It took three films and training under both Obi-Wan and Yoda to become proficient in the Jedi ways.
Rey–right out of the gate–could fight off multiple attackers, fly ships, talk to droids, use Jedi mind tricks, and beat what is essentially a Sith Lord without a single iota of training from a Jedi Master.
He looks like alt right to me. His face makes me sick.
Yep, he’s def Alt-Right. There’s a whole rising tide of them amongst the genre communtiy, all blowing air up each other’s you-know-whats.
I think I’ve pegged that other youtuber Dave Cullen as also being Alt-Right. I’m claiming to have done so at any rate.
What does an “alt right” person even look like? He looks more like a leftist hipster to me. The point, don’t judge people by their looks.
The Gorn Identity,
Re: What does an “alt right” person even look like?
I grew up in The South. If a person is wearing a white pointed hood and burning a cross in your neighbor’s lawn, he’s KKK -> White Supremacist -> Alt Right.
If a person is marching while doing a “Heil, Hitler!” salute and chanting “Jews will not replace us!”, don’t let the tiki torches fool you, he is a Nazi -> White Supremacist -> Alt Right.
Also, most Alt Righters just can’t resist the banners, emblems, uniforms, flags, and other accoutrements from failed White Supremacist Nations.
Yes, but A34 said Nerdrotic looked alt-Right. He doesn’t match any of that criteria. We are so quick to call people we don’t agree with “Nazis” and bigots. We need to stop with the hyperbole.
The Gorn Identity,
I was addressing the question you specifically asked.
As for whether hyperbole had been engaged, you have yet to establish how you know for a fact that you and A34 are referencing the same image? You made your assertion BEFORE you made certain that you had a common frame of reference. Thus revealing that you are just as willing to jump to a conclusion, to make a point, as you believe A34 did.
Have they started to say that the show has already been cancelled?
I recall when that f00l Nerdrotic was stating in his video title that Discovery would be axed after season 2 – literally a day before they announced season 3!
LOL. I’m glad I have all those channels blocked on my YouTube account.
My one concern about the show is that new viewers, and indeed old fans like myself, will need to be familiar with the Hugh story from TNG. I will give Picard a chance, but it seems like going backward with the Borg yet again. They’re the Daleks of the Star Trek universe… once good, now over used.
The Daleks still get good episodes all the time.
Hugh was only ever in two episodes, and they’re both on Netflix. If people are confused by him when he shows up on Picard, they can easily go back and rewatch his two episodes.
but recent dalek eps have dealt with solo daleks amok such as ‘inside the dalek’, ‘resolution’ and ‘asylum/daleks’.
Before Resolution, the most recent Dalek episode was Magicians Apprentice/Witch’s Familiar, which was set on Skaro and featured thousands of Daleks.
but was really all about the dr and davros, his dilemma about killing him as a child to stop the daleks being created.
an echo of ‘genesis/daleks’ which was broadcast 40 years earlier-
‘do I have the right?’
Well, most Dalek episodes since Genesis have really been about Davros, but the Daleks still play a major role. That would be like saying that First Contact isn’t really about the Borg because its about Data, Picard, and the Borg Queen.
which it is as the borg are fairly dull, like the daleks, so you bring in a human interface to spark off picard, data or the dr.
‘inside the dalek’ ends with ‘rusty’ dedicated to killing all other daleks.
It’s not that easy if you don’t have Netflix.
All of star trek is on CBS All Access if you are in the US. TNG is on Amazon Prime. Those are the only 2 places you can watch Picard outside of Canada and both services have the required episodes.
True that. Rendering the mention of Netflix in the post I was responding to unnecessary.
Which is exactly why I been saying this show is really for hardcore TNG or 24th century fans first and foremost. The guy was in two episodes from nearly 30 years ago. I can’t blame people if they can’t remember him lol. I Borg is a GREAT episode but you’re probably not going to care about Hugh all that much unless you watched him in those episodes.
But yes it will come down to the writing, obviously they will fill people in what they need to know about characters like Hugh and Data if they are watching Star Trek for the first time but I have no idea how interesting it is for them without the previous investment since the story line seems to about helping/rescuing these people in some way.
I agree that they aren’t just going to drop the viewer (especially new viewers) in without giving them the proper introduction. They have explicitly said this is not TNG part 2. But I would say they are going to go further than you are anticipating. They aren’t going to rely on 2 (really 3) episodes from 25 years ago to provide the investment in characters that this show will require. Even though I haven’t yet read any Chabon books (though I own a couple), I would think that he – if no one else – will require them to build investment in these old characters as if they were new characters. Ultimately Hugh will almost be a new character – we only saw him for 3 episodes in which his whole universe was upended twice, then he was expected to be a new leader for his “people”. 30 more years of personal development makes this practically a new character with just a brief, if impactful, intersection with our main TNG characters.
I have no doubt everyone will get new introductions and all of that. I’m not saying that, what I AM saying is I just don’t know if anyone is going to really care that much unless you already knew who they were because in all honesty most people who are naturally excited to see them are people who already know them. Obviously the same could be said about Picard himself.
But OK, maybe to explain what I mean better is by what happened with The Force Awakens, Luke and China (yes I’ll explain lol). As everyone know the movie was a huge hit practically every major country, but one, China. And part of that was because China never had the same pull with Star Wars as other places did. With TFA, it too really relied on both old and new characters and we didn’t even see our first known characters (Han and Chewie) until 40 minutes into the movie. But one of the reasons it didn’t do well in China is because while the film gave us new stories and reintroduced characters, it still hinged on finding Luke Skywalker who of course we didn’t see until the last moments of the film.
I remember reading a lot of message boards at the time and the biggest issue with Chinese audiences is they didn’t know or cared who Luke Skywalker was because the film didn’t bother to make them care even though his named was uttered all through the film and he was made to be a big deal. But if you never seen him before it never showed or explained why he was. For SW fans Luke is an icon, but for non-SW fans he’s just another character and in this case a non-seen one for 95% of the film and where it lost first time fans.
Now of course we don’t really know what Picard is about and I don’t think its the search for Hugh lol. I’m only saying you can still try and do all the right things and reintroduce old characters, etc, but if you don’t have the attachments as old fans or just mention their back stories and very little else, a lot of it may still be a big shrug for others.
And I’m not suggesting new fans can’t get into the show, maybe they can. But the other problem is so FAR looking at all the PR for this show including this very page we’re on, its all been aimed at old fans and really no one else. There hasn’t even been anything to suggest why a new fan should even care about the show at all. Its all based on nostalgia so far. Look at the Las Vegas Con, who was there to talk about the show? Riker, Seven and Hugh and they aren’t even the main stars. You would almost think Frakes was a co-star in it and he may only be in two episodes. Not even one new actor to the franchise was on that stage for some reason. BUT maybe they were all filming.
And yes its VERY early, I know. Hopefully it will change.
Well, in that sense then even a brand new Trek show is possibly doomed to failure because it is called Star Trek. That brand carries with it a stigma that just turns a number of people off regardless if it includes Picard or Kirk or completely new characters unattached to the others in any way. It’s a bit of a Catch-22 because Enterprise did not have Star Trek attached the title originally and did not do well. It was added for later seasons. Now I don’t think there is a significant correlation but that is what some thought could help. OK, now I’m just rambling and even I don’t know where I’m going any longer. :)
LOL thats OK, I’m pretty good at rambling. So I understand. ;)
But yeah thats all true and that its already hard enough to attract new fans because Star Trek in general already has a stigma, even when you have completely brand new characters. The only show I think really attracted new fans, I mean LOTS of new fans was probably TNG and that probably didn’t happen right away either. It just became more popular and eventually pulled others in. Sure DS9 and VOY also brought in new fans but my guess is only a fraction of whatever TNG brought but this is just speculation.
But yes I think its pretty valid because of what you said about Enterprise and that they left the Star Trek title off because someone thought that WOULD get more new people to watch. And since it was a prequel where its literally starting from scratch I guess they figured this would be the easiest show for a new fan to get into. They probably were right on that since you didn’t have to know anything about Star Trek but yes ironically it back fired to the point it wasn’t bringing in old fans. Of course every Star Trek fan knew Enterprise was Star Trek, I don’t the lack of a title was the problem lol, it just wasn’t a great show starting out. And yes, being a prequel probably didn’t help either. OK, now I’m rambling again lol.
ANYWAY, getting back to the main point, that’s why I think in some ways its going to be even harder for Picard. Don’t get me wrong, I think this show is going to be a BIG success for AA. It really tick off all the boxes for a lot of Trek fans. It doesn’t seem to have anything to do with exploration but yet no one seems to even care about that. If the show is actually GOOD, its going to be YUGE as a certain President always says! I don’t have any doubt about that at all.
I just don’t know if its going to be something where non fans are suddenly telling their friends you should check out that Picard show on AA, thats all. Or that its going to be a mainstream hit. It will be in terms of the fanbase but I just don’t know if I see it becoming something teenagers are going to get into starring a nearly 80 year old actor playing a character from 30 years ago. I can certainly be wrong but I’m being honest here, I live in L.A. and I work around tons of people, I have not heard a single non-trek fan mention anything about this show since the trailer dropped. It still feels like Discovery to me where it lives in the bubble on the internet but outside of that you would never know it even existed in the real world. Of course, it hasn’t aired yet, so that could change and yes that’s probably what CBS is hoping for that it WILL change that.
But so far no one I know is discussing this show beyond my already Trek co-workers. The few I talk to are really excited though and none of them watches Discovery.
Tiger, I’m not so sure how big it can even get in today’s world. It does face an uphill batter just being on CBSAA to begin with. I say this as I have friends who are Trek fans and had ZERO clue that Discovery was even going to happen a few years ago. Until I told them. But none of them wanted to spend more money on yet another service. It wasn’t until I suggested we split it that they opted to chip in. I wonder how many fans there are who are not such fans that they do not peruse fan sites or have kids who might. I wonder how many fans there are who are into Trek but not into it enough to pay for CBSAA. We will never know. It is obvious that CBS is counting on Trek to do all the heavy lifting for CBSAA. Is their faith misguided or is it properly placed? To be honest, I cannot answer that. All I know is that in my tiny circle of Trek friends, I was the only one who was willing to pay for season 2 of Discovery. I have told them about the Picard show and showed them the trailer. (They did not know about that until I told them the news last year either.) Jury is still out on how many of them might be interested in sharing an account again….
it doesn’t carry that stigma anymore, not like it did in the 90s. Star Trek into darkness made 475 million, that’s like 4 and a half million people. Star Trek may never be the fast and the furious, but it’s not some dorky show people laugh at anymore. also, science fiction is trendy now, not like in the 90s. sci-fi makes money, particularly if there’s some action in it, and that’s why they put action in Picard.
the important thing to make audiences care about this show outside of Trekkies is to make it a good show. if they do that, people will watch.
ML31, you keep referring to Trek having a stigma, but I’m wondering if you’re just reflecting your own milieu. (Although Tiger2 mentions it took)
Trek may not have gone as mainstream in US geekdom as other franchises, but I’m always surprised when you suggest Trek fans can’t admit it at work.
In my work environment, Trek is still pretty mainstream. But perhaps Canadians are more cool with Trek given we’ve had Space channel running 25 hours of Trek a week since whenever it started in the 90s.
My US experience wasn’t all that representative, and was long before geekdom went mainstream. I never hesitated to mention Trek, but I was in the US I was in a definitionally nerdly milieu, so Trek was considered fun and cool.
This is not my own milieu at all, TG47. It is pretty obvious that even those in charge have felt that way. Look at the marketing for Star Trek ’09. There was a ton geared towards saying this is a different kind of Star Trek. As I said before they even tried dropping the name from Enterprise. Now CBS is currently gambling on the name, sure. But I still think it does indeed carry a bit of a stigma. I, personally, have no problem saying I enjoy Trek where I work. But then, there are a few nerdy guys here but also as adults we tend to not be worried about such trivial differences as we were when we were kids.
“Obviously they will fill people in what they need to know about characters like Hugh and Data if they are watching Star Trek for the first time”
I could see them precede episodes with” Previously in the 24th century” ;) But seriously, they did it with Discovery and “The Cage” in one episode even, and the design differences here are way less jarring, not to forget all characters are played by the same actors!
It could be cool if episode 1 opens with a “previously on Star Trek” that recaps some of the important stuff from TNG, Voyager, and Nemesis. That might be a bit alienating for some viewers though.
Yeah, I would save something like that for maybe a third or fifth episode.
I watched those episodes but none of them resonated in any significant way. I completely forgot “Descent” even existed and could not tell you any element from that plot. At all. Now a good writer can use those elements and make them work in this new show and not require the viewer to have seen anything from those episodes. All they need is a character not familiar with the situation to serve as the audience so Picard can explain it to them in a short and concise manner. That said, overall the plotting and writing really do need to be at least above mediocre for the show to be worth something. I’m hopeful but still hedging my bets. While Chabon was not involved in Discovery a lot of other people on that staff were.
Descent stunk. Both parts.
I found it a fun action packed episode, the VFX were some of the best of the series.
I wouldn’t say it ‘stunk’. It isn’t in “Code of Honor” or “Sub Rosa” territory at all. But it isn’t anywhere close to The Best of Trek, either.
i think they’re aiming this at more than diehard Trekkies. that’s why it’s all about the borg, and that’s why its about Picard. Picard and Borg are the two things people outside of the fans know. same reason the Abrams movies used Kirk, Khan, and tribbles. its also why they put action it I, like in the movies, and not like the shows.
Even after watching those episodes, I really doubt I would care about Hugh. Maybe if Huge looked like 7 of 9😋
I dunno yall, I, Borg is a pretty seminal episode of TNG, and Hugh had a big influence on Picard and his view of the Borg. It absolutely makes sense that the Borg will factor into Picard [although they by no means had to, and it is a little troublesome to see the writers fall back on a familiar villain like the Borg, whom we haven’t seen on screen since 2002].
I really hope that they aren’t taking the Solo approach and finding all the sort of “stand out” characteristics of the main character and cramming them into one story. Basically all of Picard’s main associations are present in the Picard series: the Borg, Romulans, his friendship with Data. It’s all coming back together.
But to say that Hugh was a minor player — I dunno, I’m pretty sure I consider Hugh to be one of the most memorable characters in all of TNG, especially due to his relationship with Picard.
Well he was minor in the sense he appeared in 2 episodes out of 170. And not only that, he’s never mentioned ONCE outside of those episodes. It’s sort of like Khan in TOS. Obviously he’s memorable in the episode he’s in but he really had no bearing on the show outside of that episode and later TWOK of course. And like Hugh his name is only uttered in the episode and movie he was in, he didn’t really have any influence beyond that. Khan is obviously remembered more now thanks to TWOK but he would’ve probably just been another villain of the week for Kirk without that movie.
In Hugh’s case, sure if you are a huge TNG fan you are going to know him, but if you aren’t, then probably not unless you seen his episodes. But in terms of the Borg arc overall, we’ve seen them countless times since Descent and he was never a factor or influence in any of those stories. In fact I always thought they would swing back to him one day and even include him in First Contact but it never happened.
I agree with you about the Solo thing though. I liked the movie but it was so annoying to have all these ridiculous connections and easter eggs. Its like someone made a checklist of every thing we knew about him and then just built a movie around them. So many of them just felt forced as well (Chewbacca nickname scene, case closed). But then that happens a lot in prequels and why I never been a big fan of them.
I think Picard will naturally have some of that but I’m hoping not every other scene is “REMEMBER THIS?????”. But seeing they basically did that with Pike as well (managed to include both the only two things we knew about the guy, his time on Talos IV and ‘beep’ in one season lol), I won’t be too shocked if they go down that route with Picard.
We have to remember that Star Trek actually did something similar before where it took one off enemies from Star Trek TOS and put them together nearly 30 years later for an episode of DS9 – Blood Oath. So it is not the first time this is happening, the only difference this time it will not be a one off episode but a 10 hour series exploring these characters.
But that’s kind of my point. I honetly couldn’t remember those Klingons from TOS when that episode aired lol. I went back to them later and remembered them but I swear I remembered watching that episode trying to remember who those guys were at the time (and to be fair they did look VERY different than they did from TOS lol) and the internet wasn’t as resourceful as it is today and I watched TOS since the 70s. But I couldn’t remember every character who showed up in just 1 or 2 episodes either. I was a big fan and was still lost. But of course all the hardcore TOS fans knew who they were.
But yes I get your point, in this show its going to really stretch out all the characters being a 10 hour movie, etc. So it will be different and more involved where you will just get to know the characters all over again. That’s a good point!
You could easily watch Blood Oath without having seen TOS though. They tell you everything you need to know about Kang, Kor, and Koloth right in the episode. It was a nice reference for TOS fans, but you didn’t need to see TOS to understand the story.
I imagine it will be the same with Hugh. For those of us who have seen I, Borg and Descent, it will be cool to see what’s happening to a character who we already know. For everyone else, the new show will tell you everything you need to know about him.
TBH the change in the way the original Klingons looked put me off when the episode originally aired. First, I didn’t know that Klingons lived that long… and they looked totally different from the TOS episode. They could have updated the costume without adding the ridges, and I think I would have loved that. The narrative continuity was actually a casualty of the updated look — for me, at least. It also would have embraced a multi-ethnic, or multi-look Klingon “Empire.”
Trek in a Cafe, I felt similar. Not the make up. I figured they would get the era specific update. But I was under the impression Klingons just didn’t live that long. Not sure where I got that from. Maybe it was in a book I read maybe it was head canon. But their appearance, while fan boy fun, was a bit confusing for me at first just because of the life span thing.
And I can understand you not recalling guys who appeared in ONE episode. I was a HUGE TOS guy so I knew them immediately. As much as I liked DS9 it did have flaws. And bringing those guys back, I thought, was one of them. Sure, the fan boy in me wanted to see Kor and Koloth and Kang. But were they really needed? Not really. It felt more like a sweeps week stunt than a solid DS9 story. That said the story was framed in such a way that there was no need whatsoever to have seen them in their respective episodes to follow along with their DS9 appearance. Just as I am hoping will be the case in Picard.
Blood Oath is a low point in Trekdom for me. Changing their appearances made the characters look absolutely ridiculous.
Tiger, I would argue that Hugh wasn’t even memorable even if you DID watch the two episodes he’s in. I watched them and he was just the ‘situation of the week’. Nothing more. I even forgot he appeared a 2nd time! One really does need to be a larger than average TNG fan to even recall him. Now perhaps with this Picard show he may become TNG’s Khan. Minor character elevated to larger status due to being brought back for future movie/show.
Solo is a pretty bad example to cite. That film had behind the scenes issues to the point where they changed directors even while shooting! The result was pretty much a hot mess even though I loved Glover as Lando a TON and I was happy to get a satisfactory explanation of how the Kessel run can be less than 12 parsecs. But in the end, that might have been more fun just remaining a mystery. Yes, more often than not, prequels have to fill in the blanks. That is their function. Discovery did that and they went so far as to directly link one of their characters to arguably the most beloved character in the entire franchise. A mistake, in my opinion. They needed to try and stand completely on their own first, but that ship sailed ages ago. To me an excellent example of a great prequel is Rogue One. It provided background to a story element from the original. Created an entire group of new people and wrote them so you actually grew to care about them. And sprinkled in enough connections to the original so it did not feel like “member berries” were laying all over the place. So prequels can be done well. It’s just not that common.
I definitely liked Hugh and he was certainly memorable at the time, but yes its been 30 years lol. That’s the thing if you love TNG of course you know and remember him, but the point is he never became iconic or anything like Q, Khan or Shran where he’s constantly mentioned. He was that interesting Borg character in a few episodes and that it. I mean I seen more discussions about Hugh in the last few weeks then I seen in the last decade lol.
Fans know about him, but no one really talked about him anymore because of what I said and that we had tons of Borg stories since we last saw him and he was a complete non-factor in all of them. There aren’t obviously many Borg ‘characters’ given the nature of their species but Seven and the Borg Queen are some of the few and have stayed really popular. They are certainly iconic, but they were also relevant to the Borg until the very end. Hugh simply wasn’t and he faded. And since you are not a TNG fan in general, he would be even less so for someone like you. So we basically agree.
But yes bringing him back can obviously change all of that and maybe he will be very relevant to the story. We obviously don’t know why he’s there but I am excited he’s back. I think it was a great move to include him and to make TNG fans even more curious about the show.
And we agree about Rogue One, that was a great example of how you make a prequel even if you literally know exactly how the story would end but it still felt like its own thing and they didn’t over do it TOO much with the Star Wars connections, although when your movie is literally about the Death Star I guess you don’t have to. ;)
They just went too far with it in Solo. And your point about the directors getting fired, ironically they got fired because they were straying too far from the script. They DIDN’T want all those connections and wanted Solo to be a different character entirely. When they fired them and hired Ron Howard, he followed exactly what was in the script with some of his own changes. But what we saw in Solo actually was the film they originally wanted to make, it just took a lot more money and time to get there.
And the funny thing is I think Solo is generally a good film given everything. Not great, but decent. The problem with is it really just feels like a movie if you are a Solo fan. If you are not a big Solo fan there is no other reason to see this movie and it was the first SW film too feel so narrow in scope and probably another reason it failed.
I just will add that it was my impression that the Lord’s got fired because they were leaning more heavily to the humor than the producers wanted. I agree that it wasn’t a TERRIBLE movie on it’s own. I found it kinda enjoyable even though there were still way too many ‘member berries in it. But after viewing it and I placed it in the SW universe I was still wondering what was in it that was relevant to the rest of the SW universe apart from a post credit bit?
So maybe the reason Hugh stands out for me [and has always stood out] is because he’s like the kid Borg, and the Borg in general really stood out in TNG because they were in like what, six episodes? So every one of them stands out to me, also they were all included on that Fan Collective DVD box set in the mid 2000s that I watched endlessly. So I don’t think you need to be a big TNG fan, you just need to be a Borg fan, and Hugh is one of the most memorable Borgs there is — cuz he’s an individual. But obviously I’m speaking for myself, and it seems clear that most people here don’t remember much about I, Borg, which is a shame, cuz it’s a great episode. Descent Pts 1 and 2, not so much
OK. Good point. Not just being a larger than average fan of TNG but being a big fan of the Borg would mean Hugh is likely to be remembered. Although I would argue that those two are pretty close to being one in the same.
Would it really take that long to recap Hugh’s story though? Picard meets with Seven, they discuss Borg who have been rescued from the Collective, then Picard mentions the Enterprise once rescued a drone who became a leader of a group of free Borg — and we cut to present day Hugh. Seems like that could be covered in about five minutes of screen time.
It would be like the scene in TWOK when Khan recollects how he and his people came to be marooned there. ‘In case you never saw Space Seed, audience, here’s what happened…’
That’s what Captain Terrell was for. He wasn’t there so he had to be brought up to speed. Just like many in the audience. Such expositions are usually kept as brief as possible so we can get on with the story.
Right, well, so have another character fill that role when talking to Picard about Hugh.
That can be served by Picard’s new faithful Romulan servant or any of the other new characters.
Yes, Seven should already know about Hugh. She was still a Borg in the Queen’s Inner Circle when the Enterprise encountered Hugh.
Exactly TechNoir, given how much love TWOK gets here on TrekMovie, I’m really surprised how much fretting is happening about reviving Hugh as a character.
Hugh appeared in 2 episodes, one a season premiere, and is a member of the most powerful enemy in TNG.
I don’t see how this is in any way a reach.
If I am reading it right the Borg are not the enemy, it’s the Romulans, who are experimenting on the Borg.
I feel like between TNG and Voyager, the Borg have indeed seen their day. They are indeed overused. It got to feel that way on Voyager. “Sigh… Looks like another Borg episode next week…” The Borg have almost become a TNG era trope.
It’s not like Hugh’s story is particularly difficult to explain and/or summarize with a couple quick lines of dialogue. They don’t need to get into the whole story for “Descent” either.
What was so great about Hugh anyway? I hardly remember him.
That’s because “I, Borg” wasn’t “The Hugh Story”. It was a story exploring the morality of genocide, even against an all-powerful enemy which seeks to destroy your way of life.
At least it didn’t have Riker & Co stand and chant “We are Star Fleet!”
Berman saying watch this is reminiscent of Cameron saying watch Genysis. Hopefully not with the same results.
Geneysis looked REALLY bad with its first trailer though. Yes Picard can be bad, but so FAR everything seems to be clicking well so I have faith we are going to get a good show, even if its still not perfect. But yes after two seasons of Discovery I’m not over doing it on expectations until we see it.
So, Hugh dies?
I really want more information on the day to day members of the cast, yeah, Hugh, Data, and Seven are great but most of the screen time is with Elnor, Cristobal, Dr. Agnes, Raffi, and Dahj. They have to do the heavy lifting.
They’ll probably do more interviews and stuff once we’ve all seen them in the show, and are actually fans of them.
We need Geordi / Levar Burton in this.
Insert name of random TNG star here….
It would make sense given Hugh’s friendship with Geordi; their relationship figured significantly into both episodes that Hugh appeared on (Geordi even gave him his name if I recall correctly). That said, you can only have so many returning characters before it starts to feel like a reunion and I don’t think that’s what they’re going for.
Given that already 4 of the 6 main characters are showing up at some point and to some extent I’d say it already is feeling like a reunion show.
Six? So far we haven’t heard anything from Crusher, Geordi, Worf, or Wesley. If my calculations are correct, then when you add those four to the four who are appearing, you get a total of eight. That means that only half of the main cast are confirmed to be returning. Even less if you include Tasha and Pulaski.
OK… I forgot one. But they are forgettable characters so you can’t blame me. And I intentionally did not include Yar or Wesely or Pulaski. Yar and Pulaski weren’t around long enough for me to consider them “regular”. Wesley I left out because he’s Westley.
The point is it’s still a lot.
Wesley sucks, but he was still a member of the main cast for half the show’s run. I’d still count him.
To be honest if we do see more TNG characters there, I highly doubt we will see them all sitting in a same room somewhere. I know we will probably see Picard, Riker and Troi talking together but it doesn’t sound like Data will be there and they will probably spread out the other characters too. So even if there are more TNG characters coming it probably won’t ever feel like a proper ‘reunion’ show but of course I could be wrong and they could all show up on the Enterprise together. ;)
Maybe they could put them all in one place for the final episode of the final season.
If they are all playing Poker in the final shot I’m sure a lot of people will think it’s the best ending ever. ;)
and he designed the ‘jellyfish’ship that spock prime used to try and save the romulans according to ‘countdown’.
Or he could direct an episode of Star Trek for CBS all access. Since he is a talented director.